Pakistan crumble as England seamers assemble

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK.

Prep for a busy week with Whole Foods Market. Start your day with fully cooked breakfast sausages from Amy Lou, 365 brand frozen waffles with no bleached flours, and of course Whole Foods Market eggs, which are all cage-free or better. In the evening, bring home a build-your-own family meal that feeds 4 for just $35. Choose one entrée and 2 sides. Shop smarter, not harder, at Whole Foods Market.

Get more with BBC Podcasts wherever you listen. Be the first to listen to your favorite shows like Evil Genius, Good Bad Billionaire, and You're Dead to Me with a subscription to BBC Podcasts Premium on Apple Podcasts. You can also enjoy a range of our podcasts ad-free with an Amazon Music subscription.

You're listening to the TMS podcast from BBC Radio Five Live.

Let's look back on the second day of this second test match, Rothsay Test match between England and Pakistan here at Lord's, which began with England on 248 for nine. Pakistan had a pretty good day yesterday, but there was already concern that England had got slightly too many runs, and then it turned out they were going to get plenty more. I've got Rami's Raj alongside me as well as Jonathan. Agnew. And Michael Vaughan will be joining us shortly. And England went on to add 42 further runs, and at that point batting looked pretty easy. In actual fact, a terrific unbeaten 30 by Josh Tongue, and, uh, in partnership with Gus Atkinson, who batted really, really well actually the night before. He didn't get a lot of the strike this morning. It was a partnership that was dominated by Josh Tongue, who before that hadn't shown any great acuity with the bat, but he was batting so comfortably you thought Maybe the pitch had gone to sleep when he was— when that partnership was eventually broken with Gus Atkinson smashing the ball down the ground. First sight of Usman Ali, the spinner, and it did the trick. His eyes lit up. He'd hit the previous ball for 4 over long on, and then next ball he came charging down the wicket again, was caught at long off. That brought an end to England's innings, but they'd made it all the way up to 290, which just felt like it had taken Pakistan Out of the game, and it proved to be that way as England then proceeded to set about the Pakistan top order—one that didn't have Imam Al Haq opening the batting because he had a calf injury—and well, they were bowled out for 110. Fantastic bowling again from England's pace quartet. It was Ollie Robinson once more, this time with four wickets, did the damage alongside Joffre Archer chipping in from Atkinson and. Tongue. And then England closed the day on 81 for 3. But there's plenty to talk about there, and I suppose we could start really with Pakistan's travails at the top of the order again, Ramiz. It was a sorry showing. It's the 3rd innings of this series, have yet to break 200, and I don't really know what they can do about it.

Yeah, I mean, um, just not good enough against quality bowling attack in English conditions. You've got to have a tight defense There's got to be a better batting chart, batting plan than that. And obviously when you're on the losing, uh, stint, then, you know, the camaraderie and the oneness also goes out of the window. So if you've got an issue with your whatever, you know, it was shin area which was troubling Imam-ul-Haq, in a winning environment you probably would go out there and front up. Um, we saw in the first Test match where Babar Azam bailed out Because he had an issue with the finger. It wasn't broken. And I asked him frankly, shouldn't he have been playing that game? He said, no, I just couldn't hold my bat. But in a winning environment, in a winning dugout, you then tend to do this for the team. But when you're in the losing sequence, then you become a bit selfish also. I mean, that's a part of the deal. So you look after yourself only. That too hasn't happened in the batting department. I mean, Azan, yes, he's learning on the job. It was a good innings from him that he hung out there against quality bowling attack. But look at the rest of the field. These guys have played 30, 40 Test matches. It's not that they've been, you know, they're novices. It's just that the will to survive and have a batting plan and a chart and, you know, How to cope with the with the situation? I think the first thing would have been to play more than fifty overs. That was the, as I mentioned earlier, not beat England in at large, but stretch England to day four, day five. And if there's no rain tomorrow, this game could be over in three days again.

On the subject of Imam Al-Haq, he did not bat. He had a sore calf. It doesn't send a great message, does it? We've had some high-profile injured players come out to bat in the last few years. Nathan Lyon on this ground a couple of years ago with a similar injury, could barely walk. Rishabh Pant with a broken foot, Chris Woakes with, with barely even one arm. And I know the match situation was different here, Mike, and I know Pakistan was so up against it, but there were moments when he could have come out at the loss of the 5th wicket. Azam still in, something, you know, moments like that. Does it tell you something about the mindset of this Pakistan team at the moment?

Yeah, yeah, it does. I mean, uh, I'm expecting Iman-ul-Haq to be leaving the ground on crutches, because if you can't walk out to bat and just face a few deliveries for your team, for your country, surely you're on crutches and you can't move. Um, it kind of sums up where Pakistan have been, um, in recent times. I know they've got a Test victory in the West Indies, but they're on a really poor run of form, and the only way that you can get back into some kind of spirit and form is by fighting together. You know, just scrapping and showing a huge amount of spirit. And, you know, Iman's clearly got a problem with his leg. The spirit of a side demands that a player walks out for you, walks out into the middle. It's not going to change the course of the game. Pakistan are going to lose the game whether Iman came out or not. They're going to lose the game. But it's just that spirit that you want to see from a group of players in the dressing room, that it demands that. And he's a senior player. I actually looked at Babar when he missed the Test match at Headingley. I thought he's got a bruised hand. Not a broken bone, it's a bruised hand. He's the senior player, the leader of this team. I felt he should have played. And the same is with Iman today, senior pro. So all those younger players, look at Asana Waiz, the way that he's played today. That's a little bit of spirit that we've seen from Pakistan from a young player. But what you want to see is that from your senior core, because they're the drivers of the dressing room and they're the ones that sit in the corner. They do the most of the talking. And all these younger players around the dressing room are watching the senior cogs and how are you acting. And when they're seeing a captain miss a Test match for a bruised hand and they're seeing a senior batter not go out to bat with a little tear of the calf, I'm sorry, it's the wrong message to send to, to all the players, particularly the younger players that are coming through this system.

We'll come to England's bowling in a moment, Jonathan, but that has been what's been a disappointing feature of this series so far, hasn't it? It's that sense that Pakistan just haven't fought, that they've fallen over.

Well, yeah, I mean, we talked about that bowling attack last night, didn't we? And, and it's, it's toothless, really. I mean, it's steady, uh, and Mohammad Abbas is clearly a, a fine bowler. But, you know, you look at Josh Tonga, number 11, with an average of 5, who's out there beaming broadly, big smile on his face, gets 30. 30, you know, 30 not out, thanks very much, uh, in, in, in circumstances in which I just felt that the Babar was allowing Abbas to try and get himself on the honors board. He gave a very generous review with one that would have gone way down the leg side. It just didn't— it just— they were lacking that, that bowler to come on, no nonsense, a couple of bouncers, a couple of yorkers, blow the tail out and get off. And that was actually, I thought, quite an important passage of play this morning because it just, you know, got important runs for England, of course, but just Just the body language of it all. I just didn't think Pakistan were on, on the game. They didn't have— they didn't have the bowler that they really needed. Finally, Babar turned to a spinner. He got a wicket third ball, um, which again is just as potent against a tail, but he just seemed to be rather generously allowing Abbas possibly the chance of getting on the Lord's Honors Board rather than actually grabbing the game by the scruff of the neck and trying to do something about it.

Well, we saw Khurram Shahzad come out at number 8, and I thought it was just what you're talking about there, about a bowler being able to blast their way through the tail. Well, Coram was standing closer to the square leg umpire than he was to the leg stump at one point. I mean, slight exaggeration, but obviously at that point, you know, that was part of the body language. It just looked like Pakistan's tail was not going to wag. So, I mean, no support at all.

So I want to quote examples of Imran Khan as a leader. So You know, the moment he saw a tail-ender flinching away from the task, he would not have him playing the next Test match, even though his first job wasn't batting. But it's the body language, you know, how you shape out there. Just let the opposition know that, you know, we will fight from number 1 to 11. And the tail-enders sent a strong message to the opposition, Daggad, that we are here and nobody can bulldoze us. I mean, you don't see that from this side. Which is painful. I mean, it's as simple as that. So the, the job of the tailenders obviously is to score a little bit of runs, but it's more to do with the body language, how you conduct yourself. Because if you're afraid of fast bowling, then you're sending a message to the opposition that they can be beaten and they can be scared.

Michael, you captained a 4-pronged pace attack, the 2005 Ashes. And not entirely dissimilar to the way this one's shaping up. There are 4 different fast bowlers, different speeds, you know, for Hoggard, Reece Robinson, for example. You've got the speed of Tong. How potent is this England attack? And I ask because the numbers would suggest that it really is, but we've just, we've just been having a go at the Pakistan batting lineup. So what can we read into this? And are they, are they as good as they seem to be at the moment?

Yeah, it's a good attack and it's got a huge amount of potential because I think they can all get better. Yeah, and that's a really good sign for English cricket when you've got 4 bowlers bowling nicely, but you know there's a little bit more in the tank. I'll be brutally honest, they're not getting challenged at all, and this Pakistan batting lineup is possibly the easiest batting lineup I've seen for a long period of time to bowl to. And not only that, I think as a bowler— Agus will tell you more— I think they're all queuing up to bowl because they know there's wickets out there. You're not going to get hurt. There's no batter that's coming out to hurt them.

No.

No one's going to damage their figures. And it's really roll up, roll up, who wants to get the wickets? And I think they all know that, you know, Pakistan, they're not going to get big scores. So you're only going to be out there for 40, 50 overs. So you give it everything in every spell and you keep going to Joe Root saying, I'll bowl another one because there's so many wickets out there. It's just so easy. They're still doing a good job and they're still looking very threatening. And I think this attack bowling, the way that they're doing, will challenge better batting lineups if they continue in this fashion. No doubt they're going to challenge the likes of South Africa, Australia next summer. I think they'll challenge the Aussie batting lineup quite, quite nicely if they bowl like this. But oh, this Pakistan batting, is it second division county cricket? I'll ask you, you watch a lot of county cricket. There's no way that they're batting in any standard to say that that is a Test match batting lineup.

Very low on confidence too, aren't they? I mean, the way they had, you know, the way that Robinson was allowed, allowed to bowl 13 overs, 4 for 11. I mean, they're kind of like school, schoolboy figures in a way. with, with no, no effort to try and do something. That's, that's really the point, that has allowed him, allowed him to bowl, which of course he did. I, I enjoyed Joffre Archer's opening spell. There's some proper pace in that. Um, and Sharmas, who was pushed up to open, was dismissed pretty early on. And Tong, I think he's, he's the one who's really developing, uh, best out of all of them.

But I guess that, that opening burst from Joffre is brilliant. Loved it. But we, we— I watch him go, I want to see that next July. The first Ashes Test match, the first morning of the, the 5-match series. That's the kind of spell that sets the tone for everyone. You know, doing it against Pakistan here at Lord's is great, uh, very exciting, we love watching it. But, you know, doing it against South Africa in the first Test— is it at Centurion?

Yeah.

Or doing it in that first Test at Trent Bridge next year, that's what you're judged on as players. Can you switch it on when it's the hot series? You know, these kind of series are brilliant for players because you you kind of know you're going to win, but it's, it's more about, you know, I think in, in batting terms you put about putting a deposit in the bank, don't you? Well, bowlers are rolling, thinking, well, get a few cheap ones and get your average down. I mean, what's he got now, Ollie Robinson? 95 Test wickets at an average of 20. An average of 20, 95 wickets. An extraordinary skillful bowler that England have. And, you know, if he carries on, I think England are trying— I think Agus said on, on commentary today, they're trying to get him to get to that 81, 82 miles an hour on a more regular basis, consistently.

Consistently.

And if they can get him to that, he will challenge all batting lineups in all conditions.

Does he need to?

Well, not in the UK, he doesn't. But he will need to if a batting unit bats for 120 overs in the first innings and he has to come back a day later and do it again. That's going to be the challenge for Ollie Robinson. Is he fit enough to come back?

It's a fitness thing, isn't it?

Yeah. And that's easy to work on. You can get fitter. And how do you get fitter? Well, obviously doing a bit of running around and being in the gym, but more so by bowling. Um, but he's been a— he's been that tone setter that we were crying out for in the winter. Well, he's done it pretty much as well as anyone for the 3 Test matches that he's played this summer.

And he's relentless, isn't he? But there's— so there's just no real attempt to, to just try and knock him off that. And then, you know, I think at times— I'm not a batsman, but I think at times as a bowler, when you're in total command as he was and unchallenged, when suddenly a batsman decides to come after you a bit, and then that, that kind of put you off your stride, change your rhythm, you've got to think a bit more. But he just He just ran in and bowled ball after ball after ball exactly the same there because he wasn't being challenged.

I mean, they're a wonderfully contrasting attack though, aren't they, as well? I mean, you've got that metronomic accuracy, but Josh Tongue looks like he can take a wicket at any minute. I think Andy Zoltzman gave us an incredible stat about he's taking a wicket every 12 balls or something at some point in this series.

You want a bowler, a bowler at least who can swing it, another bowler who's got proper pace. You want another bowler who can probably reverse swing it a bit, and you want a bowler who can do your donkey work uphill into the wind. And they've got, they've got all that. And so it is, it is a very well-balanced attack, but of course without the spinner. And so that's, that's, that's, that's the problem England have with, with their bowling attack. But the, you know, but the pace attack is— it, it covers all the bases.

The TMS Podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live.

Prep for a busy week with Whole Foods Market. Start your day with fully cooked breakfast sausages from Amy Liu, 365 brand frozen waffles with no bleached flours, and of course Whole Foods Market eggs, which are all cage-free or better. In the evening, bring home a build-your-own family meal that feeds 4 for just $35. Choose 1 entrée and 2 sides. Shop smarter, not harder, at Whole Foods Market.

Get more with BBC Podcasts wherever you listen. Be the first to listen to your favourite shows like Evil Genius, Good Bad Billionaire, and You're Dead to Me with a subscription to BBC Podcasts Premium on Apple Podcasts. You can also enjoy a range of our podcasts ad-free with an Amazon Music subscription.

Before we come to England's innings, let's just dwell a little bit on Azhar. A waste because, you know, there will be people listening to this who want to hear some good news about Pakistan cricket. And yes, he got 46 in 102 balls. It's not eye-catching, he's not on the honors board, but they were difficult, difficult times to bat in, and he was getting no support at all from anybody around him. Um, that's got to be helpful, and he's 21 as well.

Yeah, yeah. And so, and, and still was able to focus. So he lost Babar Azam, he lost Saeed Shakil, lost Shaan Masood, and that can have a damning effect on your make up because you feel that the, the better ones are leaving the crease, and so you're still hanging in there. And so from that point of view, it was a very good innings. He was under the cosh, he was being challenged physically, technically. Joe Fratch's spell was lethal, it was brutal, it was fast, yet he somehow survived it and, and continued to learn on the job. So a very good bright spot for Pakistan in that innings. And I'm so happy that he's been persisted with because there's some good things about his batting. Obviously, you know, he's got a ticker. In subcontinent, with that kind of technique, he could be pretty efficient. But in England, obviously, he's got to move out of the crease. When he's driving the ball, he drives it square through the offside. And in seaming conditions, that's a risky shot to have. So maybe look to play more through the V area, through mid-off, than square drive the ball.

Well, we can actually hear from Azzam, who's with Alison Mitchell.

Azzam, a difficult day for the team but well batted. Will it be challenging to even get a draw from here?

Yeah, it's a little bit challenging pitch because, uh, pitch have little bit lateral movement. So yeah, I survived. So yeah, it's a good innings and I, I build my little bit confidence. Yes.

Was that one of the most challenging innings that you have played in your career?

Yeah, there are a lot of challenging innings in the first-class cricket, but yeah, might be this one is Of course, challenging pitch and challenging batting. So yeah.

Have you ever faced bowling as fast as that spell from Jofra Archer?

I think it's probably the fastest spell and yeah, I enjoyed it and that was a good spell.

Yeah. What did you have to do to come through it?

Yeah, I come from— yeah, I performed really well in first-class cricket and then I came here to England last year. I went for Pakistani cricket team. So yeah, this year I'm with Pakistan cricket team and I really enjoyed this environment.

You've had some experience of playing in England last summer.

Yeah, last year I went with Pakistan A cricket team. So yeah, alhamdulillah, I performed really well in the last year. So yeah, I enjoyed this, uh, and it was a very great moment for me.

Yeah, you're the youngest player in this Pakistan team. What are you learning through Test cricket?

Yeah, I learned a lot of, uh, cricket from my seniors. And especially because when you are playing international cricket, so you, you can observe the things and a lot of things you can do it to perform very well in the team. Yeah.

Back to Jofra Archer, what did you have to do to cope with his pace?

No, I just realized the things and pitch have a little bit lateral movement and you have, and the lords, they were a little bit slope. So yeah, ball as compared to other pitch, there was a little bit Extra lateral movements. Yeah, I survived and that was a very good spell. Yeah.

Did you enjoy that challenge?

Yeah, I really enjoyed it because it's first time I faced like this bowler and they have pace and accuracy. So yeah, it's good.

And you didn't open with Imam-ul-Haq. When did you find out that Imam wasn't able to bat?

I think last day they have a little bit shin problem with Imam bhai. Yeah. So I batted with Shan Bai. So yeah, we are exactly open in the domestic record. So yeah, I have a little bit confidence about there.

Good luck for the rest of the match, Azan. Well played today. Thanks so much.

That was Azan Awais with Alison Mitchell. He's a confident sounding man, Ram. He's performed very well in a number of places.

Yes, I mean, it was a hard gig for him, but as I mentioned, you know, he's a good one actually. You know, he didn't flinch, uh, and he just got behind the line of the ball and, uh, wasn't terrorized even though, you know, he was in the middle of something brutal from Jofra Archer. It really was a quick spell, the fastest probably he's bowled here in England, Jofra. So he looked to be in great rhythm and somehow he survived, so it's just good for him.

Well, since we're talking about Jofra Archer, Alison Mitchell's been talking to him as well.

Jofra, well bowled today. Can you sum up for us what's been a pretty fast-moving day of Test cricket?

Yeah, just put the ball in the right areas and you're going to have one with your name on it. So that's pretty much it in a nutshell.

How much do you relish bowling in these kind of conditions? How helpful has the pitch been?

It's been helpful. Not often in Test cricket you get wickets like these, so you just try to make the most of it because there's going to be one that's going to be not as helpful and you're going to be out there a lot longer.

You bowled a particularly fast spell to Azhar Owais. Can you talk us through what it felt— what it feels like to be bowling at those speeds throughout an entire over?

I'm gonna be honest with you, I'm a little bit under the weather and I was just— just had some paracetamols in, so the body felt fine. So if it felt fine, there was no reason not to run in.

But just a little bit of a cold at the moment and you're still yet bowling fast.

I feel a lot better when you're running around. It's better than being cooped up in the room, you know, so get some fresh air into your lungs. You know, the sun is good for it as well. So yeah, I'm just glad that I'm actually like fine enough to run in.

Were you feeling— I mean, you were close to getting that wicket of Azhar Nawaz. What was that battle like for you versus him?

I think it was a lot of plays he missed, to be honest. But, but, you know, he batted well. He got through, he got through pretty much most of the day unscathed. And on days like that, I feel like he should have probably came in, not out. It was a bit strange how he got out the way he got out, but he played really well. And, you know, if you can get through that for most of the day, he should have gone on a bit more.

Tell me about this quartet of bowlers that you're part of in this particular lineup. How do you work well together?

Everyone, everyone chips in. You know, Ollie's been phenomenal since he started. Again, and Gus, Tongi, everyone, everyone just keeps picking up the slack. So it's nice because then not one bowler is getting run into the— well, I don't want to say run into the ground, but not the bulk of the overs are all put on one person. It's all spread around. And honestly, like, if this continues, we could play, can play longer than expected.

Are you communicating a lot together with, you know, info, intel, what the pitch is doing, different batters?

We didn't have to this game. Everyone, well, everyone's played here before. Everyone knows what works here for them a bit more at least. But here everyone can see, the media team keeps putting like the replays up as well. So before you even bowl, you have an idea of like what's, what's working, the player misses, what type of balls they are as well. So you don't really have to, you know, annoy the bowler.

Yeah.

State of the game now though, is it only the Weather that could halt English progress?

I think it's only tomorrow. But, you know, if we get a nice full day, there's no reason why we shouldn't, we shouldn't bowl them out again. You know, I think all the guys are in really good form. Everybody's putting the ball in good areas at good pace as well. So as I said, there's one out there with your name on it. And, you know, we should, we should, we should get the other 10 wickets.

I hope you feel better soon.

Thank you.

Well played.

Cheers.

There are so many things in there that are quintessential fast bowler stuff, Jonathan Agnew. Like, firstly, I thought he played and missed a lot, actually, you know, so I should have had his wicket.

They can't give the batsman any credit.

Yeah, no, that he's criticized him for getting out to somebody else who wasn't him, and then he's talked about how, you know, we've got this, this great pack, we're hunting as a pack, where none of us are going to get bowled into the ground. I mean, that's a very articulate and A happy Joffre Archer, who's—

well, so I was thinking actually when I was listening to it, that's the most sort of eloquent I think I've heard him in an interview. He's, he's often, you know, quite a reluctant interviewee.

He's very keen there, wasn't he?

Yeah, he was very engaging, especially with a stinking cold. So, uh, that, that was nice. I think it probably reflects how he's, how he's feeling, isn't it? How his cricket is, you know, you can hear it there in his voice.

Well, that was England's bowling. Just to very briefly dot the i's and cross the t's, Ollie Robinson was a pick of those bowlers with 4 for 11 in 13 overs. Joffre Archer picked up 3 for 26, and Josh Tonga a couple, 2 for 27 in just 6 overs. England then went out to bat, and well, the pick of the batters today has been Emilio Gay, who's unfurled some lovely cover drives. It's a signature shot of his, Jonathan. He got to 30 unbeaten at the close from 69 balls. Didn't really knock the ball about that much, but he, he guarded his wicket well.

Yeah, I mean, he didn't have to. I mean, I think it's a great opportunity for him here because the There is no pressure from a match situation. Uh, he's what, played— this is his 4th Test, isn't it? 5th Test. He's had a couple of 50s, so he's got in, uh, and then hasn't, hasn't got on. But I like him. I just think he's got something. He's got some style. Um, we've talked to him a few times, you know, out there and so on. He's quite, he's quite a character, you know. This is— he's, he's not shy, and that's a good thing, I think, for an opening batsman, you know, to be confident and to, and to be able to stand up in the because he's going to face more challenging bowling than this. We haven't really seen him up against proper fast bowling yet, and that's, that's obviously something that has to be answered because that is what opening batsmen are going to face. And in South Africa, he's going to face some quick stuff, and the ball is going to be around his ears. Let's see how he goes. But I, I, I don't see him flinching. I think, I think he's, you know, he's that sort of a character. Lovely shots through the offside. He's got a chance to get that that elusive big score, uh, in this innings, and it'd be really good to see him get on and do that.

There was though one fly in the ointment for England. I mean, there were 3, and suppose they lost 3 wickets. They lost a couple of them very early. Khurram Shahzad picking up the wickets of Ben Duckett and Jordan Cox in no time. 13 for 2. But the one I want to talk about is Joe Root, because he's a man with 14,000 Test runs, and yet, I mean, Andy gave us an incredible stat that he was out LBW once every 1,137 balls at one stage in his career. And now it's happening repeatedly, every 84 balls to seamers. And it's happening time and time again, not just with the keeper standing up. I don't think the keeper was standing up today, for example. I mean, he looked disgusted with himself because it wasn't a ball that exaggeratedly nipped back up the slope. It sort of came on with the angle. I mean, it's straight. Yeah. But you You're a batter. Tell me, what, what has he got to do to solve this problem? Is it a technical problem?

It's a mental problem and a technical problem as well. What he has got to do is to just look for that angle back into the stumps, so not worry about the outswinger. If he's so, uh, iffy regarding that line and he's getting out to like to that inswinging angle, then he's got to manage that angle by maybe not walking across the line. You see, I, I feel that he Stays in the crease at times. He walks across. His footwork is not great. It comes across as a bit lethargic, bit loose at times. And he's looking to get on with it and seems to have a certain pattern by walking out of the crease at times, trying to take the ball a little earlier. But it's not worked. So I think it's hurting his mind. It's hurting his game. It's set up at the crease. And what he has to do is to do 2 things. A, the angle of the bat is It has got to come down straighter. And B, if that's not happening and it's difficult for him, try to open himself up so that he becomes almost like a Javed Miandad stance at the crease, square on, so that you just protect that inswinging angle and so that your front foot doesn't come in line with the ball. The 2 things he can do— and see, great players go through this at times.

Right.

So maybe he'll get a break, you know, play somewhere where batting is a little easier. These are difficult conditions, by the way. Even the bowlers don't know how much the ball is going to deviate and move around. So if you are finding it tough managing that angle, it becomes doubly difficult.

I mean, he needs time off at the end of the season to work on this, doesn't he?

Well, it's quite interesting because I was looking at some stats in that he, he scored only 7% of his runs this summer in the V. In other words, on the front foot playing down the ground. And yet he's missing the ball that's a fullish length be LBW. So something not quite right. Those two things don't— well, perhaps they do tell a story, you know, that, that he's not getting in the right place to play these balls in that V to score runs, and he's missing them. I mean, Joe Root's missing a lot of balls, which again is— it's strange. So the trouble is, as we all know, once you get something in your head, it's sort of just, you know, it's there nibbling away at you. And then, yeah, it'll be starting— it's like, well, it's like, remember all the Kevin Pietersen and the slow left-arm stuff?

Yeah.

Of course, and the more, the more he's kind of denied it, obviously getting out to left-arm spin. It's happening too often for Root now for there, for there not to be a problem. But it does seem to be— I think it's tied in with that fact those runs are not coming straight down the ground. He's missing balls of a full length with the keeper standing up and he's being able to double it. So I think the 2 things are kind of interlocked.

Yeah, Michael Vaughan sort of identified that maybe it's a sort of balance issue because he's on his tiptoes when he comes forward, but then He uses that to go back and then play that release shot through backward point, doesn't he? Which he loves, that shot, in order to sort of tick the scoring over.

And he'll work it out, he'll work it out. But it's really fascinating that this very old technique of, of, of a medium pacer bowling with a keeper standing up, which was around 80, 90 years ago— look at the old pictures— has suddenly come back to life. And it's, it's really rather nice in the modern game. Here we are, here's an old tactic that's been resuscitated.

Well, the rest of the England innings. I told you about Ben Duckett made one caught at cover. Jordan Cox, 11. He was LBW to Karam Shahzad. There've been some very good reviews, by the way, by Pakistan in this match. And Joe Root, LBW to Mohammad Ali for 24. He did review, and he was sort of convinced to review by Emilio Gay, but shown he shouldn't have done because it was clattering into the top of middle stump. But Emilio Gay took England through, 30 not out at the end of 69. Harry Brook, 7 off 13. So a lead now, because they're 81 for 3, a lead of 261. Um, we've sort of given up on Pakistan's chances. Joffre Archer's definitely given up on Pakistan's chances. Rameez, have you? Yes, sadly. Okay, well, that's, that's, that's pretty concise. Um, that's— yeah, that is unfortunate. Well, we're going to let you go. Uh, we, we don't know. We don't know what's to come. You never know. Barbarossa might unfurl an absolutely magnificent 150, and he might get some support from, from, from old or new players in the side. But, um, that, that remains to be seen. It might not be much of it tomorrow because of the rain, but let's keep our fingers crossed. Andy Zaltzman is still here. What has, what has taken your eye today?

Uh, well, let's start with those Root LBWs. Um, 9, uh, in his last 7 Tests, as you, as you mentioned, and that extraordinary rate of dismissal to seam bowling of 1 every, uh, 80, 83, 84 balls. Um, 3 times dismissed by seam in his previous 39 Tests. 7 times this summer he's been out LBW, and that ties the all-time record for most LBW dismissals by a player in, uh, an international Test season.

And that's only in 9 innings, isn't it? Because England won by an innings.

Yeah, so the only other player to be out 7 times in an English season was Kim Hughes in the 1981 Ashes. That was over 6 Tests. So yeah, a very curious sequence for Root. He's also on the list overseas in the 2016-17 season. He was out LBW 7 times, but 6 of those were to spinners. England toured Bangladesh and India that winter, and he sort of rectified that at that stage of his career. He's been a great problem solver during his career. He's averaging only 29 this summer. It's his 14th home summer of Test cricket. Currently fractionally his lowest average in a home summer behind the 2019 Ashes summer. And in the last 5 English summers, 31 Tests, he scored 13 hundreds. So this summer is a dip compared with his phenomenal recent form. Only one century for England so far this season. That was Ben Duckett. He's only got one 50-plus score in his last 10 Tests since the start of the Ashes. So it's been a very difficult summer For batting, and Pakistan are, uh, well, challenging some of the all-time records for least adept performance by a team's batting lineup in a series.

Delicately put, Andy.

Yeah, England's, uh, England's bowlers collectively, um, got a strike rate of 20, uh, a wicket every 25.4 deliveries in the, uh, the 3 innings in the series so far. So it's all quite early in the series, but But at the moment, that's the 6th lowest strike rate ever by a team in a Test series, and the 3rd lowest by England. And the other 2 in England have had a better strike rate than that were both in the 19th century. So, um, uh, we still have quite a lot of stats that are, you know, wickets falling quickest at any point since the 19th century over the last, uh, over the last few years. The 2 first innings combined 104 overs. That's the 6th shortest combined first innings Uh, in a Lord's Test, and the, uh, the 6th time in the last 11 Tests here that the first innings combined have lasted less than 140 overs, something that had happened only 10 times in the first 140 Tests on this ground. So that's, as we talked about yesterday, this is a long-standing issue for Lord's. The lateral movement is right up there with the most in any Test match in England in the last 20 years that they've been recording, uh, recording this data. So it's been a fiendish match for the batting so far, and some, uh, Some phenomenal bowling figures, uh, for England. Yeah, Ollie Robinson, 4 for 11 from 13 overs with, uh, with, with 6 maidens, uh, now averaging, uh, 20, and I think under 17 in home Test matches now. Just lost the screen with that stat on, but he's, uh, right at the top of the, uh, the, the best averages.

This is Sid Barnes territory we're talking here, isn't it?

Um, so, but he missed last summer Where England's bowled 25 balls per wicket in this series. Against India last year, it took them 72 balls to get each wicket. So a wicket every 12 overs last summer against India, a wicket every 4.1 overs against Pakistan. Very different challenges. We saw flat pitches last year. I think with the nature of modern cricket, the nature of modern balls, maybe we need more flatter pitches, which you wouldn't have said 20 years ago, certainly. But yeah, it's been— Well, there's some good bowling stats and some bad, some very bad batting stats.

Okay, well, before I let you go, um, just one more.

Uh, Pakistan have been out in under 50 overs in all 3 innings so far this series. Only 2 touring teams have ever suffered that fate, all out in under 50 overs in the first 3 innings of a series. That was Bangladesh in 2005 and Sri Lanka in 2016.

Right, so I'll ask Ramiz Raja if he had any hope for Pakistan. Have you got a single stat that can give Pakistan any hope in this match?

Um, well, I mean, their bowlers are picking up some decent stats as well. Let's focus on Mohammad Ali's batting. Uh, an epic innings from, uh, the, uh, well, the scheduled number 11. He came in at number 10 and, uh, stepped up to the added responsibility with an innings of 3 not out, uh, from, uh, 8 balls. Uh, his, uh, his highest Test score, uh, in his 13th innings. So Does that count as a crumb of comfort?

Not a lot. I mean, it hasn't taken his average quite up to one yet. Yes.

If it's a kind of crumb you find in bed, it might be a bed bug.

Right. Well, there you go. I'm sorry if you're listening in and you'd like some crumbs of comfort as a Pakistan fan, but it's hard to find them.

You're listening to the TMS Podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live.

What's that saying about not letting the truth get in the way of a good story? Well, I'm Krell Prince, and I'm in the way. Online, I catch out some of the biggest names in football, holding their tall tales to account. But now the tables have turned. Can I spot the truth from the lies as those same guys who I tried to catch try and catch me out? Roll the tapes. I'm Krowell Prince, Lie Detector, on the Football Daily Podcast. Listen on BBC Sounds.

Get more with BBC Podcasts wherever you listen. Be the first to listen to your favourite shows. Like Evil Genius, Good Bad Billionaire, and You're Dead to Me with a subscription to BBC Podcasts Premium on Apple Podcasts. You can also enjoy a range of our podcasts ad-free with an Amazon Music subscription.