Root resistance but England on the brink

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You're listening to the TMS Podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live.

Welcome to our review of the 4th day of the second test at the Oval, where New Zealand are closing in on victory. They need 5 more wickets to win. England need a further 281 to win. They're 182 for 5 at tea. They were 54 for 3, and we wondered whether we would even need a 5th day, but Joe Root is still there. He is 75 not out. Harry Brook made 58. New Zealand bowled out for 362, 110 for 7, uh, today, and 4 for 17 after lunch. But they were playing lots of shots, and they wanted to get bowling. And once they did, they just began to work their way through England's batting lineup. Michael Vaughan is here, Jonathan Agnew is here. We'll hear from Henry Nicholls and Josh Tung shortly. Firstly, Michael, a certain inevitability about where we have ended up, but at least England showed some fight today.

Yeah, they did. I thought they bowled well today. There was a little bit more happening. That stemmed from Jof Rogers' first over where he found the outside edge first ball, how he dropped Brooke dropped one at first slip. England are fighting, there's never a question of the kind of want to put everything in for the Three Lions. It's just that they're up against a side that since day one, where you kind of look back to day one and they kind of worked away New Zealand to just stay in the contest, from pretty much the day two, that first hour, they've been outstanding. They've played some tremendous cricket, and with the ball in hand, they've got a skillful attack. I did enjoy Harry Brook's innings, you know, the way that he came and played, particularly after tea. I just wonder what was said at tea because England certainly came out after tea today with a little bit more energy and a little bit more of the kind of Bazball method that we've seen for a few years. But yeah, New Zealand, I mean, I can't imagine that England will bat 90 overs without losing 5 wickets and we'll be going to Trent Bridge 1-1. But you know, you never say never in cricket while you've got someone like Joe Root out there who's once again, I mean, Every time I watch Joe, I just say he makes batting look so easy. You know, he's got all the time in the world, he's got great balance, and he's got that fire inside to want to bat for long periods of time. So obviously, for England to have any kind of sniff, and it's a long sniff, the captain's gonna have to bat all day tomorrow.

It is amazing how he keeps threading that ball through, isn't it? I mean, countless hours of video every team would have watched of how— this is how you bowl to Joe Root. Here we go, this is where we're going to put the fielders. And he still just threads that ball through, down through the slips, down through third man. He's just kind of playing with them, isn't he? It's like, it's like they've had to put the fielders on string. It's, it's, it is, it is extraordinary. But yeah, I mean, Michael's right. I mean, going to England have tried hard. It's just been, it kind of sums up the rather shambolic, chaotic build-up to all of this. They've got some young, young lads playing, giving it, giving it their best. They're just outgunned, aren't they? I mean, if New Zealand could bring in someone like Henry Nicholls to replace Kane Williamson. And, you know, England have brought in some youngsters for a look, and one or two have put their hands up. We think, okay, that looks okay. But, you know, it's— I think this Test match was always likely to end this way.

Yeah, that was my point. I mean, should anyone really be that surprised that England have been a bit disjointed this week?

No, no, no, absolutely not. When you've got 5 changes and you've got 3 debutants, um, different captain, different captain, you know, you know, they've not got a great record of late here either. Even when, you know, you go back to last year against India where Ben Stokes didn't play in the game. The last game Chris Woats got injured, so they pretty much played India with 10. Um, yeah, I mean, I've seen signs of the, the, the new players that you think, yeah, I wouldn't put any of them on the scrap heap just yet. I mean, Sonny Baker, he's got a bit of pace about him. He looks like he might have to work on a bit of skill. He clearly has to get a bit closer because then he'll bowl a yard quicker, which will help him and the team. Matt Fisher looks a skillful cricketer, played nicely with the bat. And I think James Roo, I mean, he's had two scores where he'd have liked to get the bigger numbers, but, you know, I've heard things, oh, he's got a problem with the short ball. I've seen enough of James Roo to tell you that he's a good player, you know, he's a batter, you know. His keeping is certainly a work in progress, and he can keep better than he has done this week. But, you know, if you look at James Roo purely as a batter in the future— Yeah. You know, I think he has a career in the England team. I don't see him being the, uh, the wicketkeeper batter just yet. I think there's a lot of work to do with his glove work. He'll be the first to admit that. But, you know, Jordan Cox, I mean, he's not out, but I, I see him and go, he's got something about him. He's got a lot of composure. Um, and if one thing is positive from this week, if they find out about one or two players for the future in, you know, a few games' time that they need a change in the batting lineup, and, you know, you're looking at, uh, moving someone out the like, you know, you've seen a couple of players. So that's the one positive that England can take from this week. But, uh, New Zealand are excellent. They're, they're, they're a workmanlike team, aren't they? They, they know how to kind of just gather, and they, they've got in Matt Henry this week, someone that looks a lot fitter than he did at Lord's. I think if they'd have had a Matt Henry bowling the way that we've seen him this week on that pitch at Lord's— you remember he had the back spasm on day one, um, England got 140 at Lord's on day one. If Henry had been fully fit I don't think that they got the 140.

Yeah, it's interesting watching him bowling at Root and Brook again, and the way that they were determined, I thought, to show, you think you've got a problem with this, so the keeper, I will show you. And Brook playing those big shots, wasn't he? And Root, they just look really positive against that, as if, you know, you've got this wrong, lads. But actually, they were both saved by the thinnest little edges again, weren't they? I mean, I don't think the way that they played actually necessarily answers that question. They're still with that keeper up, And a bowler like Henry nagging away like that, there is something there.

Well, I think it also, uh, identify how hard it is to bowl with the keeper up. Henry's done it brilliantly. Nathan Smith tried it and he got it a little bit short, and Harry Brook went, put him onto the leg side, a couple of cut shots. So it's, it's easy for— so you just put the keeper up and you'll get Harry Brook out, or you'll get Joe Root. Well, you've still got to have skill and you've got to have discipline. And Matt Henry, once again, he could have— and that spell in the last set, he could have had a wicket every ball. He bowled beautifully, and that's the kind of bowler that he is. He gets on a roll.

I think as a bowler, you kind of buy into it. You have to buy into the whole notion of the keeper standing up as well, because, you know, you're an opening bowler, you don't really want the— you know, you don't want the keeper standing up to you, because there is that kind of negative side to it. So you've got to buy into what it actually does, which clearly Henry's done. And he's got a career extension opportunity here to bowl that little nibbly stuff. He started off as an out-and-out quick bowler, or trying to be, Well, this is lovely.

Well, the one that did for Harry Brook was a beauty because he'd been nipping them back and he just gets one to just shape away, a thin edge which came off the keeper's thigh and kind of just ballooned to Darrell Mitchell. But I watched that spell and it was two players. You had one in Harry Brook who's thinking, how do I attack him? He had mid-on and mid-off pack. It was like a spinning field. I didn't understand that from New Zealand, that if I'd have been bowling to Harry Brook, I wanted to make sure that he was on strike. And then Joe Root technically kind of working it out. It was, it was great Test match cricket.

Yeah, it really was. Contest was on because it felt actually for, I don't know, a day until England started batting as though we're not quite going through the motions, but there's that feel about the game.

Inevitability.

Yeah, about the course of the game. But then the, the, yeah, it really was Test match cricket back on again.

I'm surprised by Roo's LBW. I don't know what you two thought. That looked an odd one. I mean, every now and then, and we see a lot of these, we see every ball bowled and see a lot of Hawkeyes and all that computer stuff. That looked an odd one to me. And it's a bit unfortunate for him, maybe, because he's going to attract more short pitch bowling. He is going to work on that, isn't he? I mean, you say he can play it, I'm sure he can. He's up against two very tall quick bowlers here who seem to think that he's vulnerable to it. And you can say that he got a bit in a strange position playing that one, but I think he might have been unlucky there.

Well, I look at Jameson where he pitched the ball, and instinctively you're saying play instinctively, and he's seen it go quite short and he's gone to play the pull pull shot, which I probably would have played that shot to that length ball. It skids on. Must have been every now and again with Hawkeye, I just see a ball that was tracking and then on this occasion it seemed to flatten. It didn't kind of carry on with the trajectory of the ball. He's out. That's something that we can't change. I actually thought he played a rook quite nicely when he went in. It's Test cricket, isn't it? You get out to a bowl in the first innings playing a pull shot, guess what? Second innings, guess who's on? O'Rourke. So that's what you have to put up with, the pressure of the 20-odd thousand, everyone talking about you on, on the television, us talking about him now. Um, I, I've seen enough of James Dream, not, not necessarily this week, but over the last 2 or 3 years. I, I, I wouldn't be putting him on the scrap heap yet.

Should we talk about another left-hander as well? Jacob Bethell, uh, 6, 14, 9, 0 in this series, but we also saw him score a superb 100 in Sydney and also a brilliant 100 in the T20 World Cup semi-final as well. The talent is there, but it's not coming out so far. Number 3—

He'll tell you about number 3.

Yeah, I'll just say, look, we're asking a lot of Jacob Bethell, and, you know, I kind of understand the IPL, and I understand, you know, this contract, and a player pulls out and you get banned, don't you? You get a couple of years on the naughty step. It's very evident to me that for a young player to be successful at this level, you're asking a lot of him if he's not going to play any red ball cricket. You know, you kind of— you're going on the hunch, oh, it happened in Sydney. But in Sydney, he'd been on a tour and he'd been hitting red balls for a long period of time. He didn't play in the first 3 test matches. England went 3-0 down. He came in at the MCG, played a bit of a dashing innings, but played well in the second innings. And obviously, throughout that tour, he'd have hit hundreds and hundreds of red balls leading into that MCG game.

And mindset too. All they're talking about is red ball cricket. You're not sitting and talking about the white ball stuff.

To come out of no red ball cricket into this environment, playing a New Zealand attack that's quality, it just tells you that if it was that easy, many would have tried it before. But the problem for Jacob is like, when does he get the red ball cricket? So he'll play next week at Trent Bridge and then go straight into the white ball series against India. Then there's the Hundred, and then straight into a Pakistan series. And, you know, he's a kind of player because he's young that he just needs time in the middle, you know. I'm actually laughing because Ben Stokes is up in Durham this week getting a few runs for Durham, 95, and he'll no doubt play at Trent Bridge, I think. And he'll be so much better for that, that time in the middle. And I do worry about young players that are all format players, that they're not going to get the chance to kind of develop the game in red-ball cricket away from the glaring eye of what is Test match cricket.

But Ben Duckett said actually, "Well, I'm not going to go and play the IPL," didn't he? So, you know, and he's an established player. Doesn't it come down to the young player? If Bethell really wants to be a successful Test player, and I'm with sort of the Alistair Cook argument against KP here, it's out of him. I mean, he's going to make a choice, isn't he? I mean, it's not down to anybody else really. I want to be a successful number 3 for England, you're going to have to get into that Red Bull mindset, aren't you? And play games. Play games. Yeah, I don't think, you know, today's dismissal was down to his fault necessarily, but he just needs to play. He just needs to play some games.

I suppose the difference with Ben Duckett is he felt his Test place was on the line, whereas as far as Bethell's concerned, he kind of established himself with that 100 in that Sydney Test match.

Well, he's actually been out a couple of times LBW. I know the ball nipping back up the slope at Lord's in the first innings with a decent delivery. And today again, it nipped back. But you know, you start looking at players and you say, oh, you know, James Root's got a problem with the short ball. Well, has he? You know, what about Jacob Bethell's problem with the ball that nips back onto his stumps? So everyone has problems playing this game. It's not easy. But, you know, when you've got young players that are coming straight from the IPL with no kind of Red Bull game time behind them against a quality attack like New Zealand, and again, you go on a pitch at Lord's which was spicy, and there's just been enough here, particularly with the new ball. Don't be surprised if a few low scores happen when you haven't got the red ball cricket behind you.

And does it apply particularly to a number 3? It's like an opener or a number 3 that, you know, if he was a middle order shot player, the fact he's come back, you know, from IPL white ball cricket, you can kind of understand in a way, because that's the way they play. But because of a number 3, it's supposed to be—

Well, the perfect example is Glenn Phillips. He's been at the IPL, he's come back and played great, hasn't he? But he's batting a bit further down and he's, you know, you can be a bit more proactive down there and be a bit more aggressive. At number 3, it's like, oh, you've got a long period of time. It's that, that element of, of, of getting yourself into the zone of batting for a long period of time. You watch Joe Root, who's been our best, and he just gets into this kind of rhythm and he just bats and just plays, and he's got this process of walking away and just coming back and he faces another ball. It's nice and upright and everything's the same. I don't know how you get that process of understanding what your game is and what your processes are unless you play. Unless you're playing lots of cricket. And you know, I think your process in T20 cricket, which is just a few balls, it's probably different to what it is in red ball cricket. You know, in white ball cricket, 20-over cricket, you're always looking for boundaries, aren't you? Where are the zones that I can strike? This is a different format.

It's a rhythm, isn't it?

Yeah, it's a rhythm. He's had a couple of good balls, but it's just getting him enough cricket so that he comes back into this and he can find that flow of playing the red ball game.

But as you say, it's not obviously going to change, is it? Because there's— okay, it's one—

Agus makes a good point.

It's white ball.

Agus makes a very good point, you know. Eventually younger players might, and the money's so big in India, obviously it's going to get more and more, you would think, over time. And it's a big call for a young player to suddenly say, I'm going to focus on red ball cricket in April and May here and try and work on my game and not take the cheque. It's a big call for a young player to do it.

Because hopefully the cheque's waiting for you in years to come, you know, like a pension perhaps.

Half century for Root today, half century for Brook, and a half century, you've alluded to already, for Ben Stokes playing for Durham against Northamptonshire. He needed those runs, didn't he, if he's going to play anyway.

I must say, I was watching quite a lot of it, and I've watched Ben in Test cricket for a while now, and I've always thought, well, He looks to me like he's properly playing with his technique, you know, he's trying to almost play the purest technical innings. I watched him today for Durham and he was dancing down, he was whacking, he was pulling the ball, and it just reminded me, I thought, that's when Ben's at his best, when he's really trying to challenge the bowler. I'm not saying that he should dance down all the time, whack it over the top, but dancing down and punching it through extra cover and dancing down and flicking it through mid-wicket, and then the bowler thinks he's coming, he's not. Bowled it short and gets onto the pull shot. And there's one thing that's happened, and it's been chaotic, it's been carnage, isn't it, for English cricket. But if one thing positive can come out of it, well, maybe Ben has found his flow of batting this week. Um, so maybe things happen for a reason. The TMS Podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live.

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What about England's bowling today? Sometimes you get to the fourth day and the team are well ahead. What were they at the start of the play today? 352 for 3, effectively, New Zealand, huge lead. But actually, then, 7 for 110, was that?

Well, they bowled well today. And it's interesting, is it? I mean, Joffre Archer looks better for bowling some overs. He just— and he bowled— I thought he bowled really well today, I must say. I think that was his best, the best that we've seen of him. And the other ones suddenly are more settled, you know. It's, you know, it's anxious playing in your first Test match. Or, I mean, for Fisher, it's more or less his first Test match. You know, it takes you time to get into it, doesn't it? And to expect, um, you know, debutants to come in and just be right on it straight away is quite unrealistic, actually. So I thought, yeah, I mean, I think, I mean, Baker's interesting, isn't he? Baker at the moment is, you know, he looks like he runs in, lets it go, and yes, he is quite expensive, but he has got some pace. I do like his character. I mean, he's not someone who's going to hide away when the ball's flying around and, you know, I don't want the captain to find me sort of person. Now he's going to be out there, isn't he? So I think, I think we'll see some more of him. But the big question for me is whether Archer plays at Trent Bridge on Thursday. 'Cause now having got himself into a state of actually having got some overs under his belt, and I thought he bowled really well today, they're not going to say, "Well, thank you, Joffre, have a rest," are they? Surely. But you just don't know. I mean, if it is 1-1 and England had to win, I hope they play him.

I suppose it depends on, well, does Ben Stokes play? We think so. We don't know as we speak. Atkinson's been playing for Surrey down at Glamorgan. He's picked up a few wickets.

What about Ollie Robinson? Robinson is running in here.

Player of the match in the last game.

Yeah, he's running in, looked very fit on the outfield this morning.

Yeah, I mean, if Joffre can go again, you're playing Joffre Archer, surely.

Yeah.

And Ben Stokes, Gus Atkinson, Josh Tongue, and for me, Ollie Robinson would miss out. You know, that's the pecking order. I don't think you can say that Ollie Robinson justifies coming straight back in the side. I know he did well at Lords, but the pitch did pretty much everything for everyone. If I wanted England's best bowling attack out there next week, I'd want Joffre Archer, Josh Tong, Gus Atkinson, Ben Stokes, and then you decide upon the spinner. I mean, we have an absolute bizarre situation in English cricket that England's number one spinner, because they keep picking him, Shoaib Bashir, can't even get a game for Derbyshire this week playing at Chesterfield because the pitch is conducive to seamers. So England's number one spinner can't get a game in the second division for Derbyshire.

So what do they do then, Michael? We think it's going to be a dry week leading into Trent Bridge. Last year, Shoaib Ashir took some wickets there, didn't he? Albeit it was against Zimbabwe. Does he just come straight back? Well, he's decided Ben Stokes is back to balance the team.

Yeah, I mean, I, I think you do need a spinner. Yeah, I mean, Shoaib Ashir against the West Indies had a, a good game at Trent Bridge, so he's had two good games, um, on the venue. Uh, it's going to be a very hot week. Uh, the, the only other way that they could go is bring in Rayan Ahmed. Got 100 for last show, so pack your bat and use a bit of leg spin. Look, we'll see how he bowls in the second. I think he got a couple of wickets in the first innings for Leicester, so that could be a way that they go. Pack the bat in, uh, use Rayan's leg spin, and obviously you've got Jacob Bethel to bowl a bit of left arm, and you've got Joe Root. If I had to choose now, that would be the way that I go.

Yeah, I'd like to see Rayan Ahmed bowl. Um, yeah, his bowling is developing, and, and he— I think he's, he's a batsman who bowls wrist spin at the moment. Rather than the wrist spinner bat together, I mean. But, um, yeah, I mean, if you're gonna— it's gonna be very dry up there, um, and if you have got enough backing for, for a young wrist spinner to bowl, which it would have, I'd play him as well, definitely.

Let's hear from Josh Chung now. He took 2 for 64 in New Zealand's second innings. He's speaking to Eleanor Aldroyd.

Well bowled this morning, Josh. How did you feel you bowled as a group, maybe in comparison to how you bowled a couple of mornings ago?

Yeah, I thought we obviously had a task this morning. Obviously we were a bit behind the game and we said as a group, obviously last night we had a little chat just knowing what we wanted to do with the ball in terms of our plans. And yeah, I thought we all did very well.

I mean, you were facing being really up against it going into today as you have for the last couple of days. Is there still a good spirit among the team?

Yeah, we're in good spirits. Obviously behind the game. But yeah, we'll just see what happens tomorrow.

For you coming into this side as one of the more experienced members of the bowling lineup now, how has that felt? Have you felt a responsibility among the less experienced bowlers who've played less Test cricket than you have?

No, obviously I'm still quite inexperienced as a fast bowler in Test cricket, and obviously I'm the likes of Jof there with us as well, coming back into the team, which has been unbelievable. And obviously Sonny's obviously done really well this season for Hampshire and obviously Fish as well. So yeah, overall we're happy.

How's the captain been in the field? There have been a couple of times where he's looked a little bit frustrated when things haven't been quite going your way.

No, he's been exceptional. Yeah, he's obviously had loads of plans for us leading into the game. We've obviously had our debriefs at the end of the days as well, and he's been very supportive out there as well. When things haven't been going well, trying to slow down the game, making sure everyone's in the right positions, and just gives us 100% confidence leading into it.

What about him going out and breaking that 14,000 mark today?

Yeah, he's obviously an unbelievable player. I've watched him for many years now, and yeah, to get to 14,000 runs is, oh yeah, it's just unbelievable.

And whenever we wrap up here, off to your home ground, Trent Bridge, on Thursday. You looking forward to that?

Yeah, it's obviously obviously an amazing place to play cricket. Obviously moved a few years back now, so yeah, I'm looking forward to getting back, back at Trent Bridge and obviously in a Test match as well, hopefully.

Do you think you have a pitch that will suit you there?

Fingers crossed. We'll see what they prepare. I might have a little word, but now we'll see what happens.

Josh Tongue there with Eleanor Oldroyd. Is he kind of almost right at the top of England's pecking order now, Josh Tongue?

Yeah, I think he's a wonderful bowler. You know, the angle, the pace, the consistency. Now, there was a period, wasn't it, it was a bit wayward and spread it around, but he seems to have found his consistency. And it's not just a consistency of action, it's consistency of playing at this level. And he obviously trusts himself and believes in himself.

So he looks threatening. That's what I think. Every ball he runs in, you, you know, you see some bowlers, you know, if you look, you look and then you look away. Tung, to me, looks like you get a wicket every ball. And he seems to believe he can get a wicket every ball. He's become a very dangerous bowler. But the interesting thing about Trent Bridge, looking at the weather, one thing you often associate with Trent Bridge is swing. Actually, it doesn't look like it's going to be that sort of—

I was actually there last week, and, um, it was quite a nice week watching a bit of county cricket, and the ball reverse swung in the second.

Reverse?

Is that unusual for Trent Bridge? Yeah, the, the, the square is really dry. Yeah, and it was a dry week, and, uh, yeah, the ball's just start to reverse swing. So, uh, we might see some kind of swing, but it might not be the conventional type.

Okay, now New Zealand, a very strong position in this Test match, uh, not largely thanks to Henry Nicholls, but certainly thanks to him. He made 121 ultimately, 100 yesterday, back to Archer today, but he did his job. He's been speaking to Eleanor as well.

Henry, very many congratulations on your century. That's back-to-back centuries for you in Test matches, isn't it, going back to Zimbabwe last year.

Yeah, a wee while between Tests, but yeah, it was obviously very pleasing. And yeah, it's, you know, it was another good day of Test cricket.

When you knew that Kane was stepping down after Lords, what was that feeling like knowing that you were going to be stepping into those shoes?

Yeah, incredibly mixed emotions. You know, Kane's someone that, you know, obviously everyone who loves cricket, not even New Zealanders, have such respect for. And, you know, I was lucky enough for a lot of my Test career to have played with him and and batted behind him. And, you know, he's just a marvel. So I guess, yeah, very mixed emotions for me. Sad that he's obviously not playing with us anymore, but also, yeah, I was really excited by the opportunity. And, yeah, I just wanted to go out there and try and make a contribution. And, you know, it was nice, I guess, how yesterday worked out and the partnerships we had with Rutchen and then Darryl later on as well.

And were you feeling very much in the groove? I know you scored a lot of runs domestically during your summer.

Yeah, sort of ebbs and flows a little bit, I think, you know, it's sort of was that sort of day. Yes, it was obviously very hot. We knew if we could try and, I guess, stick at it for a while, then the runs would come like that. And I think we saw that after tea yesterday. Rach and I scored at a very, very quick rate. I think it's just the nature of the ground here and how the ball, I guess, across the square can get away quite quickly.

What's gone right for you here that didn't go right at Lord's?

Yeah, I think they're just two very different Test matches, you know. I think the Lord's Test was a bit of a lottery, obviously, with the wicket and the surface. And I think this wicket here has been been a really good cricket wicket, and I think, you know, we've done a lot of good work, and it's been 4 tough days of Test cricket, and obviously there's one more, and, you know, we're 5 pieces of cricket away from, you know, what we wanted to do at the start of this Test match.

Well, clearly you've enjoyed batting on it. I think your seamers have enjoyed bowling on it as well. It's offered something for both, you know, both bat and ball.

Yeah, I think it's a really good cricket wicket. I think, you know, you saw the way the England boys bowled this morning, and they managed to find some movement and bounce as well, and it's again what we'll be hoping to do in the morning. And like I say, it's set up really nicely for a big day 5.

And what's it like watching Joe Root go about his business out there and passing yet another milestone in his career?

Yeah, absolutely. I say someone else that I've played a lot of Test cricket against, and yeah, obviously 14,000 runs is just incredible. And like you say, he's a phenomenal player, and you know, it's obviously frustrating on the other side when you play against them, but also like you say, yeah, that absolute admiration and You know, he's a really great guy as well, and obviously an amazing player. He'll probably go down as, you know, he's on track obviously to break the all-time one. So that's obviously a big wicket for us in the morning, and, you know, hopefully we can start well.

Are you hoping you can get this done quickly and then maybe have at least an afternoon off before you head to Nottingham? Because it's a very tight turnaround.

Yeah, I mean, that's sort of the turnaround we're used to, I guess. But, you know, Tescaritz is a funny one. I think, you know, we know how much hard work it takes to get 5 wickets, and that's gonna— what it's gonna take us tomorrow, however long it takes. It might take all day, but you know, certainly from our point of view, the hard work, you know, starts again in the morning. And obviously there's 90 overs in the day, and you know, we'll be certainly on from the morning but prepared to go as long as it takes.

Have you had family here watching you? What's the reaction been back at home?

Yeah, you know, I've got family here. I've got my wife and my two kids, so they've been down most days. And I think my wife Lucy kept them here a bit longer yesterday to see it, but they're right up in the top there. So all the family's right there, which is really special. You know, you say having 2 kids, but then coming all the way over here and they're only 4 and 2, so they're not too interested in the game. But yeah, no, it was a very special moment seeing a video of them up there when I brought up the hundred.

Not missing school quite yet?

No, not just yet, no. Perfect time next year.

Well done, thank you so much.

Thank you.

That is Henry Nicholls, made 121 in New Zealand's 362. Root back for more tomorrow, 75 not out. Andy Saltzman, uh, with me. What caught your eye today statistically, Saltz?

Well, let's just, uh, start with, uh, with Root and that milestone that Henry Nicholls, uh, talked about there, the, uh, Sachin Tendulkar's all-time test runs, uh, record, uh, 15,921. Root passed, uh, 14,000 today. If he keeps scoring at the rate he's been scoring since he began a golden period in his career in 2021, just over 90 runs per test, there's a very Well, if he keeps at that rate, he will pass that record in England's series in India early in 2028. That's assuming he plays all the games in between. His conversion rate in recent years— England will need him to have any chance of this, this sort of miracle chase— will need him to do it again. 9 of his last 11 50s he's converted into hundreds, 24 of his last 41 Um, but when that 5th wicket fell, 283 still needed. No team's added more than 243 off the fall of their 5th wicket to win a Test match. So that overall target, 463, would be a record. It would be the 2nd highest ever 4th-inning score behind the 654 England made in a draw in a timeless game in South Africa in 1939, before they had to leave to get the boat home when they were only 5 wickets down. Harry Brook, brilliant half century, 51 off 33 balls. His fastest half century and the joint 6th fastest ever for England in Test cricket. But then Matt Henry came on, tied him down. Henry has got Brook out twice in this game for just 4 runs in 19 balls, both times to defensive shots. Only the 3rd time in Harry Brook's Test career, and this is his 37th Test in which he's been out defending in both, both innings. Ben Duckett now has 7 Tests without, without a half century after his dismissal, today. And just a quick word on, on Matt Henry. Absolutely outstanding, uh, today. Just the one wicket, also had, uh, had a catch dropped early on and almost had Brook and, uh, Root out LBW, both overturned on review. He's now taken 110 wickets at 20.4 in his 30s. He didn't have a great start to his Test career, in and out of the side, but, uh, you look at the all-time best Test seamers in their, in their 30s, he's right up there in terms of average with some of the all-time greats of the game: Jasprit Bumrah, Richard Hadley, and Malcolm Marshall, and Imran Khan from the 1980s. He's just ahead of Curtly Ambrose, Josh Hazlewood, Alan Donald, Glenn McGrath, Joel Garner, and England's Freddie Truman. That's the kind of statistical company Henry's been keeping. He's not generally viewed in that, in that, um, in that class, partly because of that difficult start to his career. His average has been sort of creeping up but he has been absolutely outstanding for New Zealand for several years now and made— yeah, he's been the decisive figure in this game up until now.

Yeah, he's been phenomenal. And one more stat to finish with: no team that's been 5 down going into the final day of a Test match ever has survived to draw the game. I suppose England need 281, so if they did battle all day, they might get 281, so it wouldn't be a draw, but Look, New Zealand are closing in, you'd think, on a 1-1. You can watch highlights on Today at the Test on the BBC iPlayer. There are clips available on the BBC Sport website and app. BBC Sounds has commentary from the Women's T20 World Cup, and look out for all our podcasts, including our View from the Boundary with the Governor of the Bank of England.

5 lives for—

Favorite World Cup moment? I'd have to say commentating on my first World Cup final in Moscow in 2018.

It was a realization of achieving a childhood dream.

The 2018 World Cup final is underway.

Who's your favourite player in World Cup history? It would be Zico of Brazil back in 1982. He was skillful, he had an eye for the spectacular goal, and he was also part of that flamboyant Brazilian side that has to be one of the greatest teams never to win a World Cup.

The FIFA World Cup 2026.

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