Deuterium Demystified: Everything You Need To Know About Deuterium Depleted Water (DDW), How To Lower Deuterium & Much More!

On this episode of the Ben Greenfield.

Fitness Podcast, electromotive forces are what's important inside your cell and not gravity. And so it makes you really change the physical nature of what that cell is.

And that's what we want to do. We want to make our own deuterium depleted metabolic water so we're not so reliant on other forms of water, because.

That'S the difference between being healthy and sick is your ability to deplete deuterium and be able to make the energy.

As quickly as health, performance, nutrition, longevity, ancestral living, biohacking, and much more. My name is Ben Greenfield. Welcome to the show. Well, welcome folks. I have gotten a lot of questions about this stuff called deuterium depleted water or ddw. So I decided to go to LA and actually visit a center that specializes in deuterium depleted water and all manner of things related to using deuterium depleted water to address health conditions and also address deuterium buildup in people's bodies. And if you have absolutely no clue what that means, and if deuterium sounds like something Marvin the Martian from the old Looney Tunes cartoons would have used to power his spaceship, then have no fear, because my guests on today's show are going to fill us in on all things deuterium. They're from the center for Deuterium Depletion in Los Angeles and I'm going to link to their center and everything we talk about in the show notes today, which are going to be at BenGreenfieldFitness.com DDWPodcast that's BenGreenfieldFitness.com ddwpodcast now before we jump in, I want to introduce my guests. So my first guest on this podcast is Dr. Ann Cooper. And Ann earned her doctorate in chiropractic from Cleveland Chiropractic College and since then has been involved in functional medicine. She has a Master's degree in acupuncture and traditional Chinese medicine and she has a host of credentials. She's a licensed esthetician, if I'm pronouncing that properly. She's certified in clinical nutrition, applied kinesiology, functional medicine, energetic medicine, herbal medicine, and her day to day involves training, communicating with patients, with chiropractors, with naturopaths, with acupuncturists, herbalists, nutritionists, and she is also very well versed in this concept of deuterium depleted water. My other guest is Dr. Kay Collins and Kay Collins is a leading scientist. Am I pronouncing your first name correctly?

By the way, I left it you're going with the Spanish version.

Q. Q. Okay. Q. So Q. Collins, he's a scientist, a leading scientist in the realm of developing nutritional and metabolic therapies to treat cancer in people and in pets. He has a Ph.D. in clinical immunology on Ms. And oncotherapeutics, and MA in experimental pathology and BS in cancer epidemiology. And he is the co founder of the Signature Health Metabolic Clinic. Is that correct?

Correct.

Okay. And that's the first clinic in the world to use deuterium and deuterium tracing technologies to help people with metabolic disorders like cancer and diabetes and autoimmune disorders. And he's also involved with the Keto Pet Sanctuary, which is a big ranch outside of Austin that uses the ketogenic diet to care for dogs, particularly dogs that have cancer. And he's also the principal investigator for the Epigenics foundation, which is a not for profit organization created by a couple of friends of mine, Tom Bilyo and Ron Pena of Quest Nutrition, to promote research to prevent disease and maximize quality of life and improve physical performance. And so between Q and Ann, I feel like I've got a pretty good firepower of knowledge here to delve into all things deuterium. So we are passing the mic. We're passing the mic. I'm recording this show while I'm on the road. So Q and Ann, both between them, have one mic and I'm selfish. I've got my own personal mic. And so they're going to be kind of passing the mic back and forth and filling us in on deuterium. And that's exactly where I want to start. Which of you would like to fill me in on what deuterium is? Ann, you raised your hand. Yes, I raised my hand or kindly volunteered like you.

So this new word that you're likely hearing is deuterium. Deuterium is a form of hydrogen. The difference between hydrogen and deuterium is that deuterium has an extra neutron, which makes that atom twice as big and twice as heavy. Since water is made of hydrogens and oxygen, deuterium can replace regular hydrogens to make water. The difference is that it's called heavy water, meaning the size and the weight of the deuterium atom can have a lot of effects when we are overloaded with deuterium loaded water on a cellular level, it does affect our mitochondria, the size and the weight of the deuterium. So we have been studying and focusing on deuterium, and we've come up with tests to measure deuterium levels. And we just really want to share our knowledge with the world so that they can understand what deuterium is and how it can impact or affect negatively our health.

Now, to my understanding, the mitochondria to a certain extent, produce ATP by passing electrons through a gradient within the. The mitochondrial electron transport chain. And part of that gradient is dependent upon hydrogen ions.

Yes.

And from. From the very little that I know about deuterium. Apparently it gums up the machinery, so to speak, because the deuterium is so large compared to the hydrogen for that specific part of mitochondrial energy.

On a physical level, that's correct. Inside our mitochondria, we have many thousands of nanomotors. We call them tiny motors, and they are rotating about 9,000 rpm, faster than a Corvette engine. And as they're rotating, they're producing the ATP, which is our cellular energy. However, we've also learned, once we all studied the Krebs cycle, or the TCA cycle, which is inside the. Occurring inside the mitochondria. It has various steps and along those steps, hydrogens are replaced by deuterium levels if there is an overload of deuterium in there. So our body has many natural mechanisms in place to protect our body from those deuterium taking over the hydrogen spots. We've also learnt that it's really a hydrogen recycling plant, meaning we actually make our own detune depleted metabolic water inside the mitochondria.

When you say we've learned, or I guess since you're Australian, we've learnt.

What.

Do you mean, who's learned? Where's the research on this? Where has this been viewed in terms of a laboratory setting or in terms of actually assessing this going on on a cellular level?

Yeah. So this is interesting. There's been four Nobel Prizes given for this. The last one was two years ago on the nanomotor itself, the first one given in 1937 for one of the pathways. So in addition, so not only exist, but we've published about over 100 papers which a lot deal with how these things work. The biggest contribution, I think, that we've been able to move this forward is that it's not a discussion within the scientific world about deuterium and how it works, but what we're being able to do by inventing these new tests to measure deuterium inside the body. Now we can take it to that level of understanding what it means clinically, and we weren't able to do that before, so there's a lot of papers published on it. In every place from Hungary, from Gabor Sommelier, which is one of the founders of the center, and of course Laszlo Bors, another founder. And I do believe that those two will end up getting the Nobel Prize. And I'm not kidding when I say this for their discoveries because it's so important to metabolism and how metabolism works. It's fundamental. We were very into, Laszlo was very into it first just looking at metabolism and we've actually started as a metabolic lab just looking at how glucose metabolism work. And then lo and behold, over the years we've understood more and more and more about how that, about how metabolism works and how deuterium's the fundamental part of this. You actually even talked about electron transport chain. And the interesting thing about this is this is all connected. Everything is connected so precisely. So when these nanomotors break from high deuterium levels, it even stops the electron transport chain and you start to get this buildup of charge inside the cell. So it's always. Everything's connected.

What would that buildup of charge actually cause in terms of downstream deleterious effects?

Well, there's a. We believe one of the things that messes with cell integrity and membrane integrity. The other thing it does, it changes electro. Electromotive constant of that cell. And I'm hopeful we'll talk about how electromotive forces are what's important inside your cell and not gravity. And so it's, it makes you really change the physical nature of what that cell is.

Is there anything else that deuterium does? I mean, could it like build up in joints or brain tissue? Like is it just the mitochondria thing?

No. So indeed this is what's so amazing. Think of the tear as hydrogens as the things that hold everything together. There's nothing in your body not held together by hydrogen or hydrogen clouds. So it's just like having Lincoln Logs or rector set. When you replace the deuterium hydrogen with the deuterium, it starts to change a three dimensional structure of all things. And so when we look at diabetes and we think of insulin and receptors not working, it's because deuterium has changed the shape of that molecule and it no longer fits that key, you know, that lock and key. We have also seen that allergies and autoimmunity is related to deuterium because it changes the structure of that bone or changes the structure of that piece of muscle or thyroid. And your body sees it as being formed because it's got the same components, but the three dimensional structure is different. And that's what immunology is. Immunology recognizes simply three dimensional structures.

Wow. Where, where's this dirty little bastard coming from? This, this, this deuterium. Because it's, you know, I'm sure people want to know how they're getting exposed to this.

Yes. I would like to point out that as hydrogen deuterium is natural. It occurs naturally in our environment. There's just many, many more hydrogens than there are deuterium. In fact there's a around 150 deuterium atoms to 1 million hydrogen atoms. So it's natural, it is not a toxin and it is required to a certain point. But to answer your question, the dirty little nasty thing which is natural and we need it has increased in our environment very, very much over the last, over time. But more particularly over the last few decades, it's more heavily in our foods. Deuterium is heavier in carbohydrates, so sugars and starchy foods. And it's just in our atmosphere more and it's in our water, it's really increased in our drinking water. In fact it's, I don't want to say it's almost impossible to find not un deuterium loaded water on planet earth anymore.

Now is this like radiation from post industrialization or the Fukushima disaster? Is this like herbicides and pesticides? Because I've heard of that before. Like, like what is it that change that would be causing, Is it, is it that we have an increasing knowled the awareness of deuterium that we're diagnosing this more? Is it that it's actually like there's more of it?

There's actually more of it there. Even the simple things like climate change and the warming of the planet is allowing most of the deuterium was sequestered in ice and in the polar ice caps and that's where it was a lot lower 50,000, 60,000 years ago or anything that Ann just brought over the table.

What is this ball that you just brought over the table?

It's, it's called the zebra stone and this is the real thing. But it's 600 million years old.

That stone is.

Yeah.

And if you look in this stone, it's so old that this is before we had ox a lot of oxygen on the planet. And it's also before when deuterium was all trapped. And so the deuterium levels in this is a lot different from the deuterium levels that we have today.

Means lower.

It is, it is different. You know, again we have, it is it is different because that's one of the ways they measure ice. When they measure ice, we always, you always see them take the big cores out. They actually measure the deuterium inside that ice to see how old it is. And so it's not carbon dating, it's actually deuterium dating that you use. But deuterium has gotten to our. It is, not only has it gone up because of the processed foods and things that we eat now, but in like you were talking about the glyphosates and all these things are synthetically made. And when they're synthetically made, they're made with hydrogen molecules or, excuse me, atoms. But the hydrogen they use is deuterium because deuterium is heavier and easier and cheaper to get. And so that's the things they combine on these glyphosates. And that's what ends up being the thing. It poisons a plant. Because it is that concentration, it's able to actually act as a poison. Oh, and GMO foods. So deuterium is fantastic. And it's needed, as Ann said, because it makes things grow because it keeps your DNA open and it allows proliferation to continue. So when you see GMO foods, the reason GMO foods grow faster is because they have a lot of deuterium in them. And that's the reason that we, we go away and say they're not great.

How does the deuterium get there? Like, is it the process of genetic modifications?

The process, genetic modifications. And they're being able to have a plant that they didn't, they didn't select for, but it was the selection process did it to where it has more deuterium built within the structure of that plant.

Okay, has somebody done this? Has somebody taken like GMO fruits and vegetables and non organic versus organic produce and measured the levels of deuterium?

Yes, we have, we're going to publish a paper on it now. But yes, there is a incredible big difference between the two. And there are. And then it's also, you got to remember, it's also differs from all over the world, right? So you can get an apple one place, an apple another place has different deuterium levels because the deuterium levels are different across the planet. They're highest, they're lowest in the north and south poles, highest at the equator, lower in higher elevations and higher in lower elevations.

Deuterium is heavier. So it's too heavy to float that high. So when you're living in a higher elevation, you're not to going at least breathing in so much deuterium, which doesn't mean everybody has to leave the beach. You can still enjoy where you live. We just give you. And not just determine depleted water. We really focus on various deterrent depleting modalities, which are lifestyle. To manage people's deuterium levels, we just have mod techniques to get it down quickly so that then people's own natural mechanisms for managing deuterium can kick back in again. They've just been overloaded and we're losing that function. But we're here to help people get it into a good place. But along the way to also teach them that you can manage this yourself and really have the power for the rest of your life to manage your own deuterium levels without needing us.

Yeah. And I want to get to some of the things that you could do to lower it, but that kind of begs the question, like in addition to consumption of GMO foods or foods that have lots of herbicides and pesticides on them, are there in addition to that lifestyle practices that we're engaged in now that we weren't so much some time ago that would also lead to higher levels of deuterium, like anything related to breathing, sleep, sunlight, like any of these type of things.

So yes, what we really love is everything you do, Everything you do is a deterrent depletion. It revolves around that. And so that's why we're so excited about being here. So things like biggest problems that we. The basic problems are our lack of sleep and not getting enough deep and REM sleep. Obvious why.

What happens during sleep that we complete.

When you get rid of deuterium during deep and REM sleep, is that related.

To the glymphatic drainage thing?

Well, the glymphatic drainage part is one of them. The glymphatic drainage allows you to get rid of the waste. But when you don't have enough energy, that's when it stops opening. And that's why you see a lot of problems when you have like glioblastomas and a lot of traumatic brain injury. There's not enough energy from those from. There's not enough energy to open up the glymphatics or the lymphatics. And so you see this start to see metastases and things like that. Yeah, and REM sleep is very important because REM sleep is where you burn up all the carbs and you go into ketosis at night. So it's so very important.

That's interesting because a lot of people are super focused right now on deep sleep and what can I do to increase deep sleep? My deep sleep percentages aren't high and I've said this before, it's like don't discount the importance of REM sleep, but I didn't realize that about what occurs during REM sleep in terms of. How did you describe it? Not deuterium depletion, but it's the REM.

Sleep'S responsibility to put you into ketosis.

Yeah, ketosis. Yeah. Like, like. So substrate utilization shifts when you're in REM sleep.

Yes. And that's, and that's the reason you will see a person that's on a ketogenic diet doesn't need as much REM sleep.

Interesting.

So these are all the kind of things that's fascinating together. So you can start and why you. So therefore a person that's really doing a keto tight diet was very tight. They don't need to sleep as much because they don't need as many REM cycles to get the carbs and to get the ketosis. They're already there. So a lot more goes into deep sleep and repairing. And that's why it's a very, very anti aging diet that seems like it'd.

Be difficult to measure. Did people do like indirect calorimetry tests whether in a sleep lab to measure the substrate utilization during sleep or something like that?

That's one of the things we did before. Again using carbon 13 glucose, we can measure metabolic pathways but we can actually also now look at just. And that's what's great about the Oura ring and the Fitbit watch. And you can see some incredible things using these tools and then comparing heart rate, heart rate variability. And we can, we, we do all these things according to what your deuterium levels are and we can change those things around that you can lower and raise your deuterium levels and change your sleep just by itself. It's so, it's a, you know, it's just so easy. But sleep breathing, as you've mentioned, breathing is another thing that we've lost as a culture and what I mean. Or as a people. What I mean by that is we now breathe faster. We breathe through our chest and stood through our diaphragm. And oxygen is so very important because the oxygen goes into your tissues, binds deuterium first and removes it from your body. So it's, that's the whole idea between. Breathing is so important. Yeah.

And oxygen won't get into the tissues unless there's a certain level of carbon dioxide present. You Know, this is, for example, related to Patrick McCown's teachings and the oxygen advantage, or Anders Olson is another good author in this area. And, you know, if your, if your exhale is very short and shallow and you don't have these long, relaxed exhales, you're breathing off a lot of carbon dioxide. And when you retain carbon dioxide, the oxygen dissociates more readily into the tissue. So theoretically, that could be kind of like a deuterium depletion strategy. Very good.

That's. That's one of our biggest. Well, Ben's gonna put us out of business already.

Yes.

It's one of our basic things is to teach you with the mask, we have a special mask we've made of how to retrain and to be able to swallow that little piece of carbon dioxide. And that's going to allow you now to be able to release oxygen to your tissues. And, and we're able to measure it simply by how long you can hold your breath on exhale.

Wow.

And it's very, very, it's very.

Hold your breath on exhale.

That.

That's Patrick McCallan. He calls it the CP.

Yes. And so all these things that people are doing, that's what we're so excited about. We just can't. We say, we always say, we don't invent anything. We just make everything that's invented better.

What's a good score that you like? If somebody just does a passive exhale.

And holds a minimum of 45 seconds. Yeah. And then we, you know, we. When you get the 60 over 60 seconds, you're superhuman. That's really fantastic. But we don't see that the average person is below 30. It's. It's not good.

And, and that, that is, that's not a forceful exhale. It's a passive exhale. And you also can't hack it. You can't do like a breathe up beforehand because, I mean, when you breathe up, you can hold it all.

We've made videos for our clients so that they can really learn how to measure it properly and to do it properly.

And by the way, even though I'll link to it at BenGreenfieldFitness.com DDWPodcast what is the link for the deuterium depletion Center?

DD Centers.

DD Centers. Okay. DD Centers.com. now, before somebody begins the type of deuterium depletion protocols that you guys utilize, and we already talked a little about sleep and breath work, but I want to talk about some of the other things you guys do. I would assume you need to test somehow, like test what your deuterium is. And I went to your website before this. I noticed there's a bunch of tests like an air test, food test, water test. What is the best way to test and why are there so many different kinds of tests?

The first test that we do is called the determinator test, and it comprises of two tests, which is one is called the breathy, where we collect the condensation that's coming out of the heart and lungs, the chest area, and we'll measure the deuterium, and that's essentially what's in your tissues. And then we'll either also measure the saliva or urine, and that's an indication of how well or unwell somebody is able to remove or deplete their own deuterium level. So we're always comparing those together.

Okay.

And the others ask. A lot of our clients like to test their well water. So they'll send us a sample of their well water so that they know what they're consuming. And then we can help them work with that by incorporating or diluting that with some deuterium depleted water so it gets to the level.

That's why just well water.

A lot of our clients have wells.

Okay.

But a lot of people like to test whatever water they like to drink.

Yeah. Have you tested like, major brands like Gerald Steiner and Pellegrino and some of these folks?

We've tested many. Many, yeah.

Are any of them, like, low in deuterium or really high end deuterium?

Some are higher than others, but sadly, it's pretty hard to find low. Determine water around, commercially or naturally.

Okay. So you can test for water, you can test your own breath for your levels of deuterium. And what else?

A lot of people like to send in foods that they like to eat to find out if that's okay. Like, some people have a protein shake that they love and they don't want to give it up and they want to drink it every day.

So just please don't tell me ribeye steaks have a lot of deuterium.

No. What's important about any. Yeah, what's important about. And what's great that you do is you hunt your own meat. Is the fat content of the animal has to be low or the whole part of it, the animal has to have eaten naturally because if they've been fed corn or soy, which is high in deuterium, that meat and fat is going to be high in deuterium.

So what about grains?

Grains in general are high in deuterium. So we stay away from grains and we make. Do I say something high fat? I mean the more fat that you consume, the more of your own metabolic water you will make. Now you understand all of the other reasons metabolically for consuming fats. But we talk about the camel. That's fat on their humps. It's not water because they are deterrent depleted animals. They convert that fat to their own metabolic water so they don't need to consume water. It will get them through the desert. And that's what we want to do. We want to make our own deterrent depleted metabolic water so we're not so reliant on other forms.

That would be via beta oxidation or the burning of fats as a fuel. A metabolic byproduct of that is going to be your own water that is low in deuterium.

Right. Every time you make ATP you make metabolic water. And as a matter of fact, you make about. I know this is going to blow your mind. You almost make 1700 liters of metabolic water a day. A day. You just use it and continue. You're really just. This nuclear power sub is really what you are. So you just use it, use it, use it and recycle, recycle, recycle. If an athlete, some of our professional Olympic athletes, they're making 3,000 liters per day and we can make those calculations. So this is, it's very. So that's what the tests are for. And the important thing I want to stress is that the terminator test is very important because it allows you.

That's the determinator test when you breathe to determine your own levels.

Yeah. You really breathe into it to see what's in your tissue. And you're able to use saliva or urine to see what your. What's in your garbage. Right. What you're casting off, the difference between those is what tells you if you're healthy or not. Not the level, but the difference. Because it tells you if you're still able to deplete deuterium. Right. The, the D factor. And that's the important, important part. So there are a lot of tests that are out there just measuring saliva and. Or measuring deteriorate. And we invented these too. Or measuring blood spots. We invented all these things. The interesting or were the first people to use them if we didn't invent them. Them. The problem with those, it doesn't tell you anything. Again, it's like wondering what's in your refrigerator. So you're going to go to the garbage to see what's in your refrigerator. It just doesn't work.

What do you mean?

It doesn't tell you anything because it simply tells you how much garbage, how much is being excreted, not how well you can excrete.

Okay, I got it.

And so indeed people always ask, well how. You know, we always call it D, the term envy. How low should I be or where should. And it's, it's really more complicated. The important thing is can you deplete it? Because that's the difference between being healthy and sick, between being young and old, between being a great athlete and not being a great athlete is your ability to deplete deuterium and be able to make the energy as quickly as you can.

You know, when you talk about ketosis or high level fat burning being something that allows us to produce our own deuterium depleted water and how good sleep and good REM sleep, good sleep hygiene could help that. Avoiding GMO and herbicide laden produce and foods could do that. And then also proper breathing patterns could do that. Why do people sell deuterium depleted water if we could just make it ourselves?

Well, we begin, we invented deuterium depleted water because it was really from a standpoint of cancer. Right. And what it was for. When you're a cancer patient, when you're a cancer patient, you're the most metabolically challenged you can. You have two type of metabolisms going on. You have a metabolism for normal cells and a metabolism for cancer cells. So that tear and depleted water is fantastic on making your normal cells healthier and making your cancer cells more dysfunctional. So that's the reason it came. We really started with it. However, it is a great biohacking tool. There's no doubt about it in for the short term. But what we try to tell people is that's not the right biohacking tool. It's enough to get you down into the zone that you want to be in. But then now let's fix the things that you need to fix. Let's, as you said, let's. Let's do some cold thermogenesis. Let's do red light. I mean my shout out to juve. Let's do red light. Let's do, let's go to osteostrong and work on your, your, the, the, the mitochondria in your bones. There's. These are the things that make you superhuman and give you boundless energy, as you like to say. Not the water. The water is just a tool, short term tool to get you where you want to be now what you really want to do. I know. I see that look on your face. And it's also to eat correctly, so your body starts to make more of the water, so you don't need as much.

Okay. Why would it be so effective for cancer?

Yeah, it's effective for cancer for several reasons. One is that the way cancer. Cancer is simply a normal cell. People always get this kind of twisted. It's a normal cell with a different metabolism. And one of the problems, the major problem is that the deuterium gets into the DNA and doesn't allow the DNA to fold anymore. So now the DNA is able to replicate and replicate and replicate. So by dupe and you also, as it goes on further, the cancer cells can't use the TCA cycle anymore. And that's the reason we talk about the Warburg. You know, we always talk about eating no sugars. And because the cancer cells require those sugars, because they don't use the TCA cycle. So by using deterrent depleted water, what you're able to do is jimmy the system to where even that sugars and those bad things now are deteriorated, more determined, depleted. And therefore it gets into the DNA, into the ribosis, and it changes that DNA. So the DNA now shuts down and becomes a normal cell. It can go through apoptosis. We always tell our clients we're happy. What we do is make a cancer patient well, and we make the cancer cells sick. And that's our goal.

What are some of the other things you guys do for cancer?

Well, it's. So we really work on everything. We really work on mitochondria. That's really what we do. But we have super friends after that. And what we mean by that, we're able. We have a lot of published papers where we've shown how ketogenic diets and deterrent depletion, deteriorating depleted water allows things like chemo and radiation to work much more effectively. We work with the. We just met with the hyperthermia center in Santa Monica. And so it's going to make what they do better. It makes all these things do better for two reasons. One, because people have a lot more energy, Their immune system is working a lot better. You're optimized, you know, even though you're supposed to be sick, you're optimized. And therefore you have the resiliency to actually stand the treatments that all these other things are going to do, whether it's cancer or diabetes or anything.

I didn't know there was a hypothermia center in Santa Monica, the biggest one in the country. Dude, that. That's painful. I did, I did that one time in Switzerland. The hyperthermic chamber to induce that, that fever that would be used to kill cancer cells. It's horribly uncomfortable.

Yeah. What's great is this is completely different technique here. Okay. And the technique here is use. It's used ultrasound to focus it. It's really, really.

They're just targeting the tumor.

Yeah, it's really great. I mean, in a combination with what we do and it's. It's fantastic.

Okay, got it. So did you want to say something in.

Oh, well, by the way, you are a very big instructor of deuterium depletion. You did ask what's changed over the last few years and you know, since I guess the 60s when both parents went to work, all the fast foods and the convenience foods with margarine and all of that came in as with the rising rates of cancer and Alzheimer's and diabetes. But I do feel like people have much more low grade chronic stress that's impeding them from having that REM sleep. So it is multifactorial, why it's risen. But I know that you're teaching a lot of things like being back in nature, which we've gotten so far from working in offices and things like that. So most of the things that you're teaching, really helping people to deplete their own determination.

Grounding, earthing, sunlight, swimming in the ocean.

Yeah, we essentially work with air, food, water, sunshine, and natural therapies. Night being outdoors, food, water, sunshine, and appropriate exercise. And the other ones are thought processes. So we have people, you know, listen to a lot of meditation tapes and things like that. And the other one is support systems from your family and friends that they're not going to handicap your progress.

What do you mean air?

Air is where we utilize the. The mask, which, particularly while you're consuming the water, you will be capturing your own exhale, which will be less.

Oh, that's the carbon dioxide you're talking about.

Accumulate some of your own carbon dioxide to trigger hemoglobin to release more oxygen to your tissues. And we also teach them the breathing techniques.

A couple years ago, I tweeted about a study that they did on that. That training mask, you know, like the one that looks like Bane from Batman, these Hollywood celebs still use to train for the movies or, you know, where to look kind of badass during their workouts. And the thing gets some flack because. Because it's not truly Altitude that it's simulating. I think they even changed the name from Elevation Training Mask to Training Mask. But the study was looking at the CO2 trapped in the dead space in that mask. And the fact that you actually increase tolerance to CO2 and acidosis when you rebreathe. When you're wearing that mask during exercise, your exhale, is that kind of similar, like something you could do at home?

Yes, we actually have a patent on that. But that's one of the things that we, we did come up with. But yes, that's exactly it. What's so neat about it? Most people don't understand that each night that you sleep, depending on where you live, you breathe in anywhere from a half a liter to liter and a half of water out of the environment, out of the air.

Especially in the islands, Hawaii. And if you're living in a very humid environment, we have a lot of Houston areas.

So by using this mask, what we're able to do because when you become deteriorative depleted, it's going to go from say 151 parts per million down to below 130. So you're actually drinking deterrent depleted water while you're sleep.

That's pretty cool.

So these are the kind of things we've come up with.

Now you're talking about ppm, the parts per million. Is that when you do a test what you're measuring parts per million of deuterium?

Yes.

So what are you looking for?

So again we will say this is that as long as you deplete it, you're cool. But if we see people and we're not, if we see people that are above 155 in their tissues or below above 150 in their tissues, we tell them to go to their doctor because they have metabolic dysfunction. They need to go see what's going on. Again, we don't, we're not doctors, at least we don't treat patients. But we actually want them go to see somebody about a disease. Now what we see with, with our healthier patients is anywhere from if you're an athlete, they can be down in mid summer or mid, like in mid season, they could be running in the 90s, but the average person, they're in the mid-130s. But then what you want to be able to do, what we're teaching them, and Dr. Cooper is really good at this, is that they should periodically, it's almost like you periodically drop down for a while to optimize their body and get it going and then they can get that big depletion factor, a D factor, and then go and have your cake.

Are there other not to throw you too much of a curveball, but I don't know if you know the answer to this, but let's say somebody's high end deuterium. Are there other blood biomarkers that tend to also trend high in correlation of that, like CRP or liver enzymes or anything like that?

So yes, that's we one of the things we do when we use our as far we have markers that we call our mitochondrial health markers. And so crp, we see the HRV changes, we see changes in ceruloplasmin and iron, we see changes in the ratio of lymphocytes to macrophages. All of these things do change, but they're all signs. What modern science thinks of or modern medicine thinks of is it's a sign of disease. But what we're trying to tell is really a sign of high deuterium levels, because if you change those deuterium levels, those markers will change and in time the disease will start to take care of itself again because you have more energy, because your biomolecules are shaped the right way, because you're now an ass kicking power machine.

So arguably, if you have like low hrv, high HSCRP and other markers of inflammation, white blood cell dysfunction, iron dysfunction and other markers of inflammation, possibly even like gastric inflammation, like lactoferrin or something like that, you could probably hazard a guess that you are high in deuterium.

There's very little doubt about it. And the question is where? And it could be tissue specific. Again, the one we use is a marker for tissues. Right. In other words, we measures what's in the heart and cardiac in the heart and lungs, but you can also have different deuterium levels in different places. And that's when we have an MRI where people can go to see the clouds that are in their body. But there's no doubt about that. You cannot have inflammation without having had high deuterium levels. Just can't. It can't work that way.

Okay, got it. That's the second time you've used the word clouds. You said hydrogen clouds a while ago. You just now said you're looking at clouds and tissue. What do you mean when you say clouds?

Oh, it's just the type of MRI that we use it. It's specific enough that you can actually visually see the clouds of deuterium.

Okay. So they'll show up as like, like white patches or white Specks. Okay, interesting. So this whole idea of deuterium depleted water, I've like had it at some of my friends houses before. They'll hand me a bottle and be like drink slow. That was like that's 12$, 16 ounce bottle of water you got there. And I've heard other people talk about deuterium depleted water generators. I interviewed Robert Slovak, really good podcast we did on water. He's very bullish on DW and this idea of, of you know, buying bottled DDW or using a DDW generator to make it. When it, when it comes to deuterium depleted water, is it really that simple? You just drink the deuterium depleted water and your deuterium levels go down.

We actually don't encourage that for anybody because it's really about doing all of the modules together like one plus one equals five. We don't want people to use water to treat a little bit of water as a crutch. We don't want people reliant upon it forever. That's a very expensive way to go. We use it initially and it's always determined via the information that we take from the clients and which PPM is most appropriate for them and how much they need to consume and for how long their protocol is because eventually we want them doing all of the other components. Because you're going to make water from the foods and the liquids that you consume and the hydrogen oxygens are going to come from the breathing technique. We encourage people to make their own deterrent depleted water. Eventually people are not consuming so much water. Man wasn't running around with water everywhere with them. They would have been eaten at the watering hole. They ate the organs and the fat first. And you know, they were just built the way they're supposed to be built so they're not. We don't require to consume much water. And that's what happens with our clients over time. Thirst changes and they don't need to consume so much water at all.

Now how much water from the get go like initially would you be drinking? Like every glass of water you drink is deteriorated water. You kind of supplementing the water intake with ddw.

Yeah. And again it's all protocol specific. If it's a cancer cancer, it's, it's really, you know, almost like def comm approach. If it's a cancer patient. We and we have everything calculated for DDU's. In other words, we know by your body size, the body fat, how many deterrent depletion units are in the water that you need to drink. And so we can make those calculations very precise. However, it's not as if it's for athletes or wellness. It doesn't have to be a tight because first of all, you're not as broken as a person that has stage four cancer and a person stage four cancer. They're going to be all their water is going to come in as deuterium depleted. For another person who is just a wellness warrior or weekend warrior or just wants to optimize things, then what we want to do is simply get them down and it might take not take as much water, but get them down to the range to where their body kicks in and they start to see improvements, whatever improvements they decide it's going to be.

So somebody could like order a D. Terminator test from you guys, find out their levels and then you're going to email them or get on the phone with them and tell them how much DDW that they could drink to lower their levels.

Yeah, we, we actually it's a we what we call our private health detective or personal health detective. They'll go through, answer some questions. It will figure out the perfect things for them, including modules and sunlight, trying to fix not only the health style but also the physical things they do and emotional things that they carry with them. We fix all those components and tell them what their protocol should be and then we measure as they go using the determinator how whether the relationship between the determine levels they have now versus the benefits they're seeing.

How often do you test like how soon do you see responses?

Well, you can drop deuterium levels within two weeks from the water. However, it takes about, really about four weeks at a minimum before you seeing biological effects of that. And more importantly, a person like you or a person that's an athlete and does all the things they're doing, you may not even feel the difference. Right? You may not. People ask me that all the time. Well, I didn't feel anything. Well, your body is a person that is the enemy that decides what to do with that energy. And it may be that it's rebuilding. It may be that you're now can use your lactic acid much better. That's what we find in our athletes. And so you don't get as tired. So it is really just the idea that, you know, this is not a question on if it's helping or not. It's just you have to determine what that help is.

Okay, how's this stuff made this deuterium.

Depleted water, deteriorated depleted water. There's a variety of ways it can be made. The most common one is, is on a distillation, a distillation tower that's about 70 foot tall and it's multiple distillations, hundreds and thousands. It's very electric, it's very electricity and power consumption wise. But you're just, you're just, you're really depleting off the deteriorate. You're really causing steam to rise and you're capturing the steam and then freezing it and turning it into deterrent depleted water.

Where are these towers?

There are towers that are, the one that we use more is Preventa and that's in Hungary, but they're all over the world.

Why did you go all the way over there?

There's 1 In the US there's not any, there's nothing in the United States yet. Well, the reason it, well, the reason that this became big was because it was from communist countries that had nuclear power plants or that were making nuclear bombs. And so they were making deuterium water to make bombs. And so a lot of the water that you're getting over here from Russia and Japan, from China, that's really where those waters are coming from, is decommissioned sites that made other isotopes interesting. The one that we use from, from Hungary, from Preventa is a GMP facility which is, they actually invented it to make deterrent depleted water as a drug. So it's approved by the fda. FDA as a drug at least to.

Go into trials now turning from water to food. Obviously we talked about how GMO and herbicide or pesticide laden foods are higher in deuterium, but kind of similar to the concept of like drinking deuterium depleted water to lower deuterium levels. Are there certain foods, whether those are herbs or spices or fringe Amazonian superfoods or anything like that that could lower deuterium?

Yes, I'm a herbalist. They're great plants. Essentially the chloroplast in the green plant is the mitochondria of that plant. So as our body does, it's always trying to protect ourselves from the deuterium getting in by pushing it away. The chloroplast pushes the deuterium away from the green part of the plant. It does push it into the fruit and into the roots. So therefore they are higher in deuterium. But green plants in general are low in deuterium. So we educate our patients about which foods are high and which are low in deuterium. High fat diet from natural fed sources. And we have, we go through a whole, you know, Consult with them. And we've made videos for them to have at hand that they can check in on at any time.

So the primary thing is dark green plants or I suppose even like algae like chlorella or spirulina, because those have a lot of chlorophyll, right?

Yes. To stay away from the roots. And also the underground vegetables, they're very starchy. The reason sugar really is bad for us is it's high in deuterium.

Because most of my carbs are like pumpkin squash, Pumpkin does go above the ground. Purple potato, yam, stuff like that we.

Would take out in the beginning anyway, until we test your D factor to see how well you can handle these things.

And is it because those foods are high in deuterium or because those foods are high in sugar?

Sugar is high in deuterium.

Now what about if you're an athlete and you're burning that sugar? Because like, if I were to cut that stuff out of my diet, all my glycolytic workouts would just go to pot.

And that's, and that's, that's so important because we have a lot of professional athletes and Olympic athletes. So indeed, when you start talking about different things, it's how you handle those things metabolically. Right. It's not a cancer patient metabolically, if you, the reason you put them in is to burn it. Now you even make metabolic water from glucose. You just don't make as much as you make from fat. So that's the important part. You use a high fat diet so you can make more metabolic water, more ATP.

Because that glucose from those underground storage organs in an athlete is pretty transient. I mean, it's essentially filling a glycolytic sink in the muscle and the liver as a very short lived time in the bloodstream.

Yeah. And it's the same as water for athletes. We talk about, we make a really big thing about our clients not drinking water. But athletes need to drink a lot of water. That water never gets into your mitochondria. It's used to dissipate heat. That's all. It's, it doesn't get inside you. So all your mitochondria filled up with metabolic water and feeding your body. And the other water is just on the outside in that garbage just to get rid of dissipate heat. So it's cool there. But it doesn't make a lot of sense for people that aren't athletes to be drinking 4 and 5 gallons of water a day. It just doesn't make any sense.

You guys ever Tested anybody who's following this new carnivore diet fad because they're not eating a lot of green plants.

Well, as we, we're actually right now doing a carnivore study with Paul Saladino.

Oh really?

Yeah. So it's.

So you have any results yet?

Well, even in our own staff here, we have the best results from them. One is a carnivore and one is a vegetarian. And they both came to us with a lot of ailments and they are so happy. They have completely translated, transformed their health. So it's not essentially, you know, it can be a vegan diet, it can be any kind of diet as long as they understand the deuterium load. And we just educate them so that eventually they can think for themselves. And initially we keep them in a deuterium depleted diet closely until their own natural mechanisms for removing. You know, you can have cheesecake or whatever later on, not in huge amounts, but that's because your body can now handle it. So for your children, children and teenagers need deuterium to grow. So after the growth spurt is when, you know, we don't want things. You're not going to grow up anymore. We don't want things growing out but in children.

So I get nervous by my friends who have their kids on like a strict ketotic diet or doing like, you know, day long water fasts. You might be inducing good knowledge of some spiritual discipline in your child, but they also might get their growth stunted and you know, have low bone density by the time they're 20. Yeah, yeah.

So that's our job, is just to educate people with all of these things and yeah, so they can understand it and they have this knowledge that it makes sense to them that they think in this lifestyle way. They're always thinking, oh, that's going to do this. We really just make the correlation between deuterium and the ability of your cells to make energy. And most people get it pretty quickly. You need cellular energy to perform all of the trillions of things like growing your hair and your heart beating and you know, when you can relate it to what they want to happen in their body, it's on the forefront of their brain.

And at dd, DD centers or DDW centers, at DD centers, if somebody gets tested, so they go to your website, they get tested and then is there like a program that they sign up for to go through with you to lower their deuterium levels? And what's that look like? Is it phone coaching or emails or what happens initially?

They have a phone consultation with me, the cancer patient, speak with Dr. Q. And we go over all the modules, we learn about them so we can tailor it to them. And essentially we set them off where they're pretty good to go. We give them this knowledge and a lot of them can learn how to live this lifestyle. But Dr. Kuhn has been focusing most of his time lately on patient portal.

I think that's what I want you to talk about. The neat thing is that we've really taken that biohacking attitude and we measure everything so that each patient gets their own portal. And with that portal, we capture all their data, not only their laboratory data and clinical data, but even healthstyle and lifestyle data to see if there's any relationship between their dysfunction or, or their function and their term levels and how they're living. And they can compare that to other patients and see what that other patient or clients, whether all the clients are eating or what the other clients, what exercise they're using. And we can explain to them why this works and may work for them. So it's, it's really growing. It hasn't been done before. So we're pretty excited right now. We use it as a clinical tool ourselves as a way to look at it, but we're actually opening it up so our clients can see it. So everything is data, everything is. This is not. I'm taking guesses. This is all data driven and you get to see it.

I appreciate that. That's a good approach. And you know, before I decided to come over here and record this podcast, I went to your guys website and looked into what you're doing. And I do appreciate how a. It's very lifestyle and natural living based, but then also pretty research driven. And this isn't, you know, just if you're pulling out your butts.

So it's. Yeah, I mean we always say we. This is more of a hobby and a mission for us and not a business. And so it's not about what we sell, but we're really doing. I guess if we're selling anything, we're trying to sell health and lifestyle. Because I've been doing this 35 years. This is the closest I've ever come to saying if we do this right, we can cut down on the names on the. Let people have better lives, cut down on cancer, diabetes, obesity, all these things, the calamities we're fighting. If people understood this and understood just a bit, these basic easy to understand concepts, the world would be a lot better off.

I'll say this for him, he spent his entire life researching and his goal is to really help ameliorate all these problems that people are going through. But what I would say is great about Dr. Q is he's a serious Western scientist. He was vice president of a pharmaceutical company that that made chemotherapy drugs. So for people who have received this pretty horrible, scary diagnosis, they're lost. They're getting advice or suggestions from everywhere. They don't have the knowledge or the scientific background to make these decisions. So it's nice to have someone who can go through them, the Western medicine, all the things and all of the other things that they can do that many people don't even know about to help them along this with good scientific validation and knowledge. And they can really put things together from both aspects.

Yeah, I dig it. Well, folks, if you're listening in, you can go to BenGreenfieldFitness.com DDWPodcast I will link to everything that Q and Ann and I talked about and then you can also check out their center@ddcenters.com I'll link to that in the show notes as well. And hopefully if you're listening in, you now have a pretty decent working knowledge of this whole hard to pronounce D word that everybody seems to be talking about with increased frequency these days. So, Q and thanks so much for coming on the show.

It's really enjoyable. Thank you so much. And you asked a lot of great questions that is now able to be shared. Thank you.

I try my best.

And I want to say that, too. I've been waiting for this because we've always Liz is a big fan and so, you know, homeschooled and everything. So you guys are like, yeah. So we're very excited you came and I hope that people understand. We try to keep it simple, but we any questions they have, just ask us.

Cool.

We're here.

Cool. Yeah. Leave your comments, your questions, your feedback in the show notes@bengreenfieldfitness.com ddwpodcast and until next time, I'm Ben with Q and ann from ddcenters.com thanks for listening in.

Well, thanks for listening to today's show. You can grab all the show notes, the resources, pretty much everything that I mentioned over@BenGreenfieldFitness.com along with plenty of other goodies from me, including the highly helpful Ben Recommends page, which is a list of pretty much everything that I've ever recommended for hormones, sleep digestion, fat loss, performance and plenty more. Please also know that all the links, all the promo codes that I mentioned during this and every episode help to make this podcast happen and to generate income that enables me to keep bringing you this content every single week. So when you listen in, be sure to use the links in the show notes. Use the promo codes that I generate rate, because that helps to float this thing and keep it coming to you each and every week.