EP194: Live Enneagram Typing Session: The Heart of Life—Making Big Moves in the World with Kristen Crowley (Enneagram 2)

Welcome to the Leadership Formula podcast, where you will learn the secret sauce behind achieving massive success. I'm your host, Tracy o', Malley, multimillion dollar entrepreneur, your Enneagram expert, master performance coach, and mom to millennials. Do you want deep, meaningful relationships, to wake up every day with purpose and make money doing something you love? Well, you've landed in the right place. Every week, I will teach you how to get exactly what you want in life by strengthening your emotional intelligence. Using a combination of the Enneagram framework, live life coaching sessions, and real talk from yours truly. It's time to transform yourself into the ultimate leader of your life. Let's do this thing.

Okay, everybody, I am bringing you another episode of one of your favorite things that you are loving to hear because you do love the Enneagram and I do too. The biggest catch in the Enneagram is the typing process and being typed properly and having the right information is key to use this powerful, beautiful, incredible framework as a growth tool personally and professionally in your life. And I am excited to bring you a beautiful dynamo, Kristen Crowley today. She is incredible, you guys. And when you hear what she does and all the things we'll get to, I am very curious because originally I think she thinks she's one type. And then I have an assessment that I do that is showing something a little bit different and just getting to know her. This is the beautiful part about the Enneagram is a lot of times how especially you women, and especially you achieving women and entrepreneurial women. I think for so many of us, what we present to the world absolutely is true to us, but we can be compartmentalized and multifaceted. And that's the gift of being a woman, I gotta say. But when we're trying to grow ourselves, it can get a little confusing sometimes, right? I like to say, you know, most of us have learned how to wear a million different hats. And although that is a great skill set, it gets pretty much exhausting after a while. And we can energetically bankrupt ourselves. We can burn out our bodies and our relationships. And what I have found with the Enneagram is that knowing that we only have to really wear one hat, but how we wear it can kind of shift, really allows us to step into the most authentic version of ourselves, know what our strengths are, know the things we gotta look for and all of that. And so I love bring you live typing sessions because 65 to 70% of you are mistyped. All the online assessments, that rings true, even the paid ones. And I've done thousands of these kind of things, and those numbers don't lie. So getting the right information is not only beautiful and powerful, but there's something about, like, feeling so seen and understood in a way that really allows you to step into and unapologetically be yourself. So we're going to dive into this session today. Kristen. Hi.

Hi, everybody.

So, you know, you have a very seasoned career in media on camera. Like, fill the people in on kind of who Kristen is in this world today.

Oh, gosh. Yeah. How long do we have? I know, I know. We talk about multifaceted. I've been drug into every. Every corner of my, you know, I guess being so I grew up on a horse farm. I was a total farm girl, total tomboy. Very, very quiet, very shy. Always wanted to do fashion because I think you always want to do something opposite of where you're at. So I was, you know, manual labor on a horse farm, But I wanted to do window design. So I actually went to school, got put into visual merchandising. I did that for a long time, which is my creative outlet, which led me to the restaurant business because I loved people. So I started bartending. I did that for 15 years. Then I got pushed from bartending into television news, which is such a natural progress.

Most people, like, let's just bartend and then let's just go do some news on the anchor desk. I was still bartending for the first five years. I was actually on the local news station here. So I transitioned full time into television, really, after my second child. And I was a morning show traffic anchor and news anchor, and I did local television shows, and I was on TV so much that I loved it. And I did it as a challenge to myself because I had a fear of public speaking and. And I wanted to go into something that would challenge me. And everybody kept saying, and I know your people know this. Like, you have enough people telling you you're good at something, you'll finally believe it. I doubted it. So long of hiding from being in front of the camera that way, speaking, could take photos all day, could not talk. And I really just morphed into this TV personality role, I guess, so to speak. So I kind of lost a lot of my personal aspects for many years because you're under such strict regulations on television for the people that don't know TV owns your life, they can tell you that you can't color your hair, you can't cut your hair, you can't appear at anything without permission. People can't use your name or Image. Even if you had a friend who had a product you wanted to promote, you couldn't do that. So that stifled me a lot on my creative side. And I finally made the decision two years ago to leave television altogether and pursue my own, you know, business, which was really helping people with brand image, creativity, media, and PR in the entrepreneurial space. So it was a big shift. But ironically, every single little pieces of that puzzle worked together to kind of make me who I was to help more people. So I'm really grateful. But that's my journey in a nutshell. If that was quick enough.

One of the things I love most about you and I think why you and I so jive together, I mean, if you lived closer, I can totally see us hanging out.

Oh, yeah.

I am a tomboy too. I wrote I was raised that way. Sports and anything where I could get dirty, I loved, but I always had, you know, my hair done and lip gloss on and. And I liked that. I liked that aspect because then people would underestimate me and it. And it also was a creative outlet for me too, you know, growing up on a farm. Can I ask you how old you are again?

43. No, 42. Good God. I'm putting his only 43 this summer.

Oh, my gosh. When's your birthday?

June 15th.

Oh, we got a Gemini in the house, so that kind of adds to the ability to morph into, you know, like the twins and stuff. I love that. Do you have siblings?

Nope, Only child.

Only child. And were mom and dad. Dad was farming. Was mom part of the farming too?

No, mom was the horsewoman. My dad had never been around or ridden horses in his life, and he kind of succumbed to her love of animals. And he loved animals, but he actually took care of the horse farm for a long time. My mom also simultaneously sold real estate, so she was the breadwinner. She was very much so the dominant personality type in my family. My dad is very easygoing, the best guy ever on the planet, and he worked in the car business for a long time before he decided to help with the farm. So it was. It was an interesting dynamic, but I grew up in a very women empowering household, which I think had a lot to do with me wanting to help other women at this point.

Right. Was mom nurturing or was she just baller, like tactical mom?

She is a very hard working and very money driven personality type in the sense that she's very, very domineering in that sense. She was always a strikingly beautiful woman, but extremely strong, like, muscles. And she was the original, like, Wonder Woman, in my opinion. She looks like Lynda Carter. Like, she has that very wonderful.

So do you.

I'll take that. Thank you. Yeah, so do you. She had more muscle, so she was. You know, she almost went to the Olympics in track. Like, she's a very competitive person. And my dad's also an insane athlete, so I had two parents who were both, like, very athletic, but grew up with a really cool dynamic of seeing a man really support a woman and being strong, which was something that I think a lot of people don't get enough of nowadays, of seeing a man that's, like, comfortable with a woman beating him on certain things. My dad was better at others. But, yeah, she definitely molded me in the workaholic sense. Like, I worked my butt off from the time I was 15 until the time I was almost 40.

So she wasn't very nurturing, in a sense.

Yeah, I guess nurturing. It can be taken different ways. I mean, she's extremely, like, loving and provided the best environment, but she's not a. No coddling. I think there was. No coddling would be a good way to put it, because it was like, you're cut. Get up. Keep moving. You're not breathing that much. You're fine.

Yeah, I mean, it's funny to hear you describe that. It's almost like not nurturing has a negative connotation. And exploring all of this, you know, I know that as parents, you're a mom, too. You get this. We do the best we can. And never, ever do we ever think, like, you know what? I'm gonna intentionally withhold love for my children or withhold whatever they need from them. You know, we do what we know. And your mom sounds probably more like I was as a mom. And, you know, my kids are older now, and asking them, like, so what didn't I give you that maybe you needed growing up? And it was. Both of them said the same thing. It was like, we always knew shit was handled. We always knew that, like, you accepted us for who we were and we didn't have to be anything but that. You taught us work ethic and nurturing. It was the warm and fuzzy part. Yeah.

I don't do that much either with mine, so.

Yeah. And it's. It's interesting that, you know, you were kind of not skirting around it a little bit there, but I get it, because as women, we're supposed to be all of it, right? Like, what the hell? We have to be all of it. So it was interesting to hear you also say your dad was in the car business, but he was also easygoing.

Yeah.

That's interesting. I was in the car business for 15 years and it was anything but easygoing. What did he do in the car business?

He was a salesman and a general manager. He ran several dealerships. And honestly, again, no vice. Like, he's just one of those guys that's so trustworthy and cannot lie. So he honestly did really well because everybody loved him. But then he wouldn't push as hard as some people. So ultimately it was better for him to just work and help us on the farm because that was obviously generating more. But we lived in Michigan, Detroit, cars everywhere. You know, that was kind of the thing. But I do miss the demo cars because I got to see all the new cars because we didn't have money to ever afford new anything, and he got to bring home cars all the time. So I thought that was really cool as a kid, which probably instilled my love of cars, trucks.

So how does that. I love that. I mean, I drive a big ass truck, so I love that.

So do I.

You do? What do you drive? What do you drive?

I have a jacked up black on black Toyota Tundra. Shut the hell up. Yes. What do you drive?

I drive a jacked up black on black Dodge Ram with a.

That's what I had before. I've had rams my entire life. I just got the car. Okay, we're going. We're going together.

I'm on my fifth one, so. I love it.

I love that. I love you even more now. All right.

Do you get out of your truck? This makes me like, every time I hop out of my truck and I'm short, like, I'm like 5 foot 3 and I hop out of my truck, you know, it's like a 6 inch lift kit on it.

Yeah.

And almost at least once a week, some dude at the gas station is like, is that your truck?

Oh, get ready. You want to know what my license plate was on my yellow Dodge Ram that I used to own?

What?

NTMY M N Z. Not my man's.

That was my license plate.

I freaking love it. I have. I have a personalized plate too, but I have bling all around it too.

Yes. Yeah. Female.

Okay. This is mine and it's paid for and. Yeah. Yeah, I love that.

And I'll run you over. I'll still run you over.

Kick your ass pretty much. When did the transition happen in your house, where dad went from doing that to supporting mom's kind of Vision.

It was elementary, so probably around nine or 10 years. 99 or 10, because they got divorced a couple years after that. So he was at the farm for the last few years that they were married and still helped, you know, through the transition. When he left, he would still help out. So he was there most of the time.

So they got divorced when you're like 12. Twelveish.

I was. Yeah, I was around 12. It was middle school, so which then, you know, that was in early 90s. That wasn't as common still at that point. So, yeah, you know, that was definitely. But, you know, they remained very amicable, never argued. Like, they're really strong when you were that age.

What did you understand to be the reason of the divorce?

My dad honestly had a gambling problem, and it was very cut and dry. My mom doesn't deal with addiction at all in any way, shape or form from her family side. So, you know, so she just was like, okay, here's Chance one, chance two, and I love you, but I can't do that. And she wouldn't sacrifice her values. But it was very cut and dry. There was never. It wasn't cheating. It wasn't any. They loved each other. They still were attracted to each other. It wasn't anything except that one. One vice that my mom. Yeah, she just. But that was also where a lot of my lack of tolerance came from in the beginning of just being like, okay, if you do this, you're not strong enough to handle something. So I still, to this day, like, I'm very overall clean. Like, I mean, as far as being in the restaurant business for so long, actually never touched drugs, which is a shocker if you've worked in the restaurant business as a bartender for 15 years. But I just, you know, I liked alcohol. I can manage that. I know my tolerance levels, and I don't, you know, I know when to stop and pull back and. Yeah. So I think that that played into my success in the restaurant business because I didn't fall for all the debauchery.

Yeah. It's interesting. I was a bartender for 15 years as well, and I loved it. Like, honestly, I've even considered. Because my son is a bar manager now. Oh. And I've even considered, like, doing one or two nights a week just for fun.

Oh, I'll fly out there. We could do a charity event.

Oh, my gosh. How fun would that be?

Yes, like charity bartend.

What was that, that movie with the girls, Coyote Ugly. Yes. I loved that movie too. It's so stupid, but it's so great.

No, it's so cheesy.

But I loved the people aspect of it. And you know, I think that you having a very strong mom, knowing this from early on, what did you witness? Like, how did you feel like, you know, as kids, I know saying this right now, it's like, ooh, I didn't earn love. But you know, as kids we start kind of like interpreting. Okay, this makes mom happy, this makes dad happy. What got approval, attention, praise from your mom when you were young?

It was hard work. I mean the more, you know, hard work and winning. I mean I was obviously a very competitive equestrian, so I competed on circuit levels and we did more western hunt seat, so it wasn't jumping like most people are familiar with. Week we competed on breed circuits quarter horse palomino and I competed for literally my entire life. So I was always, you know, freshman year I was like the leading, you know, point earner on the equestrian team. I was on varsity my freshman year. I was just one of those. But I also had a farm to be training every day. So I mean my entire life was riding, you know, pretty much every day of my life, training animals and then going to horse shows every weekend. So that was my life from the time I was 5 until I was 18. So never really took much of a break from that.

What about dad?

Honestly? I mean, yeah, the same sports, kind of winning stuff, but again, he's just so easygoing about most things that, you know, just being there makes him happy. So he's a pretty easy, appreciative, low key kind of person. Didn't need the flashy stuff, like that kind of stuff.

And if you're thinking back to when you were younger, who would you say you were closer to or felt at least at ease with? Like you didn't have to like be.

On, I guess my dad.

Yeah.

Yeah, I mean, I guess, yeah, they're both very matter of fact and you didn't have to really like they accepted everyone. I grew up in a very forward thinking household, so my mom was very supportive of all cultures, all everything.

So I was so great.

A very liberal mindset in that way, business wise, totally opposite, like a very strict and like taxes and those type of things. But my mom, you know, is just a supporter of good humans and it's.

Like best of both.

I love that it was really honestly for me was great because I grew up in a very rural area and not many, not much ethnicity, like it wasn't very mixed. But I still never saw any of that. Like I, you Know in the like she prepared me very well for that, which I'm grateful because I am a very. I judge people by their character, not by anything. I don't care what your job is. I don't care if you live in your car. If you're nice to me, I'm nice to you. They're both pretty equal in that way. They're both really pretty understanding people, which was easier for me, I guess than most kids because I didn't really have it that hard, to be honest. Hard work, yes, but not improving them because I just, you know, did what I was supposed to. I was pretty good kid, I guess.

Overall, how would you say you're different from your mom? Like when you were younger and you're looking at your mom, I'm sure you looked up to her because she's taller and all the things, but was there something like you love her but I'm a little bit different and maybe she doesn't get this part of me.

I make more time for people. Yeah, I definitely make more time for people. Or I prioritize experiences over material at this point because again, you know, that generation, when people were raised in the 50s, you know, and you were on.

Especially the Midwest too. Midwest too, yeah.

You wanted all the shiny objects, you wanted the new car, you wanted the bigger place. And I think to us now we're so virtual and mobile in our lives, like you don't need all of that anymore. So. Yeah, so I'm definitely. But yeah, I make a lot more time for other people in that sense.

Yeah, I can see that and feel that for sure. You actually have the best of both because you do have that people aspect and character. I mean, I'm not saying your mom's out of character, but you know what I mean by that. Yeah, you know what I mean by that. Like that. That is something I've had to learn. My son is more naturally wired like that, but he's also ultra competitive as well. Yeah, when you were younger, before you've done all this work on yourself and you know how beautiful that you were raised. You know, I'm a first generation personal developer. My parents were not like yours where you know, it was like, yes, we're open minded to all this new kind of stuff. I love that you were raised in that. When you were younger, when you were at your best, what kind of things made you feel confident?

Really? The horses? I mean I was very confident with my animals because I had a comfort level there. I was not comfortable around people. I was, I was Picked out a lot. And I had a lot of, you know, tough times in that whole stretch of, like, fifth grade to ninth grade.

It's the worst.

It's the worst years, and especially when you're a quiet kid. My only saving grace is that I was physically very strong, so nobody would mess with me per se, to a point, because I could physically, you know, I could throw hay bales that were twice. I could. I could lift more than my weight at that age.

Why would you say you weren't comfortable around people during that time, other than the obvious shyest?

I was so afraid of being judged or doing something wrong. Like, you know, I was very afraid of judgment or just not being liked or accepted. I was definitely one of those kids. I 100% stayed quiet until I was probably in my mid-20s because I didn't want. I was an observer. Which now makes you, especially with bartending, makes you such a better judge of character, because I can read people's energy versus what they're saying because I watched them for so long, because I sat in the back corner. So it was definitely an emotional intelligence lesson my entire life because I focused on what made people feel good, what, you know, what made them uncomfortable. So again, you know this already. I'm like the welcome wagon. If you're new somewhere, I. I want you to be comfortable. Like, you shouldn't feel like an outcast. And so I am the first person to assimilate myself with whoever is, you know, needs help or wants to be that. So, yeah, I mean, it was just. I was just quiet. I was a really. I mean, people are shocked by that now, but I did not speak for many years. I just wouldn't even speak in school.

When you were struggling, other than, like, kind of being the on the wall or quiet or shy. Because I don't necessarily think that that's a bad thing. I think that that's beautiful. And it is one of your greatest assets. Your ability to observe and understand people is one of your greatest assets. Absolutely. And the warmth that people can feel from you is evident. Like, I mean, you're so inviting anyway because you're just so naturally beautiful. But, like, your heart is equally beautiful.

When you are kind of feeling like, even if the world doesn't know it, but you're kind of going off the rails a little bit or not feeling as confident. Maybe some stinking thinking creeps in. What kind of. Like, how does that play out and show up in your life?

You know, I used to get really quiet, and I would be quiet for A long time and let it fester and get negative. Now, I mean, I think it's more with wisdom, you know, with age comes wisdom. So I think I always did like, you know, you want to dress a little nicer, get up, do your makeup, get ready, you know, look more presentable in that sense. So, you know, I think I do that more now. Like, if I'm feeling kind of blah, I just either schedule time with my friends where I have to get dressed up and go out somewhere to just get my energy back up, but I 100% feed off other people's energy. So if I'm around a fun environment, I could be up for days. If I'm at home and it's boring, I'll be asleep by 8 o'. Clock. So I really feed off of whatever's in front of me. So I just try and put myself in better positions to feel more energy. And now I have a business partner who balances me out too, who keeps me going on days where I don't feel. And again, it's like these kind of conversations for therapy. If you can have these people all the time, it's just better overall. So I was very blessed to have that the past two years of someone who really understood me and knew that I needed to be quiet sometimes. And that sometimes I'm just balls to the wall and I am in the hoochiest outfit you can get on and I'm gonna go dance on a bar and I'm gonna do this and then I'm gonna go right back to being in a housecoat. And, you know, so I. That's probably one of my better and worst things is I love extremes of both sides. I mean, I love farm life. I love New York, you know, I mean, I like so many things. So it just depends on my. Where I feel like I need to get that energy up and what's going to do it for me and I just do it. Or I take a bath and have a glass of wine and stay quiet for home for an entire day.

What would you say before all this work that you've done? And that's the beauty of being 40 and above, I swear to God, it's the best ever. Just the wisdom and the zero fucks kind of pretty much. I love it. Like, I'm almost done with the 40s. I'm kind of sad about it, but they're telling me 50s are equally as great, so I'm going to trust that. But what would you say would be your go to coping mechanism when you're starting to feel that rumble of, like, it's building. It's building. Yeah. You know, because I know your heart is so beautiful, like you exploding on somebody. I'm sure it's happened and resentment has kicked in. I mean, you're feisty, for sure, but that's not your nature, typically.

Yeah, right.

What is your coping mechanism to kind of like, tame that weight training?

I mean, I honestly. I used to do martial arts as a kid and with my husband when we first got together, because he's been practicing martial arts his entire life. He's a black belt in everything. So I do go to heavyweights now. Something that I can really, again, get my mind focused back around something and get those and good endorphins going, and I feel better about myself. I think that's probably my number one. The second is probably margaritas. So I'm gonna. I'll say that, you know, But I'm always the one who. I want to have a good time, and I refuse to really let much get in the way of that, because it is a choice to let negative things overrun an event or a scenario. So I choose to have a good time. So we show up, and we are going to be the party, and you're gonna have fun with us. You know, whether you like it or not, you're gonna. You're gonna have a good time. But we bring that into that was part of our. Honestly, the whole reason our business, we built it was on that mission statement that if it's not something that we love and it brings us joy and makes us feel, you know, we're. We're really not allowing that into our ecosystem. But it always has been like either, you know, going out and dancing or something physical. Because I am a very. Like, I've gotten into a lot of altercations in the past, and it's mostly defending other people. And again, I am very defensive of others and not so much, you know, we all do that. We're not as protective of ourselves. I do. If I let myself build to a point where I'm angry, it is not a good scenario for anybody. So it's better for me to go get that out somewhere else and go work out and kind of zone out for a little bit and then be a better person later.

So, okay, when you've had relationships go south in your life, whether it was friendships or prior romantic partnerships or anything like that, or even business partnerships, what do you think is the common thing that happens that is kind of your part in it, would you say?

It used to be just work. Like if it was a loss of excitement or like interest. I was a person who was very quick to just let people go out of my life, especially if I knew they weren't of value back then. So I could admit that now. I mean, I was very vain through most of my early 20s of being like, if this person, you know, does this, but if they mess up or they do something I don't like, then they're just gone. And I really had zero issue with ex boyfriends that were, you know, kind of idiots anyways because most of them are for a reason. And you know, if they were just got too controlling or too like just attached, I don't, I don't like clingy in a sense of my mate. I like independence of my own. I guess that's an only child syndrome partially. But I enjoyed being by myself. So if I felt like someone was trying to control what I was trying to accomplish, total turn off for me. And if they were too supportive or too mushy or too, you know, loving, I guess this is all relating back. So it makes a lot of sense. I just, Yeah, I was like, not interested anymore because I do. I mean, I enjoyed a challenge in my 20s. So if you weren't a challenge for me, I just. Because I accomplished things very early. Like I bought a house by the time I was 22. I had paid for a motorcycle, a truck, like I was set by the time I was 23 years old. So I. If you didn't fit into that, Yeah, I would, I'd cut people off very quickly and I would kind of hold a grudge for a very long time.

When people mess up. Right. You know, because I know for me how I judge my kind of scale that nobody knows about. Right. It's like we all have this like, scale or the, the thing that's most important to us that are these secret expectations that we have in relationships. I know what my scale is and what, what is the most important thing to me when people mess up. Like, what is a mess up? That is like a deal breaker for.

You when it comes to lying, lying or being disrespectful. I. If there's disrespect in any kind of name calling or if there's any kind of lying that's like intentional behind my back without. And I've asked specifically for answers. And you still lie. That's my zero tolerance policy.

Do you think that. Well, I mean, that's beautiful and I love that. Do you think that it Comes from because you are so giving and open and heart centered. Do you think that that's a big part of why that is like your thing?

Yeah, I think that, you know, because most people know they can talk to me about anything. So I guess it's. It offends me when they feel they can't or if they have to lie to me for whatever reason.

Yeah.

But I just, again, I'm a very honest person, so I guess it's hard to know. And I, I mean, not saying we haven't done the white lies.

Sure, sure, sure.

That dress looks great on you. I mean, we've all done it, but there's a lot of those that have, you know, I don't know.

I'm an eight. I don't really lie too much. I'll straight shoot it. I probably should have more of a filter, but I don't.

It's okay. I got you. So it's, you know, that's. Yeah. I think other than that though, I just, I don't like disrespect. I just think once you lose respect in a relationship, it's very hard to get that back. There's certain circumstances that you may not have been able to control. But the respect part, I don't think you can ever rebuild that. Yeah, that's my biggest deal breaker.

How would you describe your anger?

Controlled.

Why do you think that is? Are you afraid that it might hurt somebody?

Oh, yeah, yeah, I've gotten to that point and it's hurt people. I mean, I physically have been in like things where I mean, I have the capability, ability to hurt people. And I don't like hurting people. But physically, if I'm. And this is a weird thing for anybody who always says, like, you know, we're in this fight or flight state most of our lives, which today causes all of that stress and a lot of anxiety for us. I have tested that theory many times in my life. Most people don't know what they would do in those situations until they're put in them. So you could say that you'd fight all day. Most people are flight.

Yeah.

I have zero flight in my system. I will fight no matter what it is. If it's an animal, a person I have, that's where I just turn off. It's a switch that I don't think is conducive to nowadays with all of the laws and things. Like people are so sensitive to things. Like I'm one of those old school people that like, if someone hits you, you're going to Hit them back.

Right.

And if someone is just acting like an ass and deserved, maybe they need their ass kicked once or twice because it'll probably help them realize that they are not all encompassing or omnipresent people that can just do whatever they want, there are repercussions. So yeah, my anger is very controlled until it.

But explosive once it happens.

It's. Once I make a decision, I always make a conscious decision of whether I'm going to act or not. And it's only happened a few times where it's been. Someone is at risk or something is going to happen or someone's going to hurt someone. And I know that I can diffuse the situation. I will physically insert myself at that point. And I have, you know, again, my husband's military, so we're very. That's our mindset anyways.

So what about if you feel unappreciated?

I just get quiet and I just shut down.

Does it kind of. Is it because it hurts or what's going on, do you think?

Yeah, I think just again, a lack of respect. So if I feel underappreciated or not respected, I just completely shut down. Like I'm.

But that character isn't reciprocated like that character integrity that you have. Do you get surprised maybe not at your age now, but like when you were younger, were you completely like shocked that people don't have that same character integrity that you do?

Yes, yes.

Yeah, I can imagine. What would people tell me is the best part about being friends with you?

It would be probably one of several things, I'm sure that I'm just fun and we're always laughing and that I am always there.

Yeah.

So I always show up.

No matter what.

Pretty much, yeah.

Even if you have something else like that, maybe you could do better or have more fun or you're a person of your word when it comes to the people.

Oh yeah. If somebody, if I say I'm going to do something, I'm there. Like I don't. I've.

No. Bullshit.

No, I've never called. I mean in my lifetime. I worked at the news station for 12 years. I used six days off in 12 years for being sick. Like I will not let people, like in that sense, you know, I won't let people down and I know that about myself. So I've been more protective of that the past couple years where I say no more now than I ever have in my life because it's just draining me. And I realized that. But again, we had more energy back in those 20s and 30s.

Yeah, but I think, like, what you just said is so powerful and this is going to make a lot of sense to those listening and maybe even you in a way that you didn't expect. Is that that ability to say no with some healthy boundaries, really energetically will refuel you. What would those same friends tell me is the hardest part about being friends with you?

Probably that I usually make all the plans or I am. I always have to be on time. So I get really frustrated if people are not on time for things. That's one of my anxiety triggers is time. And that got worse after my second child because I think hormones just screw you up when it comes to that stuff.

Is it a disrespect factor that pisses you off?

Yeah, I would say that it's. Yeah. If I say that it's going to be this, this and this, you know, I want it to be this, this and this. And I have an uncanny way of making things happen regardless of circumstance. So I think, again, it always surprises me that other people can't do that. I know now that it's more of a superpower versus, you know, most people aren't capable of that. And I. I think it's easy because it is easy to me. It's not easy to other people. My husband is never on time for most things in life, and it's just really fun. But he was in the military, so how can you not be on time?

I know it's a control thing. I mean, I know, like, I resist the stupidest shit, but I think it's because I've been adulting since I was like 4 years old. Like, minor adulting shit. I will like, procrastinate. And it's so stupid sometimes I'm like. But it makes sense. Like, I have compassion for myself. It's like, well, I've been adulting since I was this tall. So what did you think you were on the Enneagram?

I think originally it was like a three, and then the, like the smaller number was. And I don't know if I'm saying this right because I'm not well versed. And it was 4 and then 8. Those were the three numbers that I think I had in a row. And this was a while ago, so I told you it's been a long time. So I didn't really know 100%.

This is so fun. Like, I see, like, this is why this is so powerful. And, and you know, when I was talking to you before, I was like, yeah, I could see Three. I could see three, but there was just something. You remind me so much of my son.

Yeah.

So much. And he has an enneagram 2.

Okay.

But that being said, you don't fit the stereotype two, because a lot of twos get the bad rap of being codependent pushovers over givers. You and he are a little bit sneakier with that. It isn't necessarily like, I'm gonna give my whole life to you because that's how I feel loved. But people like a lot of the things that you said from how you grew up. I mean, you definitely have a strong three wing. So as a two, you have a three wing and a one wing. And I'll explain what that is in a minute. And where the four comes into play too for you.

Okay.

The other reason why so many people are mistyped on the enneagram that no assessment takes into consideration is our instinctual reaction to life. There's either self preservation, the one on one, or social. And the self preservation. And one on one look more. A little more like your typical twos. But this social one is the ambitious two. And this is the two that either looks like a three or an eight, which ironically were two of the top scores as well. In your assessment that I had you take. It was 2, 3, and 8. We're right there. And so this social. And I'll explain where else the 8 comes in which you're going to die. This is probably why we both really. I love twos, like the healthy twos like you, that are people driven but also take action. I love that. So that social two really looks very different than the other ones. And that's why a lot of twos are mistyped as threes.

Oh, okay.

Because the social two uses their seductive powers in a more intellectual way instead. Instead of this over giving way.

Yeah.

To attract and engage groups, communities and broader systems. I think this also comes from you being an only child as well. So, like, you know, you naturally interjected yourself into groups. You didn't have this like, group at home where you felt like that's where your place was. So you went out into the world with this beautiful character of people. And the main difference that you said about your mom and in you is you do take time for people. The twos are driven by a need and a desire and a motive to connect with the people.

Oh, wow.

They do want love and appreciation at the top of their game. Where the threes, like you have a lot of the three behaviors, but your worth isn't tied in what you do?

Yeah.

Like even as a little girl before you understood like you did do the achiever things because that's kind of what was modeled for you.

Yeah.

And it was great. And it's a beautiful thing about you. But your heart and your motive is always about people. Always, always like. And even what you said, I got goosebumps just thinking about you. Like, a three would absolutely bail on people if a goal was at stake. They wouldn't even think twice about it.

Okay.

And a three has a tendency. I mean, yes, you can. Like. And even you saying like you feel. Threes don't necessarily feel energy. They just know what they need to do to outperform everybody.

Gotcha.

You feel energy because you actually give a shit. Not saying that threes don't give a shit, because they do. But they give a shit about their goal first and a lot of time. The people second because their worth is tied into what they do. Right. Your heart is all people centered, which is like twos. Like the healthy twos. Because you have boundaries, thank God. But you care deeply. You care deeply. But a healthy two, and especially a social two has the ability to also challenge directly, which is you. And the social two stands out in the crowd. No doubt about it. And they often take a central or leadership role.

Oh, wow.

They enjoy being in the know. And the social two builds influence on your competence and connections. Right. This is why you aren't the over giver. That A2 can fall into giving more than you get. Maybe a strategy to distract you from uncomfortable feelings, things. You're less childlike than the other twos. Right. The other twos, when they're dysfunctional, can be very martyr like or super codependent. So it's something they really have to watch for. This is why I see why you weren't originally typed as a two, because you. Right. And your ambition and influence is especially women. Social twos always mistype as threes or eights.

Oh my gosh.

And that's. That's very, very common. So the other thing about the. And this is the beautiful anatomy. And this is like what I love seeing is how somebody that really has done a lot of work on themselves and is just stepping into their most authentic selves. You use the full anatomy of the enneagram based on your type because it's like having the right tool for the job makes everything a lot easier. And that two in you is so instinctual. You already like, you do that in your sleep, but you have really utilized the other anatomy that's connected to the two to make you this well rounded, heart centered, considerate helper, which is what the two is called. Right. They value relationships and so kindness, generosity, self sacrifice are important. The twos, their number one goal is to make the world a more loving place.

True.

It really, really is. You offer support and attention to those that you care about. At your best, you're unconditionally successful, supportive, like, even like what you said about your business and the fun aspect. A3 wouldn't necessarily care about fun.

Okay.

They just want to win and get all the people saying, you're amazing.

No, I don't.

That's not you at all.

No. God, that's crazy.

Not you at all. When twos. And you don't even give to get. Maybe when you were younger, this giving and performing to get, you know, like, I'm good enough. I mean, it looked very three. Like, I'm sure at some points in your life. But I think that also has to do with having a very strong three mom. A three or an eight mom. I'm guessing you probably have a three or an eight for a mom.

Yeah.

And sometimes twos can be flattering in a way as a manipulation, like a gift to get to like, oh, I can get anybody to like me. I mean, you naturally have that. And I'm sure being on tv, like one of the beautiful things about being a bartender and somebody on TV is you're a Persona. Yeah, you're a Persona. And that's probably why when you got out of that, it's like, who the hell am I? Right. That's a two thing for sure. Like, yeah, you become this because you all are about the people. Sometimes it can. It can feel like, who the heck am I without that? The beautiful part about the two is you. You have that three wing, which you use very, very well, that achieving quality, get shit done, goal setting. We're going to win. I can do anything. Put it in front of me and I'll crush it. Whether it's driving a big truck or looking like a Runway model or like, you do it all. I love that about you. Freaking love that about you. On the other side of the two is the one wing, which is the reformer, the improver. I like to call you all the sheriff. The one is like the righteous part of you where the two is all about the people. And they can kind of let people. They give grace a little bit too much sometimes. They give people the benefit of the doubt so much sometimes that it's actually becoming enabling. I don't see that in you very much. My son had to really be careful of that when he was a little bit younger.

Yeah.

That one wing, especially if that two and you is like, I'm gonna cut him some slack. What I'll usually tell a two to do is check in with that one wing, because that's your no filter. Straight shooting, yes or no, black or white thinking. Because that 2 is very much about the energy and the feelings. The one will call it like it is. Now, the two in you still might want to give them grace. But that other side of you, that three is like, no, this is standing in the way from helping somebody achieve a goal. Like, the three isn't just about your own goals. It's about helping others achieve their goals, which. Which makes sense with what you're doing in the world in business today. Now, the two other numbers that are attached to the two is the eight.

Okay.

Which I see a little bit of that fire in you and that protector in you.

Yeah.

So the eight is what I am. And that's the challenger, the protective challenger. And when you said that people mess up, it's usually a lack of integrity or character or appreciation. Or if you see somebody being taken advantage of, like, you'll cut a bitch, right?

Pretty much, yeah.

That's eight. That's your eight. You're easygoing and contained. Unless you feel like somebody's out of line or like there's a character problem here.

Yeah.

That's eight. And that's where you go under extreme stress. Or if you've been over giving and not taking enough time for yourself, that resentment can be brewing, and sometimes you'll just kind of unload on somebody. I don't see you doing that so much. Your husband might differ.

Nope.

I'm sure you figured that, you know, this is the beauty of growing and understanding yourself. It's like you have healthy boundaries.

Yeah.

Which is a struggle for a lot of twos. Now, the other part of you. And this is why the four comes up in your. In your assessments in the past. A2, when they are kind of getting to the holy grail, because you know the two. You know how to be a people person.

Yeah.

But there's another level of you, because although you're all about making the world a more loving, better place, you still are Kristen. And Kristen is not just here to serve the people. Kristen is here for whatever God has designed for her, and she has her own personal calling. It's not about just sacrificing for the people, even though that is your main driver. And thank God for people like you and my son, because you do make the world a better, more loving place. And you really remind us that humanity is so freaking great. It's people like you. Okay? Nothing makes me happier when I see a 2 lean into their growth number, which is the 4, which is the Enneagram 4, which you go from the helper, the considerate helper.

Yeah.

To the individualist, which four, two. That can be a really big push because if you. You feel like. If you can imagine if your motivational need is to be appreciated and loved, like, feeling like an individual can feel kind of selfish if we're not careful. Yeah, Right. And so when a two at first, and I push a two like my son, to do things for yourself, to take time and, you know, it's why you do love the animals, because it isn't you. I mean, yes, you love animals, but it's also. It's this beautiful energy exchange where an animal never wants anything from you.

Yeah, that's true.

Where when you're such a people person, very often with twos especially, the energy exchange is very rarely even. Even with the healthiest people, because that is just your nature. And so doing things for yourself, it is your creative outlet. It is. It's the creativity as well. You know, running it through the filter like before, when you say, you say no a lot more. That's your four. That's that four saying, am I saying yes because I want, like, them to like me? Or. Or is this what I would do? Or is this really what I want to do?

Yeah.

And that for you, leaning into that growth number of the four is saying no. This is a no for me. This is a no for me. So that you can say yes to the people, places, and things that really light you up and allow you to do what you've been called to do.

So that's.

That my sister.

Oh, my God, that's amazing. So much more than I ever, ever expected. Like, that is so on the money. It's ridiculous, isn't it? Can you give me some lotto numbers?

I know this is where people say, like, I read people's minds, but.

Well, it's. It is. And it's interesting because that does play into literally the phases of everything. And why, you know, I was always dubbed the chameleon in general.

But that makes a lot more sense. And for someone who, again, doesn't have a huge understanding of all the numbers now I see that it isn't one number. Like, you have all these different elements, but they come in at different times of your life. So for you to say the four is like, what's starting to show up now makes me happy because I actually feel that because I have, you know, I've set boundaries and I've said I'm going to only allow X, Y, and Z in this year, which is. Yeah, you totally nailed it.

It's so beautiful. Like. Like, it makes. Makes me so, like, when I see my son, like, go play golf by himself, I, like, light up. I'm like, oh, yay. Or when he says no or he'll tell somebody, can I get back to you in 24 hours? Like, that was a huge deal for him because he's such a. Like, I can help, so why shouldn't I?

Yeah.

And it's like four or two. Just because you can doesn't mean you should all the time.

That's the best phrase ever. Yeah. That is 100% accurate.

So, you know, because of what you do in the world, I mean, you've worn a lot of different roles in your life, from like the bartender to, you know, the horse girl to the tomboy to the newscaster to the anchor woman. All the things. And you doing what you're doing in the world today. And it's so beautiful because this is like the sweet spot for you. You are helping women become and brand themselves in a way where their light shines. Right? So talk to me, because this is exactly what you should be doing. Because not only are you helping people, but that beautiful four in you really brings the creativity and individuality to people. Plus, with the 3 Wing, you also can say, okay, this is how we're freaking gonna do it. Let's freaking go. So tell the people what you're doing today and why this. Oh, my gosh, perfect thing for a social too, on the end.

This is. It is so on the money. It's ridiculous. So, yeah, we. We transitioned into opening reframe, which is really reframing your online brand imaging. So we dedicated ourselves to helping women primarily in fitness and wellness. But solopreneurs in general really dominate their online social media images. And the thing we saw most was what we talked about. People getting taken advantage of or people feeling icky, like, okay, just post photos of your, like, tits and ass all day, and you're going to get tens of thousands of followers. And literally, what does that do for you in the long run of your business or your moral standing or so many things? Or there's photographers out there who want you to know, just post sexy or do this, do this and none of that works in the real world. It only works in this little social media bubble that really is a bunch of, like, bullshit overall, because it's just a facade. And people are smart enough, at least people you want to work with.

Exactly.

So you don't want the people that fall for that crap, because they're not going to be your. And so we call them MVPs. I know the ideal client avatar is what a lot of people say, but we say MVPs, and we don't mean most valuable players. We mean most valuable payers. So it's people who are going to pay you money for your services. So my business partner has a basis in cognitive behavioral therapy, and mine is mostly creative. So we decided, you know what? We can create brand images for women that honestly feel good to them, and they show up as their authentic selves, which is 100% tied in to what you're telling them to discover. I guess we do it in that visual way, like you're doing it in a emotional. Like that hit me in the chest because I was like, try to take deep breaths when you were explaining everything. But we do it in a visual sense so that you do show up as that person online. Which is why all of this makes sense to me now. So much more that you said it out loud, because I do want all of these things, but it is also personal for me because I didn't have that when I was, you know, at the point of starting my business. I want to be that for someone else, but I also want them to do it for themselves.

Honestly, this is why you're the perfect person to do this. I'm so glad you're not a three, quite honestly. And I knew you weren't. I knew you weren't at our last conversation, because a 3. Doing this kind of work can be very dangerous, especially when you're dealing with people where, like, they have PTSD from photo shoots. I'm one of those people. Or they're not feeling like, oh, my gosh, putting myself out there. You being a two, and you energetically, like, yeah, this is creative, and this is like, business. But you energetically make people feel safe because you are that. That warm, too. This is where you are different from your mom.

Okay?

This is the difference.

Wow, that's amazing.

Because you make. You make people feel safe. And I'm just gonna be straight. Like, when people look at you, they might immediately, without you opening up your mouth, be intimidated because you're so beautiful and your posture is so strong. But. But people can feel that energy of warmth and no judgment. And you can't lie. That does not fucking lie.

No, it doesn't.

And if you were a three, this looks really, really different in this space. And so you guys, she has a webinar coming up next week or. Yeah, next week, in a couple weeks. Tell them what that's about and why they should be on it.

Yeah. So we actually decided to do a quick webinar for everybody to get to know us better because we're launching so many amazing things next year. But it's really a brand image webinar. So it's our three step process to determining your brand image and how to show up online. So we go through some fun discoveries that will probably resonate with a lot of people because we're all guilty of them. And then how to overcome those and the three steps you should be taking to really build a brand image that converts to, you know, actually having those MVPs, those clients that you want to work with. And we've really fine tuned this process with. I want you to so do this with my business partner, Jill, because she is the opposite of me in so many ways, but the same. So we, we share the same brain, but she's much more cognitive based and she's an extreme competitor.

So if she's open to this, I would love to do this and then bring you both together.

Oh my gosh.

Talk about how this works, why it.

Works, because I would love to know why it worked so well because I've never been able to work this well with another female.

I'll tell you why.

I'll tell you why. Okay. Okay. So we worked very well together, but we wanted this, you know, with Reframe to grow into a place where women could really go for that one stop shop of building a brand image where they learned how to, you know, pose for photos in the way that feels good to them, how to create the right image, the right messaging. And you know, we teach media and pr from my news side, we teach publications because my partner's been on the COVID of, of umpteen magazines. So we really wanted to bring all this knowledge together to build something that was a safe way for coaching and brand imaging to be done for women. So that's, that was what that was for.

I love this and I'm going to explain this in a second. Where can they find you your website and Instagram for all this great stuff?

Yeah, really simple. It's www.reframeyourbiz.com and reframe your Biz on Instagram, we will be launching Brand Image Academy. So that'll be be searchable as well. And then Kristin Crowley. TV is everything. My Facebook, my Instagram. So if you want to connect with me personally, I love answering questions. Obviously from everything you've heard Tracy say about me, I love conversations. So please send me a message. It could be about what you're eating. I don't care.

You guys, this is, I'm going to say this, this is one of the beautiful strengths of mine is with an enneagram 8 you, you never have to worry that we're gonna bullshit you and I gotta say photo shoots, brand imaging. I have such a shitty taste in my mouth for so much bullshit and fucking scam crap that's out there that when her and I had talked like last month, I was so in love with what you do. I 1000% you guys listening? If you feel like you need to do some branding work and, and I could not vet her better and encourage you more to go through her process and her membership and her retreats, I might even decide to go on one of these things, which is not something I would typically do. You guys, there is not somebody in this space more in integrity than this woman. And I'm not getting. She didn't even know I was going to say that. But it's.

No, I didn't.

It's the freaking truth, you guys. So please follow her. She is in integrity. She's a straight shooting, heart centered person that really does have your best interest and your brand at heart. Kristen, my God, I love you. This is great. So great.

You're amazing. Thank you. I can't thank you enough for doing this and for us to decide to do this live. Like we didn't, I didn't know anything that was going to happen on this conversation.

So.

Good. So that was a very gut reaction like on my part of feeling what you were saying. So this is a lot for me to digest and I'm gonna.

You know where to find me, sister. You know where to find.

Yeah, I know where to find you. So we're gonna continue this conversation and continue. Yeah, you're just amazing. So thank you for doing this for me.

I mean, my pleasure.

Definitely helps me understand why and where I'm going. So it's awesome.

You're in the sweet spot. And you guys, I know if you're listening like you can, can see like how this experience can really open you up in a way that's like, yes, this is great or I need to pivot Come find me. You can find me at Tracy Underscore o' Malley on Instagram. Or you want to do something like this? Go to tracyomalley.com the work with me section and you get your own little session.

Just, you guys need to do this. You guys need to do this. Because that felt so good. Like it was that like the most affirmations I needed right now. So in one hour for you to do that. It's amazing.

Oh, I love it. Thank you so much for being so vulnerable and open and transparent and for you just helped thousands of people with what you just kind of let us in on. So I appreciate that so, so much. You guys, it's time to become the ultimate leader in your.

I'm so happy you enjoyed the Leadership Formula podcast. Please help us spread the word about this show by sharing it with a friend and leaving a written Apple podcast review. If you have any follow up questions to this episode, you can DM me directly on Instagram at Tracee Underscore Malley. You can also find additional resources on my website@traceeomalley.com I'm excited to lead you into the next level of your life.