Our Favorite Moments from 2025 - [Glue Guys, Ep. 63]

All right, boys, this is our last episode of the year. And so I think in true year end fashion time, do some reflections. I was looking through our list. Humility is an important trait, but we've had some pretty good guests this year. Like, it's crazy when you go through it, dude. There is just an embarrassment of riches here. In 2025. We have had Fiji Simo, Mike Krzyzewski, Michael Lewis, Teddy Brusky, Sheryl Sandberg, Jared Goff, Dan Quinn, Bones McKay, Wright Thompson. Should I continue? I mean, this is. It just keeps going. Jim Harbaugh, Pablo Torre, Eli Manning, Dawn Staley, Chris Weber. I mean, it was an amazing. The first thing I'm, like, grateful for, honestly, guys, is, like, everyone that decided to, like, spend time with us is someone that, like, we didn't, like, lower the bar. We, like, raised the bar. Like, everybody was someone that I was super jazzed to talk to. And I think, honestly, like, we should go through our lessons, whatever. But, like, I think all of them had fun. They all texted me afterwards being like, man, that was, like, so fun to do. And I also think it was probably pretty different than a lot of the other conversations they have. So I'm, like, proud that the thing we're doing is not just, like, I don't know, not the same as everything else. It's got its own personality, you know, whatever it is.

Who. Who was that? Who said, am I just another one of your glue guy side texts? You know, I think that's a sign of a great podcast, like the amount of side group text with. With our guests. Yes, that's that. I'm proud of that. I'm grateful for that. Right. Who said. Who said. Who called us out on that?

I think it might have been Morgan Housel new book out this year, the Art of Spending Money. Go pick it up. All right, so, Alex, you've been holding out on us on one of the things that you liked about the year. So, you know.

It'S incredible when you go through the list like that, you just to mention Morgan Housel and the book thing. I told you this. Like, I mean, I try. I try to read a lot, right? And it's obviously hard with kids, but like, this, like, as another note, like, we've had so many people on that aren't writers professionally, but have books. And so it's like, part of the diligence. I feel like this alone. I've read more books in the last year than I have in quite a few years before this, which has obviously been a nice, like, Unexpected surprise from this. There are several things from this that I have, like, selfishly tried to implement a lot, and I think about a lot, and some especially, obviously from the list from this last year, there's one that I constantly use, and I think about it all the time, and I write it down anytime I'm feeling anxious. And it's fi. I heard this story, and I don't know if it's true that you used to write fi on your shoes.

Yeah.

And for me, this so resonated because I've actually told these guys this story, but I don't think I've ever shared this publicly. When I got traded to Kansas City, I'd been in the league eight years, but I still hadn't fulfilled my, like, number one pick kind of thing. It was still. I had not established myself as a starter. And I get to Kansas City, and my quarterback coach and coordinator is Matt Nagy. And Matt was very similar to my age, and he had played quarterback. And I was, like, again, still very much dealing with, like, a lot of doubt and. And football is really weird. Like, I wanted so badly to, like, to be that guy, right? Like, to. To earn that. And I tried so hard, and I was, like, holding on so tight, and I, like, up until that point, like, I would live and die with every rep. And we. We. He came up with this, like, it, like, literally, like, on the sidelines on a TV timeout right before the opening kickoff, like, the last words that we would say to each other. And it was like a dare, right? It was like a challenge. Like, it, man, like, you've been preparing so hard. Like, just. You got to let go a little bit. And then I heard this. I. I read this story about you and your shoes, and so, like, I'm fascinated by this. Like, you obviously were to it way before I was like, how. How did you get there? Like, what led to that, like, mentality for you?

Well, it sounds like we were the same guy.

I mean, I. I just, you know, I ground myself into a pulp, you know, with. With the work and. And just, like, living and dying on every shot, every game. I did not handle the full 82 very well. You know, one bad game, and I'm, like, losing sleep. And so, yeah, that's kind of always been, you know, the way I've been built. And I guess it's, you know, it's the old Avery Johnson. My teammate used to say, same thing, make you laugh, make you cry, right? And the same thing that. That allowed you and I to succeed and get to where we did it also held us back. Right. And so I think for me, there was just a point in my career where I realized I just. I needed to let go. And it took a long time and.

You know, eventually got there.

But, you know, it's a. It's a difficult thing to do. It's one. One of the reasons I love Steph Curry so much is that he never has that problem, you know, Steve Kerr.

Writing fi on his shoes. And I just the. The duality of being the most accurate three point shooter of all time.

And.

And Right. And obviously he's someone that's analytical and you have to be, I think, to perfect the form of shooting and to spend hours to become that great. But like, that also can be your. Become your own worst enemy. Right. Like that same analysis and over analysis and like, you've got to get yourself in a mental space to like, let go and be free and play free. And like, this is another mechanism of it. And I just love the fi thing. I use it all the time. I write it on my paper right before Sunday Countdown goes live. Did I write fi on my paper?

Really? Yeah.

Like again, like the challenge on TV to like be real and cut it loose. And I use it all the time.

You told a story about playing golf with Tiger woods his last round before he tore his Achilles.

I believe my round with Tiger, people, like, how was it? I was nervous. I was nervous. Like, I don't get nervous very much. You get nervous because, look, the way I told people is like, we're off. We're all golfers and we all love golf. And I don't know about you guys, but I started playing golf because of Tiger, right?

Yeah.

And you ask a question of anyone, like, if you could have your dream foursome, who would it be? And for me, you know, it's always. My dad never got to play around with who played golf growing up, and I thought it was a boring sport. My younger brother who also played golf, I never really got to have a great round with him. And Tiger woods, like, Tiger is in all of our. All of our dream foursomes. And so I'm walking down the fairway at the first tee and I'm like, I'm living heaven. I'm literally living in heaven to have this experience with a guy who I watched every round growing up on. And the cool part about that round is it was actually way more normal past the first. The first. First hole, first hole, I step up and I was scared I was gonna whiff it. And I hit 300. 310 down the middle. And. And they're like, all right, let's go, let's go. So it's a very. It's surreal. I cannot explain, like, enough, like, how surreal.

Did you keep it cool before you totally geeked out? Like, how long did it take before, you know, like, was it like third hole?

When was the first moment you asked the question? You're like, ooh, I don't sound that co.

I tried to stay. I tried to keep the stupid stuff to myself. All right. I found myself, you know. You know, I like to talk. I found myself listening a lot more than talking.

All right, okay.

Well, then here in review, because this is like, at least my perspective on, you know, when you meet some of these larger than life, you know, people that we've idolized from afar. Was he a real dude?

Yeah. 100.

Okay, great.

100. Look, I started par, birdie, birdie, which I'm a good golfer. That's like really good golfer stuff. It's all of a sudden, you know. You know, you get the captain of the Rider cup team and the goat kind of nod and like, all right, all right. We're dealing with a player here. All right? You know, and so I had a little bit of swag. You know, there were no. There were no tiger fist bumps. But you. You act like you got to act like you belong.

Act like you've been there.

That is like the first key of. Of. Of hanging out with. With a legend. Act like you. You've been there.

The Eli Manning be the car that the kids want to go home with.

Totally.

Like, with the radio tunes. I constantly think about that. Like, I actually am more. I'm more particular about the music choices I use when I get the kids in the car now, because I'm like, I want to be the car that they want to get in with.

Right.

Dude, I thought that was like, one of the most brilliant metrics I've ever heard in my life. Truly.

If you ask, if you pull them. What's. What's the worst part of you sports? They say the ride home. It is true.

I believe it.

I believe it. I mean, I see it. I see, like. And I could probably pick out the parents that are like, you know, I don't want to be in that car with that parent right now. I. I hope that, like, my. My kid, you know, or even even like, my. My kids friends would be like, hey, I want to ride. I want to ride home with. With your dad after the game, you know, hey, they're gonna stop and get ice cream. We're gonna listen to some good tunes. Like, we're gonna have a party. We're gonna celebrate. And, you know, we're not gonna do a deep dive into, you know, that we lost the lacrosse game. Six, five, you know, and. And for what's going on, you know, we, hey, we may talk about it or we may laugh at something or. Or. But, you know, it's never gonna be, you should have done this, or, I can't believe you did. You know, it's just. That's just not my style.

That's how that.

Not how my parents raised me and.

And not.

Not the relationship I want with my kids.

That was brilliant. I will tell you one of my favorite things, and, you know, Shane should go. But, like, one of my favorite things about the year was seeing Shane with Coach K. Just being there while you got to sit there with him and, like, introduce him and for him to be like, I'm glad you got that in one take. And for him to give you shit and remember that I wouldn't be here.

Wouldn'T be glue guy without him. Coach Mike Krzyzewski, his record speaks for itself. Fifteen Final Fours, five National Championships, three gold medals, two World Cups. But more importantly, he shaped the lives of so many people. Not just people who walk through the doors of Cameron Indoor Stadium, but the world is one of the truly great role models and leaders of our time. And so excited for everyone to get a glimpse into what I got to experience the last 30 years dealing with the goat. Coach K.

One take Shane. That's pretty good.

It better be.

I swear to God, if you can't take that in one take. Coach, like, I feel like he performed.

This ain't no hobby.

And like. And then I also remember, like, that day, you know, remember the three of us are supposed to sit together with my brother and Shane kind of sheepishly coming up to us being like, hey, like, is it okay if I watch the game with my coach?

He.

He's. He said that, you know, instead of going with Mickey today, he wants to go with me. And you're like, this is like one of our best friends. And getting to see him, like, kind of have that moment. Like, dude, Shane, I'll never forget the Coach K Experience. And watching you with him was like. It felt. It felt like we were very lucky to, like, get to witness the interaction.

That was one of the highlights of my life was. It wasn't just one of the highlights of the year on the show. It was a day I Got to spend. I've never spent a whole day with Coach K. Never. When I play with him, you know, I always had to share him, you know, with my teammates or the coaches. And I felt like I had Coach K day at the top of this game for. For a whole day, you know, and how lucky. How lucky am I, right? And it was just. I got nostalgic. I got nostalgic. And I know he did, too. But it's looking back at that day, being able to spend quality time with a mentor and a person that has helped shape your life and your career and has made you the person that you are. Like, there's nothing, nothing that can replicate that.

You know, Revi and I were sitting on one side, and it's like you and I were, like, watching this, and it was history.

Right?

And again, I think, yeah, like, when you start, like, telling these stories and he's known you since you were, like, 15 years old. Right. And this relationship's around that long. And by the way, this will never happen again. Right. College sports has changed.

Like, the transfer portal.

Like this, that relationship between you and him and, like, everything, the lessons learned and the tough love and the tough coaching, like, it just won't happen anymore.

And.

Right. And again, to see you guys reflect on it together and. Right. And you and I have the front row seat was like. It was unbelievable.

It was amazing. Yeah.

I actually. I don't think I told you guys this. I actually, at one point in the conversation, I. And this doesn't happen very often for me, but I. I almost started, like, crying in the conversation when we were there because I was like, so.

Me too.

Yeah.

Like, I just, like, couldn't. And it makes more sense for you, honestly, Shane, of course, because he's like, you know, you're so close, but even for me, like, I just, like, couldn't believe I was there. Like, I don't know. I've watched this guy since I was a kid, and he's been, like, an important kind of mythical figure. And then I'm sitting there and I'm like, whatever happened in our lives that I get to sit here with this guy? He's excited. He's, like, giving me shit. You remember when he was telling me I looked older than my brother and shit? And you had told me, if he gives you shit, he likes you. And I literally almost started crying during. In the interview of how have we gotten here? That we're sitting in Coach K's office and he wants to be here. So much of life to me is like, when the other person wants to be there too, you know, it's just, like, so cool. So that was. That was, to me, like, that's such.

A hallmark with all our guests, though. I mean, the amount of accomplishment, achievement, impact on the world that just our guest list has. Has accomplished. I mean, it's, it's, it's.

It's.

It's almost embarrassingly humbling, right? I mean, talk about Mandel Crawley, you know who. That was one of my favorite interviews of the year. And really, really talks. You talk about someone from the west side of Chicago rising in one of the most coveted seats on all of Wall street, right? And maintaining his sanity and a sense of humanity. You just want to hear stories like that. And that's. That's why I'm grateful to have this. This platform and come across just people who are doing it, have done it, and are going to continue to do it for a long time.

One of the best ones that I think about a lot was than Healy fan. Blew me away, right? Like, I think this guy is one of the premier educators in the country. Like, I think about, you know, and I know he got it from David Brooks, but this, like, concept of being a Weaver, not a ripper, right? Like, I think about being a Weaver in society, right? Like, we especially, you know, we live in the freaking Silicon Valley, the Bay Area. It's crazy. People are all going on their own way, and so oftentimes they're, like, just worried about themselves. Themselves. But that. That, like, idea of being a Weaver, I think is something that I think about a lot in general.

I'm going to add something which we did not include in the first episode, that is both displays our amateur nature of interviews, but also is kind of like something I was grateful for. Dude, do you remember the story he told after we got off? Okay. And I'm just going to share it now. I think people deserve to hear this. So after we get off the recording with. Thank you, he's like, hey, do you guys want to hear a good story? And we're like, yeah, we want to hear a good story. We just spent an hour with you, like, trying to hope for great stories, but, like, yeah, tell us a great story. And this dude tells us the following story. So his dad was Obama's principal, okay. In Hawaii. Like, legitimately the principal of the school when Barack Obama was there. And apparently Barack Obama. Barry Obama at the time was not a great student and not a great, you know, like, kind of not a great, like, community member at the high school. And so his dad would give Obama a lot of tough feedback. And I guess two weeks before Obama graduated from high school, his dad expelled Obama's best friend, I think, for something, like, for some activity. I think he said he was dealing drugs or something, but, like, you know, something not great. So anyway, fast forward. Obama ends up at a college that's not the ultimate college. He goes to, but obviously transfers, ends up doing really well in his life, and becomes the President of the United States. Than tells us he's, like, going to a White House tour in, like, 2010, him, his dad, and his daughter. And they get an email from the White House that says, hey, are you the same Mr. Healey that was the principal of Barack's high school?

Punahou.

Yeah, Punahou. Okay, Punahou High School. And if so, come 30 minutes early to the tour. Maybe you'll get to meet the President. By the way, none of us know how the. The White House gets the list, and none of us know how that happened. They're like, pre AI, but, like, anyway, so they're like, okay. They, like, go home and change. And in the car on the way to this, to the White House, Than's dad, who's normally an unflappable guy, is like, visibly nervous. And Than's like, dad, like, what are you nervous about? Dan's dad's like, look, like, the last time I saw this guy was like, 30 years ago, and I was not very nice to him. And now, like, he's in the Oval Office. Like, I don't really know how this is going to go. You know, is this to, like, prove to me of, like, you know, you never believed in me and, you know, like, let me. It's like the ultimate mic drop, you know, like, why don't you come to the Oval Office? Let me give you some feedback, old man. And so instead, they go to the Oval Office, and Obama tells Than's daughter and his dad's granddaughter. Man, your dad, your grandfather made a huge impact on me. His feedback to, like, put me on the straight narrow made a big difference in my life. Like, I don't know where I'd be without him. I'm very grateful for this person. And you just take that moment. Like, I physically have, like, chills right now, like, thinking about that, like, thinking about getting experience that with your dad. Anyway, so Than, that's like the peak of his professional life. And then a few years later, he dies. But in Than's office, he has this picture of him, his dad, President Obama, and Than's daughter. And then than ties it back with the. He's like, I'm not. I have to remind myself at this school that I'm not raising 18 year olds, I'm raising 40 year olds. And what they are at 18 is not always indicative of what they'll be. And the evidence for it is a picture of the President with his dad and his daughter and him. And I was like, a real dose of humility for us of not getting it on the podcast. Yes. You know, it's all turned out.

We got it.

We got it. Thank you.

And how great, how great was Bones? I mean, you know, it was, it wasn't all serious stories. I mean, the ability to tell a story. I mean, one of the all time great caddies, one of the all time great, you know, orders in the game of golf. Bones, you famously had one veto vote a year. Okay, what was your best veto? Can you walk us through that moment?

We'll walk you through the first one. And it was, it was kind of funny in that, you know, Phil had a sense of humor about the fact that he was just ultra, ultra aggressive on the golf course. And he would say to me, he says, hey, man, I know I'm going to do something kind of wacky time to time, and I'll give you this one veto a year. And I would jokingly say, can I get one a week or one a day?

And he told your smart ass, you.

Can get one a year. So, you know, he gave me this thing and I had it in my back pocket. And we were playing in New Orleans one year and he drove it in the right rough of this golf course called English Turn outside of New Orleans. And he says to me, he's got a lot, you know, he's got, he's in the, in the trees, in the rough, and he's got water between him and the green. He says, I'm going to take a six iron out and I'm going to skip it across the lake a couple of times up onto the plank and onto the green.

Like what?

You know, we weren't in first place by any means, but we were hanging around in like 20th or 30th. And I, you know, I'd never heard of anything like this. So, you know, I couldn't get my veto out of my back pocket fast enough. So, you know, I say veto. He's, you know, he's disgusted that I'm using it. I said, you know, but you know the rules of the veto. You can't argue with me here. You know, we have to do what I want to do here. It's my one chance all year to shine here.

Here.

Let's pitch this ball out sideways into the fairway and go about it from there. So he did pitch the ball out sideways into the fairway and ended up getting the ball up and down from 100 yards for par. So we were walking down the very next hole, right? The 10th hole. I was kind of patting myself on the back and he was like, what are you so damn happy about? I said, man, that was great veto usage back there. Did you not notice that? And he said, he said, you're an idiot. He says, I'm going to do something way dumber than that before the years.

It is funny, man. The stories of he and Phil and Tiger.

Oh, yeah, the veto, unbelievable.

I love that one. I love that one. I thought the Jared Goff one where he talks about feeling betrayed when he got traded. And like, you only get that because, like, he's talking to Alex. It's like a peer to peer conversation. Like, he's talked about that a hundred times, but the word. And you're sitting there like, how cool is this? We get to like, feel what this guy's feeling during that moment.

You played at such a high level. You had played, you had fulfilled the number one pick, right? You signed the extension. You probably think you're gonna play there a long time, maybe the rest of your career, you know, and then the trade. And as someone who's been shipped off twice, can you just take us through that? Honestly, like what, what that was like, no offense to both Shane and you. Like, you shipped off to Purgatory.

Easy, careful. Choose your words wisely, qb Purgatory.

A franchise that hasn't done anything in, you know, forever, right?

So it doesn't care about Detroit. He's from Miami, remember? You know, he's not a Detroit guy anymore.

Choose your words wisely. We talk about what was our city.

Yeah, yeah, sure. I mean, it, it was, it was a shock. It was your world getting flipped upside down all at once. I think context matters, right? So we, we lose the, the playoff game to the packers in 2020 in the Divisional round. I believe we won the wild card game. We lose in the divisional round. And then I didn't have any contact with anybody until, hey, we're sending you to Detroit about, I don't know, two weeks later after that.

Oh, wow.

Yeah.

And I think that's well documented. I don't, I don't believe I'm, I'm breaking any news Here. But, yeah, so nothing until I get the phone call from Sean, and, hey, we're gonna trade you. I'm like, what? Like, that's the. That's the reason you're calling me. I was. I was shocked. And I like to hear your stories, Alex, on, like, when you got moved twice. Yeah. If you were involved in that. If you knew. But, no, I didn't know. So, yeah, you're kind of like, holy smokes, your world's turned up upside down for, you know, a little while and trying to pick up the pieces a little bit. Luckily, my wife, who was my girlfriend at the time, was. Was, you know, as soon as I was like, will you come to Detroit? She was all in. And, you know, that helped a ton. And she. And kind of a rock in this whole thing. But, yeah, so we moved out there, and, you know, you meet Dan and you meet Brad, and. And really that night. So I get traded. Let me. Let me give you the whole story. And before I go too quickly here. So I get. I get the phone call from Sean. A minute later, it's on Twitter. Not. I mean, not even 30 seconds later, right before that. So it was like, with all this within a minute, it was like, sean, my dad called. My dad knew before Twitter knew. Somehow he got it from somebody else. He's like, is this real? I'm like, yeah, it's just. I just got the call. Now it's on Twitter. Now everyone knows. Agents calling Brad and Dan were calling me, but I was getting a million phone calls. I was kind of like, just, like, declining everything at that point. So my agent texts me, or he's on the phone. He's like, hey, Brad's trying to get a hold of you. Brad Holmes, our gm. Can you answer his call? Like, he keeps getting sent to voicemail. And I'm like, oh, yeah, sure. So let me. Let me feed. Okay, got it. Okay, so. And he's on the phone.

Hey, Jared.

Jared, you know, he's so excited. He's like, finally, I got you. You know, we're so excited for you. We're so excited to have you here. And then I can hear Dan, Jared, you know, I can't wait to have you here. We're so excited. And then, like, right then, it was like, holy smokes. Like, this is what you want. That feeling of, like, someone breathing life into you and telling you how excited they are to have you on their team and what an opportunity we have here to build this thing up from the ground and be a part of that foundation forever. If we're able to build it up in the way that we have now at this point, four years later. But that right there, that moment, I'll never forget being like, all right, let's do this. Like, let's go. Like, I can. I can be a part of this. And if those two guys believe in me, then that's all I need.

There's, like, a visceral nature that you can only get when people who, like, have gone through it together can talk about it. You know, Alex, I remember you talking about the swag bag in KC and, like, how, like, swag for you and swag for the kids, you know, like, made a difference and, like, you know, like, you guys want me. And I was thinking, I was like, man, there's a great lessons for me in business on, like, just like, how taking, like, grownups, but making them feel wanted and how important that is. Like, I don't know. That one was a cool one for me, too.

And how about going to Bentonville and playing in. In Doug McMillan's pickup game? First time in 10 years the commission comes out of retirement. You know, Alex grabbing. Grabbing boards. Robbie running the court, you know, and, you know, the heart, the heartland of America. I mean, that was a crazy adventure. That was a crazy. If you said, you know, a we're going to play pick up with CEO of Walmart and be his honored guest. That is all hands meeting. I told you. You're smoking. Smoking the wacky tobacco. I mean, that was.

It was unbelievable. I don't know how we left that one off the list. I got. I don't know if I told you guys this. I don't even own fucking basketball shoes, right? So I was, like, scrounging my closet. I knew we were playing this basketball game. I took the wrong pair of shoes. I brought these, like, running shoes. I got, like. We played so many games. I got, like, four blisters on my feet that night. It was so much fun. The best part was getting paired with you, Shane. Right? Like, being on your team.

Yeah.

Well, Doug.

Doug. Doug is like, okay, it'll be me, Shane, Alex, and Ravi. And we're like, well, that sounds good. You know, like, that. And then, dude, the other thing was all of. All of the people that they play with, just, like, the best guys. The best guys. At one point, I remember I actually told Doug this, you know, when I saw him recently. At one point, I made a bad pass and I dropped, like, a loud F bomb at myself for, like, making a bad pass. And I noticed that nobody else on that court. Okay. Was swearing, and they certainly weren't dropping F bomb. And I was like, oh, I got to bring this back. You remember Doug's wife, Shelly, who's amazing, was sitting there watching us play, and I'm like, you just, like, remember, like, how good of people these people are. You know what I'm saying? And, like, dude, Bentonville is good for the soul. I also will tell you, like, they have that thing of, like, never meet your heroes. It's like, yeah, unless they're awesome. Like, yeah. You know, meeting Doug McMillan and spending time with him and his family, that was one of the greatest honors I think I will ever have, because it was like, this hero is worth having as a hero. He. How cool was he? How cool is his family? Like, it was just. It was awesome. I'll never forget that.

Speaking on the same note, like, the same. There was, like, several, like, on the podcast side, the. The acquired guys, Ben and David, were, like, absurdly cool. All right. And they get to talk with them and hang with them. They were, like, so down to earth, so amazing. Susan Lee is one that I'll, like, always remember. Like, he's one that, like, man, don't get fooled by. Like, she's a tiny little woman, but, man, she's powerful. Like, it's strong, you know? Like, I just, like, left there. I was just.

The purple jeans.

I love going to Costco and loved going as a kid, but not where they go to be at the forefront of fashion, per se. And my dad bought. I don't even know what exactly motivated him, but a pair of purple jeans. And I unwrap them on Christmas, and they are purple. And I couldn't. You know, it was like. And I felt like I couldn't even be.

Of course, you know, I didn't want.

To be disappointed because my dad had cared so much.

Yes.

And, you know, I will pause here to say it is. I think it is something. This is one of the places where when you look back and when. You know, when you're a kid in that moment, you're like, how can my dad have thought that purple was the right color for jeans? Like, everybody knows they're supposed to be blue, but when you look back now and when I think about what my parents did, you know, and they were born in the late 50s in China. They grew up through food rations, through constant relocation of themselves or their parents. They, you know, came to the United States in their late 20s. And just if you were to put in front of me the question of, could I in my late 20s with an infant.

Yes.

Have.

Yes.

You know, in my mother's case, I was six month old, six months old when she came, said goodbye to my six month, six month old, or in my dad's case, not seen my infant, and gone to a completely different country where I didn't speak the language, didn't know anything about the culture, was starting from scratch, was, you know, working menial jobs while in my PhD program. That is like a harder thing than any choice that has ever been put in front of me. I don't even know if you put that choice in front of me, whether I think I could do it.

Yeah.

But it changed the course of our lives forever in a way that I am so grateful for.

For.

And I think about this in the back of my mind, you know, someday when my kids are going to make the choice to go to Mars or something like that, like, I need to be. Be able to support them wholeheartedly. But it is when I reflect on what my parents did for me, you know, and my sister, it is, I think there's nothing that I will ever do that will come close to that in terms of the sacrifice that they made and the impact that it had on, you know, all of their future generations.

And just like, dude, she was giving you so much shit. When you started talking about, like, the meta Capex, she was like, huh? You know, I never really thought I'd get grilled on Capex by Alex Smith. Like, just like she brought us cookies before because we have a competition on who makes a better cookie. I do need to tell you that I stand down. Susan Lee makes a better cookie than I do. She's a amazing friend. She's so fierce, and she's also just like, so herself. And I got a lot of texts from people afterwards about, like, the stories she told, and that one was fun. The Wright Thompson one, to me, you know, is still just like. That to me is almost like glue guy membership. Like, like one of the deep cuts. You know, the people that really like the Wright Thompson episode, I feel like they, like, they know what we're trying to do. The thing that's crazy, right, is you think about these things on your point of, like, most interesting topic is yourself. Like, these people know the stories you write. They know that they're gonna go deep and they, they work with you on them. Because I almost wonder, do you think there's an element of. They want to see what they're like. Do you think that they want to read it later and learn about themselves? Or.

No, I don't know.

I mean, I want that to be true more than anything in the entire world. In my most vain spot, I want that.

You don't think so? Shane, you are making your face hard.

That's really, really hard.

I do.

Why do they let him go?

This. I think I'm a. I think I'm a wolf in sheep's clothing. I think I just show up in a goofy hat and a notebook, and I'm really friendly, and they don't really know what's happened till it's already happened. If I'm being honest.

I think that's right.

I think that's more the space.

Well, do you think they like it, though, at the end? Like, do you think MJ likes you? Think Tiger. Forget Tiger, because he wasn't.

He didn't.

Michael said to sd, who. You guys know where. Where did he learn all of that? And she was like, you told him. Like, like, you know what I mean? Like, don't. And so. And then there's somebody else who I won't name. I'll take this to my grave, because they told me in a moment of anger and weakness, and they probably shouldn't have, but a story ran. And then either the next day or the day after that, they went to their regularly scheduled marriage counseling session where their wife reached into her big bag, pulled out the ESPN magazine, threw it down on the desk, and said, see?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So, like, no, I don't. I don't know, man. I think, like, I think somebody's PR department sets it up, and they probably should have asked better questions.

I, I, I kind of agree with Rovi on this. Like, listen, I think there's probably. Are certainly there are some people that get set up and maybe don't realize what's happening. But, like, I, I think some of these. Listen, I. I've known Urban. I know Urban really well, man.

He.

He knew what he was getting into. I'm sure Pat and Michael, like, I think there's an aspect that. Listen, we only have one vantage point, right? Like, I, I only see things through my, My lens, and I, I'm interested. I, I'm. I'm curious on this, right? Like, I've had people tell me, oh.

You should write a book.

You should write a book. Like, I don't know. Like, I, I don't even know how clearly I see things in retrospect. And, like, I, I think it would take somebody. I think it's more interesting from an outside perspective.

Well, you know, it is interesting. Like, One of the things with Urban is that, you know how it works. Like, he doesn't remember your name. Like, you know, he was calling me the wrong name two days in. And. And then I went talk to Tom Herman about that. And then I went to. We were driving to Cleveland to a baseball game. And there's that book that Urban gives to everybody. I can't think of the name of it, but it's the book. And I went through that book in my hotel room the night before with a highlighter and a pen, and I highlighted every passage in that book that I thought described Urban Meyer's interior life. And then we got in his car, driving from Columbus to Cleveland, and I just started reading them out loud to him. And finally he was like, read that again. And then we were in. And then it was then, like, I could have moved into his house, but he was totally disinterested right up until the moment when he was very interested.

Well, right. I think that most people who have achieved a lot have a hard time.

Telling their own story.

They don't know what their story is. Right. And so that's where you come in. Right. And so I don't think people necessarily want your story, but they don't know how to tell their story. And so that's that. That's how you're able to get access. And once. Once you gain the trust and you obviously have the credibility, you know, that's everyone. Everyone wants a. You know, a legacy, you know, especially people who.

Who achieve.

But most people can't write their own story.

Yeah, but I think also people do. Jane, the only thing. And this is the part I have a small disagreement with you on. I don't know if they have it at the beginning, but I think everybody wants to be seen. And basically, dude, what they fucking believe at some point is that you see them, and then they're like, okay, let's go.

You know, I think everybody. There's always such an. Everybody has a story they tell themselves about themselves.

Yes.

And. And there. Then there's the story that is told about them. And I think the most interesting thing in the world is living in the space between those two and see how they talk to each other.

Yeah, but, like.

But, you know, the idea that, like, you. I have. I have a very definite story I tell myself about myself that would be pretty easy for a cynical journalist to tear apart. Like, it would fall apart pretty quickly under aggressive questioning.

Yeah, like, what's that.

What's that mean?

What are the.

What are the ramifications of that.

Yeah. And who. Which journalist would. Fuck it. I don't want a cynical one. But which journalist would you let write the Wright Thompson story on you?

Nobody. I've done this to too many people to let somebody do it to me.

No, we might have to have. Right on. In 2026.

100%.

We look forward. He might have to be an annual.

I think Wright's an annual guest, dude. It took a lot of discipline not to have Wright on the Lane Kiffin episode. I listened to Wright on every podcast he's ever been on. That's how much I like him. Sam Hinkey, who, by the way, needs. We got to get Sam out of. Out of podcast. You know, out of turning us down, frankly. But Sam sent me a podcast that Wright did for his school. His, like, high school. It probably has 200 listens. Okay, I'll send it to you. It's amazing. It's amazing because apparently Wright got kicked out of his high school, you know, and so he, like, went back and gave like, a. You know, like a podcast. And of course, it's, like, predictably excellent. But of all the people, I will tell you, like, when we have texts with Wright Thompson, I am so happy that he responds to us.

Truly.

Like, that is like, he. I don't know if he's my favorite guest, but he might be.

You know, we always ask our guests who their favorite glue guy blue gal in the life is. So I think it's appropriate, as we end 2025, to shout out the glue guys favorite glue guys and gals in 2025. Who were the glue people that kept the ship together for you?

Well, I know we don't like it when other people do this film. I do it anyway. Obviously, Avni is like, ultimate, ultimate, ultimate. Nothing works without her. And it's just like, I don't know, whatever elevated status somebody could have, that's what she has. So she's number one. Other people that I would shout out. You guys will appreciate this. So you know how Amazon has this idea of, like, it's always day one. It's always day one, right? So a couple of friends of mine, Sagar Sang v, Will Petrie, we have a text chain which is called Day Two, Day Two Capital, okay? Because it's sort of like, listen, like, this is not about, like, day one stuff. This is about having fun. This is just us messing around. And those two have brought me so much joy of just, like, our daily texts on some nonsense, you know, and they make me better, they help me, and they Also, you know, keep me grounded. And so I would shout out Sagar Sangvi, Will Petrie as, you know, glue guys in their own right. What about you, Shane?

Well, I have to start with my. My wife Heidi. She keeps me in line. She keeps me. Keeps me humble. But she knows when to give me a hug when I need it. And I would not be here without her. Her love celebrated 22 years of marriage this year.

Let's go.

Let's go.

A lot of glue. A lot of glue between.

We're at 18. Congrats, Shane. 22.

It's. It's. It only gets better, Robbie. It only gets better. You're 22. But she. She's my. My. The only woman I've ever loved and want to give her a huge shout out. My Chief of staff, Victoria. I got it. She.

Oh, good one.

She.

She's a glue gal for all of us.

Yeah, she is. She does so much to keep me together. Alex, Roby, you guys are my glue guys. Every week, you know, the. The calendar invite goes out and you guys show up, right? And that's the number one trade of a glue guy showing up. And you guys are always. You're always engaged, showing up, enthusiastic, passionate. And I appreciate that out of you guys.

We feel the same. I feel the same way about you, Shane. I'll let Alex go. But I feel the same way about you guys.

Blue guys, we're getting all mushy here.

I know, I know. But, you know, it's gotta be good, dude.

Of course. Yeah. Like, my. I. I mean, immediately, it's like, my wife Elizabeth, like, I travel to New York every weekend of the fall, right?

Like.

And by the way, like, I'm so lucky. Like, I get to, like, go on TV and talk about a game I love, right? And, like, I have so much fun with it, and I work with, like, a great crew there, but, like, I immediately, like, throw a lot of burden on her, right? Like, hey, just handle everything else in our life like you got, right? I'm just, like, tapping out for the weekend. And she just. She's just so unfazed. This list could go on and on.

Like, oh, you're gonna do the hardware?

I can't do shit on my own.

Reliant on. We know that. We know that.

Alex, one thing you do try to do on your own is schedule, you know?

Ea.

I mean, Jesus, come on.

Yeah. Like, I just, like, you know, there's, like, nobody in my life that I'm not grateful for because I don't do any of it. On my own.

One other one I should have mentioned was Sam. He, this year in particular, he's been an amazing glue guy for me behind the scenes. And then all of us. I do think our kids are glue guys for us. I think that, like, think about the joy and the showing up and the. I don't know, just, like, the things we share with each other about our kids. Like, just the other day, Shane, when you texted us about something good going on with your kids, I texted you about something good going on mine. And Alex, same thing for you. Like, I don't know, like, there's just nothing better than the phase that we get to be in right now as dads. Like, one of my favorite episodes, honestly, probably my favorite episode is our fatherhood episode, which I think technically fell in 2024. But, like, I don't care. Like, I'm so happy that we all get to be dads, you know? Like, there's just nothing better. It's the best, you know, of all the things to be grateful for that is. I think it was Obama actually something, but some version of, like, you know, of all the titles I've ever had, the only one that's ever mattered is dad, you know, and it's like that. Maybe that and husband, but that. That. That's as good as it gets, I think. 26 me. A good year. Good year for the glue guys.

Well, the best ability is availability. We're gonna have a good time, man. We're gonna have a good time.

I love it. Grateful for you guys. Thanks for doing it together. I'm. I'm very grateful for both of you.

And grateful for all our listeners. I want to, you know, say thank you to everybody who's clicked, subscribe and put us on in the car or in the shower or just walking their dogs. There's a lot of options out there. We know that. We appreciate that. You spend an hour, hour and a half with the blue guys every. Every.