Steve Young: Emotional Athleticism - [Glue Guys, EP.6]

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Welcome to Glue Guys. We're your hosts, Shane Battier, Ravi Gupta and Alex Smith.

And we're bringing you behind the scenes of the locker rooms, the boardrooms and the living rooms that taught us everything we know about what it takes to be great leaders and even better teammates and friends.

We hope the conversation helps you bring more ambition and more joy to your own work life and relationships. It certainly has for us. It's hard to actually where to begin on Steve, honestly, because he's this, he certainly for me growing up, he overlapped like when I fell in love with football, he was, it was like in his prime. So I mean he was a guy that like, you know, he talked about Roger Staubach. Like for me that's Steve. He's like one of the most iconic quarterbacks of all time. He's an iconic 49er, you know, obviously the franchise I played for. I've talked at length like the, the shadow he left loomed large, you know, even though he and I didn't directly overlap at all, but like it was still there. And this guy's two time mvp, three time super bowl champ, highest paid player in the league for a long, long time. Which I, you know, we only say that because I think it carries so much weight and burden. You know, he went to law school.

While he's playing and then managed to create a 25 year private equity career afterwards. Right I mean, it is an unbelievable set of life experiences. And then I, I'd be remiss not to mention his father's name. His name is Grit, which, by the.

Way, I know that's come in vogue here lately. Like that word grit has become popular now. There's the books and stuff, but like this goes back like it was his boyhood name, his dad's boyhood name, and his whole life worth book.

This is 50 years, this is decades ago. And the guy's name, not his given name, but everyone calls him Grit.

It's incredible.

And maybe his most impressive feat is the Forever Young foundation, which has given away millions, millions and millions and millions of dollars and aid for young people around the world. And so this is a man who's a family man, who is not just about professional success. He is about life success and bringing people with him.

Oh yeah, he's authored several books, by the way. Yeah, several books. You know what's really cool too, you know what he's doing now is that he helped launch girls flag football.

Oh, yeah.

At his daughter's high school.

Yeah.

Here in California. He is coaching girls flag football. And he like, loves it. Sanctioned sport. They're gonna have a state champion this year.

I mean, that's what he's about.

Right?

It's not just the professional success, even the philanthropic success. He's just like a. Seems like he's an amazing husband and father. And I think that, like, you know, what better person to have on glue, guys.

All right, where to begin, fellas?

We were talking about this. Steve, like, like where, like where do you start? I mean, like, you are like, your resume reads like hall of fame in like multiple industries. Your impact on like the world is like ridiculous. So where, where do you want to start?

I mean, I want to start by having you come to my house and tell my kids that I am freaking nothing at home, man. It's like I almost, I sometimes whisper to myself, you know, I'm a big deal. You know, you guys treat me like I'm garbage. Like there's, you know, it's so funny and I really appreciate that, Shane. You know, we're all like minded and what you guys are trying to do on the podcast is very much right down the middle of what I want to try to help pay forward as we, as we. You know, the idea that what I'm doing is not a zero sum game, never has been, never will be, and that everything I have I'd love to share and push forward for whoever's know, coming Further, I told a story yesterday with. Last Night with Alex about Bill Walsh at the height of his career. You know, and, you know, most people, when they're super famous, super powerful, you know, and you know that you're. He was two generations ahead of everybody in 1988. No one else even knew what he was doing. The west coast offense was just smoking everybody. And then he started talking about, you know, hydration and sleep and mental health. And I told Alex last night, he talked about, I want you guys to share an element of love for each other, you know, in 1988. And then he collected everything he knew in a proprietary way in a box and handed it to his assistant coaches to help them be successful. And that spirit of what I witnessed has been kind of a theme for me for a long time. And so what. I don't know how you want to talk about it, but I want to talk about how we can, you know, if anyone's watching, can say, oh, my gosh, thanks for the gift of whatever it is that we want to. You know what I mean?

When the thing. One of the things I've also read about him is kind of this idea of, like, that he empowered guys, self image, right? Like, guys on the team, that he kind of made them. It was this. I don't know about positivity, but that. The belief in them, right? And again, that. That guys, a little bit like we talked about with Andy Reid, like, that you could be yourself and that you're good enough, and you go. You come there from, like, your journey as a professional is insane, right? From the USFL to Tampa, it's insane.

Lavelle orders is my coach. Mike Hormgan is my offensive coordinator. Then Bill Walsh is my coach. Mike Homer's my offensive coordinator again. Mike Shanahan, Sid Gilman. Sid was the father of the Ford Bass. He was, like, 90 years old when I had him. And so, yeah, you know, I'd have to really screw it up. But back to Bill. What he. I think fundamentally the way that he did it was he looked at you as a partner. Like, you're playing, I'm coaching, but we are partners. And so there was never a stick. He never had that metaphorical stick out that you always felt. Now, if a decision had to be made as a coach, whether you played or not, whether you stayed on the team or not, I mean, he had a sharp knife, there's no question about that. But he always saw us as part. And I think people felt that you feel when someone looks at you like, we're in this together and I will, I will own my part and I will stand for it. I'm not going to, I'm not going to, you know, kind of duck when the, when the bullets fly. It, it breeds all the things you just talked about breeds, you know, self confidence and empowerment and, and I think but fundamentally it was, it was partnership is kind of what it was at the great at the bottom.

Steve, the thing that I was struck by in just like, I don't know, trying to learn about you beyond what I already knew from like watching you as a kid, I, I think it's just a lot bumpier of a journey than I think people realize, you know what I'm saying? Like I think starting as a running back, moving over to quarterback in high school, like being a backup versus just like oh you were so obvious that you were number one from the beginning. I think you were the eighth string quarterback at byu. I didn't even really realize the Bucks experience before you went to the Niners. Like there's just like a lot of bumps. Can you just like maybe talk about that, you know and like a little bit of the history.

Yeah, I never, I never was able to cut the line. Shane cut the line because he was six, eight and so smooth.

Yeah, right.

But Shane, all I'm saying is you're able to cut the line for an opportunity. So you go prove it. Like you, there was no shortcut when I mean cut the line. Like I couldn't arrive on campus as a starter. Like I just wasn't. That just wasn't me. I was a scrambling lefty who didn't throw very well at the time I didn't really learn to throw and I remember I got to BYU and Jim McMahon was the quarterback and there's a great stories there but I learned to throw watching Jim McMahon and once I learned to throw I kind of felt like I could put it anywhere. And it was like this super cool latent talent that I didn't really even know I had. And now I was stuck as a lefty and the offensive coordinator didn't want to coach a lefty and I was a scrambling guy that nobody at that time, byu, Stanford, University of Miami, Florida were the three places where if you want to play pro quarterback, that's where they were doing pro stuff. And so at BYU they lined up all these six, five Adonis's would line up to play to play quarterback and they'd come from all over the country because that was one of the three places. And here I am with this oddity, I mean, complete oddity. And so in that way, Robbie, you're right. I didn't. I had to kind of grind out even to get an opportunity. And it was so funny that the biggest impediment I had to my getting an opportunity was being left handed because the coach didn't want to coach a lefty. He even told me, I'm not coaching lefties. And so I was moved briefly to defense you mentioned. And I don't know if you know Tom Homo. Tom Homo was a defensive back for the 49ers for many years. And he was the athletic director. I think he coached at Cal and now he's the athletic director byu. He, he was the defensive captain. He was teaching me how to play safety. And I was like, oh my hell. I would spit up in my. I throw up in my mouth. I was like, I still, I still hate this. Like, I don't even, it's like it was gross, like it was dirty. It was like, I don't even want to be, I want no part of this. But after practice in the winter, winter practice, I'd go throw the quarterback because I had now gotten this gift, this talent that I had that I could throw it, I could throw it hard, I could throw it anywhere. And so I'd go throw the quarterbacks. And the coach left. Doug Scoville went to San Diego State. New coach came in, Ted Tolner. And he saw me throw and he goes, well, I thought you were playing quarterback. What happened? I said I was, but then I'm lefty. He goes, they wouldn't coach a lefty. You can't be lefty. And I'm like, he's like, stupid. I go, I know, but are there.

Any lefty quarterbacks in college or the NFL who had any success at this point? Like, like who are the role, who.

Are your role models? Kenny Stabler was, was, was doing it for the Raiders. So there was one person. But, but it was amazing how much it was a thing. And, and even today, Alex and I laughed about this last night. You can name on two hand in the last 40 years left handed quarterbacks have played in the NFL.

Yeah, but they're so good, the ones that didn't play.

But we represent 10% of the population, so there is a huge conspiracy of discrimination in the NFL against lefties. It's still, I can't get to the bottom of it, but it just, it's unspoken. But anyway, going back, I got my chance. Ted Tolner went in, talked to Lavelle said, look, he's. Yeah. Have you seen him throw? You need to come see him throw. And he said, I need him for two weeks of spring ball. We'll see how it goes. So I immediately started to throw. The quarterbacks went to spring ball, and the rest was. The rest was. Again, I didn't get to cut the line, you know, the usf. I mean, the rest of my life, I kind of got to cut the line. Like she and Betty, like, I got to. I showed up and I was the first draft pick. I was, you know, I was, you know, but it wasn't easy. I had to, you know, but. But that was the. That was the clawed out of rock kind of situation that I had to figure out and then had people hated me just because I was lefty. And so it was just. It was a weird time. And I. Shane, I'm just joking, by the way, about.

No, no, we got thick skin. Steve.

Steve.

Also, we like giving Shane shit.

Yeah.

I get asked all the time about mentorship, obviously about Patrick and kind of my role there and often get, like, way too much credit. But, I mean, you just, you kind of flew over this whole. Like, my freshman year, I just learned how to throw. And you learned to throw from one of the greatest college quarterbacks of all time in Jim McMahon. Like, what was he. Was he receptive to you coming in and, like, teaching you? Was this just something that you watched him and it kind of rubbed off through osmosis?

Like, he was very kind. From the first day I was on campus, I was nobody. When I say nobody, no one knew my name. No one knew anything. And he was kind to me. Like, he would give me rides back from the dorms. And I remember. I remember because he was such a big deal. I mean, he was. He was number one quarterback in college in many ways. Because any other. Any other college quarterback that was famous at the time, whether it was in Nebraska or Oklahoma, they were running the wishbone, Thomas Lott or, you know, they were. They were not throwing the ball. And Jim McMahon was crushing it. And I remember getting in his car and listening to the radio. This is gonna sound so stupid, but I remember thinking, I wonder if there's a famous person's radio station. That's the thing about fame. When you don't have it or aren't familiar with it, it has a life of like this giant Jack and the Beanstalk kind of thing. Just this. He's famous. Of all these meaning, I remember thinking that Jim McGahn is the most famous person I'VE ever met. But he was kind to me. And then what I did was because he was writing, I was lefty. I could just like Phil Mickelson with his dad. I could copy him. And you know, Alex, I don't know when you learned it, maybe it was just natural to you to throw a football. You have to. Your hand has to come, your thumb has to go down and inside. And usually you think about spinning it. Your thumb ends up, up because you just want to spin it. And until you understand that you can't put anything behind it. And so by watching him, I was like, oh, it's like that. And then once I got it, honestly, I remember, I remember going the back in the nets at the Smith field house and just throwing it any, like I'll throw it to that dot. And so all of a sudden I learned how to do it. And man, I was good at it. And I just like. But I'm lefty. So it was a tough time. Tough, tough days. I'll say this about Jim, Jim McMahon. Technically snap, drop back throw, the football reads in the pocket. Preparation was classic, technically perfect. He was a nutball. He was crazy. But his quarterbacking, I learned how to quarterback, how to drop, how to throw, how to read, how to all from the most technically sound perfect quarterback in history. And no one knows it because he went to Chicago, he pitched it back to Walter Pate, he got smashed. No one. He never got to show his. How technically amazing he was. It was. It's unfortunate people don't know him for that, but in college that was the gift he gave me.

I was just saying it's crazy to me. This idea that like you had gotten the BYU and kind of you didn't know the right way to throw. The idea that like there's this unlock by somebody showing you that all of a sudden like changes your life like that. That's crazy.

Crazy. And it's random, right? It's random. It's like, it's. It's like one of those things that life, you know, you could say it's a gift or some kind of moment or you know, but something happens and latent talents like my quickly, my daughter, she's a junior, she wanted to be in the go to. She always wanted to go to the Olympics. So she was in gymnastics. Every girl dreams of that, right? And then in 10th grade she turns me on the way home from the 18th straight day of gymnastics. You know, after school she goes, I'm not going to make the Olympics. And I'm like, oh, I didn't know you were still thinking about that. She goes, so I'm going to switch. Switching. I'm going to pick something else. And I go, what can I. She goes, what's going to make the Olympics in. I'm like, I don't know. I have no idea. It's a little late, right? And so she. She starts playing basketball. But because she doesn't have the skills, Shane, you learn skills of dribbling and all that stuff young. You try to pick it up late. You look, you're not competent. But she grinded through it. She did it, and she could jump. And one day they were testing the girls to see if they could touch the rim or how high they could touch the net and who could touch them. She grabbed the rim at 5, 8, and. And the coach sent me home the picture. And I'm like, what the. That's crazy. So a friend of mine said she should high jump. We're like, oh, all right. So we told Summer, summer, you should high jump. She's like, that's stupid. Tracks for idiots. I don't. I don't want to do that. Like. So finally the track coach convinced her to come out and run the hundred in the last track meet of the year, her junior year. She did. And then at the end was the high jump. And the coach was just try it. Just go down there. She goes and looks at it. She does it, she wins. Was just a little no big deal, but because she won, she suddenly thought, maybe, maybe I can be great at high jump. She tied for the state championship last year in her senior year. Now she's in college. A latent moment, right, Ravi? That moment where she grabbed the rim in a sport that she's not going to be any good at. And the coach took the picture. She didn't have the picture. It wouldn't have been proof to everybody, to herself. And then that someone else said, well, why does she high jump? We would have never. So how many. I guess my point is how many humans have a. Some talent? And that's why, Rob, you see it in business have a skill for deciphering through data or special people skills, eq, that's like off the charts or that never gets the full measure, never gets open to us. And I just, I think about that in my life and my daughter's life. Just the miracle of finding that latent talent to just expose something that like, you're really super good at. And you didn't know, you know, Steve.

I mean, but you from a young age wanted to play quarterback.

Oh, 100%, right?

Like, there was something that drew you to it.

100%. Roger Staubach was my hero. I watched all those. You know, there's three stations, and you watched the games all the time. And Dallas was on every week. Deacon. And I remember I had a. I had a poster in my. In my room of Roger on the move, and it had his hand on the ball and the ball. You could see his fingers on the ball in the poster. And I remember being lefty, flipping it right and going. Putting my fingers exact. Like, how does he got on the lace? Right there, right there. And then I'd hear him talk, and I'm like, I'd like to. I tried to talk like him. Like, how do I talk like Roger Staubach? And that's the power of. Of idols or heroes. And he never knew me. And the first time. And now I turned pro, and I'd never met him. And the first time that my hero, who I used to try to walk like and talk like and run like and play like, was walking out to me to meet me as the honorary Captain of the 92 championship game. 49ers versus Cowboys. First time you ever. Now he's walking, and I remember like, like, and I. Mr. Sawback, I had your poster in my room, and I was your hero. I mean, you're my hero. You know, I was just, like, babbling. And he turns me, goes, hey, Steve, maybe just focus on the game, bro. We'll. We'll talk later.

You didn't. You didn't hate him at this point for being a Cowboy?

No. I'd matured out of the Cowboy thing over it. I was fine with that. That's not a problem. I always tell Cowboy fans I was a Cowboy fan as a kid, and then I matured. But we became great friends, and he really advised me on how to transition on retirement. He is a guy that was a hero to the end, not only when I didn't know him, but then I got to know him, and he was a hero in person. And so that's. That's the ultimate gift. Again, gifts of Sid Gilman and Bill Walsh and Mike Holmgren and Andy Reid was my JV coach when I was 8. String Andy?

Really?

Yes. He was a graduate assistant at BYU and was my. He was. He was in charge of the jv. So he was my coach. And so we laugh about. Oh, there's some stories. Oh, my gosh, Andy. We ran the wishbone because Wyoming ran the wishbone and New Mexico ran the Wishbone. And everyone's run. And so I could run. I ran the wishbone in high school. That's what I was famous for. So I was a scout team wishbone guy. And so I was crushing Kyle Whittingham. He was pissed. He would like, like, yeah, I'm gonna. Because we were making the deepest look so stupid, right? So then Andy gets the. He goes, you know what? We have a JV game against UNLV this weekend down there. Let's run the wishbone. I'm like, h, no, man, I'm not going to go down there and run this. This is already embarrassing enough. Now you're going to go down and play a game for byu, not even run the fricking offense so that I can learn. And he's just like, well, that'd be great. We'll run the wishbone. He's still at 67. He's probably in the meeting right now going, hey, Patrick, what if we ran the wishbone, man? That's him, right? That's him. You know Alex, right? He's like, well, what if, you know, beer option. We could do that. Like, that's Andy. So that's my life. My life is crazy that way.

So before we move off of Roger, Steve, can you talk about, like, as you retired from football? Because I only think there's only a handful of people that have ever done this transition, right, from sports, especially from the football world, specifically, into a successful transition in the business world. And, you know, Rogers probably was the first, you know, Bill Campbell's another, obviously, that coached and then transitioned into, you know, the tech world.

Roger was the one.

And, you know, but certainly for you, I mean, in that moment, right, like, as you walked away from the game and what's next and you're faced with this, that Roger, right? I mean, from what I understand, didn't he, Alex.

It's a good question because it actually brings up my dad. My dad, when I was. I used to tell him, my dream is to play in the NFL. And, you know, you can imagine my dad's like, okay, that's a cool dream. That's like less than 1% chance. And people should have dreams. I think that's cool, Steve, that you should have that. But dreams have to have a plan. In other words, you hold your dream, you also have to hold a plan. What's the plan? What's the 80% chance plan for what you're going to do with your life? And I was a kid, I was like, well, I'll go to college and then I'll go to law school like you. That's what I'll do. And he goes, that's 80. I think there's 80% chance you can pull that off. So you hold both of those. You have your dream and your plan, and you just take them. And he used to talk about it all the time. And so then when I went pro, I remember calling him and going, dad, like, the dream became the plan. Man, that's amazing. Like, I'm. And he immediately deadpan. Average career is three years. What are you going to do for the rest of your life? So then I played six or seven years, and I'm like, well, dad, now it's like, you know, come on. He goes, okay, Steve, you're gonna gr. You're gonna retire at 35 years old. And then again, that second half of your year, you're just gonna sit up front of the car dealer and shake hands, like, what are you gonna do? Like, what are you gonna. And I said, no, no, no, you're right, you're right. I think we'll just keep the plan. So during the off seasons, there was enough time. I just got thinking, what if I went to law school while. Cause you're just sitting around for three or four months. So I started doing it, and it took six semesters, actually seven, because I had to audit the first semester to prove that I could skip the first semester, first year, which is consecutive for law school, to the law board, the National Law Board would allow me to then audit the second semester. And if I pass the test, that would qualify me to now go back and take the second semester without the first semester, and then take six semesters and graduate. And so in those six, seven years, 88 to 94, I went to three Super Bowls. I didn't really plan this out very well in school. Started, you know, the weekend after the. After the New Year's holiday. And super bowl is February, what, you know, fifth or sixth. And I remember three of those years, and even the playoff years, you know, the super bowl year, you'd come back, we flew back from Miami where the game was. We'd have the parade down Market street, and then I would catch the Delta flight to Salt Lake, and I'd be in school the next morning. And people think it's nuts, but I actually enjoyed the transition. I enjoyed the conversations, I enjoyed the challenge. I just enjoyed doing it. And that first class, the Socratic method, the professor, whatever it was, and contracts or anything else. We'd go into the class and then. Mr. Young, I just Sat down, first day, I'm a month and a half late. And it's like, Mr. Young, do you mind briefing us on, you know, Smith versus Battier? You know, and like, you know, and then everyone's like, oh, you know, because they just saw me in the super bowl two days. But I think that was, that was my dad. And it was also. That was what prepped me. And then when you go to Roger, Roger's the one. I said, roger, what did you do? How do you do it? He goes, steve, when you retire, the day before you retire, you're the best in the world at something. And then you're going to leave it and you're going to wake up the next morning and you're not going to be even good at anything else. And so you're going to have this deep desire to hold on to the thing that you're great at, like every human would want. But you've got to run away. You run as fast as you can, it'll never leave you. You'll never run away from it, but you need to run. And so I just remember when I retired, feeling the next day like, holy crap, I'm not even good at anything else. But Roger told me to start running, and that's what I did. And there was a guy that had a, you know, back in the, in the mid-90s, when the, before the government sat down, shut down the URLs for, for the Internet, you could go in there and mess around with it. And he had built an algorithm that put a geographic boundary around an Internet search so that you could actually, in the early days of the Internet, you guys are too young. But Robin maybe remembers, but Rob, are you younger than Alex? I don't even know where you are.

Shane's the old guy.

Thank you.

You know, Steve, you know what Shane, he must have been seeing the latent wisdom coming from my box.

But okay, so anyway, he had figured this out and you could put in Palo Alto Hammer and get the local hardware store, but before you'd get a USSR sickle like you. Nothing made sense in the Internet. So I started. I was actually asked to be on the board of Power Bar by Brian Maxwell, who started Power Bar. He's a marathoner. And it was a marathon. I think Parabar is still around. Nestle owns it. But at the time it was this hard, crusty bar.

It was rough, so gross.

But it was nutritional, it was filling. It was for marathoners for when they're in the middle of their race. So I famously would eat him, he found out about it and he asked me to join the board. And I remember I'd gone to law school, I was going to be a lawyer. And on the board was Larry Sonsigni of Wilson Sonsini, who is a titan of Silicon Valley, and Warren Hellman.

Really?

Robbie? Yeah, Bill Walsh. It's like I can't stop it. It's like every time I turned around.

Hellman and Friedman is this incredible private equity firm.

So Warren Hellman's one of the iconic investors in Silicon Valley. Mary Sun's the iconic lawyer, did all of the, all the M and A stuff and amazing. And they're on the board and I tell them about this friend that has this figured out the URLs. And he goes, Steve, you've forget law school. You need to get in business, start a business. We called it found.com, was backed by Bain Capital and Excel, KKR. And I met a banker in San Francisco named Rich Lawson who told me, you need a CEO. He left on the spot. Morgan Stanley was the CEO, I was the chairman. And that's how I transitioned from the plan of my dad to then, because Bain Capital was in our capital structure. One of my good friends was Bob Gay, who had worked with Mitt Romney for many years, started a, had sponsored a private equity firm and he sponsored Rich and I to make the leap from operations to private equity. And that's how I did it. And it was because my dad told me to have a plan and Roger Staubach told me to run. And that's how it went down.

Talk about that first day, walking into.

Your first board meeting, I was embarrassed. I felt like, talk about imposter syndrome. Like I had never really been exposed to. I had taken some finance classes, but never under exposed to like the board. So I think I know what that is. And even in law school, I didn't do, you know, through contracts. I didn't do business law. It wasn't part of my six semesters, which I really regret. And so it was all revelation. And I think luckily I had Warren and I had Larry and I had Brian Maxwell. And they're like, we want you to learn. You're here to learn. We're going to help you figure this out. And so I was tutored. And so the next board meeting, I was so much, so much smarter because the people that were around me were so smart. And Shane, like you and Alex and Robbie, I surround myself with the smartest people I can find. And if you're not smarter than me, you're out. You know, like, there's so many smart people in the world. I'm overstating it, but I just wanted to be around the best people to teach me and tutor me. And then I had the. I held with me the vulnerability that I don't know. And it's okay to say it. I'm not great. It's okay to say it. I'm not an expert. It's fine. Own the fact that you're trying to learn and grow and just. That just was my theme for years. In fact, I went in. That's hard though.

I mean, that, I mean, look at you. I mean, you're. You're a Super bowl winning quarterback. Mvp. That's. That's hard. Like, at what point do you learn that? And that's one of the things we talk about all the time, that you don't know what you don't know. But like, that's. That's a really hard skill to, to be comfortable with. I don't know, like, explain this to me.

I never, I guess I never. It never really felt like I was the king, you know, I think even when I probably was the king, I probably thought, I don't know if I'm the king. Maybe that's just part of my personality.

Yeah. Do you think that's like just the way you are, Steve? Is that like. Or is that from your parents? Like, where do you think it comes from? The humility.

I never shied away. I was not somebody that was like, it wasn't a part of me that was. I didn't say it was a weakness. It ended up being a strength. But I don't know that I thought about originally as, oh, I'm not good enough. But I think I. You know how sometimes people say, you know when you kind of think fake till you make it, you say, I think I can. I know I can. I can do this. I can, you know. Affirmations. Affirmations. I can do it. I think I was the opposite, man. I don't know if I can do this. I don't know. I don't know. But that would be the. That was the affirmation for me to like, like you. You were going to get a hundred percent of me. As I said, I don't know if I can do this. Wham. You know, like, that's how I did it and that's how. Because of that, maybe that fits there. I haven't really thought much about that. And I think it's served me well because now you guys remind me Even at home, in my marriage and my kids, they don't want hall of Fame Steve Young walking around. They don't. They don't mind it when it's useful, but most of the time, it's a perfect. It's a weight around their neck. So, like, let's not do that. And so let's be athletic. I. I kind of. I want to share a quick story with you. Reggie White. You know, you guys know Reggie White or when he played for the Packers. The dude was the biggest, strongest, fastest human being. Did you ever face him at all before he.

No, thankfully.

Oh, my gosh. He was a 66380, and he was fast as lightning. Just threw everyone all over the place.

I was a Bears fan growing up, and so Reggie White was in my. My nightmares as a fan.

I would tell the story quickly. But there's a point. Whenever he played him, you're like, we'll have four guys block him, you know, like, oh, yeah, we'll just run over and just trip him, try to trip him. And whenever he played, he was loud. He was a screamer. Like, he. Like, your ball would be snapped. You drop back and hear ra. You'd hear him start to growl like a bear. Ah. And throwing people out of the way, and you're sitting back in the pocket. You can hear him like, oh, he's coming closer. And then he was on you. Then he was on you. And the point I want to make is he was on you, and you were. He was this huge human, right? And he was, like, on you. And no matter what happened, he would always grab me, pick me up, turn me, and fall and fall on his back, and I'd fall on top of him. And then he would hold on to me like. Like, tight. And I'm like, steve, how you doing? I'm like, not so good, Rich. Not so good. But the thing that I want to say is we had become friends at the Senior Bowl. We played in the Japan bowl at the time. That was, like, a few years where they played in Japan, and I think it became the Hula bowl or whatever. We were in Japan, and we became fast friends. And, you know, when you play someone, you know, especially on defense, it sometimes is worse. They're bigger. You know, they're just people. The association is worse. And Reggie was somebody that could be as competitive. Never gave an inch, gave you everything he had. But he could flash in a moment to your friendship to, like, you're a friend of mine. Is your dad here? Because my dad helped him find an Agent. He's like, your dad here. I'm like, reggie, talk to me later, bro. I don't want. I felt like he wanted to sack me so he could catch up, you know what I mean? So I. What I mean by that is if you're going to be seek success or power, fame or fortune or whatever else, or corner office or I'm going to try to be the best I can be, you better carry with you an athleticism, an emotional athleticism that I saw in Reggie, that I can compete white hot. I am coming. And it's. When it's on, it's on, but when it's off, it's off. And when I'm. When I'm a dad, turn it all off. Like if I'm a husband, like if I'm at work, have the athleticism. And so the best athletes that I've ever met are not the physical athletes. It's the emotional athletes who can put on different shoes all the time and have different levers and different ways to incent people and always paying attention. That's what Bill Walsh's greatest quality was. He would see each person and go, I know intuitively how to incent you and to have you see yourself in an empowered way. And it might be comedy, it might be. I might have to joke with you. I might have to be tough on you. I might have to, you know, I might have to say, really nothing and just stare at you. Like, he had all these ways of emotional athleticism to help you find that empowerment, and those are the greatest. Andy Reid's that way. Mike Holmgren was that way. Any great coach, by definition, is that way. Coach K had to be one of the most amazing human beings in doing that, right? And it's a gift. And so I just. I honor people that I meet that are gifted that way. And people say, well, I don't have that gift. That's crap. It's discipline. It's emotional discipline to stand where you are and stand present in everything that you're doing. And if Reggie can be in Candlestick park in front of 80,000 people, screaming and yelling in a championship game, and then turn and be my friend in a flash of a second, you can do it anywhere. Like, that's the spot, right? That's. That's the most intense, full of adrenaline, lose yourself, you know, in. In the emotion of it all. If he can do that, you can do it everywhere else. So I tell you that story just as an inspiration to me. The great Reggie White, who passed away from sleep apnea about 15 years ago. But what a one last little thing. We'd go to the Pro bowl in Hawaii, and Alex, I think the Pro bowl was still happening when you were playing. Reggie would hold revivals in the hotel, and all the players would come down and he would preach, and then he would challenge people to be baptized right there. And someone would say, I'll do it. And so everyone would go out to the beach and Freddie would go into the water, and then they'd come out of the water. I would go, yeah. And it was like, didn't matter whether you were a Christian or Jewish or atheist. Like, everyone was just on board with Reggie, man. It didn't matter. And anyway, I don't know how to get off on that, but I have to just pay it forward. Whenever I think about the great Reggie.

Woods, I love it. I love it. So you got. And you guys are both USFL guys.

So that's how we broke in. We broke in. He was the Memphis shootloads. The usfl at that moment, that off season was legit. They were. They were playing. They had contracts. They had. And people were paying up. And it was fun because you'd go play. Reggie went to the Memphis Showboats. You went to University of Tennessee. I went to LA with Sid Gilman and John Hadle. Gary Zimmerman, you don't know that. Probably know that name. He's a Hall of Fame tackle from Oregon. He was a rookie with me. He ended up in the Pro Football hall of Fame. We had, like, players all over the place, and it was so much fun, and we were, like, making stuff up as we went, and the USFL was awesome, and it should still be here. It's too bad it's back. It's trying to be back. But that original one, it could have just stayed in the spring. And as a business person, Robbie, they. They blew it. They blew the business model. They tried to go in the fall.

On that note, Steve, honestly, like, I. We talk a little bit about pressure to perform and, like, kind of mindset, and you've. You've obviously talked about even the doubt, that voice in your head, but I don't know of anybody. I mean, you've. You've had a lot. Like, you're the number one pick in the usfl. You signed the largest contract in sports history. You're then the number one pick by the Tampa Bay Bucks. Oh, then you get traded and have to sit behind Joe Montana and replace, at that point, the arguably the greatest quarterback of all time. And, like, you've dealt with A lot of pressure to perform and been public about like, what those things can do to you. And I certainly feel like I've, I've dealt with that.

You know, I honor, I honor. Alex. You've done something that I did not do and it was hard.

But is there anybody that, like, through all of that, the teammates, coaches that helped you, like, deal with it, confront it? I don't know. You know, like, it just. We all have our different ways.

Alex, before he answers, can you give, like, just. Because if somebody doesn't know, I really think most many people are just going to see Steve Young, hall of Fame, two time mvp, whatever, rather than like, no, no, no, no, hold on. Like, you know, usfl, then on the Bucks, they suck back up. Like, can you just do it for people real quick?

Well, we talk. I mean, he goes from eight string quarterback.

He, he.

I mean, this all happens fast. I think people don't realize, like, he learns how to throw. Then, then all of a sudden, you know, he's, he's behind McMahon, and then he becomes a starter and then he, he lights up college football. He's a Heisman Trophy finalist, runner up. Right. And then you're the number one pick in the usfl. He signed, listen to this. These numbers, like, he signs a contract. I know we can get into the annuity and stuff, but with the USFL for $40 million and what year drafted 84. This is in like 84. I got drafted 20 years later and when I signed my contract, which made me one of the highest paid players in the NFL, I signed for $40 million. 20 years later, I. Gretzky was only making 20. Like Magic Johnson was making 20, like for 40. This is insane. Insane. And so he plays there. Then, you know, he mentioned that first year, but the second year he's playing is kind of when it crumbles. Like nobody's getting their checks.

Yeah, the league and it all kind of crumbles. And it's too bad. It's really.

But then he's the number one pick by the Tampa Bay Bucks, who hold his rights and they're dysfunctional, so he has to go to the Bucks and play for them. And the Creamsicles, which, you know, is a bad.

And then.

How many years were you with the bus?

One. One full.

And then you get traded to the Niners.

Okay. You guys don't have five hours on a podcast, but this.

We got as much time as you got.

Okay. I'd made friends in Tampa with the owner, Hugh Culverhouse. He was a man is a cattle guy. And it was a. He was a land guy. He wasn't, you know, and people skills were not his, like, best thing. And he would always. When he. When we'd ever be together with the owner, and obviously the owner is a big deal. No one would really. He couldn't really start a conversation. And Coney kind of stood over there and he didn't really know how to engage. And I. I just, like, I don't know. I'll go talk to him. So he and I got to be buddies, like friends. Like, he's like, oh, thanks for saying hello and very appreciate that, Steve. And so I played four games coming out of the usfl. I played four games. I won the first one at home against Detroit. The second one was in this blizzard in Green Bay that is still the lowest attended game in Lambeau Field history because no one could get to the game. And so my third game, I can't remember what it was. And that was it for that season. So then in the off season, I remember him and I chatting. He goes, I, I love what you do. I love how you fight. And so the scrambling lefty thing was fine with him. You know, he's like, oh, I want you to be my quarterback for life. I'm like, I don't know if I want that or that. That's an indecent proposal, but I'm giving you the preview. So then they make the coaching change and bring in Ray Perkins. And Ray Perkins in the first date, has a meeting. And then afterwards, young come here and I walk up there. He goes, I hate scramblers and I hate lefties. And I was like, nice to say hello to you too, you know, and. And that's when they had the. Because we were so bad, they had a first round draft choice. So then he traded me to St. Louis. He called me young, coach, you're traded the Cardinals. Goodbye. And so I hung up, freaked out. I called Mr. Culverhouse. I said, Mr. Culverhouse, Coach Berger just called me and said, I'm trading the St. Louis Cardinals. And he goes, oh, yeah, I'm so. But you said, you guys are quarterback for life. He goes, oh, I know, but you know, Cole, I go, but you can't. You gotta help me out. You can't send me to St. Louis. Like that's his. They were 2 and 14 too. I was like, you can't. No, no. He goes, well, Steve, you're right. That's only fair. I'm going to nix that trade. He went in and canceled it. And Gave me seven days. He said, you go find someplace you think would be good for you, and we'll make that happen. Does that happen in American history? What?

That's unbelievable.

That doesn't happen. And so what happens? I call Bill Walsh. Well, Bill Walsh called me because Lee Sarmey said, look, Joe's had his second back surgery. Last week it was like, maybe he's had a second back surgery. I have my high doubt that he can, you know, continue to do it at this, at this pace we need. And I know, I know you've had a tough goal for the, for the, this season in Tampa, but I've watched you. You can do this, and I want you to come. And I was like, where do I, you know, where do I sign? And, and, and Mr. Colverous, to his credit, you know, he just paid. Vinny Tessaverde was drafted and Ray Fergus had a big contract and he. What did Eddie DeBartolo do? He gave him a bunch of money like the old days. Charlie Finley and said, look, he gave him $3 million and then some draft picks. And Mr. Colvis was like, oh, that's sweet. And then who was the most flaming pissed of all that never forgave me? Ray Perkins. Right. Because he was so mad. But anyway, I'll just finish the story by saying, so then that training camp, I mean, that spring pro OTA was like a month, a week or two later, after I'd signed with the 49ers, I show up, Joe's had back surgery, right? So I'm like, hey, maybe I'm coming to training. They just went to the super bowl. Like, you know, like, maybe I'm in, you know, I don't know. And I remember going out early to practice. I'm like, I'm ready to go. And I see Joe come out. I never met him. And he comes out on the practice, jogs on. I'm like, oh, wow, he does not look hurt. You know, he looks pretty good. Oh, wow, this is going to be a ride. And it was a six year ride. Two of them I played, four of them he played. And we finally split after six years. That's crazy.

That'll never happen again.

That's odd and awkward. And we never argued, we never fought, but it was awkward from the first moment of the first day, and it was awkward forever. So anyway, that's.

How did Coach Walsh handle the dynamic?

I mean, he loved it. He authored it, he loved it from the very beginning. He said later, after we'd all retired, and he was, you know, he passed away in 2007, and I used to hang around with him, like early 2000s. Alex, when you were there, he'd be around a little bit and we got talking about the olden days and he'd say, like, look, I knew that putting you two together, the winner would be the 49ers, and the two of you would play the best you've ever played. And you know what? He can say that in hindsight, maybe he did believe it at the beginning, but saying when he did say it, it was actually true. He got the best of both of us. And who knew that that could be possible? And only Bill could pull it off, right? Because you'd have to be able to. When I showed up and Joe's The King, that 1987, I started like four games and I played in like eight. Like, he would throw me. We'd be in New Orleans against the Saints, and Joe would drive the team down to the 10 and like, Steve, go in. Then I'd go running in and Joe's like. And he'd jog off, just pissed as all get, you know, like. And I'd run the play. And you know, Bill would do that. He'd come the next game, he'd say, hey, look, you know, I don't know who's going to play as more, you know, And Joe being there, like, what's going on? And I'm like, I don't know what's going on. I'm just here, bro. I'm just riding it out, man. I'm just riding it out. It's just insanity. So we can go on forever on that one. That one could go literally forever. That those six years is a. Is a. Is a best selling book.

Steve, did you. During the time where you're there and you're. You're playing, but you're backing him up, did you think about asking for a trade? Like, the reason I'm thinking about is sort of like, it's.

You're.

You're like really good, but you were patient, you know, and that's a weird combo.

I feel like you hit a key theme because the second he jogged out, the awkwardness began. And then I thought to myself, what have I done? Because I told Bill, Coach Walsh, I didn't call him Bill at the time. Like, coach, I want you to know I'm not hoping that Joe's hurt, because that's not what I do. But if he is, then this is obviously a great opportunity for me. But I want you to know that I'm Going to play. Like, I. I don't want to come and watch. I want to play. And so if you're asking me to come and back up, he goes, no, no, no, it's not what I'm. That's. I'm not. I'm saying that's. I'm not having you come as a backup. And I'm like, okay, I want to do it. And. And so then when it became pretty obvious that it was some semblance of backup, that was the job. I didn't like it. I didn't want to do it. That's when I started going to law school because I was so pissed, right? And I'll do something else. And then I think I demanded a trade a lot. But what happened is I played a lot the first year. That's when the real controversy started. Then the second year was super bowl year that I contributed to. And. And then Bill retired, and then it was George, and George wouldn't have none of it. Then suddenly it was like, no, we're not, Steve, you're out. And so that's when I was like, okay. Then I, you know. Cause with Bill there, it felt like I had a shot at least competing. And so then that's when I started to say, look, maybe it's. I should go. But then I. In 1990, we, our three peat year, they had a trade with the Raiders. And there's something about, like, I don't know why, because it was kind of irrational at the time. Because, Rob, you bring up the good point, like, go play. And everyone around me is like, steve, you've got to get out of here. You got to go play. And I said, I don't know what it. I'm not. This place is for me. Like, I just got to get on the field. This place is. And so ironically, it was three months later, Joe came to training camp and couldn't throw. He hurt his arm. And that's when I started to play. And then he was hurt for two years I was MVP of the league while he was sitting on the sidelines with a hurt arm. And so the dynamics are just insanity, right? And that's when. The next year when he was traded to Kansas City. So, I mean, yeah, there's a story in there. Robbie.

Yes. I want to ask Steve. So obviously this is called Glue Guys. And so we've all had folks, Glue Guys, Glue gals that have been indispensable on all of our journeys. So wondering along your journey from Connecticut all the way to the Bay Area, who are some of the glue guys, Glue Gals made you better. And how do you think about those sort of folks?

We've talked about a lot of them and good stories. One that particularly for my 49er career was Brent Jones, the tight end who was my roommate for many, many years and indispensable as a therapist, as a confidant, as. Honestly, through what I just described to you, day to day, it's easy now to go back and talk about it. Oh, six years and oh, that would happen, this happened. But the day to day living of it and then onward, I never really felt like, you know, you know, mission accomplished. Like I was always feeling like I'm, I gotta, I gotta do more, I've gotta. And I had a lot of anxiety about it. I had a lot of pregame. I was, I was not, I was not telling jokes pregame. Like I was, you know, I wasn't starting Thursday on. I was not. I didn't laugh much. Like it was rough in my head. And Brett and Brent was the one that kind of walk me through it, right. He was always there for me, always, you know, like if I had a complaint or something that was bugging me or something that didn't seem right. And he was the guy you could tell because he loved. He was at the crossroads of the whole team. Like he would got all the information, he talked to everybody he could. You know, he was the middle of the, you know those guys, Shane and Alex and Robbie, they're, they're in the middle of the action. And so then he could give me all the insight and give me, I don't worry about that or blah. Yeah. And I just, I needed that. So you talk about Glue Guy, I mean, and then there was a woman, a mother of nine. When I first went to byu, I struggled kind of making the transition. And so my parents had a friend at church that had a cousin that lived in Provo and they had a big family of nine kids up on the hill. And they asked if I could maybe, you know, they could take me in kind of transition. And I remember loving being around that house. I would just sit in the kitchen and all the action would come through and I just felt comfortable and like it helped me make the transition. I know it sounds kind of weird and odd, but Carol Burr was her name. And Carol was somebody that, like, she became a confidant of mine through the years, through the USFL years, through the replacing Jim McMahon through the Bucks, you know, and the disasters, through the Joe Montana years through, like she was always somebody that you'd call and she'd pick up and she'd have a good perspective. And so I want to shout out to that too, because I think that's what you're talking about, is those kind of people, right? Of course.

Totally. Did you talk to your dad or your mom a lot during this period, too?

I did, but the problem was is that my dad, he didn't understand, as I found out. I didn't know this as a kid. I never slept over anyone's house. I never went to scout camp. Like, I was captain of three sports, straight A's. Like, I was killing it during the day, but at night I was. And I didn't know at the time, but I had pretty severe genetic. On my mom's side of the family. Separation anxiety. It's a kid's childhood separating anxiety. You probably have heard of a kid that had it or probably ran into somebody. I'm the kid that couldn't go to school in first grade because I couldn't leave home. And so my mom actually sat in class for the first couple of weeks, and then, you know, and kind of made the transition. And then I could figure out how to stay in school. So I was that kid. So that whatever that is kind of came out in different ways as I grew up and got older and dealt with it as a piece of the genetic. I collected some genetics, you know, as I. As I took a body and that came with me. I didn't realize that that's what it was until I was 33, through a really traumatic. Not traumatic, but a difficult spot. Finally someone said, you have this. And by knowing it, suddenly it explained why. My dad, all the years I was playing, he's like, dad, I'm struggling. I don't know about this. I'm not sure I can, man. You know, he'd be like, my dream was to play. Your dream was to play professional. My dream is to play football. Get paid for it. Go have fun. Just have fun. Like, I don't understand how you can't just have fun. And so I. That's actually not. Didn't help, you know, I was like, I hear you, but I'm not hearing you. And so when you go to my parents, my parents were patient and loving and amazing. My dad was gritty and tough and wonderful. My mom's the peacemaker of all peacemakers. Our home, my home, where I sit right now, is a peaceful home because my mother taught me how to have a peaceful home. And so, like, I. All the things they did for me but at the time, how I was trying to get through my life, their encouragement, their. You can do. Oh, it'll just smile, you know, you'll be. You know, it just, it wasn't what was. You know, there's really nothing they could say in some ways, right. Brent Jones just had to be there and just walk it out with me. Right. And my dad was like, he could not fathom that I wasn't just clicking my heels down the yellow brick road playing football. That was his dream, right? It's like, how in the world are you, like, making it a suffer. Like, how are you suffering through playing football? And Alex, you'll respond to that because I think you suffered plenty too. Your parents probably like, why do you have to suffer so much for sure.

And I think. And I don't know how you feel about this, but like, everything changed when I became a professional.

Yeah.

Like when I started getting paid and I signed a big contract.

Shane, you know this too. Guys that are getting paid, it's like it is game on. And in fact, if you don't love the game that you're playing basketball or football, if you don't truly have a passion for it, the pro game will spit you out. You will find your way out. And the guys that are super talented, that are amazing, but they don't love grinds them into a. They don't, they don't make it, you know, and so you're right. It's. The pro game is where, man, things get hairy and more difficult. And I just wasn't the kind of guy that just. John Taylor was a receiver for us for many years with Jerry Rice. He laughed at training camp, he laughed on the bus, he laughed in the hotel, he laughed in pregame, he laughed in the huddle, he laughed as he caught the ball, he laughed as he scored. Like everything was a. Everything was fun and easy. And I remember looking at John Taylor's like, why don't I just. My dad's right. Why don't I just be John Taylor? You know, John Taylor, like, like he never, it never doesn't have a smile on his face, just like loving every second of every minute of it. That's just. That was not me. So off we go.

Just quickly, I mean, obviously this is been well documented. But then, then you take over for Joe and again, like the pressure, right? You're here, you are.

He.

He gets traded, you're taken over for at that point, you know, the guy that's one of the most Lombardies in history, I mean, the PR Again And I think at this point, are you the highest paid guy in the league? You know, like, what? There's a lot there, right? And leading up to 94 point, by.

Then I'd actually chosen it. At first I got kind of bamboozled into it, but by then I was actually voting with my feet. And now I'm like, now I got to go do it. And it's like, oh, that's a whole other can of worms. And I quickly dug a hole. Well, a hole. I said this last night. You heard it, Alex. I quickly felt immediately the stares of everyone in the building. You know, at times I wanted to go tell everyone, hey, you know what? Joe actually threw an incomplete pass. Like, it happened. He actually threw an interception one day. I don't know if you ever saw it, but he actually did that.

Steve, to your point, like, LeBron used to put on Jordan's games. Like, we all think Michael Jordan, like walked on water, you know. Revie, plug your ears. But when I was with the Heat, LeBron used to put in D. Wade used to put on games where Jordan went like 6 for 30 with like five turnovers. Because, like, we don't remember him.

Like, like no one, no one can.

Remember a bad game Michael Jordan ever had.

Hug your ears, everybody. He actually lost a game, you know, and so that's the situation. And so I. I quickly became victimized. Like, there's nothing. I can't do anything. I can't do anything that anyone's satisfied with. I can't. There's nothing that can happen that anyone. And I'm over invested in trying to do this. And you're clearly not. And you guys are. And everyone's staring at me. And I remember Bill Walsh called me one day and said, put me probably his office. And he says, like, look, you got to quit taking the blame for everything. It's like, well, what else you want me to do? Like what? I said it's not my fault. And. And it was a rough. It was a rough going. So I built this like a hole, and I was in the bottom of it. And it got so bad, I decided one Tuesday after a loss, tough loss against the Raiders in front of 100,000 people in the Coliseum. I'm running around the last play of the game, and Jerry Rice is open in the end zone. He literally. Shane, we watched the film. Next day he's like this. And I don't see him get sacked and we lose. And I'm like, oh, my gosh. And so I got out of town and on My way back, I ran into a guy named Steve Covey. You guys are too young for Steve Covey. He wrote books about kind of self help books. And I'd heard about him and met him before, briefly. I told him how terrible my life was. Like, how's he doing? Oh, it's terrible. And I described it and he said something that was amazing to me. He said, steve, I will travel the world looking for platforms, places, businesses, family offices, places where they allow the humans that are on the platform the chance to iterate and find out how good they are. And when I see those qualities, I put them in books. And I see you as a 49er. Eddie DeBartolo, the first owner in the history of man who wants to be a partner with his players. Bill Walsh is famously three generations ahead of everybody. Joe Montana's on your team you can use as a mentor. Like, in the end, you have the greatest platform I've ever seen for any human to go find out how good you are. This is the greatest opportunity ever. And I like him saying that, like, honestly, it was as if I was in a trance. And he snapped his fingers and I was like, oh, my gosh, what am I doing? I raced back to practice the next morning because I thought I was going to get fired. You know Wednesday mornings when you get fired in the NFL, and I'm like. And I didn't realize at the time that I was the one that had dug the hole. I was the one that was playing the victim. I was the one that, like, I blame it on everybody else, but I was the one who was depressed and anxiety ridden because I had misdiagnosed the situation and had found the death in it rather than the profit in it. And he snapped me out of it. And all of a sudden I saw nothing but opportunity. And it never became about. I never asked the question about Joe again. I never asked. It wasn't the thing. The quest was, how good can you be? And go be about it and go, let's go. And that's when things turned for me in the middle of 1991. In 1992, I was the MVP of the league. 93. I got beat by a couple votes by Emmett Smith. I only tell you this because I think it's from where I was in the bottom of the hole. It's good to just have the context. I lost the MVP to Emmett Smith by two votes or something. And then the next year I won it again because I was on a quest and it just flipped. The whole thing flipped in A more positive way where I could put everything that was happening in context. That was profitable. And now Joe became a mentor. It was like, could he mentor me? What could he do to help? Everything was redefined, and I just had to find everything in a way of victimization that I now watch others do all the time. And it's so obvious to me now because I lived it and did it, and I just like, no, don't. That's like. Bryce Young gets benched this week for the Carolina Panthers, number one pick. And I hope he calls me because I want him to not have any mitigation in his mind, heart or spirit or in his mouth, like, nothing that's happened. We understand that the owner has screwed up. We understand the general manager screwed up. We understand that the offense is not maybe built for you. We understand the coach is not calling the right plays. We know that your players are probably not fully, you know, kind of in the right spot, but at the end of the day, you have the ball in your hands, own it, and don't talk about any other mitigation and just say to yourself, whatever I'm at right now, I'm. If I'm backing up, I'm the greatest backup that ever lived. And that's how I'm going to claw my way back and get back on the field and reclaim my spot. Because if you don't, if you start to play victim, you will not get there. And he has the chance. Today's Wednesday. They're at post practice. Today he'll meet the media for the first time after getting benched. And the words need to be. I have three things to say. I screwed it up. I'm going to go fix it, and just watch and walk away. Because that's how I learned you have to define stuff in the proper way, or else you'll play the victim and waste sometimes your life in the bottom of a hole that you thought someone else dug and threw you in. And as it ends up, I dug it myself by hand and jumped in. And that's the biggest change for. That's the biggest. One of the biggest gifts of my life was sitting on that plane with Stephen Covey, if you can believe it, and him telling me you complained a lot, but you're the luckiest man alive.

Why is that so hard for younger people today? That lesson right there, it was so well said. Why? Why is that hard? Why is that hard for especially young.

People, don't you think? It's been timeless, by the way. Don't you think everybody deals with this.

Mitigation, by its definition, is truth. In other words, things have happened that are true, that have made it very difficult for you to be successful or to fail or to anything else. And they're truths. But there's always a truer truth. The truest truth. The truest truth is I had the ball in my hands. And I say this metaphorically to anyone in their life. The ball's in your hand and you threw it to the other team. It's your. You have to own it. Own the truest truth. And then don't worry about mitigation because that's where victimization lives. That's where I was living. And it feels so comfortable because then you don't have to take it in. It's some of this. I've been. I've been victimized. Like I've been. And the truth is, you have. I get it. But it doesn't actually profit you to spend the time. Bryce Young, I guarantee you, being the first pick of the worst team. Alex will. He'll give you a lesson on it. Like, it's brutal. Five coordinators in five years. Like the revolving door of defensive coordinators trying to be head coaches and talk about quarterbacks. I'd rather scratch my eyeballs out like, you gotta be kidding me. Like, that was like the most painful. I saw you in Seattle. Your shoulder was hurt. I knew that you were hurt. And you couldn't hardly play. You were warming up. And I'm like, bro, are you okay? And he's like. And you looked at me like you've been. You've been chewing at the pant leg so long. You're just like. You growl at me like I'm fine. He treats us like that sometimes. That's the only way through it. But I, you know, anyway, I think.

There'S so much truth to that. And even for, like, not just individuals, but companies. Because, Rev, you always talk about this. Like, sometimes your most important role as a board member is to hold the mirror up right to the guy. Like. Like, this is the truth.

Listen, like, the last thing I want to do is talk during this, but I could not agree more. And Steve, I actually take it less for companies. I would tell you, like, if I could give my kids one thing, it's not curiosity, it's not even kindness, it's agency. Just, you're the captain of your own ship because that's the only source to ever, like, actually have long term happiness is because you can get out of whatever you're in. You have the control.

You Know what I'm saying?

Not of the whole situation, but at.

Least your own behavior.

And I think that I can't agree with you own. It is just like that. That's what I'm thinking about.

I've said this. If I could give my kids one thing, and what would that one thing be? And it would be the virtual circle to be able to be vulnerable your whole life, to recognize when you've screwed up, to say it and then go fix it in that way. That's the agency you're talking about. It's like, look, I'm. Whatever's happened, I'm not going to look around. It's easy to do, to say all the things that went wrong, all the things that the people. I'm going to focus number one on, I screwed this up and I'm going to go fix it. And if my kids can do that like I learned to do later in life, man, that's a superpower. And that comes from the vulnerability of not being so sad sack. Oh, it's my fault. Oh, it's my. Everything's my fault. No, it's the maturity. It's the power to have the vulnerability. Like in the agency you have. I'm empowered to watch for where I'm screwing up. And that's not a weakness, it's a strength to say, dang, man, I could have handled that way better and then go fix it. And that'd be a miracle for my. My kids could do it younger than I did it because I try to. I'm very aspirational about that today. It's still super hard. The other day, my wife, I came home from the grocery store and she's.

Like, don't go to the grocery store.

Next time, Steve, use Instacart. She said, I forgot. She's like, how could you possibly forget the first? I mean, you went to other four things you got. But what about the first thing I said? I swear to you in my mind, I'm whispering because she's nearby. I swear to you in my mind, I said it's because. Because you freaking mumbled it. But I learned that it doesn't matter. I was sent to the school to get the thing. I didn't get it. So I say to her, you know what? I screwed it up. I'm going back and I'll get it. And now we're having our 25th wedding anniversary. And I know why, right? Because it's the same stuff, boys. And look, as you guys know, I've been private equity for 25 years. Now almost 25 years and our company HTTC is just down the street and we're into our fourth fund and $2.5 billion, we're middle market private equity fund, trying to do the exact thing that we've just spent an hour talking about to take into the most transactional environment, which is deal making, private equity. Make the deal. Emergency room. It's emergency room as a medical metaphor, right? It's like, come in, you're hurt, fix you up, get you out. It's like, it's transactional. And we're trying to change the nature of that. And using Bill Walsh and all the things that I've learned, all things we just talked about, to try to do private equity in a partnership, truly referenceable partnership way so that like Every. We have 70 platforms and do I have 70 people on my Rolodex that could reference me for me doing what I said I was going to do as a partner to you. We don't own 100% of anything. We're in partnership with 100% all the time. And in that partnership, it is challenged every day. And do you have the skill set to not be victimized, to not blame game, but to put the mirror up yourself and to others and to have great relationships? It's really, Bill, I'm trying to do in private equity what Bill Walsh did in football, essentially. And it's a fun. And thankfully, Roger told me to run and here I am. So it's awesome.

Boom.

You guys are great. You brought out things in me that I hadn't thought about in a long time. Pieces of it that reminded me, oh, my gosh, I have been through some things, you know, like you just forget. And there were moments when I wish my kids were sitting here because they could have heard that, you know, there's.

More to just dad, they can listen to it. I feel like I wrote down two pages of notes right now we need.

We need subscribers, so please have them listen to it, all right?

My oldest boy would come home from elementary school and like, dad, I heard, I heard that my friend at school said that you punched Joe Montana in the face and he kicked you in the balls. And that was, you know, and I'm like, that did not happen. You know, he kept coming back with stories like that, like, no, that did not happen. And so I started thinking, if I don't tell my son my story, it's going to be told by others. That is totally false. And so I ended up writing a book with a lot of help from a guy to try to just tell my son my story. Oh, there it is. Ravi's holding it up. I never meant to publish it, Ravi. But what's funny about it is my son, who I. You know, it's inspiration to put it on paper for my four kids, that one of my kids have read, because I don't blame him too much right now, but there will be a day when it matters, and they'll be able to crack it open and say, okay, what's the truth?

Well, everybody should go read it.

It's.

The book is awesome.

The book is awesome.

It's QB Life behind the Spiral.

It's awesome.

It's awesome. And it's also awesome about life. And the thing. Steve, we are so appreciative because it's so fun to hang with you, but it's also, we get to learn. And I think the book is the same way of just like, it's a lifebook. It's not a football book. It's just, like, you get to be. You feel like you have a path to being a better person, and it's just really special. So this meant a lot to us that you spent the time with us and, you know, just who you are.

You guys are great.

Appreciate you, bro.

Much love to you.

Thank you so much.

Thank you, Steve.

Thank you. Thanks for tuning in to Glue Guys. We're on social media at Glue Guys Podcast, and we'll be back next week.