348 - 7 Lies That Will Ruin Your Life w/ Joshua Broome

Welcome to the Pure Desire Podcast, helping you take back your life from unwanted sexual behavior and betrayal trauma. Good morning, or whatever time it is for you. I'm your host, Trevor Windsor, and you're listening to episode 348 of the Pure Desire podcast here. Joining me and you'll hear a little late in the episode, Mr. Nick Stumbo.

This pen is royal blue.

The pen is blue.

Okay, so just a little bit behind the scenes production right now we've got, like a new monitoring system that we have and we have in ears in. And right now we hear our voices echoed. And so it's kind of grand. You listener will not hear the echo. Praise be. But that felt like. That was like, epic. That's Liar, Liar. And it's probably my favorite Jim Carrey movie ever.

Yeah. Is that like late 90s or.

Probably. Probably. I didn't see it in the late 90s, but yeah, it's for those that.

May not have, you know, been into movies at that time or aren't old enough to appreciate that.

Yes.

Yeah. Jim Carrey. Liar, Liar. And his son wishes his birthday wishes that his dad can never lie again. And so he goes through this day where every. And he's a lawyer who has made a career out of lying. And you just realize all the places in his life he's just accustomed to using both big and small lies to get through life. And. And he figures out that's what's happening. He tries to say that a pen is red and he can't get, you know, read out. And. Yeah, it's one of my favorite scenes in that movie.

Just since you said that's yours. Mine is the. When he gets pulled over and he asks, like, do you know why I pulled you over? It's like, well, depends on when you started following me. He just lays it all out. It's so good. Okay. I have speeding tickets. Yeah. Oh, and he hits it and they all. Oh, my gosh. Okay.

And what does he say? Like, be gracious or be kind or something. Be merciful.

Okay, so we had a guy on who I think we're now really, like, starting a friendship with, and we like him a lot. Joshua Broom. And he's a speaker at this September's Pure desire summit with Dr. Adrian Hickman and Nancy Pearcey. But we had Josh on today to talk about his new book that is released right now, today, and it's called the Seven Lies that Will Ruin youn Life.

Yeah.

And I think what has really drawn us to Joshua is just his transparency and honesty around his Journey and how he has really used, you know, what the enemy intended for evil, is now using his story for such good and really a depth of processing. What he had to learn, what had to take place, not just, like, leave the industry. I mean, that's the obvious, you know, big move. But there were all sorts of things internally about his ways of thinking and the shame messages and lies that he had learned to believe. And I think in this book and in today's interview, he just unpacks that so well in a way that applies really to all of us, because I think there is some truth. There's nothing new under the sun. The enemy tries to get us all to listen to some of the same lies. And you're going to hear whether you're male or female, young or old, struggler or betrayed, like, there are lies that the enemy tries to use to get life to be something different than God intended. And I think when we see them for what they are, then we can really lean into the truth that God has. And, you know, the other thing I've thought about Joshua is just the way that in some regards, like, he had what our world sexually says should be like the pinnacle, right? And he looks at all of that to just say, it's so empty and hollow, and it is not at all what. What we're intended or made for. And it makes me think of, like, there was a famous interview with Tom Brady where he was asked about his life and at the end of the interview says, there's got to be more than this, you know, and here he is, super bowl champion, all these MVPs, you know, all the money, the superstar wife. And he's looking at the camera saying, there's got to be more than this. And I think that's the message that we get sucked into these lies, thinking, well, this will make me happier. This will give me fulfillment. And as we talk about so much today, it's not. And there's lies and there's a reason those are lies. And if we expose them, we can move towards the kind of fulfilling life that God made us for. So I thought it was a great time. Glad for the part I got to be here for, and glad that our listeners can hear it today.

Yeah. And if you haven't listened, we have an episode that we'll put in the show notes as well with him where he tells his story from porn porn star to pastor. And yeah, we have all the links and stuff to buy. This new book, it's out today. Go grab it and please join us for the summit, whether it's in person, at a church watch party or online, just please join us. You can go to PureDesureSummit.com and you can find that. And with that, let's get into our conversation with Joshua Broome on his new book, Seven Lies that Will Ruin youn Life. Joshua Broome, excited to have you back on the podcast, man. Thanks for being here.

So glad to be with you guys and looking forward to all the fun stuff we're doing in the future.

Yeah, man. And just so everyone kind of knows, we'll talk about it in the intro as well. Nick, for some scheduling reasons, couldn't be here for the first part of our conversation. So I'm just going to carry this. So if Nick is your favorite part of the episode, I apologize. Believe me, he'll be here eventually. But Joshua, we are excited to have you on for a couple of reasons. The first one is at the time of this record release you have released, I believe it's your first book. And if you want to hold it up for people, show them what's up 7 lies that will ruin your life. And it's what my journey from porn star to preacher taught me about the truth that sets us free. And we are in some conversation too. We'll make sure that people can get links and everything to grab a copy of the book. That's the first reason we're excited to have a conversation. The second is that we're excited to have you this September at our Pure Desire Summit event. And that's September 20 and 21 and we'll have links as well to register. But dude, we're excited to have you on for those two reasons. So we're pumped to have this conversation.

Absolutely. I remember about a year ago, Ben Bennett is a great friend of mine and we were just talking and he went on about an hour tangent on how amazing you guys were. And I was like, man, I got to connect with these guys. And he connected me with Nick. And just so glad to know you guys and I'm really excited to be with you in person and I think God's going to do something really special through this book and I love in person events. There's just something special about being in the room and I think that God is going to do something really special on that day as well.

Yeah. Yeah, we're looking forward to it for sure. Okay, well, let's get in. For those who listen to the show regularly, they know that we've had you on before and we heard your story about Going from porn star to preacher, your conversion story, all of that. And so we'll put that link to that episode in the show notes so people can go back and listen to that. But your book, Seven Lies that Will Ruin youn Life is really all about that journey. I got an advanced copy, was able to flip through that, and I'm excited for people to get it. But talk me through what made you want to capture your journey in a book. Like, talk to me about that and the process of writing it.

Yeah, I mean, it's funny because I thought that I wanted to, so I knew that I wanted to tell my story in a more in depth way. And what I love about my story is, is really, it's, it's not my story. It's God's story in the redemption arc that lives through my life. But I, I wanted to tell my story in an in depth way. And I had a conversation with my literary agent and we put together this proposal and it was really just a deep dive into my story. And as I started having conversations with different people, God really started tugging on my heart and asking me the question, well, is telling your story the thing that you're most passionate about? And I would say, no, it's not. Preaching the gospel is the thing that I'm most passionate about. And if you ask, you know, I've had the opportunity to, to be on some large platforms and especially the secular ones when they ask me the question, well, how did you go from being an award winning porn actor to traveling and preaching the gospel? And I'm always so elated because the answer to the question is the gospel. And I, and I, and I've had the opportunity to share, you know, share that on, on some pretty amazing places, but started wrestling with, okay, I want to, I want to share my story. And I, I put together something that was closer to a, you know, here's, here's my story. Like super in depth. Yeah. But then it's like, well, what, what are the lessons that I learned? And like, okay, like that I think that would be more valuable and that, that, that's really what the, what the, the book became. Because what life and what is true in general, if you believe a lie to be true, it's true to you. And, and through that lie, you see the world, you see relationships, you see yourself, and you see God. But, but there is a truth that supersedes the lie and it's found in the word of God. And that's really my story. And seven lies that will ruin your life. It takes seven big cultural, you know, things that. That culture promotes as, you know, success. What intimacy is, council culture. Like, all these things, and it. It just holds them up to scripture. And it's like, okay, here. Here's what the world is screaming is true, but here's the word of God and how in my life, believing a lie was detrimental, but the word of God, it actually dismantled and destroyed that lie, and it gave me healing and freedom. And that's what the book is about.

And, I mean, this whole language of, like, faulty beliefs or lies is so central to what we do, helping people with recovery and betrayal, trauma, sexual brokenness, all of that, because it is those lies that inform the decisions that we make. And, I mean, in my opinion, it goes all the way back to Genesis 3. Eve hearing a lie about herself, about the Lord holding out on her, and that belief led her to step into sin and.

Right.

Everything changed after that. So this is very much like our language, and that's why we're so pumped about the book. And I'm still waiting for my signed copy, so send it to me, man. Let's make that happen.

On the way. On the way.

But for the remainder of our time, we wanted to kind of give you an opportunity to talk through these seven lies. And so that's what we're gonna go into. Now. The first lie is the lie of false approval. So can you describe false approval, what this lie is, and how it might play out in our life?

Yeah, I mean, I think that we all fall victim to believing that Again, back to the garden. We know what's best, you know, and that's, you know, why the first commandment, it's like, have no other gods before me. And what we tend to do is create our own autonomy. We want to believe that we know what's best for ourselves. We want to believe that we are actually a good lord, but we're actually a terrible lord over our own lives. Lives. And. And what we search for and. And what I would say that is a primary idol in most people's life is approval. And why that. Why that's the way the. The book started for me is because for me, I grew up without a father. And having that gap in my life, it caused me to see myself as inadequate. And I had this gap in my life, and I tried to fill something that only God could fill. And the way that I tried to fill it was with approval. And the world tells us that, you know, from a secular point of view, if you have enough followers, if you have a Blue check mark. If enough people know your name, if you drive the right car, you know, if the paparazzi, you know, are chasing you around, then your life must be more important. So we. We seek after these counterfeit, you know, approvals. We chase after these things that we feel like are going to make us feel good. And that's actually what we're doing. We're. We're creating idols out of our feelings. We're creating idols out of this. This false sense of approval. And, man, guess what? We've. We've already been approved by God through Jesus on the cross. If you are a follower of Jesus Christ, guess what Jesus, what he accomplished on the cross, that's the most important thing about you. And you stand approved before God because of what Jesus has done. So the approval that you feel like you need, you actually already have. But if you lie to yourself and say, well, I need, you know, the approval of others, guess what? I'm going to end up in this cyclical. I'm unsatisfied. I have that dopamine hit. I need more. And that's. That's really, you know, the first chapter.

Yeah, and we see that play out, too when it comes to specifically pornography addiction, because, you know, for you not growing up with a dad, you didn't have that approval around, right? What we were designed to experience from our parents or from our caregivers. And so that lie seeps in through that negative experience, and then you seek out, you know, and this was my story. This is the story of so many people. Pornography is a really good band Aid, man. It's something that always is approving and always accepting. And so that lie definitely plays out for sure. And when we can address it, identify it, man, that's when things really start to change. When you see. And really, I can remember the first time I was in group and sharing my darkest secrets and seeing the approval I experienced from those other men where they said, hey, man, me too. And they said, you know, we know this deep, dark secret now, but we still love you and we approve of you and you're still our brother. That, to me, was experiencing the vertical love of Jesus on a horizontal plane. And so it's. That's huge. And so I know that our listeners will absolutely resonate with chapter one for sure.

Yeah. And I love how you said that because, you know, the Bible tells us that, you know, that forgiveness is that, you know, that. That vertical, you know, if we confess our sins, that, you know, that God will forgive us. But then James 5:16 talks about how it is through confession to one another and through the prayer of a righteous man, like, we're healed. And as that's where that healing has to happen. And I would say, man, the other lie that kind of is nuanced with the pornograph is, well, guess what? You'll never be rejected.

Yeah.

And it's like that. So for someone that has felt rejected. So for me, not only was there an absentee father, there was a father that was in close enough proximity that I saw him, because I grew up in a small town and he was around. He wasn't in my life, but he was in close enough proximity to know I knew what he was doing. I know different nuances of his life. So I, I experienced absence and rejection simultaneously. And that's another lie. That pornography. It's like, well, I won't be rejected. But you're, you're. You're believing that you're not going to be rejected from something that's actually fictitious. And that's something that I talk about in the, in the intimacy chapter. But, yeah, I mean, it's, it's, it's all a lie. And that's why it's so addictive, because you believe it's something it's not. But again, if you believe a lie to be true, it's true to you.

Yeah, man. So good. Okay, well, let's keep going. The second lie you address is a big one, I think, in our culture, and we've kind of already talked about it, you mentioned it at the top. It's the lie of the synthetic God of self. So unpack this one for us.

Yeah. I mean, the thing that really jumps out to me is. So one of the books that I read early on, after I gave my life to Christ, it really gave language to some of the theological concepts that, that I was trying to understand and then also communicate was killing kryptonite. And the way that John Bevere talked about the, you know, what happened in Exodus 32, where we see, you know, that, that Moses is, you know, going up to get the Ten Commandments, and then Aaron and this tribe that have been through, you know, all this stuff, they're. They're. They're waiting there. They've been delivered. And what do they do? They, they. They take all their jewelry and they, they build this, like, golden animal, this golden calf. And it's like, what's crazy about it. And, and what I really wanted to, like, lean into in that is they called that idol Yahweh. And how many times in Our life. If we say we worship Jesus, but we omit the things where we want to compromise in our life and we, we say, well, I'm going to surrender most of my life to Jesus, but there's these certain aspects that either I don't want to surrender or I feel like he doesn't have any say or doesn't have to have any say in this aspect of my life. Well, you've actually have become your own God. You're saying that you know best and you've created this God of self. And I think again, like back to the garden, being deceived because, you know, it all goes back to did God really say, right, that you couldn't eat the fruit? And if we question God, what we end up doing is thinking that we know better than God. And that's always going to lead to destruction.

Yeah, absolutely. To me, what comes up with this lie is it's a sense of control. Because if I create a God in myself or I have created this idol, which then is this thing I worship or, you know, sacrifice to or whatever, it's something I can control because I can't control God, you know. And so for me to have trust and faith in the Lord, it's a complete release of control. It is a complete submission where if I'm creating an idol of pornography or maybe it's alcohol or relationships or whatever, man, I can control or have some semblance of control over those things. So that's what resonates with me in that one.

Yeah, and it's, and, and what I would say to so many people. A lot of leaders, a lot of really great leaders that I respect. I, I, I, I find myself challenging because not everyone, but there's been several times over the last decade where I found myself in rooms with, with people that, that I love and respect. And I love that I, you know, gained the relational equity where I can say these things with, with confidence and, but in grace, people will say, well, you know, I, there's this area of my life that I compromise, but I can control the level in which I compromise. So it's not that big of a deal. And it's like, man, what's true is compromise in one area of your life will always lead to compromise in every area of your life. And man, you like the pathway to whatever it is, anything that's good is always going to be surrender and submission. And it's not partial submission, it's not partial surrender. And it's like we want so desperately to hold on to that that portion of ourselves that we used to be. And it's actually because we find comforting chaos. Because if we've been in chaos for so long that it's all that we know.

Equilibrium.

Yeah. And it's like. Yeah. Like, you know, like, literally, it's like cognitive. Cognitively, I've become so familiar with these patterns that even though I found destruction in some aspects of my life and sometime periods of my life, I feel like if I can just hold on to this little thing, I'll do all of this. God, but don't ask me to do this. Yeah. You know, and it all goes back to. It's like, gosh, to. To find the deepest intimacy with God, to find that. That another level of consecration, to find that another level of holiness, to, you know, eradicate that thing in your life that you feel like you just can't overcome. It's gonna. It's gonna cause you to surrender. Yeah. To another level that maybe you've never surrendered before. And it's like, maybe, you know, it's like, well, you know, I, I, you know, there's. There's arguments out there where, like, you know, like, you, You. You can curse to a certain extent, but, like, that doesn't impact, you know, my. My faith walk in this area. You know, I can get drunk sometimes, and it's not that big of a deal.

Yeah.

You know, and so on and so on. Whatever. You know, your sin of choice might be. But I think there's so many people that's like, well, I can do this. Me, personally, I can do this. It's my personal conviction. Like, like your conviction is different than others. It's like my personal conviction is this and that. And it's like, man, you're trying to be God. And it's like, gosh, if, If. If you like the thing that you're struggling with, what it's going to cost you.

Yeah.

Is to die to yourself. Right. And that's really what the. What the capture tries to. To encompass.

Dude, we could. We could spend an entire hour or three probably on that one. So let's just. Let's keep going. That's some good stuff. Okay, so the third lie, and I think it's one. You know, I want to be careful even when I say it this way, that, like, this is not, you know, shots fired at the church, but I think that this culture permeates through the church in so many ways. Your third lie is the counterfeit cleanup. And so just talk to me about that. What does that look like?

Yeah, I mean, I would just say that the reason that I talk about this so boldly is because, you know, what's true is true. And I've got the facts. And the facts are 2000 plus people per month reach out to me via, you know, direct message on social media, or they email me. And I get over and over and over again. I love Jesus, I am part of a church, I attend church. But I am struggling with habitual sin. And the counterfeit cleanup is the lie that if I do something, I can overcome something. And again, you have to receive something that you cannot obtain on your own. You cannot overcome sin on your own. You cannot clean up your own life because you don't even have the desire. Like, read Romans 7. You don't even want to do the things you ought to do.

Exactly.

Why do you, like, why do you arrogantly believe that you can clean up your life by doing X, Y and Z? And you're struggling with, why am I not seeing fruit? Why can't I overcome this? Why am I struggling in this relationship? Why do I keep, you know, losing my jobs? Why can't I be more successful in my career? And it's like, you're trying to do a list of dues instead of receiving.

Yeah, that's good. And that's something too, that we see, you know, in our ministry and in our groups is that's why community is so important. Because that idea of that counterfeit cleanup is this is something I can do by myself. Which, I mean, honestly, man, the more I think about it, like, also comes back to control. Like, I can control how I respond to myself and my sin and what this cleanup process looks like. But I can't control how someone else is going to respond if I tell them, you know, I've had a habitual pornography addiction since I was 12 years old.

And I was going to say, I mean, that's what I love about pure desire. It's like, man, it's a long term commitment, man. Like you, you, like, I'm going to struggle with pornography for 20 years and feel like I can download an app and listen to a sermon and I'm going to eradicate, you know, 20 plus years of sin for my life. No way, man. So, I mean, so many people ask me, like, how do I go from A to B? It's like, well, the answer, one of my favorite books, Eugene Peterson, is Long Obedience in the same direction.

Yep.

The answer is doing the deep work. It's, you know, identifying why do I say yes to the thing that I know is Destructive to my life. You know, what, what, what's. You know, I would. I. I love to say, you know, the fruit is found in the root. If I can get to the root of why do I say yes to the thing? It's like, yes, the. There is plenty of neuroscience around this habitual thing in my life, but it's deeper than that at a heart level, because there's something that I have not dealt with that is causing me to believe if I do this thing. Yes, I'm going to overcome or I'm going to be numb to this thing that I actually don't want to deal with.

Yeah. Yeah, that's good. It just. Man, again, I'm so pumped for people to have this book. So I feel like this is going to be a great thing to have conversations with so many people about and even explore in our own lives. But for time, let's keep going, man. The fourth lie is what you call faux freedom. So. And that's faux freedom. So how does this lie impact us? This not real, this fake freedom?

Yeah, I mean, what. I mean, I would just encompass it in one sentence. You're only as free as you're honest. You're only as free as you're honest. And if I'm not honest, I'm not free.

Yep.

And you know, this. This idea of Christian liberty, it's not I can do whatever I want, it's. I can actually restrain from not doing what I don't want to do. I. I love the way Titus 2:11 14 talks about it. It's. It talks about how the grace of God that offers salvation to all people, it teaches us to say no to ungodliness and worldly passions and live self controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age. And as it goes on, the. It. The way it ends, it ties to Romans 12:2 in that it. You know what. What do we end up being? What? We end up being a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good. And then the end of Romans 12:2 talks about, you know, we're to be conformed not by the world, but be transformed by the renewing of our mind. Why? So that we can know what is God's good, pleasing and perfect will. So we need that line in the sand so that we can know and so we can desire, so God can change the desires of our heart. But if we're lying to ourselves and we're lying to others, we're never going to be free. So freedom is that I'm going to put all of myself on the table. I'm going to bring all of myself to the foot of the cross. And unless I'm ready to be honest, I'll never be free. And what I'll experience is that. Is that faux freedom, that fake freedom freedom, that freedom that is like, why. Why am I still stuck? I did what I was supposed to do. Well, did you confess all of it?

Yeah.

Like, because the level of your confession often will correlate with the level of your healing. I say, man, I went to this website and I watched this stuff I shouldn't have watched, or, like, man, this is the type of porn I watch. I masturbated and I felt terrible afterwards. And I even, like, went and, like, binged and ate, you know, a bunch of pastries afterwards, like, to try to, like, make myself feel better. And it's like, if I. If I confess like, that. Yeah, that's different. Yep.

Yeah.

And if I have someone in my life that's truly going to hold me accountable, that's different. Because if you say to me, josh, you're acting in a way that's not contingent with the character I know you to be. What. What's going on? I could do. I could respond in two ways, man. You're right. You know what? I'm pretty tired. You know, I, I, you know, my wife and I, we just had a kid, you know, 10 days ago. I'm pretty tired. Yeah. You know, praise God for little Abel, but, like, I'm tired, so maybe I'm moody. You know what? Maybe, Maybe I, I spoke to someone in a way that I shouldn't have. Yeah. Thank you for. For calling me out on that. Totally. I need to do something about that. Or I can say, man, don't tell me what to do. Yeah, but. And that. Because, again, accountability and freedom, it's. It's only is good is I'm truly honest. And if I'm not willing to be honest, the freedom that I'm experiencing, it's not going to be real, man.

It just. It's something. Something that I'm just hearing in each of these, too, is the importance of being in relationship with other fellow believers. Like, this is only stuff that can play out in community. And I've. I've heard it said, too, and I've heard this said about spiritual disciplines, but I really do believe that there's a reality, too, with. When it comes to our relationship with the Lord, that the playing field of our relationship with the Lord is really in relationship with other people. I mean, you see, so Many things in scripture that talk about that. And so, I mean, you know, you're talking about honesty. It's like, well, God knows everything. So it's like I can, I really don't have any choice to be honest with him, but I do have a choice to be honest with the people around me. How much I let them in, how much I reveal about myself or my struggle. Or like, dude, if you have a kid born 10 days ago, of course you're tired. People are gonna be like, dude, I get you, I understand you. You know, unless there's a single friend that thinks parenting is easy and they just have a lot of maturing to do, but you know what I mean, there's just so much to that. But yeah, man, there's community. Seems to be such this, this big piece to what you're talking about.

Yeah, I mean, and you know, like, that's why I talk about discipleship so much. Because I would say, yes, Jesus saved my life, but me being in church community, me being in the Word of God, like the Bible and applying, like knowing the Bible, reading the Bible and studying the Bible. Because reading the Bible and studying the Bible are two different things. I'm doing both of those. And being in commun with others and allowing people into my life, that is practically how my life changed.

Yes.

Because if, if I was not discipled, I might have been saved, but I never would have been healed.

All right, well, Josh, one of the things we know is how important purpose is in life and recovery. I remember when we looked at Jay Stringer's work, he said that men who lacked purpose were seven times more likely to struggle with pornography. So just one stat about, you know, if our purposes aren't well aligned in life, we tend to run after really false things. So in your book, the fifth lie is all about false purpose. Talk to us a little bit about what that means. What do you mean by a false purpose?

Yeah, I mean to your point, it's like if I don't know who I am and what I'm created to do, I'm going to wander through life, you know, being conformed by the world, believing that I'm supposed to shape my life, shape my desire, shape my accomplishments after those around me. So unless I know my unique purpose and who I'm authentically created to be, I'm just going to wander through life. I'm going to be not only dissatisfied, but I'm going to be going in this pretty self destructive cycle feeling, you know, especially like as a man, it's like Man, I'm. If I don't know what I'm supposed to do with my life, I'm gonna struggle with that.

Yeah.

And it's gonna, you know, it. That's why. I think that's why there's. There's such a correlation between people who struggle with pornography and struggle with their mental health. It's like, if I feel dissatisfied because I'm experiencing this. This counterfeit version of the intimacy that God created me to experience with him. And I'm not doing the thing that I'm created to do. All I'm doing is experiencing counterfeits, which leave me empty. So of course I'm going to be frustrated. Of course I'm going to struggle with anxiety. Of course I'm going to be prone to struggle with depression. So I would just say, man, if I don't know what I'm supposed to do, I'm going to be pretty dissatisfied with my life.

And doesn't it seem like if we don't have that purpose from Christ through our faith that the world or culture is. They're quick to give us those counterfeit purposes, aren't they?

Certainly. I mean, that's, that's, that's really what the, the book is about. It's like, hey, here's what. Yeah, really, it's. It could be encompassing, like Romans 12:1 and 2. It's like, who. Who am I supposed to be? Okay, well, my life is actually designed to be a living sacrifice. And then Romans 12:2 talks about, well, I'm supposed to be not conformed by the things of this world. I'm supposed to go through this metamorphosis. I'm supposed to be transformed so that I can know what is God's good, pleasing and perfect will for my life. What am I supposed to do? Who am I supposed to be? And the deeper I grow in intimacy with God, the more I can actually know who I'm supposed to be and what I'm supposed to do.

Dude.

And I. It's funny, too. As you've been talking about this one, I can see how a lot of these lies can, like, interplay with each other. You know, when you go back to, like, your first lie of false approval, it's like, if I believe I'm not, you know, if I don't have that approval or I don't want to be rejected. Right. Those two sides you're talking about, then my purpose is totally going to be false. I'm going to be seeking out things that are going to try to scratch that. Itch or be a balm right to that, that pain I have in my life. And so this one specifically, I can see our purpose being so informed by the other lies that get tangled up in our soul and really move us in a direction that we weren't created for.

Yeah, I mean you go to the desert where Satan is trying to tempt Jesus and it's like, you know, change this in the food, you know, you'll, I'll have these people worship you. I'll do this, I'll do that. And you know, Jesus combats his lie with truth, you know, and, and that's why it's so important to, to know the word of God. It's, you know, it's not only a guide to how to live my life and how to seek out my purpose, but it's also a gate to, to protect me from the lies of the enemy.

It makes me think of that little tool that the Navigators used to use in their discipleship process. I think it was the Navigators where they have a circle and in the circle is a figure of a chair which is the throne of your life and they show that like you know, are you on the throne of your life or have you stepped down and is Christ on the throne? And I think the truth is if we're still on the throne of our life, if we're defining our own purpose, then so many things like pleasure, like popularity, like performance, like the, you know, getting the attention of others and having the crowd love us, that becomes purposeful because it's really self driven and it's all about what do I get out of life? But as we find those are the very avenues that lead us into our deeper struggles and things that can take us even further away from the true kind of self giving, other centered, Christ centered life that God has really made us to live. And I think we just see the tragic outcomes of that happening all over the place with people really living with themselves on the throne of their life.

And it's so wild to see Nick just people that are so gifted and you know that there, there's so many things that God has created them to do and you know, it's like them uniquely like there's people who God has created with all these gifts and talents and all these things, but they're mis purposing them and they feel dissatisfied because they're not accomplishing the thing that they think if they accomplish they'll feel satisfied but if they would just really repent. Right, that logistical terminology, if they would just turn back to God. And they could see themselves rightly, and they could use the tools that God has given them to do the thing that God has called them to do. Guess what? There's satisfaction in that. There's satisfaction to be found in the person of Jesus.

Right?

Yeah, absolutely. Okay, so the sixth lie is one that I think can be very easily misunderstood or honestly missed completely. And it's around the topic of intimacy. And I know you touched on this a little bit earlier, but the lie that you address is the imitation intimacy. So what is that? Talk us through that.

Yeah, I mean, I would say if you ask, you know, teenagers, young adults, what is the first thing, what's the first word that comes to your mind when you say intimacy? And probably 90% of people are going to say sex. But guess what? Sex is not intimacy of its. In its own. Like sex. Like there is intimacy involved in sex, but sex in itself is not intimacy. Intimacy is found in the presence of God. We see when there's creation, like God created us to desire him when we. And. And then if we distort what intimacy actually is, it's actually proximity to our creator. And when we look at marriage as what it actually is, it's a representation between Christ and his bride. It's. It's not to fill my desires. It's not to, you know, live out these sexual fantasies. It's not to dissipate my desire to do this. If we just really stop and understand and there's something better that's available to us, but it's not that. And it is again, it just like goes back to counterfeits time and time again. It's like, man, the enemy really wants us to just like, well, if you would just take this thing that God has designed. That's really good. If I can just distort it just a little bit, you know, if I'm five degrees off, then I. I can take you to a place where you never thought you would end up doing things you never thought you would do.

I think that really does explain why a lot of people feel like when they're single, they look at marriage as kind of this solution of, well, when I'm married, I won't struggle or have these same struggles because they feel like sex and intimacy go together and I'm going to have what I'm looking for. And then they're married and they're having a physical relationship with their spouse. But they're not truly, as you're bringing up Joshua, they're not truly experiencing intimacy. They're Having some physical closeness. They're maybe having a piece of what intimacy is, but they're not truly being known. They're not truly being loved for who they really are. They're still perhaps wearing masks or trying to find fulfillment through pleasure. And it's never, as you brought up so well, it's never enough. And so there's an emptiness that comes, I think, even deeper in marriage. I mean, that's the thing that I would say to single people that sometimes they miss. They think, oh, well, married people have it so easy because, you know, they've got this depth of connection with their spouse, and so they don't struggle like I do. But the truth is, I think a lot of people in marriage that are struggling with pornography or lust, they actually feel it, a deeper sense maybe of shame or worthlessness or regret, because there's this feeling of, well, I'm having the sex, what I've called intimacy, and it's not enough. Why isn't it enough? What's wrong with me? And then they're kind of stuck in that place when they don't see, well, you're only getting a piece of what God calls us to in intimacy. And so if we can unpack the full version of intimacy before Christ and that knowing and being known and being loved for who we are, that's really a game changer, I think, in our recovery.

Yeah, I mean, it's like it's impossible for us to desire or it's. It's impossible for us to satisfy our heart by using our flesh. It. It will never work. You'll. You'll never mitigate an internal problem exclusively with an external solution. It'll never work.

Put that on Twitter.

Yes. Tweet it. We'll put it on a T shirt, we'll put it on a mug, whatever. Yeah.

Well, I'm excited to hear about the last lie, Joshua, because, you know, healing is a lot of what we do. It's a big part of pure desire. But I think there are forms of healing that really aren't going to help us. And so your seventh lie is all about hijacked healing. Talk us through this final lie.

Yeah, I think that it. It can correlate with several of the lies. But, you know, believing that you can heal yourself would be one layer. It's like. And then believing that you can heal alone is another lie. And we just keep going back to this need to be known, and we can only be as healed, or we can only be as free as we're willing to be honest. And Also, we need to be in community. We need to be doing life with one another. Because I need to have criticism in my life if I want to grow in any aspect of my life, if I want to be a good athlete, if I want to be a good speaker, whatever it might be, if I want to progress in any aspect of my life, I need to welcome people who love me enough to tell me the truth. Not just what I want to hear, what I need to hear. And I can't see what's on my back. I can't see some of my struggles. I can't see some of my faults. I can't see some of my downfalls.

Yeah.

And I would say for me, this chapter is so emotional because for me, I think that we're only able to find the level of consecration as we're willing to repent. And. And what I mean by that for me is that about three years after I came to Christ, I started to have opportunities to share my testimony. And then I was on staff at a large church and saw God moving in a lot of incredible ways. But I was in a hotel and God woke me up in the middle of the night. And if I wake up around 2 to 3am I feel urged by the Holy Spirit to pray. And I started to lazily. I was lazy. And I was laying there praying and God's no, on your face, out of the bed. On your face. And I get out of the bed and I get on my face. And what's brought to the forefront of my mind is that I had again and again believed that if my life would have looked different, I wouldn't have done some of the things that I've done. Specifically, if my father would have been there, I wouldn't have committed some of the sins that I did. If my father would have been there, I wouldn't have done the porn. If my father would have been there, I wouldn't have been promiscuous. My father would have been there. I wouldn't have done X, Y, and Z. And what is true is while yes, your trauma can have an impact on the way that you see yourself, God gives you the gift of free will. And it was upon my own volition that I chose to sin against God. And when I got to a place where I relinquished the blame that I was putting on my father and I took full responsibility for my sin, I found a level of healing that I'd never experienced before. And some of the. The frustration and some of the. Almost like the need to continue to do more and, you know, almost like this performance mindset, it snuck back in and I. I realized that I needed to forgive my father. I needed to let go of that debt, and I needed to trust that God is not only good, but he's just. And he's a just judge. And I'm going to trust him with that debt, and I'm going to relinquish whatever I believe that he owes me. And in addition to that, I'm going to let go of these presuppositions that, well, I forgave him, but reconciliation didn't meet my expectations. I thought if I forgave my dad and we reconnected, we would have this perfect. This perfect relationship. We didn't. We. I mean, we still, we. We talk. But he wasn't in my life. I still didn't really have a dad that I thought that I would. I would have. And that made me angry. And I just had to bring all of that to God.

Yeah.

And say, here is how I feel. Here is what is true. And let. And just meet him there. And what God has done in my life since then, it. It's hard to even put into words. But I think if we can get to that place where we can be truly honest before God and truly honest before people, then and only then can we find the healing that's available to us.

Yeah. So I feel like you're kind of getting into it. And obviously that. That may not be an experience that everyone has, but the Lord does meet us in these unique ways in these unique pockets. And I know that this last question can be kind of a big one, but if you were to encourage people how to start addressing these lies or how to start identifying and then working toward really, like, blowing them up.

Right.

Like getting them out of our life. What does that look like? Like, what's your tip for someone who wants to start identifying and then working through the lies they believe?

I think the answer is buy the book.

Well, yeah, besides.

Right. Like, let's say, buy Joshua's book. That's what you need to do.

And come hear him speak at the summit.

Exactly. Sure.

So other than those two, like, what are some thoughts you got?

Yeah, I would. I would say I can only be as obedient as I'm self aware. And I can only be so self aware of myself. I need people in my life that know me. So I would say, find someone you trust and start having those hard conversations. So my life was changed because of a man named Andrew Yates. And every Friday he would ask me really Tough questions. Not just am I doing the right things? How's my thought life? You know, am I like, am I struggling with anger? Am I struggling with lust? Am I looking at people and thinking things that I shouldn't? You know, and if I am, what, what am I allowing into my life that's leading me into those ways? Why am I saying yes to the things that I don't want to do? And it's like through those conversations, through him, you know, like proverbs talk about how the wounds of a friend. Yeah. It's like we, we all need the wounds of a friend. We all need to be stabbed in the front by a trusted friend. But we, because we desperately need that. So that way I can be self aware and what's going to happen in those conversations. And this is what I found, like through processing aloud with a trusted friend, I can see gaps in my life. And if I can address the integrity gaps in my life, then and only then I can start walking in truth.

Yeah, yeah.

As, as you were sharing that story about your dad, you know, what came to mind for me is that if repentance doesn't lead us into deeper relationship with other people, we maybe need to question, is it true repentance? You know, I know Dietrich Bonhoeffer talked about when we only come to God and confess all our sin and he forgives us, that there's a level there of self absolution, that we're not really entering into transparency and into the intimacy God longs for us because we don't include other people. And I think that's just what you're saying about the pathway forward. It has to include other people. And as we're humbled by our self awareness, I think that's an awareness of how deep our sin nature goes, that, that there is a part of us that desperately longs for what's wicked. And that's the old nature that Christ in the sanctification process is killing off. But we can't do that alone. We need others who can see us and understand us and repeat back to us things in a way we've never seen and that are encouraging us and praying for us. And when we're entering into that, and even more so when we're entering into that at a marriage level, that's the kind of intimacy that I think transforms and heals us. And I'm excited for people to grab hold of your book to dive more into these stories and thoughts. And I think it's a transformational message.

Yeah, I mean, that's it to your point. It's like, man, we all obviously need that forgiveness that First John talks about. But what some of us are missing is that James 5:16 component where we need that confession to others. We need that community around us because there is found healing. So some of us, we may be forgiven, but we're not healed. And that's why maybe we're stuck where we are.

Yeah, man, we're just so excited for people to get this book. Where can people grab their copy of your book?

Yeah, so Amazon, Barnes and Noble, wherever you buy books, Walmart, Target, all those places you can, you can get it there.

That's awesome. And we know it's going to be helpful. We'll have all those links in the show notes as well. So go grab a copy of 7 Lies that Will Ruin your life by our friend here. We'll also drop Josh's links and socials in there as well. And man, we are not only thankful you're spending time with us here, but as we've already mentioned a couple times, September 20th and 21st, you're going to be with us here in the Pacific Northwest at our Pure Desire Summer it. And we are pumped to have you in person, man. So thank you for your time and we're really excited to see you in September.

Absolutely. I can't wait, guys.

And if you are a fan of the podcast, please subscribe, share it with somebody and write us a review. If you want more information on our groups, our resources or counseling, just go to purazire.org and lastly, never stop being healthy.

Sam.