180 - Present For The Holidays: Managing Stress

You're listening to the Pure Desire podcast. Your safe place to find hope, healing, and freedom from sexual addiction, betrayal and relationship issues. Merry a week away Christmas, everybody. I'm your host, Trevor Windsor, and you're listening to episode 180 of the Pure Desire podcast. Here joining me as always, is my co host, Nick Stumbo.

Like a good neighbor. See, I was. I was leaving it because I figured all over the country people would be finishing it for me. And sure, it's like crowd participation, right? And we just had our producer participate in the podcast. I hope people can hear the echoes of his. His charming voice.

That was.

That was.

It wasn't bad. It wasn't bad. That was your head voice, right? That wasn't your chest voice, for sure. Oh, sorry, falsetto. Whatever you. I don't know. Some people are picky about that. Okay, so we are continuing on in our present for the holidays season. A few things real quick. Subscribe to the podcast. If you are not subscribed. Honestly, what are you doing with your life? Just do it. It's really. It's free. Every new episode shows up in your inbox in your podcast player. Just do it. And if you can write us a review, that actually would be more helpful. Even if you don't subscribe but still write a review, we're game with that. Also, follow us on social media, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, earedesirepdmi, and if you want to consume video content, we do have clips of these episodes and some other videos up as well on YouTube. Just search Pure Desire Ministries. Okay, so we want to talk about real quick, the last thing before we get into the episode. We have started a new giving campaign that we are titling stories of healing.

Yeah, and you just mentioned it. Even, like with the reviews, we have the privilege here at Pure Desire of hearing from people every week about how a podcast changed their life. An interview they heard sent their marriage on a different trajectory. A group they were involved in rescued them from something. It's amazing to see how God has used this ministry. And as excited as we are about every single one of those stories and the way that it fuels us to keep doing it, we know we're only scratching the surface. I mean, the numbers that are out there when it comes to our sexual addiction and sexual brokenness, and particularly during this season of COVID are honestly worse than ever. And we just have this burden where we say, there's so much work to be done. Lord, would you equip us and help us have the resources to reach more people? And so we're kind of putting a call out to all of you that listen and would say, in some way this ministry has touched my life. And the Stories of Healing is our invitation to say, join with us. I mean, you're already with us in terms of your words and your encouragement, but would you be willing to take a little piece of your finances and partner with us on a monthly basis to say, I want to be a part of, of someone else experiencing healing in the way that I have, or my family or my loved ones. And so we see how even when you make a small donation, I mean, a small donation made monthly adds up over time. And so you might be listening feeling like, well, I don't have much to give. I don't have a big huge savings pot that I can just drop down 20 GS on some.

Well, me neither.

Yeah, almost no one does, but I'm guessing we could say, boy, at 20 bucks a month, you know, you multiply that over years and decades, you can make a difference. And more than just making a difference, it's how you feel like you're then a part of the mission because you really are entering into this work with us in your support, in your prayers, and our ability then to track with you as you're a monthly donor. We will send updates and kind of keep you in the, in the news, so to speak, of what's happening, how God's using people's donations. So we just want to ask, wherever you're at, whether it's a small amount or a large amount, if you would jump in with us as a monthly donor, you could be a part of the next Stories of Healing. And we really believe that God can use all of us together to make a difference in this world.

Yep. And so just ask yourself this question. If I were to financially give to pure Desire, what stories of healing could I create? So if you want to give, whether it's monthly or if you do also want to just give a one time gift, go to PureDesire.org stories All right, so as I said, this is the third week of the Present for the Holidays series. And we had Dan Howey, our online group administrator. Administrator.

Is that the right title?

Sounds good.

Yeah.

I'm not great with titles around here, if you remember, but I remember that sounds like a good title to me.

Okay. We had him on to talk about managing stress.

Yes. And I think a very important topic and timely. I mean, any holiday season. But when you add a holiday season that also includes Covid measures and ongoing political turmoil and it just, it's a season where those kind of negative emotions and stress can creep up on us and really cause havoc in our lives and relationships before we're aware of it, if we're not being proactive to pay attention. And so to me, that's the goal of this episode is not whether or not we're going to have stress, and that comes up several times, but the question of when stress comes up, how will I deal with it? We mentioned this in an episode or two ago that stress can have a positive impact, that it can take us actually towards some healthy steps that get us moving. I mean, it's stress that causes muscles to grow. So not all stress is bad, but it's what do we do with that stress to keep it from taking us to old, unhealthy places. And I think Dan offers some great perspective. He's been living this recovery journey for a while now, and so just great to hear from him. And obviously we throw in our two cents and I hope people get a lot out of this on how they're going to deal with stress because it's a reality for all of us.

Yeah. And this episode may be challenging, but really press in because managing stress in a healthy way is possible. So enjoy. Dan, thanks for being here.

So glad to be here.

Be honest, Dan, are you a little salty today?

Today has been this week, let's put it, let's just back it up a bit. This week has been a challenge and I have stress management opportunities abounding. So it's very appropriate topic. Very appropriate.

So yes, as you heard in the intro, we were talking about managing stress. So we actually didn't orchestrate you to have a stressful week or did you in preparation for this. But I'm okay. So the polar express of the holiday season is still chugging along. We all know this. And contrary to how culture, movies, music, how it all presents it, the holiday season has and usually is very stressful, has potential to be and also really emotional. And in our work in recovery, we know this pushes us to wanting to isolate, using unwanted behaviors to really run away from those unwanted emotions, those unwanted experiences. And so as we often talk about, being spiritually, emotionally and physically present is key to living in health. This is week three of our four week series titled present features for the holidays. And we are gonna talk about managing stress.

Let's manage together.

So this is where me and Nick don't talk and you just carry the entire episode.

All right, folks.

Okay. So we all know the holidays can be pretty stressful. But I don't know if we can always pinpoint why or where those stressful points are. So let's just name some of the things that really are stressful points. Um, like think of a minefield. What are those ones in the holiday season that could blow off at any point and cause stress?

Yeah. And these are really individual because for me could be completely different for you. And I think what is important is we start to be able to step back and realize how we're responding to see where. What's really stressful. For a long time, um, having a lot of people in the house felt like a great way for. It was kind of a way for me to hide. Yeah. Because there was all sorts of people and I could kind of disengage and kind of move to the background. So. But I also realize now it was really stressful because I felt like now I've got to do all this stuff. So now I'm, now I'm overloaded with things to do. So for me, things like having extra family in the house could be a pressure point. Certainly I think we can all talk about money and the holidays are not a cheap time of year.

So unless you're that one friend who never gets gifts for anybody. Right.

Yes. Yeah, that's true, Trevor. And you know, and then obviously our closest relationships, I mean, if they're under stress, we'll probably take on or at least experience some of that as well. It's certainly going to impact us. So those are the super easy off the top ones.

Yeah, I came up with the list and if we're playing Boggle, you got three of mine. I had three more that I still could get points for. But I was thinking about things like unmet expectations. I think that's a big one for the holidays where we maybe expect something's going to go a certain way or especially this year, as we're still in Covid. Depending on when a person listens to this, they may have forgotten a little bit, but that there may be a lot of things this year that simply don't happen. And that unmet expectation of, oh, this is what I thought it was going to be can be really stress inducing. Another one is busy schedules. Just, we want to go to this party, we need to see this family, we need to go to that event and we need to shop for these kids and we need to donate to that program and this church function and all of them good things in and of themselves. But I think a lot of families look at a calendar and go, whoa, whoa, where did we go wrong? And now it feels like work and a chore again. Maybe that won't be as much this year with COVID issues, but I think the busyness of the season, another major one I see that is stress inducing, particularly in our social media world, is comparison that we see the Joanna and Chip Gaines inspired living room setting with a tree that's perfect. And gifts that these ship layers. Yeah. And all the furniture is from some fancy place. And look at our living room and it's like, dang, you know, and suddenly I feel bad about my life that two minutes earlier I didn't.

Not that we don't like Chip and Joanna. Let's be really clear.

They're great, but they can create expectations that are unrealistic. And I think it's so easy to compare right now to, oh, this family went to Disneyland and we didn't even go to McDonald's, you know, those kind of things. Which, which then also the last one I thought of was what I would call contradicting traditions. I think within families is a big one where I'm used to opening gifts early on Christmas morning in our pajamas. And my wife's family's used to getting up, getting ready, getting dressed, taking pictures, you know, and opening gifts sometime by lunch.

Just like pictures before presents.

I'm telling you, these people exist. So just one of the many examples. If you as a couple, as a family haven't really thought these through. My guess is you're coming up to things like, dang it, every year we have the same argument. We get into this. I let her down, she lets me down. We're frustrated and often it's just because we have those expectations and traditions that if we haven't figured out a new way to do it together as a couple, as a family, it just, it creates all the stress. And even if things go well, sometimes there's stress of. Well, this has been a fight in the past. So now I'm stressed about is it going to be a fight this year? So sometimes our history works against us.

Yeah, I think I would. The only one I'd add is to the schedule piece is like a lack of a rhythm. I think that in my day. I know, I know for me, like right now we've got a six month old who is not sleeping and he is constantly disrupting, disrupting my normal daily rhythm. And so I don't get to do the things that I. I literally wake up at five so that I can read, I can journal, I can work out. Right now I May be reading, journaling every other day and I'm not working out. And for me, I feel like those are things I put in. I know those are things I put in place to help me be healthy. But because of the season we're in and he's not sleeping, please pray for me. It disrupts my rhythm. And I think that the holiday season always disrupts rhythm because there's all these new things that are not part of our weekly daily routine. And so I think that what we do is we know it's coming, but it's not like we actually do anything to plan for it. We're just like, well, it's just gonna be crazy and chaos. But I think that's, that's for me and I again.

And some people thrive off that. I mean, there's literally some people who love it. They're like, great. This is like going to be an adventure every day for the next, you know, Thanksgiving and New Year's and they love it. And then for others, it's like, wow, just like what you're talking about. So, yeah, you have to know that, you know, especially within your family.

Yeah. Go back and listen to the first episode of this series, Emotional Awareness. It'll help you.

Yeah.

Well, a lot of what we're describing, guys, as we think about the holidays, these are what are joyful moments. In fact, some of what we've described are both joyful and stressful. So why is there so much stress around activities that we would usually think of as being joyful? Gift giving, parties, get togethers. Why do those things go together?

It seems like there's like, you hit on it earlier. For me, this, this expectations, whether they're spoken or unspoken or even if you know them or don't know them or can recognize them, it all for me comes down to expectations. I, I hope that it goes this way because if it does, I'll feel comfortable and maybe I'll make you happier. Maybe I'll make me happy. So this joyful time, it's like I have a shot at making everyone happy, but I have a shot of, you know, blowing it up. So these expectations for me really have to be managed because a joyful, a potentially joyful situation can turn on a dime if I'm unaware.

And I think part of the, the picture that's painted for us is how families need to unite at these times. And I think, man, I have friends who's like, they don't like their families. They don't. Being around them is not healthy.

They feel like obligations Right.

And so, and again, that's the comparison. And then also the expectation where it's supposed to be this thing where everyone's sitting around like a well lit room, everyone's, you know, dressed to the nines and someone carved the perfect, perfect turkey. Right. Which I don't care. I'd rather have stuffing if I'm being honest. But like, I think that there is this, this is the expectation or what's taught to me or the, the culture that. What the culture is telling me about this. But the experience, my expectation with my family is not the same thing. And so a couple things I think. One, it's really hard to draw boundaries like that in general. And so I think that that causes stress because I don't want to tell my family no when it's the holidays. And this is supposed to be, quote unquote, the time I hang out with them. But then the other piece is there's also that shame that if I do, I know how people are going to respond. I know that if I draw those boundaries, the response I'm going to get is not always going to be pop. People are going to go, thanks for drawing a boundary and that we can't see each other this Christmas. Right. Like, no one's going to thank you for that. And so I think that you're kind of in this double bind, consistently in that. And a lot of that tends to revolve around family.

Yeah.

Yeah. Well, I think just like the question kind of implies, it can be healthy for us to acknowledge things may coexist, that it may both be stressful and a joyful thing we want to do. I think about for us, like that process of gift buying and gift giving to our kids. We enjoy that. We want to do that. But, you know, this year my wife made a comment like maybe we could just not do gifts. And I'm like, what? It's so much fun. It's great. And she's like, oh, so are you going to get the list from all the kids and are you going to figure out what stores to shop at and how much wrapping paper do we need and do we have boxes? And she lists off like eight things that admittedly she does more of than I do. I usually come in last minute and help with the wrapping. Like, you did a great job on the gift, babe.

We did so good this year.

Awesome. And I mean, I do a little more than that, but not much. But that, that's a very real thing of. You have people. Well, there's also bathrooms to clean and Things to put away. And that's stress and fun. And so I think there do need to be conversations where we kind of recognize what level of stress are we willing to bring on ourselves in order to do the kind of things we want to do? And then making some choices to say, you know, it's the level of stress that will go into that. We need to maybe alter our approach to it, do something a little different this year.

I think that principle, too, can be applied to any area of growth, in recovery, in your marriage, in parenting, that there is this stepping into stress or discomfort in order for the benefit or the fruit of that. So I think that's a good principle to just hold onto. Okay, so I think this is probably more true in 2020 maybe than any year before. But. And I know for me, like, the way I would describe it is I felt stress in my shoulders for the first few months. I could just physically feel stress building. And so there tend to be in life, and especially, like I'm saying this year, stress that goes on under the surface that we don't. We couldn't exactly pinpoint or tell you where it's coming from. And so if we are experiencing that, what does it look like to actually identify where that stress is coming from? How do we recognize. That's the question. How do we recognize stress in our life?

Yeah. Well, I think a few podcasts ago, we talked about the faster scale, and that is a really. I mean, that's what it points to. It's like, how do you identify? And we often, we can't really identify our beliefs in the moment, but we certainly can identify our behaviors. And if we're spending time understanding how we behave when we're under stress, we can. And sharing that with our trusted people in our lives, we can really start to hone in on, hey, are you speeding up? My wife will ask that of me. Hey, Dan, do you think you're speeding up? No. No, I've been ticked off, clearly. Yeah, but she can. She can identify these things and she doesn't. I mean, she's really good at it. She's not like, you're speeding up. She's like, tell me, what do you think? But just starting to identify the behaviors that we go to when we're under stress can really help because like you said, this is not a rhythm thing. We don't do Christmas 12 times a year. We do it once a year.

Oh, Jesus, thank you.

And yes, Jesus, thank you. Literally so, I mean, we aren't going to see the same stressors any other time of year. So that's.

And I think you already hit on it a little, Trevor. That it's a very real thing to pay attention to our bodies because our body doesn't lie and sometimes we may be reacting to something physically before mentally we become aware of what we're reacting to. So and that's not to say that every physical symptom is related to stress. I mean, maybe you just had a bad night of sleep and you're sore and groggy, your back hurts because you're old. Yeah. If you notice tightness in your shoulders, stiffness in your chest, just attention in your muscle, like okay, what, what have I been thinking about? What's maybe been in my subconscious? That if I really just took a two minute break, took some deep breaths and said, what am I feeling? It's very likely that maybe a certain situation or a certain person or a certain stress will come to my like, wow, I didn't realize I was thinking about these in laws coming or having to go to that store or that work party or whatever it is. But your body may be trying to tell you something. So I think paying attention to that and the other thing that I look for, particularly in my own life is just where do I have unusual reactions? Yep. When am I too tense, too bitter, too sarcastic, too angry? And I can just feel it in my interactions like, wow, all my kid was asking for was could I get them some milk?

Yeah.

And the way I said get it yourself was. I mean it was maybe appropriate to say you could get it yourself. But the tone I used was wow.

Yeah.

So okay, that's a pause to say what created that kind of reaction? Because it's more than just my son needing milk. There's something else going on here. And, and paying attention when you're overreacting to say, okay, got to figure out what's going on here.

And don't minimize the underreacting.

Yeah.

For someone like me, it's like, honey, honey, I've been talking to you.

Right.

Well. And I haven't been listening.

Well, if your spouse has asked you maybe, or like maybe not just a spouse, but if a family member or someone you're in close community with, most likely your spouse says are you okay? Like you're not acting normal, that's a pretty good indicator that something's off. And it probably has to do with some stress about a double bind that you don't want to experience.

Right.

Like, so I think the under reacting is huge. Yeah. That's, I think that one Is harder to identify.

Oh, yeah, because you'll just say, yeah, I'm fine.

Right. Because anger is a negative reaction. Right. But if I'm just like. Like I haven't done anything wrong at that point. But that doesn't mean that there's stuff going on on the surface.

Yeah, yeah. And an unwillingness to engage may also show that's a way your brain is coping by just trying to stay distant from it.

Yeah.

So we've already alluded to a couple of things, and some of this might seem obvious, but let's really talk through. How does stress relate to our addictions and coping behaviors? What are the connection points we see between those things?

Well, addiction 101 will try to avoid whatever we don't want to feel. And stress often brings out these emotions because we're conveying or connecting an emotion to a belief, and that belief is something we don't want to address or don't want to feel. So in order to not feel that, I'm going to do anything or something to avoid it. So really understanding what our belief systems are and what we believe is key to understanding how we cope. Just like we talked about my. When I was spending time in the kitchen, I was just avoiding. I mean, that was my. My way to. To back out and not have to deal with conversations and talk to people and feel uncomfortable. So, yeah, you just have to know that whatever stress you have, your body, your mind is definitely going to want to avoid it. And. And coping is. Can come in all sorts of ways.

And. And if you continue down that path, coping actually makes it more stressful because you haven't dealt with it. You ran away and you felt good for a second, but then you'll hit a low where that coping behavior is not filling that gap anymore, that void. And then you're going to run right back into the stress and be like, well, I thought I ran away from this. Why is it still there? And you go to another coping behavior, and stress in some ways is like whack a mole. It's just gonna show up. Like, either you can deal with it or you can, like, walk away. It's your decision. You know what I mean? But you got a hammer in your hand, Might as well use it, like.

Take care of it.

Right?

Well, I think you brought up a really important point, Dan, and that's that the stress itself is one thing, but identifying the message under the stress. Because I think too often we just say, well, I'm just under a lot of stress, or we're just really Busy. But usually there's also a message of, well, the reason I'm under a lot of stress is because I feel the pressure to have my house clean for these guests coming over. Because I'm fearful if my house isn't clean, I'll be judged, and I'll be seen as a less worthy mom or dad or parent. And I don't want to feel that way. So I want my house to be spotless. Well, so it's not just the house cleaning. It's actually the message of I don't want to be seen as worthless that's driving us. And it's those underlying messages that I think are really what drive us into addictive behavior and coping behaviors. It's not necessarily the stress we're dealing with. It's the answer to that negative message that says, well, I don't feel good enough or worthy. Oh, well, fantasy or coping behaviors can provide that relief. Where I feel good enough, I feel worthy, even in a totally fake or fantasy kind of way. So paying attention to those messages, I think is super important. And the other thing that I would really encourage in this area, there's definitely acting out with our addictions or coping behaviors that can take place because of the stress. But there's also a secondary driver of what happens after stress, because stress really has the tendency to deplete us, to wear us down. It sucks away our emotional energy. It even kind of burns through our emotional and physical reserves where we're just. We're kind of down and done. And I've talked to so many people that that's when their relapses occurred. It wasn't. I was super stressed out, and so I just ran off and, you know, looked at porn and medicated. It was actually two days after the family left. Everything was quiet. I was all alone, and I just totally messed up because they weren't aware of how depleted stress had made them. So I think that's what we want to be conscious of in this season. We're going to feel stress, but the question of how am I responding to it and what am I doing to get back to healthy places mentally, emotionally, physically, relationally, without running to those old coping patterns, Whether that's pornography or drinking or whatever kind of escape I've come up with.

Yeah. So let's. Let's kind of go off that a little bit. Let's go with how if we can recognize stress. I'm going to tweak this question a little bit because I think we've already talked about some of the Ways that we run away from stress or we try to deal with it, coping behaviors, avoidance, that kind of thing. In, in the context of both of those types of responses, what are some unhealthy ways that we mask dealing with stress? Like where. And I don't know if you guys are catching what I'm saying, but, like, I think that there are some things that we do that, like, seem like a normal response, but it's actually not. It's a way for us to cope or to manage it in an unhealthy way. Do you guys ever experience that?

Well, yeah, Most of my coping mechanisms were designed to make others comfortable. So withdrawing or being super nice or ultra serving all seem like really good things. Like, man, that guy, what a godly man. He's. Wow, they are lucky to have him because look, he just spent an hour and 20 minutes washing the dishes. Meanwhile. Meanwhile, I'm over in the corner. A, being resentful that I'm doing this and no one's helping, and B, thankful that I don't have to listen to Uncle Joe talk about the same story from his childhood again. That I know is bs, you know, so it's like all these things where I'm masking what I really feel. And. And anytime I know that my inner critic or inner voice is making judgments and going to court and things like that, I know that I'm. I'm masking.

Right.

Vulnerability and authenticity.

Well, and I think some obvious ones, we take out stress on the wrong people.

Yeah.

You know, we're stressed about the family that's coming over, but we're taking out the stress on our own spouse or our kids because they're not helping. And can't you see how busy I am? And maybe it would be appropriate to ask for their help.

Yeah.

But when we just kind of explode on them, we're. We're really trying to manage stress in an unhealthy way.

Yeah.

Another thing that I think we do a lot of in the holidays is the idea of just get through it. We just got to get through the holidays. And. Which is really kind of a way of saying, I'm going to ignore how I'm feeling. I'm going to ignore my needs, which are real. I'm going to ignore things I could do for health or for emotional recovery and just plow on through. It's a little bit like we're just prolonging the crash and maybe increasing the likelihood that something negative will happen if we're just getting through it. That emotional explosion that running to our coping behaviors is probably only becoming more and more likely. So if you hear yourself saying that kind of phrase, like, well, we just got to get through it. It's like, wait, really? Maybe we could hit pause for a day and do something relaxing if that's how we're feeling. Like, let's look at a way to mix it up. Because I don't want to get to the end of the holiday saying, thank goodness that's over. I want to get to the end of it going, you know, we had a really nice time together, or we had a really good trip, or it was really enjoyable to see them. So asking that question, what would you need to alter to truly make those experiences that you do have planned most likely to be a good experience?

Yeah. Yeah. I think one of the. My wife will tell you this. When I get stressed, I'll go clean. And I just, like, I saw over serve. Right. Or like. And what I'm. What I'm actually doing is running away. I'm. I'm withdrawing. And what's interesting, too, is I've justified it, that I just need to think. And what that means is, like, I mean, and sometimes that can look healthy or that can be healthy. Like, I just need a break. Give me 15 minutes, I'll come back and we'll talk. But the indicator is when I don't come back and I haven't actually thought about it. I just, like, threw in a, you know, a podcast or listening to a book or watching something on my computer while I'm doing the dishes. You know what I mean? And so I think that this is probably one of the. My guess is that very few of us recognize those unless we're really out to find them, because we are going to have people that are just like, thank you for doing the dishes, Dan. That's just really means a lot. Like, it allowed me to just experience family, you know, while the whole time you're, like, in your mind flipping that person off.

Yeah.

Saying like, I did it so I don't have to talk to you, Doris. Like, right. And so I think that. I think this would be my encouragement to listeners is try to identify those in the season. Try to look for those times where you're actually running away, withdrawing or overreacting in a way that you can justify it. And that may happen after you blow up or after you withdraw, but at least identifying that and maybe journaling about it, writing it down, having a conversation with a group member or your spouse at a Probably another time about it. I think that that could be a helpful way to identify those like masked or cloaked ways that we try to manage with stress that are actually unhealthy.

Yeah. One other thing I just thought of is sometimes we create a boundary or a barrier in the guise that it's protective of me when really we're. We're protecting us from having to face our feelings. So if you don't want to talk to Aunt Jane.

Right.

And you're like, I'm just. I cannot talk to you this, this holiday season. I love you, but we cannot interact.

That's such a fine line. Right, Right.

Is it true?

Yeah.

Is that. Is that truly what you need or is this just a way to avoid.

Yeah.

So, yeah.

And questions like that are going to be answered in relationship with other people, in community, with people that know you. To say, okay is not going to. This a healthy step for us or is us just avoiding something that we need to do? And having those conversations, I find is. Is really beneficial. So we're starting to lean into more forward thinking, solution thinking here, but let's keep going with that. What does it actually look like to handle stress in a healthy way, particularly.

At this time of year, eating lots of food, maybe?

You said what is in a healthy way? Dan went through kind of the unhealthy ways.

Vegetables.

We don't want people getting drunk off.

Drunk off food.

Yeah.

That's hard.

It's not.

Okay. Healthy ways. Okay. So you kind of touched on it. Right. Just then. Community. I mean, you're talking about. The addiction thrives in isolation. And if we are isolated, even though we're around a lot of people and talking and doing things, you know, that is not community and it's certainly not vulnerability. So maintain your true intimate relationships and be honest with those. That is absolutely number one. And that's the hardest one for me because I'll just be busy enough that I can't return a phone call or make a phone call. And then you talk about self care. You know, if you've done the three circles exercises, that's not the time to ignore that last. That outer circle. You have to be able to continue within the confines. You maybe have to adjust it somehow. Like you're talking about, I don't get to work out, but I'm. I'm reading and journaling.

Yeah.

What do I do? How do I maintain some semblance of.

Self care, which is managing our own expectations and then also doing what we can to still maintain health in those healthy habits? Yeah. That's good. I think for Me, something I've been learning recently is that I'm a verbal processor, which no one's surprised by. But what I've learned is that I don't actually process. I more vent. And what I've actually learned is that venting not only makes me more angry, but actually multiplies, duplicates my anger with the other person. So if I vent to you, Nick, and I'm telling you all the things that our producer, Justin has done wrong, the likelihood is I'll actually be more angry. And then you also will be angry.

Oh, that Justin.

Right, like.

Or I'll be defending him. Yeah, right, that Trevor.

But if you. If you're just like, that's put. Someone comes up to you and says, like, tell me what's going on. And then you vent, they're just like, man, yeah, that just right. Like, I think very few people will just, you know, hit you in the mouth with truth. And so what I have. What I've had to work on is not calling my venting verbal processing, but more of looking at processing as sharing how I'm feeling and inviting people's perspective into that. Because usually venting is just me spewing out and then someone receiving what I'm saying, they're just getting my perspective. But if I'm actually processing, that's got to involve other perspective, questions and answers, more conversation. And that's done in the context of community. And so stop calling verbal processing or stop calling my venting verbal processing. That's a practical one for me.

I think at the same time, we do have to just acknowledge that a healthy way to deal with stress is to talk it through, to be honest about it. I think sometimes in the holiday season, we feel like it's noble to not bring it up when really it's just going to create bigger problems. So if you need to go to your spouse and be honest with them to say, I'm really feeling a lot of stress about going to your family's house. And they say, oh, well, let's talk about that. I didn't know that. Or, why are you feeling that way? Or if you're the spouse listening to this, maybe you need to be the one that goes to them and says, hey, how are you feeling about having our families over Christmas Day? What do you feel good about? What are you nervous? And just kind of get those things out and not feel like, well, I don't want to tell anyone I'm really stressed, because then they'll feel like I'm a bird. If something is really Creating those emotions. You need to talk to people that care. And that can be part of the solution. I think also having that self honesty and honesty as a family about the season of life that you're in to just say, maybe other years we've done this or been able to do that, but right now, this year, because of the number of kids we have or where we're at with jobs or Covid, it's not going to make sense this year. And that's expressing boundaries in a different kind of way. Not necessarily about other people, but just what do we need to say? This is all we can do and that's okay. We're not going to compare to the family on Facebook that we see that seems to have something going on every night of the week. Like we're okay with what we've chosen to do and that can be really, really valuable. Just finding gratitude and peace in the choices you have made.

I've heard someone say, and I can't remember the quote, but basically the premise is that learning and accepting our limits is actually how we live the healthiest life. That if we're always trying to do more or be more like this person or that person, we're not accepting the limits that we have. And that's actually causing us to like, redline and overdo things. And so that's been a challenge for me personally because I like to do fun things and just go, go, go. But I've learned that it actually almost looks more to like, I tend to be a more godly Christ like version of myself when I accept my limitations and live in a healthy way within them rather than trying to like, bust through and do new things.

Yeah, yeah. One of the other things that helps cope well or cope better is a mindset where you're choosing to believe the best about others. So in other words, I'm not walking in. I don't do it with you, but that's okay. But walking in with the expectations that they will receive the. At least receive it with an open, open mind. We often go in or I often go in ready to defend my position. That's all right. Okay. I need to. I need to talk this through. So I'm gonna. Here's my backup argument. And there's. There's 2A. And then if they don't go there, I'm gonna slip right into C. And then, you know, so I think if I'm just like, hey, let's talk about this versus, you know, I've got a.

That's good.

Be really ready for it. So.

So we've already talked about this a little bit, the idea of sharing our stress with people. So how much would you guys say of that stress? Should we share, like, is there too much or should we just share it all?

Well, it depends on who they are.

That's good. Yeah.

We'll start with. Start with the people that you. That you trust and know your story and have earned the right to. To hear it.

Yeah.

Certainly we want to be as vulnerable and. And transparent as we can be with everyone, but, you know, there's. Not everyone is trustworthy and not everyone's going to be a healthy sounding board. And it may not even be safe. You know, how many times have you told someone something, never expecting it to go beyond that room or be understood in a way that you didn't expect?

Because we know the people. Like, I could tell you in my family, if I wanted to justify my own position in something, I know who in my family I could go talk to and would have my back and wouldn't press in and say, like, hold on a second.

Right.

Like, you're. You're off here. Right. And so it's funny that even in that you can withdraw from community, even though you're, quote, unquote, having a conversation in Community, you're actually isolating by the type of person you're picking.

Absolutely. Yeah.

Yeah. Good to know. I'm not the only one, you know.

So I think the truth is that if I become aware that stress is impacting me, what impacts me impacts others. So if I'm being impacted, I need to find a way to share it with my spouse or my kids and to start. Not so that I burden them with it, but I always try to start with, hey, I realize I'm feeling a lot of stress about this, and I. I feel like it's making me grumpy. And I'm sorry if I'm coming across that way, you know, that both acknowledges some humility to my. Like, if this is to my wife, it acknowledges some humility to her, but it also gives her a window into what I'm feeling. And so I just think that's a really healthy practice that depending who you're around, if it's coworkers or your family, when you realize it's impacting, you find a person that is safe to share. Like, I'm just. I'm really overwhelmed today, and I realize it's making me very isolated and withdrawn. So, you know, if you need something, let me know. And I just realized I'm doing That and I wanted to let you know. And I think typically when it's more self focused about, I'm just trying to share with you what's impacting me because I recognize it might impact you too. It's easy for people to be thankful for that. It's like, oh, well, yeah, thanks for recognizing that. I'll try to think about how I could help or is there anything I could do versus waiting until we blow up with them in anger and they're like, oh, I'm sorry. And well, now it's going to be hard for them to support us working through our stress.

So, yeah, I think asking like timing is important to not just who, but timing. And I think a good maybe front door to just gauging that is asking permission. Like, I feel really stressed right now. Do you mind if I share? You know, and if the answer is no, make sure it's no, but yes later. Right? But I think that that way because I think sometimes when we share our stress, we've already talked about it, it stresses those people out too. And so I think that you can get a little bit of gauge on what the right timing is just by asking a question like, like that greed. That's a good lull, guys.

Yeah.

Yes. So let's talk practically here. What are some tips of managing stress that you've experienced that have worked for you guys?

First of all, acknowledging that I'm under pressure or under stress most of the time. And a lot of people I know are just like, yeah, this is the way it is. I just, I know it's going to be this way. Kind of like what you were alluding to earlier. I'm just going to push through. Like I said, managing it correctly really comes down to continuing to look into those activities that really help that really keep us on focus. So I can't get away from that enough.

For me. Journaling has always been really helpful in a number of ways. One, it's just nice to. I feel like oftentimes I get in my own way from being honest about how I feel. But when I journal there's some sort of like defense system I've like bypassed where it's just kind of coming out right through my pen or through, you know, typing. And what's interesting about once I write it down is that I'm actually able to sit, read through what I just wrote and then I can actually see it. It's almost like when you have actually said out loud how you actually feel about something. It's like, I didn't realize I felt that way or I didn't realize that was stressing me out. And so for me, I've had tons, especially over this last, like, year, year and a half, tons of revelation from just writing down. And usually it's in a prayerful tone for me, like I really am using it as a prayer time with the Lord.

Yeah.

Um, and so it allows me to observe what's really going on under the surface. Not every time's that way, but I feel like every week I usually come away with something and then calling people who I know know me, you know, people who. Because it's, it's, it's that. Not calling the friend you know who's going to have your back and high five whatever perspective you have. But it's the friend that, you know tends to challenge you and tends to push in, whether that's your spouse or a group member or just a mentor. So, like, for me, I. I have a guy, Bryant, I call him every week and we talk about it. And I just will say, this is how I'm feeling. We just tell me real quick, like, am I good? Am I off? Like. And we end up having usually a 30 to 45 minute conversation that he didn't like, bash me over the head with truth, but he added perspective. We dialogue back and forth and it allowed me to wrestle with how I'm feeling. And then also those conversations tend to end with now what are you going to do about it? You can't just sit on what we just talked about. So community and then journaling just personally has been helpful for me.

A couple things that come to mind for me is, number one, being proactive. I mean, in all likelihood, if you sat down and thought about the coming week, you could identify the one or two points where you are most likely to feel a lot of stress. And you could be proactive to come up with a better plan. You know, so if you know you're having Friday night dinner guests for a Christmas thing, but you work until 5 and they're coming over at 6, you could pretty well look ahead and go, if I don't make good plans, I'm going to be stressed about getting off work, getting home, getting cleaned up, being ready for. And that will be stressful. Okay, what could we do different? Could I get off work a little early one day? Could we do a lot of preparation Thursday night? Now that you're thinking ahead, it can change that whole dynamic. One of the things I was thinking about in our story along these lines, a stressful thing for me has often been getting our Christmas tree. And part of it is we tend to go later in the afternoon and I start to feel this pressure of it's getting dark, we have to make sure to find the tree. And I get into like this, you know, hunter gatherer mode and like we've got to find it and bag it. But typically my spouse can be more on the experience of we need the hot cocoa and take the pictures. And I'm like, it's getting dark. And well, that's very, very stressful for me when I feel like there's something to get done and others aren't in the same hurry I am. So it's like, well, hey pal, maybe look ahead at your week and say instead of waiting till 3 to load up and go, could we do this at one? Because then we got all kinds of time before dark hits. So just thinking ahead, where's that stress going to come? And then what could I do to kind of navigate it better? The second thing that has been really important for me and this is particularly about the schedules that come during holidays with just being busy morning, noon and night, always having something going on and even fun stuff. But for me, like if a weekend is okay, in the morning we're going to this house, then in the afternoon we're going to go shopping and then in the evening there's this concert in the next. If all of my blocks are filled, that's where I just, I get edgy and I need to know there's going to be a block of time and it could be, you know, a day or two down the road that there's, we don't have to do anything. And that for me kind of becomes the, the light at the end of the tunnel, if you will, where I know, okay, that's the time I can practice some self care. I can take a nap if I want or just relax that morning. So that's what I would encourage everyone just to kind of look at. Where are your blocks of time where you can take time for health, take time for self care, take time to sleep in whatever's important to you for recovery. Because if you know that time of recovery is built into the schedule, then I found I can handle a whole lot of busyness around it because there's kind of some pockets where, okay, I'll get to take a breath there so we can, we can make it work.

And don't be afraid to ask for that because I think that's something too. We think that there's this like selfish factor to it not if it's going to make you a better version for the other things that you have that day. So don't be afraid to ask for it.

For sure. Yeah. Yeah. And just one last thing that you were talking about when you were journaling for me. I struggle to journal, so I'm, I'm on and off.

I gave you a journal. I know.

It's super filled right now, like massively filled.

It's kind of personal that, you know, whether or not he's written in his journal, Trevor, I just.

I just am assuming that, Sorry, I'm not thinking the best in you.

This. Where do you leave this journal? Trevor knows what's in it.

Well, he may. Yeah.

It's not a good conversation. Keep going.

For me, what has been another thing that that helps is that pause in the morning, like not hit the ground running, which is one of the things I'm most famous for, is just like, get up, wake up, get up. Yeah. Sitting, laying, even just laying in bed and listing gratitudes will help me. You know, kind of like you were saying, you can feel it in your shoulders. It'll help me drop my shoulders off, feel different. If I can just spend just even a few minutes.

Yeah.

What am I grateful for and what is today? What can today bring? And what am I grateful for? That will happen.

Yeah.

Whether it's difficult or not. So just a few minutes just to recharge or to set expectations.

Really good. Well, as you can tell, we did not title this podcast how to have a Stress Free Holiday. It's how you manage it. So whether you're willing to admit it or not, the holiday season will carry stress for you. Whether we face it or not, that stress will show up in one form or another. Overreacting, underreacting, acting out, running away, whatever it may be. And that's why it's so important. As we just discussed that those practices, those disciplines, and really what we talked about in the episode two is the importance of a support system to have around you is so important to maintain health in the holiday season. And so we have to remember that we want to get healthy this holiday season. And I don't know about you guys, I want the next holiday season be even healthier. So it's that idea of building on that. So. So remember, whether it's sexual, relational, emotional or physical health, being present for the holidays is essential to maintaining our health for the long haul. Guys. Nick, Dan, thanks for talking about this in a stressful season.

Thank you.

Good times.

Wherever you're at, on your journey. Pure Desire is here to help create a roadmap for your healing. You or someone you know is looking for help. Go to PureDesire.org and start your healing journey today. If you haven't subscribed to the podcast, do it. If you are a subscriber, please please write a review. It helps others find the podcast and Dan will love you forever. And lastly, never stop being healthy.