Kundalini Yoga, Cannabidiol, Psilocybin Mushrooms & More With Dr. Somer Nicole & James Radina.

In this episode of the Ben Greenfield Fitness Show.

Cannabis has two sides of the plant, marijuana and hemp. And we derive, specifically in this conversation, we derive our CBD from hemp oil, and therefore it's classified as hemp oil and can be shipped California, Colorado, Florida, Kansas.

It is a direct link to balancing your glandular system and strengthening your nervous system, which for me is what I found the most powerful effect of it was that stronger nervous system. I was a pretty sensitive, sensitive person before Kundalini.

He's an expert in human performance and nutrition, voted America's top personal trainer and one of the globe's most influential people in health and fitness. His show provides you with everything you need to optimize physical and mental performance. He is Ben Greenfield. Power, speed, mobility, balance, whatever it is for you, that's the natural movement. Get out there. When you look at all the studies done, studies that have shown the greatest.

Efficacy.

All the information you need in one place right here, right now on the Ben Greenfield Fitness Podcast. Hey, folks, it's Ben Greenfield. And last last month, I had the pleasure of visiting an island of Hawaii I'd never been to, because usually when I go to Hawaii, it's to do the masochistic suffer fest that is Ironman Hawaii on the big island of Kona. But this time I went to Kauai and I got a chance to actually hang out while I was there with a few of what I would consider to be some of the coolest couples on the face of the planet. For example, a couple of weeks ago, I released a podcast interview that I did down there with with big wave surfer Laird Hamilton and his wife, the volleyball Olympian and fitness celebrity, Gabby Reese. We had a great conversation. If you didn't get a chance to listen to that, go back to the archives and listen in. But another couple that I hung out with quite a bit along with my wife when I was down in Kauai was my friend James Radina, who's actually been on this podcast before. And I will jog your memory here briefly as to why he was on the podcast and what he is in, expert in, but also along with him, his, well, girlfriend at the time, fiance now, Dr. Summer Nicole. Dr. Summer Nicole. And you're going to get to meet her in this podcast episode. So, first of all, let's start with Summer. I mentioned that a couple of weeks ago, I actually hired an expert in Kundalini yoga and physical therapy to design a Kundalini custom yoga routine for me to do in the morning, for me to open up specific Chakras and specific, you know, basically energize my body in the way that I wanted to be energized in the morning. And Summer is that person who designed this custom kundalini yoga routine for me. She's a doctor of physical therapy. She specializes in cranial sacral therapy, somato emotional release, and she's a Reiki teacher as well. She teaches hatha yoga. She teaches kundalini yoga. She took us through a few yoga sessions when we were down there in Kauai and she's very, very good. And like I mentioned, she does personalized yoga videos for folks as well. And I'll link over to her and everything she does in the show notes for this episode, which is@BenGreenfieldFitness.com YogaPodcast but she is here on the show along with James Redina and he was a podcast guest in a special episode that I did on cannabidiol. And James is the CEO of an organization called EAD Labs, which develops cannabis based formulations. He's a co founder of the documentary that's actually releasing later this year called the Science of Weed that has a few dozen of the top doctors and scientists on the subject of using cannabis for healing. And he's built a hemp based CBD product company that is really the gold standard in the industry in terms of absorption. They use something called nanomedicine to deliver cannabidiols to the body. So between the two of them, they kind of span the gamut when it comes to health. So Summer, James, I know that when I was down there in Hawaii, we had a lot of groundbreaking kundalini yoga sessions. We talked a lot and did a lot with cbd. We even experimented a little bit with psilocybin. And we've got plenty to talk about on today's show. So welcome.

Aloha, Ben.

Aloha, Ben. Thanks for aloha.

Or as we. What was the phrase that we would use when we were down there, James, to evoke power. Imua. Yeah. So you guys are such a cool couple, such, you know, so much fun to hang out with. I had to get you on the show. But I'm curious just if you could hit the rewind button for us real quick and tell me how you two actually met.

Right on, Dan. It's a funny story in a lot of ways. And I was living in Encinitas. This was about three, a little over three years ago. My best friend had hired Summer to do some physical therapy on his shoulder. And as soon as the session came up, he comes running upstairs in the house and my room. He said, james, this summer girl, she just moved into town. And I have this hit that something special between you two is gonna happen. So I run downstairs to try to get to catch a glimpse of her leaving, but I don't catch her. And he says, well, she's got a yoga class on Saturday.

And that can be tough because Encinita is like the yoga capital of the world. Everybody there wears yoga pants. So you never know who this yoga instructor could have been.

So I walked into her class and I've never experienced a yoga class like that for first of all. And then it turned into non stop text messaging and bantering back and forth, and we just started to build a friendship. Next thing you know, turns out this is a Grandmaster Ms. Pac Man Player. And we had just happened to have a Pac man machine in her house. And so when she found that out.

It was meant to be.

Yeah. So, you know, I think one of the best parts about our story actually isn't necessarily how we met Ben, because we. We came together really fast, and then we also came apart really fast. The magic of our story is actually what we went through in order to get here today. That, I think is one of the things that so many people ask us about. And, you know, what I had to uncover about my ability to allow love in, for example, was something I never really went through and gave time and energy to. Yeah, go ahead.

Since I met you a couple years ago, you actually came to a business meeting at my house, James. First time that I'd met you and hung out with you, and we hit it off pretty well. But you've actually changed a little bit since I first met you. And I've noticed that you've become almost like a lot more open and a lot more energetic. And I never really understood why. Like you told me you'd been experimenting with chakras and stuff like that. But when I came down there to Kauai, one of the very first mornings I was there, you walked me and some of the other folks who were out there out into the backyard and took us through this routine that, from what I understand, something you do every morning. Can you walk me through what it is that you do every morning and what it is that you taught us that morning?

Absolutely. So for me, it was about a year and a half ago that summer and I were about to head over to India where she was going through a Kundalini training 30 day intensive. And prior to that, we started to get ourselves ready for it. I think we did like wanted to do a 40 day or 90 day challenge to get ourselves into Kundalini. And it was there that I started to experience it for myself. And there's a couple of things, Ben. It's not necessarily just about Kundalini or what I do. It's more the fact that I actually scheduled out some time in my life for the first time to commit to a morning practice. And so one of the things that I want to share is that a lot of times it doesn't really matter matter what people do as their modality. It's the giving themselves a space to actually do it. And in the morning, the power of doing that in the morning. We learned there's a lot of science behind that about the planet is a lot calmer around in your area. You're able to drop in your mind isn't going as much. So if you can do things right there in the morning, whether it's meditation or for me it's Kundalini and Hatha Yoga, it's breath work. I incorporate all of this in what works for me and myself and my body. And it's a little bit different than what Summer uses and what she worked with. It's pretty similar. But you know, every person will find their own, I think beauty in a morning practice of what their own intelligence says is their best for them.

Yeah, and I've always been into morning routines but man, I mean like when you took me through what, what you were doing and, and so correct me if I'm wrong, what we did was Kundalini Yoga, right?

Yes.

Okay, so, so let's start here before because I want to hear like what your routine is, James. Like what you do when you get out of bed in the morning before you do your Kundalin, like how long you spend on it and, and what your personal routine looks like because I see how much it's changed you or, or at least, you know, not that you were like a horrible person or an. But I mean like you're just like I've, I've noticed like you're just like your energy is going through the roof. Summer, what is Kundalini Yoga?

Kundalini Yoga is. It's known as the Yoga of Awareness or some people call it the Yoga of Transformation, but it's specifically Yoga body. And so what that means is the subtle body. So your energy body consists of the seven main chakras in the body, which are the seven main energy centers in the body along with the eighth chakra which is your aura or the electromagnetic field that surrounds your whole body. So Kundalini yoga. And I've pretty much studied every style of yoga in depth. And many before Kundalini were the alignment based therapeutic styles of yoga. And when I found Kundalini, I can, I can honestly say I was like, man, this is like yoga on speed. You know, because of all the breath work that is incorporated in the repetition of the way the exercises are done in Kundalini, it intensifies or enhances the effects of the postures. So it's a super powerful style of yoga. I still do my Hatha yoga practice to work out the kinks in my body. But when I'm wanting to basically do energy work on myself and, you know, clear my own energy and enhance clarity and really get tuned into my intuition, Kundalini is definitely the most powerful practice. And it works because you can think of the seven main chakras in the body. They all correlate with endocrine glands as well as nerve plexus in the body. And so your endocrine system, you know, are, is that collection of glands that produce hormones, you know, regulates your metabolism, tissue function, development, sleep, mood, you know, among other things. And nerve plexus, the autonomic nerve plexus is in your body. You know, they're formed by the parasympathetic and sympathetic fibers of your nervous system, and they innervate your visceral organs to help regulate their activity. So it is a direct link to balancing your glandular system and strengthening your nervous system. Which for me is what I found the most powerful effect of it was that stronger nervous system. I was a pretty sensitive person before Kundalini, and I found that strengthening my electromagnetic field and strengthening the energy centers in my body and my nervous system, I was just able to manage stress a lot better and able to kind of just really see what's mine and what's not mine and not be so affected by other people's negative energy.

So when someone's getting like an acupuncture session, for example, and that's supposedly allowing for better energy flow throughout the body, and people will do this for like injuries or for insomnia or for depression, basically what you're doing is you're using breathing and specific movements to achieve something similar to what something like acupuncture might achieve.

Yeah, it is, it's definitely working with the energy system of the body for sure. You know, in acupuncture they call it meridians. And you know, from India, it's. They Call it the nadis. And there's 72,000 nadis, or energy channels throughout the body that you're working with really. And kundalini is also Kundalini Yoga is considered the signs of angles. So it's about directing blood flow and prana or that life force energy, or call it to specific organs or specific chakras. I'll give you an example. Like when you do, if you have your arms overhead 60 degrees that direct 60 degrees, it directs energy to the heart. So that's one example. So it's a science of angles and it's about increasing circulation and directing energy to specific areas of the body depending on what kind of effect you want to have. And Kundalini yoga has thousands, literally thousands of kriyas or sequences that you can choose from. And that's why I really like it too. You can really, really hone in on what you want to work on.

So you can choose which organ system that you want to specifically target.

Yep, organ system, glandular system, you can target the circulatory system you can target releasing anger, you can target, releasing fear, you can target developing your intuition. You name it, it's there.

Okay, interesting. So like when I came to you and had you design a routine for me and I told you that I, that I wanted something that was physically invigorating during the day, that worked on like cardiovascular blood flow, I, I primarily wanted cardiovascular and cognitive performance. What I came away with was this, this 30 minute routine. And for example, like, like parts of it, I am more out of breath than when I'm like, you know, working out on an air dine or with a bat or with a battle rope. I mean, I like, like I hadn't really thought too much about how tired you can make yourself with some of these movements, but there's one where I'm just punching back and forth, exhaling with the left and then inhaling as that comes back in, exhaling with the right. But it's like, and I'm doing it, I'm doing it and it's like three minutes long and it's just going and going, going. Then you finish and you contract your whole body for like 5 or 10 seconds and then release everything and you get this, this weird tingling sensation. Then before I know it, right, it's like another movement. Before I've even caught my breath. There's another series of movements. And it's really interesting how challenging it can actually be. And I wasn't aware prior to you kind of explaining this to me about the neurobiology of it, but basically specific angles and specific breathing patterns that target specific organs and endocrine systems, right?

Yep, correct. And like what you're doing, you know, in that punching one in particular, if I remember correctly, it induces this sort of breath of fire. Right? And breath of fire is like that in and out through the nose, but it's that pumping of your navel point. As you exhale. The navel point draws up and in. Right. And you're pumping the navel point, which is a big deal in Kundalini Yoga. It's a common thread and not all the Kriyas, but a lot of them. And the breath of fire, when you're really concentrating on pumping the navel point, it's stimulating all of these nerve endings and energy channels you have around the solar plexus around the navel. And it's super, super powerful. That's one of the most powerful breaths of Kundalini Yoga, which is why we knew we wanted to put it in your routine. Because it's like, you can tell it's very energizing, it's very clearing. And then that 60 degree angle of the arms overhead directs energy to the heart, which charges the electromagnetic field around the heart and gets your blood pumping. So yeah, it's super clearing. Pretty much one of the most powerful breathing techniques that I know.

Now, are you familiar with Wim Hof at all?

Yes.

Okay, so he's the Iceman and he'll do that type of power breathing before he goes and immerses himself in cold water. Do you know if he does Kundalini Yoga or does he just do this fire breathing?

The documentary I saw on him, it didn't mention anything about even yoga in general. Kind of showed him doing some, I think like a headstand. And, you know, so you kind of got the idea that he was a yogi, but it wasn't specific in mentioning like Hatha Yoga or Kundalini Yoga. It was just really honed in on the breath work. And from the little I know about him, it's like, you know, he, at the end of it, he gets rid of all the exhale, right. And then he holds it. Right. So in Kundalini Yoga, it's basically the opposite, where you're the fire or whatever it is for a while. You take a big breath in and then you hold the breath in and then you lift what's called mulabanda and Uddiyana bandha, which is the pelvic floor. And the navel draws up and in draws energy up you slightly tuck the chin, and then you're basically gazing right at the. Between the eyebrows, which is the third eye point for intuition. And you're drawing energy up to the crown. And so that's what they're talking about when you're talking about rising, you know, getting your Kundalini energy to rise. So that's the difference, I think, between Kundalini and Wim Hof is that you take a big inhale, you hold the breath, and then you allow all of that energy to circulate around all of the chakras. And there's even a visualization that you can do of this, that energy spiraling up the spine from the root all the way to the crown.

Yeah, and I had experienced the same thing because I've been through Wim Hof's protocol, and I own his books and everything. And you'll finish. You'll be breathing, but then you'll finish and you'll exhale everything out and hold it out. And I think the idea behind his program is to get rid of a lot of carbon dioxide. And that's one of the ways in which he increases the body temperature. And I think it seems that with Kundalini, it's more hyperoxygenation than breathing off of carbon dioxide, because you'll finish that hole with just a full breath in. And then you hold it and hold it and hold it, and you're like, holding it in your. I believe you refer to it as like your sexual organs. Right. Like you're contracting those and contracting the entire body. And it's a really interesting sensation once you actually release all that and let it go and the tingling comes down the fingertips. And it's just. It's really cool. I'm kind of addicted to it right now.

It's amazing. And that tingling that you're speaking to is, you know, and especially for you, I know your particular practice is very much centered around getting energy around the heart. And so that tingling that you have in the fingers, think of it like energy. You're raising all that energy up to the crown, and then when you release it, the Kundalini energy descends. And as it descends, it goes to the heart, and then from the heart, it expands out and then goes down the meridians and the energy channels of the arms and then into the palms. And then that's when you'll feel that charge in the palms. So you can even have that visualization as you're doing that breath work. And then from the palms, you can send that out into your immediate Electromagnetic field. So it's like you're charging your own electromagnetic field.

James, what does your morning routine look like?

So first thing I do is I get up and I say some words of gratitude and I just get myself into a place of receptivity. I then do some oil pulling with coconut oil and right behind that is a cold shower. And then I. We live just a couple, you know, minutes from the beach. So I walk down to the beach and I sit down in the sand and I drop in with a little bit of meditation and then I start a Kundalini practice. That is I have a bag of tricks of two or three that I like to go to as my go to. And those are anywhere from. If I need to, I can keep them short and a half an hour. If I want to, I can go for 90 minutes. And for me, then what I've realized, because I'm, you know, I believe that we are all our own best doctors, that we're all our own best medical system. So I'm constantly just checking in with what's working for me, not only in that practice, but, but also in how I show up through the rest of the day, how present I am on different calls, things like that. So, Ben, I did a seven day sighing retreat with Adashanti a couple years ago this summer and I did it. And it took me about three to four days, somewhere in the middle of that sigh and retreat to get to a place where, in a sense, my mind was quiet. And why I love doing Kundalini yoga and breath, which is really breath work with yoga, is that I can, within just a couple minutes after a kriya, I can drop into a place that's so quiet that's similar to that state that I took me three and a half days to get to at a silent retreat.

Yeah, that's one of the things that I noticed when you took me through your routine in the morning, James, was I actually like to meditate for a few minutes after I do a yoga routine. And I found that I was automatically in this. It's this strange tingly state of like a mental high in which you feel extremely connected to yourself. And for me, for some people, they would say to the universe, for me it was to God, because for me it's prayer and meditation after I finish my routine. But it was amazing how much more connected I felt after something like this. And I've talked on the podcast before about how I've done everything from holotropic breathwork to transcendental meditation. And with Kundalini yoga. What I like about it is you're pumping the bellows, right? It feels like you're really working your lungs and your cardiovascular system at the same time as you're tapping into a lot of these powers of meditation. And so it's really interesting. And the first time I'd really felt that was when you took me through that morning routine. One thing you mentioned I wanted to hit on real quickly was the oil pulling. Why do you do that?

You know, I haven't been to the dentist to actually test to see if this is working, but we've been doing this for months now because we've read a couple different articles now that, you know the oil from coconut oil. So I stick a tablespoon of coconut oil or three fingers full of coconut oil into my. Into my mouth, and I switched around for 15 minutes. And what we read is it's supposed to be pulling out the toxins and supporting with whitening your teeth, bad breath, all the things that I would go to a dentist for. And I'm not a big fan of going to dentist. I believe personally that I can take care of my teeth on my own, and I should go to the dentist more often. But I use coconut oil pulling as a way to prolong my dentist. Summer has some.

Yeah, it's supposed to basically delay the onset of cavities. And I got in with one dentist who was open to it, and. And I had a kind of like a small cavity back there. And I said, hey, I'm going to start doing oil pulling. He goes, yeah, yeah, do it. And then come back six months later and then see. We'll see if it's kind of kept it at bay. And it did. So I'm sold on it. So I also do it every morning. It's really good.

Yeah. My kid, one of my boys, Taryn, got diagnosed with a little bit of, like, a cavity about a year and a half ago, because we go to a holistic dentist who doesn't use, you know, like, toxins and, you know, keeps metals out of the air and things, things like that. And we got him on a remineralization program that completely got rid of it. And he just does a tooth powder that Jessa makes, and then he does, along with his brother, oil pulling every night with coconut oil for about four or five minutes. And then he also does cod liver oil as a supplement along with vitamin D and vitamin K. And so that's like their healthy teeth protocol. And I'm guessing that they're probably going to have pretty bulletproof teeth for the rest of their lives if they keep that up. It's something I wish that I'd have done. And my wife, who's had like a dozen cavities and fillings and all sorts of stuff, like, she wishes she had done it as well. But it's amazing how resilient the teeth are if you actually take care of them. So, basically, as far as this custom yoga routine, I do want to talk to you guys a little bit about cannabidiol and about psilocybin. But. But when someone comes to you and they want their own yoga routine created, Summer, how do you decide if somebody's listening in? They're like, how do I even know? For me, I knew I knew I wanted my heart to be open. I knew I wanted cardiovascular blood flow. I knew I wanted a little bit of a nootropic cognitive performance enhancing effect. But if somebody doesn't know or they're trying to decide what they should ask for, what they should talk to you about for a custom yoga routine, where do they start?

Yeah, well, I haven't filled an intake form that gives me, you know, a brief history and, you know, their injuries and whatnot. So, you know, you start on the. On the physical level of just for me finding out, you know, okay, what are you working with? What injuries have you had? Which ones still bother you? You know, which areas of your body are the most tight, which ones are the most weak. You know, if that is the case, if they're actually wanting, you know, more for a physical effect. Because I get some people that are like, you know, I'm really just looking for a flexibility program. And some people are like, I'm really looking to stabilize my lower back and doing some core work. And so it just depends on a physical level, what they've been through and what their goals are. And then I ask them to be as specific as possible with me about what the mental and even emotional qualities that they want to walk away with. Because you can get really specific with the kinds of sensations and feelings and mental state that you walk away with from a practice, depending on what breath, work and meditation you do. So, you know, people can. They can tell me if they're wanting to work on, you know, decreasing anxiety or improving focus or, you know, developing intuition or reducing stress or whatever it is. So I asked them to be really specific with me and. And then I just asked them too, you know, if they've gravitated in the past to certain styles of yoga, because I want them. I want the practice, you know, the sequence to be what they want. And so, you know, if they're really attracted to that sort of, you know, flow type of yoga where, you know, that's what they're going to get the most out of, I'll incorporate that. But if they're open and I can kind of just tell from their history and the injuries and, you know, what the mental and emotional effects that they want, I can kind of choose. And I just kind of intuitively know myself, like, okay, this is going to be more of a Kundalini practice, or this is going to be more of a Hatha yoga practice.

Interesting. And then it can be customized to a specific timeframe. Or does it always need to be a half hour?

Yeah, I did a couple that were. That were an hour long and it was just a bit much as far as the time it takes me to do it. And sometimes I have to reshoot the video if starts raining or, you know, there's too many roosters in the background or whatever it is. And so 30 minutes is just about right as far as what it takes me to, the time it takes me to shoot it, you know, what it's valued at and timing to edit it and all of that. So. So I do it at about 30 minutes now.

Got it. And there is a rooster in the background of mine, by the way.

Yeah.

So, you know, it's kind of cool, actually. But the problem is I have rooster, so I can't tell if it's your rooster or mine when it goes off. But, yeah, I literally just flip open my laptop and lay on my yoga mat. And occasionally I'll do the. The routine I've almost got to memorize. I still have to watch your video of you walking me through it as I do it. But I'll set my. My computer in front of my sauna. And so I'll sit inside my sauna and I can still hear the computer through the. Cause I won't bring my computer into the sauna. I don't want to melt it. But I'll put the computer outside of the sauna and I'll do a hot Kundalini yoga session, which is really interesting, combining the breath work with the sweat. But for those of you listening in, by the way, I'll put a link to all this stuff in the show notes if you go to BenGreenfieldFitness.com YogaPodcast that's BenGreenfieldFitness.com yogaPodcast you can go to Summer's website where she does all these custom yoga videos and see some of the stuff that she does. She's got a yoga doctors TV also where she does a bunch of yoga and meditation and holistic video or holistic living videos. It's cool stuff, so. Oh, go ahead.

Do you think we should just give everybody a little sample of a 60 second breath of fire so they can stand up and experience 60 seconds of this?

Yeah, if you're driving, this is the part where you press fast forward. But yeah, let's do it. I'm ready. I could, I could use it. We're, we're, you know, we're halfway through the show, so we can recharge with a little, little breath of fire. Let's do it.

Okay. Yeah, we could just do it standing. So just have your feet, hip systems apart. Like press equally down through both heels and then lift the heart. And the breath that we'll do is breath of fire. So it's a powerful inhale and exhale through the nose. And on the exhale, you time navel drawing up and in. But put equal emphasis on the inhale and the exhale. Okay, so from here, draw your arms up like a capital Y. Bring the fingertips to the finger mounds and then plug the thumbs as if you could plug them up into the sky. And then draw the shoulder blades down the back. Okay. 60 degrees of the arms. Arms straight. Got it, Ben? Okay. All right, so close the eyes. Roll the eyes in and up right between the eyebrows to the third eye, your intuitive center. And we'll just go for 60 seconds here together. Right. Deep breath in and begin.

It. Good.

Take a deep breath in. Without looking. Hold the breath in and then lift the pelvic floor. Draw the navel up and in. Slightly tuck the chin. Gazes at the third eye. Now stretch everything up. Spread. Stretch your fingers up. Hold it. And exhale. Let your arms just down. Let your palms face forward. Just keep your eyes closed and take a couple breaths, allowing your breath to return back to its natural rhythm. And just feel for a moment.

Love that feeling.

Yeah.

That one in particular directs energy to the heart. You get that little tingling that you were talking about down the arms that charge in the palms.

Yeah, that's good radio right there.

Good stuff.

Better than a cup of coffee. Awesome. Hopefully nobody drove off the road. Yeah, it's so powerful. So cool. So if you're listening and you haven't yet tapped into Kundalini yoga, you. You need to try it, you know, and this is coming from a guy who, you know, I guinea pig everything. And this is One of the more powerful things that I've. I've experienced, especially from a yoga standpoint, so, so dig into that. Check out the show notes. We're going to take a. Take a little, little dive here in another direction, but the shownotes are@BenGreenfieldFitness.com YogaPodcast okay, I want to talk a little bit about cannabidiol, obviously, James, and I'll put a link to this in the show notes. You and I have done a whole podcast on cannabidiol or, or cbd. But I'm curious when you first started using this and, and why, like, were you. Were you using marijuana and then switched to CBD as like an alternative? Or, like, how did you start to tap into the use of cannabidiol?

I wasn't actually a smoker prior to experiencing cbd. I had in the past, you know, high school. I found myself couch locked a number of different times with some Kansas ditch weeds, but it just didn't really resonate with me. And what I watched some of what happened to some of my friends, it just wasn't resonating with me. So I didn't do it through college and for the most part, other than after a night of drinking or something. But it wasn't really part of my life until a couple of my friends approached me. They wanted me to help do some marketing for their second documentary on the medicinal benefits of cannabis, the science behind cannabis. And that really piqued my interest then because I never really thought about the medicinal benefits of this plant. And they started to share with me and show me video clips of some of the footage they received. Their first film is@marijuanamovie.org and, you know, they went around and filmed some of the best doctors and thought leaders on the subject of cannabis to really get into the science behind this amazing plant. And so I told them that I would keep my mind open and. And more importantly, if it worked for this little. I call him little Lance. He's basically a little brother of mine that I've known for the last eight years when I was running half marathons for the Crohn's and Colitis Foundation. Lance was the poster child for the San Diego chapter. And he would come in and he was 7 years old at the time, and he was just little, tiny little guy, twig and bones, nothing to him. And he was bouting with Crohn's his entire life, in and out of the hospital every single month. And so I just fell in love with him and his family and Kind of adopt him as a bigger brother. And for the last seven years prior to cbd, I've been trying to find things that would work for him, trying to help change their diet, giving him acai berry, all these different things, and trying to get him off pharmaceutical drugs. So I said to the guys, I said, listen, if we're going to film all these doctors, all these scientists, all these researchers about cannabis, let's also look at some, what we call now BNA's before and afters. Let's give this to some people and actually film their progress. And Lance was the first person I chose. And today Ben, I can probably say he's 15 months hospital free for the first time in his life. And so as soon as we started to see those benefits with Lance, here's an example, we thought we were going to have to film 20 different people, follow them around while giving them CBD in hopes that we would have seven really good stories. Well, turns out we gave this to eight different people and every one of them made the film. Every one of them had life changing impact, which was mind blowing to us. And so after I saw the real kind of in with my own eyes of a family, basically family member being helped with it, plus a number of different people we got to film, I started to look more and more into the medicinal benefits then. And so going from the days of Kansas, you know, getting, getting into cannabis or marijuana for the high to where I'm really fascinated and eyes wide open for the medicinal benef is where I stand today.

Okay, gotcha. And do you use CBD every day?

Absolutely.

Okay, the reason I ask is like it's my gut. I just wrote an article about sleep cycles and I take 20 to 40 milligrams of this nature CBD that full disclosure to the audience. It's formulated by James's labs using this nanoparticle delivery. And we're not going to get into that because we did a whole podcast on how you can make, make these molecules super duper small, cause them to be absorbed at a rate that allows you to take about 10 times less cannabidiol to get the same effect as you would from a lot of cbd. But James, as far as CBD delivery mechanisms, what kind of forms do you use? I use the nature CBD capsules obviously, because I help to formulate those and that's my brand. But I'm curious how you, how you like to use your, your cbd, you or summer?

Yeah, well, Ben, we have your capsules here at the house. We Love taking them every day. First of all, we have the gel that, you know, is one of the things we formulated. I sent some samples up to you for that. We also brought.

The gel is the one that you put sublingually under your tongue and you hold, right?

Yes, exactly. Hold it for 90 seconds. It starts to start to act right away into your system. People feel it within a few seconds. So that's kind of our rapid response. Ge.

What do people feel?

Depends on. Without making any claims, Ben, but for people that like your audience. Right. Most people aren't dealing with a major ailment. If they are, then they'll start to feel kind of sometimes a relief in that area. I'm trying not to make any actual claims here, but for the most part, people feel like this kind of like, you know, when you first take a powerful shot of like, even green algae or wheatgrass or even acai berry for the first time, your body's kind of like, just takes on this, like, wow, that you can check in and feel good. That's what we get. And so most people, that's the immediate piece within a couple seconds to actually feel it in their body. And then two, most people with, you know, 10 to 20 milligrams will get kind of a clear focus, just kind of a little presence to themselves and what they're working on.

Okay, got it. And so you've got the. You've got the capsules, you've got the gel that you put underneath your tongue.

Topical oil up to your house, which is really great for sore muscles, joints, pain that happens to be in the shoulders or back or anywhere. That. And then also the vaporizer. Right. You know, vaporizing a CBD that is basically no THC or trace amounts of THC again, will produce not a high, but a. Just a relaxed calming effect and presence and not a sedative of like, I need to be on the couch or sleep. But, you know, I will, you know, if I have a lot of calls throughout the day, you know, I have a CBD vape pen next to me, and I'll just kind of puff on it a couple times just to almost just relax my nervous system a little bit. It's really subtle, Ben. So there's not a real expressive. What am I trying to say? Feeling. Yeah. Dramatic effect. It's just real internal. In fact, if you're not really in touch with your body or whatnot, you might not even feel it. So it's so subtle.

Now, the vaporizer, something like that. Is that, like, can you travel with that is that legal to just like put in your carry on bag? Can you take it on? Obviously you wouldn't take it in the airplane bathroom and vape, but I mean, can you take it like cross borders across states, things like that?

Yeah, the legalities of our CBDs that we derive from hemp, so it's hemp oil derived. And so just like all hemp seeds, hemp T shirts, hemp oil that you see in every grocery store, we get our CBD from hemp oil. So it's just as legal as hemp oil. It can go across all state borders. We ship to all 50 states. And so, yes, you can carry it on your checked on luggage if you want.

Because it's made from industrial hemp, not from like marijuana per se.

Correct. Just to be really clear on this, you know, if there's. If it's marijuana derived, let's say in the state of Washington or California, it must stay in that state. You must have a license, and you must get it from a dispensary. That's the marijuana side of the plant. So cannabis has two sides of the plant, marijuana and hemp. And we derive, specifically in this conversation, we derive our CBD from hemp oil, and therefore it's classified as hemp oil and can be shipped California, Colorado, Florida, Kansas.

Okay, got it. And do you use it too, somewhere?

Yeah. Well, one of the more dramatic effects I feel whenever I use it is actually during like day one of menstrual cramps. That seems to really help. Help me. It's one of the more like dramatic feelings. Improvement of feeling, I guess you could say. And then in general, if I have like an acute injury, I'll use it for pain and inflammation.

Okay, I didn't know that. I'll have to fill Jessa in. So it could be used for like, PMS symptoms, menstrual cramps, things along those lines.

Yeah, I just noticed that it just kind of relieves cramping in the gut and even the low back a bit.

Yeah, I know that it decreases because I did some research on CBD and like irritable bowel syndrome and stuff like that. I actually, you know, what I should do in the show notes for folks is I just did a big podcast with the website Smart Drug Smarts, where we talk about all the little things I've found lately regarding cbd. So if you're listening in and you want to geek out on CBD big time, go listen to that podcast episode on Smart Drug Smarts and I'll link to it's episode 124. It's actually a good podcast. Either way, that. That entire smart drug smarts thing. Were you saying something, James?

I was gonna say it's actually one of the most common testimonials we get from women is that to use it during their moon cycle or their cycle of the month. So, yeah, please have Jessa try and let us know what she feels. Everybody's different at the end of the day, CBD is one of those things that's fascinating that it works on so many different aspects of the body because the endocannabinoid system really, really helps regulate every system of the body. And so CBD affecting that system, it goes to that system, addresses wherever is needed. So if during that time of the month, that's where your body needs the most love and support and energy focus, CBD goes and starts to support that area of your body.

Got it. Okay, so there's another thing that I wanted to touch on another. Another compound that is probably a lot more controversial, even more so than, say, cannabis, and that would be psilocybin. Now, I know that you have some experience with the use of mushrooms and psilocybin, and I'm curious how you first discovered or tapped into that and why.

I think that psilocybin, like a lot of what people call drugs, but we're really talking about plant based medicine here, is to tap into an altered state of consciousness. And I think as humans, that's something that we're always looking to do. We're, you know, same with meditation is that where can I get into a different perspective than my day to day, normal life? And so for me, the first time that I did psilocybin or mushrooms was back with college buddies. And we thought it was, you know, just when it's. We wanted to experiment with something and that was a lot of fun. We played, we put on some, you know, old costumes and ran around in nature and things like that and built forts and had a lot of fun. But now, Ben, you know, as I look and study it more and see this, some of the other aspects of why different people are using it now, there's a lot of science about is coming down to me. For me, again, what I like to use is like similar to what I did in the beginning. But I don't do as much for play. And as a recreation, I do it more for dropping into nature, dropping into a meditative state, dropping into a place of getting a different perspective on life, because I can be in my head quite A bit throughout the day building companies and you know, psilocybin. Every once in a while I like to drop into a different experience and take a. For me it allows my intuition to come out, allows me to ask questions of some bigger force, God consciousness, whatever it is, is. I can ask questions there and the answers are quite profound and really help me.

Do you microdose with it? From the research that I've done like one and a half to three milligrams or so of psilocybin is like an acceptable dose to actually feel some of the effects. But I've also heard of people using very, very small amounts for as almost like a nootropic throughout the day as like a smart drug or a pick me up. Like what, what do you. Or what have you looked at as far as dosages are concerned?

Yeah Ben, and it's actually not milligrams. Most people dose anywhere between one and three grams or grams.

Sorry, yeah, grams.

Yeah, no, all good. And so yes, I just actually started getting into in this last year microdosing and I think it's a phenomenal place for me. Anyways, I'll just speak from my own experience and one thing I want to share with you Ben is that there I was just shared with from this from some friends of ours from another website that I won't mention them right now because I didn't get their permission but anyways to mix it with lemon juice. And when you mix it with lemon juice Ben, you can take a fraction of that. I would start with one tenth of what you would normally take. So start now with milligrams instead, like 100 milligrams instead of 1 gram. If you were going to do a 1 gram and anyways you mix it with lemon juice and when you mix it with lemon juice and let it set for five to 10 minutes and when you take it it the onset is a lot faster. Instead of taking maybe 45 minutes to kick in, it'll kick in as quick as 10 minutes and the length is a lot shorter. And so you'll get the experience, you'll have it for like an hour and then almost immediately within a couple five minutes you're off of it and you're back to like you can't even know that it's there. And so lemon is a way of making more bioavailable bioactive something. It allows it to go into the system a lot faster. I've heard about this with cranberry juice, but not as strong as lemon juice.

Yeah, grapefruit they say that as well, although I know, interestingly, I was reading a book on marijuana, and with marijuana, it's actually a mango extract that surprisingly appears to magnify the effects. I don't know if it speeds up the effects, but it definitely magnifies the effects. Which might be why a lot of the more popular strains of marijuana seem to have mango added to them somehow. Or mango flavoring.

Yeah, our CBD gel, that rapid response gel as a mango.

Oh, really?

Yes.

I did not know that.

I believe in India they've known this for a long time. We're just kind of waking up to it in the Western world. Dr. Mewa is an Indian man. It's part of the magic behind that rapid response gel.

Yeah, he was on the podcast along with you and we were talking about a cbd. That's very interesting. So what's the proposed mechanism of action for something like psilocybin? How's that actually working? Is it similar to CBD where it's working on something like the endocannabinoid system or do you know exactly what's going on when you feel that creativeness or when I did it, an intense connection with nature, not just the same day using the psilocybin, but for the next several days afterwards. Do you know what's going on there from a cognitive or physiological standpoint?

You probably know more about this, Ben, than I do. And I can't really speak into this as a doctor. I do want to plug in an amazing movie that some friends of mine have edited called Neurons to Nirvana. And in there they cover five different plant based medicines and psilocybin and cannabidiol are two of them.

Them.

And so it's a phenomenal movie. And it looks into the research and the science behind these clinical studies that are now coming out that answer these questions as to how this is affecting the body, why it's affecting the body, and what people might want to consider using it for.

Okay, gotcha. It's called Neurons to Nirvana.

Yes. Okay, free film.

I'll put a link to that in the show notes. Yeah, the only thing I've heard about psilocybin is that it can mimic the effects of serotonin. Right. So basically, if you get like a dopamine dopaminergic response, I get like a big dump of dopamine or a big dump of serotonin. It's considered to be like a feel good type of chemical that enhances everything from like sex to creativeness to your perception of colors. And you Know, I'm sure that there are some other neurotransmitters being released. But I know one of the big, big things that it causes is a serotonin duct, which is, I suppose they have these selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors that flood the brain with serotonin for people who are depressed. I would imagine that someone at some point has probably looked into psilocybin as a treatment for things like anxiety and depression.

Absolutely. That's what the studies are coming out right now is. And they've got some major universities and backers. Some of the best clinical studies are happening really around that. Anxiety, depression, things like that. And you know, because it is a serotonin boost bend like everything we got to everything in life should be used in balance. And so I just want to give that disclaimer is that, you know, using for recreation or maxing out 3 grams or more, you can really mess with your system. So, you know, I just always come back to people, you know your body, you know your limits and you are your best doctor.

Now what do you, you know, for example, when I've used psilocybin based edible, it was mixed with things. Do you take it in an edible form? Do you take it in like a tincture form? Do you just use the raw mushroom? What is your preferred mechanism of delivery?

Up until just this recent, lemon oil, where I've taken this powder and mixed it with lemon juice for a micro dosing experience. I would buy it from people that I know that had mixed it with chocolate, raw chocolate, and they would also mix in some other superfoods and that would be other mushrooms and different experiences that you would want to have. So now there are chefs that can mix it in with chocolate and create an experience in itself. The last time I purchased it from a raw chef, actually he asked me, do you want the one that's more creative, uplifting and fun or do you want one that's going to allow you to be more meditative and do some work? And so chocolate form is a great way to do it. Powder and lemon juice powder. A lot of people just mix it with any kind of food or pizza, hide it because it can taste a little bit interesting. And I think in the future, Ben, we're going to start to see it a little bit more into people making experiences like in capsules where you'll have some other herbs. Like your CBD formulation is a great example. CBD or psilocybin, it's one part of it, but mixing it with other herbs for synergistic effect, let's say ashwagandha and lemon balm, like your current formulation, would allow for a different experience than mixing it with some moringa, for example. But I think we're going to start to see a little bit more of that as the science catches up to how beneficial this aspect of the. Of mushrooms can be.

Interesting. And so. So in terms of frequency, how frequently would you use something like that? If you're using cannabidiol, every day, would psilocybin be just like a weekly, like a monthly, very special type of trip that you'd go on for microdosing, would it be a daily? Or what exactly would frequency look like?

I can only answer for myself. For me personally, I like to do a little bit of a stronger piece only when I'm called. I don't have a set routine, but there are times in my life where I feel like, wow, this would be a really good opportunity. I've been working hard, or I've been going just to really drop into nature and really get into a place of where I believe new pathways are being built in my brain from this. And there's some research out there about this. And it really just disrupts my normal way of communicating, my normal way of being. And so it flips the perspective on its edge. And then that's for the bigger times. I like to do it so maybe a couple times a year. And then on the microdose, Ben, again, I find my own place of balance around it. And I've been talking to a number of different people and reading some different forms that doing it once every week, not in a prolonged time, but just two or three weeks at a time, will get. I'm experimenting with that right now, is what I should say, is to see how that shows up when I'm not on it. Because for me, one of the biggest things that I want to experience through this is taking less and less and less of it, Ben, and still being able to access those points, if that makes sense. So same with cannabis is that when I smoke, I like to smoke and go into a meditative state because it allows me to drop away the ego, drop away the mind for a minute. But as I take less and less, and then that's the point of microdosing. Take less and less to still get you to that place. So that I would love to be at a place where I was an enlightened guru, where I didn't need external things to allow me to drop into that quiet place of nothing.

Right, Right. That makes Sense. And with the psilocybin, is that actually illegal everywhere to use? I mean, what's the legality on that? Is it just kind of one of those gray areas where you can pick a mushroom if you're walking through, through the forest and it's, it's. You're right. Or how does that work exactly?

You know, that's it is illegal in the United States. I think there's a couple different countries that still allow for it to be sold. But as far as the United States, it is still considered a Schedule 1 drug and therefore has potential for abuse. And it does grow wild like you can find it here in Kauai. I have gone picking before and so got it. Apparently there's no restriction for cultivation as long as it's not being intended use to be used as a drug. So whatever that means.

Yeah, I was just curious. Apparently I have some here in the forest on my land that one mushroom expert who I was walking through the forest with pointed out to me. But I was just curious about the actual legality regarding harvesting and use, etc. So you guys obviously live pretty connected lives when it comes to your physical and spiritual awareness. Everything from kundalini yoga to cannabidiol to psilocybin. I'm curious though, just for everybody listening in, are there any other practices like physical practices or spiritual or medicinal practices that you would consider to be crucial components of your lives that people might not know about that might fly under the radar? Right. Like a lot of people living normal day to day lives, they don't think much about using things like kundalini or CBD or psilocybin. Are there other things that you guys have tapped into or discovered?

I'll speak for myself and for me, as James had said, I start the morning with gratitude. And sometimes I'm called to do a mantra for 40 days. So what? For whatever. And just like yoga and breath work, there's different mantras for different things that you can work on. So you know, in Kundalini we learn if you do anything for 40 days, it develops a habit. And so sometimes I'll do either a certain practice for 40 days or a mantra for 40 days. Meditation is always a vital element of my day. And I try to do. I always get in a morning meditation and I'm just now trying to do twice a day, so one in the morning and one in the evening and I always do prayer in the morning and it's just right at the end of my yoga practice. And then for me personally, you know, I tend to need a lot of grounding. And so for me, it's, you know, getting my bare feet on the sand, hiking. You know, anything that I can do to connect with nature on a daily basis is super grounding for me and helps to just. Just, you know, keep me in balance. And there's actually a book called Earthing that, you know, they say if you just get your bare feet on the earth, you know, sand or grass, 10 minutes a day, the earth's electromagnetic field helps to normalize your biological functions. And, yeah, for me, yeah, I find that to be very, very helpful.

It's a really interesting documentary, the Grounding, the Earthing one. And I've talked about this on a podcast recently about how I'll even travel now with these Earthing sandals. They're called Earth Runners, and they have, like, these copper conductive laces and copper plugs on the bottom of them so you can stay earthed or grounded, even if you happen to be, you know, walking through an urban area on concrete and, you know, can't reveal my big, ugly bare feet. But yeah, they're really cool. They're called Earth Runners. I'll link to them in the. In the show notes for people who. Who are interested. What about you, James? Any. Any last little things that you do?

Absolutely. So I. I Summer, and I've been talking about this a lot lately, is that I like to have a whole set of tools for modalities in different aspects. For me, I'm all over the place. You know, like we talked about Kundalini, regular Hatha yoga. Breath work is really important to me. Why I like mantras. Sound healing is one of my favorite modalities of all time. So, you know, you set me in front of a couple gongs or a drum, and I'm just taken away. I don't have to do anything. And so all of these, for me, Ben, are ways to get me out of my mind, allow the ego to take a backseat and just drop into, like, a real quiet self awareness, self realization, which is, you know, one of my highest goals in life as much as possible. You know, another thing that takes me there, Ben, and, you know, this is the action sports, you know, so I surf, you know, but it also can be hiking in nature. It's really, you know, getting so dialed in and present in the moment. That's the same to me as mantra breath work, meditation, and yoga.

Now, this sound therapy that you're talking about, can people purchase, like, these gongs or drums and ring them and use them that way? Or do you just put on music? How exactly does that work?

Well, yeah, you can do either or. I mean, I have a Reiki drum, so I actually use it in my individual healing sessions with people to help clear energy. Think of it as like vibrational healing. Helps to unblock stagnant energy. So you can use it like that or you can just, you know, literally, you know, you can look on Spotify and type in, you know, gong or chakra balancing music or, you know, Native American music or drum or whatever it is that you want. In Kundalini yoga specifically, they're really big on the gong. And. And so we would have that whenever I was in India at the end of. At the end of our practices, they would do the gong for 10, 15 minutes. And I just. It was just totally refreshing and it just felt like a super deep, like powerful nap almost that you. That you went through and then you're just really clear whenever you wake up. So, yeah, it's like vibrational healing sound's.

Been around since the beginning of time, as you know, Ben. And so even, even for some people, guitar, right, Playing music. But you can buy Native American flutes. It doesn't take any experience to learn. Drumming is another great thing that hardly any experience. And you can pick it up another thing, you know, strum sticks or guitars, things like that. The string instruments they put produce vibrations. And when you're quiet and you're playing those actually they do work on your body without you having to do anything.

Yeah. I actually had a very interesting conversation at a conference I spoke at with a woman who wrote a book called Tuning the Human Biofield. And what she does is she trains you. She sends you tuning forks that vibrate and she trains you how to use specific notes to address specific areas of your body because different notes up from a tuning fork fork resound with a different frequency. It was really a very interesting discussion. I tend to be a little bit more organic like you, James, and I'll just, you know, sing, which has been shown to activate your vagus nerve or your parasympathetic nervous system. Or I'll strum on the guitar just because frankly, I'd rather be playing Johnny Cash than waving a tuning fork around my head. But it really is an interesting book. I'll link to it in the show notes called Tuning the Human Biofilm. It's about healing with vibrational sound therapy. So we have obviously dug deep into the woo woo on this episode. From Kundalini to vibration sound therapy to psilocybin and beyond. But for those of you listening in who just like to do, say, I don't know, riding a bicycle and wearing a Fitbit, you're missing out on a lot if that's your idea of what makes you a whole body, physically, mentally, spiritually, et cetera. And I'd really encourage you to delve into some of the notes that I've created over@BenGreenfieldFitness.com YogaPodcast and consider just picking one or two things and maybe delving into some of this stuff a little bit and seeing how it changes your life. Because like I mentioned, my morning has dramatically changed. My life has dramatically changed by using a lot of these things, from plant based medicines to breath work to different forms of yoga. And James and Sommer have certainly taught me a lot over the past month or so and in a lot of the realms that we just got done discussing. So, James Sommer, I want to thank you for coming on the show and being so generous with this information.

Thanks for having us, Ben.

It's our pleasure, Ben, to you and your amazing following. Community. Aloha.

Aloha and the Mua. All right, folks, so this is Ben Greenfield, James Redina and Dr. Summer Nicole signing out from BenGreenfieldFitness.com check out the show notes@BenGreenfieldFitness.com yoga podcast and have a healthy week. You've been listening to the Ben Greenfield Fitness podcast. Go to BenGreenfieldFitness.com for even more cutting edge fitness and performance advice. It.