Sciver-Brunt 75 sends England into World Cup Final

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You're listening to the TMS Podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live. So England are through to the T20 World Cup final. Final. They've won by 40 runs here at the Oval. All smiles, jubilation for an England side that were wobbling earlier on. They lost 3 early wickets inside the power play to find themselves early on at 23 for 3. They then needed something special, and that special partnership came from Heather Knight, the former captain, alongside the current captain and returning from injury Nat Sciver-Brunt. They put on 133 of just 90 deliveries England eventually scoring 169 for 5. In response, South Africa, well, there were moments early on where it looked as though Laura Woolfheart could get going, that Tasmin Brits, who played nicely for a half century, could possibly do something. But no, the wickets kept on falling at crucial times. England's bowling was outstanding, their fielding excellent, and they book their place in the final to face Australia at Lord's on Sunday afternoon. They win by 40 runs. And it will be England v Australia, that familiar fixture at the home of cricket, to decide who will be lifting the T20 World Cup trophy. Winner of the last time England won an ICC trophy, part of that squad at Lord's in 2017 and on the field taking wickets throughout that competition as well. Alex Hartley, you are part of it. You know how it feels. Fadose Munda, you've been here before as a South African cricket follower. You know what it is to see a side getting close but not quite over the line. Let's run the rule over what we've seen. Alex, first of all, your reaction.

I mean, I'm just so proud of the England girls for getting through. I mean, so much pressure on them to get to that home World Cup final because England have never lost a home World Cup ever. And there's been a lot of talk, crowds have got behind the girls and how they've crumbled under pressure in the past, how they've not fielded well, how they've been under par, how they've been dominated by Australia, by South Africa. Charlotte Edwards has taken over a year ago and she had this World Cup in her sight. She said, I will be judged at this World Cup, and she absolutely will be, and she'll be judged in a proper way and the right way. And whatever happens on Sunday, whatever the result, this team is a completely different team to what it was a year ago.

Fidesz, I don't think South Africa played to potential at this tournament, and they certainly didn't look like a side that should be in a World Cup final or even winning a World Cup. There were far too many close matches. The batting was discombobulated through a lot of the tournament, and they were over-reliant on two bowlers, Maryzan Kapp and Shabnam Ismail. So I almost feel like from a team that reached the last three finals in ICC events, they've gone a little bit backwards, but the bar is quite high. You're reaching finals and now you're not. There is a little bit of work to be done in terms of depth, maybe in terms of the backroom staff, and also moving on from that golden generation. They'll be very disappointed, but I think that deep heartbreak that has accompanied some of the losses is not there this time. Because they didn't deserve it. And as Alex said of England, they absolutely did.

Ladies and gentlemen, the player of the match tonight is none other than England captain Nat Sciver-Brunt. She receives her player of the match medallion from two-time World Cup winner Isha Guha. 75 from 47, 11 fours and 1 six, striking at nearly 160. Firstly, welcome back. What were your feelings coming into this match, knowing what a crucial match it was to return?

Yeah, I guess obviously nervous. Probably the occasion gets quite big as well. So that increased the nerves as well. And I missed a few games as well. So yeah, I guess there was a lot of emotion pre-game. But yeah, I suppose as soon as the warm-up started, I managed to switch back on to game time and yeah, just enjoyed myself out there.

And the way you managed to switch back on, 23 for 3, You got together with Heather Knight, you needed just one partnership, you got that, but how did you go about rebuilding that England innings?

Yeah, I guess Shabnim and Marozane are obviously world-class opening bowlers that we knew could do the damage. So I suppose Heather and I wanted to nullify the threat and make sure that we were then in and able to capitalize on the other bowlers. And yeah, I suppose with our experience we put our heads together and yeah, got the job done.

It's usually a good surface here, but it was the third game played on this wicket. How did you find the conditions and how did you manage your game out there?

Yeah, a little bit of variable bounce, so I guess we had to be really strong on the stumps and I guess be very clear on where you wanted to score. And yeah, I suppose when, when you're in for a period of time, it does get a little bit easier. And yeah, I guess making it— it was difficult for new batters coming in, so Um, yeah, the partnership was obviously crucial.

Well, congratulations tonight. Our player of the match, Nat Sciver-Brunt.

The England captain, Nat Sciver-Brunt, speaking down there on the boundary edge. And, uh, reaction immediately that we will bring more of as we get it, as we look back on England qualifying for the final of the tournament that is going to roll around quickly, Alex. Sunday, not long to wait, but lying in wait, Australia. I mean, it's a huge fixture, it's what the tournament's deserved actually, I think.

Yeah, absolutely, the two best teams, aren't they? Have been the two best teams. Australia, best team in the world. England shown their dominance throughout this tournament. So yeah, it definitely deserves an England-Australia final.

Yeah, we'll get on to maybe how that game will go shortly, but just if we do examine the, the England performance those. You mentioned the fact that you feel maybe South Africa have gone backwards. I'm not sure from the positioning that we're in at 23 for 3 a year ago, even they go on to, to post a total like the 169 for 5, because I think that they were a more brittle side then. I think they're tougher.

Yeah, definitely. You know, Henry, we know that teams 73% or 77% of the time when you lose 3 3 wickets in the power play, you go on to lose the game. And just to see their 2 experienced players, Nat Sciver-Brunt and Heather Knight, playing as well as they did— that was an incredible partnership. The pacing of the innings was good. Nat Sciver-Brunt looked incredible. She was in total control. And I love what she said there about how she just switched on when the warm-ups came and she knew that she had to lead this team there. So I think England are a lot stronger. I was really interested to see what Charlotte Edwards would do with this side and turn them around the way she has. You know, it hasn't been that long that she's been in charge and she's already made such a big difference. They really look like a strong side. I think the final is going to be so interesting.

I think you're right. Yeah, uh, 2010, you have to go back 7 editions for the last time a side lost 3 wickets in the power play and came back to win it. I mean, that, that says quite a lot.

Yeah, it does. And the funny thing is, like, a year ago, England losing 3 in the power play, you'd go, let's get him off, isn't it? Going to crumble under the pressure. We were saying it on air really, I had no doubt that there would be a partnership between Nat Sciver-Brunt and Heather Knight. These are two players that have played in the team in the past where I'd have gone, oh, they're going to crumble under pressure and they're going to get knocked out of the tournament. So whatever is going on in that dressing room to give them confidence and to give everyone—

what is going on? How does that happen?

I think the way, the way they are playing cricket and the way they are winning games of cricket gives you confidence. The way they're fielding, the way they're stopping the ball on the boundary, the catches they're taking, the opportunities they're creating in the field. Um, the way that Freya Kemp and Dani Gibson have come into this side and both on separate occasions taken the game away from a team. Um, knowing that Heather Knight and Nat Sciver-Brunt just have a 6 or 7 over partnership, you have that firepower at the back. It just, it's just such a well-balanced side now.

Yeah, and, and that feels like there is real confidence that if one person doesn't perform, or two or three people don't perform, there is the resilience. They're not going to be quite as fickle as us.

It feels like Charlie Dean coming in at 8 in this team is so different to Charlie Dean coming in at 8 last year.

Yeah, it's funny how perspectives change, isn't it? How much credit do you put at the door of Charlotte Edwards for, for the turnaround?

I think a lot of it because she has brought in that all-rounder aspect, and she, you know, she said that I want Freya Kemp and I want Dani Gibson from the outset. And you know, from the off, she's been really, really keen to develop everybody as all-rounders. And you can't just be an opening bat, you've got to be a jet in the field. You know, they had to get fitter, they had to start fielding better. They have done that, they absolutely have done that. The way that everybody's developed their game, you know, Danni Wyatt-Hodge being able to play 360, Nat Sciver-Brunt obviously doing that as well, Heather Knight being confident enough to play a reverse sweep. So I just think everybody has adapted their game for the better.

Yeah, it feels that way, doesn't it? It feels as though they've grown in confidence and strength and resilience and, and all of those sort of key elements that no matter how many hours of drills you do in the nets, you're never going to necessarily get. Uh, word on, on England's bowling for those. First of all, I mean, some brilliant figures in there. And bearing in mind that the required rate at the start of the South African run chase was, was in excess of 8-0 over the The fact that nobody's economy was over that figure is such a credit to England. And you know, you have to say that, yeah, particularly Sophie Ecclestone and particularly Freya Kemp, and, and also I think you could probably chuck in Charlie Dean, though she did go for a few runs at the back end of her, of her spell. But it just was such a strong all-round unit.

It was. I think England also do a really nice thing where they start with Lindsay Smith, and she tends to get rid of an over or two really cheaply. Up front. So already you're under pressure. You start needing 8 runs and over. By the 4th over, you need 9 or 10 runs and over. Then you've got Lauren Bell coming, you know the ball's going to be swinging. Then you've got Sophie Ecclestone who comes on after the power play, and she was impossible to get away. It was a really impressive performance from her. You know, she's also been under pressure. I think as a unit, they just came together in a way that I haven't seen another team do at this tournament. Australia maybe, but to me— and I've watched the matches in this tournament, I think England look almost just that little bit stronger at the moment.

Sophie Ecclestone, Alex now has 334 wickets across international formats. We'll hear more from you in a moment, but here is Laura Woolfard.

I know it's pretty raw at the moment, but just talk us through the emotions.

Yeah, uh, very disappointed, um, but just not meant to be for us today. Um, I think we're outplayed today by, by a really good England side. Side. And yeah, I think they played really well.

You've been in situations like this before and you've been able to, to get over the line. So what was different this evening?

Uh, not too sure. Um, I think the main difference between our innings and theirs is just they had so many more partnerships. Um, obviously we started really well with the ball and then they had that really big partnership, and I think we just didn't have any partnerships to, to sort of speak of, um, and didn't really have any batters that really got going. Um, so frustrating to lose this way on a big stage. But yeah, we'll go back to the drawing board.

Did the pitch play as you expected to in that second innings, and what did you feel was traceable at the halfway stage?

Yeah, I thought it was a pretty decent pitch, uh, coming on quite nicely. Um, thought 170 was about par. Um, pretty happy with that. Um, yeah, I thought especially with the outfield as well, it's lightning. I thought it was going to be tough to defend. Um, but yeah, I think they built pretty well. Clearly had different plans for us and yeah, we weren't able to step up.

How difficult is it to play against a team that have so much home support as well at a ground like this?

Yeah, I think it does play a role, but also cool to see so many fans here tonight. I think it just adds sort of to the vibe and the energy. Couple of South Africans as well that I saw. So yeah, that was nice.

And just lastly, just on South Africa on the whole through this tournament, you know, A lot of positives obviously for you to get to this point. How will you reflect on, you know, what you put and what you brought to the table?

Yeah, a decent campaign for us. I think happy to have made it out of this group stages. I think upon reflection, our batting never really fired throughout the competition. We had some glimpses here or there, some special innings throughout the tournament, but I think as a whole we just weren't quite clicking. So yeah, and I think that showed again a bit today. But yeah, I think our bowling and our fielding was pretty good throughout. So yeah, I think we'll have a look at what we've done wrong and hopefully be better next time.

A lot of experienced players within that squad, but a lot of young players coming through. Do you see that they've learned enough lessons here to be able to take forwards?

I hope so. Yeah, I think we have got an exciting mix at the moment. Got some really senior players who have played a lot of games with a lot of experience, but some exciting youngsters coming through as well. Hopefully we learn from this. I think the likes of Daxton was, was pretty good with the bat throughout. So yeah, hopefully players like that can be even better in the next edition.

Hard luck once again, Laura, and all the best in your matches coming up.

Thanks.

That's a good run.

The winning captain. 17 years since England last won a T20 World Cup semi-final here. There's something about the Oval and playing here as an England team.

Yeah. Yeah, what a special place to play cricket. We've really loved playing here over the years, obviously 17 years ago as well. But yeah, what a great ground to, I suppose, show the crowd how much we enjoy playing for England and yeah, trying to inspire as many people as we can.

At 23 for 3, you've already explained how you and Heather Knight went about your business and the partnership that you put together. A lot of experience there, but how much belief can you tell us that you have as a unit at the moment that you can bounce back from difficult situations?

Yeah, I guess we've got full confidence in our batting lineup from top to bottom. So I suppose from that point of view, there was never any worry about, you know, other people coming in. But Heather and I knew that we had a really important job to do to get our team back on track. And yeah, I suppose the composure that we showed was really important. You know, we could have tried to go harder earlier and, you know, maybe it didn't work out the way it did. So yeah, I think we were really smart and yeah, took the game on in a slightly different way to, I suppose, a typical T20 innings.

Did you feel short at the halfway stage?

No, I think we had a good score. We could tell that there was some variable bounce and keeping the stumps in play was going to be so important. Maybe using some cutters and cross seamers as a seam bowling group. And yeah, I thought that Freya Kemp especially did so well with her off pace deliveries and mixing it up just made it so difficult for the batters.

When it came to that second innings, we know how much depth South Africa have with the bat. It felt like a bit of a gamble that, that 6 over in the powerplay with Lindsay Smith coming back on. You got the wicket of the captain. Charlotte Edwards ran onto the field. Was there a plan behind that?

Yeah, to get 3 overs from the same bowler is pretty tough in T20. Lindsay's done a brilliant job for us in the powerplay, but I suppose tactically for us to be able to have 4 overs of Sophie in the middle that has been a huge benefit for our team. But obviously Lindsay taking that wicket of Wolfhard in the powerplay was so key. We had the plan set out right and yeah, we stuck to our guns really. When she'd hit one over the top, the delivery before, Lindsay and I looked at each other and thought, let's go again.

Yeah. The crowd, just incredible. Did you have a chance to kind of take it all in? We heard than banging out Adele at one point.

Yeah, very, very tuneful. Yeah, no, the crowd has been so good throughout this tournament. I managed to take it in a little bit walking out to bat and walking off and a few of the wickets as well. Yeah, it's just infectious playing with this team and in front of the home crowd has been so special. So yeah, I cannot wait to do it again.

How's the calf?

Calf's good.

The old enemy at Lord's, how big of an occasion is that going to be?

Massive. Yeah, what an occasion it'll be. I guess, you know, finding out there's a home World Cup, who has dreamed to be in that final, and what an opposition to be facing. Yes, obviously a really, really talented side that have had a huge success. But yeah, we'll see what happens down at the awards.

Is it coming home?

Hopefully.

Okay, we'll leave it at that. Well done this evening, Nat. Congratulations on your own performance, to Heather as well, and for the overall team performance. All the best on Sunday.

You're listening to the TMS Podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live. Thoughts there of the two captains. That was Nat Sciver-Brunt, Jassim Duishi Guha. And, uh, I'm mentioning Australia and their record in finals against England. Well, uh, I might as well bring you the stat. They've played 6 of them and Australia have won 6 of them, going right back from 1982, '88, 2012, 2014, 2018, and 2022. But records are there to be broken, Alex Hartley.

They are indeed, and that record has to be broken at some stage, doesn't it? So England will be hoping and praying that it is this time around. This time on Sunday, England have lifted the trophy hopefully, and they'll be out on the outfield having a drink. Um, yeah, but Australia have been dominant against England in World Cup finals.

Yeah, they have. They've been so strong. Uh, so a little word on Sophie Ecclestone. 334 international wickets across formats. Uh, Hypercourse, thank you for that stat and for pointing out that, uh, that it is now only one behind England's leading wicket-taker, Katherine Siver-Brunt.

I mean, that's just ridiculous, isn't it? She's an unbelievable cricketer, you know, there's absolutely no doubt about that. Um, I said, you know, she's— what is she now, 26? She's got another 10 years, she could take 1,000 wickets, like genuinely, you know, she's such a good player. Um, yeah, I mean, I've There's no words to sum her up as a player. One wicket behind Katherine Silverbrunt, she's like the greatest England have ever had, a fast bowler. Sophie Ecclestone is, you know, the best bowler I think that cricket has produced ever, women. She's not quite Rashid Khan, but, but she's the women's version of—

Yeah, well, that's pretty high praise, Alex, I have to say. Uh, she took 1 for 21 from her 4 overs this evening, and she's been speaking Alison Mitchell.

Sophie, you're into a World Cup final at home. What's tonight meant to you all?

I can't even put into words how much I'm absolutely buzzing. Like, home World Cup final, how much— like, the cheerio was unbelievable tonight, so I can't wait for Sunday.

How about Nat Zimmerbrandt, your captain, strolling in?

Carve?

What carve?

Yeah, I can't— like, can't believe how good she was. I've got no words for her. She's just unbelievable and one in a generation cricketer.

Take me into the dugout though, when it was 23 for 3, what were you all feeling then and how did then things unfold when that, as that partnership developed between Nat Sciver-Brunt and Heather Knight?

Yeah, I was going a bit quiet, but to watch Heather walk out to join Nat, I feel like that's the calmest duo you've got in cricket and we're very lucky to have them. So to watch them go out and do their thing, I think is like world class to watch them do that.

And the catch you took, couple of catches tonight. Talk us through those.

Yeah, I feel like it was following me a little bit, but I feel like, yeah, I'm a big game player, like live for The ball's following me, then I love it.

So I was buzzing to take a few catches.

You're into the World Cup final. In 2017, when England won the World Cup, you had already made your debut for England, but you couldn't be in contention for the World Cup, could you, back then? Tell us about that story.

Yeah, obviously I was in school, so I got told to do my exams over cricket. So to be in a home World Cup final now, however many years on, I'm absolutely buzzing. I can't wait.

What do you remember of that final? Did you watch it?

Yeah, I was in the stands watching, so I got a picture of Danny White-Hodge with the trophy, so hopefully we can reincarnate that on Sunday.

How important do you think it will be to have some of those in the side still that played in that final to bring their experience to what's going to be such a big occasion?

Yeah, to have some experienced players there like Heather and Nat, I mean, it's unbelievable to have them in the team anyway, but they've got World Cup experience on home soil. So yeah, we'll definitely be tapping into them too ahead of Sunday.

Australia has just been such a thorn in England's side for so long. Is there any sense of fear factor about this current Australian side?

T20 cricket, anything can happen. They're a great team, but we're also a great team. I feel like we've proved how good we are over the last few weeks and few months. So hopefully we can give them a good game and yeah, come out on top.

You're unbeaten. What sense of momentum does that give you going into a final?

Yeah, unbelievable to be unbeaten, getting to a World Cup final. Can't ask for much more. So yeah, we're really excited for that.

Well done. Incredible achievement. See you on Sunday.

Thank you.

Sophie Ecclestone, who took from her 4 overs 1 for 21 as England won by 40 runs to ensure their place in Sunday's T20 World Cup final. Come on then, Alex, how do they beat Australia?

Hold your nerve, hold your nerve. When Australia are going hard at you, don't crumble under that pressure. They are human, they are not robots. They will also be feeling that pressure. I think they're allowed to have good spells in the game, but England hold their nerve. They were very capable of coming back. Um, I think they have to use the strength of their bowling attack for that, to their advantage. You know, I think England have been very adaptable in the way that they've gone about things. Sophie Ecclestone, if she needs to bowl in the power play, has to bowl in the power play. Lindsay Smith doesn't necessarily have to bowl in at the death. Um, they've obviously got Kemp and Gibson. Gibson with a back of the hand slower balls. Lauren Bell, uh, up top. I, I think Yeah, just, just hold your nerve against a very, very strong Australian side and absorb the pressure. And if they're on top, so be it. You know that, you know, somebody like Phoebe Litchfield, for example, when she's in and she's striking the ball, she's playing a sweep, so reverse sweeps, she's also going to create opportunities with those.

So you think they can do it?

Absolutely think they— the way I've seen this England side play, that the way they've cruise through this group stage, the confidence they'll take. Like I've said before, the way they're fielding, the way they're taking their catches, their ground fielding— Dani Gibson has set the standard. She's been unbelievable in the field, and it's just given them all confidence. So yes, I do believe they can win, um, it's not— it's just not going to be easy.

Talk us through that feeling, just finally, of, of being part of an England squad as you were in 2017. That knows the pressure to get to the final is a big pressure because of the fact it's a home World Cup. I mean, how, how relieved do you feel at this point that you've done that as a side?

Yeah, so relieved. You've almost— it's— the game has changed in the 9 years since we did it back in 2017. It was almost like a, okay, we've got to the World Cup finals, almost a job done. And that's— yeah, the talk to me was that job done, whatever happens happens. And obviously among amongst the senior players, it would have been, we've got to win this game of cricket to see what had to change in English cricket in the future. Um, in a weird way, there is more pressure on this side because having won in '17 means we've never lost the home World Cup final. The Roses, the Lionesses, they've added a little bit of pressure as well. Um, but then you're playing against the world's best side who are very adaptable, who have all basically covered, that clinical, they know how to win, but they haven't been winning either, you know. They've not made World Cup finals.

Yeah, their recent record is not what it was.

Exactly. So you've got one team with a point to prove to themselves, being Australia. I don't think they've got a point to prove to the rest of the world. And you've got England that go in as underdogs at home with the backing of the crowd, hopefully a sold-out Lords and I guess that confidence of knowing how they've played throughout this tournament.

We shall see. Alex Hartley, thank you very much indeed for your thoughts and company this evening. And that is just about where we will leave things here from the Oval, where we've seen England getting over the line quite comfortably in the end to beat South Africa by 40 runs and book their place in the final of the T20 World Cup against Australia on Sunday. So much to look forward to., ahead of that game as well. Don't forget, on BBC Sounds, the Test Match Special podcast has, uh, an edition looking back at that 2017 success from those inside the camp, and, uh, I highly recommend that. So do look out for that. Just search Test Match Special on BBC Sounds. On Sunday, we will be live on air 3:00 ahead of a 3:30 start from Lord's, the home of cricket. Before that, the second T20 England's men against India from 2:15 on Saturday. From Old Trafford. So much to look forward to, so much to enjoy. England through to the World Cup final against Australia. We'll be there on Sunday. Make sure you're with us. The TMS Podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live.

5 likes for my favorite World Cup moment. It's the first World Cup I properly remember watching, Argentina '78. The ticker tape, Mario Kempes, Harry Hahn scoring goals from miles out. And always one of my favorite World Cup moments, Archie Gemmell's great goal for Scotland England against the Dutch. What makes the World Cup such a special tournament is the atmosphere, the color. It is a meeting of the nations and of people who love football.

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