How Sound Healing Works, Why Most Music Is At The Wrong Frequency, The Best Music For Sleep & Much More With Wholetones Composer Michael Tyrrell.

In this episode of the Ben Greenfield Fitness Show.

And I tell people this because I'm not going to sell somebody something they already have. There has to be integrity in everything you do, or everything you do has no integrity. Frequency as a whole basically has that same innate ability to be able to create things or destroy things. And so, in my whole search of finding optimum frequency, the first thing I had to do is figure out why there was something about music that bothered me. There is nothing that comes in dynamically that would have awaken or cause anybody to tap their feet.

He's an expert in human performance and nutrition, voted America's top personal trainer and one of the globe's most influential people in health and fitness. His show provides you with everything you need to optimize physical and mental performance. He is Ben Greenfield.

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Hey, folks. A composer named Michael Tyrell first appeared on this show in an episode called Unleashing the Phenomenon of Using Sound and Music for Performance, Recovery, Healing, and More. And in that episode, I describe how at a health summit, somebody handed me a book called the Sound of Healing, written by Michael, along with a handful of CDs that he had recorded. The CDs were called whole Tones, and they were described on the CD cover as music that heals, repairs, and protects against disease. Well, I was skeptical. I was also curious. So I sat down and I read the entire book, Sound of Healing by Michael. And then I started listening to these CDs while I was driving, getting a massage, pumping them out in the surround sound speakers in my sauna. And every time I finish one of the tracks, I had this really cool feeling of elation and satisfaction and relaxation. So I haven't got to the point where, based off of Michael's advice in his Sound of Healing book, I used a digital tuner to retune my guitar and retune my ukulele to the actual frequencies that Michael describes in the book, which sounds kind of woo, woo, but it actually made a big difference in the ability of the music I was playing to make me feel more uplifted and full of positive energy. So I did that podcast with Michael, and we talked about a ton of things, like why the music and the sound you listen to every day is not tuned the right way and could actually be destroying your cellular Function and how sound frequencies affect the body and water and plants, how to retune your own musical instruments if you're a musician. And the best way to use things like sounds and sounds therapy to. To heal your body. And Michael really does know a lot about this stuff. He's not only the founder of this company called Whole Tones, but he travels around the world to speak about music and sound therapy. And of course, he's a composer himself. He puts out these amazing tracks that me and my kids and my wife love to listen to whenever we need, like, relaxation or some kind of music therapy. I even take two speakers and put them on either side of a massage table. If I have a massage, like a massage therapist comes to my house a couple of times a month and gives me a massage, and I just blast myself with Michael's Whole Tones. Or more lately, Michael's new track called Life, Love and lullabies, which is six really beautiful songs. Each one is about 30 minutes long. And these are specifically designed to help relax you or to help you fall asleep or to stay asleep. And so I've been playing it in my kids and also for relaxing evenings in the infrared sauna. And I decided I wanted to get Michael back on the show, not only to talk about how music affects sleep and how sound affects sleep, but also to revisit some of the science and the research on sound and the human body and sound healing in general. So, Michael, welcome back to the show, man.

It's an honor, my friend. Love spending time with you and with your guests, that's for sure.

Yeah, I wasn't actually sure I was going to be able to get ahold of you because you're in Florida. Just got hit by hurricane the. The eye. Right. It's not Irene. It was. Was it Irene, Irma? Yeah, Irma, that's right. Irene was an old one. How are you doing?

Well, we're doing. We're doing great. You know, it's amazing how, you know, I call it pthd, you know, post traumatic hurricane disorder. Everybody just kind of walks around in a stupor after that. Because this time it was both kind of the. The end of anxiety and disbelief. Ben. Because we were supposed to get. I mean, we were supposed to be in another zip code. I mean, this thing was supposed to come in a four or five. And. And miraculously in our area, we got probably about a two. And though there's, you know, it'd probably take them five months to pick up all the debris. And yeah, there was a lot of stuff. I mean, ultimately My birdhouse was still in the tree when I woke up in the morning. I could. I mean, I don't want to. Yeah, I don't want to, like, downplay the storm because I'm a guy, and you would have done the same thing. I walked outside because I wanted to feel the power, and I got pushed five feet, like, just across the yard.

I mean, as guys do, we always have.

My wife. I don't even tell her because she'll go, what are you doing? Get in the house. And so, you know, but it was just the sheer power of a 90, you know, 90, 92 mile an hour sustained when you walk out. And it's just like if you jumped out of a car at 90, it's just you're there, you're gone, you're blown across the yard. But with all that being said, the wonder of God loving the little things. Like, there was still a little sparrow's nest in one of my trees, and my birdhouse that was not nailed to the tree was sitting in the branches. After all of this, the neighbor's roof might be gone, but there's a birdhouse in the tree. And I think the takeaway from it, bro, was that you can live in a neighborhood, but when you have a disaster, there's an opportunity for community. All of us got to know each other after the storm. I helped the guy next door cut down a tree with a chainsaw. People made coffee for other neighbors. You were forced because we had no power, no Internet, no phones, to actually meet the people you live next to and get to know them.

Yeah, that's a really good point. That. That and the fact that you don't actually need to nail down your birdhouse with 8 to 12 inch wood screws when you live in Florida, because God doesn't want to blow away the birdhouses. Hey, yeah, but by the way, I grew up in Lewiston, Idaho, out on a hilltop, where we'd get 70 to 90 mile per hour gusts, which aren't quite as much as you'd get from a hurricane. But my brothers and I on the basketball court used to hold a giant sheet and put on roller skates. And when the wind came, we'd roller skate around the basketball court getting blown with our giant sails. So that was our idea of fun. We didn't have we. Or what's it called, Oculus Rift back then. Just. Just sheets and roller skates. You know, I was actually just down in Sedona, Michael, and I thought of you because I, you know, Sedona is Known as, as like a mecca of sound therapy and sound healers and bodywork practitioners. And I literally just got back from there a couple of days ago and I did a sound healing session. The first time I've ever done like a full on sound healing session with a guy named Barungay. And by the way, for those of you listening in, I'll link to everything I talk about, including this Purungai guy I met. If you go to BenGreenfieldFitness.com lullaby that's where you can find the show notes for the discussion Michael and I have today. That's BenGreenfieldFitness.com lullaby Anyways, he had a massage table that vibrated and made sound from tracks that he was playing in the room. And, and he combined body work, like deep tissue bodywork with like the didgeridoo and gongs and crystal bowls and all these different instruments that he was using to basically just blast me with sound frequencies as he worked on my body. Have you ever done something like that?

Well, similar. And let me explain because most of your listeners may not be aware of this. But you know, it's really funny, Ben, that someone that was known primarily as a mathematician actually was the grandfather of everything that you've just spoken of and everything that I do. His name was Pythagoras and people don't realize that his main forte was music. And so he combined and converted everything in the same fashion I did. I didn't realize this until after whole tones with arithmetic, geometry, music and harmony and astronomy. And he created an instrument called the Monochord, which I am working with right now. And you will be hearing it on a whole Tones album and hopefully you and me will get together. You'll be experiencing it in the way you just experienced something. The Monochord basically is a unbelievable stringed instrument that has almost consonant sounding string vibrations. But the cool part is that it flips on a cantilever and one side is a bed. And so while you would be laying on that bed, for example, if you come to my house, I would be playing the strings underneath you and the whole entire bed vibrates at a particular frequency. And so to answer your question with a question, yes and yes, I'm working on that with the Monochord now myself, even though people will experience that both with whole tones chroma also, you know, because you have the light component there in your living room if you're watching it by DVD or Blu Ray. But in the same way we can resonate in a mode in a, in Several different modalities. Like, you know, the same thing. The singing balls blow a shofar right at my gut. You know, all different. And the bottom line is, is that we're all being crossed through and crossed into by frequency. And whether it's right now with you and I conversing and your listeners hearing the sounds of our voices, we operate on on two different frequencies ourselves. And so even while they're listening, they're getting touched by whatever it is that we are broadcasting organically from ourselves. So, yeah, I do believe there's a lot of benefit in doing that. I've never had that many things at one time, so I imagine it was pretty awesome. However, I do at the house, I have a few machines here, and like I said, I'm working with the monochord now.

Okay. It's called a monochord. Can people actually see a photo of this, like, online?

Yes, yes. If you Google Pythagoras monochord.

Oh, I see there's a video on YouTube about it. Okay, cool. I'll link to this in the show Notes for People. So you could lay down on this and actually get a massage on it too, huh?

Oh, yeah. They have chairs and beds, and there's even a place for your head, you know, both ways, whether you use the chair one or that one. And the patient. Like, all of this came from the Pythagoreans. And here's another interesting note. Plato was a Pythagorean. So people are always, like, saying, well, what do you think about this? It's like, oh, this is kind of as old as it gets as far as just. But he actually believed. This is what I love, that he actually believed and used it on all of the disciples, the Pythagoreans, if they had any emotional, physical, spiritual imbalances. And most of what he said was most of it was dealing with the soul of man, which is absolute truth, thought, will, and emotions. He would use this monochord. And these guys, they said they'd get off that thing, go onto their bed, and sleep eight or nine hours and then just be completely healed when they woke up. But his thing was arithmetic was number in itself. Geometry was number in space. Music and harmonies was numbers in time. And astronomy was numbers in space and time. And this guy was able to determine pretty quickly that everything. What Nikola Tesla said about if you could understand the magnificence of the 3, the 6, and the 9, you would understand the creation of the universe with that, is that he realized that everything was a balanced arithmetic equation that also would equate itself to the alignment of the stars and vibration. So if you look at all the whole tones, frequencies, Ben. I aligned them that same way. They all have the same harmonic component and they're also all. The denominator of each of those frequencies is either a three, a six or a nine.

Yeah. I actually want to ask you a little bit more about why the music that we listen to most of the time these days, it doesn't really fall into that. That healing modality that a guy like Pythagoras actually discovered. But it's kind of sad. Like a lot, a lot of the Pythagoreans, you know, who, who really were, you know, there are, you know, they were like the forefathers of. Of modern music as a medicine or modern sound healing. A lot of them got pretty brutally murdered, I believe, like, like kind of like wiped out by the government. I think this would have been. Where were they living? Was it Egypt? I think that the Pythagoreans were primarily based out of. I could be wrong. I don't remember Greek. Greece maybe.

But anyways, I believe it was Greece.

Yeah, Greece. Pythagoras actually decided to stop eating after that and went on a fast and then like on it was like day 30 or 40 or something that just basically died of starvation. It's kind of a sad ending to the Pythagoras era. But it's very interesting how this guy was like the father of modern healing, modern sound therapy.

Absolutely.

It's a really interesting story. And what I wanted to ask you, especially for people who aren't really even aware of how sound and how music can affect the body, is there any actual science or research out there on the effects of sound frequencies on something like a cell or the body or tissue or an organ?

Well, I'm glad you brought this up too, because as you can imagine, and as you said very succinctly, and you look historically, over time this drama has played itself out with everyone from Joseph. Well, let's use even a better example. Let's use Tesla, for example, and what happened to him with GE and every royal rife, every single person that you can think of that's been an innovator or kind of a gatekeeper of something new that the government couldn't get control of. They always are being persecuted. And in the same way, you know, people kept telling me, well, you can't say what you're saying, it's unsubstantiated. So I went about the daunting task of spending a month substantiating this very ideal and claim. And at the end of the day when I submitted 1200 pages to the government, the government said it's unconclusive. So yes and no. Are there studies? You can Google it too. You can see what scientists say about 528 hertz and its ability to alter the DNA chain. But you know What?

When push 528 Hz.

Yes sir, 520 on the album, it's called transformation.

Is that the Hertz frequency associated with the emotion of love?

That is actually, there's even a book entitled 528 Love and it's by Leonard Horowitz and it's a fabulous read and I think he's way ahead of his time. But yes, people do say that. And the reason they say that Ben, is because if you think of the color green, it immediately makes you think of the plant kingdom and chlorophyll and life in itself. And so you think about that as far as the nurturing capabilities of plants and their ability to give us oxygen when we give them nothing but carbon dioxide in return. So ultimately its main purpose though is a transformative or transformation. In other words, what scientists have said is that it can actually alter the DNA chain or diseased DNA can actually restore a lot of that. We also can remember we had this little conversation, you and I off the grid last time. But there's a Canadian scientist that used 528Hz to clear 1 cubic square mile of water that was damaged years ago by the Valdez spill. And there was oil and oil balls all over the water and he used sound to clean the water and one cubic mile.

That's very, very interesting. You know, I have, I have two things that I. Well, three things that I use. First of all, certain essential oils vibrate at, at a very, at a frequency that is. And I realize there's a lot of people who are like I'm going to stop listening. This is this complete woo woo. But I mean look this stuff up. For example, if you look at, I think it's blue spruce oil. It's either blue spruce or lavender. I want to say it's blue spruce though, which by the way increases testosterone when consumed orally. It also. And something I'll diffuse in an essential oil diffuser and also sprinkle in my sauna when I go in my sauna where I also play your 528Hz frequency. So I kind of get a doubling up effect with both the smell and the sound. But that vibrates at around that 528 cycles per second to affect physiological function in a positive manner. The other couple of things I use is around my neck, I actually own and wear this thing called a love tuner. And it's just a very, very small. It's basically like a tiny, tiny flute that you blow into. And I blow into this for my kids at night, for example, or when I want a little bit of an uplifting sound to listen to. And it's just a one single tone that I can blow into that vibrates at 528Hz. And then most interestingly, this is a very expensive device, but it's sitting next to me right now. It's a device called the nanov. And what this does is it exposes water to about a 528 Hz frequency. Because of what. There's actually some very interesting studies at UC Berkeley that show that when you bathe water in a specific frequency, it very similar to like homeopathic medicine can hold that frequency, like create clusters based on that frequency. And when you breathe that in, that water in, it actually affects DNA in a positive manner. Means specifically repairing DNA. Which is very interesting considering that DNA is kind of like a. Well, it's a computer program, it's a mathematical model. So it's really interesting stuff. I mean, obviously a lot of this flies under the radar, but there are studies like the effects of sound wave on the synthesis of nucleic acid and protein that have shown that genes can be switched on or off under the influence of sound simulations and frequencies. And like I mentioned, there's a lot of other studies that I'm aware of at UC Berkeley and also at what's called the Quantum Biology Research Lab in New York that goes into this stuff. So it's super fascinating that there's actual real science behind this idea of using sound or frequencies at a specific rate to heal the body.

Now what's funny, Ben, though, is that they're absolutely. Like I said, I gathered 1200 pages and I didn't grab 1200 pages from like alternate universe or some of the. What we would. What you would call, or the guests would call woo woo, information or pseudoscience. I gathered them from like the New England Nurses Society and major colleges and John Hopkins, and they still said it's inconclusive. So at that point you realize what you're dealing with. It's the same thing when you're doing clinical trials. So you spend the money, you do a clinical trial on whatever a consumable you know, or something you use, for example, or something that I do that's. That's audio or visual. And then at the end of the day, you spend all this money and you know what they want when you're done? More trials. Because there's money to be made in doing the trials. It's not that we don't want to substantiate, but there's a point where people won't receive substantiation when it's staring right in the face.

Now, what about the deleterious effects of sound frequencies on the body? Obviously, some frequencies would be damaging. There's a book by Dr. David Hawkins, who I've talked about before on the show. He has multiple books, but in one book, I think it's called the one called Healing and Recovery, he talks about how certain frequencies are associated with love and peace and joy. You know, love, like the 528Hz that we talked about. And then some are associated with fear and shame and suffering. Like when you get down below 100 hertz or so. Talk to me about modern music and the music that we listen to nowadays and how it is that the frequency is different and what happened to make that. So I know it's kind of an involved story, but can you kind of lay it out for people?

That's okay. And I also want to include harp while we're at it. In Alaska H aarp, there is a mill frequency, so there is what we would call more of a, you know, a wicked, if you wouldn't want to go that far, or negative use of frequencies just as much as there is, you know, on the other side, people that really desire to see spontaneous healing in people's lives be optimum and use the positive side of frequency. Of course, if we were talking about the Bible, there's one simple verse says the power of life and death is in the tongue. And the tongue is nothing more than a vibratory member of your body that. That we use to communicate as we are doing now. And that vibration is what actually causes us to be able to form the words that have intent. And so you can speak life or death. You can say things to people that you could say something to want to hurt somebody's feelings, Ben, and it could hit them, you know. You know what I'm talking about. I'm sure you. You've been ridiculed. And sometime it got through the grid and you felt it in your gut and you just went, oh, my God. Well, you know, that's a negative vibration, and they're powerful if they're focused and if people are receptive to them. So with that being said, frequency as a whole basically has that same innate ability to be able to create things or destroy things. And so, in my whole search of finding optimum frequency, the first thing I had to do is figure out why there was something about music that bothered me. I mean, I'm talking about as a child, as beautiful as music is, and I play several instruments, and, you know, I've been an engineer, producer, creator, composer for years, But I knew that there was something innately wrong with what I was hearing in our country as far as music. So after that long process, you know, over 18 years, before I even came close to releasing whole tones, one of the big, you know, rabbit's hole discoveries was is that our country and Canada tune differently than the other countries. I was under the assumption as a young person that everybody tuned music, that music had this universal tuning that the Note a equaled 440 Hz, or beats or vibrations per second for the listener, right?

Which would mean that, for example, when I was a kid and I took violin lessons for about 13 years, when I'd walk into my violin teacher's house, you'd have a tuning fork, right, for the A, and I would. And she would strike it, and I would tune my A to that chord. And for people not familiar with music, basically universally, you know, an A is an A, G is a G, and E is an E. And they all vibrate at specific frequencies. And you're saying that frequency is. Is, for example, for a 440.

That's correct. It's interesting, too. A lot of people do a lot of work, like you spoke, like cranial sacral work and stuff, using tuning forks. Thankfully, they've discovered that using a different tuning is more beneficial, which is where I'm going with this. And so my first question was, and it was a good one, and nobody could answer it was at a music store. I asked, the guy said, so why are these tuners calibrated to A equals 440Hhz? And it was, I don't have a clue. I don't know, bro. Beats me. And I kept asking that question as much as I could, and I never got an answer. And so I kept looking and looking and looking and looking and looking till I found militarization of music. And it was a kind of a blog about Joseph Goebbels. And when I read, for those of you that don't know, Joseph Goebbels was more or less the right Hand man to Adolf Hitler in charge of mind control and basically propaganda like, you know, setting up any type of leaflets or whatever to basically make the people believe they were always winning the war and, you know, that same type of thing. But mind control and how to affect the human psyche and the natural electrical impulses which adhere us to gravity. He tried to find ways of disrupting the circadian rhythm and the pulse and other things in order to be able to control. So with that being said, I suddenly found out that. That this 440Hz or 440Cycles was also nicknamed the German radio beat. And it was derived by Joseph Goebbels for mind control. And I'm like, wait a minute, that's the same frequency I tuned my guitar to and the piano, and where did it come from? So this is happening. The whole world is being assaulted by, by, you know, frequencies that could actually interrupt your sleep and make you an insomniac and mess with your wiring. And so I realized that only two countries in the entire world had adhered to Joseph Goebbels attempt during wartime, which I found fascinating. Ben, I would have thought there was more important things for him to channel his energy into than trying to convince the whole world to tune to A equals 440 Hz. But nonetheless, that was his mission, his campaign, which failed miserably, thank goodness. But the two countries that went along with it were the US and Canada. And so that's where our tuning comes from. And if you don't believe me, the easiest way to do would be to pack up your guitar and your tuner and go to Venezuela and have their band tuned to their tuner and you tune to yours and then try to play and tune together and you suddenly have this revelation. Oh, my gosh. People in every country tune their instruments differently and there is no standard tuning. And it was a mesmerism. And so all that to say that music in its own right, that we listen to a lot and even a lot on our playlist that's recorded in A equals 440 had its origin in a nefarious activity created by Joseph Goebbels to try to interfere with the human wiring.

Interesting, interesting. So based on that, when we are listening to, say, the radio and different bands from whatever edition cheering to the Yvette Brothers to Nine Inch Nails or whatever, what you're saying is most of them have tuned their A's to 440Hz, and thus the music that we're listening to is not necessarily as uplifting or healing as it could be, especially if we're already injured, sick, you know, bombarded by Wi Fi, Bluetooth, etc. It's not doing us any favors in that department.

You just knocked it out of the park. That's primarily what I'm saying.

Is it causing damage to listen to those frequencies, or is it just not as healing as it would be if it were tuned to a different frequency?

Well, let me answer that question this way. When I recently met Dr. Oz and spent a few days in New York there, and he made a statement that blew me away. And it's so like. It's so simple, but so profound. We were talking about whole tones. The new one, actually life, love and lullabies. And he said, I think this is going to really be something important. And I said, well, why is that? And he goes, it doesn't matter what supplement you're taking. It doesn't matter what exercise regimen you have. If you don't sleep, Michael, you can't heal. It's impossible. And that was it. I realized that Goebbels knew that if you can't sleep, you can't heal. So is it doing permanent damage? Probably not. But cumulative damage? Absolutely. Because you know what it's like to go a few nights without sleep. You feel like garbage, and that's gotta be negative to your hormones and everything else in your body and throwing you kind of into a state of chaos. So what I would tell the listeners is more than anything else, I think that listening to music in the wrong frequency, the music itself has this appearance of beauty. But in the end, it's more like a gnat that you have to keep swatting away from your head. It actually really is irritating and causing a bit of inflammation in the body. It's interesting.

Yeah, it is interesting, especially when you consider. And we went over this in pretty good detail in our last show, and again, I'll put a link to that show if you go to BenGreenfieldFitness.com.

That'S.

BenGreenlefinitis.com Lullaby with an I. You know, you talked about the important role that vibration plays in nature and the fact that every organ has its own frequency that it vibrates at. Just like kind of a tuning fork. You know, different sets of tuning forks will vibrate at specific frequencies, like D or A or E or whatever. But bacteria and viruses and parasites and fungi and all of these have their own frequencies as well. And so, for example, when an organ becomes damaged or sick or contains a disease, the lungs will often resonate, for example, at like 72 hertz. And if the lungs develop an infection and you measure that hertz frequency, then typically it would drop several hertz. And so the idea is that, you know, ideally to allow something like the lungs to heal, you would expose them to a hertz frequency that would bring it back up to its normal, healthy frequency. I think you even talked last time about like special medical devices they have now that literally treat people with frequencies. You know, not just like a gong or a didgeridoo, but actual medical devices. I think the one you talked about last time was it called a deta. Are you familiar with this one, the deta?

I don't think I mentioned that. When I mentioned the rife machine, I mentioned the laser probes. I have a whole frequency manual myself that has thousands of frequencies and it coincides with everything from candidiasis to a myriad of different diseases, fungal infections, whatever. And why that whole idea, why that works? I mean, it's really not rocket science, but the AMA is they're virulent against this type of. They call it like, they call it pseudoscience. And all I can tell you is that the biggest thing about frequency is that it will have an impact on, on your body in a cellular level and without a hypodermic needle. And that is, that's paramount. Secondly, if you can find out the atomic weight of anything, whether it be your heart, liver, if you can, if you can properly vibrate that with, with the appropriate frequency, the body was created by God to spontaneously heal. Period.

Yeah, Actually that surprised me when you talk about the ama, for those of you listening on this, the American Medical association, because there actually is some pretty good research. For example, I know the FDA has actually approved some energy treatments for patients as an alternative to chemotherapy. Like there's a non invasive treatment for tumors called Novocure and that literally treats cancerous growths. I think they use this one for recurrent glioblastoma or brain tumors. And it delivers electric fields to a patient using a portable wearable device. And it's literally just producing a sound frequency that slows or reduces tumor growth by what it inhibits is what's called mitosis, which is how cancer cells divide and replicate. And there's been a few studies on electromagnetic fields and frequencies very similar to that rife machine you talked and cancer and the ability to actually halt the growth of cancer cells. And I know there was one in the British Journal of Cancer and I'll try and link to some of this in the show notes for you guys that found that the growth of breast cancer cells was significantly decreased by exposing that cancer to specific frequencies associated with breast cancer. And so, yeah, I mean, the science is out there. It's just like a lot of people want the needle, they want the supplement, they want the pill, they want the chemo, when in fact you can get into the body. Just like with ultrasound. Right? You'd use ultrasound for a soft tissue injury. You can do the same thing in sound frequencies. So it's really quite interesting. And it just shocks me that so many people are resistant to the concept of sound healing. And for me, fresh on my mind, getting off that table in Sedona and feeling like a million bucks, driving back to the airport, I can tell you it works. But you just recorded this Life, Love and Lullabies, Michael. And from what I understand, you actually did that specifically for sleep, which I already mentioned once. But talk to me about how the specific frequencies or the way that you composed and designed Life, Love and Lullaby, how that actually affects sleep. And when you describe that, if you could kind of describe how you're actually making these tracks for people, like if you're in a studio, if you're using a synthesizer, how this actually works.

Absolutely. Well, the first thing is funny and all of us could use a little laugh. And so I'll tell you before I get into the guts of it, after recording Life, Love and Lullabies, and after the musicians left, it was only me and the other engineer that works with me on this stuff when we go to Dallas to record. And so Brad and I, it was the middle of the day. And when I tell you that I was falling asleep, bro, I was absolutely, like almost unconscious. And we'd had four, like, I only drink two cups of coffee a day. I'd already had four cups of coffee and in a cold brewed coffee. And we're falling apart at the, you know, mixing down these songs. And then I looked at him, he goes, dude, I just can't stay awake. And then all of a sudden, the light bulb came on. I said, we're mixing lullabies. This stuff really works. And every single person, it's like, it's almost criminally funny. I would have listening parties for people to be able to listen to the music. And I'd turn it on and look and they're all their heads are back and their mouths are open, catching flies, and everybody's out, like in five minutes. And I was like, ah. Because I. I'll be really honest with you, I wasn't like whole tones. I wasn't 100% cognizant that I was creating a sleep project. It wasn't like I sat there in the studio and said, all right, guys, we're going to do something to knock people out. I just recorded what I felt in my spirit was relevant for this next season. I never look at anything like, with a. With a focused purpose, per se. I created what I felt was what was necessary. And what was a little different about this one is we've introduced some new frequencies, Ben.

Interesting. So what did you do that was different? Like, what's the frequency associated with sleep? Because I know a lot of people will listen to like binaural beats or there's a new program I've talked about before on the show called Brain FM that plays specific beats for sleep. But what exactly was it that you guys were doing to. To cause the music or the frequencies to. Well, it sounds like down regulate or I suppose it'd be upregulate something like delta or theta brainwaves.

Well, again, all I knew with this, and it was really hard because I love Dustin the drummer I called Dustin before I even started working on this. I said, there's not supposed to be any drums or percussion or rhythm on this next project. And he goes, oh, that's okay. He goes, can I come hang out in the studio anyway? Because that's the kind of guy he is. So the very first thing I can say is that there, there is no rhythm. And when I say rhythm, Ben, I'm talking about cadence or there's no particular time signatures and, or beat drum or anything like that in this. And that's probably the very, probably the most talked about thing about this is that most people said, well, I'm trying to sleep with whole tones on, but then 8:52 comes on and these drums come in. And I said, well, that wasn't a sleep project. I didn't create that. I'm happy you can sleep to any of it. But I didn't create whole tones for sleep. And I didn't create life, love and lullabies for sleep. I just knew that I wasn't supposed to have any drums on it. And so that's first and foremost was there is nothing that comes in dynamically that would awaken or, you know, you know what I mean? Or cause anybody to tap their feet and get into a rhythm or not. It was basically more like a river. More just like this really slow moving river that. I mean, when I listen to this music, I feel like I could lay on top of it and just be taken down the river. So the first thing was not having drums. The second thing was there wasn't any other dynamic instruments on this project either. Most of them are very sine wave. I mean, this is the first time a harp, a real harp, Nibel harp, actually shows up on. On a whole Tones album. It's pretty amazing. I had a guy come in with a real harp and play on one of the songs. And so I think that just from, you know, from an ambient standpoint, the instruments chosen in their own right, are elementally very peaceful themselves. There wasn't anything like. I didn't even have, like, my electric guitar on there or anything that had a transient that might awaken someone. So that's the first part. The second part also is just that adding frequencies or doing certain things with the underlayment of the music has a profound effect that is like 396 people were sleeping to that all the time. But you still have those transient points where the drums all of a sudden kick in really heavy or disappear. And like you had mentioned when I read your email, that kind of stuff wakes people up. You know, if you have like a straight beat and all of a sudden the drummer drops out and then starts up again, that wakes people up. There's really nothing to wake anyone up in this. And the new frequencies for your listeners that did not appear on there are several. You go, well, that's on the first hotel. The frequencies are. But the music's vastly different. But there's one that I think you'll find profound, which is called Angels All Around. And what I thought was hysterical is that that was over and above the most popular of these six pieces. And I wrote it, which I thought. I just. I mean, I never wrote a lullaby before, but everybody's crazy about this. But one of the reasons, perhaps, is it's the first time that I've split frequencies on any piece that I've ever done.

What does that mean, split frequencies?

I'm glad you asked. In other words, remember this. Whenever we're talking about harmonics, whenever we're talking about musical notation, if I take something up to the next octave, it's the same note, but it has a different hue, just like in colors. Like if a lime green is, you know, a particular hertz, if we add the next, you know, octave of colors, it's going to be a different color green, the same thing with the music. So I was, as I always am, thinking, man, I would really love to go a little higher than 852, which is on the last one, and do a 963, which was basically perfect harmonic. If you think about it, it's the nine, the six, and the three. I would really love to do that. Well, here's the cool thing. So once I had that frequency and I was listening to it, it sounded hauntingly familiar, but much higher than what I was thinking of. So when I scanned down, I also realized it's the same as 120Hz, same key. So I'm thinking 120Hz is like royal Rife's tonic frequency that he gave credit to, healing just about anything that was wrong. And so I combine those two frequencies. So on the top, we have 963 hertz. And on the bottom of the drone, you'll hear the 120Hz and unbelievably healing track. I mean, and then we have BRAHMS Lullaby at 174Hz. And Gabriela, which is the second of the four that I wrote to. And the other one was Gabriella, and that was named after my niece who came into the world listening to Whole Tones. And just. Just an added note. When we were in the pediatric ward, when she was coming into the world, Whole Tones was blasting in. In. In the. You know, in the delivery room. And so we also had a Whole Tones to go playing in in the room where she was going to be. So we all went in there. When the baby. I saw the baby, I freaked out anyway, just because she's amazing. But here's the takeaway. So as soon as we got there, all the doctors and nurses were all crowded into her room, and they had a whole wing to deal with, and they won't leave the room. And finally one of the nurses said, I don't want to leave this room because what I'm feeling and hear this music, it's the most peaceful I've ever felt. And so, yeah, it knocks my kids.

Out like a light.

So the one lady says to the. Says to the nurse, well, the guy that wrote is standing next to you. And she said, young man, she said, I believe that this whole Tones is the soundtrack for the entrance and the exit of every human life. And when she said that, man, my hair stood up. And I said, can I coin that phrase? So what are you saying? She said, I'm saying from entrance to exit, from. From hospital to hospice. And I was like, that's the most profound thing anyone said. So anyway, I wrote that one that's 333Hz for Gabriella, because she always. And you have kids and you know, there's sometimes when they're too young to know better, like when they're just little itty bitty, you know, little sprouts and you're looking at them, they make eye contact, then they look over your shoulder and they start giggling hysterically and pointing. What are they seeing? Are they seeing what we used to know that we forgot? What are they seeing? They're seeing something. And she kept doing that all the time. And in 333, they call it the Angelic Frequency. And I wrote this about my little niece for her, and she absolutely went nuts when I played this piece. She doesn't know. She probably doesn't even know her name's Gabriella, but she knows this music. She knows it really well.

Yeah, my kids like the. Like the Brahms Lullaby. That's the one that they. They really do they. Yeah.

Oh, I'm so glad. I am so glad, because I love that one, too. And. And that was the thing for your listeners, too, is that there's six pieces, but four of them are traditional lullabies, and two of them I wrote. And what's so amazing is, you know, at first, like whole tones, like we couldn't keep it in stock, but when Life, Love and lullabies came out, a lot of people weren't really engaging in it at first. And I was so. I was like, this is crazy. Amazing. Why wouldn't. Well, people thought it was just for babies, Ben. Yeah, that's so. It was a hard brand, you know, but I didn't want to rebrand it because it was so beautiful. And so, you know, I'm working on another video now to explain to. To listeners and customers that this is for the child and all of us. This is for a night of sleep that you haven't had in a long, long time. Eight straight. When you wake up and you think, oh, I'm not sick after all.

It's really amazing. I actually want to get speakers on either side of my bed because right now I use headphones. And I wanted to ask you about this. I know in our last talk, you said that you kind of wish in an ideal world you could record these things in vinyl to really get that true analog sound where the sound is delivered in almost like. I believe the difference is analog is almost like little packets of sound, isn't it? Versus the digital delivery.

No, technically, the way it really unpacks is binary. Digital is sound waves or wave forms converted into numbers 0, 1 and 2. Okay. And so there is a very close representation, but there's Peaks and valleys that are inevitably missing. Analog is like if I sat in front of you and played my guitar in your room hanging out with you, and we recorded tape. That's what it sounds like when we convert that sound wave into digital information. Numbers, you know, can tend to clip and truncate a little bit then. Not to mention mp3 streaming or whatever. So here's the thing, though. People get hung up on that. I wrote an article about it to tell people. Oh, and a chapter in the book to explain to people the difference. However, people immediately go too far and they say, so wait a minute. So digital's no good? No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that analog is a little bit of a bigger signal. And when that comes into play is if someone has a trained ear and they're musicologists or audiologists or audio files, and they have to listen to their music at a certain place because their ability to hear is so precise, from 20Hz, even up to 20,000Hz or 20K Hertz. If people can hear that, then they're looking for all of these little, you know, peaks and valleys that I speak of. But for the common person, we found that a lot of people went on the wholetones.com and listened to the sample MP3s, which is probably, you know, I mean, not even close to what you're hearing on whole tones anyway, and getting miraculously healed and having incredible. I mean, so one lady said. I'm embarrassed to tell you that, you know, it was a nurse in Tampa said I was healed from rheumatoid arthritis that has no. It has no cure by listening to the samples. I never bought your music. Well, like. Like I would be offended. I'm so happy that she's free. Who cares? But the point is that digital and analog will absolutely work with frequency. You can't find a laser probe that's not being generated by a frequency analyzer. That is what, digital, Right. But there is something warm and wonderful about analog. And so, just so your listeners know, when I create these in the studio, I always do what I call an analog wash. And I'll explain that to you. I record everything with a digital format only in that it takes memory and virtual tracking. Thus I don't have to use, like, tape. And if I make a mistake, cut the tape and do it over again. I can fragment stuff and I can fix things without having to rerecord them. That's the beauty of it. The other side of it is that I run it through A mixing board that is analog, which is a neve board that has all these luscious analog channels. And so you begin your digital signal washing through them. And then in the mastering process, it goes through a myriad of old tube amplifiers, filters and eqs before. So basically what I have is the ease of recording with a digital format, but the warmth and the sound of an analog recording. So it's really the best of both worlds.

So when you're sleeping, what would be best to have speakers on either side of the bed to play these or some type of headphones plugged into say, like either a CD player or. What I did was I actually took some of the tracks and just converted them and put them onto my iPhone. So I've got them on my iPhone. But if you were in someone's shoes, what would be the best way to use these to sleep if you wanted to get all the benefits?

Great question. For me personally, it's really difficult for me to keep plugs in my ears or phones on my head while I'm sleeping. I'm not one of those blessed people that lays down and they're out and they wake up in the same position. So with that being said, I found that speakers work much better. And with that being said, we have a new whole tones to sleep that is all of these life, love and lullabies elements on a speaker that sits right by your bed, that has no lights on it and it works like a charm. I recommend that. I also recommend people that if they have anything from a Bose wave radio to some of the higher end audiophile stuff, Ben. They can also put something that's effective in the right size by the side of their bed and listen to it. Then they're free from worrying about what side they're sleeping on or whatever. Headphones. For me, the biggest component for headphones are people that deal with TBIs, PTSD, people that deal with tinnitus, for example, or have injuries to the head and or you know, have an audio issue of some kind with their ears. Those are the people I tend to say, hey, you know, you might want to use an in ear noise canceling bud or you know, a full over the ear headset because it tends to isolate that area much better and seems to work even better. But as far as sleep, if it was me, I'd probably use my new powered speaker because it has a super good battery in it. I would do that. Or I would get a great little system that you could.

What'd you say? A powered speaker?

Yeah, the one That I have now, if you remember Whole Tones to Go, we have a new one and it's just for sleep. And it's called Whole Tones to Sleep. And it's the old one had a blinking light that drove people crazy. But that was because we weren't thinking people were going to try to go to sleep with it on. It was a charging light.

You actually make a speaker?

Oh yeah.

I didn't even know that.

Oh my gosh. I got to send you this stuff. Yeah, I have two. I have a Wholetones to Go, which is the first album on a self powered speaker that sits right by your bed or can hang off of a hospital bed. It's got a wrist strap on it. Wherever you go, Wholetones goes with you. But now I have Wholetones to Sleep, which is a self powered speaker that has all of these life, love and lullabies on it. And you turn it on and go to bed.

Oh my gosh. Okay, I'm gonna put a link to these in the show notes. I gotta get these.

That's so cool. I'll get them.

That's amazing. I had no clue because I've been thinking about adding speakers to my bed to play your tunes and dude, I had no clue you actually made speakers. Okay, cool. We gotta talk afterwards.

Just connect with me with your address. I'll make sure I get one in the mail.

That's great. And I'll put a link to these in the show notes too for people to grab them. That's super conven. You know, I was gonna ask you if you've heard before of these things called sleep phones. Have you heard of sleep phones?

Is that the one that it's like a combination, like it looks like a headband sleep mask and has the ear things in there and holds them in or is it something else?

Yeah, it's basically like a headband. It's for people who are like side sleepers who want to have like a very soft way to listen to music while they're asleep. And they work pretty well. They sell them on like Amazon for example.

Oh, cool. I haven't tried them yet.

Yeah, yeah, they're interesting. Okay, a couple other questions for you. When the sound turns off, obviously you mentioned that there's no drums or anything that you know, that would get introduced and wake you up. What about when the sound stops? Because I'll use binaural beats or I'll use like white noise sometimes, but then if it turns off, I wake up.

Great question.

Because I know, you know there's six tracks at 30 minutes, you do the math, it's three hours. What happens for the other five hours if you want an eight hour sleep night?

Well, the good news is you can loop it and you can loop the whole tones to sleep device just to play all night and it just keeps going over seamlessly. But you bring up a fantastic question. And I would have to say that some of that depends on the individual, of course. But I used white noise for years and if we had a power failure, the minute that white noise stops, I'm up. I mean like sit up in bed, like, what's going on? I've never had that with life, love and lullabies. In fact, one of the bylines one of the guys wrote because it affected him so much in our company was the only song you'll never hear the end to. So I have never woken up when it does go off. And sometimes even the charger on my speaker unit, I will have used it during the day and forgot to recharge it when it goes off. I still keep sleeping. So I would say that's a question that would depend on the user. But I noticed a quantum difference between using the speaker versus is my white noise fan machine.

Okay, that's all I have to try then. Is the speaker cool?

Yeah, very cool.

Okay, so the other thing that I wanted to ask you. Well, a couple other things. First of all, tell me about the pets CD that you make. I just noticed that you actually have a wholetones for animals, which is really interesting. You know, my animals love some of the things that I have at the house. Like we have a biomat, right? I have one and my kids have one. It's like, you know, it's a mat with infrared and amethyst and tourmaline crystals that vibrate at a specific frequency. In many cases you can get a massage on this or take a nap on it, but my kids have one and the dog sleeps on it and absolutely loves it, especially in the winter. Sleep means like cuddling up with a warm blanket and the dog. Also, he loves to kind of hang out when we're listening to Love life and lullabies in the sauna. He'll come sit at the sauna and just kind of curl up at the door of the sauna and bathe in some of the frequencies. But, but tell me about the one that you designed for pets and how that works.

Sure. Well, what's really funny is that I don't think I've ever been inundated with emails, people calling, even during the hurricane because their dogs are freaking out the first frequency. And I tell people this because I'm not going to sell somebody something they already have. There has to be integrity in everything you do or everything you do has no integrity. So the first whole tones, I'm sure you remember the very first disc is called the open door 396 hertz. So by subtraction, I found out that our rescue dog who just walked into the office, Ziva, she was afraid of thunder, fireworks, lightning, any kind of storms. And in Florida that's an inevitability. And she would shake violently and then try to go between the chairs and the wall. And so one day I was playing 396 during a pretty heavy storm and I noticed she went over to her bed and curled up in a ball and went to sleep. So I kept doing it and it worked every time. So then one of the kids, one of the sons of the publisher, took a recording of this same frequency to the local spca. Usually when you open the front door, it's like this cacophony of dogs coming apart, barking, whatever. And so he opened the door and that's exactly what happened. So then it just happened that the regional director of the SPCA happened to be there, as fate would have it, and he came out and then he turned the whole tones 396 on and opened the same door with it on. There wasn't a peep out of the dogs. Not a peep. And so we started realizing there's a real behavioral component for dogs that have anxiety, separation anxiety, fear of thunder, lightning storms, fireworks on the 4th. And so sure enough, 396 works like with, I'd have to say a high percentage in the 90s of dogs. And we can't keep it in stock. But I let customers know that if you buy the whole tones or if you already have all seven of those frequencies, it's the first one. We just made it available as a one off disc for pet owners. And so they wouldn't have to buy the whole seven set in order if that was their only goal, was to pacify their dogs or cats, hamsters, guinea pigs in the house during storms or, you know, or they wanted them to be peaceful while they were gone. They leave it on in the house, come back to a refreshed dog. That's 396 hertz.

Interesting. Okay, so 396 is for animals. And I'm actually going to look into getting one of those for our dog Comet, and see, see what he thinks of that and, and, and I don't know, I'll blast it for him while he's. I don't know, I'll. I'll sneak up on him, take him by surprise, blast him with some of your sound frequencies.

If you, if you look on the whole tones Facebook site and scroll back a bit, you'll actually see I was on a show and they pulled a fast one on me, Ben, and they brought a really flipped out pit bull onto the stage and they said, we'll see if this really works. And they put it to the test and they put the dog's running around licking the, you know, the host's face, licked his makeup off and whatever. And he all of a sudden put Holt on the dog, stands, sits, looks up at the speaker, starts to drool and falls asleep. Right on tv, right on camera.

Wow, that's pretty cool. I like it. Okay, so cool. So we got the pets. And the other thing I wanted to ask you about, which I actually really enjoy in that we also blast through our house during the holidays, which. Which are about the time this comes out, going to be quickly approaching or will be. In the midst of them, you have the whole tones for Christmas. Tell me about those.

Happily, that was like the joy of my life when I recorded this project. I actually recorded it in 2015. And I have all these favorite songs. But what's funny about when people get familiar with whole tones is you can't just arbitrarily say, I'd like to put this song to that frequency bend because from a melodic content, it might not fit. It might be in or out of that particular key. And one thing I didn't mention is that that since frequencies are so absolutely, you know, spot on the money, there's no. You can't mess around with melody. You can't go outside of the key or whatever. It has to be a constant. So I had all of these frequencies and I wrote down a list of all my favorite Christmas songs. Right. Every one of the ones that I picked perfectly went along with one of the seven frequencies. So we have the Little Drummer Boy, I Saw Three Ships, O Come, O Come, Emmanuel, Carol of the Bells, Angels We've Heard on High, Hark the Herald, Angels Sing and Joy to the World. And what we found out that was so awesome, again, not expecting it is because of the behavioral component and the peace. A lot of times, unfortunately during the holidays, you know, all of our relatives show up, even the ones that don't believe like we or have different political persuasions. And there tends to Be a lot of tension and sometimes arguments during the, the holidays. And I got more emails saying, you know, even, even Uncle Herb, that always starts something on. Christmas was peaceful and happy the whole time. That's what the whole point was, is that this is supposed to be the greatest season of the world where we celebrate the greatest birth that we ever saw. And. And I wanted to create something that brought so much peace and joy during the holidays. And this one, even when we were in the studio, Ben, the piece that was in the studio, when we were recording this, we didn't. Everything was like a first taker. It was no work at all. It was just so natural. Wow. Yeah. That's Christmas Volume one.

Cool. Cool. I like it, man. I like all your tracks. These are amazing. So if you're, if you're listening in, I mean, get them all, get the whole tones. If you have a pet, get the whole tones for dogs. And then also. And I'll put a link to all these in the show notes if you go to Bengrufitness, because, I mean, it's not like CDs are expensive and these are definitely going to make your life better. Get the Life Lovin Lullaby's CDs for Sleep. And then I also recommend you get his whole Whole tones set of CDs, which aren't necessarily for sleep, but just for feeling these amazing emotions of love and peace and joy while you're at work or while you're at home or while you're meditating or while you're getting a massage or whenever you want to listen to what we call the Woo Woo music. And then I'll also link to some of the other things that we talked about in the show, like that love tuner that I wear and the whole tones. Christmas albums and some of the things that we talked about in the previous episode, as well as for those of you who want to take a deeper dive into the science and the history of all of this, Michael's book, Sound of Healing. The Sound of Healing. So that all being said, I'll put all that@bengreenfieldfitness.com lullaby that's bengreenfieldfitness.com Lullaby. You can go knock yourself out and get all this stuff. But Michael, first of all, I'm glad that you didn't blow away and your birdhouse didn't blow away and you were able to make it onto the show. Also, thanks for coming on, man.

Anytime. I love spending time with you. I forgot to tell you because. Because you'll get a charge out of this when they go to see the Lifelove and lullabies. We now offer a tourmaline enhanced sleep mask. So it's really cool. It's a true energy sleep mask and it's full of tourmaline and it really does make a difference in your sleep. That's brand new, dude.

You're telling me all this new stuff I got to try. Okay. All right, cool. I'll check that out, too. I'll let you guys know how that goes. And in the meantime, if you have questions or comments for Michael or myself, just go to BenGreenfieldFitness.com lullaby and you can leave them over there. Michael. I'll catch you later, dude.

All right. Blessings, friend. Great to hear your voice.

All right, folks, until next time, I'm Ben Greenfield along with Michael Tyrell signing out from BenGreenfieldFitness.com have a healthy week.

You've been listening to the Ben Greenfield Fitness podcast. Go to BenGreenfieldFitness.com for even more cutting edge fitness and performance advice.

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