EP199: Live Enneagram Typing Session: The Ability to EMBODY Every Enneagram Type with Elegance and Grace with Amber Lilyestrom (Enneagram 9)

Welcome to the Leadership Formula podcast, where you will learn the secret sauce behind achieving massive success. I'm your host, Tracy o', Malley, multimillion dollar entrepreneur, your Enneagram expert, master performance coach, and mom to millennials. Do you want deep, meaningful relationships? To wake up every day with purpose and make money doing something you love? Well, you've landed in the right place. Every week, I will teach you how to get exactly what you want in life by strengthening your emotional intelligence. Using a combination of the Enneagram framework, live life coaching sessions, and real talk from yours truly. It's time to transform yourself into the ultimate leader of your life. Let's do this thing.

All right, you all, you are in for a doozy because this one has been keeping me up at night. I'm gonna tell you, yes, this is your favorite kind of episode is what you're telling me you love the live Enneagram typing sessions. And I am bringing you a very, very, very special friend guest. She is a legend, people. My dear friend Amber Strum is here and I met her and I of course knew of her because she's like a best selling author. She's the shit. Let's just say she's got friends in high places and she is like the person you want to get to know. Not just because of what she does, but just her whole essence is stunning, beautiful. You know, you are in the presence of the real freaking deal when you are with her. And I gotta say, I felt that before I'd even met her. And then the second I was in a room with her, I'm like, she's my people for sure. And I honestly, I mean, I don't mean this kind of cocky, but I'm not quite sure I've ever met somebody that has done as much internal work as I have besides you. And that, that is a true testament to wanting to not only be the very best you can be as a wife, as a mother, as a coach, but as a human being. I absolutely know this woman. You guys walks her talk. Now, that being said, we. We met each other in a mastermind. And you know, obviously my thing is the Enneagram. And she came right up to me. She's like, so I'm a three. And I'm like, okay. And I didn't know her very well at that point, but I was like, okay, okay. I can see that, you know, threes, especially women are very mistyped. Threes and eight women are the most mistyped on the Enneagram, especially in the entrepreneurial space, because those Behaviors. And those expressions are just so, like, obvious. Right. They're take charge kind of people, get it done live out loud, courageous, fearless in all the things. And she absolutely embodies that. But we've spent thousands of hours, it seems like, together via zoom and in rooms and just, like, getting to know each other. And the more I got to know her, I was like, I don't think you're a three. I'm not quite sure you're a three. And I've had some theories and all the things. And we knew you were going to come and do this on the podcast, so of course I send her another assessment and. And it's now something totally different.

Which is interesting. But looking at her assessment and, you know, I have read thousands of these and I can kind of see patterns in it and where you're very much like me. And this tells me how well rounded you are, because you're very familiar with the subtypes. Right. Instinctual responses to life. And next to trauma, that is the number one reason why a lot of you are mistyped, because these assessments can't really take into account a lot of that stuff. And you're the only other person besides me that I have met that for the subtype stacking, you know, the self preservation, the one on one, and the social. You are dead even on all three, and so am I. Which means that you're very well rounded and you've done a lot of work. A lot. And you can pretty much communicate with everyone.

Yeah.

Which is very true for what you guys. You know, she. She's a business coach. She does more than branding and business, but she seriously will take people on the journey of the entire thing. And because she is so in integrity with who she is, how she shows up in every aspect of her life. She is your girl for sure. But that really, like, I was like, dang it. Like, this Enneagram thing, though.

Seriously, it's keeping me up at night because this is such a powerful tool you've been using it. You're married to an enneagram one. Her husband, for sure.

He's a 100% one. Yeah, we know that.

Yeah. And we believe that her daughter, who's 8, is a 7 on the enneagram. And I would probably 100% agree with that with all the time I've been able to get.

She loves you. She loves. She's like, oh, Tracy, I'm coming upstairs.

I love it. And so where does that leave sweet Amber? All right, so I'm gonna kind of take you through the process of, you know. And you. And I, like I said, have privately questioned and asked lots of questions, but I'm gonna kind of take you through some. Some of the journey. Cause I don't know a lot about, like, your childhood. And I think that for most of us, you know, the enneagram is part nature, part nurture, and then part, like, childhood. Learned coping mechanisms depending on our experiences, the environment, the situations we were put in. And I can kind of change the expression of our core type, for sure. And knowing what I know about you, I'm still kind of holding firm in what I believe here, but I may be wrong here. So this should be really interesting. And I might be the first time stumped in my life. Who knows?

It wouldn't be off the realm of possibility that I'm the person who doesn't have an enneagram type. I'm always the person. Well, Therese, it's like canary in a coal mine, people. The anomaly. The business. Coach, poet, like, division one athlete, captain of the soccer team. Like, introvert. I mean, wants, you know, you know, homeschooling. Homeschooling mom, like, okay, yeah.

And then stand on stage in front of tens of thousands of people. No problem.

Right?

And then put on the hoodie and the PJs and call it a day. Yeah, yeah. This is making even more sense to me, though. And we'll be able to unpack what that looks like. So where did Amber first get her start in life? You grew up in the Northeast?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I grew up north of. Well, not. Not that far north of Boston. Families from the Boston area, but also immigrants, you know, so like, first generation German, Greek, Scottish folks right off the boat. My grandfather, one of. One of the most, you know, just amazing revelations that I've put together in the last few years. My grandfather and his brother left. His parents went and got them, but they left Germany to escape the. The Hitler Youth regime that they were going to be, you know, just indoctrinated into. And the parents didn't want that. And they escaped and came. Got on the boat. And I just like that all that blows me away to think, like, one generation ago, my ancestors were on boats, and we get upset about not having WI fi on a freaking plane. Like, give me a break, you know. So, yeah, so that was, you know, definitely, like, survival mechanisms in place. Surviving Great Depression, you know, coming over here and trying to start from scratch. Right? Like, that's really the story, the identity of much of my family. So I grew up in Reading, mass. For about 10 years. But really one of the more important parts of the story, and I'll just share that this is a story about sexual trauma and abuse. So for anybody who's listening that doesn't want to hear that part of, of my story, please just fast forward through. I was sexually abused as a 3, 4 year old. And my honestly, really, truly earliest memories, and then I testified in court when I was five. So I was literally standing in a courtroom telling my story in front of a grand jury and ultimately made the decision. And I remember because it was just like, it was so traumatic, the court stuff. I mean, the trauma is, the trauma's the trauma, but it's like listening to the Attorney General, listening to all of them saying to my mom, like, she's not going to remember, she's not going to remember. And I'm like, like hell, I'm not going to remember. I remember everything. Like, don't talk to me like I'm a child. When I was. But I mean, I, I was, I grew up in a, in an instant. And I felt this sense of responsibility for kind of like everybody, you know, the emotional, the weight of just like what my mom was going through because I watched the, what she had to grapple with in feeling all of the grief, just, oh gosh, all that. And then on top of that, my cousin seeing him and realizing he might lose his dad and just feeling all of this responsibility at such a young age. My emotional intelligence and awareness as a young child was so insanely evolved. Most people don't believe me when I say it. They're like, this is you projecting that? I'm like, no, it's not. I was a five year old and I remember literally standing in front of a room full of adults, all of them staring at me, just remembering, like, I don't wanna say words that kids aren't supposed, little girls aren't supposed to say. I don't wanna tell this story again. I wanna be done with this. And I remember shaking, but remembering my mom had taught me the word courage. And I just knew I had to find it and I knew I had to do it so I could get out of there and go back to my life. And so that was really, like, that was the beginning, Tracy. And then, you know, I was in therapy, you know, up until about Ani's age, until I was about 8. And I remember saying to my mom, you know, I remember being at therapy and like seeing the other kids that were there because it was like group so that we get to like, have like playgroup and feeling like, so bad for the other kids because I was like, they are. Their situation's worse than mine. Like, I'm okay. Like, I remember just thinking, like, I'm okay. Like, I'm literally fine. And I was angry. I definitely was an angry kid, but I was angry because I didn't want to go to fucking therapy and I didn't want to be in court anymore. I just wanted to be a kid. I didn't want to talk about it. And of course, like, that was part of my anger, you know, like, that was a real thing. But legitimately, I just wanted to kind of like get on with my life, you know. And I was very blessed to have parents who, who believed me. A, thanks to behind me. B. Yeah. And I know that's not the case for everybody, so I have an enormous amount of compassion when I talk about my story because I was very privileged to be in a situation where I had parents who could, could respond, you know, My mom literally was an entrepreneur. She had a photography business. She was highly, highly successful. She sold her business because back then she couldn't go online. She couldn't. She. You know, and she wouldn't, you know, my mother wouldn't.

Right.

And of course she was like, you. Oh, makes me just cry to say, like, she's like, you are my dream. There was no, nothing, nothing that mattered.

More than you when it came to how, like, it all went down. Obviously, you know, you thank God you have the parents you do and you were able to speak up even as a three year old. Thank God. Three, four year old.

Yeah.

And speak it in your memories. Because you and I grew up very, very early myself include. I have very vivid memories, clear as day when.

Yes.

Same kind of shit, right? Do you remember when you were going to tell your parents, part of you concerned about how they may receive it?

Well, the way that I told my mom was by drawing. So I was drawing weird pictures as a little, like little, little kid, right. And my mom was like, what's that? And then I started telling her and then she just like, oh my God, you know, what is happening? So there was almost like this realization kind of that happened, like, oh, I did something wrong or bad. Like, oh, I didn't know. I just was being a kid, I didn't know because how could I have? And so I think that there was some historical perspective that was happening for me in that, like 4, 5, 6. I was like feeling almost like I remember thinking if I didn't say anything, then none of this would ever happen. Because part of what happened was my mom's family abandoned us. They didn't pick us. They didn't pick this Team Amber.

Team Amber.

They didn't. They went the other way.

Wow.

And so I felt the weight of that, like, watching my mom literally lose her mom, my grandmother, like, lose her family, and then being villainized. And so then I carried that weight of that pain for my whole life. Like that feeling of, like, being bad or like doing the. You know, and so that was. That was a big thing that definitely was like a wrecking ball through my life for years and years and years and years that I did not really have a sort of a grasp on or comprehension of until I was really in my 30s. I mean, I definitely went through an eating disorder in my teens, up into my 20s and stuff like that for cop. But yeah, that was. I definitely had a very clear awareness of many things. And I think one clear awareness that was very important to speak. But I wouldn't talk about it until, frankly, I was in the profession I'm in now. But I remember being a 5 year old one day, sitting on the floor, playing with my Barbies and feeling like God was talking to me and saying, this didn't happen to you for nothing. You are here to help other people. Like, your story will help other people be free.

It wasn't like a specific sentence. It was just like a feeling. And I was like, da, da, da. I felt it in my gut, like in my core as a little kid just being like, okay. And I visualized, like books. Like I was going to write my story, I was going to speak my story, I was gonna help people. Just had that visualization.

How old were you?

I was five.

I was nine when I had that exact same thing happen to me. And it was like I was on my b. In the rain, you know, after a whole drunken night at our house. And I got on my bike and the same kind of download, it was very clear as day. This is all gonna matter for something. Yeah. I promise you, child. This is all gonna matter for something. Do you remember how your dad dealt with it?

Well, the truth. My dad wanted to, like, go murder. I mean, he wanted, you know, and my mom just said, like, what kind of childhood do you think she'll have if she was never dad?

Thank God she said that.

Thank God she said that. Thank God she said that. Yeah. And, you know, and I think, you know, my dad has been. My dad's my person, you know, he's always been there. And we definitely had some challenges through my teen years and my parents and their relationship and all of this. That was definitely tumultuous for me as, you know, a very overly perceptive, emotionally evolved child that just understood the depths of everything. And also, like, in human design, I have an open solar plexus. I freaking feel everything. I can literally be in a session with a client, and I can feel them. I'm like, why did you stop breathing? Like, why are you holding your breath? They're like, what? You know, I can literally feel thing. And it's just part of. Just part of my ability, you know, And I am so, so, so, so sensitive. But thank God I am, because I know it saved me from many things. It's also. I've also gone through a lot of really, really challenging physical experiences, like reactions to things in surgeries, and I'm allergic to a lot of things. I learned that the very hard way, you know, so that's been. There's been a lot of trauma in my life with that stuff, like my physical body wanting to protect me. So, yeah, that is a big theme. But I'm very fortunate to have the parents that I have, you know, to this day. They're both just rock solid, and they have weathered the storms, and they've been always like, who they've been. You know, they've just been such tried and true people.

When you talk about the challenges that you had as a teen, do you think a lot of it was, you know, the compound effect of the trauma and the watching the family fall apart on your mom's side? And what were the challenges that you faced as a teen with your parents and with life in general, would you say?

You know, my parents didn't do therapy. Right? Like, they didn't. They didn't have the. I don't know what the word would be. Right. Like, there was something that kept them from going and doing that work for themselves? And there's a lot of reasons. You know, there's a lot of reasons for that. A lot. Mostly fear, but also, like, you know, resource ability, stories. They told themselves about it all. They're very resistant to doing that kind of work, and they did their work in their own ways. But why that's relevant is because I could see their suffering, and I could see the ways that their suffering then created pain for my brother and I, and there was nothing we could do about it. You know, there's nothing. And the thing. It's like, ooh, my little inner child's like, don't say that. Because what my mom would say, hearing me say that was like, I guess I was a terrible mother then. You know, like two going to eight. Right. So, so right. Like, and that there couldn't be further from the truth. My mother literally did her job to support us and to survive through really challenging financial circumstances and emotional circumstances that as an adult now and as a mother now, I just look back and I go, how did, literally, how did she do that? I don't know.

Well, she sacrificed her own kind of healing around it.

Yeah, for sure. For us, you know, for my brother and I, 100% like to create wonderment, to create, to keep the magic alive for us. She did everything she could. Like, I mean, dinner, dinner on the table every night while she was working. Multiple jobs, candles and music. Like, that's my mother, you know, like.

Oh. So I think there wasn't space for my emotional reality or experience. Nobody was asking me, how do you feel? Nobody wanted to talk to me about that. And I was just, would not, I was not gonna do therapy or anything like that. At that point. I was just the angry teenager watching my so called life in my bedroom, writing in my diary.

What do you think the anger was about?

I was angry that my parents were just not happy. You know, I was just like, I wanted it to feel better. I wanted life to feel better. But I think at that point, you know, I had really started to implode on myself around like the self hatred. So it doesn't even matter if my mom and dad got happy. I hated myself at that point. Like by 15, there was a lot of momentum around that. The eating disorder started. Soccer was my therapy. That was my outlet. That was the place where I could achieve. I held myself to such high standards. My parents would say, you can't play your sports if you don't make the honor roll. And I would be like, in my head I go, yeah, high honor roll, like bring it. And I would just challenge myself to achieve because it would give me that hit of feeling good, you know. And I hear my mom talking on the phone to her best friend and saying, bragging about me saying the things that I did. So it was like I knew I would get love in that way if I. If I accomplished. And so I learned that little equation, Tracy, Right? Like, I learned that equation of achievement. And I worked it and it worked, you know, to help me get through those really, really hard years.

Okay? It's all making sense to me right now. So this achievement, like you said, it was a formula that you figured out and so would you agree that a lot of this, like, honor roll. Yeah, bring it. High end. D1 athlete. Yeah, bring it. High end Captain. Yeah, of course. With the big C on the jersey, Right?

That's right. That's right.

Do you believe that that was more to have certainty that you would have what you needed rather than. That's not necessarily about significance for you.

Not at all. I. I literally. It's so funny because now as an. I don't give a shit.

Which, you know. You don't.

I don't. I literally don't care. And I remember feeling in the last few years, I'm cutting ahead here. Second. But it feels important.

Love it.

Saying like, I don't want to be an enneagram3. Like, I would take the test again because I didn't feel resonant. I didn't. I did not feel a resonance where I was like, I can do three, but I don't feel like I'm a three. Because then I experienced threes and I was like, oh, this does not feel good. Like, I would never.

Oh.

I won't want people to feel this way in my relationship with them because it's not actually what matters to me. I'm not interested in competing with people. Now, look, if you put me on the soccer field, you're the same way you put me. Like, I'm gonna crush it. I'm like, I have a game at 9 o' clock tonight. Which is like, somebody said to me, like, are you insane? I'm like, girlfriend, you're gonna be on the couch and I'm gonna be scoring goals. Like, let's go. It's so fun to me. Right? It's my joy of joys. But like, remember we did that Shark Tank thing? Yeah. I don't give a shit about that.

I don't either.

I'm like, okay, I'm just gonna cheer for everybody else. And there's not a horse in that race for me. I'm not interested in that at all. And it's not cause I'm wimping out. It's just not what I want to do.

You are so not a three.

I know. Thank you for saying that. You are so not a. It felt like an identity crisis of.

Being like, I happens all the time.

I am not that.

And you can be that, but I can be same. That's why I was mistyped as a three as well. Right. Okay.

It's like a convenient label to put on people who can. Who have the ability to achieve stuff. And look, there's nothing wrong with threes. We love you guys. You guys are freaking rock stars. And I'll let you, like, go ahead. I mean, unless it's on a soccer field, but otherwise, like, go make all the money. Go do. I'm going to be there clapping and cheering for you because I think you're.

The center of attention. Go be it, please. Right? Please. Okay.

Because that's not what motivates me. It's not being the center of attention. Actually, it's the least motivating thing.

Me, too. Me too. And this. I'm very proud of myself right now because I freaking nailed this. And I knew it. I knew it. I knew it. I knew it. So for the people, when you're at your very best and feel harmony in your body, mind, and soul, what is going on in your life?

I'm, like, watching people grow. Oh, it makes me cry just to talk about it.

I know it's your gift.

It's like, it's not about me, but, like, I know that it's. I have to be there, right? Like, I have to show up for my gift, but it's not about me. It's like, I just want to see people, like, not suffer, you know, I want to see my parents, like, see how amazing they are.

Yeah.

I feel that way about all my clients. It's like.

It's so obvious. It's so obvious. Like, it oozes out of you.

I cry, too, a lot, guys.

So same. You've learned to let yourself know that that's okay. So do I now.

It's real. Like, this is real. You know, Like, I can't talk about it without getting really emotional.

I get like that, too. And that took a long time of, like, letting people see the vulnerable parts of me.

Oh, yeah, you little Ate you. Yeah.

And also, you know, because you and I are a lot alike in this way where, you know, we take huge responsibility in what we have been called by God to do in this world. And to know that those experiences that were horrific that we live through, we definitely take the responsibility of having that matter for something very seriously. Almost over responsibility for a big part of our life. In those eating disorder years that you and I both faced. And when you aren't doing so great, it's very rare now because you catch it, because you're committed to growth and excellence with compassion. Like, there's a difference between excellence with the whipping stick of shame and guilt and ego. And then there's. You and I both confront the harder parts of who we are, sometimes with compassion and honor. And love. But when that's happening, what is going on that you tend to show up in the world with, when there's kind of the darker cloud kind of hovering.

To clarify what is happening for me inside, when that's.

When I'm struggling, like, internally and behaviorally, would you say?

Yeah, it's like I'm. I'm obsessing in my head a lot, right. I'm like questioning myself. Did I. What did I do wrong there? Like, how could I have done that differently? What. You know, that kind of like going back over that. Like feeling that. Like that stomach drop feeling of hurting someone's feelings or something. Like, what did I miss? How did I. Oh, it's so not in integrity with what my intentions are. So that feeling of.

Being made the bad person in a way. And I will just turn the volume up on that. So hard on myself. That's just an easy way to go, too. It's over responsibility. And then I think it's just hard for me to show up. I just get really quiet. I can't. I don't know what to say. Like, I'm not able to be in. I can, you know, I can show up for my clients.

That.

That's really, like my family and my clients, my friends. Like, you know, there's. You push a button, I'm there all the way in forever. I mean, this has been a really hard year for me, Trace.

Like this.

This year has been a really challenging year for me. And I would say when I look back over it, my clients didn't feel that. My family and friends didn't feel that I was riding the wave of feeling depressed and anxious. Like, back and forth, worrying about how I was going to do it, how am I going to show up, how am I going to have the energy? My body's broken down after miscarriage and failed IVF and putting my body through hell with all of that and all the grief that goes with it. So I think I just kind of. I'm hidden away and I'm not showing my face. I'm not talking as much. I'm not in my. It's almost like God's not speaking through me because God's just trying to get to me because I'm all hidden.

What would people tell me is the best part about being your friend? That's tricky. Not really, I can tell you.

I mean, I think that they would say that I. Like, I'm all in for them. Like, I show up for them. I love them. It's like they never have to question that. Yeah.

And I will say, as your friend, one of my favorite things. There's many favorite things I have about you, but, like, the safe place that you are, the no judgment zone. Just the wisdom that you bring because of your own. Your willingness to go first and all the things. And I just love you first and foremost. I know why we met now. I've known this, but now I really know. On the other side of this, what would your friends tell me? I haven't experienced this part yet, but what would your friends tell me is the hardest part about being your friend?

I really move fast, so I'm, like, onto the next thing. And I think they would say they wish that I could see what they see, that they wish that I could. Like, that part where I can obsess and worry and, like, is it enough? Am I doing enough? Is it like that? When I will sort of tell them that that's happening for me, like, the worries. I think that they would want to give me back the gift that I give them and just say, like, you're good, you know, and, like, the questioning of myself thing that I tend to go into. I'm sure they wish they could, like, backfill that for me.

If I was sitting around with Ben and Ani and your family and some of your close friends. If you were to leave the world tomorrow, what would you hope they would tell me that they loved most about you and learned from you here on your time on Earth?

You had to say ani.

Oh, well, she's. She's our. She's your biggest teacher, for sure.

I just. I hope that they would know that. That they can trust themselves, you know, that. That they are so loved and that they just. Their life matters.

God, I'm so blessed to call you friend. Seriously, thank you so much for doing this. And I know you helped so many people with just your vulnerability and honesty and wisdom and just your willingness to show up fully. And when it comes to the Enneagram, I nailed it on our last conversation for sure. And I knew it. And all the things that you said today really embody that. I think I may or may not have told you this before, that I believe that the divine highest power, God, Jesus, you know, whatever you guys out there call it, I call it God. I think you do, too.

Yeah.

They were that person. That spirit is an enneagram. Nine on the enneagram. And so are you. And I get so emotional because it's. Nines can be really hard to pull into their light because they're all about harmony and having the environment and the people in their environment feeling good. And I think that's your true essence. And then, you know, throw on the experience that you had that gets even more magnified in certain areas. And then the rebellion later, which I'll kind of tap into. But the Enneagram 9, when they step into their light like you have. And our mutual coach, Tim Story, he's an enneagram9 too.

Yeah, yeah.

I like it so much. Makes so much sense, right? It's like this divine knowing and you have the ability as the nine on the Enneagram, they're the kings and queens for sure, because they don't necessarily need the spotlight, but they can see things in a way that none of us can. Like I use my nine wing a hell of a lot, but I'm still not opera. Like, I'm still fire. Like I will go in hot and burn the boats and everything later.

We're so. We love you so much.

We love it.

We love that fire. It's amazing.

When it's healthy, it's great. But the nine, like, I can care deeply, but you may not always feel that because I'm always in the challenge directly. Right, right. As an eight, the challenger. But the nine, you never question how much they care because the delivery of their caring deeply, even when they challenge directly, feels like a beautiful, safe, inclusive, nonjudgmental, safe hug always. Even when you tell somebody to fuck off. It feels really good.

It does.

And this, the subtypes, even though you're stacked pretty evenly, I think that the Tim stories of the world, the you's, the Jesus of the world, fall into that more social subtype, which doesn't look like your typical 9. It does not look like the, oh, I don't have an opinion. Oh, I'm just going to keep the peace. The reason they're called the adaptive peacemaker is because there's a difference between making peace and keeping the peace. An unhealthy nine is a peacekeeper, which means they will sacrifice their opinions, their thoughts, their feelings, their self care. They'll sacrifice everything in order to keep the peace. But it's their passive aggressive way to be controlled. You're in the body triad. So the eights, nines and ones, they're all instinct, which you are. Yeah, you are pure instinct. And that's why the three never resonated with you. Even though you can feel deeply, it is at an instinctual gut level. Yeah. It's not necessarily in your heart first. It's in your whole body. And it's probably why your body has broken down at times. Because you and I, I think eights, nines and ones specifically, we struggle the most with our health because we have spent a lifetime instinctually and especially with the experiences that you had and I had. We internalized a lot of it, whether it was for self protection or to keep the harmony or whatever. But being a peacemaker, I mean, think about Jesus for a second, like care deeply, no question about it, but would call shit out, no problem. Which is you. Yeah, I mean that is you to a T. But the social subtype, I think that that's probably the dominator, but you have the ability to kind of float through the self preservation, the intimate experiences. And the friendly social nine counter type is the one that doesn't quite look like the, you know, fly in the side of the wall kind of person. Because this 9 leans in and participates fully in life, often taking the role of mediator or facilitator in groups. Big shocker right there. Just like Jesus. Just like you. And you have learned to put your own issues aside and maintain a front to avoid burdening others. And you make sacrifices to meet group needs. Yeah. That is who you are. And then, you know, the experiences, of course, accentuated that you take comfort from feeling a part of things in a broader group or community. You work hard to keep the people in your life happy. And you know, this is where this nine can look very three like. Because this nine runs the risk of becoming a workaholic a lot of times to kind of hide the pain or stress. Now on the flip side, this is also why you don't feel like a three. Because when you're growing and when it's something that matters to you, you can turn the three button on because that's your growth number.

Right? Right.

And you don't like the three. Like you said, like we know that they find their worth in that and it can be and feel kind of icky and feel like we're just a pawn in their part of things. But since you're not motivated, like a three. But when you are using the other components of the nine, which are your wings and even the stress number in a healthy way, it's why you can hit the accelerator and crush people. But it doesn't matter to you necessarily, like for your whole being.

No.

Right.

No.

So that nine in you definitely will always, if, if left to your own nine ways, you will seek harmony over pretty much everything. If it's just left to your nine ways. Right. But that's why your wings are so powerful, too. This is why a 9, especially the more social 9, when you utilize your wings, which you do so elegantly. And this is why we're friends, because you can respect my eightness, because I'm a healthier version of it, because we both. We complement each other. Because I have a nine wing. You have an eight wing, right?

Yeah.

So the nine, like, this is how I explain Jesus on the Enneagram. Like, Jesus is all about making peace and everything's for the greatest good, right? Which is you, like, what's for the greatest good? Now, if Jesus just kind of operated like that, you know, all hell's breaking loose, right? And the hooligans are out taking. Taking over. And they tried. But when you lean into your one wing, I call it the Sheriff. When the harmonic nine, just like, this is all good, you know, I'll kind of go internally and be in my body and just turn off my feelings, right? But you've got this filter of the one wing, and you're married to one. This also makes sense why you're married to a one. Because you respect it, even when it annoys you.

Because the sheriff's in town and they're the straight shooting, calling bullshit always. Like, there's no gray area with the one very little. And so, thankfully, when the nine in you wants to just make peace, keep harmony, the one's going, I'm calling bullshit. I'm calling bullshit. This is not okay. This is not okay. And I think that one is, as a little girl, is what said, you know, this was wrong. And even if you did it in a way, through pictures, but then you. You still leaned into. Like, this was wrong. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Now, the nine and the one don't necessarily want to do anything about it, though, you know, because they like to call it out, but they don't like to be on the front line and have people mad at them necessarily, or, you know, anybody to challenge them. They just want to, you know, drop the mic and then leave it there, right? Like the one.

I mean, that feels the best to me.

Of course it does. Drop it and go.

I'm like, it's okay. Everything's fine.

Okay, bye. Yeah, but this is where the gift of your eight wing comes into play. Or having a good friend. That's an eight, right?

Because what would Tracy do? Get a little bracelet?

Okay, this is when. And I see you do this like you did it as a little girl. Like, this is when. Like, no, it's time for the fight, and I'm in it and I'm not afraid. And I will take whatever comes my way for the greatest good. And because it's right.

Yes.

The greatest good is your nine. The what is right or wrong is the one. And then let's fucking go is eight. Like, bring it, bring it. And I'm not afraid. And because the 8, 9, and 1 are all rooted in autonomy and independence, can you imagine when, like, the three of those are working together? No wonder you can easily push to the three.

You got the army of independence. Not just.

It makes so much sense. My whole key thing I used to say to my parents when I was a little kid, Trace, you'll love this. Was, don't tell me, mommy. Don't tell me daddy. I did not want anyone to tell me what to do, and I stand by that to this day. I still. It's like, it doesn't work. So my team has a label for anything that I am going to create. They don't put dates. They say OTF on the fly because I can't schedule when my downloads are going to come, when my clarity is going to come, and I'm always right on time. But I just don't even try to tell me when it has to be done because my challenger comes out. And then I literally will purposely not do it at that time because I'm so irritated at being told what to do.

That's also a nine thing. And, like, where I can get very aggressive with that and really, like, bite back if somebody tries to put restrictions on me or it feels controlled. Like, even, like, I can't ever plan content. I can't.

Neither can I. It feels contrived to me.

And, like, we're being controlled. And so this is where the eight can, like, be very aggressive and explosive. The nine in you is a little more passive aggressive in how you do it, but you still don't want to be controlled. And even though you might not be as, like, cut and explosive as I am, you still will procrastinate.

Oh, yeah.

Be stubborn. Pretend, like selective hearing a nine. Definitely.

My inbox, I was like, oh, there's a lot of things in there. Okay, let's.

Let's go look over somewhere else, right? Yeah, let's go do something different, you know? And the thing that you said about your physical body's always protecting you, that also is a very nine thing. The root chakra. But one of the things that you said about when you're under stress and even the need to achieve, like, I was like, okay, but it's not rooted in significance, which, you know, a three is. It was. It gave you certainty that everything would be okay, which is very six. Like, which is your stress number.

So it is my stress number. When you told me that everything clicked in because my dad is a six. Mm. And my dad is the guy who will say about everything and anything. Well, make sure they aren't gonna scam you and make sure they're gonna. It's like constantly. I'm like. Literally, the things he'll say. I'm like, what? Like, I don't even understand how you could think that that was gonna somehow get me in trouble or keep. You know, like, this will just make you wanna cry. When I drive home for my soccer games, I play on Monday nights and I drive home and it's always dark. You know, it's. My games are between 7 and 9pm and so my dad always wants me to call to tell him how the game went, but that's just because he wants to talk to me till I get home to make sure I made home safe.

Oh, such a six thing.

Oh, my gosh.

I know.

It's like the most loving thing, but the six, for me, it's like the money fear stuff comes up. It's like survival stuff comes up. That would be the thing when you ask the question about, like, what would your friends say?

It's that, like, enough, worst case scenario.

Worst like, you know, imagining. I remember early in my entrepreneurial career, Trace, and maybe every entrepreneur feels this. But this one day, I'm like, everything was going great and I'm standing in our. I remember our master bedroom. I'm like, you know, I don't know, probably almost a year into the business doing well, and I had this overwhelming feeling of like, we could lose it all. Like, it's all on me. That's it. There's always this it's all on me thing, this weight. Like I have to be able to do everything. And I'm responsible for everybody's survival and my family's, you know, and that. That's like where I could just completely go down the drain.

Yeah. And like, what you said about obsessing, the questioning, the. How did I not see that one coming? That is all six. I'm curious, though, with your dad, because my best friend is a six as well. And I remember when we were first, like, becoming friends because the sixes incessantly question. And the nine and eight in us, that feels like we're being controlled by all their questions. Like, don't you think I have this Figured out.

Well, yeah.

Or. And I remember at first, like, I would be a little aggressive back. I'm like, what the. Like, seriously? Do you think I'm an idiot? Do you think I don't know what's happening? But when I understood that she was a six, I re. I recognized that that was her need for certainty, and it wasn't about me, even though it felt like I was being controlled. Are there moments that you and your dad have gone, like, toe to toe? And also because it's your stress number, I'm sure it gets amplified even more when you're not in the best spot. Plus, Dad's incessant, like, I gotta know all the things part comes in.

Yeah, well, I think I. Because I really understand it all now. I can just immediately know that's what he does to feel certainty and to feel safe. And so I just. I'm already in compassion. But when the questions begin, because I just know to expect it, so it doesn't trigger me really, at all. It does make me laugh, though. I'll be like, dad, what? I'm like, how did we get there? I'm like, oh, my gosh, I love you so much. And I'll. And I'll joke back, and he's like, what? You know, it disarms him a little bit.

Yeah.

And then I'll just go, dad, don't worry. You know, whatever. Da, da, da, da, da. I'll fill in the gap on whatever the thing is, and I'll go, like. And I'll share all the ways that I've thought about that thing. I also have a team member who's a six. I used to feel exactly what you said. I'd be like, oh, you don't think that this launch is going to work? Like, you think we suck? Like, you know, I wouldn't say that to her, but we did have a sort of jovial conversation about it later, once we all learned about the Enneagram. And I was like, oh, my God, James. I used to think that you thought that we, like, we're gonna fail. And then I learned that was. You were. Actually, that's your way of protecting us. And I'm so. I celebrate it. It's always like, I'm so grateful, Jaime. I'll be like, tell us what we haven't thought about because we're over here, like, our little generator selves. Like, green means go.

Yeah, tell us.

And I value that in her, and I celebrate and praise that in her on our team, because she does bring that dynamic for us.

Man, do they keep us out of a lot of trouble too, because we are so in our body that we don't always use our brains. And those sixes are more cerebral than probably. Well, the fives can be too. But I was helping my friend. She was doing a live in person event, and I was kind of in my eightness, kind of just handling shit, and she was frantically spinning, and I was washing something in the sink, and there was like a glob of cream cheese, you know, that I just hadn't washed down the drain yet. And she was obsessed. I'm like, okay. I'm like, you and your sickness need to get out of my face. Cheese. I will get the cheese. But I know, like, when you are in stress or feeling overwhelmed, I'm like, that, that's me.

I'm like, there's cream cheese in the sink, Trace. You know, like, this something is not in the right place. And I can go there. I can absolutely full body go there. And I just have had so much experience in watching my dad. I also have a client who's a six and he's a man. And so he brings. Oh, you can imagine, right? I'm like, all of his worry, obsessing, cycling, patterning is a mirror for what I grew up with with my dad. And so it's actually very healing. Cause I'm actually getting to, like, work with him, but it can trigger me in moments. Right? That's. That's like the beauty of being the coach that we are. It's like you get to see, like I've told you, my mom's a two, but she spent a lot of time in her eight as a kid. And so all the eights that I was getting, all the eights in my life were triggering the hell out of me because they're reminding me of. Of my mom in her stress place for my, like, most of my childhood.

Well, I'm hoping I bring a new element to the.

You do? Yeah. Well, and what I love is like, the eights go to two. And so it's just that's been such a healing thing to learn and to witness and to, I think for me to settle into this nine ness that really, when you said it, I remember feeling like this peace apropos, right? Like this feeling of peace and this at homeness and this like, oh, gosh, I don't have to do that three thing. Like, I don't have to be that. Like, I can have fun there, but I don't have to, like, do that. Oh, my gosh, What a relief.

Right? And, you know, like, nines have the ability to look like all the other ones. And ironically, on your little assessment that I had you take, you'll be surprised. Like, you popped up as a seven, which.

It doesn't completely surprise me because they're visionary. They. Anything's possible. And you very much. But, like, your top four scores were all, like, one point away from each other, which is, you know, can happen a lot, especially with a nine, with somebody who's done as much work as you have.

It's like, when I take the assessment, I'm just like, oh, I see what they're doing here. Like, you know, you can. You just see the whole. The whole pattern of it. And I remember when I used to take it, I would want to answer it because I thought that I had to be that. Right. In the older days. Right. And in the last, like, couple years, for sure. I mean, you see it in our mastermind. I just sit in there and I just go, oh, my gosh, what am I? How do I even. How am I even in here? And then, you know, when Chris says, that's such a kind thing, but it will. It just reverberates for me. Like, Amber is. She's, of all the people I've ever known, like, one of the most solidly in her integrity of who she is, what she believes, like, what is right for her. You will never shake her out of that tree. And, you know, he's tried as my coach. He's. He's. Chris is a 3 to the nth degree. And he sees the possibility. He sees the win lane. He sees what that is. And then I'm like, I don't like that, though. Like, that doesn't. I can't push that button, Chris. Like, I know what you're saying. I do understand that that would win, but I can't because it's just not who I am.

Exactly. Me, too. Me too. And, you know, your conflict styles, like, this is another thing that comes into play. Like the ones, the threes, the fives, are all about, you know, being competent.

Yeah.

And if it's out of integrity for you, you don't give a shit about competency.

No.

The reactive types are the fours, the sixes and the eights, which you might get like that under stress, but not in general. And so the positive outlooks are the twos, the sevens and the nines. And you very much fall in that, I think, even when things weren't great and even through, like, this last year, like you said, even though it was hurting. And you allowed yourself to feel that. Your clients didn't really feel it. Your husband didn't really feel it. Ani didn't really feel it. But you did. And I felt you.

Yeah, I did.

I get it. So how do you feel being a nine sister? I think it's awesome. You're my favorite.

Yeah, it feels like home. It feels. I feel like it's exciting, Trace, because it's like I didn't really learn a lot about the nine, you know, I didn't really know too much about the nine. I don't have that many nine clients either. I literally can only think of two that I've had. I have one right now who is she absolutely is. And it makes a lot of sense. Well, I will say this, right. It's like I can see how it's difficult to make as a coach to encourage a 9 to take action on things very hard. And so I've seen that in myself this year in ways that I'm not running from what I'm afraid of anymore. I'm only creating from a place of what I'm being assigned to do. What's my divine ascent when I'm being called into. And this year there's been so much like, I wanted to do it the three way, like, let me go. And then it's just like, nope, the message keeps coming. Nope, nope, nope, nope, nope. And so in some ways, you know, again, like, there's no place for ego with me. Like, I just. It's like a non starter. I just literally don't care. It's not motivating to me. But I think there's a part of me, Trace, that's felt a lot this year, like, why don't I care more about wanting to achieve the things that I'm supposed. I'm using air quotes, you guys, supposed to be achieved. Why don't I. What is wrong with me? Am I broken? What is happening? And this year it's like, no, you're just. It's about peace. And I think it's the ultimate, right? It's like I've spent so many years trying to cultivate peace for everybody else, and it's the first time this year where it's like you get to actually be at peace in who you are and what you were born to do and to create here and what you were born to share and like, how you're. How you're meant to share that gift. Like, that's. That's the ultimate. And so I'm really letting myself Be with what that looks and feels like.

And this is the beauty of being in that body center of intelligence too. I remember it was like four or five years ago. My therapist was like, you should practice that this date. And I was like, I don't practice, honestly. And I think that you'll understand this as well. And it wasn't necessarily about dating, but it's even the saying yes to the things, the, the winning lane that it doesn't feel right. I mean, Chris says the same thing to me. I mean like, I get it. I'm not stupid.

It's like, why are you doing one to one coaching? I'm like, right, because I love it. Because I love people and I want to help them. And did you hear me cry about it earlier? That's why. That's why.

Here's the thing that I said to my therapist and she never challenged me on it again. I said, listen, I know what I'm doing and I know that if I spend my time doing what isn't for me, I will miss the opportunity to step into what I know is. And I think that's what you're doing. And it's what we as instinctual people that have honored not only the process, but the calling and the experiences that brought us here today. It's why you are a frickin amazing mom, wife, leader, friend and coach. And my God, we are all so blessed to love you and learn from you for sure.

Thank you. Trace, I love you so much. And I'd say the same back. I would say the same back, sister. What a gift you've given me today. So just thank you so much for all of this.

Thank you for trusting me with this, you guys. She's got a podcast, the Amber Lilly Strom Show. Definitely check it out. She has interviewed some crazy people, popular people. But I like her solo episodes. Quite honestly, just learning from her wisdom is definitely where it's at. She's also doing a workshop that is starting next week. You guys will want to learn from her. It's free, isn't it?

No, it's actually paid. It's a three day situation. And there's a fourth bonus day that you can add on if you want to. That's all about business. But it's called Dream into youo 2022 and I'm bringing you through my truly. Like my. My process sounds so cheesy. Like my signature process. No, just like the shit that I do every year to dream into the next season of, of living and giving and growing and expanding and Evolving and loving and it's, it is strategic. Like there are some granular things that I do that are very, very powerful. It's like, how do you, how do you arrange your space to support where you're going? How do you arrange your space to support you energetically? How do you think about time? Like I just taught a training on time bending. How do you think about like what are we reimagining in your life that is going to move you in a quantum way closer to how you want to experience your life and yes, I mean like earn an income, show up in your work, show up in your message, all of those things. So it's a three day situation basically it's like the container of that week and you can head on over to my website, amberrelation.com and right on the top bar of the website there is a little thing you can click and you can head over to that page, learn all about it. You decide if you want to join or not. And it's going to be an experience. And it's like for me, Trace, I just go, look, one of the most important things you can do is review where you've been in a year and really dream into and really like cast the vision and put it on the page and commune with yourself there. Because what's going to happen is second you put down the stuff that you want to dream into, all of your blocks, all of your fears, all of your, all of your resistance gonna come up and to me, because I'm masochistic that way, I friggin love it. I'm like, oh yes, this feels terrifying and hard. Amen. Because this is now my chance to grow. And so I love when that happens. And that's what I'm trying to actually catalyze in people. I want you to get honest with yourself because the second you do that, the closer to freedom you get. And it's like, let's just walk through the fire guys. Like let's stop holding back and literally like torturing ourselves and the people in our lives with these broken stories that have us as these abandoned, wounded, orphaned, broken little children. That's not who we are. You're a fucking genius. Like you are here to expand into the fullness of who you really are. That's what your purpose on this planet is about. So like let's take this year end exercise seriously because it's a really powerful launching pad into what you can create and how you can change the course of history not only for yourself, but for the people that you Love in the process.

You guys, spending three to four days with this beautiful soul seriously will change your life. And the beauty of her being a 9 is she can see the bigger picture in a way that a lot of these online business coaches and even in person business coaches, they don't have the view that she has. This is why when she's a 9 and in her greatness, that nobody can touch her. Nobody can touch her or help you like she can. Please go to amber lillystrom.com along the top it says Dream into youo 2022 Workshop. Go do it. Go do it right now. I trust this woman with my life and I trust her with each and every one of you. I want you to step into 2022 as the ultimate leader in your life and in everybody and everything that you're here to do. And I know that you heard how passionate and emotional she got about hearing and watching people grow. Like, you know you're in the right spot when you're in the room with her. So please go. I love you, girl, so much.

I love you so much. Oh my gosh, you're making me cry again. Thank you, thank you, thank you. And thanks everybody for being here for this very vulnerable, powerful conversation that we had today. What a gift.

You guys, if you love this episode, give us a screenshot, share it on the gram. Let us know what you loved about it. I'm sure there's a lot of nines out there that really, really needed to hear somebody who has stepped into it and quit making the piece and now brings it to all of us in a way that is for them, for us, for everybody we touch. So I just love you, girl.

Thank you, honey.

I love you too.

I'm so happy you enjoyed the leadership of Formula Podcast. Please help us spread the word about this show by sharing it with a friend and leaving a written Apple podcast review. If you have any follow up questions to this episode, you can DM me directly on Instagram at traceyomalley. You can also find additional resources on my website@tracyomalley.com I'm excited to lead you into the next level of your life.

Sam.