How & Why To Change Your Name, Why You Should Meditate Right After You Get Out Of Bed, Principles Of Healthy Flourishing & More

My name is Ben Greenfield, and on this episode of the Ben Greenfield Life.

Podcast, our intention has always been to empower. And really we've had this recipe that's incredibly effective that we keep tinkering with. We keep changing things just to try to have more and more of an impact with every passing event. But essentially, we like to think of the human as a plant. And our mission really is to create the conditions for the human to really flourish, to really thrive.

Faith, family, fitness, health, performance, nutrition, longevity, ancestral living, biohacking, and a whole lot more. Welcome to the show. All right, so the podcast you're about to hear is with my buddy and his wife. So he's formerly known as Joe distefano. He's totally changed his name. His name is now Joseph Anu. We talk about that on the podcast. So if that's a big for you, just stay tuned. Anyways, though, we spent a lot of time talking about the meaning of one's name, how it can help to identify you and your path in life. We talk a lot about a special event that Joe hosts in Austin, Texas, called Runga, and we even talk about some parenting concepts, some spirituality concepts, etc. But Joe also is a real wealth of knowledge when it comes to just daily optimization. You know, how we live our days is how we live our life. I believe the saying goes something like that. And Joe's really got a great grasp on how to optimize your morning routine. I've learned a lot from him in that regard. He was gracious enough to actually take up my offer to answer a question that I asked him, actually, after we had the show. And that question was related to what he's doing now that are big wins in his morning routine. So before the actual interview starts, you're going to hear from Joe and he's going to walk you through his morning routine. I think you'll get a lot out of it. And then we'll move on to the actual interview with Joseph, I should say, and his wife Amelia. So tune in and I hope you enjoy this one. All the shownotes are going to be@BenGreenfieldLife.com TheGathering Hey, Ben.

Yeah. I've been a big believer in morning routines for a long time, and I know you are big on that as well. And it really is sort of the cornerstone of a healthy day.

Right.

And I know you've talked about on the podcast probably before. I know I have on mine. It's this, you know, the healthy user bias. Right. So it's, it's when people start taking a green juice smoothie and they credit that with so much of their success, when in fact that anchor was actually just the thing that got them to either stop doing things that were severely detracting from their health or start doing a host of things like drinking more water, going to the gym more frequently or exercising harder, or all of these things that we can do, maybe tracking their sleep at the same time. And so a lot of times it's just about finding those anchors and it's less maybe the green juice and more just that healthy user bias and that anchoring us into this, into this more healthy existence. And I think we make decisions throughout our days in sort of resonance with how we view ourselves. So this sort of explains why if somebody is sad, they're going to sit on the couch eating Oreos because they're in this sort of place of maybe some self loathing or whatever you want to call it, just this sadness. And we are attracted to foods, activities, people that are resonating or that match our internal environment. And I think the morning routine gives us having just a concrete, reliable morning routine that's realistic for us. And I'll get into in a second just how my morning routine took a hit. Obviously throughout pregnancy with my wife and the birth of my son and, and Covid and being in a foreign country, it took me quite a while to really get my morning routine back. But I think that's just life and that's the importance of sort of not trying to create a morning routine that doesn't fit your lifestyle or that you're not truly connected with and embodying. And I know we're going to talk about this concept later in the show, but in terms of the core elements of my morning routine that I think might be useful for your listeners, I can really sum up mine in three terms. Number one is powering up. Number two is double dipping. And number three is bucketing. And when I think powering up, when I think about powering up, it's about how can I create a. How can I enter my day, I should say with the maximal amount of personal power. How can my morning routine not detract from my personal power? And sneak peek, the key to that is really running and hiding from your cell phone and your email and pretty much all tech for the first hour at a minimum. And if you can blow that out to two hours, more power to you. But I think the other piece of this that I've sort of that honestly having a child has really taught me Is how does my morning routine not take any of my willpower? I like to think of willpower as a muscle, and I think this is a lot of what we see even in the higher ends of fitness. Working with a lot of professional athletes over the years, people think that diet and nutrition, as an example, are not the same thing. It's like if I run far enough, if I run hard enough, if I burn enough calories, I deserve the pizza. When in fact, it's almost like that workout, that fitness routine, took so much of your willpower that you don't have any left to make wiser nutritional decisions. Or just like the example I just used with somebody that's on the couch feeling depressed, your physiology is a little beat down, right? Some of these workouts are just way too hard. And the body is either craving comfort or just extremely dense sources of calories that can only be met with pizza and ice cream, cheeseburgers and french fries, which are all among the top 10 sources of calories in the United States of America today, which is pretty scary. So when it comes to powering up, as I mentioned, avoiding cell phone, avoiding emails, avoiding anything that can detract from your energy, because when we wake up in the morning, we have a clean slate. Our brain waves and our hormones, they're on our side. And I think the real key to this and to ensure that your morning routine truly does get you off to the right start. And I know there's always a balance as well with sleep, and we can talk about that. And I think the quick answer on sleep is you gotta do this maybe over time. So in other words, if currently you're going to bed at midnight, then it might not be the week to begin the 5am Club. But I think over time, if you set the intention to get up earlier and earlier, and if you get up with an alarm, and hopefully it's some sort of more natural waking device, you know, you can ratchet yourself earlier by, you know, 20 to 30 minute intervals over time, as you also bring your bedtime earlier so that it's not so abrupt and you're not, you know, losing hours of sleep necessarily in order to power up, because that seems oxymoronic. But it is a decision oftentimes. Am I going to be better off? At least for me, am I going to be better off with seven hours of sleep and an hour of inner work that I'll talk about in one minute, or am I going to be better off with eight hours of sleep? And honestly, almost always I choose the seven to seven and a half hours because I just have reaped the benefits so greatly to a solid morning routine. But if it's seven hours or eight hours, when either way I'm going to roll out of bed and just start chugging coffee, then that's a different decision perhaps. So when it comes to powering up, it's all about how do I connect myself with my purpose? How do I connect myself with. How do I create meaning in this day? And so for me, my morning routine really revolves around. I literally roll out of bed, drag myself out of bed if I have to, I drink a glass of water and I often. If it's early, usually it's around 5am I frank in my fr. Frankenstein my way up to my sauna. That's my ritual space. I have my prayer flags up. I have different things in there that make me maximally comfortable and also get my mind in that space. So just a quick tangent. I noticed a phenomenon when around the time when my son was born. And I noticed that it was easier when I would either travel or, you know, as you know, Ben, we more or less got stranded in Europe for a year during COVID and just had to make some really crazy decisions knowing that lockdowns were coming and borders were closing and wanting to be around family when our son was born. So it was wild that, you know, things like cold showers get easier when you are not at home. Things like cold showers. A lot of people have no problem taking a cold shower in a hotel room when they travel, but when they're home, they're. They can't do it. And the reason is we associate different spaces with different emotions and feelings. And so if I take a nice, hot, soothing, relaxing, hot shower 10 times a week in my shower, then, yeah, when I walk into that ritual space, it's going to be very challenging to make it uncomfortable because my mind and body and spirit are so associated with having a higher level of comfort in that space. So as it relates to meditation, I think meditating consistently in the same space, ideally some sort of ritual closed space. I use a sauna space. Sauna, which is kind of like a little tent. And it works perfectly for me. And as I mentioned, I've got prayer flags. I've got things I can sense that I can have in there with me. I have stones. I have all sorts of stuff in there that help keep me grounded in my intention. So I think that's key as well, is knowing where you go. And this kind of gets into reducing the willpower. Don't leave it up to chance. Don't have to decide where in your house you're going to meditate today. Have it be the same space every single day, the same. We really want to make the routine mindless. And that's been the evolution for me. I used to really complicate my workouts as an example, and I used to consider my morning fasted workout a workout, but now I don't. Now I look at all of this as just a lifestyle hack. Now it's all about getting me into my power. And I'll explain the difference between like a power up workout and a workout because I think it's important. So, you know, my personal day, you know, begins. I get myself into my ritual space. I meditate from anywhere from 30 minutes, sometimes all the way up to two hours, depending on how early I get up and how much I value that. And I think there's always a decision as well. When you start really getting into stillness and silence. It's always trying to determine how long is the amount of time that you need and at what point are you detracting from potentially another element of a potential morning routine or of your health and wellness journey. Is it sort of like a law of diminishing returns? And so ultimately you want to stay in meditation until you find the present moment, until that mind is in a place that you can feel comfortable with and you've kind of cleared a lot of that mental chatter. And I do believe that the morning, and we could talk about this later on the podcast, the morning is like any other time. So in other words, it might take you two hours to find the present moment if you try to meditate at 3pm after lunch and after a lot of work and when you've been staring into a screen all day, but you might find that same present moment in 25 or 30 minutes first thing in the morning. So for me, after I leave my ritual space after my meditation every other day, so I have a sort of alternating routine, I will get into my. I'm fortunate and blessed with a hyperbaric oxygen chamber in my home. I'm really focused on my cognitive health because I have a lot of concussions in my childhood. And you know, that's, that's an element of my health that I've really decided to prioritize because I am, you know, I am trying to stay way ahead of any potential declines or any issues I could have relating to those concussions. And, and so I'm very blessed to have a hyperbaric oxygen chamber in my house. And so after my, after my sauna every other day, I'll jump in that HBOT and I'll do a little extra breath work. So in my sauna it's more meditation and stillness and maybe really quiet silent breathing. And then when I go into the hyperbaric oxygen chamber, that's when I'll do maybe a more intense breathwork session. After that I come downstairs. Usually I will make. Lately I've just been doing for the last bunch of months just an instant coffee of sorts because I don't want to waste any time, I don't want to detract, I want to get right into my routine. And the next stop is my garage, which is where I have my fan bike. And I'll do 30 minutes on the bike every single day. And this helps us get sort of, it's like punching the clock. So our bodies, our physiology need a minimum of 150 minutes a week of what I call MAF cardio, which is Phil Maffetone's method, which is around 180 minus your age. A heart rate of 180 minus your age is the max aerobic power. It's also to me, sort of the peak nasal breathing intensity. And I know you've talked about on the show, Ben, about nasal breathing and the difference between mouth breathing and nasal breathing and the health benefits of nasal breathing both to the cardiovascular respiratory system as well as the sexual function. And there's so many other pieces of the puzzle there that nasal breathing supports. And so entering this bike and realizing that we're punching the clock for that 150 minutes a week of low level, moderate intensity cardiovascular exercise. And nasal breathing is key because you may have a quote workout later in the day. That could be your hard interval training. It could be, you know, a metcon, it could be a mixed modal thing. But this is just you basically powering up your system. And so when I do 30 minutes on the bike, typically I do, I allow the intensity to sort of govern itself. So in other words, you'll notice if you start pedaling, you know, when you first get on the bike, you're going to be at a lower rpm and obviously every five to ten minutes you're naturally going to be able to pedal faster as your body and circulation catch up with you.

Right.

It takes at least five minutes for the aerobic system to catch on in most people. So what you'll find is if you're going to do 30 minutes, you know, I typically personally set a goal of about 300 calories in 30 minutes. But I'll explain in a minute how that fluctuates. And so in my first 10 minutes, you know, I might burn 80 or 90 calories. Second 10 minutes, you know, it'll be, you know, a hundred, you know, 110. And then in my last 10 minutes, it'll be, you know, the, the highest caloric burn per 10 minutes. And at the end of 30 minutes is usually around 300. But. But I'm also kind to myself sometimes, and I don't necessarily stress about the total calories. And I really go with the intention is I'm doing this every single day, so I'd rather go 20% easy on myself and make sure I'm gonna be here tomorrow. I never wanna risk going at an intensity that could detract or leave me with any soreness in my legs, because that's not the purpose of this. This is just my powering up. This is like priming the. Priming the pump, right? And then after, after the bike, I do some stretching and I'll do those typically involving my vibration platform, which I am really big on. I think, you know, you gotta have either a vibe plate or a trampoline in your house. Something to get the lymph. And then every other day, you know, and so this sort of like piggybacks the H bot. So I do the hbot, and then every other day I'll do a hundred kettlebell swings. And again, there could be a workout later in the day that you consider your exercise or your workout. These a hundred swings are, are just to really prime the pump and really hit the musculature that are most vital to longevity, which are the hips. And, you know, I think reducing willpower drain. I don't modify the exercise. So it's always 30 minutes on the bike. I always have the intention of burning around a hundred cal, 300 calories. It's always kettlebell swings. I always have the intention of doing a hundred, whether it's ten sets of ten, five sets of twenty, whatever it may be. And I always also swing a bell that's about 30% of my body weight, which for me is usually the 20 kilo bell. And during my workouts, I usually use a 24. So you can kind of see that this morning routine and lifestyle hack is more about, again, powering up. And as you can probably hear in my stories, which is kind of the second principle of a fantastic morning routine, in my opinion, outside of really focusing on powering you up without reducing any of your willpower. But the other important Thing is double dipping where you can. So I meditate in my red light sauna. I do my breath work in the hyperbaric chamber. I ride my bike and it's in the garage. So I pop the garage door. And now I'm getting my morning sun on. Maximal sun, exposed skin. My neighbors think I'm crazy, but a lot of times I'm just in my underwear getting full morning sun while I'm doing that 30 minutes. And I'm then stretching on the vibe plate. So you're double dipping everywhere. And again, reducing the variables that fluctuate from day to day, outside of maybe your alternating day routines. But if I complicated the kettlebell swings and today it's going to be a few presses in there, you know, you can do that. But of course, I want this to be a punch the clock, mindless morning routine that I can do with a blindfold on because it's just my powering, it's just my warmup activity. It's just what I'm doing for my health to check some boxes off to take control of my day. And I do believe, and when you look at the research on, say, the 150 minutes of cardio per week, which would be 30 minutes, five days a week, and we can of course do at seven, but that's sort of like the American Heart Association's minimum for health and for maintaining a healthy weight and for, honestly, emotional health. So 30 minutes of cardio on most days of the week is actually just as effective as antidepressant, anti anxiety drugs. So there's a lot of research around that particular number, 150 minutes a week, which is why I chose it, and it's why I kind of speak to it so often. Even though if you're doing it six days a week, you're obviously a little bit higher, and if you're doing it seven, you're even higher still. And that's fantastic. And again, because we're in this space, we're in the health and wellness arena. We're enthusiasts, we're checking that box and we're punching that clock, and we're not even counting it as our exercise. So we're hitting the minimum before we even have our coffee in the morning. And that's just what we do to get our mind in the right place. And then we can, of course, pile on as much intensity later and as much specific goals as we'd like. And that would be your. Your marathon training, or if you're training for a kettlebell challenge, or your training is much More specific. So double dipping is key because you're getting more out of every single element that you're doing. And again, you can do it blindfolded and it doesn't take any willpower. You're not really following a checklist because after you do this for a couple weeks, it's so automatic. And again, it really does hinge. And most of this you can start to see if my son typically wakes up between 7 and 7:30, then you can do the math. You're going to need minimum of one hour of the house to yourself with no cell phone, et cetera, unless you're using it for music in your cycling, which is fantastic. But it's amazing what you can do with a single hour before everyone else gets up. And then the third really critical element that really we can't forget about, it's really bucketing are days and sort of from a high level for me, like Wednesdays and Saturdays are my kindness days. So those are the days I give myself two days a week where I'm a little extra kind to myself. So on those days I might sleep an extra 30 minutes. I may allow myself to really come up short on the bike that day. Again, kind of with that mindset, I'm doing this every single day. So if today I, you know, only hit 250 calories, it's like, well, tomorrow maybe I'll hit 3:30. And that actually often happens. And, and you know, just from the recovery cycles that you've been through in your own training, that sometimes you see these super compensations after a, after a tough day, you may move coffee up in the rotation, you may reduce or extend your meditation. But the key on a, on a kindness day where you're being a little easier on yourself is you don't skip anything. So you check the box as you punch the clock still. And you're just not, there's no judgment around it, you're just going through it a little more casually. And you know, to kind of counter this, you know, in my own personal life, if Wednesdays are my kindness days, Mondays and Thursdays are the days that I make sure I hit everything. You know, I get up even, you know, sometimes even earlier than the other days, I make sure I hit my 300 calories or more on the bike. So I tend to be a little bit harder on myself on Mondays, first day of the week and Thursdays where it's sort of like the final push of the week. And then I have those kindness days. And then the last thing that I think is really important as well is having a flex day, which is often Sunday. And that's where you may skip some things. You may just be extra kind. Sometimes I'll wake up, I'll sleep in a little bit on Sunday and then I'll my quote meditation might be playing in my kid's sandbox with him for an hour with tractors really present and really just connected with him. And that might be my practice for Sunday. So you kind of have these buckets of different days which are just sort of like your intention that you take into those days. And I really believe that when you have that intention it really impacts your mood and your energy and the sort of light that you take into the day. So you know, on Monday when you, you know, you really hit the bike hard and you made sure to hit the marks and you know you're going to take a higher level of focus into that day and on your kindness day you're going to be more likely to kind of gravitate things into your field that are more in alignment with that. So you can start to really kind of get a nice almost seasonality to your week. And I've really found that it's a vital component so that we don't feel like every day is the same and yesterday and tomorrow aren't identical. And there's always a slightly different energy, a slightly different intensity or intention to each day, even if it's subtle. And I've noticed that that just has really had a profound impact on my life. And once your family starts to understand, at least from my experience, the routine that you're on, it's also really cool when on your kindness days, as an example, it might be the day that you quit work early and you take an early day to take your family out to a special dinner. Same with the flex day on Sunday. So there's this like, there's also this sort of balance that organically weaves into a morning routine like this where you know, your whole world starts to be shaped around this very specific routine. And of course the last thing I'll say is like, you know, these positive power up, emotionally uplifting activities that you do first thing in the morning. Your hours become days, your days become weeks, your weeks become months, your months become years. And so these absolutely have the power to change literally your entire worldview and personality as you start to really anchor yourself into your well self with a morning routine like this that really puts a lot back, powers you up and helps you bucket your life. So that's how I handle my mornings and even with kids. Sure, it was easier when I was a single guy, but being a happy married man and a father, it still works because it's really only 60 to 90 minutes and it's just a matter of getting that alarm clock set. So that's my morning routine.

Ben. All right, folks, I have somebody joining me on the show today for what I think is a three peat appearance on my podcast. Although I could be wrong, I don't do that well keeping track of score. But he is not only one of my dear friends, he has coached me in the past for everything from kettlebell fitness to Spartan racing. He himself has a podcast called the Immersive Warrior, and he hosts what I would say is one of my favorite events of the year, an immersive, typically about a three day long event called Runga, where you go and get trained by wellness experts from all over the globe and eat amazing meals and get access to all these cutting edge biohacking and anti aging tools and do meditation and cold baths and workouts and tons of other little surprises thrown in here and there. And it's absolutely a great time. His wife Emilia also is a big part of that event. She's also one of my wife's friends, and my wife Jessa and Amelia teach these wonderful cooking and nourishing food classes at the same event. But anyways, you might know my guests as Joe distefano, which is his name, at least on the past several podcasts. However, a lot has changed since I've last spoken with Joe and he even has a new name. And that's obviously a very big deal that we're going to be talking about on today's show. So he is a wealth of knowledge. He's a man after my own heart in terms of just health optimization, spiritual optimization, mind optimization. This is the very first time that I'm not only interviewing Joe or Joseph, as he's now known, but also his wife Emilia. So welcome to the show, Joseph and Amelia.

Thank you so much, Ben. What a beautiful intro. I'm so glad to be here.

Yeah, thank you. We're very grateful to be here.

I always practice my introductions a lot in front of the mirror just while I flex and do my hair. All right, so I think that before we just get going with everything that I want to talk to you about, because I even tuned into your podcast a few times this week, Joseph, just so I could kind of hear the latest and the greatest that you're up to, and I even have a few questions from that. But I Want to know about the name change, first of all, because, I mean, there's a lot going on. Not only do you have a new son or relatively new son since the last time that we talked, but you've changed your names. Fill me in what's going on here.

Yeah, Ben. Well, thank you so much. And this is really the maiden voyage. This is really the first interview that I've done since the change. And so I'm grateful for you and kind of setting me a sail here. And, you know, I think it really boils down, you know, to this idea of personal power. And I've found this topic of personal power very interesting for a long time. You know, I. I did years and years ago. I started doing Tony Robbins programs and things like that. And more recently, I've really been into what blocks our power and how do we sustain that feeling, and how do we walk and talk in our highest truth, in our strength, and just free of as many limiting beliefs and as much fear as absolutely possible. And this latest sort of phase of my life that I'm so grateful for really was spawned by the death of my father and the birth of my son coming just a few years apart. And that sent me on a bit of a roller coaster, especially one that sort of was directed inward. Any man who loses his father, it's almost like it doesn't even matter, almost the depth of that relationship, you know, whether. Whether your father's your best friend or not, in some other cases, it leaves a really big hole, and you lose a lot of your masculine backbone in a lot of cases. And I think that as this interest of personal power was already within me, realizing that hole was being filled by him, and I didn't think it was. I thought I was already on my own two feet, but it really created an interesting place in my own self to really explore. And then, of course, with the birth of my son, Leon Thor, I knew I needed to develop into my highest self, my absolute strongest being I possibly could. And he has sent me on a journey, and that was really the sort of start to it. And I can dive a little deeper or throw you the ball back.

Yeah. Well, I've always known you as Joe distefano. I assumed it was maybe, like, Italian or something. I know you were living in Boston when I first met you. I'm just curious. The Transition from Joe DiStefano to Joseph Anu. How'd you actually choose the first and the last name?

Great question, Ben. And I'll say that was a really interesting piece of this is, as you know, for the last decade, I've been going by Joe Di.

Yeah, Coach Jodi. That's like your social media handles and everything.

Exactly. And I spent almost 10 years teaching people how to climb ropes and jump over walls. And Joe Di really became my identity. And I want to get into identity because I think it's just so darn interesting. But when my father passed, it was really interesting. It's this idea of when the student is ready, the teacher appears. And I was getting coffee with a friend, and he was explaining that he hired a coach. And this coach really dove into a lot of areas I wanted to dive into as well. And so I had him connect me. And it was a guy named Arnold Patent. And Arnold. I don't know if he's still coaching. He was over 90 years old when I was working with him in 2018. But what was so crazy to me is that one of the first things he said to me, he almost chuckled when I said, I go by Joe Di. And he said, you have no idea how much power you're losing in that name. You have no idea how much of your identity you're sort of not. You're not owning. And that ownership and standing in that power is going to be the key to your success. And so he was coaching me in a lot of different areas, and I thought that was really, really wild. And, you know, as, you know, like a lot of times when we learn something new, especially about ourselves, like, it takes some time. You gotta really sit with it. You know, it's like I remember when I first went to a Paul check seminar in 2007, and, you know, it was like every year another 10% of that seminar came true for me. And I started to. I remember I thought he was nuts for saying, you shouldn't sleep in front of the TV back then, you know, and so he planted that seed, and it's really kind of blossomed. And I think that maybe going into sort of names in general might be helpful, and then I can get into kind of the. The path that I took. I think that.

You mean. You mean names in general in terms of how they kind of, like, define our character or our path in life?

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So I guess if we look at, you know, last names first, I think last names are really interesting. And I think for many they can, of course, carry a lot of strength, pride, heritage, tradition. It's very healthy to be proud of your roots and where you come from. But I think for many others, it's sort of just this Thing that got passed down, and there's not a real story behind it. And I think it's when we look at names specifically, and I think this varies from culture to culture around the world. But my wife Emilia, who's on the phone with us right now, she's Icelandic. And in Iceland, a lot of people are probably most familiar maybe with some of the CrossFit athletes, like Katrin, David's daughter. Right, yeah.

Or Thoris. They all sound like Viking last names. Thor's daughter. Thor's daughter. Obviously, you know, they're the female descendants of whatever Thor or Doris, whoever that is. So, yeah, I'm certainly familiar.

Well, the really interesting thing about that, Ben, is that those names are unique to that individual. So David's daughter, Katrin, David's daughter. That implies that her dad, not some dad in the distant past, not great, great, great, great, great, great father, but her dad is David. And if she were to have a brother, his last name would actually be unique to him as well. His last name would be David's son. So she's David's daughter and he's David's son. And I think.

Okay, so wait, wait, Dave. So if her name. If her last name is David's daughter and her dad's name is David, what would her dad's last name be?

Her dad's last name would be his father's first name. Son.

Okay, gotcha.

David's father would be, we'll say, Thor's son.

Right. So it's very dynamic. It changes from generation to generation.

It changes, exactly. And so your last name in Iceland, and, you know, it's a small population up there, it tells the story of who you are and helps people understand who you're related to, where you come from. And we look at, when we look at so many names today in America and, you know, the UK and Europe, including my former last name, but names like McDonald, that actually is son of Donald, so it came from the same place, I guess no one told Iceland, but it comes from that same type of tradition. And so even now, a lot of females are walking around with the last name that actually means Donald's son, because it was just this thing that was passed down. And so I found that to be really curious. But the other funny thing about names and the thing that really got my wheels turning in this area is that so many other common names like Shepherd, Smith, these names were taken and assumed based on what that family or person was doing in the world. So Smith were often blacksmiths, tailors were often tailors, Shepherds were typically sheepherders. Greenfield, you might have been a landowner.

Well, actually, you know what's funny, just as a slight rabbit hole here is my grandfather changed his last name due to what I believe, and I don't want to speak too much to the family history here, I'm sure my dad or my aunt or somebody might correct me, but he had a falling out with his father, I believe, whose last name was Romalia, and changed his last name to Greenfield, but took that last name based on, I believe, another relationship in the family with the last name Greenfield. So I actually have a last name change pretty early on, just two generations back from Romalia to Greenfield. Do you think the Greenfields would have been farmers or something like that? Like that last name?

I think so. Ben and I want to get into a phenomenon called implicit egotism in a little while because it's a really exciting topic and I'm sure we'll get to it in just a second. So as I was kind of exploring this and not even with the thought that I might change my name, but just out of curiosity, I started to think about that. Wow. So way, way, way back in the day, especially names like Smith, they were to tell the story of what you are here, to contribute what you do for the people in your community. And so that was cool. And I guess I'll go into implicit egotism a little bit right now, but.

When we look at that, I've never heard that phrase before, by the way.

So it's this phenomenon where we identify with certain elements of ourself, especially, especially our names. It's one of the most strong markers of our identity. Our first name is our person and our last name is either our family or what we're here to do. And there's a phenomenon where you gravitate or magnetically attract or are attracted to things that resemble, or you could easily identify with your identity. So in modern research, I'll say like Smiths as an example, like they were. They were blacksmiths for generations and generations. And even today, years after generations later, they still, on subjective surveys, consider themselves regardless of their physical fitness, regardless of their body stature, regardless of their size. The last name Smith has a strength to it that these people subjectively assume, I guess is the word, that they are slightly stronger than average, they're more capable physically. And I find that interesting. And I think that research study compared Smiths to Taylors, and they found that Taylors really didn't have that. They did not consider themselves to be specimens or anything. As I dug deeper you start to see some really wild stuff. Like there's an abnormal number of dentists named Dennis. There are an abnormal number of people named Florence in Florida. There's an abnormal number of Callahans in Calgary. There's this wild thing, and it actually transcends our name. It's really anything associated with identity. If you're born in February, you're statistically more likely to live on Second street than somebody that's not born in February. So I started to dig into this stuff and it was just like, wow, what am I pulling in? What am I subconsciously attracting into my life, into my field, into that relates to the identity that I carry and how I see myself. And that was the real journey.

Wow. Okay, so the last name obviously appears, can define some things you might not even think about, like career choices or the way that you think about in the case of, like, Smith versus Taylor, your toughness or a whole range of different things. So you obviously must have thought a lot about what you wanted to change your name to. So tell me about that.

Yeah, and I think that as I started to explore this for myself, and the funny thing too, Ben, was I took a little bit of a different approach. I really sort of sat in meditation and asked and didn't get an answer for quite some time. It's a humongous question.

What's that look like for you to sit in meditation and ask? I think a lot of people might wonder what that actually goes like.

Yeah, well, you know, I have my sauna space that I've kind of converted. It's like my little tent upstairs, and I sit in there every single morning. And I typically begin with a question. And I think that questions, they create more brain activity and usher in more ideas than answers or concepts do. Right. So I love asking a question. I love starting a day that I know I have a lot to do with. How can I maximize my focus today and not really search for the answer, just see what sort of floats in? And honestly, sometimes I don't get a great answer. Sometimes I don't get it. I don't have an aha moment every single day, but I sit with it and I stay with it. And the name thing was more of like this. I think first, I think there's this process that you have to sort of. It takes a lot of opening before you start getting a lot of answers. So in other words, when you even have the thought of changing your name, there's a lot of things that keep you from even wanting to go there. You know, you don't want to disappoint people that are attached to you. You don't want to. You know, you've got a million views on YouTube. You've got, like, there's a lot that sort of keep you stuck. And this is true of even people in fitness programs. And they don't want to be the crazy health freak at work that brings a salad when everyone else is having cake. Right. So there's this. A lot of this stuff outside of us. And I think in my experience, from the time I initially considered this or began to, it was years before I actually began to get any answers. And I think if we think about things like ready, fire, aim. Excuse me? Ready, aim, fire. Like, you spend the most time in ready and aim.

Right.

And I think that a lot of people make the mistake of maybe firing first. But I spent a lot of time in ready and aim. And as I began to ask more questions and they got more specific. And so the questions became, how could I use my name to reinforce my purpose for myself? To give my son a name that will know that he can always start again? He can always start at zero. There's never a bad time to begin something new. How could I tell the world, even subconsciously, what I'm here to do without them even knowing me? And as I started to ask those questions, this name came up, Ben. And it was probably a year at least, of certainty. And I used a lot of muscle testing on it. And you're probably familiar with muscle testing. Yeah.

And what did that look like for you?

So I really wanted to, obviously, as people are listening, I wanted to sanity check this as much as possible. And back when part of my story is when I was younger, I had a really horrific head injury, fractured myself, skull, head surgery on my brain. And when I was sort of having some issues relating to post concussion stuff, I got really close with a couple of docs in Boston. One of them is Dr. Peter Pacoco, and the other one's name is Dr. John Marchese. And these two guys are just. I mean, they have a forever place in my heart. They're just magical men. They're so smart. And they both used it, and Marchese used it a lot. And I started to get really intrigued. Like, how come you can tell me to smell something and I get stronger? How come I can, you know, you can put something in my hand, you can have me think a thought, and it will either make me weak or make me strong. And the amazing thing about what I believe today is sort of our means of Communication with our higher self is that our bodies are not meant to tell a lie. We're not supposed to lie. And I think that probably has some roots in community and tribalism. You find a stash of bananas, you're not supposed to keep them for yourself, you're supposed to share them and you're supposed to speak the truth. So the idea with muscle testing, and there's a great book on this called Power versus Force that I'm sure you've stumbled on to.

That's David Hawkins.

Yeah, yeah. And that book, for folks that think this sounds maybe a little woo woo or whatever, read that book, it's really great. So I would have Amelia test me in a lot of different ways. I would also. You'll dig this, Ben. I would hang from a pull up bar and tell myself lies and tell myself truths and see what made me stronger and see what made me weaker. And over the course of a year, I got affirmed in this name again and again and again. I never had a day of weakness with it. It just always made me stronger. And so after a while, I just had to take the plunge. And I'm 37, my kid's 2 years old. It's like, if not now, when you only live once.

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So what does anew actually mean? And why'd you go from Joe to Joseph?

Anew is transformation. I identified through my professional career. As you mentioned. I've been working with people for a long time. I started in sit and push fitness, I like to call it, and then evolved and started doing more functional training. And then CrossFit, the wave came in and. And I managed a franchise of gyms. And then I got really into obstacle racing and spent almost a decade at Spartan Race. And what I sort of pulled out of the last 20 years of my life is that I love being a part of transformation. I love it. And it's ultimately my calling. And when I look at what I could say, created. But Emilia's really taken to the next level with Ranga. I started to see that that's what we're doing there as well. In fact, we got feedback from the last bunch of runga events, really post Covid runga events. We've done three now. And people say, people say, wow, I can just really be myself. And I started to say, wow, we're really creating a space of transformation. And that's ultimately whether I've been working with Hollywood celebrities or professional runners or average Joes, it's always been about transformation for me. So when I started to look at this name anew. What it means to me is it's a symbol of my own personal transformation. It's my higher self speaking to my human ego self that gets upset sometimes. It's my higher self talking to my son, telling him what I would tell him in the event that someday I'm not there. And it's the world having a clue as to what I do and a means of me communicating to the world what I'm here to do for a lot of people, as many people as I can touch during my life. So the first name is, of course, your first name. A lot of people don't have much to do with it. And I think that I've met just a number of people recently that have changed their first name. And our parents do their best. They take a guess, but I think there's so many outside influences, names that are popular on TV at that era or, you know, there's a lot of things. There's a lot of degrees of freedom or, you know, room for things to maybe go wrong. So I think analyzing your first name is an important thing. If you suspect that maybe you're not, you know, identified or you're not. If you're not really feeling power from your name, then it's an interesting subject and, well, to dive into for me. Arnold telling me so Arnold Patton's work is amazing. He wrote a bunch of books. He's almost 100 years old now, but he was like the Joe Dispenza before Joe Dispenza, and I think he was on Oprah in the early 90s. And he's got a few principles. One of them is the universal principles. And he has another one called the Family Story. He's got some really great books, but his concept can ultimately be boiled down to, you are born abundant, you are born joyful, you are born free and happy. And the human experience creates wounds. And it's our job over the course of our lifetime to first accumulate those wounds and then heal them and get back to that abundant, joyful self that we were born as. And when we look at those wounds or things that identify us, limiting beliefs specifically, or I guess the life, the journey that we're all on. He believes that we are all powerful. We all have what could be called prana chi qi qian, right? We all have this amazing life force within us, and the only thing blocking us are these limits on our power. And again, most of those are wounds. But when you're walking around and you're given such a, you know, in My opinion, a beautiful name, Joseph. It's very, you know, it's like a. It's a symphony. It's got power, it's got strength, it's got a biblical tie. It's got a lot to it. To cut that down to Joe is an area that he was pretty insistent, was limiting me in my life. And the longer I sat with it, especially wanting to make an example for my son and knowing that it's now or never, I decided to step back into it and let myself be a test and hopefully maybe an inspiration for some others, because it is a challenging ride. Ben. I won't joke. It's challenging.

Yeah. I watched my sister go through this because she changed her name, Natalie, into Angel Greenfield. She's a musical performing artist. And so that's not only her stage name now, if you want to call it a stage name, but also just her literal first name, like, she no longer goes by Natalie. I've always kind of wondered if I changed my name to my full name, Benjamin, and started going by Benjamin Greenfield, if it would influence anything from wealth to success to mindset. For example, I've looked into the name, and apparently the wealthiest name that exists is Benjamin, if you look at the actual income or something like that. Not that I necessarily think life is all about finances or wealth, but it's interesting as a thought exercise to just think about the way that you're named and whether a shortcut name or nickname might actually be influencing your day to day life. It is interesting to think about. Now, Emilia, what do you think of all of this? Like, are you now going by the last name anew? Did you think Joe was just, like, out of his mind when he decided to do this? Or where are you at with all this?

That's a great question, you know. Well, first of all, I should say, when we got married, we sort of eloped. So we got married in our front yard in Venice, very local.

Elope.

Oh, yeah. I guess that's not an elope. Well, we had three friends, so, you know, we didn't have our family. And I never changed my name to Deciphano. And I think that in my head, I always thought that I would take his last name when we had a real wedding and, you know, brought all our families together and, like, kind of save that. Yes. Have that be something sacred, something, you know, another initiation down the line to look forward to. So it was interesting because, you know, I'm still. I still have the last name that I. That I was born with. And when Joseph came home one day and I think, I don't know where you were, you were just thinking about it and you decided to tell me about this crazy idea that you had and you had been sitting with for a while. And surprisingly, I wasn't that shocked. I don't know if that says more, says a lot about us, our relationship.

I kind of just most supportive wife ever been. It's unbelievable.

Yeah, no, trust, trust me, I know anytime I do something weird, it takes a lot for my wife to be shocked because she's used to quite a bit of craziness, obviously.

Well, I remember initially he said to me, you can sit with it and if there's a certain way you'd want to spell it or something else that feels good to you, we can talk about it. But I could just see, I could just sense how in his heart this was what he wanted, that this was really important to him. And I could feel like he told me how strong it made him feel. He told me about the process, how it kept coming back up for him. So who am I really to say no or to limit that at all? I think I'm just happy for him that he's in this place and really tapping into that personal power.

Has it actually changed? And Emilia, you may have noticed this in Joseph, or Joseph, you can speak to this yourself, but has it actually changed the way that you go about your day to day existence, having gone from Joe distefano to Joseph? Anu, just as far as, like, anything that you've noticed has changed thus far, because it's obviously a pretty new thing, I think in the past couple months that this has happened.

Yeah. And he can speak to this for sure, a little better than I. But as a witness, I would just say that there's definitely a sort of pride that's very healthy and perhaps more of a lighthearted energy also, maybe because there's a meeting and then it strikes up conversation with people. And I definitely think that there's been a. A little bit of a shift and maybe it's more subtle, but at least for me as a witness, it feels. Feels really good.

Yeah.

You know, and I think, you know, I'm really excited right now because I feel like I have a renewed sort of permission to really, truly go all in on myself and truly setting examples for my son and the people I work with. And it's really kept me anchored. And I think I really look at this and I delayed for a long time just because I know the name. You know, it's almost. I don't worry about it. But I know that people. It's like a lot of people can see, obviously, that it's a name that I discovered or that I decided on. Right. It doesn't. It's not. I didn't change it to Smith, so I knew it was bold, and that meant I needed to sit with it for a long time again. It's like ready, aim, and aim is the lot was the longest one. And then I went back to ready. And then finally I decided to fire. But what really put me over the edge was maybe six or eight months ago, I read Ram Dass biography. And Ram Dass, he was Richard Alpert, he was a professor at Harvard, and he went to India and began spending a lot of time in meditation and with his guru in India. And his guru named him Ram Dass, which means messenger of God. And when I was hearing Ram Dass and I started, I was kind of in this place of thinking about this. When I was going through his biography. And when he came home from India and Richard was now Ram Dass, I was like, people must have thought he was nuts. But as I started to read, and I've consumed hours of Ram Dass at this point, podcast that they've created with all of his old lectures and things is phenomenal. I started to realize that he struggled. Like everyone. He has his vices, he has his weaknesses, he has his things he has to work through, just like everybody. And I believe that the name is what really kept him anchored to his purpose. So if he was Richard Alpert, I think there was probably a real challenging phase when he got home, as I mentioned, and changed overalls, credit cards or whatever. Right? There's that phase. But as his career blossomed and his purpose became clear and his. His mission became larger and larger, I believe that name likely kept him truly anchored, feet on the ground during challenging times. And that was really actually what put me over the edge. Because I said, I want that. I have a son. The world is challenging. The world is also very progressive right now. And so there's no better time to make a major change. This is my own inner monologue. But really, Ram Dass journey really was the thing that put me over the edge. Cause I said, wow. So he knew his purpose, he was aimed, and he was ready to fire. But just in case life got in the way, just in case things got tough, he had the name as a backbone. And it's a source of his kingship, it's a source of his strength. And that's actually what really put me over the edge was that biography.

Now, do you have to actually go to have your legal status change as well when it comes to changing your name like this, logistically, did you have to go through some of that? I'm just asking because people are listening and maybe they're interested in doing this. Is there more than just announcing to the world, hey, this is my new name?

Yeah. And a lot of people ask if I, like. Most people are like, okay, cool. Are you really doing it? Is it a real thing? Are you going to have your credit cards and your license change? And the answer is yes. And that process, speaking of timing, it actually got a lot easier post Covid. So now there's only very important or real pressing court dates. If you're not. I learned this in the system, is that most people changing their name, they've committed a crime or they're on the front page of the newspaper. And so if you don't check any of those boxes, it's a really quite easy process. I did need to go down to the clerk and just do a couple of quick things. Had to sign a couple of documents. But unlike before COVID there was really no crazy court date. There was no. So it wasn't a lot of work. It was actually just time and money to begin that process. And then once you get the letters from the judge that are signed, you can just take those to the DMV and send them to the Social Security office, and you start that process. And each step of that journey is four to 10 weeks or more, but it's a slower process, but it's really not that cumbersome, to be honest.

I was just thinking about my Kundalini experience because a lot of people are given spiritual names in that tradition. And I was given a spiritual name as well, a few years into my practice. And it's interesting because I don't. I'm just thinking about it as you're speaking. I don't think that the people who, you know, were going by their spiritual name, especially in our community. I don't think anybody actually changed their name. You know, they changed it on Facebook and Instagram, and then it was, you know, everyone knew to address them by that name. I don't believe anyone that I know changed it legally or, you know, at least there was no discussion about it. So even in those traditions where maybe, you know, you don't want to take that step to change it legally, I still think there's a lot of pal power in a name that's given to You. I remember my name was, or is, I suppose, Priyashanti, which I believe means Beloved Peace. Beloved Peace. And I remember especially when it was first given to me and it felt really special. And I remember just meditating on it. It became like a mantra. And I never actually went by that. A bunch of my friends kept trying to make it a thing.

You had parentheses on your Facebook for a while.

I did.

In Kundalini tradition. A lot of my listeners might not be that familiar with Kundalini yoga or the Kundalini practice. Who chooses this spiritual name for you?

So Yogi Bhajan, when he was around, they have a kind of a center in Espanola in New Mexico where his house was. And there's still that community there. They run the 3 HO organization. And I believe it means Happy Holy. Can't remember what the last agent, but it's a three agent. Happy Holy. Sending out hippie.

That'll work. Happy Holy Hippies.

That would be very accurate. Well, he assigned a person to make these names, and I know that there is some sort of name bank, some sort of system, and when you apply for a spiritual name, you speak to them. I believe, if I remember correctly, it was about seven or eight years ago at the this point, but I remember writing a letter and just talking about my experience with the practice, how, you know, how big, how much my life has changed, how big of a part of my life the practice is. So you start to, you know, you kind of feel like you just want to pour your heart out. You want. You want them to see how important is this to you, so that they put a lot of intention and love and thought behind assigning your spiritual name. So it feels very reciprocal when you receive your name because you know that you put a lot of energy into kind of maybe proving yourself a little bit, and then it feels really personal. There's a lot of power. It's empowering.

Yeah. And you also, at the same time Joe changed the name of your podcast. Was that intentional or was that just coincidental that your podcast changed from. I think it was Stats before, and now it's Immersive Warrior.

Yeah. Intuitive Warrior.

Oh, Intuitive Warrior.

Okay. That was also intentional. Again, it's sort of. I want. I'm going all in on myself right now, and I want to. I'm trying to create all these sort of tentacles from my mission to align and to both tell a story and also keep me connected and stacked was kind of. Was based on a teaching that I kind of began in fitness. It was really my Fitness, identity. And I want to really get into intuition and strength and transformation. And so that's where Intuitive Warrior came from and was born from. And I'll also mention that getting back a little bit to Kundalini Yoga, when Emilia and I met, she was, I think you were already preashanti. And she got me, you know, she steeped me in it. And we were pretty devout for a number of years. And Kundalini Yoga says that when you want to transform any part of your life, you need to employ the power of a thunderbolt. What they mean by that is you need sound and vibration. And so much of Kundalini, I mean, we've probably done these mantras, which are sort of similar to any transcendental mantra type practice. I mean, we've probably done a lot of these fate, blossoming, protection, fearlessness mantras. We've probably done them thousands of times. And I'm curious as to the impact that had on this decision. But I love that the, that the teachings say that you need the power of a thunderbolt because transformation really doesn't happen overnight. And when you start to think about mantra and sound and the healing potential of everything from gongs to a lot of the things we do at Runga, of course, and that's why we're doing them, it's very incredible. And as I began to look at that implicit egotism and how do I magnetically attract things that are connected to my identity in some way? And the answer might be in the. I think there's 82 or 83 acupuncture points on the roof of the mouth. And when you start to stimulate your mouth through these mantras, and of course this gets into affirmations in the morning and putting vibrations into the universe, I'm beginning to suspect a lot of that is it's been around for 5,000 years for a reason is my guess. Ben.

That leads me. And this might seem like a kind of weird segue, but like I mentioned, I listened to your podcast in a few recent episodes. One thing really stood out to me, and it's related to something you just mentioned about meditation. In the morning, I usually get up and I'll stretch and do some breath work, make some coffee, kind of go about the day. And maybe like an hour and a half or so after I get up, I'm finally sitting down to do my prayer and my meditation. Things like that. That the few times that I've just wandered downstairs and sat down on a cushion in the living room and started meditating, it seems a Lot better. Even though I haven't really fully changed my habit of doing a bunch of stuff before I meditate. You said in a recent podcast that there's a big advantage to just doing it. First thing first. First thing. Can you explain that?

Absolutely, Ben. And this is also a Kundalini practice. Amelia and I's first argument as a couple was about this, actually. So there's a practice in Kundalini called sadhana, and this is common in a lot of yoga traditions. But you get up two and a half hours before the sun rises. And I believe that the reason is that the brainwave state that exists at that time, the chemical state with the interactions between chemicals like melatonin that are still floating around your brain.

Can I slow you down for just a second? You said you get get up two and a half hours after the sun rises.

Before the sun rises.

Before the sun.

Before the sun.

Okay, got it. That makes better sense. I was going to say it sounds kind of lazy.

It's called the Amrit Vela.

Yeah. Emelia used to make us get up at 3:30 in the morning and drive to the yoga studio for sadhana. It was wild. And now I do my best on most days of the week. I've kind of got my days bucketed. So I have certain days of the week that I'll let myself sleep as late as I can, but I have other days of the week that I get up at 5 and get immediately into my ritual space. So sadhana is. It's getting up two and a half hours before the sun rises. And my intuition tells me that the brainwave state at that time where you're sort of, you just forced yourself out of bed, you haven't looked at your cell phone, you're not. It's not 3 o' clock in the afternoon when. And you've got so much on your mind, you're in this sort of in between brainwave state. And I believe that's far more conducive for a productive meditation than after you've put a bunch of things in your head. And I also suspect that from a spiritual perspective, and this gets into maybe some of John Laurence's teachings, which I know you've had John on the podcast just around.

I interviewed him yesterday, actually.

Oh, really? I'm so curious about sort of the chemical state as well, in addition to the brainwave state and what potential may lie or what the yogis over the last couple of thousand years have really figured out as it relates to mystical experience or depth of meditation.

Yeah, I'M certainly sure that there's a lot of gaba, like the inhibitory neurotransmitter GABA still floating around in there. And the excitatory neurotransmitters transmitters like norepinephrine or dopamine haven't really had a chance to surge into the bloodstream quite so readily. So, yeah, it's really interesting, though. It actually is something that I've really been trying to start doing. Just get up and put on hold all those racing thoughts or that desire to optimize the body first and just go straight into meditation. I'm actually planning on moving my meditation cushion up by my bed just to make sure I don't even step foot into anything else before I launch in. Now, at Runga, you guys obviously do you do the meditation in the morning? I think a lot of people might have heard our other podcasts and might be familiar with this Runga thing, but the last time that I interviewed you, it was a little bit different.

People.

Would show up, most of them would stay on site. It kind of rotated in different spots around the globe. And the structure of the event was a little bit different. I think that for people who might be interested in this gathering and the next one's taking place in Austin, Texas this October. I'll put all the info in the show notes. You can find them at BenGreenfieldLife.com TheGathering that's BenGreenfieldLife.com Thegathering you guys have changed up some other things as well. And I don't want this to be a giant commercial for Runga, as much as I would like to hear a little bit about the reasoning behind some of the different things that you've added there and some of the stuff that you think is most important when it comes to health optimization. And why? Because there's also, I mean, you got like hyperbaric and you have these electrical devices and the different injections and IVs and peptides, but then you have the outdoor practices and the ice baths. So talk to me about some of the most important changes.

Yeah, absolutely. And you're right, we have had a lot of changes over the years. And I can tell you a little bit more about our philosophy because Ranga is really like this recipe. So our intention has always been to empower, just like Joseph described. And really we've had this recipe that's incredibly effective that we keep tinkering with. We keep changing things just to try to have more and more of an impact with every, every passing event and we can definitely talk more about that and break down all the elements and everything that goes into that. But essentially we like to think of the human as a plant. And our mission really is to create the conditions for the human to really flourish, to really thrive.

When you say the human is a plant, are you talking like Rudolf Steiner type of stuff where you would eat the roots of a plant to nourish your internal environment or some of the leaves for cardiovascular and venous performance, things along those lines? I think it's called Anthrobio, anthroposophy, something like that with Rudolf Steiner.

Oh, that's so interesting. That's a great question. I'm not as familiar with Rudolf Steiner as I maybe should be and probably will be as Leon grows up. But actually this idea came from Aristotle. So this idea of the human as a plant, it became ingrained in me a few years, even before I met Joseph and way before I was involved in Runga and I was studying law in London and I got really into Aristotle. I took a class with a man named Eric Hinds. It was called Law, justice and Ethics. And I actually had no idea that it was a class dedicated to Aristotle and specifically actually how we create justice. You know, what policies, procedures, practices in society are conducive to justice in creating just humans. And Aristotle didn't just believe the objective was to have humans that behaved in just, just waves ways that, you know, that did just actions, but they also had to enjoy doing them. It had to be ingrained in them. So this is relevant to us. It sounds apparently maybe like it's not. But if you're familiar with Aristotle, he had these substantive interests and these are the virtues of the just humans. So he sought out to identify in part, you know, the procedural elements that would be the most conducive in producing humans with these qualities. So for example, some of the virtues, there's bravery, there's generosity, there's truthfulness. And each of these, he explains, is a golden mean between two extremes. So for example, truthfulness, you want to be truthful when speaking about yourself, but you don't want to be truthful in speaking about things that aren't yours to share. And that's the mean, that's the golden mean between being boastful and being maybe self deprecating. So you kind of get the picture. You know, generous, but not too generous, generous, not stingy, those types of things. So you actually, when you're reading this, you kind of get the feeling like you're reading one of the original self Help books, which is kind of funny, it's so old. Right.

And what's it called again?

He had a few books, so Aristotle, Nicomachean ethics. I'm probably saying that wrong. There was rhetoric and politics, so those were the three that I researched the most and studied the most. But you start to realize whatever you're reading from him, really, that justice is one thing, but underneath it all, he's really talking about happiness and fulfillment. And that's what his model of justice is concerned with. So a just human with all these virtues is the natural result of human growing in the right conditions, you know, in the fertile soil. So this metaphor, with enough sunlight, the right amount of nutrients, the right amount of water, that the ultimate goal, the ultimate good, actually is for humans to fulfill their potential. There's this Greek word, eudaimonia, and there's really no. Maybe you're familiar with it.

There's.

There's really no word for it in English, and a lot of times it's misconstrued. But it's best described as this sense of true happiness and fulfillment. And it's not an emotion. It doesn't come and go.

It would be like a state of flourishing. Eudaimonia.

Yes, absolutely. So that's what he was really concerned about, the human becoming the most human, the human fulfilling his potential. And he set out to identify the conditions most conducive to that, which is really actually what we've been concerned with Brunga as well, to making the human the most human, bringing out the best in the human. So this is such a powerful concept because for us, we believe health is our birthright. And just like Joseph was talking about Arnold Patton believing that joy, abundance, happiness, these are our birth rates, these are our true nature. This is what our DNA can provide for and manifest. So if grown under the perfect conditions, the human being is. Well, you know, the human's highest nature is to be. Well. And that could be. Yeah, that could be manifested through his environment, habits, nutrition. And so this is what Runga's always.

Been about in terms of flourishing and being. Well, I think, and this is something that I've learned from Joseph and experienced at Runga and also learned from you, Amelia, during some of the breathwork and the movements that we do during Kundalini, it seems like no matter what practice this, you see the same general principles arise over and over again. Nourishing the spirit early in the day, as we've just briefly alluded to, with things like meditation and breath work, subjecting the body to Some elements of hormetic stress via things like fasted morning movement, ice baths, rather early in the day or later on in the day, some type of sauna or heat exposure, lifting some type of unwieldy or heavy object, being out in the sunlight, being barefoot on the ground, nourishing the body with healthy food after a period of fasting has occurred, being with people, relationships, love having some form of body awareness and paying attention to the little things that people sometimes neglect when they're lifting heavy weights like mobility or soft tissue integrity, fascial movement, et cetera. And it seems as though when you look at that idea of eudaimonia, that's kind of the way that you guys, I don't know if you intentionally did this, but it seems like it's the way that runga is structured. And it doesn't mean that somebody has to go all the way to Texas in October to be able to do this stuff. It's just that immersive event just kind of teaches you, I think with a lot of other people, without you feeling stupid, how to actually start incorporating this stuff into your day to day routine. But it seems so simple when you step back and look at it. What do you think it is or why do you think it is? More people. I realize people are busy, they have kids, they got work, they got a lot going on. But why do you think it is? More people don't just do things like wake up, go outside barefoot, get a little sunlight, meditate, breathwork, weave in cold, heat, heavy lifting and mobility and then being with people throughout the week. Where do you think the disconnect occurs?

Yeah, that's a great, great question. And it's interesting because, you know, we know just from experience it's not enough to have a checklist of things that you know are healthy, that you know are good for you. We know knowledge isn't all of it. You know, there has to be, there's, there's more to the story. So actually, and we can talk more about how we do this, but a large part of why we're so, our experiences are so impactful is because we're aligning species, aligning people's hearts with their objectives. You know, it's no longer aspirational. These things that you want to do or believe that you need to do to be the healthiest that you can be. And really the recipe to be able to create that impact is in like you said, this state of flourishment. And how we create that is we, we actually, we see the community, if we look at the human as a plant. We see the community aspect as this fertile soil. And then all the programming, all the teachings, all the therapies, they're, you know, maybe the nutrients and the sunlight and the water, we like to look at it that way. So when it comes to healing and really tapping into a really vibrant state of health, we believe we have so much more in common, you know, people in general, than we do differences despite, you know, different things that we have going on simultaneously. You know, we have fitness and yoga and nutrients and, you know, an open bar of peptides and quicksilver scientific and all these things, you know, hyperbaric, oxygen, pemf. We have all these incredible healing modalities. But what Runga really provides that can actually be overlooked. You know, if you're just sitting at home listening to this and maybe even you have some health challenges and you might be working with, you know, an integrative physician or functional medicine practitioner, something that can be really overlooked even in these functional approaches is our human need for connection and belonging to. And for us, this is really the fertile soil that holds everything. This is the space and then all the practices, all these things that can be really health promoting. We pile those on top of this nourishing space. But the nourishing space is really the differentiator between us and other events and really provides something that a lot of people don't have in their daily lives.

Yeah, yeah. So the event, the next one, the gathering, as I think you're calling it. The Gathering, Right.

You know, it's back to just runga.

Okay, so it's back to just Runga. Okay, got it. So in terms of. And I know I told people to go to BenGreenfieldLife.com TheGathering and it is a gathering, so I'll leave it at that. But it's called Runga. What can people expect if they show up at the October event? What's the typical day look like?

Yes, that's a great question. I would love to talk a little bit about some of the principles that go into why we keep it a small group, for example, because I think that's really important for people to know. You know, you're not signing up. It's not a conference. You're not signing up for something that, you know, you could come, for example, alone. You don't have to sign up with a partner or group of friends. And we have an application process. So people. People apply first of all. And, you know, we want to. We want to hear their intentions. We want to know what makes them excited about the experience, what they think it'll provide for them. We also really want to get to know people stories because people come in with so many different stories. And it's really a way for us to connect on a heart level and to try to envision these people in this space, in this community, so that we can really bring together a group that's, you know, it's very intentional, it's very. It's very curated. Obviously, all the aspects of the experience are curated, but so are the people. So Aristotle actually, again, you know, in the procedural element that he identified as being conducive to the human becoming the most human, he said that a city state of Holis couldn't be too large. And this is exactly what we've discovered, too, in our events that, you know, we're hosting 50 people, 50 guests for three full days. And we have found that this is the perfect number, really, for everyone to feel at ease. There's enough, you know, the way that we structure our days and we can talk a little more about how we. How we. We structure the activities and the cycles, but the way that we do it, people are going to. With that number of people, get to know everyone really, really well. And this is such an important aspect of the experience, even just at the outset, when you're thinking about applying and you really want to come, it's very unintimidating, and I think that's an important part of it.

And I'll just tack on to your question about the evolution from the early days when you and I were, you know, swinging kettlebells in Costa Rica and, you know, whitewater rafting, you know, it really came from the feedback that we were getting. And one of the pieces of feedback that really, it honestly contributed to my own personal journey that we always already kind of went into. But people kept saying they can really just be themselves. They can really be themselves here. And when they walk away, they have a tremendous amount of momentum. And the person that, you know, came in maybe a little introverted, left, and now they're the ice bath gal on Instagram. Immediately, you know, that we saw these amazing transformations. And so we started to align the programming with creating those, you know, biohacking those, hacking those. How do we create more of this and how. Through our application process, how do we bring in a precise person that we feel would be the greatest fit for that? And as it relates to the daily schedule, we have a lot of different activities. As, you know, we kind of blend these ancient traditions, the Sound baths and the gongs and the meditation. Kundalini yoga with, you know, the latest and greatest, whether it's hyperbaric oxygen or the newbie device. And so you're kind of getting this never before blend of some of the most powerful ancient tools and latest tools. But specifically how we create this situation where people are truly embodying not only the practices, but this new element of self, this new connection. Getting them into their heart and making them feel safe is key. But how we organize the days, there's typically there's multiple blocks and there could be two or three things happening at any given time. But people go through an individual activity. So the first thing in the day might be a meditation where people really connect with themselves. And from there they go into some form of small group activity. And from there in some form of large group activity, it could be lunch. And when they go through those cycles, they probably unknowingly, unconsciously go through those cycles about 10 times in three days. And what it does is every time they sort of discover a new element of themselves, they get practice. And so this gets back to my own personal journey. You know, my first dabbling my toe in terms of after 36 years of being Joe, how do I step into being Joseph? Well, what I did was I went to a small group coaching event and I told everybody I was Joseph and I survived. And everyone knows me as Joseph now. And so it works. And then I, you know, now I'm obviously going to the world with this. But on a smaller scale, we feel that that process that we take people through, that what we call real time integration, really connects people with these practices. And like I said, it's not a cognitive thing, it's not a knowledge thing, it's a heart thing, it's a connection, it's an embodiment. And yeah, we're seeing people walk away with just tremendous momentum. And that's sort of the theme that we're really trying to, to create more of through the various elements that we add, incorporate or take away.

Okay, got it. Now a few kind of rapid fire questions. It's in Austin. Do people actually stay because it's on this big property if it's in the same place as it was this last time that I went. Do people actually stay there? Do they get their own hotel and show up each day?

Yeah, so there's a hotel nearby. It actually began this new sort of program that works, worked tremendously well for us, began during our, at our first event back from COVID And a lot of people didn't want to stay on the premises. And what we learned was it enabled us to actually offer a service that was superior. And so now what we do is we have an amazing venue. It's a seven acre property here in Austin, Texas, and we've got two hotels nearby. And so people leave the property and go have their own time, their own space, and their own hotel room. And then they come back in the morning and we run a shuttle to the hotel and bring them back each day. So the event runs from around 8am and this year in October, we're actually going to go a little bit later, we're going to do some activities. We're going to have more panels with experts like yourself in the evening, and then we're going to top the day off with some breath work under the stars. And we're so excited about that. So, yeah, people gather. 50 of us, we gather at the property and people are four to nine minutes away at a hotel overnight.

Okay, all right, got it. And then the total number of people is 50, right?

Yeah.

Okay. And for people to register. I know. I'll put a registration link@bengreenfieldlife.com thegathering this podcast is probably going to be coming out at some point during this month of August. About when does it typically fill up, at least in your experiences in previous years?

Yeah. So it's about, what, half full right now? We've got a lot of applications. Of course, when you drop a podcast, Ben, we usually get quite a few visits.

But you curate this thing. You go through each application one by one and interview people to see if they're a fit.

Yeah, weirdos show up.

We're all weirdos, actually.

Yeah. So I get on the phone with a lot of the applicants, not every single one, but we've got an incredible team. We call them the Angels. And they take care of people once they apply. You know, they kind of get into the system. We chat with them via email. I'll get on the phone with them to really connect them with the experience. You know, we love people to go all in on themselves at Runga. And so we love to get on the phone and connect them with the experience before they arrive. Because then that first step, there's no. There's no slow build. You know, you walk in the door and we are all in for three full days.

I wanted to add too, just. Just the sense of connection that people can really experience. I'm sure all of us have times in our lives where we've experienced really the joy and the Purpose of really feeling a part of something greater than ourselves. So some of us are lucky to have it in our jobs or can in some way sense that in the day to day. But for others, we might just have memories or moments in life that really stand out where you felt that, like maybe you were in a play or a musical. And that's actually one of my stories because when I first moved to Austin, I knew nobody and I had none of my immediate family in the States. And it wasn't until I joined the Law School musical, which is called Assault and Flattery, that I actually was able to tap into that sense of belonging. And I finally felt like I was in the right place in my life. So I wanted to communicate this idea that it's in us, this human need for belonging is in us, and it's actually more than just a need. All these health things are one thing, but. But this is actually, you know, like we say, the fertile soil. This is the foundation. And it's a yearning so deep in our hearts. And I truly believe it's the whole, whole point of life to belong and connect with each other. And you've probably spoken about Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and if you're listening, you're familiar with that. You might remember the physiological needs being at the bottom. So that's like air, water, food and shelter. And then there's, there's safety needs, which are security, resources, health. And then you have love and belonging. And above that there's self esteem and self actualization at the top. And what's so interesting about that is, you know, the idea behind that is the needs higher up can't be tended to until the lower needs have been satisfied for the most part. But actually, this is super interesting. Even Maslow went back and corrected himself and he said that belonging, connection, compassion, community, these can all proceed, even the meeting of basic safety and physiological needs. And frequently actually they do.

That was like his deathbed insight, right?

Or it might have been.

It was towards the end of his.

You mean like you can be poor and hungry and unprotected and if you have a friend and you feel as though you're loving or being loved adequately, you can still have some amount of happiness and satisfaction.

Yeah. And perhaps even a better example is you hear these stories and maybe even movies that have been made about these awful things like tsunamis and earthquakes, where people's basic needs are barely being met and there's so much suffering, and yet these stories that you hear are often about these beautiful outpourings of love that are happening within the community. You know, people coming together and helping each other, sharing what they have when they themselves have so little too. So it's in our nature, you know, it's ingrained in us to love and connect with each other. And you know, as it relates to Ranga and even this idea, you know, we're all about biohacking, right? So we're like, well, how do we hack community? Because clearly belonging is so important. How do you hack that? But keeping the group small is just one thing. But the whole, you know, the intention behind everything is make people feel like they're at home. You know, people can tap into that sense of belonging. And as this is the fertile soil for the human, our impact is magnified way beyond what we could achieve if we had, you know, more people or even if our intention was different and we didn't bring people back to their own personal experience. You know, having that real time integration that you know, know self, small groups, community cycling, those activities that allows us to, you know, bring people back home into their hearts.

Yeah.

And I love this quote by Maya Angelou and I, I know it off by heart because I recite it in meditation so many times that it's, I long as does every other human being, to feel at home wherever I find myself.

Cool. I like that.

That's, that's really our, our philosophy. We can't hack it on our own, you know, we can't. It's not one of those things that we can, that we can do on our own. And Joseph, you were talking the other day about we get hurt in community and we heal in community.

Yeah.

We really need each other.

Yeah. Well, I've certainly felt at home at all the events that I've done down there. Even though you're doing a bunch of kind of like weird stuff, you know, like peptide injections and IVs and Kundalini. And I think a lot of people show up just like, yeah, kind of having no clue what they're getting into. But yeah, I think the community element of it is important and everybody just feels like they fit in. Even if you walk in and you're kind of like, I don't know, I throw a house party sometimes. Somebody once commented, ben, when I come to one of your house dinner parties, there's no click. There's no necessarily like a feeling of a tribe with a language per se. As much as I feel like I'm on the island of misfit toys with a bunch of random people who just, despite being, being Random and all thrown in this pot together are all super happy and thriving. And that's kind of the way that Runga feels. I know we gotta wrap up pretty soon, but what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna link to the other podcast because Joseph and I have certainly geeked out on biohacking and ice baths and kettlebells and all sorts of the crazy stuff that you might encounter at Runga on other shows. And I'll link to that. And I know people might have their own questions about change, changing their name or family history or actualization through your actual moniker that you carry through life, as well as perhaps questions about Runga. So if you're listening in, you can leave all your comments and your questions and your feedback. If you go to BenGreenfieldLife.com TheGathering and then you're gonna see me down there, me and my wife. Last time my sons came, they might be there again as well. Down there in October in Austin, Texas. You'll definitely be there, able to see us there. And the exact days again, Joe, Seth or Amelia. See, I almost just called you Joe.

Did you hear that?

What are the exact dates again?

The dates are October 13th to 15th.

Okay, all right, perfect, perfect. Well, thanks so much for coming on, you guys, for sharing all this with us, for being vulnerable and also, Joseph, just for being inspirational in terms of listening to where it is that you were called to go and actually taking a big step, step in going there and doing a little bit of the hero's journey, especially when it comes to this name change. I'm excited about what God has planned for you here going forward.

Thank you so much, Ben. Yeah, I'm so excited. And yeah, if anybody is going through a major change, whether it's a name or whether it's a job or they want to start a new business, I'm here and I've gone through some cycles and I've gone through a lot of these, you know, challenges recently. So I would love to support any way I can because I know it's. It's hard, but necessary.

And Ben, I wanted to say too, I loved you bringing in non judgment as well. And just to say, to bring in one last, you know, way of looking at the human as a plant. It is the sense of non judgment. Right? Because when you see a plant and if he, you know, if you're just walking in the forest, you just accept the plant, you know, you realize that if he's leaning one way or a little short, you just, you recognize that it didn't get enough sunlight or it didn't get enough water. So Ram Dass actually says, I practice seeing people as trees. And this is really the philosophy as well that's embodied in Ranga and that you're, you know, speaking about experiencing because it's this essence of non judgment now. We're accepting of anyone however they show up and we're not. You know, perfection isn't the standard.

Yeah, yeah, I agree. That's certainly been my experience there and I dig the vibe. So again, if you're listening in, I'll put all the links@bengreenfieldlife.com thegathering and until next time, I'm Ben along with Joseph Anu and his wife Amelia signing out from BenGreenfieldLife.com have an amazing week. So there's two events coming up. You go to both of them. I'm going to go to both of them. Obviously I'm going to fly to Texas, then fly over to Lexington. The Texas event called Runga, is October 13th through the 15th. The wild health one is October 22nd. Go to both. I am. Obviously you can also check BenGreenfieldLife.com calendar for all of the events that I'll be teaching at this year. So I hope to see you there. Are you ready to be empowered?

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More than ever these days, people like you and me need a fresh, entertaining, well informed and often outside the box approach to discovering the health and happiness and hope that we all crave. So I hope I've been able to do that for you on this episode today. And if you liked it, or if you love what I'm up to, then please leave me a review on your preferred podcast listening channel, wherever that might be, and just find the Ben Greenfield Life episode. Say something nice. Thanks so much. Means a lot.