186. What Women Want

This episode is brought to you by our high performance father coaching program where we help men juggle business, marriage and fatherhood to create the greatest balance and impact life has to offer. This is done with our philosophy that is at the core of achieving these phenomenal results in family, self and service and that is investing in yourself first so you can be a true 100% for yourself but just as importantly for those around you that you love and care about. If you're a father struggling with choosing between your work, work and your family, lacking balance and connection in your relationship, what your children need, your own needs whilst building prosperity in your business, head over to highperformancefather.com fill out the form and I'll have my coaches contact you to see how we can help you and if you're a good fit, what it looks like to join the winner's circle on the inside. But for now, take the time to yourself for yourself and enjoy this episode. You know what I love most, Cat, Especially when I do videos. And those who are just joining us, welcome to another episode. When I'm looking at the video, I can see all the bits of all over me from the children's breakfast and my shirts. I'm dusting myself off before I hit the record button. I'm like, too bad. If you're watching this video on YouTube, it's yes. You just have to look at Al's shirts and know that the shoulders and the hip pockets are filled with shit from shoes and hands. But here we have the. The not self proclaimed but her reputation, the orgasm fairy. Welcome, Katrina.

Thank you, Ali. Thank you. Thank you so much. That's what people refer to me as the orgasm fairy because I like to gift them out across the land, sprinkle my magic orgasm dust.

It's certainly got the attention of the men and fathers listening to this. So men pay attention. We have an incredibly powerful. I think this is going to be. Well, I already know this is going to be one of the most powerful episodes. I'm not sure what we'll call it, Kat. Maybe we'll call it what women want, who knows. But essentially this is, this is something that I feel has been a long time coming. I've known you through the gym days and we've spent plenty of time together and really I think a lot of common threads in both of our lives in wanting to help people, wanting to find the ways that we can have better connection and ultimately expanding that out onto all of the moving parts and hats we wear, not just as mothers and fathers but business owners or workers, colleagues, friends, members of society, you know, husband, wife, the daughter and son, you know, as some of our men, some of our old bulls that we call them, getting into their 50s grandfathers, like, it's you couple that with the world today and fuck, there's so much chaos, isn't there? It's crazy. So it's. I'm so glad. This is something I've planned for a long time. Even though I contacted you probably less than six months ago, I'm like, I've got to get Katrina on. This is just going to be an absolute home run. I cannot wait to get. And here we are. The time has ARR.

I know. I'm so excited. It's been a long time. I mean, I've been, you know, dribbling bits of advice into you now for about five years, from when you were training me at the gym and all the way through. So. Yeah. And obviously lovely contact I've had with your beautiful wife and her friends. And. Yeah, I think it's something that we need to chat about more. I kind of am the person that talks about the awkward things that nobody wants to talk about, that sex business and intimacy and all of that stuff. Everybody gets a bit panicked when I start talking about it, but I think it should just be a part of our normal dialogue. It's the same. We talk about our arm injury or our rash or whatever, but we won't talk about our sexual health. And whether you're male, female, it doesn't really matter. It's about acknowledging that part of your body. And as soon as we start to acknowledge that our intimate self is a huge part of our actual self, I think we'll all become a whole lot happier.

Couldn't agree more. Relationships starve to death. Any of you men out there listening who wake up one day and shit hits the fan, it's like, no, mate. You go upstream. This is something where it's like nutrition. You have starved your relationship for a period of time and there are different circles or different areas of what makes your relationship. And things like sex and awareness is a big thing, but things like sex and that level of intimacy, Kat, is really a byproduct of the type and level and types and level of connection that you have to your wife or to your husband. I think it's an incredibly important thing. We're very transparent on this episode and those listening to this. We've built some pretty good runs on the board together over time. Where this is episode 186, and I think A lot of you men are probably ready for this now as well, and hopefully this is the first of many episodes we do together, Kat. But I guess I'd love to start with yourself first and just sharing a bit of your background, your personal story and your journey, and we can layer that into what's led to where you are now and start to dive into some of the nitty gritty behind men, women, mothers, fathers and marriages.

Yeah, well, I'm pretty much just the female version of lots of the guys that are listening to this right now and probably their wives might be listening to. We've all lived a life. We've had, you know, stories that have been impressed upon us as children and that's woven in and became our story. And I've always kind of been on the fringe of some mental health issues my entire life. And I guess in the last few years since losing my mum, I've surrendered into that and gone, okay, yep, this is where I'm at now. I need to really actively work back from there. So I have spent most of my adult life trying to, you know, work through all of those things. But during the process of that, I've been a defence wife. My husband's been. He served 30 years in the military and I spent 27 of them with him. And we've been married for 25 years at the end of March. So we've done the rounds. We've lived all across Australia. We've lived in 25 houses in that 25 years and raised three kids. And obviously my husband was away on deployments and all of those sorts of things, being a military family. And then to put the icing on the top of that, my kids have additional needs, autism and ADHD and complex anxiety and things like that thrown in. So it's a pretty wild ride on most given days. And I've done a gamut of careers in there as well, because being a defence wife, you have to take what you can get when you move. That's the way it is. So a lot of my background was in pharmacy and health. Then I've moved into teaching. I was a teacher aide for special needs kids. And that kind of process, I started wanting something a little bit more for me and I stumbled across the current business that I'm with. Pure romance at a party and just love the values, love the concept. Found out by accident that I had a bit of core knowledge that I didn't really know about and I rolled in from there. And so I used to laugh and say to people by day, I entertain and, you know, educate small children and by evening I entertain and educate beautiful women. And that was kind of how it started and that was eight years ago. And then it became something. Working with my own business gave me the flexibility to be available for my kids, look after my mum before she passed away and just let me connect with women and just see that the difference is available for people just to be able to, I don't know, just give people permission. I guess that's what a lot of it comes down to, permission to own their intimacy, to own their personal skills. And I think that words are a really powerful part of that. I don't ever, other than when I'm going to reference it now use the word masturbate. When I talk about intimacy or with yourself or with anyone else, I always talk about it as self pleasure. We live in a world right now where self love and self care and all of those things are such a buzz term that we use so often. Let's talk about self pleasure as a way to reconnect with yourself. It's not about not being with your partner or any of those things. It's about rediscovering what you like. Because as we age and our bodies change, like a lot of your dads on this journey, they are having massive weight loss and they've gotten to a point where you know what, the weight has crept up that's affected their intimacy, their confidence. And then as it's come off, things have changed again, but they're changing. But maybe their partner hasn't achieved that level of change yet. And so that can create that divide in their intimacy. And it's about reconnecting with that, having the permission to have a conversation and know that it's okay to say, hey hon, how do you feel about this? You know, do you want to introduce some things? Let's try and reconnect. And it's that permission factor, I think for a lot of people that I discovered personally. For a lot of women, that's where it comes from. Especially you know, cultural reasons. So faith based reasons, again, your internal story history, all of those things all affect how people feel about intimacy, but also feel about the conversation around intimacy. And you know, if they've had a faith based, you know, life, they may not know that there is more. They've, you know, they just. No one's ever had that conversation because nobody sits around and goes, by the way. And this is the bit, sorry, I always get excited about this when everyone's doing sex ed right from school. You Know, nobody at any point in time tells you that sex is supposed to be pleasurable. We don't focus on that. We focus on don't get pregnant, don't get an sti, those sorts of things. But we don't actually focus on the fact that the end product of intimacy should be pleasure. That's what it's about. We're not about just making babies. We've moved past that. We're not cavemen anymore. We are supposed to feel good. We're supposed to feel connected with the person that we're intimate with. Pleasure, you know, whether that is, you know, via orgasm or via that connection. Touch, any of those things. That should be our ultimate goal when we're setting out for intimacy, is to make sure that both parties, if you're in a, you know, in a relationship, both parties are feeling pleasured and connected in that situation.

Yeah, couldn't agree more. I mean, that's something we forget in the world full of chaos, Kat, where, you know, in life a lot of us are seeking joy, we're seeking pleasure, we're seeking things that bring worth or meaning or fulfillment. Like it's. It's worth it to have my shit together and organize my routines, look after the kids, build a routine for them so I can have what we call. And I've said this to you when I spoke to the other day. We call it honey and handsome time, which is like a date night, but date, day, date, anytime. So it's worth it to me because I know the end product, not so much will be having sex with my wife, but actually just having that connection together where we can be intimate. And here's the ironic part that I just. I wrote a couple of points because it's. This is. This is such a powerful episode. Those of you listening to this or watching this, we strongly recommend that this can be. We do have a fair few of our father's cat that do share our podcast with women. And apologies if I dropped the odd F bomb, ladies. It's, you know, it's out of passion, nothing else. Definitely not out of habit. I can control. And I've done that before. I've done episodes and not sworn on purpose. And then at the end I said, see, I didn't, um, and even say it then I said it. So. But the irony of this is I wrote a note. It's not sexy to talk about sex or intimacy. And maybe that's why. And we'll talk. We're definitely going to touch on communication because unfortunately, there is a widening of the Gap where the men doesn't talk, the woman doesn't talk. My wife had three Caesareans. That definitely affected her hormones. She had polycystic ovaries and endometriosis. So ivf, our first two kids. So that there's a lot going on. And there's so much going on that, as mentioned, who are just a to B. Mr. Fix. It's. We don't understand. So our perspective is we definitely feel useless at times. But then what do we do? We suppress. And then talking about it. One of our fathers, the other night, we did a coaching piece about talking about intimacy and planning this and not being robotic or methodical, but just planning. When you get all the structures lined up and you're planning, communicating about when you have this block, all of that planning and structure gives you the space to then have all that spontaneity, creativity, pleasure and joy. Like it goes hand in hand. People don't realize that Hollywood's bullshit. You can't just go in and this is what happens. And I laugh about this. You know, they're gonna have sex. She rolls over. There's no mess, nothing to clean up. You're all good. It's like, okay, that's not life.

Life is messy. Life is messy. And everything about it is messy. And it is just what it is. And intimacy is. It does take a little bit of planning. It doesn't have to be some. I think. And this is where sometimes men get caught up in trying to make it. The movies, Exactly. Like they try to make this big magical thing. It's just so simple. Just dumb it down, keep it simple and just like, just. I don't know how to explain it the right way, but just make sure that it's the little things. It's the message in the day. It's not about the flowers. It's not about, you know, it's making sure that your partner feels really comfortable for people if they've been out of intimacy for a little while or which happens as bodies change and hormones and all those things. I often suggest to people to do simple things like put fairy lights in your bedroom. Because then you can see where everything is. But it's soft. Everything's beautiful by fairy lights. Let's be honest. Christmas is magical. If you can make it like Christmas in your bedroom with all of those fairy lights, it just softens the glow, sets the mood. Light a candle, put a bit of music on, you know, and while. So for partners, you know, for fellows that are in relationships, go put the kids to bed and you know, and get those things sorted and then have that time or while your wife's putting the kids to bed, you set up the bedroom and just make it really casual. It's about a massage, it's about creating that touch. For women, you know, the clitoris isn't the only spot on their body that is going to give them pleasure. It's, we've got multiple erogenous zones, same as men have. Give her a massage, massage her feet, you know, any of those things. Create that intimate connection again and start to excite that desire. So women tend to be, men are a little bit different in how their desire works. So women, we kind of peak and then we need to maintain that or we drop off really quick. Which is why, you know, often women are at the end going, okay, are we done yet? Is this, you know, kind of thing? Because we, we need to maintain that stimulation and that's mental as well as physical and touch. And I think it's just sometimes men just go. And no offense guys, I don't mean to sound disrespectful, but as my husband told me once when I grabbed him and put him on a zoom with some girls that I had a party going with and I said, you know, asked him about lots of questions that women had clitoris, all sorts of things. And he said, I don't have a clitoris, I don't know what to do with it. Why do women expect us to know what we're supposed to do with the clitoris? And I went, never really thought about it that way because I don't own one. How am I, how was I supposed to know when I was first working this business out, know what I was supposed to do with it? And I think that's where a lot of guys, they don't know what to do. And they think, okay, in the movies, they're just straight in there. That's just whatever it happens. Whereas for women, it's their whole body, just give her a massage, you know, stroke her arm, do things like that. But do it from a perspective of not. Your end goal isn't penetration. So if you think about it that way, the end goal isn't penetration. The end goal is connection and pleasure. And if you can think of it from that perspective, it changes how you look at intimacy. I think that's probably like sex is a word gets confused. But if you just sort of go, okay, we're not about penetration tonight. We're about making each other feel really, really good. And sometimes mutual self pleasure is enough to Ignite that passion again. And it's not about, you know, the 15 seconds of fame. It's about connection. And I'm going to say that word a thousand times. So sorry, everybody who's listening to this podcast going, oh my God, she's banging on about connection. But it is what it is. If you don't have it with your partner and if you haven't worked at trying to have a connection, then it's kind of a bit of a tough place to start. That's really your starting point for intimacy is connect with her?

Yeah, I couldn't agree more. And we talk about that a lot. We definitely talk about connection. Cat ends up energy. There are a lot of energies that are very easy to read. So, you know, and I say this like, no one responds to energy more than our children because they're not adults. So they, they can't articulate different types of language, body language and whatnot. But they can definitely pick up, sorry words, but they can definitely pick up on things like body language and the energy you express. So you're right, if what the man has it front and center. Sex, sex, sex. And that's just the game. That's the end game. Your wife is going to pick up on that shit a mile away. That's not attractive. Like, you go upstream, it's like you set the stage at 6am when you all wake up and it's like by night time it's done, man. And you can see that in any circumstance, whether it's fights, whether it's fear, anxiety, entering a room, public speaking. There are different types of energy where you can just cut the air with a knife. And that's one of them. Kat And I think they're like a couple of notes I've written here, not that I actually ran into. Look at them at a fundamental level. What, what we, what we're saying here is showing your wife and saying, hey, I appreciate you. You are important to me. I am trying, you know, the hard part with things like the clitoris. What you're saying there is. We make so many assumptions or there's so many unknowns that we don't create knowns through communicating and working together. That just creates this separation. Or we just, we just suppress areas to explore things to explore. And that's not just in the bedroom. It's how to connect through the ways that you communicate is asking questions and being actively vulnerable in that state. You know, it's no different with me and my wife. It's not like I went from, you know, 13 to 25 to 31 days. Like, yeah, I'm. I'm a stud because I've watched a fucking porno, so I know how it works. Like, it, you know, like, it's, it's so funny. It really is. And I look at that and it's what you're sharing there about massaging and whatnot. If there's a passage of time where you haven't given your wife a foot rub, well, that's going to connect. It's going to be like, shit, it's been a long time. This feels really nice on my feet. So. Showing that I appreciate you, you are important to me. I'm trying. That goes hand in hand with some of the things you shared about helping put the kids to sleep and whatnot, and some of the routines of the household. Because when you're a couple, showing your wife that she's important to you and she plays a significant role in your life with, hey, I'm going to take some of the burden off you so you're not fucking exhausted. Because that's another massive turn off for women if they're tired, exhausted and fatigued. And you are too men, because you're working or she's working. You've been home with the kids. If you're both exhausted, you're both fucked. Nothing's going to happen. So this is why health is such a big part of what we do here. But it's not a fitness program. It's your physical, your mental, your emotional health. So when we're sharing some of those loads there with helping out with the kids, the routines, cleaning, all that sort of stuff. Kat, I think it's probably fair to say that what you're doing is you're at least minimizing the depletion of your wife's energy so she could possibly turn up and you can both be there for each other more in what you do. And that's teamwork, right? That's how you run the household.

Absolutely. Like, that's in our house anyway. We are a team and that's how we roll. I guess that's how we've managed to make 25 years of marriage as well. And by no stretch of the imagination has that been a simple road. Obviously my husband did 30 years and he has mental health issues and that's why he discharged from the military. And so, you know, he does have scrambled eggs for brains some days, but that is just something that we work through. And some days I do feel like I've got an extra child, but I have to manage that. I've been very aware lately of not managing that. Like, I'm treating him like one of our kids because that's really disrespectful of me to do that. And I became aware of that with our family therapist, that I was undermining and taking away his masculine space by treating him like a child as well. So there are so many different layers to it. Often women step into, and I know we chatted about this the other night, step into our masculine. So everyone's side, you know, you have a feminine and masculine side to your personality. When you're in control or you need to be in control, women step into that zone and they become their masculine. And so in that that's where we're giving orders and we're bossy and we do all of these things. And sometimes it's really hard for women to step back into their feminine and accept that, you know, their partner can do those things if we let them. It's just that we get a little bit too controlling as women and like to be the boss of everything and that. I'm sure I'm not the only woman out there. And there's probably guys that are listening to this right now going, right, that's my wife. Yes. And it's not that we're innately bossy, it's just simply that out of necessity, you know, if. If hubby's away working long hours, you know, is committed to his job, which is amazing because obviously that pays for the mortgage and the bills and all of those things, and kids, sports. But often they become a little bit absent from the husband, father role. So then mum needs to step into that and so she has no choice but to have to maintain that. You know, they're the disciplinarian. You know, gone are the days where we, you know, when we were kids were to be like, you wait till your father comes home. We don't it now, it's just like, all right, I've got to deal with it right now. This is what we're doing. And so when women do that, they create kind of forget how to be sexy. They forget how to be soft, they forget how to laugh, how to have fun, because their role is being responsible. And again, the flip side can be the same for men as well. They have a feminine side too. And sometimes they get so stuck in that masculine that they don't laugh, they don't have fun. Like, when was the last time? And when I say this to people, they kind of go, oh, like, when was the last time you were just really silly with your kids, with your partner, just had that laughter that just, you know, the dance in the backyard. Playful, fun side of ourselves that we lose as we get older, we forget that it's there. And as our expectations of life and society and all of those things get bigger, we forget how to be playful. And whether that's with your kids and your family or with your partner, like, just be playful in the bedroom. Just play, have fun and enjoy the experience. And just. Yeah, it's taking the load off makes it a little bit less. Because then the woman isn't laying in bed. Because women, I'll give you guys a hint if you don't know it yet. We overthink. Our little brain is all night long thinking about the washing, the ironing, did I put the bins out? Have I got snacks for the kids for lunch tomorrow? All of those things always. So by being playful and having fun, she'll be able to quieten that part of her brain. Because we worked out really early on in the piece that, like, as far as. I mean, if you go back to the caveman days, sex was about reproduction. If we didn't want to reproduce, then we didn't have sex. That's simple as it was. So for women, if life's really stressful and really hard, the first thing that our brain ditches is libido and that desire. Because we just don't have time. We don't have time for that. And it's really sad because we are in a busy society. That's our favorite word these days. When everybody says, how have you been? You go, I've been so busy. Well, you didn't have to be so busy. You chose to be busy because you chose to take all of that on. And if you didn't choose it, you let it happen because you enjoy it. You think it's what makes you feel important. Whereas, you know what? Who cares? Go talk to your plants. I love wandering around my yard chatting to my plants and my chooks. It's when I feel the most calm because I'm just connected to nature, real stuff. Not, I'm busy and all of that rubbish. And that's when, yeah, the playful side of you comes out. And that's when you can relax into that and be more present, be more intimate with your partner. Because, again, we talked about it the other night, Alex being present. Like, how many people are on their phone while they're on the couch at night? Or, you know, all these sorts of things, and they're not being present in their relationship. And even something that I just. I just was like, one little secret for fellas. If your wife wants to watch that really crappy TV show, like, whatever is going on at the moment, curl up on the couch next to her, make her a cup of tea, and watch it with her just once. And she will think you are the coolest guy in the world. She honestly will be like, oh, my God. You probably will be sitting there feeling like you're having your brain removed. But it's something for her, and you've set the scene then that as a reciprocation, there'll be something for you. And it's not that that's what it's set up to be, but that's how people work, an exchange of energy. If you exchange energy with her and you sit and watch her stupid show or whatever it is, or like, my poor husband. I dragged him off a while ago now to get a pedicure at the nail. You know, the little nail salons. He was not loving it at first, but now he books the appointment and we go together and have a petty together, because that's our special time. We chat, we relax. There's nothing else. Phones are away. You know, the lovely lady's giving him a foot scrub and a massage and, you know, and he loves it. He's like, sits there and gets his pedi done and she cuts his toenail so he doesn't have to worry about it. But we do it together. And he worked out that that was actually something he really liked to do with me.

It's really interesting that you mentioned that as well, Kat, because it's just these little. These different points. You talk about being a team, and it's like, it can come in so many different ways. I go to the same hairdresser as Crin now. And just that connection, like what you're talking about with, you know, with hubby is like, well, we can all do that, hubby and wife together. And with the. With what we do with the hairdresser is essentially, she doesn't know this. So hopefully Corinne doesn't listen to these podcasts, but I've booked her in for a surprise session in a week and a half to get keratin done. Now, look, I've got an idea around keratin, how it works, but obviously it's something that takes a lot of the buff out, I think, of hair and straighten or keeps it much less maintenance. Kryn loves it. So essentially, here's me, like a typical male, not Even knowing much about it. But I knew enough to know that something she connects to and then. And I've done this a couple of times before. That in itself is a little bond. And the important part is it's not about leverage. Like you said in the space of just making trades by sitting there and watching. As long as it's not married at first sight for sitting there and watching a show with your wife. Like Corinne loves Bridgerton and I take the piss out of her and laugh or not. But I have sat down and watched an episode and. And again, man. Like it sounds crazy but it baffles me. But she's so appreciative of it. I'm like how? Why? This is a non event for me. But they love it. And again, this isn't leverage for me to go how I did this. There's a lot of the times where I'll do what might be perceived in my head or mind and actions. A 10x effort that 10x in itself without an expectation of return is going to yield a return. It will. Even if it's a 1 or 2x and when I least suspect it and something whether it's pleasurable or not, something Corinne will do with and for me. So there's definitely some value there. And I think a couple of key things that you're talking about there, Kat, like with women overthinking and men definitely do that as well. They possibly keep that in the realm of work but unfortunately they bring that home. But it's because a lot of the times I find that that's so prevalent in a busy world because when we become parents we lose control and certainties. How do we get that back? By playing in our head what the future will be and planning. I'll have this done by this time. This will be done. All of a sudden it's like this mon brain just goes into overdrive and we just keep going and both are at play here and that comes. Future can be great. The past can be great for learning or planning. But both of them come at the cost of the now and being present like you said. And it's really funny about the letting.

The man do it.

The other day I was taking my dishes over the kitchen crin's like can you put them in the dishwasher? I said, oh well, you haven't even given me the chance yet to fail. You haven't even. You give me the chance to put it in there first before. So I get that. But it's. But it's also for a lot of you guys who feel like your wife might be bossy, it's like, well, shit, man. Like, have you shown her? Have you been consistent with your actions? Like it, you know, why is that in place? Sometimes, yeah, don't take it personal. Other times, well, the history has shown that that's a pattern, that that's what you do, whether it's dishes, whether it's the kitchen, whether it's talking, whether it's when you come home. And that's the hard part when it comes to feeling sexy and playful for all of us, Kat, because unfortunately, all of these triggers and all these challenges, they happen in the same environment in the household, which means that environment alone triggers subconsciously, chemically, a response that again, cuts down libido and other things that opens up to the possibility is that what you find is like, I guess I'd love to get your advice on this. Is that the biggest problem you find that marriages face, most of them are like, is they're entering their 40s. Is it. There's a lack of. Of time and energy together, communication. Like, what do you find is the biggest challenge in marriages, you know, for husband and wife, mother and father? And then. And then we might take that into diving into, I guess, the female's perspective and carrying that through to some of the pure romance stuff as well.

So I guess a lot of it is people dividing themselves into so many pieces. And, you know, as your life and marriage evolves, you. Your, I guess, things become different and more complex. And your kids by your 40s say, you know, at our point, like, I'm in my 40s, I've got a 17 and 13 and 11 year old. So, you know, we're doing driving lessons and, you know, off to school, sports and dance and fees. And, you know, it's all of these things that we're juggling all the time. So that divides us. And obviously we've got therapies involved in that as well. So that divides Scott and I across. Across those things. And we are always like ships in the night sometimes. And we're very fortunate he's retired and I'm, you know, working from home. So we have a little bit more, well, far more flexibility than what another. Other couples have. If you're both working full time and you're trying to maintain all of that, you've got a lot of stuff in the air. And as our bodies change, and you would have discovered that with all of your fellows that, you know, their hormones change and your body image, they play a huge part for men and Women. So women in this bracket, we're heading into menopause and trust me, I had no idea about menopause until it smacked me right upside of the head. And I had had the same medical conditions as what Corinne had had. You know, I've had some, lots of gynecological issues in my life as well, but I had no, like, just could not fathom how much of an effect a woman's hormones has on her body. So this will be a two part. So a little bit of what, you know, what you asked me to answer, but also from a perspective of what women are saying as well. So I had no idea that going into menopause in what they call perimenopause would make me feel like I was an 80 year old lady. I was struggling to get out of bed in the morning. I couldn't put my feet on the floor because of the pain as the hormones aren't reaching your tendons and your muscles in the same way. Fatigue, brain fog, like the fatigue was like nothing I'd ever had before the brain fog. I thought I had Alzheimer's. I went to the doctor and legitimately had testing for Alzheimer's because I thought I was, had lost my mind. There's the obvious ones like the mood swings and all of those kinds of things that everybody associates. Oh my God, she's such a cranky bitch. She must be in menopause. But that was only a really small part of it for me. And then obviously there's the weight gain changes to your body and you wake up each day and feel like your body's betraying you because this stuff's out of your control. And I mean, I'm very lucky now. I found a fantastic female clinic. They do online stuff, but it's, they have helped me with the right hormones and I'm back on track and feeling significantly better than where I was six months ago before I started hormone therapy. But for a lot of women, they don't realize that's what's happening to their body. Because I had been to the gp, they had told me I was too young. You know, I was 43, 44 the first time I asked the question. It wasn't until I was 45 that a doctor actually listened to me and said, yeah, you're in perimenopause because blood tests weren't showing it the right way, that kind of stuff. So for a couple of years I just thought I was losing my mind. I was struggling to put a sentence together because the brain fog was so bad. I couldn't clearly think of a whole sentence, and halfway through, I would drift off into another one. And I know that men face those challenges as well with their hormone levels as they change. For women, I think we don't talk about it again. Like everything else, we don't talk about it enough. So people don't know what a huge effect it can have. It's like hormones are our internal. Like, you know, the oil in the machine, so to speak. If you take it out, the machine stops working. And that's where a lot of women are at. And then obviously, there's the changes with libido. You can wake up one day and suddenly it just left the building. And it's not because you don't want to be intimate or connected with your partner. It's just simply that that hormone that's driving that part of your brain just isn't there. It's gone. And so it's about thinking about other ways to change that, to sort of bring about that desire without using that normal chemical response. But also, and I know for myself, you know, like, I've gained 15 kilos in the last 18 months, and nothing has changed. Like, nothing in my diet or exercise or anything else has changed, but totally out of my control. 15 kilos. So now I need to work out how I'm supposed to get that back off again, because I'm not loving how I feel in myself. And so I think from what I've seen from lots of women, and when I talk to lots of women about menopause, that's a really common theme, because you don't feel sexy, your body shape has changed, the weight comes on in different places. Like you might have been, you know, had a big booty back in the day or whatever, but now you've got a funny tummy that you feel weird about, and it's just all awkward. And for women, that's a really, really big part, is just feeling confident in the bedroom. And if you don't feel confident in the bedroom, if you don't feel like you look attractive to your partner, because that's another game that we play in our mind. Does our partner still find us attractive? There's lots of that all sewn in together. And so that's what happens for a lot of women. It's what happens for men as well. You know, their bodies have changed, and those two things just are happening at the same time now. You know, go back a few hundred years. Nobody lived past 50. Really. If you made it to 45, you were old by a lot of standards. So they weren't really living past this. And so now we're living way past it. We've got to work out how we're supposed to move through this phase where, you know, she's feeling like this and he's feeling like this, and. And how do we do it together without breaking apart and suddenly looking at each other? If you've had kids a bit younger in life, and I know that this has happened to a few people that I know, their kids leave home, they've been busy with all of that, and then they look at each other and they go, don't actually really enjoy you anymore because you've become two separate people. And they look at each other and they're like, I really don't enjoy being with you. You know, you don't make me laugh. You don't. There's just nothing. They became two best friends who live together, raised some children, the children have left, and then they don't really have anything in common anymore. And it's. I mean, I've seen it with friends and family, and it's. It makes me sad because I'm like, you've had a whole lifetime with this person and raised these amazing children, and all it would have taken was some time and some conversations and some connection, and you might have actually made it work.

It's hard, isn't it? Like, you look at things like intimacy in the sex, and it's an important part of the game, but it's the entire game that unfortunately changes. Kat. And through the second half, for a lot of our men in their 40s and 50s, if they don't adjust and change to the game or even some of these things you've brought to light that I don't even know about either. Man. Making my way in the world, too. It's like, man, this is. It's hard for both. That's what I love about this episode. Like, it's not about he or she or he deserves this, she deserves that, or he's done this wrong, she's done that wrong. It's going, how do we move through this space together? Because you're right. I've had so many clients like that where kids have moved out, so they've lost that commonality. So. And that's the hard part. Life is investment. So you don't realize your wife stopped investing in you because you still have that commonality of raising the kids. But as soon as they move out, there's no more roi. The kids are gone. So what am I going to do all right. I'm going to split. I'm going to live my own life. And the confidence thing in the body image and all that sort of stuff and even the hormones in what you mentioned, it's almost like it's a double whammy. It's not spoken about enough. So people aren't understanding of themselves, their own bodies. And guys, I got to tell you, like, you can't just, like, Corinne might not feel sexy. It doesn't matter how much. I just say, well, I think you're sexy. Like, it just doesn't work that simply. Like, it's providing that stimulus and maintaining a peak of self love and importance and desire because someone else that she's invested in me continually expresses that through different ways, different love languages, which we spoke about, haven't spoken about here, but we spoke about before. It's a double whammy with that not being a thing that is commonly spoken about, because that's a natural part of life coupled with this is why it's a double whammy. The conditioning of society. This is what it should be. And it's so hard because I look at it, I'm like, and this is definitely not my point of view, but what I see is they put so much emphasis on just the way a woman looks. And it's like, well, fuck, man. That's a depreciating asset for both of us. Men and women. Like, you could say, oh, you look like Richard Gere. Well, not every old man looks like Richard Gere. So it's not like as we get older as men, we're better either. But it's really hammered down on the women. I really feel for them in that respect where it's like you put so much stress and pressure on women in conditioning them as well as not addressing the hardships and the reality of life for them. So it becomes a double dip on just destroying their confidence, self belief and what they value in something that, like all of us as organic beings, we are going to die and age and get older. So that's a big play, like you said, on the mental state. And I can definitely see how that can create a rift in marriages when it's not openly expressed from both sides. But what do you. I mean, I guess I'd love to get your perspective on that from so many of the women you work with. For a lot of our guys and our men here listening, what is it that women want? Like, when they come to you, when you do your workshops or your parties with them, what's the common theme. What's something that we can help with? I guess tying this in. You know, you did a great one for Corinne and her friends. And you know, I say this with respect. I'm definitely not pigeonholing what you do. But guys, this isn't about fucking sex toys on dildos. It's about appreciating yourself and your body and helping give them what they want so you get what you want. And with what you've done with, with Karin and I, there's times when it's unnecessary. There's other times it's great. Even something like a natural lubricant, you know, because of skin issues and whatnot, like, we can't get that shit at the shop. So the natural lubricant that we got from you is just an amazing thing. So, like, this is such a. I find it such an easy thing to talk about because it's the truth, but so many people just hide away from it. Now, you guys don't have to talk to me about it or cat about it. We will have a platform for you to ask questions, and I'm going share that at the end of this. And we can address them anonymously, of course. But, you know, our men on the inside of our program, Kat, they are opening up to this stuff and it's such a common thing. So I love to see these breakthroughs. But what do you get? What do you hear? What's the. I guess just to help our men, what are some of the common things or themes that women come to you and how do you help them? And what's something that we can take from that to help us, I guess, go upstream a bit to really support and connect with.

So I think a lot of the things that women, you know, I guess what I've circled back to a couple of times is that women don't. They don't respond well to sometimes the stimulation that their partner is giving them. Because men don't have a clitoris. They don't really know what to do with it. But that's a communication. Ask her. But she's coming to me saying, you know, what can you do to help? My libido is lowered. Hormones have changed, those sorts of things. So some of the things that we have, we have an enhancement cream that we can use on her and on him that's going to increase the blood flow and bring about that intense sensation. Because as things have dulled and that happens for men as well, there are sort of sensation and that response from a sensory perspective needs A bit of a boost. There's products available, but people don't know that. They don't know that you can get an enhancement cream. They don't know that a lubricant can be so amazingly helpful. And it's not, you're not doing your job properly thing. And I think this is the number one thing that women find, is that men assume that if they. If a woman needs to use a lubricant, he's not good enough. Or if she uses an enhancement cream or a vibrator, he's not good enough. That's not the point at all. It's so far from it. You know, as we. Again, hormones like going to circle back to it a thousand times. As women's bodies change, their lubrication level changes. Now, that's whether you're in your 40s and perimenopause. If you're on cold and flu tablets, deplete your natural lubrication because that's what they're designed to do. Dry up nasal secretions. In women, it's the same system, essentially. So if you're taking cold flu tablets and antihistamines all the time as a woman, that can be depleting your natural lubrication vaginally. So it doesn't matter how amazing your partner is. Your body's not producing enough because it just. You're taking something that's interrupting that flow. Dehydration. That can play a really big factor in it for women if they're not hydrated. Good, good nutrition, all of those things. Factor in intimacy and penetration is as weird and as clinical as this sounds. You're inserting something into a person's body. If it doesn't have the right amount of lubrication and adequate lubrication, then you're going to be at risk of, you know, fellas will get chafing on, you know, on their penis. Women will get micro tears inside of their vaginal walls that over time becomes scar tissue, can affect them later on in life. All of those things. It's not about. He's not doing a good enough job. He didn't get her aroused. Most fellas don't know that women need anywhere from 15 to 45 minutes of foreplay. Okay? So if you're looking at that and you're expecting it to be like a porn movie, it ain't going to happen. Sorry. It's not going to happen. You don't walk in and your wife is like, ready to roll. You need to sweet talk her. You need to, you know, have some fun to be playful, play with her clitoris, arouse her, work on that part of it. You know, introducing enhancements, introducing lubricants, introducing toys. Be open to the fact that women need constant clitoral stimulation during penetration to maintain that arousal level. Because ultimately our clitoris is kind of in the wrong spot as far as where it sits in our body and in relation to penetration. So, you know men, they're having a great time because all of their nerve endings are in their penis. It's inside of her. It's great. But for her, it still feels good. But to maintain that high level of arousal, she's going to need some clitoral stimulation during that process as well. So that's where using a C ring with a vibrating C ring, or introducing some toys into the play, that kind of thing helps to give them that next level of stimulation. Like men don't realize. And I it for the point of a podcast, it's probably not helpful. But if they happen to watch it on a video, if they're on YouTube, a woman's clitoris actually isn't just that little button at the top. It actually extends right down underneath her labia, and it's sitting right inside of her body there. That swells with blood, gives it a really beautiful pulsing feeling. Her vaginal passage actually passes through the center of those arms of her clitoris. All of that, by arousing her, getting all that blood flow happening, that's actually going to plump up those walls and make her feel so much more amazing. It's going to feel great for him, but it's also going to bring her to a more heightened state. So it's about taking a bit of time. Use that 15 minutes. Also ish. Use an enhancement cream. Start the play a little bit earlier. Make the conversation that it's okay to put a toy in. It's not taking away from him. There are plenty of toys out there that aren't about a big penis that's going to replace him. It's about clitoral stimulation. It's about. And we laugh, but honestly, there are a lot of guys, and I have done a lot of parties in eight years, spoken to a lot of ladies who have husbands who think that they're going to be replaced. And I sometimes make a joke and go, it's okay. We still need someone to take the bins out. But.

That'S brutal.

I know, but it's. And it's. It's a joke. It is a joke because it is about that beautiful connection. But it Is about addressing what we need. Like, sometimes we need. He may need a little bit more stimulation. Guys might not realize that there are things that can help you last a little bit longer and those kinds of things. There is brain training that you can do that helps a guy maintain his erection longer and not ejaculate so quickly. You know, we do have a product that helps to reduce a bit of that sensitivity. Maintaining a little bit longer might, you know, that's great for his fitness as well. And her fitness. Burn a lot of calories doing that. But also it gives you time to switch positions, be more playful, have that bigger connection instead of feeling like, you know, and it's. This is, again, no disrespect, fellas. This is what I hear from ladies. That's a little bit like a wham, bam, thank you, ma' am kind of thing for a lot of relationships, because they are tired, they get home and they're busy, and then it's like, just get the job done and we're done and let's go to sleep. Whereas we can't maintain that. It's not fun. It's supposed to be fun. Have fun, laugh, have great sex, feel connected, release all those good hormones, all of those things. So they're. The main things that I hear from women is just that, you know, they just need that more arousal. They need understanding. They do need a massage. They need that connection. You know, they're tired, they. They get home and they feel like their plate is full. And if you can take a few things off that plate, you've just increased your sexy status by 10 points. If you, yeah, just address her body in a beautiful way and be appreciative if. If she's had babies, look at that body and go, oh, my God, that body grew our children. She is phenomenal. You know, she is a phenomenal creature. Acknowledge that she's brave and strong and just. It's not all about, this will come back to you. But make her feel sexy. Buy some beautiful lingerie. That's not about looking like, you know, sluttyville, looking like a porn star. It's about if she's self conscious about her tummy. Buy something that covers her tummy. You know, if just by doing those little tiny steps and just thinking about, okay, I know she's really self conscious about her bum. Not buy her a G string, let's buy her some beautiful French knickers, that sort of thing. It means that she's got those French knickers on and she is like, he thought of Me. And honestly, that little arousal process is already starting. And yes, lingerie could be expensive and it may not be on her body for a very long time. But do you know what? We've bought some really expensive rugs for our bedroom in this time, and they're just on the floor as well. So you know what? Buy really nice lingerie. Make her feel dead sexy. If it gets ripped off and chucked on the floor, it doesn't matter. But the point is it started off arousing her.

It's a principle behind it, isn't it? And especially a lot of women, if they have the like for you guys, if a lot of. If a lot of your wives already have the walls up, it's layers. Like, you can't just go buying some of those products that Kat talked about and you know, we have some of them and they're awesome, but you can't just buy it and throw it on and go, here you go. Like, you need the layer that you in. Otherwise she's going to have the walls up in between going off. Fuck, here we go. This is. This is just another play. And I will ask you about that, I guess, on how to. How to navigate that best. Maybe that will include just suggesting or showing, or maybe it's buying or maybe it's not that to start with. Maybe it's lingerie, but there's definitely layers to this. Man. I guess a couple of key points here is really, really. This is never about judgment or blame too. It's looking back for our listeners as fathers and men going, what can we control? What can we take ownership over? Foreplay, don't have time. Or maybe if you piss off the bullshit of scrolling on your phone. Have a look and go to your settings and check your screen time. And I guarantee it's probably five to eight hours a day. Maybe if you cut 5% of that, you have enough time to do that. I'm busy with work. What, you can't take half a day off? Take a half day off Wednesday and go home and do the house chores or do what I do, I go and get a cleaner. It costs us 50 bucks a week. Now, of course, our house needs to be cleaned more than that. But essentially that two hours and that mental stress that freeze. Corinne, she's become friends with our cleaner. So that's another emotional connection with an adult when she's around children so often. Just like the lingerie. Like, guys, we have no idea at times the ripple effect and layers that this can create in the psychology or the perspective of the woman that then ties back to appreciation to you because maybe you led or pioneered or suggested or innovated something that's supporting her. Like it's such a. It's a, such not even a give and take, it's a given you'll receive like it's a given. It's the way the universe equalizes and balances out. Where can we take control? What can we do? Just like the love languages, like words of affirmation, quality time, acts of service, physical gifts, like the physical touch, like it's not even knowing what she has there, it's how do you apply that to and with her? When do you do that? Are you communicating why you're doing that? You know, like Corinne was probably hesitant, but just introducing you to her cat led to her hosting a party in herself and, and one of her things like what you mentioned and for so many women is even just a daily lubrication for personal health. Right? Like it, it's not even around that. But then everything ties back into, well, I made the connection. I introduced Kat to Corinne, my wife. And so I'm not saying that I'm sitting back just getting a tally board of going, hey Corinne, don't forget I made that. That's a run on the board for hours. She will do that herself over time, like you said, getting the wheels in motion.

And yeah, it's just lessening that load. Like even, you know, like you said, you organized a cleaner instantly you became again seven levels sexier because you organized the cleaner. You know, that is such a simple thing often. Like I had a conversation with a girlfriend the other day about after school care. She works full time, he works full time. You know, they are in business, in a vet practice together, but the after school care always falls onto her. And she said to me just once, could he organise it just once, like organise who's picking the kids up or you know, anything. And after school activity. She said it just feels like such an enormous load for her to be finishing work and racing to get the kids, whereas he is in the same profession and still doesn't connect. That. That is very taxing on her emotionally and mentally. Everybody's situation is different, obviously, but that was something that a friend said to me and you know, and I was like, I never even thought about that. We just automatically assume the role of carer as women and I'm not saying that men ever dump that on us, but there are times where, you know what, organise a babysitter. You know, you make the calls, you find the sit up and take your wife out for dinner. Okay? And dinner, if you don't have a lot of money and you have to pay for a sit up dinner doesn't have to be fancy. Make dinner at home. Go and have a picnic somewhere nice. If you live somewhere with a nice view, go have a picnic. You know, your hair, what you call it, honey and handsome thyme. That doesn't have to be an expensive thing. And I'm. This is my, my number one out of 25 years of marriage. My number one favorite, you know, honey and handsome night was Scott made dinner and he called it a night in Paris. And we got dressed up and we stayed at home. We lived in a really remote community in the northern territory. There were no restaurants that were nice to go to for dinner. We didn't have the option to have sitters. And so the kids were put to bed. I settled the kids into bed. He made some beautiful French cuisine, set up a table underneath the tree in the front yard with fairy lights. And we sat there and ate dinner in. Under the fairy lights, under the tree. Like, it was so simple. If you can follow an instruction set, you can make a meal. Honestly, mate, that's as simple as it gets. And using the excuse that you can't cook is rubbish because if you can follow instructions, you can follow a recipe, you can cook her a meal and just do something nice. Have a picnic in the backyard. It so simple. So, so simple. And that some nice champagne or whatever her preference is. You know, let's be honest. We're going to start to lubricate the wheels and you're going to start to feel a little bit sexier. She's highly appreciative of the fact that you've gone to so much effort and it doesn't have to be expensive and it doesn't have to be extravagant.

Just on that note, I'm curious too. Like, not that I look at it as investing in stocks or drawing out dividends, but essentially how many times did that replay in your head after that night that you just found yourself appreciating Scott? Like, how many. Like, this is Ted. Like, how many times did that then play up? Just that one event to build this momentum of, hey, we are connected. I appreciate him. This is great.

Yeah, it was huge. And it's just such a. It was, you know, if you looked at it, you'd be like, oh, it's a bit lame. But it was. He just had put all the little pieces in. He made, you know, French food and it was beautiful. And we Would dress nicely. That was a long time ago, but still number one date night ever. And we were at home, our kids were in bed. Nothing was out of the ordinary. He just organized that. And I put kids to bed and we got dressed in some nice clothes because, again, let's be honest, especially with COVID When was the last time you got dressed up and just felt a bit nice and just do it for no reason? Put some makeup on, dry your hair like you said. Take Corinne and get her hair done. She's going to feel a million bucks that night because she's got beautiful new hair. And just it's. I think people think it has to be complicated and convoluted and extravagant. It doesn't. It doesn't at all. Give your wife time to blow dry her hair after a shower, and she will be so appreciative if she can do that without children hanging off her leg.

Yeah, it's. It's honestly, like, it's not that. It's not that hard. It's not as hard as men make it. You know, like, you talk about the school drop off and pick up. I do. I do so much for Corinne and the kids. I do so much for family. But you know what? I do so much for myself, too, Kat. And I make sure they know that, like, I communicate. I'm going to train here. This is what I'm doing. I'm going to get some physio and get a tune up because my neck's tightened. Because I do that. That don't walk all over me. Because I know a lot of men are cautious that it's like, oh, I just flogged myself out. I do everything for the family. They keep expecting more. It's like, yeah, because you didn't put up your own boundaries and respect your own space. But because I have that, when I give so much to the family, they value it because they know on the opposite, I give so much to myself, which means they want to provide and give to me because they know that what I'm juggling is something of a higher value to give to them and still maintain who I am, which is an attractive thing. They see value in dad. They respect Crit, appreciates me. I get affection. She's like, well, Al's looking after himself, too and looking after us, so be cautious of that man. Like, when you're giving for your family, some of you might be feeling like you're giving too much, but have you asked them what they actually want and have you not put up your own boundaries? But you can find that middle ground and definitely not go the other way. Where old mate with a vet just expects his wife to pick up the kids all the time. You can definitely have both. And some of those things like he like that just once for a few years now, since I repaired my relationship with Corinne, that hasn't happened for her where she's had that just once I'd like him to do this and it hasn't. It's not always rainbows and smiles, but this is life. But essentially some of these gestures which connect and they make it personal. Like the story you shared so many years on obviously had an impact, otherwise you wouldn't have brought it up here and there. Right? And that's something you men need to understand. Like it's, you know, it will have a continual effect of the overthinking. Right. With the woman. Well, let's put the good thoughts in there from what we're doing and sometimes with things around, like even touching on stuff like sex, Think about it. Men, like really play it through in your head, especially if you feel like you're not getting enough of that or intimacy. Okay, what if you did have sex every night? Would you really value it? What if it was easy, your wife just laid down and said, I can hear you go. I'm not saying it's the thrill of the chase cat. That's probably not the most respectful term to use, but it is something where everything in life feels better, tastes better, is worth it, has more when it's earned, like when you're investing in it. I'm not saying I want to build a 10 year dating regime to have sex with crim once. Like there's obviously a sweet spot, but it's worth it. Like if I didn't go through the blood, sweat and tears of my marriage breaking down in 2017. I think you remember at the time, like shit was falling apart, I was playing the wrong game. I was still trying to be an elite athlete really hard. Stella wasn't sleeping, none of us had sleep, we didn't talk. Shit was just everywhere. And if I didn't go through that, it wouldn't be so worth to where it is now. It doesn't mean you have to look for breakdowns, but it really is knowing that not just the flowers, the massage, creating your own little French restaurant, fairy lights, all these little subtleties, it makes it more worth it to the point where you know, you're like, you know what? This has been an amazing honey and hens. No, it wouldn't even bother me if we, if we didn't. But. And you know what? That's exactly when you'll get it. Like, that's exactly when you get like. That's the crazy fucking part, man. Sorry to swear. It's just so funny.

Like it's true. When you don't expect it, it just will come.

Yeah. It's the point where it surprised me. I'll be like, I'll not to be smart. I hope Corinne doesn't listen to this. She probably will. I'm like, no, not tonight. I've got a headache and I'll roll over. I'll be. I'll be smart. But it's a fine line to walk because I don't want to obviously pitch her off, but there'll be times like that and I'll turn the tides in a joke. But it's playfulness. That's what it is in that note.

And that's what it's about. It's supposed to be playful. And I guess a little bit of it too is like when I said about dropping your kids off that time that you have with your kids on the way to and from schools and all of those things that honestly will be some of the most amazing conversations you will ever have with your kids when it's just you and Stella in the car on the way to school. Oh my God. And when Roman's older and it's just you two in the car on the way to footy training or whatever it is he chooses to do, that is time you cannot ever get back. It cannot be constructed, it cannot be manufactured. It is something that is a true gift. And I don't think people understand how special a cartridge is. It can be nothing and it can be everything. And I say that to people a lot in relation to when I lost my mum. She was a huge part of our lives and our kids lives. She lived with us for a long time, as you know. And I say to people, the most magical memories were in the nothing. Like everything came from the nothing. So our kids racing home and sitting on the couch with my mum in the afternoon and watching Friends on TV in the day to day. People look at that as nothing. But that is the one most favorite memory our kids have of. My mum was sitting on the couch with her curled up in her room watching whatever silly old TV show that was on TV in the afternoon. So it comes back to don't make everything complicated, just the everything. The most beautiful memories, the most amazing intimate connections are literally made in the smallest of gestures, just done from A really organic place. And it's just as simple as that. If you just take the time to ask your partner, wife, whatever relationship you're in when she walks in the door, or if you're in a same sex relationship, your husband walks in the door and say, how was your day, honey? And actually be interested. Just, you know, focus on the highlights. I don't know. Your kids are still little Al. We at dinner time at night, we make sure that we sit down together at the table as a family and we do the best part of our day. And, you know, everybody has to think of the favorite part of the day and we move around the table and whether we've got 15 people at our table. When we have friends and family over, we always do, what was the best part of your day? You know, and we talk a lot about gratitude and those kinds of things and finding the positives in your day. And, you know, maybe men love to fix stuff. Their partner comes in and they are like, oh, I'm having this problem with this person at work. Sometimes it's great to fix and sometimes it's just to go, oh, honey, that's really tough. I know that's really tough on you, but let's leave that behind for now because I would really like to have a nice night with you and I don't want you to hold onto that and feel really stressed about it when we're just together being us. And you haven't dismissed her feelings. You haven't, you know, downplayed her emotions about that. But you've given it a place and we can chat about it later. But let's for now just kind of hang out and watch whatever junk's on TV or whatever they're going to do together. Runner or bus. But just that is something that is so simple. But she will be like, oh, my God. He actually didn't try to magically fix everything. He didn't give me a solution. He just gave me space to have that feeling and to move on.

It's a large part to initiate or sustain connection. I find Kat, it's just appreciating and acknowledging the same. Like I found I was like, that Krina, give me something. I'd be like, I already know the answer. Like, that's just such a given. This, this and that. I'm like, wait on. That's a whilst that's true. There's many ways to skin a cat. And B, that's just my perspective on things. What is the point of purpose? And what is Corinne trying to get out of this situation. Maybe it's just a listening ear to express and get a bit of her own poison out of herself. She doesn't need a solution because the solution is just me appreciating, acknowledging and giving the space, like you said, to share.

Often we. Sorry, I'm going to say one thing that I always think of with this is we listen to answer. We don't listen to hear. And when you think about that and you say that over in your head, that's what we do all the time. We listen to somebody saying a sentence because we want to answer that question or we want to solve it, we've got the answer. How about we stop just doing that and just listen to hear what they're saying and hold space for it?

Absolutely couldn't agree. It's like, I like. It's why I love some of these notes I've written because you've come up with some amazing gold mic. I just want to expand. Let's continue on that. Let's keep going and sit in that area where there's just. There's so much value for these men. One of the biggest ones that you actually just showed me then, I didn't realize. Maybe I do it subtly, maybe I do it sporadically. But repeat return on investment. When you speak about the smallest things there was. I think Corinne got the Bridgerton books as well. And I think she had the first four. So this was last year for a birthday. I bought the whole series. So it wasn't. I mean, books are what, 16 to 20 bucks? I bought four more books and that carried her through seasons five to eight. And I gave that to her. But what I mean Men by Repeat Roi is every time she picked up that book, whether she thought of it or not, it was there because I. I gave it to her. It was there because of me. So it's like, shit, man, she's going to read for the next six months. And same with getting the keratin done. Same with like the French or the fairy lights. Anytime you'd see fairy lights, I guarantee you, maybe you remember, maybe you don't. But at least immediately after, you'd be somewhere else in town or somewhere, you'd be on a ship, you'd be like, fairy lights. You'd be like, oh, we have fairy lights. When you put that dinner on for these are the things that men and women can have. But women are so in tune with, like, they're so. Their intuition's insane. That's a powerful thing. Men like. It's something we can use.

So this is not so much of the podcast, but Al, the new series of Bridgerton, comes out shortly on Netflix. If you could just take the kids out for the day and leave your beautiful wife at home. Again, big points there because, you know, there's some sexy scenes in Bridgerton for anyone, any of the fellows who haven't heard about it. There is some pretty hot and heavy scenes in there. Women are visual and we see those things and we kind of get in our imagination. And that's going to be a really nice night for Al if he takes the kids out and brings them home and pops them to bed. And Corinne's had the whole day watching Bridgerton.

You know, on that note, I'm going to take a leaf out of your book, Cat. I'm going to put fairy lights around the tv. I'll come home and Corinne will be dry humping the television. Hey, get away from there. I'm the one.

Just kidding. But yeah, it honestly. So that is just such a simple thing. But if you know that she loves that show, taking the kids out for a few hours so she can binge watch a bit of it. Oh, my God. She is going to be like, buy her a bag of popcorn and a bottle of bubbles and she will sit and watch that and you will have earned yourself like a million points.

Yeah, it's so true. Just those little bits of subtlety and creativity, you know, Like I. Let's say, all right, my wife needs some time out. You can't just rock up and spontaneously go, okay, it's Saturday morning, I'm taking kids out for four hours, and she just left. Unprepared, unplanned, unaware. Just sitting in the house on her own.

She's just going to do housework or something.

Yeah. What are we going to do? You just left me alone. So some of those things where you can. Yeah. You can reposition or set up or. And it's not about control, Kat. Like me getting her with the hair, with the keratin. These are all things I'm like, she desires them anyway. Like, I'm like, I'm not like, what do I want to give her that she should appreciate? I'm like, what would she appreciate that I could potentially help with.

You giving her permission. Sorry again. It's that permission. Having keratin done is expensive. And women will put that off because they don't feel that they deserve that. By you making that choice again, it's much bigger because you've given her permission, which is not. When I say permission, I don't mean it like he's the boss of the world, you know, like that kind of stuff. I mean, like out of a family budget, she can, from a guilt free perspective, take that money out of a family budget and go and spend that on herself and, and that's completely guilt free. The same as your guys who do, you know, your high performance fathers, they had to get their own internal permission and in a way, permission from wives to take a piece of their family budget and invest that in themselves. That's what you know, and that's really important. And it's not about permission in the sense of the word, it's about the approval and the. Yeah, I think that's a great thing for you to do for yourself, you know, I totally support you in that choice. And that is a guilt free choice then, because they can spend money to do what they want to do. And for the dads out there that, you know, if you like to finish work and go via the beach and look at the ocean, because that helps to calm you down, just let your wife know, let your partner know, just say, hey, babe, I finished work, but I've had a big day. I'm just gonna drive by the sea on the way home and take a breath and then I'm gonna come back home and I'm gonna be ready. And she is just gonna be like, that's a great idea. Because the equivalent then is that you're not gonna walk in the door cranky because you've had time to decompress on the way home. That works for both of you. But you've spoken to her about it. She's not sitting at home waiting for an hour while you dilly dally down at the beach having a wonderful time. And then you walk in the door and she's like, where have you been? And you say, oh, I went to the beach. And then she gets ticked off because, you know, you could have taken the kids to the beach or whatever else. Whereas if you say, I just need to decompress, I'm going to go by the beach on the way home or whatever. Is your beautiful place close to your home? You haven't sought permission, but you've had a conversation about it so that it's an okay thing to do and you can do it from a guilt free perspective.

Yeah, no, agreed. And a lot of it, a lot of it is showing. Is showing, Cat. Like we've had men who've, they've shown their families why that is. That is an investment that's worth Doing too, through taking action, creating change and whatnot. We've got some of our guys who, their, their wives have found out that day, that week or that month, they're like, you've changed. Something's different. It's like, well, you know, I've done it. Then it's like, oh yeah, that's great. And you're right, it's not like cringe can do whatever she wants. But what, what I'm, what I'm doing is I'm supporting her, pulling down the barriers to give herself permission to go, yeah, I will do this or I'm not going to be my own roadblock now. And it's, it's not, it's not a pointing finger going, oh, Alex said I could do it. It's going, well, you know, Al's the vessel for me to give myself the acceptance. You know what, I only get it done once every, I think it's once every 18 months, maybe 12 months, I don't know. But she's going to go do it and that's great. And, and again, it's just, it's thinking it through, right? It's a Thursday, all the kids are at school. She has nothing else to worry about. It's at 10:30, so it's not at 9 o'.

Clock.

Drop offs and nightmares like, man, you got an hour of cruise. So these are the little things where it's just, I call it modern intelligence, Cat. It's social and self awareness and just like the communicating. I didn't think like for all of you guys and all of you men listening for a while, you know, I'm pretty solid in myself in all areas of life. It's not like I'm, I'm reporting back to my wife. But what you mentioned then about the beach Cat, like I, I'd message Corinne three, four times a day. We speak two or three times. Sometimes a couple little videos, just, just sometimes just shooting shit or having a laugh, something that the kids do. And I was like, wow, I didn't. And it's not that it's a bad thing to have space either. And it's like mobile phones have ruined it. I used to go to work, come home, and we didn't saturate each other's lives. So it's worth more because we spend the time together. It's all quality. It's not about that way or the other. It's just, it's actually building that connection whilst we're not even together. It's leverage. It's a tool for you so me connecting with her seven or eight times a day, that gives her. I don't feel like I necessarily need it, but for her, that gives her her needs. But then that reinforces. So it does give me what I want, which is more affection, appreciation and just the day to day running. What's the routine? What are we doing? It's pissing down rain. It's flooding everywhere. Are we okay? Krin's sending me to suburbs. Okay, we're not at risk here. No worries. The kids are dropped off at school. She spent the night away, so I actually pampered her and she had the night away on her own last night, which is. And lo and behold, you give it. I give her a night away and she's messaging, calling me. I miss home. It's so funny and ironic how that works. Stay away, stay away and have that time. But what do you. This has been a really powerful episode, Kat. And look for a lot of you guys, if you have, if you have questions like nitty gritty, could be anything, send them through. We'll definitely do another episode and we can touch and rapid fire a lot of these. Send it to admin@realdadmovement.com no such thing as a silly or a stupid question. Anything. Don't just give us statements. That means fucking nothing to me. Excuse the French. Like what is what Quality questions will lead to us finding better answers together. But I guess as we start to wrap this up though, Kat, what is some advice assuming that the men's wives might listen to this episode or not. Let's say they're not. What would be some advice for the women for mums in relationships to help and support the husband, to help and support the father that even if their wives don't listen this episode, us as men have better awareness to maybe ask, like maybe ask our wives at that and say, hey, you know what? I listen to this and this was a great perspective from Katrina that was on our support. Like what would be your advice there for women to make sure that there's. Yeah, we're meeting in the middle, I guess.

Just so. And again, I'll say this, this is something I suggested to my friend the other day is that write down your feelings and your expectations. If when you go to have a conversation with your partner and it automatically feels like a confrontation, it automatically feels like, you know, you're accusing them of not being too present or, you know, any of those things, communicate via and it sounds really daggy. A love letter. Write a love letter. Write your feelings, write what you would like, not in a finger pointing, blame game way, but in a I feel sad when you don't let me know that you're going to be late home from work. I feel abandoned. You know, those kinds of things start the conversation because often when people are in that awkward place, they don't know how, they've forgotten how. Because, you know, you're caught up with little kids or whatever and you haven't communicated effectively for so long that you forgot how. And then it just feels like a fight. Everything's a fight. And so I suggested that to my girlfriend was to write her feelings down and pass it to her partner with no agenda. I actually told her to get a little notepad, get a nice notepad, write your feelings, give it to him and just say, when you're ready, let me know how you feel about that. He then wrote back to her. And that started the conversation. Instead of the finger pointing and the blaming and ending up in a big argument. If you've got tricky stuff to talk about with somebody and you know, or if you're asking for more time to do sport or to do things that fill your cup, make sure that that's an equal situation. So she has time to fill your cup, her cup, you have time to fill your cup. And then together you can fill a cup together. Communication and just, you know, for women, don't be all blame gamey because we're really good at that. We're really good at the keeping score. And you did this and you did this and you went out with your mates and all of that and Alex trying not to smile, then we are really good at it. And I'm sad to say that, but, you know, just be mindful and I'm gonna. And even though a lot of what you do and what I do is on social media, ditch that shit for a hot minute. And seriously, it's fake book and it's all fake. It's bullshit. And the stuff that you see on there is not real. Instagram is the same. If you see your friends and they look like they've got this really amazing marriage and your wife is comparing your marriage to their marriage or whatever else, just stop for a second and go, is that real? Anyone can edit a photo of a couple to make it look like they're super happy and they walk away and they actually hate each other's guts. Perspective on that. And just be mindful. And if your partner is coming to you going, oh my God, Sally and Sam look so happy, like, why can't we Be that happy. Well, A, are Sally and Sam really that happy? And B, what are they doing? If your mates with Sam, send him a message and go, hey, you and Sal look really happy. What are you doing to make you feel so happy? What are you doing? And start the conversation, put it out there. Talk to your friends about feelings. I know it's weird, fellas, but get it out there and have a bit of a chat and just go, hey, your marriage looks amazing. What. What secrets have you got? What is your tip number one tip? And yeah, for girls, do the same thing. And don't be comparing in a, you know, in a negative way, because that's just. Yeah, comparison is the thief of all joy. So don't use that. But have a conversation with people and get some tips. Like, you know, come and do the admin and ask and Alan, I'll come back and answer questions. You know, we've both had marriages that have had some tough times and we've come back and we're still married and we actually really love the person that we're with, you know, which is a really valuable thing these days to love somebody. To actually wake up and go, all right, you might have snored and you might be annoying me, but I cannot imagine my existence without you. And that's a really big thing to be able to say to love somebody that much. How did it get there? Hard work, that's how you get there. Doesn't happen overnight. It's like all the awesome stuff that they're learning, you know, with the high performance fathers and all of those things, it's all about the work that you put in, is what you get back.

Couldn't agree more, couldn't agree more. I love the writing too, because it slows down the brain, right? Like, you can't write as quick as you think, so you actually processing maybe some of your own stories, maybe some of your own shit, maybe a lot of your truths, but you can express and put that down. And then you give your husband time for that and vice versa. So now some great points there, Kat. And even right at the end there, like, this is the thing, right? Life isn't sitting on a beach, having margaritas in the Bahamas or any of that. Sort of like, that's an exception. That's an event. 80% of your life is made up of how you walk through the door, how your wife greets you, how you greet your wife, what you talk about at the dinner table, at the breakfast table, how you carry yourself in your conversations, how you plan things. These are the little things. There's 10 minutes there, there's an hour there, there's. It's not a one week holiday on white sand and crystal clear water just to solve all your problems, make all your shit go away. It's actually a large portion of how you fundamentally perform. And that stuff's simple enough, but it's hard. But you get that together, things can turn around very, very quickly, very quickly. And communication in all of that is the key, how you're turning up and not being triggered. Same for women and for men like us. As men, we just want to please and provide and protect and love and be loved with our queen and vice versa. And as soon as we start pointing fingers or keeping score, it's. It gets lost in really the deeper side of life that makes everything and all the shitstorms that we have to weather actually worth it. Because we have a tried, tested and true partner for life. In love, in intimacy, in leadership, together, in working as a team, in the hats of parenthood, controlling that environment to raise children and everything in between. Amazing episode. Thank you so much for coming on, Katrina. I've really enjoyed this. It's been incredible. One, and don't forget, guys, admineldadmovement.com Any questions that you do have, we'll definitely do another one. But I really appreciate you coming on. I guess I'd love to get final thoughts. Any last pieces or anything that you wanted to share before we wrap this up?

I just thought of the coolest little analogy. I have to share it. We've got to stop. I know, I love them, I'm all about them, but we've got to stop eating, like living our lives like a toddler eating a cupcake. So you've got toddlers. What do they do with the cupcake? They just lick the icing off and leave the cake part behind. And that's what we do. Everybody's expecting it just to be the beautiful icing, but the cake, the cupcake part, that's the bulk of our lives, that's the real deal. That's where the magic happens. But everybody's just got this toddler mentality and we lick the icing off and chuck the cake away, like, just. I'm not telling everybody to eat cake because you're telling them not to eat cake, but do you know what I mean? You're saying, don't eat cake. And I'm saying, yeah, eat the cake, don't just take the icing. But it's about enjoy the whole thing. Instead of just Expecting the icing to be sweet and delicious and amazing. You got to take it all. And if you don't want to take it all, don't take it at all. And that's really. You're either all in or you're out. And that is where they're at with your work. That's where they're at in their relationships. If you're all in, you're all in. But if you're not, then don't make it painful for everybody. I'm not advocating separating and divorcing, but don't. If you're not willing to do the work and be all in, then make space for somebody who is.

Yeah, I couldn't agree more. Yeah, the crumbs. All the shit falling on the floor from the cupcake being stuck to the wrapper. It's life. It's part of life. And the biggest thing for us as men is don't feel like you're losing your power or your pride gets in the way by asking questions. How can I please you? How can I make things better? How can I pleasure? Because when you master that, he gets your power back. And some. Because you're the fucking man. And she appreciates you for that. Something that came to me earlier when you're talking about, you know, us not knowing where the clitoris, all that sort of stuff. Absolutely. So learn. Understand that. Mask that skill just like your work. And, yeah.

Just ask. And like you said, ask in a message. Because this is the one thing that I've always learned is that you're sitting in a room and you would have seen this before. Like, you're in a room at a lecture or whatever, and you've got a question in your mind and you're like, it might sound stupid. I don't want to ask it. Don't want to ask it. There are five other people, at least in that room, that have the same question in their mind. None of them have got the balls to say it. So for all the fellows listening right now, take your balls and ask your questions, because there's somebody else out there listening to this podcast right now that isn't brave enough to ask, and they really need that answer. And you're putting good stuff out in the universe by asking the question and then you getting the answer, and those five others getting the answer as well. And you've just helped somebody and you didn't even realize. So ask the question.

Absolutely. Leadership is never what you think it is, man. You know, it really isn't. It's not. Arnie. With muscles, standing on top of a mountain with a fucking sword. It's things like that. Ownership, asking questions, seeking answers and building the wisdom of leader that you are through a man who takes action. And as you said, Kat goes all in. Goes all in. Yeah. Couldn't agree more. It's awesome. Thanks so much for joining us.

Thank you. It's been so much fun.

I love it. The best one I've been part of when it comes to working with another woman to help men understand. We hope you guys got a lot out of this as well. And any questions, flick them through.

Brilliant. Thank you so much.

And that's a wrap. I hope you enjoyed this episode and got some golden nuggets with possibly one or two aha moments as well. If you truly loved and enjoyed what you listened to, then I want to invite you to share this episode with someone who you know needs to hear this. It could be your brother, friends, colleagues, your uncle, even your wife. If there's one thing I've learned, it's that none of us are alone in the hardships we face. But the solution to getting back on top, winning can start with a gift from someone else. And that gift could be an episode like this. Because another man transformed is another family saved. Which is exactly what we're all about, thriving and winning in life. There is no alternative. It's possible. It has been done. It can be done, so it should be done. I appreciate your support in spreading this message. Cheers, mate.