Ep 6: Jordan Reasoner on the Health Benefits of Nature

Welcome to the Rewild Gear Podcast. Modern life, society, and responsibilities have domesticated us, but now it's time to rediscover your adventurous side. Whether that's camping, hiking, hunting, fishing, or just spending time in the great outdoors, this is the podcast for you. Join us as we get back to the wilderness and rewild. Welcome to the Rewire With Gear podcast. I'm your host, Seth Spears, and I'm here today with a good friend of mine, Jordan Resner, who's a business owner, a hunter, and an outdoorsman living in Bozeman, Montana. He's a guy that I've known for years in the health space and has made a transition into a lot of business consulting and doing some really fun things in the outdoor space too, including starting a food company and some outdoor excursions. And so I'm really excited to chat with Jordan today because he is a gear nut just like me. Jordan, welcome to the podcast.

Hey, thanks for having me, Seth. I'm stoked to be here. I'm gonna have some fun today.

Yeah, I think so. Jordan, just to get started, why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself, you know, your background history? I know you've gone through a lot of health issues and things like that and kind of used the natural health side to help fix all of that. And I know nature's played a big part in that. So let's, let's hear your story.

Yeah, thanks for having me. Well, I grew up in the Midwest. I was born and raised a bow hunter. I'm actually a 4th-generation bow hunter hunting whitetails in Michigan and started my career as an engineer. Actually became a mechanical engineer coming out of college and worked for General Motors. And, my health fell apart, man. I was having diarrhea 10, 15 times a day, malnourished. The doctors didn't know what's wrong with me. And, they finally figured out it was celiac disease and that sent me down this path of alternative health and just trying to figure out how to repair my gut, put it back together, and ended up starting a whole new career path in alternative wellness and started a company called HealthyGut.com with my business partner Steve. And, we had that company for about 10 years and I exited it in 2019. And, Steve's still crushing it doing his thing with that. But fortunately, during all of that, I was able to work from home, become an entrepreneur, be a business owner and move to Montana, which was always a lifetime dream. So, I've been in Montana probably 8 years now and just love to be out in the wilderness hunting elk and deer and just spend as much time in the backcountry as I can. So, I've really structured my life and my businesses and the work that I do around being able to spend 100 days a year in the wilderness here in Montana and Wyoming. And man, it's just become my biggest passion. It fuels me in a way that nothing else can. And, I feel really blessed to be able to have a business and a lifestyle that allows me to do those things. And now, going into this year, I've started a new project that you've been really supportive and are going to join me with. And, that's just being able to start to bring men out into the wilderness with me.

Yeah.

bring men out into the deep backcountry and do the kind of crazy 5, 6, 7-day trips that I love to do on a regular basis. So, that's a new project that's just kind of a soul passion, heart passion project that I'm really enjoying. And, we're going to be doing our first one this May. So, pretty excited about that.

Nice. Yeah, I'm really stoked about this. And, we're kind of having our Rewild Gear team kickoff retreat, if you will, out there with you. And, super, super excited to hang out with you and Jake and spend a lot of time in the backcountry and And really just, you know, have some quality time and bonding and just, you know, recovering our souls in nature, if you will.

It's going to be so fun. Yeah.

Yeah, exactly. Jordan, why is nature, the outdoors, and just wild places in general, why is that important to you? What, what is it about that that just calls to you?

Man, it's interesting. I feel, I feel more safe and at home and more myself when I'm in the backcountry than I do in my home, in my town. It is the place that I go to reconnect to my heart, to my spirit, to what I'm up to in the world, and also to have some quiet. My mind is quiet, my spirit is quiet, and I just feel connected and at home out there. Even though in some people's eyes, it's a little bit less safe, there's grizzly bears and mountain lions and— All kinds of things that can kill you out there, but I do feel safer back there. And so, it calls to me on a regular basis. And, if I'm not going out there more regularly, I feel this frenetic anxiety, I feel less connected to who I am as a man, I feel less masculine, I feel less confident and clear in what I'm doing in my life. I'm not as good of a father. I'm not as good of a partner in my relationship if I'm not regularly connecting to the wilderness and just nourishing that part of me that is, I don't know, ancient. And, it's interesting to think about the question, why do you do that? I've been asked that in various ways over the years. Why do I hunt? Why do I go in the wilderness? And, I find it a difficult question to answer because it's almost in the same vein of why do you eat food? Why do you drink water? It's like, I don't know. My DNA tells— I just have this internal drive that I have to drink water or I might die. And, I literally feel that same way about going in the wilderness. It's just this primordial drive that I'm wired to do just eat and drink water. And, if I'm not doing it, I literally feel like part of me is dying and not— taken care of, if that makes sense.

Yeah, no, that does make a lot of sense. I'd like to dig in a little more about what you said about the quiet and about how it makes you feel more you. And, you know, you become one with nature, if you will, in that, because that's really counterintuitive for a lot of people. There's so many people, and at times myself included, where the quiet is scary and being alone or being by yourself, that's so different than our normal day-to-day because we've become such an urban, modernized society where there's There's always noise. You know, everyone has a phone in their pocket. Something is always dinging. So we don't have a lot of that quiet anymore. And so it can be very different or, you know, scary or even a little bit off-putting at times when people are first getting into that. And just whether that's meditation or just sitting with themselves and their thoughts. Can you talk a little bit more about that and how maybe you have adapted to experience that and why it's so beneficial to you? And why it's good for everyone? Or is it good for everyone?

I believe it is. And, you know, you've been in the health space too for a long time with your, you know, amazing work that you do and all the health companies that you're a part of with Katy and everything else. And you understand all the science and the research. But man, the science that's coming out about nature is really, really fascinating. There's some studies that have been done that show that Just 3 nights in the wilderness, 3 overnights in the wilderness will completely reset your circadian rhythms, which are your internal biological clocks that control a lot of stuff, really important stuff in your body such as hormones, cortisol, melatonin so you can sleep. I mean, all these things get reset. And, it's amazing what happens when they measure people's blood after 3 nights in the backcountry and all the shifts that happen. And, Asia has a ton of research coming out around what they call forest bathing.

Yeah.

If you want to go down a rabbit hole, research forest bathing, which is literally going out in nature. They call it forest bathing.

I think we actually wrote an article about that over on Wellness Mama a couple years ago.

Well, then definitely go read that if you're listening to this. So, all that to be said, there's a lot of science and research that backs up what I feel, what I experience in my body when I go out there. And, You can use the word quiet, stillness, but I feel a shift in my central nervous system primarily. My central nervous system downregulates. I think all the stimulus and all the stress and all the dinging in the phone and the accessibility to work, electronics, blue light, I mean, all these things have an impact on our health and our nervous system, our immune system. And, for me, when I go out there, It takes me about 2, 3 days, but I do feel that just downshift just in my nervous system. And, that feels amazing. And so, if no one has ever gone out into the wilderness for 3 days and had that experience, it's kind of like what we maybe talk about jokingly about like, I just want to go sit on a beach for a week.

Yeah.

What we're seeking, I think, when we say those types of things, I want to go sit on a beach for a week, that's what I actually experienced in the wilderness. Not so much on the beach, but in the wilderness. That's actually what my body experiences. And so, that plus the experience for me in my mental state, my mental and emotional being, both are impacted. So, just getting rid of all that stimuli and dropping into nature, which at the end of the day just forces me to be more present. We do practices like meditation or things of that nature to try to become more present. What does that mean? Well, not thinking about the future, not worrying about the past, right? Not ruminating, reliving the past. I've heard it said that depression is when you relive the past and anxiety is when you are worrying about the future. And, when you combine those things, you're kind of doing both and I'm guilty of it. Certainly struggles with anxiety and depression over here a lot. And so, at the end of the day, it's medicine for me. It's a medicine, it's a treatment for me. It's my main source of medicine. And, when I go out there, I drop into a level of presence where I don't experience anxiety and depression in the wilderness. It goes away completely for me. And then, I have that on top of my drop in the nervous system so I can finally regulate my nervous system in a healthy way. It's downregulated. Those 2 things to me are just so nourishing. And, it gives me space and capacity to just tap into what it is to be a human being and be in nature and reconnect to the generations of our ancestors who used to live life that way. This is one hell of an interesting experiment we're in right now.

Yeah.

With all of our electronics and all of our stimulus and all of this technology. We are really the first full generation who's going through this interesting experiment in humanity. And, I don't know how good it is for us. I would argue that maybe it's not. And so, for me, I experienced those health benefits when I got into nature. And man, it is some of the best medicine.

I agree with that. What would you say to someone who brings up the argument that I don't want to poop in the woods, or the lack of indoor plumbing. Even if you're in a rustic cabin with no amenities, no electricity or running water, or whether you're hiking 10 miles into the backcountry and sleeping under the stars or in a tent, there's a lot of people that they like their creature comforts and they don't want to get away from some of those modern conveniences.

Yeah. What would I say to them? I would say it's really, really worth it. And, it's really liberating to take a poop out in the middle of the woods actually once you do it. But, I love creature comforts too. For example, if I'm going out for 5, 6, 7 days, I do bring a really hefty pack of butt wipes.

Yeah.

I'm not going to leave home without my butt wipes. So, certainly, there are not toilets, but you can still have things like butt wipes, which can make the experience a little bit more enjoyable, a little bit more clean. But yeah, I mean, at the end of the day, we sacrifice things to go be out in the wilderness. But for me, I'm reminded of an expression, chop wood, carry water, right? Even in the wilderness, you have camp chores, you have tasks. It's not a retreat in that way. It's not going to be something that— You know, your lavish life out there is what you're going to be experiencing. But there's like a nourishing practice and just the simplicity of what you're responsible for. Yes, there's no creature comforts. I got to filter water. I got to get a good shelter set up. I got to make sure I have my food handled. I got to make sure I have cover from the sun or from rain. And I have to poop in the woods. But those Simple tasks actually bring me a lot of joy in a weird way. Call them chores, but they're simple. They're so simple. This is all I'm concerned with in my entire reality right now. Am I safe? Do I have these food, shelter, water pieces handled? And once they are, there's just a relaxation and kind of a joy. I like filtering water. I like chopping some firewood. I like building a fire. And I would say that in the first 24 hours, that slight uncomfortableness that you feel from the lack of creature comforts, like even the chill in the air, if you're out in Montana in the mountains, even in summertime, it gets chilly at night and there's that chill in the air, but you're in it and you become accustomed to it. And it doesn't take very long, maybe 24 hours where it's a little uncomfortable at first, like, I'm a little chilly, but that briskness goes away and the uncomfortableness of doing all these tasks goes away and it just becomes part of the fun of the experience for me and I think for most people.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And there's something very, very simplistic and almost like a spiritual practice around that. I believe it was Benedictine and Carthusian monks. They had this whole thing about working and praying and they would just do their tasks repeatedly, like the ones who were making wine or cheese or beer or things like that. And so, you know, they had their jobs and their tasks. that they were doing, then they also had their spiritual disciplines as well. And so it was a very simplistic lifestyle. And so I'm noticing kind of a similarity there as well, where, you know, you're focusing on those things that maybe you don't necessarily want to do, but you're just doing them. And just, you know, it's very simple and an interesting practice.

Yeah, I mean, you're not having to worry about getting the truck fixed or credit card bills or a lunch meeting with coworkers or picking up your kids on time, you know, it's so much more quiet and still than you might imagine because you have literally 3 things to worry about and that's all.

Yeah, that does make a lot of sense. I feel like in the outdoor space anymore, we're trying to incorporate so much more technology to make it easier on ourselves, whether that is GPS devices or satellite phones or higher-tech equipment to— and it's a good thing mostly, but I'm curious if you think that some of these technologies and changes that we're seeing, just whether you're hunting or backpacking or, you know, whatever the case may be, just getting away for a weekend, if it's all good or you see some issues there as well.

I think it's really awesome that we have these technologies. I use them certainly. I use, you know, I have a DeLorme Garmin bought them now, DeLorme GPS unit that I have an SOS button that if I push that button, they'll send the cavalry and come save me. I have that tool in my pack at all times. I still use services like OnX Maps to navigate in the backcountry, especially to make sure I'm on public land and not trespassing, things of that nature. I think those are nice tools. I think that It's on each of us to choose how we rely on that technology in the wilderness. The nice thing about Montana is we don't get cell phone reception anywhere in the mountains, anywhere in the wilderness. But, it's funny, I've gone in Colorado, I've gone way in the backcountry and done hunts and turned my phone on and I have full service. And, I have no idea how that's a reality in Colorado, but—

A lot.

I can be on some 11,000-foot You can have full service. And I'm like—

Elon Musk is pointing all of his new satellites directly at Colorado but not Montana apparently.

But what I found is that certainly when I first moved to Montana and I was trying to figure out fieldcraft and learn fieldcraft and navigation and land navigation in the mountains, and I was constantly checking my phone like, where the hell am I? Constantly trying to figure out where I'm going, what I'm doing. And what I would encourage everyone to do, and I just challenge myself to do this, is just to rely on the technology less and less every time I go out and give myself permission to play a little bit more, wander a little bit more. So I've done things now where I'm not going to check my phone until the end of the day and see if I can figure out where I am and what I'm doing and how I'm doing it. And what I found is that the less and less that I've relied on technology in the wilderness, the more enriching experiences, the more amazing experiences I've had, the more fun I have, the more I actually feel better. And so, I've started to put my phone in my pack unless I want to take a picture or something and just try to check into those services less and less. But I do still use them certainly, and I think it's wise to use them. But I think that Anybody who starts to do this on a regular basis quickly realizes how amazing it is to turn your phone off. I mean, it's one of the best privileges I've ever experienced is, hey, I'm going to be gone for 7 days. You're not going to hear from me. Turn the phone off. That's good. That's good medicine.

But if you're not posting about it on Instagram, did it really happen? Jordan, you mentioned earlier about being a 4th-generation bow hunter. Tell me a little bit more about that. How was your father and grandfather and, you know, great-grandfather, were they instrumental as far as building your love of nature or encouraging you to get into the outdoors and spend time, whether that's hunting or just camping or whatever, all those different activities that you enjoy?

They definitely passed the torch on to me for sure. And, it lit a fire in me that I think was already there. I don't think that it's something that I necessarily continue to do because of the lineage. I continue to do it because of how nourishing and awesome it is for me and my life, how much it lights me up. But certainly, my dad put a bow in my hand when I was 6 and we started shooting in the backyard. And some of my favorite memories with my father were when we were hunting in the woods in Michigan, harvesting my first couple of deer with bow and arrow. I mean, I'll never forget those moments and being able to feed my family as a 14-year-old kid was really, really impactful for me. And I'll never forget those memories we shared and the bonds we shared and what he passed down to me and what his father passed down to him and what his father passed down to him. And there may be more generations, I just don't know for sure. But, you know, he lit that fire in me and we were able to bond in that way. And my dad wasn't the most perfect guy. He had his own traumas and he had his own issues and he was kind of an emotionally detached man. And so, for us, we were able to really have a special father-son bond and connection and love in wilderness that probably we wouldn't have had otherwise in life. And so, I really cherish that about it. But the heritage thing is so important because it just got it into me at a younger age, and I feel really grateful for that. But I love part of what you're doing with Rewild, and part of what I think needs to happen for a lot of society right now is those of us that did not receive that torch passed to us when we were young, we can choose it in our 30s, 40s, 50s, even 60s. We can just choose it now and create that lineage in our families now. And so, that's what I think is really the most important work because there's just less and less of us that are getting the torch passed and so much of us need it, right?

How are you passing that on to your own children?

Gently. Gently.

You're not just throwing them in the wilderness and say, hey, Hey, here's a knife, here's some water, go have fun.

Yeah, they don't really like to do the 15-mile days and stuff that I like to do, really high elevation stuff. It's one of those things. I think there's a balance. My kids aren't super into it yet, and so I'm trying to navigate that carefully. I don't want to force it down their throats or overdo it to the extent where they're just annoyed and hate it. But we do share some epic adventures. And I really just calibrate it as they get older, we can do longer trips, bigger trips. Last summer, we had a really fun camping trip at a high-elevation lake and caught a bunch of beautiful fish on fly rods and ate them over a fire. And I know those memories are going to last a lifetime for them. And so, for me, I'm just kind of checking in like, hey, what do you think about going to do this? And just kind of Doing little bits and pieces of it and seeing how they engage with it, see if they like it, see if they don't. And I don't think it's going to be something where I'll ever let it go completely. I'm always going to be— because I'm doing it already, so we might as well go and do it together. But the experiences we have had have been so amazing. I mean, some of the best memories I've had as a father are out there just kind of lighting that fire in them. You know, I take their feedback and calibrate things a little bit because they have small legs and, you know. Sure.

A quick story on, on that as far as getting kids into the outdoors, just a personal story. So my oldest son, Tony, we were on vacation in Florida and he doesn't like fish, right? Doesn't like any seafood. So we brought a fishing pole and we went down. We were at the beach and we were fishing and he caught a fish. This is his first one. He was probably 7, maybe 6 or 7. And so we caught it, it was just a little like whitefish or something. So we took it back to the condo where we were staying, filleted it, grilled it. He helped do all of that and he ate it. He's like, this is so good. This is the best fish ever. I like fish now. And it was that connecting with nature and the food supply and where it came from and not just going to the store and buying it that I guess did it for him where he realized, hey, I actually do like this.

It's—

I caught it, I harvested it, you know, and I cooked it. And so, that was a big changing point, I think, for him.

I love that story. That's awesome. Yeah, we had a similar experience too, like when my son shot his first whitetail deer out here in Montana when he was 10. We were able to go through the whole process of harvesting the animal, butchering the animal, processing the animal. And then, when we got the meat all frozen, I was able to have him make his first night of tacos, deer tacos. And, I just remember having this picture of him kind of sautéing the meat. He'd get this big smile on his face because he was about to make tacos for our entire family that he had brought home himself. And I think that's part of it too, like with the trips to the high mountain lakes. My daughter Ripley wasn't as interested in it as my son and I were. So, we passed down one of my Canon cameras to her. She loves photography. And so—

Oh, cool.

We were fishing while she was taking amazing photos, landscape photos, photos of us fishing. And we ended up starting a business for her. She started her own photography business and we built this website for her on SmugMug, which is a platform for photographers.

Nice.

And so, she was able to transform her passion for photography into a real business through nature. And so, now she has all these amazing prints out that people have been buying of just Montana wilderness. And so, I think that that's a really cool opportunity that you shared with your son just to be able to engage them in something and find a way to connect Whatever they're interested into the actual trip itself and then have some pride around it, you know, makes it fun.

I think that story about him catching the fish, that was really instrumental as far as his interest in food. And so last year, he and some of his friends actually wrote and published a cookbook, got a publishing deal for it, and called Kids Cook— or Chef Junior is the name of it. And it's done incredibly well. But Tony's just become super interested in food. And so every Friday night, him and some of His friends in the neighborhood, they'll get together and make homemade pizza, sourdough pizza from scratch. And so, it's become this thing where he's just become really interested in food. And kind of like the story that you told about your son getting his first deer, my son got his first last fall. He's 14, so he's a little bit older, but I've been taking him out hunting since he was 5. Both of my boys, when they hit 5, is kind of the age when it's like they're old enough where they can kind of sit in the stand or the blind and they kind of begin to appreciate it. The funny thing is, this is the first time that Tony had actually seen a deer in the stand because he likes to talk. And so I think maybe just a little bit too noisy at times. But he finally was old enough where he was patient and quiet and saw a nice little buck. And I was incredibly impressed and very proud of him for— he shot it right, right through the heart. It took like 3 steps and keeled over and harvested it and made some really delicious meals with it too.

I love that story. You and Katie are amazing parents, and it's so fun to see not only the spark of nature that you're putting into your family lineage, but also the spark of entrepreneurship. And it's so cool that Tony and his buddies are— I mean, you just don't hear stories like that. I mean, that's What is it, 1% of the population where the children have this entrepreneurial drive, they're having their friends over making food. I mean, that's so cool.

Yeah, they've, they've really enjoyed it. It's been a fun process watching them, watching them grow. Jordan, let's, let's talk a little bit about food, especially nutrition in the outdoors. And I know because you have started a backpacking food company. And so I want to talk— I think that's on hiatus right now, but I want to hear a little bit about that. But also with your background in health and nutrition and how that has influenced you when it comes to the outdoors. I mean, especially when you're talking about extended backcountry trips, how do you bring food? How do you pack it? How many calories and just the nutritional macros and things like that? Can you talk a little bit about that?

Yeah, happy to. It's fun because you and I both follow a paleo-type diet lifestyle and, you know, that nourishes us and keeps us really healthy in our day-to-day life. And, you know, it was interesting to me when I moved from the Midwest to out west and started to do, you know, different kinds of wilderness trips, you know, not really car camping right next to my car anymore.

Yeah.

And, I learned about this stuff called freeze-dried food, which I had no idea what that even was. We didn't really need that stuff when you're, you know, car camping by the river and you have your stove and you can make bacon and eggs and all that. So, I quickly discovered that there's this really interesting stuff called freeze-dried food where they suck all the moisture out of it and then it can last 30 years and all you got to do is reheat it with water and you have a meal right in this pouch. But, what I found is that I was having a challenging time being able to eat a paleo-type diet with freeze-dried food. There wasn't a lot of companies out there that were making that type of stuff and you found a lot of pasta and chilies and things like that that I didn't really have a lot of resources available in terms of eating healthy in the backcountry. And so, that sent me down a path of kind of making my own paleo meals and just buying freeze-dried chicken and buying freeze-dried pineapple and making pineapple chicken and things like that for myself. And, I think it sent me down an interesting path because there's some interesting needs that your body has in the wilderness, in the backcountry. For me, I needed a lot more fat, I needed a lot more calories because I was burning so many calories running around the mountains that I just couldn't get enough. I couldn't get enough calories and I couldn't get enough fat and protein out there in a way that supported me for a Paleo-type diet. So, I think there's a lot more options now. I mean, I think 14 new companies have popped up in the last 3 years.

Wow.

I think last time I looked. So, it's great. I mean, the opportunities and the selections that are available are exploding, which is fun for a lot of us who are doing this type of stuff. So, I'm excited about the industry and how it's exploding. Even bars and things like that. I mean, I remember when Epic Bar was at the Ancestral Health Symposium in I think 2014 or something. And that was the first time we had seen them and of course now what's available with them. It's so cool, the paleo solutions that are available to us now. Bars, sandwiches, all kinds of stuff that we never would have had available before. So, yeah. That's an interesting conversation and we can talk more about the nuances of it, but that's broad strokes I think for me was trying to find Paleo solutions that would allow me to use freeze-dried foods and bars and things like that to be able to go out for 5 to 7 days when I don't have a stove and things like that.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Do you want to talk a little bit about Humble Foods and about the company that you started?

Yeah, my business partner Steve and I, we started Humble Foods. Just to try to bring really high-calorie, organic, healthy freeze-dried meals to people. And what's cool about it to me is that once you discover this technology, it's so fun because not only can you eat this stuff in the wilderness, like camping trips and stuff like that, but if you're a busy mom on a Tuesday night and you really don't have time to make organic farm-to-table level meals, all you have to do is heat some water up. Pour it in and wait 10 minutes and you can feed your family with a really organic, healthy paleo-type meal. So, it's a really cool opportunity to me to bring that technology to people who aren't even aware of the technology. There's a lot of people, for example, moms in California who aren't even aware that this stuff exists. And so, I'm excited to be able to bring that technology to more people because it is a really cool way to eat food where it's preserved so that the nutrients and the micronutrients and things like that are not destroyed in the heating process. You don't have to microwave anything. And, you know, it allows us to especially be able to do things like during this pandemic where we could be able to eat really healthy meals without having to go out and try to get fast food or anything like that. So, I think it's a really cool technology that could transform a lot of families who are really busy and want to eat healthy and don't have time and they also don't want to eat fast food, right? So, with Humble Foods, we were trying to make sure that we made really high-calorie, diverse macronutrients meals that had organic cabbage in it and organic broccoli and grass-fed beef and organic chicken. And so, it's really cool. We have to go out and source 10,000 pounds of organic chicken, bring it into a facility where we can cook it, and then we put it into this crazy German freeze dryer. And they use this freeze-drying technology that takes 99.99% of the moisture out of the chicken.

Wow!

Then, you're left with this little tiny hard piece of chicken. And then, we put it into this facility that mixes it all together with the right ingredients. And now, you've got this pineapple chicken meal or beef chili stew kind of meal. And then, all you need to do is put hot water back in. I just think it's so cool.

Yeah.

From a dorky engineer, I think this is the This is the coolest thing I've ever heard of. So, that's what we started to do with Humble Foods and trying to make sure that we could support hunters and people who want to go out in the wilderness and camp and they can have a great healthy meal so they feel really good out there. But then, also really reach a wider audience and help busy families just make sure they're feeding their kids. And, that was a cool litmus test. My kids are pretty picky. So, if they wouldn't eat it, then it probably isn't going to pass the test. So, we started out with 6 meals, 3 chicken and 3 beef. And, uh, and that's what we're, uh, we're beginning with our, our company for now.

Super. Well, that's, that's great. I'm really excited to get to try some of the new ones once, once you've got them out.

Me too.

Hey, Jordan, what's, what's been one of your favorite outdoor adventures that you've ever been on? You know, as someone who spends 100 years per night, uh, under the stars, um, I'm sure there's a lot of stories and experiences, probably some fun, probably some not so fun, but what's been the most memorable or the one that you tell the story the most?

Ooh, that's a tough question.

That's why I asked it.

Oh man, there's so many. There's scary ones. There's, you know, ones that were really blissful and changed my life. I think that the most transformative ones for me have been when I've been alone. I do a lot of my trips alone only because there's just not a lot of people that can go get away as much as I'm able to and blessed to be able to do. So, a lot of them have been solo, but man, there's so many. There's my first bull that I killed with my bow and arrow out here in the wilderness.

Mm-hmm.

There's the first time I thought I was going to die in the wilderness. There's the time I ran into a grizzly bear with her cubs. I mean, there's so many interesting stories. There's wicked snowstorms that I've been caught in.

Wow.

I think that probably the most interesting transformative one for me was When I really thought for the first time that I might actually— might die. And I think that was probably impactful for me in many ways because I finally had pushed myself to an edge that things got really dangerous and I was by myself. So I didn't have anyone to—

Hmm.

Be able to support me and lift me up. Like, it was just me. And, I had to handle it on my own. I had to make decisions on my own despite lots of fear. And, navigating that was really interesting because I had studied survival, I had been to survival schools, I had been to backcountry medicine training. I had a lot of the knowledge and information that I needed to be prepared for that moment. But then, in the moment, the fear was incredibly intense. And so, the context of the story is It was, I think, 2016 or 2017. And Montana has these extended elk seasons that are just for cow elk. And so, the normal rifle season had completed and I had an additional tag to be able to go out and harvest a cow elk, which would've been another 200 pounds of meat for my family and my friends. And so, I wanted to be able to go harvest cow elk that year. But we were now in late December. So, Winter is here in Montana. It's cold and there's a lot of snow. And so, what's interesting about this story is that I was hiking into a place that was about 5 miles into the backcountry, but I didn't plan to stay overnight. My plan was to just hunt during the day. It's almost Christmas, so it's getting dark by 5:30, 6 o'clock, and I would hike back out and back to my truck for the night. And so, I didn't have a tent, I didn't have a sleeping bag, I didn't have any overnight stuff with me that day. I just had a— we call it a day pack out here, just had stuff for the day. And there's a weather phenomenon in Montana called Arctic Blast, which I did not know about until after this day. And to spare the science and stuff, an Arctic Blast is just— there's a certain way that the jet stream and the winds and stuff happens where a weather system comes in and it'll sort of suck air from really high up in the atmosphere that's very, very cold air and it'll bring it down really fast. And so, when that happens, the temperature will swing dramatically, 30, 40 degrees temperature will just plummet really quickly and it'll just be really, really cold for a day or two during this weather system. And, the forecast I think had a low around in the 20s. And so anyway, it's cold, it's winter. I'm I'm hiking and I hike in 5 miles, I find a cow elk by herself. And, that's weird. Usually, cow elk are in big herds. And so, I got in closer to her and found out that she had what ended up being a birth defect where she only had 3 legs.

Oh.

And, I could tell she was really struggling to get through the snow. And, I just felt like I was really meant to be there in that moment to harvest this elk. And, She was by herself. She shouldn't have been by herself. And she was hobbling around trying to eat. And anyway, I was able to get in a position and harvest this elk. And I think I had— she died around maybe 4:00 PM. I still had an hour or so of light left, something like that. So I hiked over to her. I'm about 5 miles from my truck at this point, which isn't too bad. I can usually pack out a cow elk in 2 trips. You know, half of her one trip, come back and get the other half. Certainly would've been a long night, you know?

Yeah.

But it's also cold, so I can hang the meat up and it'll be fine overnight. But everything's fine. Everything's pretty straightforward. It's a day trip, whatever. Good news, harvest the elk, take some pictures. I'm so stoked, so overjoyed that I got this cow. And then I start butchering her up. And to butcher up a cow by yourself, it's going to take 3 hours or so, maybe 4, to get her all butchered up and get the meat all separated from the the carcass. And so I'm doing this and I'm getting a little sweaty. I'm working on this cow. And all of a sudden, I kind of feel something on the back of my neck, like there's like a tingling in the back of my neck. And I looked over and I remember looking at my headlamp and I took a breath and my breath came out and it wasn't just the normal misty breath. It was almost like crystallized.

Hmm.

And then I took another breath in and the air kind of felt colder in my lungs. And I looked down and I'm not kidding, my sweatshirt that I was wearing was moist. It was just moist from sweat and kind of working on this elk. I watched, I swear to you, I watched my sweatshirt freeze.

Whoa.

Like up and kind of almost like some apocalyptic movie where you can see the winter coming and freezing everything.

Game of Thrones-esque.

Yeah, I'm not kidding. It was so bizarre and I had no idea what was going on. And, I looked over and my water bottle that was sitting to my left, it was a Nalgene, a 1-liter Nalgene, had frozen solid.

Whoa.

And, in 20-degree weather, a Nalgene sitting in the snow shouldn't freeze in an hour. And, I thought, what is going on? My mind couldn't really process what was happening. It's so bizarre. And, All of a sudden, I started to shiver and I could just feel my sweatshirt was now stiff as a board as I was moving around because it was frozen solid. The front of it was frozen. And I didn't have that much in terms of layers and stuff because it was just a day trip. And anyway, it quickly dawned on me that it got really, really cold. And I felt my beard and my beard had frozen solid. All my whole beard had ice crystals coming off of it. And, I knew something just wasn't right. I've never experienced anything like this, but the temperature had probably dropped, I don't know, 30 or 40 degrees in a matter of, I don't know, maybe 20 or 30 minutes. I don't know how long it took. I was just kind of butchering this elk. And so, I started to get really freaked out like something's wrong here, something's going on. And, I started to really work fast and try to butcher this elk up without trying to cut myself. And, by the time I finished butchering the elk and got all the meat moved away from the carcass, I was shivering violently, which When you're shivering violently, that's like the first stage of, yeah, it's pretty dangerous. You're getting pretty cold.

Hypothermia is inevitable.

Yeah. And certainly, the next phase is when you stop shivering, that's bad. And so, I was very aware of this and tracking it. And, the whole time I'm just thinking about, I'm going to be fine. I just need to get this done and get out of here. And, at the point that I started to shiver violently to the point where I couldn't hold my knife still, I knew that I might actually be making a stupid decision by trying to finish the elk first. And, because I didn't have any shelter with me or any sleeping bag or anything else to warm up, I knew that I didn't have a lot of options other than to get out and back to my truck, which in the mountains when you're cold, if you start moving, you typically warm up. And, that's nice. That's a nice go-to, just got to move. And I hadn't been moving and I'd been sweating. So it was dangerous because I was wet, my layers were wet, and they got cold really fast. So I was wet and cold. Now, the other drawback is I always have fire-starting stuff in my pack, but I was in an area of high desert where there wasn't really much to burn other than a few little scarce sagebrush roots. I would've been able to make a little fire with some sagebrush roots, But, it wasn't a place where I had trees. I didn't have a lot of wilderness and it's not a place I'm used to hunting. Normally, there'd be pine trees everywhere and I could make a big fire and get warm. I didn't have a lot of stuff to burn, which was also like, oh, God, I don't have a lot of stuff to burn. So, I knew that I didn't have a lot of time because of how violently I was shivering and I knew I needed to move right now. So, I grabbed— the other thing is I could have touched my SOS button, for example, if things got really bad. The SOS button. But, I knew that I was probably 2 to 3 hours away from any help getting to me. And so, how am I going to stay warm? I don't really have a lot of stuff to make a fire. I could have burned some stuff in my pack, but I didn't really feel like hitting the SOS button on my thing would have even done anything. I probably would have slipped into some deeper levels of hypothermia, maybe frostbite in my toes and hands. My boots were soaked, all very dangerous recipes, right? So I got really, really scared, probably the most afraid I've ever been in my life that I was going to die because I felt like I was in a bad situation. I was wet, which is always a bad recipe. Unexpected cold, didn't have quite enough layers, didn't have shelter, had nothing to burn, just a bad situation to be in. I thought about burning my pack. I thought about lighting my pack on fire. I just didn't know what else to do. By then, the cow elk was cold. I thought maybe I could warm up a little bit by the carcass, but she was cold at that point. I panicked. I panicked for a while. I panicked when I thought that I didn't have enough time for people to come rescue me if I even hit my button. I knew I didn't have a lot of time, and so the only thing that I could think to do was to run. I needed to get as hot as I possibly could get. And so, I threw a quarter of the cow in my pack, which was about 75 pounds. And, I threw my pack on and I started running as fast as I could. And, I basically ran 5 miles out of the mountains. It was about 2 in the morning. In the dark.

In the dark.

2 in the morning. Yeah. 2:00 in the morning, I basically ran 5 miles with 75 pounds on my back. And a couple of times I stopped to catch my breath. It's hard to run with 75 pounds on my back. And when I started running, I warmed up really rapidly. My core warmed up, which is what I wanted. But again, sweating, still wet. The couple of times that I stopped, my hands would hurt so bad that I thought I was getting frostbite in my fingertips.

Oh, wow.

They were just aching with my heartbeat and my feet as well, my toes. I lost feeling in my feet. And I knew that there was nothing I could do. Like, the only thing that I could do was to get out of there and I had to do it by myself. No one was going to save me. I just needed to move. And it's a little scary when the only solution is to run as fast as you can.

Yeah.

And again, it was just a unique scenario. I was in a unique place. Nothing to burn, whatever. But I was really afraid. I was really afraid that I was going to die that night. And anyway, I made it to my truck. And I made it to my truck by, I think, 3:30 in the morning. And I couldn't bend my fingers to even get the key in the door for my truck. I had to put them in my pants so that I could just bend them enough to turn the key. Oh my God. And get in my truck. And I just got in my truck and my truck almost didn't start. It was so cold. It was like, you know, and I was like, please God, please start, you know. And finally, it finally started up. And then, you know, my truck dash came on and it had the temperature gauge and the temperature gauge said that it was 20 below.

Oh my goodness.

And, it was forecasted to be 20, I think, that night. It's just some kind of weird weather phenomenon that happens sometimes. It wasn't some record thing or whatever. It wasn't a strange storm. It was just a— they call it an Arctic blast. And anyway, I took a picture. I have a picture that I took when my fingers started to thaw and I could move them. I took a picture of my beard and my beard just all ice crystals and my face is beat red from the cold. So, I had almost like a burn on my face from how cold the air was. And anyway, I made it home. I made it home about 4:30 in the morning and I ended up violently shivering for probably the next 24 hours. I had to take a lot of hot baths. I didn't regain feeling in my hands and my toes for about a week. They were still completely numb to the touch. They ached for about a week.

Wow.

And yeah, I was violently shivering for the next 24 hours. And I think in reflection, I was proud of myself for the decisions I made, but there was a lot of moments in that experience where I had to face the reality that no one was going to save me. I was scared that I was going to die and I would have probably died if I didn't make the right decision. If I would've fallen and twisted my ankle, anything of that nature, I probably would've died. And it was such a silly scenario. It was like a quick day hunt, 5 miles in, whatever, like not a big deal. But that not a big deal scenario ended up creating some weird conditions that put my life at risk. And I've been in way more dangerous places with way riskier, more situations. But this was the first one that I really felt like I was going to die in a real way. And that's an interesting thing to experience as a man. And I just felt— at the end of the day, I was just laughing about it because it was so silly. It was like, I went on a quick day hunt at a pretty not dangerous place. It's just funny how random those events can happen. But I still look back at that day and remember how afraid I was and how much it made me freeze and almost not be able to make decisions. It was a pretty impactful experience and had a lot of tears on the other end of it for sure.

That's an amazing story. That's crazy. I'd like to ask, how did that experience— how has that changed what you do as far as preparation and the gear that you carry when you're outside, whether you're going on a hunt or you're just hiking? And so, what gear do you always carry now that is just like your absolute essentials? You're never going to go out into the woods without it. Yeah.

The 2 things that I changed based on that experience, one was I always carry a pair of base layers in my pack that are just always there that are dry. One of the most dangerous parts of that experience was how much I was sweating butchering that elk up. And that is part of the recipe that made it very dangerous for me. I had another incident like that where I fell into a river.

Oh.

Packing out a mule deer and I was walking across the iced-over river and I fell through. And just anytime you're wet and it's cold, that's the recipe for disaster. So I keep a pair of dry base layers in a little dry bag in my pack now. So that's just like a shirt and underwear. And merino wool long underwear, pants, and top. And, if I would have been able to in that moment take off my wet layers that were merino, merino doesn't dry that well. That's one of the drawbacks of merino. So, it was just a bad recipe. So, I keep those in my pack in a dry bag because if I would have been able to switch my base layers, I would have had a lot better time keeping my core temperature up on my own. The other thing that I always keep in my pack now is my stove, my MSR Reactor stove. Because if I could have boiled water in my Nalgene and put that into my shirt or into my pants, I would have had a lot better time keeping my core temperature up too. And then the other thing that I keep in my pack now is a full-body space blanket that I could have crawled into if I needed to. And I could have crawled into that with Nalgene full of boiled water. And those are just simple things that I already knew about that I just didn't have in my pack that day. And so now I just have a hard and fast rule that, you know, I used to have that rule about my fire kit, but it's different when you're in a place you don't have anything to burn.

Yeah.

And so those were alternatives that are now must-haves in my pack for sure.

What other items do you always have in your pack?

My Garmin GPS for sure. A fire kit. I have fireproof matches. What I use for a fire starter is this military surplus stuff called trioxane.

It's amazing.

I think they actually use it to heat their MREs and stuff. It's just a brick of this chemical. But man, when you light that stuff, it burns at like, I don't even know, 1,000 degrees. And I've started a fire in the pouring rain with that stuff. And you can buy it on eBay or Amazon, just military surplus. It's super cheap. So I always keep a bunch of bricks of triaxane, fireproof matches, lighters, always a knife, always a knife. And then for me, it's always about having the right layers too. I always have the right layers in my pack. So I'm always gonna have a puffy layer. I'm always gonna have a mid layer. I'm always gonna have a base layer that's dry. And those are essentials no matter what. Water filtration is always in my pack. I use a Katadyn Hiker Pro, is always in my pack to filter water. And now, I always keep a stove in my pack so I can always heat up water if I need to. And they're just always in my pack no matter what. Even if I'm just going out for the day with the kids, I'm always going to have that stuff in my pack. And with all of those tools, I think I could pretty well survive overnight in pretty much any situation.

Got it. That's great. No, that makes a lot of sense. Jordan, talk to me a little bit about your wilderness event coming up because that's something we're really stoked about. And so, I'm sure there's going to be other people listening to the podcast that may be interested in it too. So, give us the rundown on that.

Yeah. I started a project called wildernessevent.com and you were a big catalyst for that, Seth. So, thank you for prompting me to do it. But yeah, the idea is just to get men back into the wilderness and similar to what you're doing with Rewild with gear and everything, There's a lot of synergies with your mission and what you're up to with Rewild. We're just trying to get men into the wilderness for 5 days and go deep into the backcountry far away from cell service. And, it's not only just a guided backpacking trip, but it's also you're going to learn skills to be able to do this stuff on your own. So, my hope is to be able to start to bring high performers, entrepreneurs, business leaders, Get them away from the desk, get them away from the computer, get them out into the wilderness not only as a physically challenging experience that will push you physically but also to provide you with the health benefits that we talked about before, reset your central nervous system almost like a meditation retreat would and just tap you back into that ancient part of your DNA that's just not being met in your day-to-day life. Because so much of the modern-day domesticated man is one of depression, anxiety, stress. And, I believe that a big symptom from that is just that we're not getting into the wilderness regularly. We're not tapping into that resource we have available to us. So, I started this guided backpacking trip as a way to teach men how to be able to do this stuff on their own. So, you're going to learn wilderness skills, you're going to learn navigation, survival skills, basic medical skills, Bear safety, shelters, food, water, all of those types of things. But you're also going to be able to learn how to plan and create these trips on your own for you and your family, you and your friends. And so, we can pass that torch on to a lot more people to be able to do this stuff in their lives on a regular basis. And I'm super excited about it.

Yeah, it's going to be great. I'm really, really stoked on this. And all my brothers who are part of this REWILD Gear project, we're all going to be out there for it. And it's going to be kind of our kickoff retreat for the company because we're hoping that our gear is going to be launching right around that same time. Still waiting on the manufacturing piece there to get the final timeframe on that, but it's looking like it's going to be pretty close to that. So really excited there.

Me too. We've known each other for a lot of years in our entrepreneurial business circles, and I'm really stoked to take our relationship to the next level and our brotherhood to another level with you and your family. Have a good time out there, man. Yeah.

Let's get into a couple quick questions here before we wrap up because we're running close to time here. Jordan, both of us are really big into the conservation and to protecting our wild spaces. Where do you see the biggest need is when it comes to, to the conservation side of the outdoors?

I think there's 2 biggest needs. One is that we keep public land acreage from becoming smaller. There's a great organization called the Backcountry Hunters and Anglers Association, and there's a lot of information about how there's a pretty common practice of federal lands, whatever they be, national forest or BLM or whatever the designation is. A lot of times, they maybe necessarily can't have the budget to be able to manage them, so they'll pass on some of those lands. They'll give them to certain states And then, when those states get the land, they don't have the budget to be able to handle the land. So, a lot of times, they'll end up selling them to private ranches, to wealthy people. And so, our public lands are just dwindling every year. And that process flow ends up happening because the feds give the land to the states and then the states see it as a profit source. If they sell it, they make $15 million, $30 million versus it being a budget item. So, the management of the lands and just keeping the lands from being sold to private is number one. And then, I think if not more important is that more people use it. The vast majority of public land is kind of in the Rocky Mountain West, right? And the vast majority of the population in the United States is not there. And so, for somebody in maybe Nebraska or Florida who doesn't really use public lands much because there's not a lot of public lands, we need to make sure that those folks are coming out and enjoying the public lands, whether that's coming out to Yellowstone or Glacier or Yosemite. Or just national forests and mountains and BLM land like what we're doing. Um, come out and enjoy that land and take advantage of it because it's so rare that we have it. And if they're not using it and valuing it and seeing the experience of it, then it's, it's just not going to be something that they feel connected to supporting.

Got it. That's, that's great advice. Is there anything else you would add to that as far as what people can do to really help support conservation efforts other than just visiting our national parks and some of those public BLM lands and such?

Yeah. I mean, first and foremost, you got to come use it, come enjoy it. And then secondarily, I would say find public land that's close to you and use it, whether that's some woods or some river that you can go camp on with your family. Just go for walks, go for hikes in public lands, public parks, and just enjoy the spaces that we have and get away, get your little slice of nature when you can, even if you're in New York and you're using Central Park. You know, go get a slice of nature in any way that you can locally and do it regularly. And if somebody is trying to take that opportunity away from you, whether it's a bill that gets proposed or, you know, legislation that comes to the table, don't let it happen. Say no. Speak up.

Great advice. Jordan, what, what are some of your favorite outdoor companies, outdoor equipment or gear? Who do you think is doing just a great job, whether that's putting out just amazing new equipment, That's some of the stances that they take when it comes to conservation. Who are some of your favorite outdoor gear companies and brands?

Well, selfishly, I got to say Rewild's up there because a lot of the stuff that you're building is stuff that I just wish I would have had.

We haven't launched yet, so let's, let's take us out of the equation until we actually get to market.

I know, but I have all these text messages of you with all the, all the blueprints and the plans, and I'm just excited. I'm excited. I got some insider info about what you're up I love to. That's number one for sure. I mean, definitely Kifaru. I got to shout out Kifaru. Aaron Snyder is just an amazing, amazing dude, the president of Kifaru. I've learned so much from him about hunting and fieldcraft and being in the mountains and the backcountry and gear, and they make some of the best packs on the planet. I only run Kifaru packs. I also use their sleep systems. They're amazing. And Aaron is such a generous guy with his teachings and information that's out there. They're definitely up there for sure. So I have to definitely shout out them for sure. And then, you know, I think next up would probably be— I have to say Hilleberg for shelters. I've just been in some weird situations. I was in Wyoming one time when there was 80-mile-an-hour wind gusts and it It bent and basically broke my shelter that I was in because I did not have a Hilleberg shelter. So now, I only run Hilleberg shelters because if I'm ever in weird winter storms or bad weather situations, they're built for that kind of stuff. And so, Hilleberg shelters are the best and I really feel safe when I have those out in the backcountry. Those would be my top 2 for sure.

Cool. Yeah, that's great. Jordan, what book or books have had the biggest impact on your life?

Number one is The Alchemist by Paulo Coelho. It's actually a fiction story, but I've probably read it over 50 times. I don't even know at this point. I used to buy boxes of it and give it to people in my life and just ask them to read it. It is an amazing story about finding your personal story, your personal journey, following your heart, and just following omens and how you can find what you're here to do in this world. And there's a crazy twist at the end that blows my mind. And I would encourage anyone to read The Alchemist. It's like a spiritual book. It's a work-related book. It's a find-your-passion book. It's an inspirational book. And it's all of those things. And it's a short read. I think you probably get through the audiobook in 4.5 hours or so. It's amazing.

Great. Do you have a favorite podcast?

Yeah, I like Kifaru Cast. Aaron Snyder runs Kifaru Cast in terms of gear and stuff like that. That's always a fun one for me in terms of the wilderness. And then from that, there's a lot of different podcasts, whether you want to go in the hunting space or just the wilderness space. But I think that the most educational one for me has definitely been Kifaru Cast. That'd be my number one pick.

And before we wrap up, what is one piece of advice that you would give to everyone regarding nature and the outdoors?

Turn your phone off and get outside. Just look at it like a supplement or a pill or medicine that you're taking because it has that much power over your health and well-being. Anything you can do to get outside, just go do it. Get away. Turn your phone off. Make it part of your practices in your life.

Super. I love it. Jordan Reesner, thanks so much for being here. Really appreciate the time. Where can everyone find you online?

wildernessevent.com for more info on the Montana backcountry trip. And then you can find me on Instagram. It's just @jordanreesner. And I've got some cool outdoor content on Instagram, so you can message me there.

Thanks so much for your time. This has been great. Can't wait to do it again and really looking forward to hanging out in the wilderness of Montana in May.

Awesome. Thanks, Seth. Appreciate you, man. Thanks for listening to the Rewild Gear Podcast. You could check out the show notes for today's episode at rewildgearpodcast.com. If you're ready to spend more time in the wild, our line of high-quality, minimalistic outdoor gear can help you do just that. Check us out at rewildgear.com.