Chris Webber - Building a Legacy - [Glue Guys, EP. 47]

Early in my career, I'd spend hours alone in the film room thinking I was being productive. But the truth was, I had no idea what I was doing. I was just going through the motions. That's what finance leaders tell me. They're frustrated because they waste hours manually tracking expenses and reconciling statements when they should be focusing on driving their business forward. Be honest with me, how much of your time is spent on high value work? For many finance teams, it's less than 20%. But you can change that right now with Ramp. Ramp is a free corporate card that handles all the tedious financial operations automatically so your finance team can focus on what actually moves the needle. One CFO told me they cut their month end close from five days to one. It's no surprise over 25,000 businesses trust ramp, including Shopify, CBRE and Boys and Girls Club of America. Don't waste any more time going through the motions. Check out ramp@ramp.com GG and for glue Guys listeners, Ramp is offering metal cards for the next 30 days. Just go to ramp.com gigi cards issued by Sutton bank member FDIC. Terms and conditions apply.

He asked me a question. He was like, what do you want to be known for? He was like, you can have the same stats here and we'd be lost in a small town, the highest tax bracket, the smallest fan base. Or you can make something special. And it's about legacy. And I think it is about your legacy. It's about what you're fighting for. When something's bigger than you, I think that you're able to put much more into it.

Well, the success of Glue Guys to this point has taken our show on the road. We were invited to speak and present a Glue Guys Live at the next Legacy Bridge Summit in San Francisco a few weeks ago. So Alex Smith and I took the stage with special guest Chris Weber to discuss what makes Glue Guy. Chris is a special person in my life. I followed him at Detroit Country Day High School many, many years ago, played with both his brothers. So he's always been a role model and a hero to me. So it was a thrill for me personally to take the stage with Chris and ask him to share some of the memories he's had in his hall of Fame career. So I hope you enjoy the conversation between Alex Smith, Chris Weber and Shane Battier talking about Glue Guys. Guys, this is completely unscripted. So if you don't cheer at the end, we completely understand we're flying by the seat of our pants, but we have amazing Guests here today. I'm Shane Battier. I'm the lacquered of this group. I was only the sixth pick in the NBA draft. We have two number one picks of their respective sports hall of Famer, Chris Weber, member of the Naismith National Basketball hall of Fame, Alex Smith, who was the number one pick, three time Pro Bowler of the San Francisco 49ers. Welcome to Glue Guys Live. So our day jobs, Alex and I host a podcast called Glue Guys where we talk about lessons of sports and business and life and culture. And it's really nerdy, but it's sometimes entertaining. So we're trying to bring that flavor here today. And so my first question for you guys. All right. Cooper Flagg is the first pick in the NBA draft. We're so lucky to have two first picks of their respective drafts with us today. What is Cooper Flagg feeling right now?

Go ahead, Chris. I'll let you take this one. Go ahead.

I think Cooper Flagg is feeling a whole host of emotions. Number one, you're nervous. You're trying to be cool and keep in your emotions because everyone in your family is experiencing emotions. You know, what are you going to wear? What are you going to do? Hey, how many tickets can we get? And so it's great in that factor, you get to see all your high school coaches. Everyone's kind of reminding you how much fun the journey was. So one, I hope that they're nervous, I hope they're excited, and I hope they're going through in their head just the journey. And I remember doing that after I just called a timeout. We had just lost the national championship. And here, 60 days later, I'm able to be, you know, drafted in Detroit, where I'm from. And it was just such a high and appreciative moment. And I think right now they're just going through a word salad and a bunch of emotions just like I'm giving you guys now.

Completely agree. It was. It was so surreal. It was like an outer body experience. I mean, to be in the green room. I mean, this. I grew up a football fan and you watch the NFL draft, it's this big, big deal. You know, you never fathom in your wildest dreams like that it actually would ever be you back there. And then there you are sitting at that round table and that phone in the middle of the table that you don't know how it got there is ringing, right? And all of a sudden your name's called. And for me, it was a life changing event, a life changing Event. I mean, I was a late bloomer, under the radar, underdog, and had been my entire life. And then it flipped. And then you're on the COVID of every newspaper in the country. And with that comes huge expectations, right? And you know, I've, I talked about this, but like, you know, coming to The San Francisco 49ers, this, this, this franchise steeped in quarterback legacy, right? It's, it's Joe Montana and Steve Young, and then on top of that, you're the number one pick. So for me, I got to be John Elway and Peyton Manning all at once. And I'm a 20 year old kid and I just, I had just never dealt with anything like that. So Cooper and Chris both, I mean, I think for them the trajectories were apparent much younger. And I think for me also, I don't know about you, but as the first professional contract I signed, that really changed things, right? Like the first time to be making money and you signed this crazy. You know, you've been playing for free and you would play for free, but all of a sudden you're getting a ton of money, a ton of money. And everybody knows what you make, right? And it just, it changes everything.

So did you guys read the book that they sent you before on how to be number one draft pick?

Yeah, I didn't get that book.

You're still waiting for that one?

Yeah, get that book.

So Chris and I have a kind of a crazy connection. Chris was like my hero growing up. We're both from Detroit, all right? And when he graduated from Detroit Country Day, he was a three time state champion, Mr. Basketball in the state of Michigan and the Naismith national player of the Year. I show up at Country Day's front steps as a 6, 4, 7th grader and they said, oh, you're the next Chris Webber. I said, who's Chris Webber? And so Chris cast a huge shadow on my career and gave me an amazing bar to shoot for. And I had the pleasure of playing with both his younger brothers. And luckily we also won three state championships and I won Mr. Basketball and the Naismith National Player of the Year. So it all worked out, right? But it's funny and ironic that we're here today, but we're here today to talk about Glue Guys, okay? The name of our podcast, Glue. Glue Guys and Glue Gals. Glue People. What's that mean? It's the folks in the office that always clean off the whiteboard when the meeting's over, right? It's the folks that bring in the coffee in the morning and brighten everyone's day. It's the people that just make things run smoother and they're better when that person's involved and never get the credit. Never get the credit. Does anyone relate to that at all? Right. You know, we have people who've been to pro Bowls and NBA Finals, and there's not a successful person in this room who has not had a glue guy, a glue gal on their team. So let's give the glue guys, the glue gals, some love today. Let's talk about that. All right. And so when I think about glue, I think about the acronym glass. All right? G, Give first. Okay? They're the first givers of a group. Now, Alex, you mentored first ballot hall of Famer Patrick Mahomes. Okay. Talk about when he was drafted and talk about basically having to teach your replacement, even though you're a Pro bowl hall of Famer.

Yeah, it was hard. It was hard, right? Like, you know, for us in Kansas City at the time, we were a really good football team. You know, going to the playoffs, winning the division, you think you're a player or two away from making the run. I mean, I'd been playing my best football. And you don't ever expect on draft day for your team to move up and trade up multiple picks to draft a player at your position and, you know, definitely a hard pill to swallow. And for me, I think, you know, a defining moment, like, what was I going to do with that? Right. You know, as much as the media made a big deal about it and then pitted us against each other and he's going to take my job. But I knew, you know, Andy Reid had told me that, like, I still was the starting quarterback that year, right? Like, I had the keys to the car. And I also knew, like, it was year 13 for me, that regardless of Patrick being there, like, if I didn't play, winning football was gonna be out of a job anyway. Right. And so it was. It wasn't gonna do me any good to be looking over my shoulder and distracting and being distracted. And I think the bigger thing, though, you know, I remember being the top pick. I just talked about it, right? Like, I remember I started really early in my career. I can remember spending hours and hours in the film room as a 21 year old kid by myself and having no clue what I was doing. I didn't know what an NFL quarterback looked like. I mean, I knew they were supposed to watch a lot of film, and I was in there watching a lot of film and just wasting my time. And, you know, I think as I got older, I remember how alone I felt. Like I felt really alone. And I didn't have anybody to call, right? There's only 32 people in the world that have this job. None of them live in my city, right? And it wasn't like I could pick up a phone and call any of them and ask for advice. And again, you know, fast forward, here's Patrick, and he didn't have any say in this, right? And I think inherent in any relationship is respect, right? And Patrick's a super respectful kid. And, you know, you give respect, you get respect. And he. And I hit it off right away. And I think the other thing, like, listen, it's not like I was whispering the secrets to quarterbacking to Patrick in the film room, right? Like, that's not what this was.

But you gave him your Tuesday night, Thursday night plan. You helped him.

He got. I mean, I was in year 13 at that point. I had three kids. I had my week down, scheduled to the minute, right? Like, I was so efficient with my time, what every single day of the week needed to look like so I could play well on Sunday. And the cool thing about the Kansas City quarterback room is, like, you have to do everything together. That's the culture. And so Patrick got a front row seat for an entire year on the ups and downs, the in betweens and off season again, Mondays after a tough loss, Mondays after a big win, Saturday night, prepping for a big game and all the stuff in between. And he got for an entire year to kind of see that right up close and to take what he likes and certainly a modeling of a behavior. And I mean, there's a guy that. He was at my house on Thanksgiving, right? He's a young guy. Like, we go out to eat at QB dinners, and I gotta tell him, like, stop putting ketchup on your steak, right? Like, you know, this is a nice steakhouse. We don't have to drink Coors Light. Patrick. So there's all that stuff, right? And it's funny, you know, you obviously, you realize pretty quickly that my path and Patrick's path, believe it or not, are not contradictory, right? Like, I'm trying to be the best I can be, and so is he. And those two things don't have to go against each other, you know, Chris.

For those who weren't familiar with the Sacramento Kings, they were like the most fun team to watch. They shared the basketball. They look like they cared about each other, right? They ran into A buzzsaw. The Laker team, all right, they were.

The Roadblock and the refs.

I didn't want to go there. I didn't want to go there.

Just full context, that's all.

No scar tissue.

But Chris, talk about being a giver, all right, you're an all NBA player, future hall of Famer, you know, one of the best players in the league. But correct me if I'm wrong, you got more joy in creating opportunities for your teammates and passing. And that was. It was such a tough place to play in Arco when I played against you guys. So talk about like the mentality of being the best player but still being the glue guy that wants to get everybody involved. Like, where do you learn that, man?

Well, thank you. You mentioned it about the person at the meeting that whites off the wipes off the whiteboard. And I think also you have to look to the leader that recognizes, Wait, that guy's been wiping off the whiteboard and hasn't said anything. He's about to move up because I see he's a team player. And I think when you want to win, it's really about the full environment. And Coach Carril, who was the coach of Princeton at the time, Coach Pete Carrill came to our team and I absolutely love this man. He was a walking. He was a walking encyclopedia when it came to basketball. And he gave me a book and it was the fast take from the strong. And we talked about how the trend was to be so strong, but really it should be to be fast. And he was like, what does that mean mentally? And he asked me a question. He was like, what do you want to be known for? He was like, you can have the same stats here. And we'd be lost in a small town, the highest tax bracket, the smallest supporting fan base, or you can make something special special. And it's about legacy. And I think, you know, we've heard founders here talk about, you know, being a founder and what it takes to put into it. And a lot of time with that off work balance. It is about your legacy. It's about what you're fighting for. And when something's bigger than you, I think that you're able to put much more into it. And playing with a guy like a Vladi Divak who was a great passer, or a guy like Peja, who you're a fool if you don't pass him the ball because he's going to make the shot. And our whole thing was having that great culture. And so I think when you're a leader. I think being a glue guy is even that much more important because it takes away from your ego to step back and to let those that know what they're doing do it with passion. And then when it's time to step in as well, to help build that culture. And that's what I wanted to do. Build the culture in the locker room where we were friends and family first, because we were always going to be David fighting with a rock against Goliath. And if you're, if you, if you're going to be the small guy fighting against the big guys, then you better play with guys that even if you lose, you'll love at the end of the day, because that's what you have to be rooted in.

That's an excellent point. And when I think about glue guys, the OWL stands for listening deeply, having an awareness of sort of what's going on. So talk about how, how you have sort of an anticipatory awareness of listening in the locker room. How important is that in creating a stronger, more cohesive team?

So a pretty good lesson I learned. You know how the locker room is. You always hear it, I'm sure, for the office, many of you, it's a sanctuary. Because if Shane comes in, I'm going to go, oh, you wore another blue jacket today. And, you know, just bust you up, just to take your mind off any seriousness, because here it's a safe haven. And I remember playing with Vladi, and Vladi used to always have bedhead, always used to come in. He looks like he's asleep all of the time. And I just took it for granted because he was my older guy. And, you know, when it really went down into it, and you go, hey, how was last night? And he goes, I didn't sleep. You know, that's not time for the joke. And it's why. And he's like, because my countries in war, and seeing him go through that with Yugoslavia, now Serbia, it was really tough because of the time difference. He's up 24 hours. He's seen pictures of people being mutilated at home, and yet he has to come in. And in our team, his personality was the uplifter and I kind of was the bad cop. And so in seeing that and really saying, wait a minute, his smile isn't the same, or, wow, he didn't give another stupid joke or something like that, you know, and that's where listening comes in. And when you listen, you can shift the dynamics. You can take over, take responsibility, give people rest, give People, incentive. And so I really learned to do that because at the end of the day, you know this. Everybody wants to be really great in sports. And if you understand where. Where that heart comes from, you usually can speak. Speak to them. Whether it's a guy that didn't make a lot of shots, whether it's a guy that shoots too much, you can always get in his story and go, okay, you know what? I can work on you based upon me listening and knowing who you are. And that builds trust when you listen.

Absolutely. So, Alex, like, this would resonate with the founders in this room, right? So if you're the founder, kind of like the quarterback, you kind of have to have a pulse on everything, right? As a quarterback, you sort of have to do the same thing, right? So, like, hot, like. And your job is also really difficult because you have very large men, you know, trying to throw you to the ground and sit on you, right? So you have a lot going on in your mind. So how do you find time to listen to get the pulse of every person on your roster that's going to affect our chances of winning?

Yeah, I mean, I think it's. I mean, it's really important. And I think, you know, in football, like, a lot of businesses, too, you're. You oftentimes can get siloed in your unit. Right? Like, I spent a ton of time with quarterbacks, and obviously I naturally spend a lot of time with the receivers. Right. Like, we have to have great communication o line, and then you start rippling out, though. And a lot of the guys on the defense and special teams, you don't necessarily have to have a lot of, you know, interaction with them for the team to work and run, theoretically. And I think as a quarterback, though, you know, like a founder, obviously, there's inherently, whether you like it or not, there's a leadership role that comes with this. You touch the ball every single play, you make a lot of decisions, and people's livelihood depend on that. And again, there's a lot of, obviously, weight that comes with that. And I think, again, whether it be in the heat of a battle on a sideline, right, when emotions are high and every wideout's telling you they're wide open, right, throw me the ball, I'm killing this guy, you know, and. Or vice versa, you know, obviously with the defense, right. Like, sometimes you need a big stop, right? Sometimes you haven't done your best, you know, critically. I got a couple Niner teammates here, like, for several years, we weren't very good on offense. And the defense was a whole lot better than us, right? A whole lot better than us. And it was hard coming in. It had some halftimes, right? And you're not holding up your end, and you're telling. You know, you're trying to listen to those guys and tell them to hang tough and. And keep it together.

What are they telling you? Just give you that. That look like, come on, man.

To kill is not. He was. He was a sweetheart in the locker room. Sweetheart. No. Yeah. But it's. It can fracture, right? Especially when things get difficult and there's adversity and. And I think that certainly when listening is most critical, and, you know, to Chris's point, it has to be those relationships, and that trust has to be formed before then, obviously, right? Like, that's when it kicks in, and that's when it pays off. And so I think you have to work hard. I mean, it was something. As I got older and I became the kind of the dinosaur in the locker room, you know, you worked hard. Like, again, like, I couldn't go out with the guys at night. Like, I'm going home to change diapers, right? And so you really got to spend and be conscious to make an effort to listen and connect and form those relationships even, I think, even more so when they don't come naturally.

You know, I was not a very high flyer or high scorer, but I prided myself on being a glue guy. And one of the things that I was very keenly always aware of was how well did my teammates understand a game plan, okay? And I was the annoying kid who'd always ask all the questions. And, like, the coach was like, oh, my gosh, baddy a. Like, you're so annoying. But I wanted absolute clarity for my team. So if I'm in a pregame meeting and I see Mario Chalmers kind of doing this in the corner, I know he doesn't have the strength of character to say, hey, Coach, explain that again, because no one wants to look bad in a meeting. And so I knew I couldn't do my job unless Mario Chalmers did his job. And if he didn't know how to do his job, then we were not going to be successful. So I was the one who said, hey, Coach, can you run that again, please? Like, humor me. And everyone looks at me like, baddiet, like, you have the highest IQ on the team. Then you don't get this simple concept, like, what's wrong? Just humor me. And so they would humor me, go over the game plan one more time, and then Mario would Get it? And just by asking that question, okay. And showing a little humility, not being afraid to be. Be called out. All right. We made our team that much better. Was that the difference in us winning and losing the game? I don't know. But I promise you, Mario knew the game plan, Right? And so that's what glue people do. They just add little. Little basis points to the team and get you this much closer to winning. And it's something that none of my teammates could ever figure out, none of my coaches would ever. Would ever recognize me for.

But.

But I knew that it mattered. Right?

So, Shane, if I could interrupt you one second, I think maybe the locker room, I do think they knew. I think that's why you guys won. Of course, you had great players, but they needed that. But I think it also affected the reputation of the players that played against you. You know, we understood how prepared you were. We understood that you would probably do something like that to be that humble in the locker room, because you're checking Kobe and He could score 60 on you tonight. And every time, you still play him with the same integrity and defensive integrity. And that builds trust as well in the locker room. And, you know, here's just a basketball example. Someone playing defense on the wing by themselves, we say they're on an island, and you want to be able to trust everyone behind you, because if you cross over, if you fall or anything, it's very embarrassing. And the thing that Shane is being very humble with is that his two teams, we knew that they were always going to run through the finish line, that they were going to do exactly what it took, whether that was because of great Pat Riley or was because the great Shane Valliere and the great LeBron James and the great D. Wade and the great other players. But we knew that you guys were paying attention, and it was because of the GRU guys like you that let the superstars kind of do their thing. And those are the most dangerous teams, when, you know, teams are one accord and you have guys like, like yourselves being idiots, asking too many questions in practice.

Well, I appreciate that we're going to wrap now because we have a special guest. But really quick, who's the favorite glue guy that you play with and glue guy that you play with?

Well, I would say. Oh, my favorite glue guy, Bobby Jackson.

All right.

Oh, man. For me, no doubt, it's Blake Costanzo. I've told the story about this, man. I was lucky enough after my leg injury, you know, again, played 16 years, horrific leg injury, and I got asked by Ted to do a talk, and you're like, what the hell does Ted want to hear from me? Like some old quarterback, like, what do I have to say? And it was crazy, the exercise, right? To look back on my career and my life and, like, what is important, right? Like, are there any takeaways? And I ended up, like, the majority of my talks about this guy. He's a special teams guy. None of you should ever have heard of him, nor do I ever expect you to full the ultimate glue guy. This guy brought energy and made everybody better and changed my life when I really needed it and again, forever grateful for him. Well, how about you?

My favorite glue guy was Chuck Hayes. He was 6 foot 4, and he guarded Shaq. Unbelievable force of nature.

You better be a glue guy.

Well, we hope you guys enjoyed our discussion on glue people. It's our hope you go home today and you say, you know what? Glue person in my life, thank you for making our ship run a little bit smoother. So thanks to Chris. Thanks.

Thank you, man.

Thank you, guys. Thank you.