Season 2 | Episode 57 | Lenny the Lying Lizard Intervention w/Jennifer Smith & Lorenzo Cantoja

Lance, I'm already laughing. Why episode? Because it'd be Fun. Episode. Episode 57.

Yeah, dude, 57 is going to be amazing. You know what else is going to be really good?

What's that?

58, 59, 56, 50. I can't count. I can't count. The truth is I can't count.

9, 60 and 61. Yeah, dude, this one's gonna be great. Hey, can I make an announcement?

Please make a really good announcement.

Right?

Okay. Texas people. April 25th. April 25th. It's a Friday night Saturday. We are doing a Texas gathering dinner on Friday night in Austin, out outside Austin area. And Hill Country Bible Church is hosting us on Saturday for an all day 9 to 4 event where Eric Salwin will be teaching on the forgiveness model. The forgiveness model within the restoration therapy. And we'll get seven CEUs. What? It's $50 and that includes lunch and snacks. And your CEUs dinner Friday night is on you right now. I was looking at registration. Our goal is to really have about 35 people. That'd be like pretty massive for us, I think, in our first gathering. And I looked earlier this morning. I think we have about 19 spots left. So if you're in Texas, Texas area, sign up. That's all I got for that. Boom.

Dude, I might sneak out there.

You.

You should. You should sneak out. We. We'll find something.

I could probably just go, but there's no.

Yeah, there's no coastline, nothing. Oh, there is a coastline, but it's not pretty like California. So maybe we can cruise around Texas Hill country, hang out with Michael Cox and all the other Texas people.

Dude, I love that guy.

You have any announcements?

I just got to say, like, we got to hang out this last weekend. It was fun.

Yeah, Lance and I got to hang out this last weekend. And yeah, with spouses I got to meet.

I met Heather.

Yeah.

For the first time, which was cool. And you met Jen before.

I've met Jen before, but we got to spend more time with Jen and you got to meet my wife Heather, who's amazing. And so, yeah, we talked about having.

The spouses do a thing. I don't think it's. I don't know if it'll happen or not.

We should have on the podcast.

Yeah, that would be so cool.

What is it like to be a spouse of a therapist?

Yeah, that might be the only time they listen to the podcast too. If they're off, they're on it.

Oh, my gosh. Gosh, bro. So we got some action going on, like these Next five set five episodes are going to be. You're going to want to get on the video, right?

Yeah.

I mean, you can listen for sure, because we will narrate really well, decently. I mean, but do you want to talk about what we're doing?

Yeah. We are returning to what we did kind of earlier in episode 45. We had Nancy Freegard out with a couple of her awesome therapists, Jennifer and Lorenzo, and how you guys, they have. They're part of Freedom Family Counseling in Phoenix, in Glendale, and they have really cool shirts, apparently. Yeah, they got swag, too.

Oh, yeah.

But they're doing amazing stuff with. Specifically, we were focusing on kids and working with kids, adolescents, and they were doing some really cool activities around that time, like the sports camp and some other stuff that we posted about. And you and I were thinking they need to come back on and do just interventions. Yeah, it was really popular when Tanner did marital interventions, a couples work stuff. And we were kind of talking about. We don't have a lot of interventions around children, youth, adolescent that we've been talking about. And they seem like the perfect two to come on and do this. So you want to say anything else about them before we let them on here?

I think we are in for a treat today and for the next few days, so game on.

All right. Hey, welcome to the podcast, you two.

Thanks so much. Good to be here. Pretty stoked. Yeah, it's gonna be great.

Is there anything you want to say that we did not say introduction about you to.

Oh, yeah.

Well, I want to just say Lorenzo is in the middle of his sports camp.

Oh, it's on right now.

If you want to say anything about how that's been going.

It's been going good.

Yeah.

The sports camp, it's been fun. Definitely learning a lot, too, as we're going along, especially, you know, seeing, you know, when it comes to these camps, too. And without disclosing anything with the kids, I'll just say when there's ADHD involved and you have a lot of things out, we gotta make sure. Especially sports items. We gotta really make sure that we have those sealed away. So learning that the first two weeks was definitely a game changer. And, you know, it's been really great as far as, you know, having the other interns working with me in that field. And, yeah, just seeing these kids come together in sports is really fun. You know, I think sports nowadays can get a little competitive to the point where it's like, oh, I gotta prove my worth or myself through this sport or like, if I do this, then, you know, maybe I can make dad love me or I can make, you know, something happen out of this, like, instead of just joy of the game. And that's what we're really emphasizing in these sports camps. So, yeah, I'm looking forward to the next one, too, and just learning and just continuing to grow this. So it's gonna be fun, but. Oh, it's been a lot of fun. I love these kids.

I'm excited about. You know, when Lance and I started this podcast, we just started it on our own because we wanted to, like, try to connect people. But we. Obviously, the RT community is huge, and we know some people, but not everybody. And there's so many cool things happening out there, like this sports stuff, you know, that we knew about from our last podcast. And so I'm just saying that out loud because a lot of people listening are doing really cool stuff, and we'd love to hear from you, too. And so I'm excited to see where this, you know, what you two are doing and Nancy is doing in that community, you know, I think is a really important template for how we can take RT and that work into other. Other communities as well. So no pressure on you at all. You too, for today.

No, no, no, don't drop the ball.

So explain what you guys are going to do today. We're going to do, I think, five interventions, correct?

Yes. So five interventions, and we figured we'll do one for kind of every RT step and we'll go in it in sequence. So let's talk about pain, like how to identify pain, um, how to identify the truth, um, how to also practice the four steps. So one thing that. Actually, now I'm looking at these interventions, one thing we're not diving into specifically is the coping part. Mainly because we did that the first episode is when we introduced the coping characters. So with identifying coping with kids, it's basically whatever character they really embody or kind of go to. And with interventions, you'll see we did, like, obviously, when we get to the four steps, we'll talk about coping as well. Yeah, cool.

And we'll link that episode you did before to the notes and everything so people can take a look at that. Well, you guys are in charge. Let's let you start. So this is intervention number one, essentially, episode 57.

Yes. All right, so we might. We'll probably do a little role play for most of these. And so to set this first one up, this is usually one that I'll do second session. Usually I'll do more of like an assessment first session, talking with parents or guardians. And I'll usually do like a kinetic drawing or something like that first session and just really trying to join with the client. Next session I'm really exploring or teaching or giving language of our, you know, Lenny, the lying lizard. So that's where they're starting to begin. Or they have this concept now of there's someone that reacts when we experience pain. So you'll see me kind of explain it how I will explain it to kids. And we'll also simultaneously be introducing Shalom, the truth dove, who is like that wise part of our brain that regulating truth and how she's the boss of Lenny. And so but we'll do it through play and a specific kind of intervention that we'll do. So in this one, I'm going to be the therapist. Lorenzo will be the client. So we'll just kind of jump in.

Be a big kid.

He'll be a big kid.

For those of you that are listening as they're talking, you, you'll see Jen has the Lenny in her hand. And also Shalom and the dove. So just so you're keeping in mind when you hear, I guess you'll notice these things.

Yes, yeah. Or if my voice changes suddenly, that's why.

Yeah.

All the voices. There's so many voices. You can do so many voices with these guys. So Lenny will come in different forms, different spices, same with Shalom. Yeah, you might have, you know, something with like a high pitch going up and then back down or whatever the case may be. It have some inflection, but we'll see.

All right. All right. So, Lorenzo, I'm so glad to have you back today. So one thing I was kind of wondering since last time is what do you know about lizards?

They're. They're like dinosaurs. A little bit.

Yeah. Yeah, a little bit like miniature dinosaurs. What else? Any fun facts about them?

Lizards, they have like sharp teeth. They have sharp teeth that they can bite with.

Yes, definitely. They could definitely bite here. Do you want to play with them? So lizards, among those facts that you said are cold blooded, that means they can't regulate their temperature. So to survive, you know, you know, they. Have you ever seen a lizard out on a rock in the sun?

Yeah, I seen one in my playground before on the salon.

And he's tanning, he's getting on the sun. But then he has to act real fast and move. Can you make him go fast? Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly, Just like that. And so. And he has to cool Off. So where did he go to cool off, you think? Oh, maybe. Yes, Maybe go buy some water. Yeah, that's. That's him regulating and cooling down. So the cool thing about us humans is that we have a part of our brain that's like Lenny helps us survive, protects us. If we're being chased by a bear, we might need to, like, get at safety. But he gets tricky sometimes when we have heart, emotions that hurt, he might trick us into acting fast and doing something we might not want to do. So we have a part of our brain called Shalom or we call her Shalom or the truth Dove. And she is the boss of Lenny. So when Lenny acts fast in our brain, we'll be like, wait a second, that's not true or that's not right. And she regulates us because we're warm blooded, right? We can regulate. So let's. Let's practice that. Let's play a game. Okay, so yeah, we can put Lenny over here because he's still going to be. He might be telling us lies. I also forgot to tell you his name. He's called Lenny the lying lizard and he tells us lies sometimes in our brain when we feel pain because he's trying to get us to act fast, to do something, to survive. So with that, we're gonna practice. We're gonna do some arm circles. Have you ever done that before? Okay, we're gonna do arm circles and see how long we can do them. Okay, are you ready? Okay, we're gonna stand up. All right, Ready, set, go. Sorry, guys.

They're doing. They're going really fast with their arms right now. For those of you who are listening, we're getting tired. Lorenzo is really good at this and Jen is like, next level.

I gotta give up. Oh, it's hurting. You're feeling sore.

That hurt.

So what kind of things were going on in your brain right there? What were you noticing?

This hurts so bad.

Yeah, it's sore. You gotta stop. Yeah, I know. For me, I was like, ugh, I can't go for so long. That is like our Lenny lying lizard telling us to stop. We can't go on. So we're gonna try it again. We're gonna see if we could beat our time. Okay, this time, when you start to hear Lenny's lies in your head, I want you to say out loud the truth. Which I could. Keep going. I'm strong. You wanna try that? See if it works?

Okay.

Okay. All right, I'm gonna try too. So when I start to feel myself wanting to give up, I'm gonna start. Say the truth. All right, we're getting a Shalom. All right, let's try again. All right. Ready, set, start. Yeah, I can go farther than I did last time.

I can do it.

You're so strong. I'm strong.

All right.

I think you can beat me. You can beat me. Keep going.

I can do it.

Yeah. All right. Pause. We beat our time. Oh, my gosh. Yes. So that is an example. You just did it. You told yourself the truth, and you are the boss of Lenny. Isn't that awesome?

Yeah.

Lenny.

No, no, not Lenny here right now.

Lenny.

Dummy head.

All right, perfect. So that's the end of Lenny. Introducing Lenny the Lying lizard. And Shalom.

What do you do? You call that any specific intervention, particularly when you guys practice?

It's more of a. Well, in the book we listed as just Lenny the Lion Lizard. That is like the intro.

Yeah.

So you could either do that. You can do a plank. You can do.

Yeah, you could do different things.

You could do a progressively harder exercise where it's like, you can have them do a plank on their knees.

And.

And then. Okay. And then usually for kids, they're like, oh, that's easy. And then be like, okay, now go ahead and get both knees up. And then. Okay, it's getting harder. Okay, now go ahead and lift one foot up in the air and hold that plank. And then go ahead and hold both hands up. And then eventually get to a place where they're like, no, I can't.

What are you talking about?

Like, you can't get to that.

Yeah, yeah.

So that's definitely where you could adjust the need or the abilities of the kids. Arm circles seem to work. Or you can. You can keep the time low. Like, you could say, let's see if we can make it past 30 seconds. Because sometimes kids will want to go, especially when you introduce Shalom. They'll want to go for, like, three minutes. It's like, all right, let's keep going.

You guys must get buff at the end of the day.

Massive shoulders there.

Like doing emdr. And you're like, oh, my gosh.

You got to tell yourself the truth. I could keep going.

That's what I have to do.

Is there an age range that you find that most effective with in your work?

I would say all of these interventions.

Like, 5 to 12.

Yeah, I would say 5 to 12. Yeah, 5 to 12. So I'll say this, though, too. I would taught a undergrad class one time introducing these concepts to undergrad students, and they had a blast I did this arm circle intervention and they like loved it.

So.

Yeah, so it's obviously designed for kids, but I've done this.

Yeah.

And you could, you could maybe take the puppets out for like an adult or something.

Yeah.

But just to kind of demonstrate. Hey, you have power over that part of your brain that says, don't do this anymore.

So say the things that are important to say about the lizard. Just so people that are, you know, listening. What were the. You said they're cold blooded, which means they have so and they can't regulate. So say. Say those things.

Yeah. So cold blooded, they can't regulate, meaning they don't have control over their body temperature. So. So to survive, I use that language to survive.

Yeah.

They have to act fast without thinking. So then, you know, sometimes they'll say, we have a lizard brain. We have a Lenny in our head. A way too. To also incorporate spiritual integration is to talk about how that is an important part of our design. Or you could say that even leaving God out, you could just be like, that's an important part of our design. It protects us. And it's really important because kids might hear Lenny, lying lizard. Oh, Lenny is bad because he lies. Or they'll want to like beat him up. It's important to say, no, he's just trying to survive. We have that inside of us.

Oh, that's good.

It helps us survive when there's danger.

Yeah.

But sometimes when our heart gets poked, we react in ways that don't fit.

Yeah.

So a good way to frame it too. You could say Lenny, you know, would say when he.

What?

What happens if Lenny comes in and tries to protect us when we don't really need protection right here, like, let's say. And then, you know, he'd bring in the coping characters and situations where it's like, okay, like, what happens if Lenny tells you this? And then how do we act? Like we might be contessa, Sharla, Brutus, Eddie. Right. Go into either blame, shame, control, escape. And when you identify those, then the kid might say like, yeah, I'll yell at my parents and be like. And usually they just stop yelling at me. Or they don't wanna, you know, eventually they leave and then I don't feel as bad. And then we might be like, okay, well, why might we not want to do that act and listen to what happens? Well, they usually get more mad at.

Me or I get in trouble or.

I get in trouble or I might. Yeah. And then we can kind of explore that a little bit more with the kid where it's like, oh, okay, here's okay. So I could see, yeah, Lenny's trying to protect. And he has a good job of trying to silence an emotion. But what ends up happening is that. Okay, now we got a whole different flurry of other emotions coming in that are also painful. So.

Nice.

Yeah, heavy emphasis there.

Yeah.

And then when you differentiate to Shalom, our dove, like the things we want to say are.

Yeah. So again, so we are warm blooded. So we can control, we can make choices. Which kind of leads again, to the truth. Right? We can control. Yeah. So we can make choices. So let's. And it's the boss of Lenny. The only one that could quiet Lenny. That regulate that part is Shalom is the truth. Because sometimes, right, we'll go to coping to try to silence Lenny or prove otherwise, but the thing is, we can't. That doesn't work. Shalom is the only one that can tell us the truth. That is the boss of Lenny.

Exactly. And general go over. There's an intervention general run through where you access. We can help the kiddos access the truth and find out where that source comes from. And they can use that and start to use it as a place where they can start to defend themselves from any lies trying to infiltrate or influence any type of behavior. So.

Yeah.

Nice.

Yeah.

What do you think, Rhett?

I think it's awesome. I like it. And I. I was also thinking, since I don't work with, you know, 5 to 12 year olds, I was like, oh, I could use some of these stuff with my adult clients. So that's where my brain went, you know, intervention. I really, really like it. So.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Guys, look at this. This is my daughter.

Oh.

And see that on the ground? That is a lizard trap.

Oh, it's a lizard trap. Oh, my gosh.

She is. She has been influenced by you guys trapping Laney the lizard. So we have a lizard trap in the backyard.

Oh, we need to make that into an intervention lizard trap.

That's awesome. That's so.

Yeah, that's awesome.

That's amazing.

You designed her own trap. It's so funny. I was thinking about that coming in.

It was hard.

Yeah.

Oh, tell us.

We'll see. We'll see.

Join the team.

Jolts will be a good addition to you guys.

Yes.

I love that.

Can't give her up, though. She's still too young.

Okay, we'll wait. All right.

Good job, people. Episode 57, intervention number one.

It.