Define your 2025 visionboard using words | She reimagined OF | Price is all about storytelling - Ep3

So I don't know if you know this, but it's a father-son business. He lent money initially from his dad. That's that's how it started. And yeah, most people don't know it was a family.

This is a family. This is a wholesome family business.

A wholesome. Hello everyone. Welcome to another episode of the we don't know how we're gonna call the show yet, but it's our third episode. My name is Mio Zavala, your host. With me are other host Yoad Mick. How's it going, man?

By the way, I thought of this. It could be just right now as a description, at the crosspoint between imagination and storytelling. So sort of the RX Factor.

I think we should have a prize. If someone finds a good name for the show, we'll give them something.

All right, let's do it.

Each one of us will give them 5 hours. It's like worth, what, $5,000 at least?

Damn. That's a, that's a Christmas gift and a New Year's special. I like it.

Great. So this is how we're gonna start the episode. If you can find a good name that combines something with storytelling and imagination, we'll give you 10 hours of our combined time that you can use any way you want to help your business.

In today's episode, by the way, did I tell you about the trip we had this week?

Tell me.

Okay.

What trip?

And by the way, I love the fact we both have nice haircuts today. Love it.

Oh yeah. I, I comb mine.

That's how I send people to the YouTube when we do these things. I'm in Northern Thailand at the moment. It was kind of like Christmas. There's no one here. I was working and some people said, hey, let's, let's grab some bikes and ride. We rented them. Went out, unbelievable. And we rode about 700 kilometers from village to village for about 4 days. And I'm telling this because something caught my eye while we were talking. And every time we stopped and we're having coffee, we're having lunch, we're driving from village to village, village to village, and everybody's listening to podcasts on their bikes.

Okay.

And it was interesting because when we stop and we're kind of like, oh, what did you listen to? What did you learn now? And stuff like that. People said I need to revisit my 2025, kind of like, should I have a vision board? Should I revisit my decisions? What should I do with it? And a lot of people said, when we go back on the first, I'm gonna start doing things, which you and I both know means they're never gonna start doing them. The second thing that was interesting is the way people describe things. So I, I never do this. I I'm not that type of person. I will never go to the gym, which is something I used to say a lot, and now I go almost every day. So the limit that we are able to create by the words we choose was quite fascinating. And when we were there, I asked them, what if we don't say that? What if we can't use the word but? What if we can do anything? What would you like to achieve, and how would you like to achieve that? And as days passed, the first, the second, third day, people started to use different words. I am going to lose weight, and this is how I'm going to do it. I am going to write something. You know, the people who said, "I wanted to do a vision board, and I am visual, but I don't want to print things and put them on the wall." 3 days later they're like, yeah, maybe I should do it. Or some guy told me, the problem is, um, if I do it, it's an A3 big paper. You know, if, if A4 is 2 printing pages, it's not enough room. And I was like, 2 minutes ago we didn't even wanna make—

now it's not enough.

Yeah, it, it's, it's really interesting. I think that the words we choose is critical and, you know, a lot It's, it's been spoken a lot about, you know, the energy that you even create, but it's not even on the, on sort of the holistic energetic level. It's literally the energy that you create within yourself. And I think a lot of the things that I think we deal with is the fact that you say something that you want to do, that you want to achieve. I think there's 2 aspects to that. First of all, does it really belong to you or doesn't belong to you? And I think one of the key things to understand is like, do you say things because you're supposed to say things because that's the way, because you're supposed to, you know, how you close up the year, you have to be good and you have to do this. And I think this have to, you notice a lot of people do not continue this because it disconnects them emotionally. So they say this, and then there's also that but that you say, because there's the caveat, right? It comes with the, with sort of the, um, uh, small print that already provides the excuse for something that's gonna happen because, you know, you know what's gonna happen. So I think there, there are 2 parts of this, which we, we continuously sort of work on to, to discover. And I do that with myself as like, You know, this big thing called authenticity, but what is really your— to discover what is the authentic thing that you want to do for yourself that is really growth. I think that it doesn't touch on that feeling that makes you excited, proud, you know, that feeling of commitment. What experiences are creating you when you say these things? Okay. When you say that and you say here, yes, and automatically here you feel, yeah, but I think that's automatically just sort of checking off that box and it's not authentically yours. So, so that's really.

Yeah.

And it's a thing. And then the second thing that I just say, look, let's say we passed this and you did discover what your authentic thing to be, because this is how you want to feel, how you want to make people feel. People want to know exactly. I think so. One of the things is to connect to what experience you want to create, what experience you want to feel. So, okay, let's say we did this and now we understand a little bit more, which I, by the way, find people are having such a difficult time with to separate the subjective specific reality with the experience that it creates in you. They think it's the very same thing, which it is not.

Yeah.

But then I think it's observing from that place in a very sort of powerfully vulnerable way, like I always talk about, to understand what are the blocks and limitations. Or as you said, those self-held and self-made truths that you hold. And like with everything, it's like if you don't start to sort of reshape them with words, reshape that with feelings, another opportunity to not— you have one opportunity to be this, but maybe there's another one and another one, another opportunity. which you connect with emotionally and then bring that into play. So using words as well, I think if you don't start sort of breaking those self-filled truths, then there's no chance to reach and make those things.

So what was interesting is my suggestion to the people listening or watching this, make a list of all the things that are limiting, right? So I don't do this, I hate doing that. Make a list.

And if we said why, Which is fine, by the way.

Make a decision that you hate doing—

going to the gym. Why? Now make another step. What would it mean if you agreed to go to the gym once or twice or 3 times a week? Which, by the way, I'm not pushing anyone to go to the gym. I hate it. A month in, I'm not enjoying. I'm going because I understand what will happen on the other side. So the next step is, once you have these And we agree to make that list. What if you can't use the words but? If you can't use the words I can't or I don't? And then if we create that structure and we say, okay, I don't want to go, I don't like, uh, if I had to, why would I go?

What would I like to achieve on the other side? And start making that list. And call that your 2025 list. So I want to write another book. Okay. I'll make it. By the way, I was invited by a good friend of mine to visit a location in Mexico this August, August 25th, to write. He's going to write a book and he said, write something. And I was like, I don't know if I'll have another book by 2025. I don't know if this book is going to be done. It's gonna be hot. I hate the heat. I prefer the cold. And they're gonna surf every day. I don't surf. And I was like, wait, I don't surf every day? And they have beginners classes every day? I had an idea for a book. I'll find that file. I've never written a book in 30 days. This is gonna be awesome. So I said yes. Nothing changed. The price, the details, the dates, the, the heat, nothing fucking changed.

The only thing that changed was the internal conversation I had with myself.

I think there's another thing that you added into it, which, which is actually one of the things that, for example, with startups, I find this a lot. And, and I just had it actually this morning when it was a really interesting session. We'll talk 2 things about it. But one of the key things that repeat every time is that when they start talking, they start talking about the product. Just like they start talking about the things in analogy, what they're going to do for the new year. I'm going to go to the gym, go to the— what they're missing in each part. And you just mentioned that right now is what we call the impact. Or as you say, as for what? So basically turning all these things I need to do as a means to an end. Meaning also with the startup, I said your product, nobody gives a shit about your product. Nobody gives a shit, especially not at this stage. They're, I mean, if they're investing in you, they're investing like for the long run, for the 5 to 10 years, for the ecosystem that you'll build, for the impact that you will have, for the, 5x that you'll do and so on and so on. That's what they're investing in right now. This is a meets the line, a proof point. And then actually, you know, coming, um, coming back to investing in the team, they're investing in you right now and your words and your intention and your passion. And are you going to be the one that's going to be driving it? But especially they want to, you know, I call this collective imagination, but to bring people in means that you need to tell them what you're going to do for what. For what are you going to do it? Because you want, you want to go to the gym. Do you want to be sexy? Do you want to be healthy? Do you want to be this? There has to be a motivation because sure, you're going to do it once, twice, 3 times. Then your subconscious is going to start going, fuck you, right? Bringing you back saying, stay in today. Don't go. You know, it's too much. You're hurting. It's still leg day. So there's so many things that are stopping you. And the question is, how will you make the choice to overcome the resistance so you can go there again? Before you reap the reward of that was a satisfying day, right? So the question is, how are you going to do it again and again and again? And sometimes the outcome will not be what you want. It's going to suck. The question is, if you don't understand what the impact is, can you really continue this if you don't see this as a means to an end? And did you ever ask yourself, why am I doing this? Why do I have to make these New Year resolutions or whatever?

Love it. So I decided this year I'm going to flip everything. So that means that I really hate going to the gym. So I got a month subscription and I go 5 or 6 times a week. Now, the idea was that I only need to go this amount of times before I'm allowed to quit.

So everything I don't like doing, And what that means?

I put on a list and I said, these are the things I always say I'll never do.

It, it's, it's interesting. It is flipped. But now, now let me just ask you, I'll give you my example that, that I faced, and then tell me how you're, you take it on yours. Because I give this example that I, I do cold showers. I still do. I think we talked about that. And the thing is that I did this because I heard that it was good. Wim Hof told it, Huberman Lab told it, everybody said that it's really healthy.

So I did this.

And I suffered for years of like every time like that. Then I'd say that, you know, because, because I just went to the shower. The point was the shower. I was focusing on the shower, on the cold. And, and I was holding on, but it was, it was a, it was this aversive reaction every time to go again. It was like, ah, right. And then finally it's over. There was no that. So like you in the industry, you're saying 5 days that I was like gritting my teeth every day because I knew I'd do this, but I wasn't getting the, something was missing.

Yeah.

Right? The, the, why was I doing it? But truly the passion and not just logically, but also emotionally. I think I felt the disconnection in the fact that I didn't want to, but, but I, but I said I have to, and then it caused something not nice, but I had to get over. And we're both, uh, you know, after the army and all these experiences, so we know how to push ourselves, you know, even into uncomfortable situations and to continue moving on. But then I heard the thing when Bob say to, to say to yourself that you choose this. And you connect with this emotionally, and then you go and do this. And when I started doing this, suddenly I was choosing it and saying, and thinking of the experience of me and being proud of this experience of walking in. And I wasn't having the aversive reaction suddenly, and I was actually more comfortable under the water. And I felt success afterwards because now I was like emotionally connected to why I'm doing this and what will happen because of this. So now everything sort of fit in together. Same question to you.

You go there 5 times, you grit your teeth.

Okay, you're done with your 5 times.

Now what?

Then I make a decision, but I've done it enough times, enough repetitions to know if I like it or not.

Now I'm allowed to say I don't like it.

I don't want to go find something else to do. That's fine.

To your cold plunges, by the way, I think it's stupid. But why, why do I think that?

Because nobody really enjoys going into a Uh, the ice bath. And we went here to a party a couple of weeks ago, and you know, this is Thailand. The party includes, uh, um, hot sauna, dry sauna, uh, uh, cold plunges, Muay Thai, uh, sessions, yoga, whatever. Fuck this shit. But when we left— wait, when we left the sauna, everybody went out to the cold plunge, right? I've done this enough times. By the way, when I met Wim Hof, I told him he owes me money because I was doing cold plunges and I'm not his size anymore and I shrunk. And he was like, tell me how much I owe you, I'll pay you. Okay. So, but I've done it in—

You met him? Oh my God.

Yeah, I met him.

I, I spoke, um, he was the keynote speaker in 2018 in a Hamburg event and I was talking before. I was funnier.

So the thing was that when we left the sauna and we all went and people were like, ah, yeah, no, I just went in. I know how it feels. I understand it's part of the process. There's no point of complaining about it. You go in, there's a timer. When the time is done, you leave. It's fine. It's, it's not connected to— for me, what I love about cold plunges now is that I was able to overcome the fear, the not fear.

I just go in.

I focus on the breathing.

Beautiful.

If there's a benefit, I will get the benefit cuz I only focus now. I need to stick it out 3 minutes, 3 minutes, whatever is needed, you know? But I still can't say, yeah, this is what I love doing every morning. It's not.

I agree, but I have to, to, to hear like a different experience from, from like even a child's point of view. That doesn't have all the complications that we've gathered along the way. So one of the cold plunges that I did was with my, you know, in this sauna place, and there's ice, like full ice because it's really ice bath, the outside pool. Anyway, so my 9-year-old goes with me and the sheer excitement of going and choosing to do something that she cared.

The sheer excitement of going into this ice bath actually really empowered her and made her enjoy the choice to overcome and go. So even if you divide it, there is the first thing to be proud of yourself for overcoming the resistance and saying, amazing, I did that, going and overcoming second resistance, the third resistance. So, a lot of times we say, okay, how do we take this big thing of going to the gym or doing a plunge and then divide it into many parts? And every part you can be proud of. I chose, overcome the resistance, success score. And then, you have compounding success of those small things. And looking at her do that and then choosing to do that again because we were sitting in the sound after, it was like, amazing, I did that. I overcame this. Okay, let's do it again. So, this little kid thing that we all have it, the do it again thing, that's what a lot of times I'm trying to tap into because it's there, it was there. So, how do I bring it to things and find the gratification and find the small instances of pride? And that's basically like reimagining how you look at this or telling yourself the story in a way that explains that this is the intention and this is the means to an end. And this is what I'm proud of and this is what I choose. And now, so that fortifies a different part that you have not considered yet to To develop the behavior, to overcome the inconvenience, to reimagine why you surf every day, like you said.

Yeah. So to wrap up this part of the show, I think for 2025, I think we agree on find what makes you feel uncomfortable, talk to yourself a bit differently, rewrite your story for 2025. It's completely up to you because between you and I, nobody cares. You can keep doing exactly the same shit you did before, up to you. You can change small things, and that's the important thing. Take the big goal, break it into small things. You only need to show up at the gym. Go to the gym every day, don't do anything. Go stand by the cold plunge, right? Open a notebook, don't write a single thing, and then say hi and take it from there.

By the way, just to add a note on top of that, after you do exactly what you said, When you go back and you're like— I know many people don't do this, but I started doing this and it's actually very powerful. At the beginning, it feels stupid to write what you're proud of because you think you're supposed to be proud of huge things. But standing— when you didn't stand in the gym near the cold plunge and you did, then even reimagining what it means to be proud of yourself for achieving that step because you didn't have that step before. Like you said, he wanted the big thing where he didn't even have one word to start with. Suddenly, he wants a 3 by 8 to write this. So, even reminding yourself, I'm proud of myself for Doing that, for standing there, for— yes, not again— for touching the water, for things like that. And you go, well, this is stupid. There's nothing to be proud of. And people say this all the time, but if you don't do that, there's not that compounding effect. So I absolutely strengthen that. Do that, but then also give yourself credit for it, because that way you'll reach that point which you really want to reach in the first place.

Yeah, I agree.

And by the way, I broke a record for running because I'm losing weight at the gym. So that's my thing.

Nice.

So what's your topic? Next one. You had an interesting conversation this morning.

I did. I think it's built on the conversation that we had on how do you quantify yourself and then how do you explain yourself? And especially when things that we do, and I'm sure a lot of people that don't know that have this impact to work with people or work with mindsets or a way of doing things, it's hard to just say exactly what your impact is or Or what specifically you do when they ask you, give me it in a sentence. And I think it's hard. So, it's the same for me because I feel every time I do one-on-one coaching, I go into the other person's world. I really listen and understand what they need, where they're at, the words that they're saying, the patterns that they form. And then, so the session is very much tailored, yes, through my prism of imagination training, but very much specific to that person because of their needs and their blocks and the patterns that they don't see and so on. Like this morning, I was with this very interesting startup and very powerful female founder. And, you know, she knows this and she's going to be— she already has things lined up, but she's also in a very bad place emotionally. But she's also— she knows logically what things are waiting for her, but there's this dissonance between those two. And I kept telling her about the things that we do. And it was like, logically, she understood this, she understood, understood. But the more we talked, we got into the logical and emotional side. Then we got to the emotional side, we noticed how much they're disconnected and how much basically she's not bringing the emotion and the passion and thing into it because she's scared to tap into that because emotions are weakness and emotions are— you're vulnerable and things like that. So even reimagining with her what it means to be powerfully vulnerable. And then it was— I told you at the end of the session, She started, she got so, she chose so much to go into it that it resulted in crying. And at the minute she started crying, it was like, oh, okay, you know, it's weakness because I'm crying. We're like, no, no, no, no, that's exactly the point where we got to. Like, hold on to that. Now imagine that you look at this crying as something very powerful because you're tapping into a dam of emotions. That's exactly what you want. It's like, now I believe you and I believe what you're tapping into and then pour that into what you do. So, in all this thing, I said, okay, so what is my impact? What is my deliverable? The entire session, the emotional part at the end, do I make people cry? Is that what's happening? So, I think it's got to do with the— there's a lot of emotions and feelings and things that you have to experience. And I think tapping back to what you do is how do you then quantify that into words that make sense to people that touch on their pain points that they understand that they can walk into a process like this as well.

So I think no one wants to pay for you to make them cry. Of course, they can go to the shrink. What's interesting here is people forget the most important thing. The currency we trade is emotions. You can do whatever you want. The number one currency we all trade is emotions. And that's, by the way, the premise of my book, is that we use too much data Whereas our audience understands something completely different.

If we understand this concept, you are able to take me from point A to point B, for example, to better tap into my emotions, understand who I am, how to convey the emotions I feel onto my audience, which will help me then— they will resonate, they will like me, they will appreciate me. And we know that at the beginning you might have 10 slides, an idea, maybe an MVP. People like you or not, they get where you're going, the way you behave, you make them feel something. That's where people put their money. So if you're able to take me from point A to point B, from not having anything to maybe raising funds, how much is that worth?

It's worth a lot, but that's a very quantifiable thing that you do for a process that's very amorphic.

In a way.

Why?

Because when you think about it, you have— okay, a pitch is something that you can hold on to because you go up and there's a pitch there. And then, but I'll give you an example. How much is it worth to train an entrepreneur to become resilient?

For them, everything.

You're right.

How could you quantify that?

Do you wanna become an entrepreneur?

Yes.

What are you willing to pay to do that?

Anything.

Great. I only charge 10 grand.

Quantifiable, by the way, is not according to the price we charge. It is according to this thing that is next to us. So why do we give options on SaaS platforms? We give 3 options. Why? Because you won't take the cheapest, right? And you won't take the most expensive.

You are never alone.

The idea is that the pricing model is never— it's always subjective, and it has to be subjective to something else. So if I have 3 proposals, will be subjective, right? But what if I have yes or no and I need the yes? The yes is worth everything. So how much will you pay? Anything. Great. So this is very cheap. More than that, we are the only ones who offer something that is very unique. We do not only solve their problem, we actually change the way they think, which then results in a multiplier. And you know what, I'm going to give you a discount. You only pay me once. You don't need to pay me every time you use my method. Ah, it's like 90% discount, only $10,000. It is a matter of perception. Yeah, we are not selling this, we're not charging a certain price. We're making them feel that they can achieve something with us. The problem in sales is sometimes we again express the benefits and say, how do you quantify the benefits?

How much is a spouse worth? We don't know.

That's exactly.

Right.

But then you have 2 things. I mean, when you say, do you want to become an entrepreneur? You're tapping into something that I want. That's absolutely true. But sometimes when you don't promise that at the end to have something, a mindset or transformation or things like that, people, they don't know how to hold on to that. It doesn't mean anything. So I think another thing that we're trying to do is tap into what is the pain point that I want to solve for you? Or what is the, you know, if you, for example, we talked about even reimagining the blocks, their truths. Like, are they your truth or someone else's? I mean, is it really the truth? I mean, can you reimagine another way? So even getting to the point where you can then imagine yourself in a future self that's not the usual or not defined by you today, that's a journey. There has to be a lot of things. You don't start with that. You don't start with this or the brainstorming or whatever the thing is.

You have—

there's a journey that has to go there.

I think— The Wizard of Oz.

Okay. The Wizard of Oz is a great journey. One of the best stories about the journey, right? Um, Lord of the Rings, great journey. They go on an adventure, something happens. You're an entrepreneur, you're stuck at this point. I can take you from this step to this step. By the way, I won't take you all the way. You need someone else.

Yep.

Now I need to understand who you are, what you want, how much you're willing to do. By the way, prove that you're willing to do. For many years, I was like, take me, take me. I think I had a call earlier today, which is a great example for a company who spent hundreds of thousands on a branding process. And I was brought in as a favor to a good friend of mine, which I'll tell you that story in a second as well, which I think is very relevant to this. And the ask was, can I talk to them? When I was presented as this brand whisperer, which is cool, it's great. But when I spoke to them, the brand's not relevant to the conversation. They have a founder's problem, not a branding problem. The brand's not relevant to the story. By the way, I think there's a different discussion to be had if it's a solidified thing. If it's even a brand or a founder story that they're all following, which is great. It will last to a certain point. But they brought me in and now they expected something, but I'm not— I don't do marriage counseling. I'm single. I have no idea how this shit works. So the problem is completely different. On the other hand, by the way, I got a call from a good friend who said, hey, we're struggling with a client. They want to do certain things in their content. We need to fix it. They don't understand who they are. They don't understand their identity. To which I replied, I'm riding on a motorcycle in northern Thailand. Can you send me a one-pager? And I got there to Pai.

I took a look. I called him. I said, it's not a good page.

Very bad.

I don't understand a single thing. And she said, I understand, but we've been back and forth for weeks. How do we fix it? And I said, I'll fix it. 10 minutes later, I send them the page. They're like, but all the things they wanted, they're not here. All the sayings and the slang and the thing. I was like, yeah, not relevant. She's like, yeah, but they said it has to be in. I said, they don't know what they need. The way they will read it in their minds, the one-pager, They will fall in love. They would love you. They would call you and tell you they love you. She's like, listen, you don't understand the client. I said, I don't even know the client. Trust me, it works. She went to her boss, said, hey, um, this is the draft. And he was like, what is this? No, no, trust me, this is the draft. 2 hours pass. Guess what happened? They called and said, finally you get us. We understand who you are.

They don't.

I just made them feel— they felt it. I know how to write in a way that makes you feel something.

The previous paper didn't make them feel the way they wanted to feel about themselves. Has nothing to do with who they are. I just know how to tap the buttons.

That's exactly a good point to lead to that, that people— it's not that just the people don't know what they want. That's the cliché. But let's put that aside for a sec. It's like people assume That there is a solution that is well known to them to a problem that they keep looping around in. So, on the one hand, they're looping in problems, but they already know what to expect from the solution. And you're going, do you understand that there's a paradox there? If you want right now to break from the loop into a spiral up, and not a spiral down, but a spiral up, you have to go into that unexpected unknown. So, A lot of times, even in the workshops, they tell me, okay, tell me what to expect from going into the unknown, the unexpected, into this imagination journey. And it's like, again, you understand that this is dissonance. If I already tell you what to expect from something that's unexpected, you can't do that. And if you want to know what to expect or the magic pill that's going to— or the magic pill that's going to be when you're done, then you already know it. We're going to be looping back into the same thing. And that's why they went back and forth, back and forth, back and forth. By the way, you did something that she may perhaps should have done as well. And that's, yes, you read this. So I'm sure that what you wrote was also based on understanding what they wanted, which that page did. But so they were trying just to satisfy them, but there was no sort of my truth, my emotion, my passion of how I want to do. So I'm giving— so for as the one who provides you a solution, I'll give you the opportunity to have this, whether you accept it or not is up to you, but I will give this to you regardless of what you think the process is supposed to be or the answer is supposed to be. Now, many times they'll go, oh, it's not what we wanted. They'll break off. I had that working in advertising. We have that a lot. We can have a genius campaign, but they look at this and it doesn't even touch on the zone because they're so involved politically, as you said, that they can't even break away from that. But let's say that we still give them this and they can have the opportunity to suddenly see something through a new light to make them excited, make it emotional, but it comes from you just giving them the opportunity and not trying to just tell them what to do. define yourself by whatever they want to give you. And I think that's what you do differently, is what I do differently. We said, okay, this is the opportunity we give, this is what we can do. You think that the solution is brainstorming? Now, there's— at one point, yes, but there's like all these things that you have to unblock in order to do this. You can't imagine limitlessly if you don't even know what it's like, like we spoke last time, to step out of the box.

Amazing. So my friend said, you know, Lovett saved us. I think I've been so close that I wasn't able to do it differently. And I said, what's the problem? Just start from scratch. And she said, I'm not sure I could start from scratch. You're so in the process. Now, the ability that you have to come and pick me up, take me out of that place, start from scratch, know how to ask the question, bring something else to the table, something that's completely different. And by the way, It's so cheap because without this you might be doing the same thing until you run out of money. How much money do you have? $50,000? Great, it's cheap.

Pricing is always in comparison to something else. By the way, I now charge because I understand my value, and if not, it's completely fine. I want to do other things. I wanna help more people. And if you don't get it, it's completely your problem. And I solve most of the problems very fast, by the way.

So how, what would you, um, so people who are having this difficulty around quant, sort of explaining themselves, explaining not the process that they do, but the value that they give at the end, what would you, what would be like one tip that you'd give 'em to an exercise?

Yeah, I think the one-liner is very critical that people need to understand very fast what we do. You look at your website in one sentence. What do we actually do? So if I'm the right type of audience and I have a problem and I log in and I see a website, I'm like, ah, this is what we're looking for. So the hero section will have what we do in a sentence, maybe an elaboration of 2 sentences underneath. But under that, to simplify for a lot of you guys, put how you solve it. Now I'm interested. By the way, when I get to the pricing, I should already feel like this is probably the right person or company to solve my problem because I understand that I'm the audience and I need a solution. I understand how you're going to do it for me. And now let me, the audience, quantify. And when I see your pricing model It's great. Another tip that took me, by the way, years as someone who did agency life, and then I did it alone before and alone after and other stuff, and always I was like, um, what's your pricing? I'm like, this is the pricing. And I had a call like that 6 or 7 days ago when someone called and said, hey, listen, we got screwed.

It's not working. It's not what we need.

We want 1, 2, 3, explain the whole thing. And I said, oh, that's great. It will take 8 weeks. This is how much it costs. And I can start on January 6th. And he was like, amazing. Send the contract. 24 hours later, 70% of the money's in the bank. Before I would be like, ah, yeah, listen, you know, it took me years to get to the point.

Like, but I think it's very much connected to get to the point where you say this is like also understanding the impact. That you have, the value you create. And then you can be very, you can give them the opportunity to take it or not take it and not be defined by that. And then continue to do this until you, but the ones who choose it, choose it.

The ones who don't, don't.

And I think—

You want your second tip?

Yes.

I'm adding a button. Used to have that in a different version. I'm adding a button to my website. Hopefully by the next podcast we do, I can show you. Book a call now. I'll solve your problems. It's $1,000 a session. And if I don't, I'll refund you the money, no questions asked. These are the topics I can help you with. And if not, I'll refund the money.

Sounds good. I like it.

So I think For me, it also clears out the— I don't have any more free calls unless I initiate something, unless I'm interested. But if not, hey, there's no point. By the way, if they afterwards need more work, it goes into the contract. So I'll take it down. I'll take it out from the The main contract, if we have, depending if it's, I don't know, $15,000, $20,000, $50,000, we'll take it out, no problem.

Um, the story we tell ourselves is very important when it comes to this thing.

What we do and how we do it, and pricing is subjective to something.

So either the proposals, other options that we have— half a package, a package, 2 things, more hours, whatever you might offer— there's a pricing that you can use. And I suggest if you're not sure about it, add the packages to your website. It will solve a lot of problems for you because then people make the comparison to your services and not to others. And they will always remember that there's also a cheap tier. Tier 1 is also, it's $5,000. And then they'll talk to other clients and they'll be like, $8,000. They'll know they have a $5,000 one and they'll book a $10,000 with you. Don't worry about it. And then make sure that the value you offer is more valuable, right, to what they want to achieve.

It's funny. So it's like back in advertising, we used to have 3 directions that we used to give with both equal, like, all right, like one was supposed to calm them down and say, okay, we understand you. One was supposed to go, this is insane.

And you go, oh.

And then the one we actually wanted, which was like a, pushing the boundaries but would still safe enough. So this sort of, we called it lowballing. It's like, okay, oh, you have this and then they picked that thing. So it was always like kill your baby kind of thing that you have to because you're going for that one.

But so we would say, I'm gonna show you this, but the CEO is not gonna like it. He will never approve, but we're gonna show you. Guess what?

The CEO approves it because if not, We're trading emotions, man.

It's all it is.

That's actually very true.

So what else do we have? You want to do another one?

Oh yeah, but did I tell you about— oh, you said something about acronyms, that you don't like acronyms and I love acronyms.

Let's do acronyms and then I have one for you.

All right, so I was lying in bed this morning, 5:30, don't ask me why. Got up and then I was just sitting there trying to get to sleep. And then now what I do is called Imagem, which is sort of a Twist on imagination gym, you know. And I was saying, okay, there has to be the there. I must have called it imagine for more reason than I thought about what I do and how I do and how to connect with the emotions. All the conversations we just had today, sitting there at five a.m. going through this. And then I came to an acronym, and it was good. It was according to the letters of imagine, which was imagination makes authentic growth your mindset. And I was going, that's actually, yeah, what I do. Authenticity, growth, reimagining even the opportunity to do that through this. I said, okay, it brings the process, it brings the value of this, and it includes the choice for you to make it your own because you have to choose and the ownership and everything. So I said, okay, it really brings it all together. Will it make sense to others? Good question.

Yeah. But to me, it was like, I love the fact that you can train people, train them to use their brain in a limitless way. I love that every time we talk, because it is great, but it's better than— I can't even repeat what you said.

Imagination makes authentic growth your mindset.

Acronyms are made for the people who invented them. Because when you were telling me this earlier today, I was like, yeah, great. And I was like, what are the other acronyms? You know how in the army we would ask people, what was the acronym for that? He's like, it's 20 years ago. Who remembers? We call it like that. Okay. And then at EO, the Entrepreneurs Organization, we all have these acronyms and everybody, every time someone joins and you're like, we do this competition that's called ta ta ta ta ta. And they're like, yeah, what does it mean?

It means the It's the— so the problem with acronyms, but that could be the sentence too.

No, no, I think my sentence is good. The idea of a gym and training, they get, and training an imagination, I think is an awesome concept. And, and by the way, love the acronym.

Well, if you ask me in 2 hours, I won't remember.

No, you're right. I understand that, but for me, it was a trip. Then yes, it's for us to get connected emotionally to this. Yes, we can use it as a sentence in the site if it really describes, as you said, the one sentence that people go, you know, I don't even need them to understand so much as to be really curious and to feel that, you know what, it's really interesting for me to explore this because there's something there. Because sometimes you can't.

So what if you don't need curiosity? Curiosity means that they need to figure out if they will like what they see.

There's one step more.

They need to know that what they saw is what they need.

Exactly.

That's true.

That's true.

So 10% of the human brain is what they claim we use, right? And if you could unlock another 1%, how amazing would that be? Hi, welcome to Imagine Gym.

That's true. That's true. But, but then, then, you know, it's, it's a, It's a claim, but if you can't prove the claim, you know, it's up to you. Yeah, very interesting. I think, yeah, I think it's something that, um, I agree with you in part, but I think it's, uh, I think for me, and connecting back to what we did, it's about how do you tie yourself also emotionally to this. And so when you— so sometimes I feel, for example, when I talk about these amorphic things, As I was talking about this morning in the session, I said, does anybody have any doubt that I'm passionate about this? They say, no. Do you exactly know what we do? And then it's like, no, but sometimes this is like creating this collective imagination with you.

It's like exciting.

You bring into the world, we're creating something together. What are we creating? I don't know, but this is going somewhere and I'm discovering new things. And then at the end of the day, when they summarize it, by the way, a nice tip that I discovered on, as far as if anybody's watching this that does coaching summary, I don't ask them to summarize the session, I ask them to summarize it and then teach it to me, which is of course a very good tool, but, and then we continue to iterate the summary from time to time to time to time, the same base and how the lesson changes, and then that's something very quantifiable, if you will, or at least right in front of you, you can see your own process as you explain your own process to doing things, so I discovered that this is really cool. And people really put themselves in there, and then it's not you; it's them. So it's another interesting, emotionally connecting thing. You were telling me something really interesting on something.

I want to talk to you about reimagining stuff.

You know, very sad.

Let's go off topic for a second, and I want to talk to you about porn. Not not porn porn, but like yeah porn. So I don't know how many of you know the concept of OnlyFans.

It's that kind of show.

Yeah, yeah, listen listen.

It's important.

2016, 2016, guy in London named Tim Stalkley had an idea. What if we connected celebrities with their fans and we give them the chance and we take out the mediators, right?

There's always someone in the middle that makes money. And what if we give them a great way to create content, talk to their fans, everybody's happy, everybody makes money. So I don't know if you know this, but it's a father-son business. He lent money initially from his dad. That's, that's how it started. And yeah, most people don't know it was a family-owned business.

This is a family, this is a wholesome family business.

A wholesome family business.

Basically, you wanna, you wanna connect to the stars. All you wanna do is be close. That's all you wanna do.

Exactly. But the idea was great.

Okay.

And then 2018, Leonid Levitsky, he's a Ukrainian-American businessman. He started to buy equity and then I think he finalized a few years ago the whole deal where he now is the sole proprietor of OnlyFans. It's a private company, which by the way is interesting because in the UK over a certain revenue you have to give your numbers. Okay. So they gave away $630 million, I think last year. Insane.

Insane.

They, they'll cross probably the billion by the time we spoke now. So the interesting thing is—

A lot of fans.

People are now reimagining the way that you can do different types of pornography. But the idea was nice to connect with people. Now, fundamentally, it is flawed because if you think about it, we always said the internet is supposed to take the middleman out. Yet today, if you wanted to take a hotel, you go to Airbnb or Booking.

Yeah.

Right? If you wanna hire someone to do a job in the Philippines, you go to Fiverr or Upwork.

So basically what happened is middlemen came in and as always, and I don't know if you know this, I think 1 out of 3 point something pages on the web, 1 out of 3 point something is poor and it will always go down to the lowest common denominator, which is sex. The problem was that when they built this website, OnlyFans have had a great concept. Patreon, by the way, was a great success about supporting. They never had nudity. They had some, uh, um, what was it called? Artistic nudity, but very slightly tweaked and stuff. Everything else was about creators, people who did shows, anime, designers, and other stuff. Really cool. Um, I was even there for a while. And then the idea was that when OnlyFans came and said, no limits, everything's okay.

Mm-hmm.

Right? And I think Cardi B was the first one to do nudity as a celebrity over there.

What's interesting is that as this shifted, different type of creators start to do different things. Now, if everybody does the same thing, how do you differentiate? You need something else. And then comes this girl. I think she's 20. Her name is Sophie Reign. The web is going crazy for this girl. And over a podcast, I think last month or 2 months ago, she mentioned that she makes quite a lot of money. She didn't want to say at the beginning and everything. She made $43 million last year. Now, the interesting thing is, are you ready for this? Because this is not the final thing. It goes crazier. She is a wholesome, good Christian American girl.

Just like they intended in the beginning.

Exactly. And she became, okay, she became that girl. There's no other.

And she is what they like to say, maintaining Christian values, as the website likes to say. And she was offered now what is claimed to be 8 figures, 8 figures to lose that Christian wholesome thing, if you understand what I'm saying. And the internet is going crazy. She reimagined how to make money doing technically what you might call porn but isn't really porn according to the website. She became number one. She's making more money than NBA players are making. She's making more money than football players.

She was getting less value than what is perceived to be the value of OnlyFans and then actually making more standing out.

Yeah.

How do you explain that?

Because I think it is the girl next door concept and I think there's no other that does that. And there's enough people online who don't want to see everything, but they want to see the idea and she found the niche, only the niche. And apparently mostly in the US, Christian-wise exploded. By the way, we have to say there was one guy who put about $4 million this year out of the 43. So that's, yeah. Yeah. I think the dude either, he's either a priest or he has a problem.

Well, the church, the church has money. No, but it, but it is interesting if, if you look at actually what she did, The reimagining of what is the value that you're supposed to create. And perhaps also instead of just going after the herds into the quote unquote red ocean, really to sort of understand what are the pain points or the needs that are really just there and not just the expected needs. So maybe even in the— I always say that when you talk to your clients, there's— to imagine the opportunities with them is actually also to attain the ability to talk to them empathetically, not to decide for them. And then when you sort of sell to a client, you have to understand that the client— you're not the client, of course, but he's the client. The client has like a ripple effect around them. What happens when they use this and how does it impact them?

How does it—

so there's an entire—

But listen, I've been traveling and every place I go, every place I go, I see young girls saying, if I want to keep traveling and I don't want to go back to work, I'll sell feet or do other things. Right. So like we've been able to say we're pushing the boundaries every single time. And I always say, what's going to be the next thing? You can pay $10 today and see every crazy thing you can imagine. What will be the next thing? Because if you say people will film, what, crazy violence, by the way, there's websites you can see that. What's interesting is she was able to go back, do less, earn more. She is reimagining the concept and she became number one. So if we look at something and everybody would assume the same thing, what if we allow ourselves to look at it differently? And I think what she's done, unbelievable, like hats off, like amazing.

By the way, I know I sound like a broken imagination record every time, but that's exactly saying, okay, I'm imagining the future. Change that is not defined by the existing limitations or the expectations or the status quo or the norm, but also to believe it and stick to it. I mean, I don't know how long it took her to become that, but there may have been, just like in every entrepreneur's life, well, for most of them at least, there's a very long period, longer than you would want, that you have to choose to go and quote unquote fail again, choose and fail again, choose and fail again. And then, And that's another conversation that I had this morning is how people say, yeah, I have imagination, I can imagine things, I'm creative.

I say, great.

When everything is nice and flowing and working, and that's really great. The question is, does it contribute to the confidence and resilience when things are not bad? When suddenly you're having this convergent thinking, when you're just stressed for money, so you go and do, even like in her case, what everybody else does just so you can make it happen, or you break it, break the— Your idea or whatever impact you want to bring just so you can align with everyone else. So, I said that's where it really is measured when you're in the uncomfort, when you're in the out of your comfort, out of your comfort zone, in the unknown, in the stressing environments. That's where you really measure yourself if you are resilient, if you're really reimagining, or you're sort of just sort of faking it, not even. Works back to the New Year's resolutions. Are you really authentic in what you're doing? Can you observe what is the reason that you're going to do that? Is that a means to an end? And so on. So, I think it ties into everything that we talk about. This resilience thing is to imagine that future that's not defined by existing limitations will tie into everything from ability to explain yourself to pricing to positioning yourself to going bravely into a blue ocean that you know that you have to Walk a lot until you get noticed and so on, and to go through the tough times with your head up. And and then you inspire others to you know catch their interest and walk with you. So really, I love that example. Thank you. I didn't know where it was going, but it went well.

I told you. I told you don't worry about it. I know what I'm doing. I've talked a lot about porn online. Don't worry about it.

Thanks.

As we're wrapping up, I think we're getting better at this.

Yeah, yeah, I like it.

Good, guys. I'm gonna do everything in my power to edit this, but I want you all to know there are 2 problems. We don't have a name for the episode, and the second thing, my computer keeps crashing when I edit these videos, right?

So by the way, we do have that reward out. Wanted name.

I'll add that to the website.

I'll add it to the description on YouTube. And I think it's time we move to also audio versions. So I'm gonna try and do that.

I love it.

Peeps, thank you very much for watching, listening. If you have any thoughts, ideas, please leave a comment or two. We'd appreciate it. And let's start sharing. And if you need any help with anything, please DM me on any of the platforms. And if the question is good, we'll answer them on the show. And if not, maybe we'll do some office hours together. So see you next time, guys.

Happy New Year.

Thank you. Happy New Year.

Happy New Year.