206 - Stories Of Healing: Ben Bennett

You're listening to the Pure Desire Podcast, your safe place to find hope, healing, and freedom from sexual addiction, betrayal, and relationship issues. What is up, people? I'm your host, Trevor Windsor, and you're listening to episode 206 of the Pure Desire Podcast. You're joining me, as always, is my co host, Nick Stumbo.

Ain't nobody got time for that.

What? What? What? Okay.

Usually you respond. We wait for you to respond.

There's.

I don't know anything more about that black lady's quote than that great YouTube video line.

Yeah, okay, got you. Okay.

There's nothing more I can say.

Ain't nobody got time for that. Can't track it.

I'm just waiting for you to continue on.

Let's just move on. Today we got to hear. It's a good friend of ours, Ben Bennett, Benny B. Is back on the podcast. He's been on a few times, and we really just. We asked him questions so that he could explain and talk us through his story of healing.

Yeah. And you know, Ben Bennett's a single guy, which is awesome. To get his perspective that it wasn't about conflict in his marriage. It wasn't about a spouse that was mad that there were things outside of that that I think even if you are married, it's like, helps us see there's more to our healing than fixing a broken relationship or the way we've hurt other people. And as significant as that is in our journey, it's good to just see there's really value and health that comes for us as individuals that then goes over into our relationships. And I think Ben kind of makes that observation as he looks back at the life that he had with pornography and his attitude like, ain't nobody got time for that. Why would I go back to that lifestyle? Because what I'm experiencing now, even as a single guy, is so much better. And I think it's just a needed perspective in our world today to hear healthy, single young men, young women saying, this is a good life and you don't need the stuff our culture throws at you to try and fill up, you know, what we perceive to be our emptiness. Because being single is not a place of emptiness. It can really be a place of huge fulfillment and purpose. So I think that I think Ben does a great job at talking through that.

Yeah. And I know Ben doesn't want to be single for the rest of his life.

Yeah. It's not like it's just permanent.

Yeah.

He definitely wants to be married, right? Totally. Well, yeah, we've got A really good episode. I mean, Ben's stuff is always really good. Get to hear his heart. A couple things before we get into it. Subscribe to the podcast. We're on all the major platforms and also follow us on social media earedesirepdmi on Facebook, Twitter and Instagram. Also, you can find our full episodes now up on YouTube. Just search Pure Desire Ministries. And here is Ben Bennett sharing his story of healing. Benny B. Welcome back to the Pure Desire podcast.

Hey, thanks for having me today, guys. Good to see you.

Yes, we love seeing your mustache as often as we can. So we appreciate it. For those of you who recognize the voice, see the face, Ben Bennett has been on a number of times, good friend of ours here. And we've heard, Ben, some of your story kind of mixed throughout. I remember the first couple episodes we did with you and Jake Kissick where we talked about singleness and addiction and we've talked about your Resolution Movement and we've just explored a number of topics with you, but we've actually never heard the whole narrative, if you will, of your story. So we wanted to dive in and have you really talk us through your story of healing.

Yeah, absolutely. I am looking forward to discussing it with you all.

Yeah. And Ben is one of the co authors of our college aged resource, Living Free for Single Young Men and also was a featured guest and expert on our Sexual Integrity 101 video course, plug, plug, plug. Like he's the man. Ben, for those listeners who may not know you yet, just give us a little bit of your biographical information and tell us a bit about the ministry that you're a part of leading the Resolution Movement.

Yeah, so I get to serve with Joshua Gall ministry as a speaker and author like you mentioned, the Living Free Resource and then have a book coming out called free to thrive August 17th. Josh McDowell and I co wrote it. It's coming out with Thomas Nelson. We're so pumped. It's all about healing and mental health and hurts and brain science and just really how to thrive here now and have healthy relationships. So we are pumped about that. Another thing I do is head up the Resolution Movement. The Resolution Movement because we're all about resolutioning people to their hearts and struggles with biblically based answers informed by research and brain science. So we do a ton on, especially these days on TikTok, YouTube, Instagram, and absolutely love getting to do it. Seeing teenagers meet Jesus, seeing college students reach out in their moment of need, whether they're struggling with porn or depression and really to point them to proven resources like you alls and therapists and whatnot and having some great conversations online.

Yeah, yeah. Reaching people where they're at. I love it.

Totally.

Well, I mean, Ben, I've heard some of your story. I mean, again, Nick mentioned in Living free and the 101 on the podcast, but let's kind of go back. You know, this is your story. A story of sexual brokenness, pornography addiction. Looking back, when did sexual brokenness first enter your life? Talk us through that experience.

I would say the first time it started to really enter was when the curiosity began around the age of seven. I quickly started dealing with sexual fantasies and imagining different scenarios and thinking about situations. I think that's around the time that I learned about sex. And that for maybe a couple years, became a way of. A way of exploring curiosity, but also a way of escape. I remember trying to fall asleep, you know, at night as a kid and thinking about these different situations. And then fast forward to around the age of 12 was when I learned about masturbation and also pornography. I still remember the first time that my friend showed me pornography. It was a VHS tape, and they had been watching it before, and I didn't really know what to expect. But that first exposure, I was. It was like the shock ran through all of my body. I was just caught off guard, like, what is this? Knowing it wasn't right. I understood to some extent God's design for sex. And it was like this strong almost repulsion. I actually got up and walked out of the room. So there's this disgust, but at the same time there's this curiosity. And that curiosity, I would say five minutes later, led me right back to that room where my friends were watching pornography. And then. So that's kind of how it all began. And quickly was hooked on mainly masturbation and those sexual fantasies. And then throughout the years, you know, the pornography just escalated as I continued to become more and more desensitized to pornography. And nothing really ever felt like that that first time. That shock, that disgust that quickly went away and it became just pure, I would even say ecstasy. This high, this escape, this euphoric feeling. And of course, there was the shame after watching it, but the disgust quickly went away.

Yeah, I think what you're saying in that story, Ben, is something that a lot of listeners can relate to of that early push pull of pornography or any sexual content that like something in us that is pushed away. Like, I don't want this. I don't know what's going on. It doesn't feel right. It doesn't feel, you know, good. It's even maybe that what we're seeing feels like, why would anyone watch this? But yet at the same time, you know, what you said five minutes later, that pull of it's done something in my brain that I want more. And there was some sort of. And none of us as kids knew that it was dopamine and some of those brain chemicals that we now know are firing off. And it's just a very biological, natural response. But I think that push pull is the very thing that people get stuck in and don't know how to process. And so when you tell your story like that, I think a lot of people are connecting the dots. And so you enter into this phase in your life, or that's something you're into battling with, dealing with. When would you say it came to that point in your life where you realized this? The sexual brokenness was really something that was a problem and needed to be dealt with?

Yeah. And something I forgot to mention, too, that I've learned over the years was I realized there was a sexual brokenness in my life related to just my view of sex. Like, not just having a minimal. Having a very small view of sex and why God created, like, yeah, it'll be fun in marriages for procreation. And this. I didn't really understand the full picture and how exciting it was and the why. So it was almost like a. There was sexual brokenness from the world mainly influencing my. My view of sex and then pornography and then struggling sexually. So whether I've started to think whether or not somebody's struggling with masturbation or pornography or sexual fantasies, this sexual anorexia or this lack of understanding of this robust, beautiful picture that God has was a part of my sexual brokenness too. And then all throughout high school, really struggling more and more with hardcore pornography, getting my own laptop throughout college, the binge purge cycle, trying to quit. Trying to. I would say I realized in my freshman year of college after I started really taking my faith seriously with Jesus and pursuing him and sharing my faith with others, and had recommitted my life to Christ. There was about five or six months where I just purged and wasn't really giving into sexual fantasies, wasn't masturbating, didn't look at pornography. But then five months later, you know, I was right back there again. And then that cycle continued all throughout college. So I knew it was a problem. I definitely knew it was a problem then, but I still thought it was just a sin issue. I thought it Was a moral issue. I thought, I get angry sometimes. I look at porn sometimes. You know, here, these are just different, random things that I struggle with. But to finally answer your question, I'd say I really understood the gravity of it. You know, people talk about rock bottom or whatnot. I would say I had an experience like that in 2011. I was getting ready to graduate college. I had been involved in a campus ministry for years. You know, one of the top leaders, volunteering, discipling people, sharing my faith, and still had this on and off battle with pornography. And I applied to work for this campus ministry. They said, everything looks great on your application except for this area. And it had been a month or two. So, you know, I thought I was doing pretty well.

You're rocking it, man.

Right, right. Finally free, man. Yeah. But they kind of looked at me point blank and said, this is a significant issue and we can't accept you right now. We want to give you a couple steps to take and we'll check in in a couple months and if this hasn't been a struggle, you'll likely be accepted. And I remember just being rocked by that, like having a significant realization of, wow, this struggle could significantly prevent me from going into full time ministry, from serving Jesus, from doing the things I want to do the rest of my life. And that's when I doubled down on willpower and went another five months, got accepted to work for this campus ministry. But after that, you know, I was right back there struggling again. And so that's when I realized, man, I really got to figure something out.

So, I mean, you know, you get into this journey and you start moving along and, you know, maybe it's willpower. We'll get into some of those strategies that you tried here in a minute. But what can you now identify as some of the biggest hurdles with overcoming this pornography addiction? This continue to go back to masturbation and fantasy. Like, how do you. How would you describe the hurdles that were in your way?

I think one of the biggest hurdles was knowing it was not knowing what it was about, you know, thinking that it was just a discipline, a lack of discipline. So I started trying to. I told several people to hold me accountable, which I don't really like that word because I was basically saying, hey, you hold me responsible to not do this again, rather than owning my growth and whatnot. It's a whole nother conversation. But I said, hey, I'm going to be going to bed by this time each night. Hey, so and so, hold on to my laptop if you ever see it? Not in the common area, because I lived with several guys. You know, what's up? Hey, I'm going to sleep with the door open. All of these ways of which I think they can be a good first step, as long as they're not the only step.

Yeah, there's value in these things.

Yeah, totally.

Yeah. You know, just like if somebody is a bartender and is an alcoholic or. And sleeps upstairs above the bar, you probably want to move and you probably want to get a new job. So there are some of those preventative measures. But I didn't understand the why. I didn't understand what was really going on, which we can get into. But one of the significant things I think was it was hard to bring that into the light and to be honest with the fact that I don't have it all together. And here's what I'm struggling with. And just to be vulnerable and not. Not to wait, you know, several days after I looked at porn until the shame eventually went away and I felt better. But in those moments of temptation and the. Or even the day after, just to start having a life and no secrets was so, so hard. That was one of the big initial hurdles. And then asking for help, you know, thinking about how come I. How come. How come my application got put on hold? Or this was something that I had to work through when my friend, one of my friends got accepted to work for the campus ministry. The difference was it had been three months for him rather than one month. But then it's like we almost had the same stories in the amount of struggle. So.

Right.

But it was cool. God was very kind in that moment or in those situations to me, rather than running the opposite direction, blaming, saying, why me? You know, the Holy Spirit just really convicted me and empowered me and motivated me. And I saw it as an opportunity to really begin healing because I so desperately wanted to be free.

Totally.

So, Ben, you described a lot of strategies there that I think many listeners have probably used as well. You know, having accountability, keeping devices in public places, you know, having wise guardrails. And we would say a lot of this is wisdom. Those are good things to do in your journey. As you look back, you know, why would you say those things didn't work?

And.

And would you say, are there other strategies that you also tried or that you see young men. And maybe in particular, if we could focus in a little on singles strategies that you see single men or women attempting in terms of their sexual purity, that just aren't effective strategies. And why aren't those things working?

Yeah, I think there's a ton of them. Early on, I was, you know, I knew the verse that talks about taking thoughts captive. So I thought, okay, every time I have a lustful thought or I'm tempted to, let me attack that with a verse that talks about why sexual sin is wrong or job making a covenant to not look at a woman lustfully. The issue, though, is that just made me think about it all the more. It's like, oh, don't have that sexual thought. Okay. Sexual thoughts are wrong. Quote a Bible verse that. That didn't solve what I was truly looking for and longing for. I thought these. The sexual temptation. I thought my sexual thoughts were random rather than questioning them. Like, I was quick to condemn them and not quick to question them and figure out what they were actually about. What was I truly looking for or longing for? So that would. That would have been one, I think another was viewing it as separated from the rest of my life. I thought, I've got the sexual thing over here, the sexual issue here. Then over here, I've got the spiritual part of my life, and I've got the relational. Then I've got the emotional and how I view myself and my mental health struggles. So I thought I just got to kind of get rid of this and deal with this. But I quickly learned that it was all. It was all integrated. And so I was fighting the wrong battles ultimately.

That's good.

That's a good word. And I needed to understand the blueprint, you know, what the battle was actually about, what the enemy was using in my life. There's one more I would share, and it's that there's. When you're struggling with this, When I was struggling with this, there was so much shame around the issue. I would feel so much shame for the fact that I initially went to pornography that I got addicted when I was 12. Basically, as I looked at my sexual brokenness journey, I blamed myself for any. For everything. And sure, there's an element of, we're responsible for our sin, we're responsible for our choices. But we forget that the majority of people who get hooked on porn or sexual sin don't go looking for it. The enemy wants to have them introduced to it, to get them hooked. The porn industry preys on our kids. They want to create lifelong consumers and a child who is not supposed to ever see pornography. And what that does to their brain, to some extent, is being victimized. It's a form. Some people are even calling it now. It's a form of sexual abuse for a child to be introduced to pornography from one of their other childhood friends or to come across it on the Internet. So having self compassion and kindness for yourself, I mean shame is one of the biggest things that sets us up to go back to pornography. So let's quit shaming ourselves for the fact that we struggle with it or struggled with it even to begin with and realize that it's the kindness of God that leads us to repentance or to change or to change our thinking.

I really appreciate what you just pointed out, Ben, because I think for a lot of us when it comes to sexual brokenness, we do feel like the problem is just mainly about me and my choices or my morality. And we can ignore that. Well, no, there is a culture and an industry that is geared towards hooking us into this because it's a huge moneymaker. I mean, there's a reality behind it. Like this is a multi billion dollar industry and even if we're just clicking and never paying for it, we're fueling that. And there's an enemy that wants us to get hooked in this because it really destroys our oneness with Christ or a spouse or with friends. Because at a very core level we feel the shame. Then there's our brain that has the neurochemicals and the pattern that hooks us in. And then let's not forget that a sexual climax is designed by God to be intensely pleasurable. And so all of these things kind of align to create something that if we limit it to just say, well, I'm making bad choices and ignore all the other factors that are happening, we're not going to get very far in our freedom because it's so much more than choices we're making. And yes, we are making choices, yes we are responsible for them. But if that's the only thing as you said you focused on, I just need to make better choices. I need to stop doing those things. And that's the other thing I was thinking as you were sharing. Most people I feel don't realize that they're just stuck in a lot of negativity when it comes to their sexual brokenness. Don't do this, stop that. Why are you thinking this way? God says it's wrong. The Bible says it's wrong, the church says it's wrong. And even if all those things are true, it's totally approaching it from the negative. And I think we would look at any area of life and say if that's our only approach to change. If we have an eating Habit problem. We say, don't eat sugar. Stop that. Sugar's bad. Sugar's wrong. But I've never thought about what is healthy eating and what food should I buy and what should I have on my kitchen counter so that I help create. If I've never thought of the positive side just being negative, I don't think has changed anyone in any discipline. So, yeah, I just. I appreciate so much what you said because I think there's incredible wisdom in it for everyone.

Yeah.

And I think you've mentioned it before, Nick, the idea of instead of focusing on all the nos, we also have to focus on the yeses. I think that's a really good way to describe it. And so I'm just gonna quote you. Cause you should feel good. Cause it's a great line. The yeses are really, really important. Right. And I think a lot of that too comes. Cause I think one of the things that I would add to this is just the culture you grew up in, how that factors into brokenness. Whether people talked about sex or sexuality or pornography and masturbation in your household or not, that also creates this cloud or covering of shame. And also when it's exposed and, you know, a struggle is revealed, what are they telling you to do? What are they telling you your next steps are? And so there's a misunderstanding, too, of. Of what brokenness is, how it manifests. And then also, Ben, you talk about being integrated, the holistic nature of what it is. That sexuality is not a unique, distinctive element of who we are. It is a piece of us, but it's a piece of a very holistic being. Our emotions are tied to our sexuality. Our relationship with the Lord is tied to our sexuality. It's very, very dynamic and holistic. And I think our misunderstanding of that makes us, you know, and as men, we're very good at creating these little categories or these little boxes in our life. It's like, well, if I can, like you were saying, I can just work on my sexuality, then I can be a part of this campus ministry and I can be effective and I can have great relationships when maybe you stop watching porn, but emotionally, you're still a child. Like, it doesn't mean that you're healthy just because one area is. So I think that's another thing too. Just misunderstanding it. But, Ben, I know, I know. And I'm not trying to take away the punch from you, but I know that Dr. Ted played a huge role in your healing. And so talk about how you got introduced to Ted. What that was like, and then really, what finally made all of it click? Like, just that moment where you're like, oh, okay, I got it. I understand now what the journey is going to look like, moving forward.

Yeah. It was back in 2011 that I first got into a Seven Pillars group for about a semester because, you know, after that I was good. I was finally free, so I thought. But, you know, did that for a semester. It wasn't as structured as, you know, generally seven pillars. It's like, there's a begin date, there's an end date. This was a little more. Less structured. Did that first semester. Started leading guys through the Pure Desire book, then started taking some guys through the seven pillars. So I kind of dabbled for a couple years in Life of no Secrets. Life of secrets, Life of no Secrets. Just kind of back and forth. And there was growth, there was some understanding, but it really wasn't until 2014. Where was it? 2014, 20, 2013, where Brett Butcher, who works with crew and who had gone through his own healing journey with Dr. Ted and whatnot, he started mentoring me how to lead groups and introduced me to the 40, 60, 20. No, what is it? 40, 60, 20 format. Yeah, the faster scale, the double bind, and it rocks my world. And I started. I started leading groups and I was fully bought into the process and going through Top Gun, the teenage resource. We were taking college guys through it because that was before Living Free, leading the Conquer series group, started leading seven Pillars groups online. At one point, I was leading. It was like six different groups one semester. And prior to that, that was the last time I acted out, the last time I had a sexual fantasy, masturbated, looked at porn. That was 2013. And it was really finally getting in, having the right tools, being all in on the process and saying. And I remember the first couple of weeks going, oh, shoot, I'm committed to this. I'm leading these guys. I'm bought into this lifestyle of no secrets. I don't know if I can do this the rest of my life. You know, I kind of. I kind of miss those weekends where I binged and then came back, you know?

Yeah.

Or I kind of, kind of miss, you know, having this. I don't know if I can imagine my life without porn. But, you know, I was just trying to take it a month at a time, a day at a time and whatnot. And that's something I would encourage. Don't think about. I'm giving this up for Life. Think about 24 days at a time. My friend John Elmore Just wrote a book on this called Freedom Starts Today. And his big thing is 24 hours at a time. You know, by God's strength, I think that's incredibly wise. Think about today. Today, God's given you grace for today. So I started leading that and then I was about, I was sober for about a year, free from the stuff. And that's when I began the process with Dr. Ted because I wanted to grow in leading groups. I also wanted to explore more of my study. And I remember this would have been spring of 2014, doing the initial the evaluation process with Dr. Ted, which to anybody listening I highly recommend. I can't recommend the pure desire evaluate clinical evaluation process enough where you take several different tests and clinical tests and then you meet with a therapist even if you're not going to do the whole blown process. I learned in those hour and a half with Dr. Ted it was, it was one of the most significant hour and a half periods of my life because it was like the veil was peeled back on the hardships I faced growing up. Not just why I was struggling sexually, but why I was dealing with anxiety and depression. A lot of the negative thoughts I had. It was such a moment of an eye opening moment of clarity. And granted, I had been in, I'd seen several different counselors I'd been in counseling for, was going every other week for about four years at this point, but hadn't had the realizations that I had in that hour and a half. And then I went through this year long process with Dr. Ted and that's really when layer upon layer of understanding dawned on me as to why I was struggling with all of the different things I was struggling with. But then also what I could do about it, what God wanted to do about it with these new tools and this new understanding and the power of the spirit in my life, what could be true of me and what became true of me, you know, years later?

And I mean I've heard you share a number of times about your relationship with Ted and how meaningful it is to you. And I think, you know, one of those things that really is important. And I know for me I've had a couple of those guys, I mean, Rich Moore here on staff was one of those people that as I was going through, having someone who's further down the road, who has the tools, the competency, the understanding, the grace is extremely important. I mean, I know for me when I first started leading groups like I had never led groups before, like I was as sexually broken as I'd Ever been and needed. Needed to just jump in my own healing, but was also leading people through it. But having those people who are down the road who are like, no, no, no. Remember, this is where we're heading. I've experienced this. You can experience this too. This is where we're going. So it gives you those, like, signposts. That's always the visual I get is like, what are these signposts or these mile markers on the recovery road? And I think having somebody like Dr. Ted and maybe for people listening, maybe it's not gonna be a certified sexual addiction therapist or pastoral sex addiction professional, but might just be a really devoted and healthy group leader or a really honest friend who has done the recovery or inner soul work. But whatever it is, I think it's important that we have those type of relationships at least with somebody. And sometimes that takes looking for it. And I know, Ben, you love being one of those people for others, helping people through that. I know we all do. So I think that's just something that I hear from your story that I think is really important for people to grab onto.

Yeah, yeah. And I think too, I love that you mentioned that having somebody further along the journey than you, because I think one of our biggest struggles, and probably the greatest lie the enemy will try to get us to believe in our healing journey is that this is going to be a struggle forever. That God can do it for them, but he can't do it for you. That you're just going to. You're going to wrestle with sexual stuff the rest of your life, or when you go back to a relapse, that you're right back there at the beginning, starting over. No, you're not. The healing process isn't linear. It's. And it's. It's not about a destination. It's about a daily decision. You know, ultimately, it's not about freedom and sobriety. It's about health every single day. Am I moving towards wholeness? Am I getting closer to God and others? It's way less about the behavior and more about, am I thriving here and now? Is Jesus restoring me? Am I becoming the person God created me to be? Or am I living out who he already created me to be and who he's made me in Christ?

Yeah. Yeah. Amen to all that. That'll preach. So, you know, Ben, you're Talking now about 6, 7 plus years of living in this new way, in freedom, new patterns, habits, disciplines, all that. As you kind of look back now on your journey, what would you say are Some of the key elements that you've discovered about finding freedom and walking in that freedom from sexual brokenness.

One, I would say is having a lifestyle of no secrets. I mean, if. Regardless of. If you're. Every single person needs to have a lifestyle, secrets, having at least two people who know everything about you, whether or not you're struggling sexually, it's just wisdom in this life in general. And what that looks like is. And what that looked like early on was having these guys that I would reach out to about every day, sharing not just my sin or my thoughts or the things I was struggling with, but my emotions. What's stressing me out, what am I dealing with, what am I struggling with? Because as we know, emotions and stress is what sets people up to want to cope, to want to return to unhealthy sexual behavior. That was one. And what I found in, that was amazing, was that when I started this lifestyle of reaching out rather than acting out, I was getting the exact same thing that pornography was attempting to give me, yet in a healthy way. Because when I would go to pornography, I was feeling rejected, alone, inadequate. And when instead, the way God has designed it was I was supposed to be going to people where I could feel loved instead of rejected, where I could feel believed in rather than inadequate. And even on a neuroscientific level, pornography releases dopamine and oxytocin, which makes you feel good and bonded to it. God designed that same thing to be released in conversations with other people, dopamine and oxytocin. So I was being healed as I was reaching out rather than acting out by God through people. Another one was knowing the why. What is Knowing my story, knowing that my. That my sexual behavior wasn't random, but it was a signal. It was a signal for something deeper that needed to be resolved in my life. I think of experiencing so much shame growing up feeling or experiencing the disapproval of my dad, his anger, his lashing out, feeling like I was inadequate. I think of the bullying from my friends, for my faith, for the way I dressed. And I think of this narrative I told myself over and over every single day for years and believe that I was worthless, I wasn't good enough, something was wrong with me and that God somehow tolerated me. So understanding the why and how pornography had entered in as a way to escape that to. And not just escape that. It wasn't just about coping. It was about trying to fulfill that void in my life. Because, you know, with pornography, there's. That's in the porn industry knows this that's why there's so many varieties to try and find resolution to people's stories. So examination, you know, for me, feeling inadequate, I could go to porn and feel so loved and pursued by someone on the screen and find those scenarios in pornography, which was a way I didn't know, but was subconsciously trying to resolve the unresolved stuff from growing up. I think another big one was, as Dr. Ted says, cutting the trash talking voice in your head. I'm not sure how many lies the enemy has to feed us when we do such a good job of telling them to ourselves, you know, so there was just so much like waking up, oh, I'm going to fail. I'm not good enough. Somebody rejected me. I would literally have these things going on in my head. I cut that out. Which for some reason was so easy. But what has continued, that I'm still working through weekly in therapy now is emotions. You know, if, if I feel rejected, if somebody says something, I can quickly start to feel sad. And it's this not a, it's not a verbal way anymore in my mind, but it's, it's my emotions just right there instantly believing shame and so challenging that telling myself the truth, remembering who God says I am, that has been huge.

When you figure that out, when you figure that out, will you let me know? Because I'm there with you, man.

Yeah.

I tell you we need a T shirt.

Thanks.

We need a T shirt that says reaching out rather than acting out. That's just what we call the last 20 minutes of group. We're working on our commitment to change and check in. It's like we call this the reaching out instead of acting out time.

That's right.

How am I going to connect? I love what you're saying, that it creates some of those same even at a neurochemical level. And it's not the high spike that maybe we can get from some sort of sexual relapse, but it's a steady flow of I think the kind of brain chemicals that God intended for us to have to create real joy, real lasting friendship, lasting pleasure in this world that is meant to be pleasurable, but it can become what sustains us in a healthy way. So just a great observation there, man.

Yeah. And honestly, it's not gonna be as intense like reaching out and having a good conversation with someone else is not as intense as a climax. But it doesn't carry the same shame and the guilt that porn or masturbation or sexually acting out in some way does. And so it's this sustained over the long haul creates this trajectory of health when we reach out. So it's not like it's like a one to one ratio on like pleasure or enjoyment, you know, also depends on what kind of friend you're reaching out. Like, maybe it's the friend who, you know, sucks, like tons of your emotional energy. And it's like, okay, but Ben, I think, and I love this question because there's just so many different ways that this manifests in people's life. But when we get healthy, it's great and it feels good. We have this new perspective on life, on ourself, on relationships, all of this. But then there's this piece of where we start to share our story. And I think a lot of people get stuck between the, like, okay, I'm healthy now. Let's just keep going through life and this. No, no, no, I need to share this. People need to hear that hope's out there. So for you, what was that like? What gave you the courage? What kind of pushed you over the edge to, okay, I'm gonna start sharing my story with other people?

Initially it was really just kind of like this. It dawned on me. People are suffering in silence. They're struggling. They're hearing garbage answers about what to do about it from everybody around them. I can't not speak up. I think of in acts when I think it was the forgetting, who it was who said this. But how can we not speak of the things we have seen and heard? And that's what it was for me. It was. I've been on this healing journey. I found God has brought the answers into my life. These are different than everything I've ever heard. They're biblical and somehow I've missed it. They work. I can't help but share this with others and take those opportunities. Whether it's a one on one conversation with someone or whether it's a doing a seminar, speaking from a stage, or creating a video online or writing a book. I just desperately wanted people to know that they could be free and they could truly thrive.

Yeah.

I think when we're in touch with our own brokenness and we can remember, I mean, in a way, shame has a good effect. If we remember how shame felt when we're free of it. And to say, there are so many people trapped in that place, how could God use me? And that really does prompt. I know a lot of the work that you do, Ben, and the work that we're doing at Pure Desire and the ways that we've partnered together so talk a little bit more about relationships. As you've said, having now your Journey Going back 10 years to 2011, when you started, and then really, in particular the last six, seven years, really experiencing freedom and healing. And now with the Resolution movement, how has this impacted your relationships? And I think, in particular, really sharing that from a single perspective. Because I think in the church still, too often, many people think of, well, the goal of sexual health is that I have a better marriage. Like, that's why you kick the porn habit. That's why you stop masturbating. So I have a better marriage. And you're not married, which is awesome, because you can speak with some real authority, I think, to why is this valuable for your relationships right now as a single guy? And maybe some of it is about a future possible marriage that, I mean, God could lead any single person into. But. But as a single person, what have you experienced in your friendships and relationships that you would say to everyone, this makes it worthwhile whether or not your marriage improves in addition to other friendships?

Yeah, I know initially, for me, it was, I don't want to take this into my marriage. Like, I want to deal with this. I want to have a healthy sexual life. But then there was a shift. There was, I want to walk in freedom and help other people get free. And then I started to see another shift where it was like, my life is so much better without porn. My relationships are so much better. I'm not emotionally numb. I don't feel shame. I don't feel like the shell of a human I was created to be. In fact, I feel more confident talking to women, talking to my guy friends. I feel more alive and who God made me to be. I don't feel as like I'm walking around having this secret life that I'm ashamed of. I feel like I can truly show up and be me in all these different relational situations. I feel closer to God. I feel like I've. Because with porn, the shame was so strong that as much as I wanted to believe who God is, says I was, it was like there was this constant wet blanket being, you know, thrown on it. So you get that off, and it's like, finally I feel like I can see what God's trying to be, trying to communicate to me my whole life. But the enemies use this situation and that situation, and porn, Porn got out of the way so that I could truly thrive and be who God created me to be. And there was a point a couple years in where I realized, you know, initially was, I can't imagine my life without porn. And then I got to a point where it was, I can't imagine my life with porn. Are you freaking kidding me? Why? I would never trade everything I have today. Yes, God. With others, with what God is doing, for going back to that lifestyle I used to live. It's not even an option.

Yeah.

And so, you know, six and a half years free of all of that. It's. It's. And having a rewired brain. I think this is another thing that is so important to get, is that it's almost as if I never struggled with porn. I remember years ago, was probably 2010, my counselor at the time, I was asking him what it was like, you know, because he had never struggled with sexual issues. Really? He was like, forget the analogy. He shared. Oh, it was like this. For some reason, he shared this analogy. Crazy. He's like, say you're really big. Say this is hilarious. Say you're really big into cow tipping. You drive by a field, like, all right, not tracking, but I'll follow you. You drive by a field, you see a cow. You just can't stop thinking about tipping those cows. All right. Yeah. Where you go with this? That's somebody struggling. Whereas, say, I've never struggled with cow tipping. I drive by a field, I notice the cows. Beautiful. I keep on driving. That's kind of what it's like when. When sexual stuff comes up on the TV or online or whatever. Yeah. I just don't really give it a second thought. It's almost, you know, whatever. I was like, okay, I'm kind of tracking. But I thought back on that, and I'm like, yeah, I get what he's saying now. Even on this side of the addiction, it's almost as if I never struggled with it. Because the things that used to tempt me, that used to trigger me, like being living alone, like back in the day. Never. That would have never been an option. Whereas now I've been living alone for years, and I'm not tempted to look at pornography. I can't remember. It's been years, I think, since I've been tempted to look at pornography. You know, it's like, what used to trigger me doesn't trigger me anymore. And it's because, you know, God is faithful. Romans 12. To be transformed by the renewing of your mind. I've got a new mind, and I'm so sick of people saying that this is going to be something I'm going to struggle with. I'm going to always struggle with this situation. This type of thought, this temptation, I'm going to struggle with porn until the day I die. That doesn't have to be the case. Jesus didn't die on the cross and defeat Satan, sin and death. And why are you to heal and be transformed by the renewing of your mind so that you could struggle the rest of your life? Yeah, that may be the case. But I believe that he's given you the power of the Holy Spirit and with the right tools and the process and trusting him, that you can actually truly heal and overcome this and get to a point where it's like you never struggled with it.

We could end the episode right there and that would be a good close. But okay, so another thing. So now you're sharing your story, you're experiencing better relationships, better intimacy with other people and not sexual intimacy, actual intimacy, being known and knowing both other people, God knowing yourself. And then also in that God seems to be moving us into what does ministry look like? What does reaching out to other people and helping them, not just sharing our story, but actually walking with people and doing life this way with other people. So how has God, like, what does that ministry look like for you? How is God using you? I know we can talk about resolution, but I mean, think, think big picture ministry stuff, but then also just in relationships, how God's using you to minister to other people in this area.

Yeah, so many ways. Like, one of the things I've recently been praying is, God, will you use me today? Just a quick prayer. And you'd be amazed at the things that God will do when you start asking him to use your story. And it's been awesome to see. Let's see, last last week, okay, so early January, some guy reached out to me online and said that he was struggling with porn and didn't know what to do about it. So I sent him a video, never heard anything back. Six weeks later go by, I get a message from him. He says, hi again, still struggling with porn. I just truly want to be free and I want to truly surrender my life to Jesus. And I go, okay. And I respond like, thanks for sharing. Thanks for your courage. Are you asking if you're trying to figure out how to be free from porn, or are you asking if you're trying to figure out how to start a personal relationship with God and surrender to him? He goes, oh. And I'm like, all right, let's go. So I walk him through the gospel and how to have a relationship with Jesus. He prays to receive Christ. Granted, it was close to midnight. So I just imagine he just got done, you know, watching porn. Feels in his moment of need, so much shame. Am I. How do I surrender my life to Jesus? I'm sick of this. I want a new kind of life. Reaches out praise to receive Christ. First time his heart's ever been in it, really doing that. And now he's on that journey and also on this journey of finding freedom from porn. I think of a couple weeks ago, a guy who reached out who had come across my story, wasn't a Christian, felt so hopeless, shared that he thinks about suicide and death often. Pointed him to the crisis text line, because I'm not a therapist and if things get dark, reach out. Reach out to a certified organization. But we began dialoguing, talking about his doubts. He was saying that he felt so far off, so ashamed, doubts about God's existence. Can God truly heal me? That's one of the things he said. And I just got to relate to him and share my story. And there's so many similarities between our story. Checked in on him recently. He just finished reading the Case for Christ by Lee Strobel. He went to church for the first time, and he's on this journey of exploring Jesus and exploring freedom from all of these issues. So those individual stories are what gets me the most excited. That's why we do what we do with the Resolution Movement at Joshua Dell Ministry to help people have these breakthrough moments of healing and of meeting Jesus and of growing wherever they're at in their journey.

So cool.

It's so encouraging, Ben, to hear about places in your life now where you are that you're that mentor down the road, you're that wise guide. You're that friend that can look at others and say, I know where you are. I've felt what you're feeling. And maybe our struggles aren't exactly the same as someone else's, but we can really look with empathy and say, I know what that's like. And I also know that there's a better way. Here's some steps. And follow me as I'm following Christ. And I really believe that's what God has made all of us for. That as we learn and grow and are transformed, that we don't just use it for ourselves. And like, oh, now I can go and have a better life. For me to say, no. The growth and healing I have is so that I can turn and look to others and say, God, use me. I love that prayer. Lord, how could you use me today? And would you use me today? So as we move towards wrapping up this episode, Ben, a question we always ask of those sharing their story. What is some final encouragement or wisdom that you would like to share with listeners today? And maybe especially, I'm just thinking some of the things you've shared today about, like, it's been years since I've been tempted to look at porn. I've got a new brain. I don't even think that way anymore. I mean, those are awesome things you're testifying to. But I'm guessing for some listeners that's like, wow, that'll never be me. I've been struggling for years, and maybe I'm finding some freedom, but I'm still tempted a lot. And it may just seem so far beyond their experience that they feel some doubt and hopelessness about ever getting there. How would you speak to that person today and encourage them about the kind of lasting change that is possible?

Yeah, I would say that the goal is not to be over here and no longer struggling necessarily. And it is almost as if I had never struggled with it. You know, God wants to use us in our mess. It's okay that we don't have it all together. The goal is health. Today. I would say that I echo those doubts because in other areas of my life, with anxiety, or specifically with anxiety, I'm in weekly therapy right now, digging deeper into my story and trying to find healing. I remember a couple years ago, I met a guy who had gone through the clinical process with Dr. Ted, and he was sharing that, yep, he got free from porn. He was no longer struggling with anxiety. And I'm going, dang, I wish. I wish that I was also free from anxiety. But here I am, four years later, and those doubts, too. It's like, am I truly ever going to be free from anxiety? But I have to remember, if God can do it in their life, he can do it in my life. And the goal for me is not. Is not to be free from anxiety. It's to trust God today. It's to walk in intimacy and health with him and others today. It's to, yeah, take these steps, to grow and to change. But what if God wanted to do something greater in the process than in the product and in the product of my healing? That's what he's about. He wants to meet us in our mess and use us today. Not when we check all the religious boxes, not when we have it all together. That's not what he's about, is about today helping you live into who he's already made you in your Behavior lining up more and more. And I think another thing is, I think it's. It's so easy for the people listening, or when I'm listening to podcasts or people that are, you know, more seasoned or experienced or whatever in different areas of ministry to think, oh, that's them, and that's their responsibility. It's their responsibility to share their story, to tell people about Jesus. But I'm a businessman or I'm a dad, and this is what I do. But all of us are called to share our stories, to share about the one who's changed everything, and to look for those opportunities. So I would say this whole episode is a massive failure. If you walk away going, well, Nick and Trevor and Ben, you guys have got stories. You're the ones sharing about it, and that is your ministry. But I am over here and I am putting my head down at work and just trying to get healthy. No, it is your responsibility. God has called you to reach those around you, to share the hope that you have in Christ. And even if you are not free to invite. Like, that is how it all started for me. Four years of dabbling. I was in the mess of it, trying to invite other people in, and they were getting free as I was getting free. And that's what Jesus is about, and he wants to use us in it. Yeah.

And I think a lot of it comes down to too a. It's a comparison thing. Like, you talk about, you know, listening to these stories on here and then thinking, I'm over here. Well, just like, simply, we're all over here in some area in our life. For me, it's working through, like, I'm at the place of my recovery where I'm working on the messages that I tell myself. And it's taken me six years to really get down to what I think is, like, the foundational thing that has motivated a lot of my unwanted behaviors. And that's my over here thing. Right. I also have anger that I deal with. This is a really stressful season. Guess what? Food has reared its ugly head again. And all of a sudden I'm eating cake when I don't want to. And I'm not making fun of it, genuinely. That is a struggle for me. And so I think that we need to understand that maybe someone's healthy in this certain area, but that doesn't mean that they're better or further along where they're so much healthier than you are. We always have our, like, over there type of things that we're working on. And that's that beauty of that process that God's taking us through, of continuing to make us more integrated, make us more whole. And I just. I love that word, that wholeness, that that's what we're after. We're moving more and more and closer and closer to wholeness. And I think we're all there. Wherever you're at, whatever you struggle with, we are all in that process. You got anything, Nick?

Okay, I'm good.

Except for Nick. He's got it all together.

I just am not gonna say anything. Okay. So, Ben, I wanted to give him opportunity, so.

Sorry, I thought you were moving towards the last question.

We can. Let's do it.

I was ready.

Let's do it. Ben, if people want to keep up with you, keep up with resolution movement, Josh McDowell. Where can they keep up with what you guys are doing?

Yep. Resolutionmovement.org is our. Well, one of our websites there. We've got our podcasts up there, links to social media. On social media, we're resolution movement, Facebook, TikTok, YouTube. TikTok is fun. We're definitely on there. Instagram. And then my personal one is Ben V. As in Virginia. I'm from Virginia or victorious. Ben V. Bennett. Two Ns, two Ts Instagram, Facebook and Josh.org somehow we got that. That's our Josh McDowell Ministry website, Josh.org tons of fun resources on there. But I would say if you've got a question, if you were encouraged by this. I know, of course, Pure Desire would love to hear about you, hear from you, but I'd love to hear from you. I'd love to pray for you, I'd love to dialogue. I'm super accessible on social media. I love just talking to people, encouraging them, praying for them and having a conversation. So reach out to me. Ben V. Bennett.

Sweet. We'll have all that stuff in the show. Notes. One thing that's really stuck out from hearing again, I've heard a lot of that, Ben, but something that really stuck out from your story today is just the idea of focusing on today, I think so often we look ahead and we think, I'm not sure I can get there, but I've just been reminded by your story and even things recently in my life that daily faithfulness is how massive things happen in life. It's not just that we set this big goal and we, you know, we're smarter or better or bigger than other people. So we get there. It's actually the daily faithfulness. So just take it day by day by day, knowing that if I can be healthy and move toward health today, that's gonna set me up better for tomorrow. And then when I get to tomorrow, do the same thing over and over again. And as we've heard in your story, it's still a process. You still have struggles. You still deal with different stuff in your life, but it's the idea you said of that process, not the product, but the process. And so, Ben, from us to you, we're huge fans of you. We love you. We really appreciate that process that you're in and that you invite people in, you share it. And we just love you, man. Thanks for being with us today and sharing your story.

I love you guys to love what you're doing, but really love who you are and just the relationships we've got to build over the years and spending time together. And of course, love this ministry. I'm convinced that God used it to save my life years ago because of the direction I was headed. And yeah, just thankful for you all and what you're doing.

Thanks, man. And wherever you're at at on your healing journey, we are here to help create a road map for your healing. If you or someone you know is impacted by sexual brokenness, go to PureDesire.org and let's start the healing journey today. Don't for don't forget to subscribe to the podcast. Each week we put out new content to help you on the road to freedom from the effects of sexual brokenness. And lastly, never stop being healthy.