023 - One-Sided Healing (Addicted Spouse)

Welcome to the Pure Desire podcast, where we partner with you to bring hope and freedom on your journey to purity. Hey there. I'm your host, Trevor Windsor, and we're so thankful you're taking time out of your day to hang out with us. I'm here with my co host, Nick Stumbo.

Glad to be here.

And we are joined today by Tyler Chinson. Tyler, thanks for hanging out with us.

Good to be here. Thank you.

Your last name is not an easy one to say smoothly.

It really is not.

Yeah. So I'm gonna pat myself on the.

Back a little bit.

I feel like that was a great transition. And so, Tyler, we're glad to have you back on the podcast. For those of you who might not remember, Tyler was on a previous episode talking about counseling. We had you and your wife Sherry on, and Tyler is our clinical director and is one of our clinicians. So he has lots of letters after his name, and it's safe to say he's pretty smart. So we're just gonna trust what he has to say. Does that represent you well enough?

Again, you nailed it. Okay, thanks, Trevor.

Perfect. Okay, so today we have Tyler on to talk about a situation that we see on the journey to freedom from sexual addiction. And it's when the addicted spouse wants to find healing and freedom, but their spouse is not supportive. So we see this in our groups and in our counseling pretty often, and we want to speak directly to it. So this is a situation where husbands and wives that are caught in sexual addiction know they need help and their family is not behind them or supporting them. So it's a tough situation to be in. And we hope that today's episode can be an encouragement to anybody who's in this situation and are listening to it. So let's just jump right in.

Yeah. I like something you said in the intro, Trevor, that this is something we see quite a bit, and it might be an encouragement to someone who's listening right now that feels like they're the only one, that maybe they're starting some steps towards freedom and they're in a group, and everyone else, their spouse is engaged, and they're working on it as a couple, and maybe in their situation, they feel really isolated or somehow stuck. And so we do want to just offer that encouragement that this is not uncommon. But there are definitely some things that can be done, some steps to be taken to help perhaps get the other spouse more engaged. And that's really what we want to focus on today. And so, Tyler, some of our listeners might be tuning into this Podcast because they're in a tough situation and they've maybe started the journey towards freedom, or they've maybe been on it for a while, maybe in a group for a while or processing, and they've really been doing it on their own with a spouse or family that's just not supportive, doesn't want to be a part of it, doesn't want to engage, doesn't want to deal with the problem. So they've said, well, you go work on it, but I don't want to be a part of it. What initial encouragement would you give to someone that finds themselves in that situation?

Well, for those men or women who have been engaged in group, I would say continue, Just press on, trust the process. You'll get to a point where your spouse will see change in the relationship, and then he or she may be more open to exploring ways to restore the marriage. Because oftentimes this behavior has been devastating to a relationship, to a marriage. So I would say to them, just continue on the path. If you're on the path. If you haven't stepped on the path yet, go to that place, step on the path, because there is hope for healing and restoration. You don't need to live in the bondage. And you're not alone, you know. In fact, about 70% of men from a recent survey indicated they struggle in this area with sexual purity and their purity walk. So again, don't wait. You're not alone. Engage in the process. Be patient with your spouse as well.

Yeah, yeah.

So you would say if someone is in that place where they're recognizing a problem, they're starting to deal with it, but a spouse is not willing or wanting to be engaged, you'd encourage that person to move forward anyway and to not wait for the spouse to be on board before they take any steps.

Exactly. Because for the spouse, this is uncharted territory. Oftentimes it is a lot of unknown involved, and they may also think or perceive it's their spouse's problem. If you just got fixed, we'd be okay. Yeah, that's not often the case.

Yeah. All right, so let's get really practical then on that, because you're talking about someone who, you know, needs to get onto this road to recovery. They need to start their healing process. And even if their spouse isn't on board with it, they need to start taking some steps towards healing. So what would be some first initial steps for somebody who really isn't. Isn't an addicted cycle and wants to get out and find freedom?

I would suggest do your homework. Pure Desire is an excellent resource to provide support groups, recovery resources, and counseling. But Pure Desire isn't the only game in town. There are a number of qualified individuals, organizations that can help. So I would recommend doing a little bit of homework around proven resources for recovery. But begin the process now.

Right on. Just get going. Yeah.

So you mentioned the groups and resources that we have available through Pure Desire. What are some of those? And can you just explain for listeners that might not be familiar with the approach, where do they start? What group should they be looking at for addressing their struggle for men?

Go to the PureDesire.org website and there is a group locator there and key in your zip code. And there are contact individuals that would come up, whether it be your regional group leader or the international group leader, there would be a contact person there for you. So the first step would be integration in a group. And we believe that Pure Desire has the resources in place, the support in place that help people through this process of restoration, recovery, recovery, renewal, and freedom.

Yeah.

Some other resources provided by Pure Desire, we integrate a book workbook titled Seven Pillars of Freedom. There's a journal that's integrated within that work. And you would walk through that workbook with your group members, and the group is facilitated by a trained individual who knows Pure Desire. They're walking in restoration, and they can help you in that process. Another resource available to people is the Pure Desire book. I first started this work, gosh, over 20 years ago in working with people who were incarcerated. And the Pure Desire book was actually in prisons, the ones that I visited. So this is a resource that's been time tested. And it's incredibly valuable for people to understand the nature of addiction, the nature of healing, and what freedom can look like for them. For the female addict, and there are some out there, the eight Pillars of Freedom is a resource for them. There's also some groups available for that person. The next resource, if. Let me restate, that could be Pure Desire counseling. And we consider that a resource. Currently, we're serving about 200 clients out of the Pure Desire office in Gresham. And because we are a ministry, about 80% of those clients are served via video conference. They don't come into the Pure Desire office.

Yeah, yeah. Well, and to speak to the group stuff, it's one of those things that I think that we tend to think, I can do this on my own. I can find freedom. I can find healing. And, you know, I was just having a conversation this morning with a friend that I think that we tend to think, I got myself into this mess, I can get myself out. There's this. This undertone of pride that I can pull myself up by my bootstraps. And part of that is just the culture we've been grow, you know, I've grown up in, we've grown up in. That teaches us that we're the superstar, we're the superhero in the story, and we can pull ourselves up. But if you've been in addiction for, you know, more than a short period of time, you know that that's not true. And so what's so nice about being in the groups and using those resources is that it surrounds you with a group of people that have a shared struggle and are all working together in community towards freedom. And what you see is that you start to have real relationships. You're not just, you know, putting on your best face when you go out. You walk into the group, whether it's a men's group or a women's group, and everybody knows who you are. They know your junk, they know your mess, but they still love you. They still accept you. And so that's the beauty of groups and why these are so important for an addict is that you can be a part of community because addiction tells you you should isolate. No one's going to love you or accept you when we find out that's not true.

Great points, Trevor. The nature of addiction, isolation feeds the addiction. It absolutely does. What we've acknowledged and recognize here at pure desire is that a lot of people, they're hesitant to enter into a community. And sure, their stuff, sure, their shortcomings, their failures, their shame, but once they engage in that process and recognize and experience being received and there's grace spoken over them, encouragement, support, transformation takes place. Yeah, absolutely.

Well, and for the person that's listening, that doesn't maybe have the support of their spouse, one of the reasons might be because the spouse has been the only person that they've confided in that they've confessed things to. And that spouse is just weary of being the support system for a person they see who isn't changing. And so to step into a group that becomes a new support structure, a new community of people that can hear your story and understand you and really take pressure off of the spouse to be the police officer or the fix it person in the relationship. And going back to what you said earlier, Tyler, to keep with it, it may just be the spouse needs some time to see that this new situation where the addict is really facing it and has a group around them is going to be different than all the other times. Because so often when someone starts a group, we find that it's not because it's just come to light. And sometimes that's the case that in a relationship, one's been found out and so they get in a group, but very often it's been a part of their relationship for many years. And so one of the spouses is just like, I don't want to deal with it anymore. But that's why the group is so valuable, because it creates that process of change. And then the spouse who's not engaged can kind of watch what's happening and. And hopefully be encouraged and eventually drawn into being a part of that change process.

Yeah, If I could add, change is experiential. We have to experience that. We can't necessarily pick up a book and read about change and then experience change. It helps.

That would be nice if that were that way.

Many of us have.

Yeah, but absolutely, we do need to step into those new relationships that are supportive and encouraging.

Well, when God created us and designed us, he knew what he was doing. He put that into place. And we see that in scripture. You know, we're not supposed to forsake meeting together. You know, that's a huge piece. And community and sanctification is played out on the playing field of relationship, not in the corner with your Bible. You take the biblical truth and you apply it to community, and that's where real transformation takes place. It's cool. Well, okay, let's get really honest then about this. So this is a difficult situation for the addiction, Whether it's a husband or a wife and. Or whether it's. It's a single person as well who's struggling with this. And I think that's important to say that even single people who don't have a spouse. That this is affecting doesn't mean that it's not affecting other people. So an addict who wants healing, why is it so difficult for them to find that healing if their spouse or their family or the support structure are not supportive?

Well, we're all connected to a family system, family dynamic. And when there's change with one individual, it will impact the others. And if one person is changing within that family system and the others are not responsive to it, then there's going to be struggle because the change with the other people becomes more of a resistance than actually welcoming that change. The term we often use in the counseling office is homeostasis. And homeostasis doesn't mean Health or unhealth. But homeostasis means what we've become accustomed to. Yeah, it's our normal again. Doesn't mean that it's healthy. And when there's change in that homeostasis, it will upset some of the others.

Yeah, I know you mentioned this also, Tyler. And working with the prison population, I would go in occasionally as a chaplain and hear the stories of men and women. And 95% of the people I met with as a chaplain were battling through drug addiction. And I would say almost 100% of the people I met with, they were changed. They were. It was a new lease on life. They were never going to be back again. And yet every one of them. I never met with someone that was in jail for their first time for drug offense. It was always 7, 10. I mean, they'd lost count. And then I'd hear their story about how they had changed and it was going to be different. I would ask questions about the environment they were going back to, and it was sobering to me how often they hadn't really thought about that or, well, I've got the same friends. And, well, yeah, they do drugs or there's drugs around. And I would really try, in a loving, encouraging way, to challenge them to say, if you don't change some of those environmental things, you probably aren't going to sustain this change. And sure enough, they would loop back around again. And it just is evidence to me when we are experiencing change, that change can be very real. Because I think for the people I met with as a chaplain, they really had felt they were sober, they were clean, they were changed. But because nothing else in their environment had changed, they just found themselves caught back up in their old patterns. And I think when we're talking about a struggle with sexual addiction and impurity, in a lot of ways, we have become a byproduct of our environment. And that's not to blame our environment for our problems, but just to say we have found that pornography or acting out sexually is a way of medicating our pain. And if we haven't really addressed the system that's creating the pain and how we're medicating it, we find ourselves back in the same system. And so I just. I think we want to look at holistically. Healing is as much about healing the system I'm a part of. You mentioned the family system, Tyler, as it is about my own personal healing. And when we see our life as being interconnected like that, it really underscores how important it is that we have our spouse or family along with us on this journey of change.

The ideal pure desire approach to care is the family system. Exactly what you said, Nick. If we pick one person up, dust them off, clean them up from the sexually compulsive behavior, put them back in that system, we really only done a partial job.

Yeah.

There's more work to be done.

Yeah. So let's push into that a little bit more. Why then is it so important that the addict has a supportive spouse during that time of healing?

I would say that a supportive spouse expedites the process they develop between the two of them. A shared language, shared growth, shared insight on how to do relationship in a more healthy manner. And the spouse is open to that. Granted, the spouse oftentimes feels betrayed, hurt, and they're going to want to see real change in that individual before they fully entrust that person with their heart.

Yeah.

So it takes time, but less time when you have a supportive spouse.

Yeah.

Well, and it's important to underscore that when. When the person who's struggling or the addict is getting help, the other spouse might feel like, well, this is their problem and it's all about them. And if they would just, you, you know, you said it. You know, if they would just fix the problem, we'd be fine. But that can sometimes leave that spouse a little blinded to their own issues and shortcomings. And what we see happen over and over in groups is that when a spouse engages, they come back saying, I didn't realize how much I needed to work on that. Yes, he had a problem or she had a problem, and it was obvious and it needed to be fixed, but I had issues of my own. And when both spouses start to recognize the way they've brought issues into the marriage from their family of origin or trauma from their past and they're able to address it, it's just incredible, the healing it brings for that spouse. And so an encouragement to a spouse who's maybe listening, saying, well, it's not my problem. Why should I have to be in a group? Well, the truth is, if you'll allow this to be a lens into your life, God will use his issue or her issue and the pain that it's caused in your life to expose things in you that maybe you know or there but have never really gotten traction on, changing this experience really is effective at helping a person address those things. And so I just. I hear all the time as we share at events and conferences, that spouse that says, I thought it was just about him, but Man, I got into a group and I couldn't believe what God wanted me to address. And that doesn't mean they're an addict or in any way that they should be ashamed of their own problems. But to say there's an opportunity here, that it's not just about them, it's about you as a couple, and it's about what God wants to do in your life. And when you get in this kind of change environment with other people attempting and walking on that same path, it becomes a tremendous journey for you, for your own change and your healing as well.

I think it's important to mention, too, that the healing process for both people is not going to be at the same pace. I think that it's easy to, you know, when we talk about this, and we've talked about it a few times about having, you know, both sets, both spouses and groups is really important and really is going to help the healing process continue. But I think that it is really, though, important to know that if I am a husband and I'm in a seven Pillars group and I'm trying to find healing on my journey, I can't just expect that just because I started a group that my wife's going to want to jump into a betrayal and beyond group, or maybe even eight Pillars group if she's dealing with love addiction or sex addiction by herself. And so I think it's important to know that you can trust the Lord and trust the process, but don't expect that it's going to be an overnight turn and it may take some time. It's important to say that. I think.

Well, that brings up a good point that for some people listening to this, you know, I know my mindset for 10 years as I was married and struggling with pornography, was thinking, well, I need to fix me. And so there would have been opportunities had I found pure desire earlier in our marriage where I probably would have jumped into a group just there to fix me, because that's, you know, I'm going to be the superhero and I'm going to fix it. And it hadn't occurred to me how much healing my wife needed to go through, how much she needed a support structure. And so maybe for someone listening, that's been their mindset of, well, I'm just gonna go fix me. And I hope they hear that that'll be really challenging to do alone. And there are great opportunities for your spouse to find hope and healing through this process also. And so to think about it as a. How can we address this as A couple, and not just as an individual. That might be a change in thinking, but it's tremendously powerful to watch what happens.

Yeah, absolutely.

All right, so let's turn the page a little bit, Tyler, and ask about approaches to involving the spouse. So we've underscored how important it is that couples are involved together or that a single person has some support from their family. So maybe in listening, a person's now motivated. They're thinking, yes, let's do this together. What would be some unhealthy ways, though, that a person might go about asking for that support?

Because I'm sure there are many.

Yeah. How can an addict maybe avoid some pitfalls in trying to recruit or encourage the support of their spouse?

Well, if the addict makes the problem about the spouse, that is not the step to take. If one was to say, you need to work on you, too, you know, in order for us to get healthy, I don't think that would be received well.

I think it's safe to say it will not be received well. Totally.

Yeah.

So another perhaps misstep could be, you know, if you were just a better wife. You can learn how to be a better wife this way. And that's rather blunt, but there are different forms of communicating that same message, and I would just be hesitant to make it about her. So much of this work is around humility and servanthood, and for a lot of people, that is something that may be new for them. So I would just encourage the individual to approach with humility. You know, granted, I brought this stuff into our home. I want to apologize. I want to do all the work that I can possibly do, and to the level of your comfort, I would like you to be a part of that. That's what I would encourage.

Something I've seen, too, is over sharing. Like, you walk into the door, and it's like, let me tell you everything we talked about for the last two hours and sharing. You know, depending on where you're at, as far as the length of your sobriety, you know, we need to have some conversations about when it is okay to disclose and to share your entire sexual history. But I think sometimes, you know, especially if you have a spouse that's not in group and you walk in and you just start sharing, it's going to be information overload. And you're, you know, taking a fire hydrant of all this information and process of your own stuff and just dumping it on. On your spouse. And that, in some ways, can feel really good. As the addicted spouse, like, here's Here it is. And then it's just off my chest, and I can walk away feeling, okay.

But who's carrying that burden?

Right? You just a dump truck of stuff onto your spouse. And so I think that the one thing I would mention is don't overshare. Don't walk in the door and think that you need to share all of this stuff. That's what the group's for. That's why the group structure is so important.

A story that comes to mind from. From our journey about the involvement of the spouse. There came a point in our healing, and my wife had been in a group at this point, but I shared our story with our church. I was pastor at the time, and as a part of our weekend services, shared my story and asked for forgiveness, asked for help, asked for their support in starting the ministry and asked people to contact us that were interested. And my wife would say, that was one of the best days of our lives. Which is kind of strange because it really, you know, pulled back the COVID on some unpleasant things in my life and in our marriage. But what I didn't see coming was how freeing it was for her, because up to that point, it had been my story and my secret. And even if she wanted to talk to somebody else, she felt like. Like, I can't. This is his issue and his secrets. And. But once it was public, it was like, I'm free and people can talk to me and I can talk to them. And it was so liberating. And I relate that to this question of how could you approach your spouse? Is that idea of she may be has or he has had no one else to talk to because it's your secret and it's your issue, and they feel uncomfortable, you know, bringing it up with family or in laws or friends. They don't. They don't want to defame you or shame you, so they've just had nowhere to share. And to be able to go to your spouse and say, honey, I care about you and I'm working. I'm going to work really hard on this change, and I hope you're going to see it and watch me. But I wonder if. If it wouldn't be helpful for you to have a place to process, a place where you could be honest. You could look at all the ways that this has hurt you and be with others that have had similar experiences and hear their stories and to paint it in that light, not like you said, tyler, go work on you. But, hey, what about a safe place for you to process? Because this has been painful or this has been a part of our marriage. And in that light, I think many spouses are like, well, yeah, I'd like to be able to talk to someone and others that have gone through the same thing that can relate and have empathy. Wow, that could be powerful. And so it would draw them to it.

But be patient in that. I mean, that's what I would say is don't expect, again, that conversation to be a one time or maybe just one month. It may take a year to that point. It may take years to get to that point where you're having these consistent conversations where some sobriety and health is being established and then the openness becomes more and more, and then they're willing to do it. So don't feel like this is the silver bullet to get healing in your family to just an overnight success, because let's be honest, we all want that kind of success in everything we do. But that's not the reality of marriage or of healing. So just be aware that, again, it's going to take some time.

Indeed, it's amazing how many spouses have stepped into that support group and in a short, relatively short period of time said, that is exactly what I needed. People in that same place that I am, or people who have been where I'm at and can speak truth into that and encouragement. It's amazing the help and support that is received through that type of group work.

Just one really creative idea we heard from a church that we work with in terms of engaging spouses. And so this was a situation where the men's groups were for the addict and the women's groups were for healing. So I'll be using that terminology, but the gals, a couple of the women that had gone through the process of a healing group, they had written some letters to other women and done it in a way that it wasn't personalized, but more of a. This could be shared with anyone. And it was sharing their experience and an encouragement of what they would say to a woman, of why they should consider this group. And so a husband who was coming to group and his wife was not supportive or not engaged could take that letter home from another woman to his wife that just would say, you know, here's a little bit of my story. Here's. Here's why the group was so helpful to me and why I'd encourage you to come and check it out. And so then the wife in this case wasn't just hearing the encouragement from the husband. She was hearing it from another Woman. And I thought, boy, that's a great idea. And so that may be something that other churches could implement, or if your spouse is resistant. But, you know, a friend of theirs who has gone through the process could kind of recruit them to say, hey, would you mind talking to this person? Because a lot of times our spouses, they've heard some of the same lines from us and are maybe more resistant. But if a friend can come and say, here's been my experience. Let me share with you, that might really open them up to entering into a group situation.

Absolutely.

Hey, could I ask a question off script and just get your thoughts on something?

Absolutely.

We're hearing more and more from spouses who will say, well, I shared with my wife, and she said, well, yeah, you should fix it and change. But I'm fine. I'm not hurt. It doesn't bother me. And I think we're hearing that more perhaps in an Internet generation where people have grown up with pornography being so prevalent that one response of women has just been to kind of distance themselves from it and say, well, so long as it's not other women or real people. Do what you have to do and just don't tell me about it. And so they're kind of insulating themselves in that way. I'm just curious, from a counseling perspective, when you hear that from a spouse, I'm fine. Doesn't bother me. Do you think that's true, or do you think that's a bit of a smokescreen for how they're dealing with the situation?

I think it depends on the individual. It may be true for her. My question to her would be, how are you supporting him to become the man God designed him to be?

So what about for those that might be their way of kind of trauma, Blocking the trauma, if you will, that they just kind of turn off that dial, if you will, and act like, well, I'm fine. It doesn't bother me. That's become maybe a defensive mechanism. How might a spouse get around that defense mechanism?

I would likely ask, is there a way our relationship could be strengthened and let her run with that question or the response? Pure Desire has developed a great couples resource that could be very helpful in addressing some of that denial. And it's called Connected Building a bridge to intimacy. That may be a resource to get the spouse engaged, Begin to talk about some of these issues because they are impacting her whether she's aware of it or not. So much of this behavior can be directly connected to what we term an intimacy disorder. Just the Inability to perhaps acquire that language of intimacy. A language of intimacy is speaking from the heart about emotions, thoughts, feelings, those types of things. And if she's not aware that there is a language of intimacy, he's not aware of it. Then they go through life less than fully fulfilled.

Yeah, yeah, we talk about that here in terms of our family systems that all of us grew up in homes that we think, well, it was. It was normal or it was fine. But that might be because it's the only family we knew, and that's how we define normal. And we don't realize that certain patterns or behaviors were not healthy or were kind of a dysfunction that was being passed through the generations. And when we learn health, and that's not to blame the family or make them the point of our situation, but to recognize, boy, here's things that were kind of faulty. And, man, it can be so much better. I think the same thing happens in the marriage relationship. If it's the only marriage we've ever known, we feel like, well, I guess that's just what marriage is like, and we don't see how much better it could be, what levels of intimacy or connection and ability to be vulnerable with one another and on the same page, on the same team. So I think it's really important in churches that we allow there to be testimonies and for couples to share that have walked through group and have experienced healing together, for them to share their story of how they're connecting, how they're able to talk and be real and face issues together. I think that speaks to other couples listening, because then they realize what they could have, and they hunger for change, not just because they want to come out of the pain, especially if it's a situation where they don't think they're being hurt. But what might encourage them is the vision of, as you said, Tyler, how much our relationship could improve. And when they hear someone else talk about it and kind of see that reality painted for them, that might really help a couple engage that had been hesitant up to that point.

Yeah. Okay, so this has been great. Tyler, we appreciate your insight into this. And, you know, as I asked this. This last question, we asked this last question, really, every episode. And so besides picking up a couple of the copies of Connected and starting the conversation that way, maybe what are some final. Encourage encouragements that you'd give to hurting people out there who know that healing is so very needed, but doesn't have that support from their spouse or their.

Family in this season. Press into it. Press into the work press into the support press into those group of people who know what you're experiencing, know what you're going through, and can speak truth and encouragement into that. This isn't the rest of the story. As you do the work well, your spouse will see change and she'll desire to be a part of that change. He or she will.

Yeah, that's good.

Yeah. I think we have to really evaluate do I want my spouse involved so that they'll change. Because as you mentioned earlier, when our desire is to change them or to have them get fixed, it's going to twist our motivation and our wording and the way we relate to them. And so it's really good to come back to that place of saying, I'm going to focus on me, not in an unhealthy way, but in terms of going to focus on my change, my commitments, my phone calls, my group homework, and I'm just going to go all in. And it really is a statement of trust to say, lord, I'm going to trust that if I do everything you're asking me to do and I focus on all the changes I need to make, I'm going to trust that you'll use that and you'll be speaking to the heart of my spouse and you'll be encouraging them to take steps they need to take. Because as we find so often in life, the greatest way to change other people is to focus on changing ourselves. Because when we focus on changing them, that doesn't work immediately. We hit a brick wall of resistance. But when we just focus on how God wants to change us, that becomes an open door for others to step into that change also.

Yeah. And it just, it's more confirmation. I felt the word of the day today was humble. Just be humble, be receptive, be available for what God has for you. And so it's a. It's a good, so good stuff, guys. Thanks, Tyler. Thank you again. Nick, Privilege.

Thank you.

Yeah, this is really a tough topic and situation for men and women out there. And we just appreciate you guys insight and wisdom on it. So we really appreciate it.

Thank you.

Good times.

Yeah. And we just want to make sure that any listeners out there who are currently in this spot or situation hear me when I say this, and we're all saying this. You are not alone. You are not alone. Yes, you are in a really tough spot. But don't let that deter you from finding, healing and really getting healthy. Because the best thing you can do, really, is to get free from sexual addiction and trust that God will process you through this and will bring about change in your household. So don't give up. All right? And thank you for listening to the Pure Desire Podcast. If you like what you're hearing and want to keep up with the podcast, please subscribe and check out our website, PureDesire.org. you can also rate and review our podcast and let us know how we're doing. For more information, check out our website, PureDesire.org. you can follow us on social mediauredesirepdmi. Once again, that's your DesirePDMI. We'll see you next time. Thanks for listening to the Pure Desire Podcast. For more information, check out our website, www.puredesire.org. check in each week for new content on the podcast and we pray that it will help you find hope and freedom on your journey to purity.