If They Lose Attraction When You Show Interest, This Is Why...

It's very draining to be someone that you're not in order to make other people happy.

Because it is a trap. So many men have this like fucking kettle that's boiling, that's just building because they're not expressing. They don't want to upset someone.

What if that's not the right person?

I hear this a lot from the guys that I coach. It's like, sometimes it feels like everything I'm doing for my partner is not enough. The polarity will fade when you do that.

A lot of those blocks come from the inner child dynamics that we experienced growing up of who we believed we needed to be in order to be loved. There's time she called me and she was just venting. I had to literally just listen to her and then say, Wow, that must— like, in the moment, she just wanted to feel seen and heard in her pain.

You have to be in some level of tension for growth to happen, and most of us are just trying to avoid it. Yeah, why would we label it as bad? Why would we judge the tension?

So my ego all day long can visualize the perfect relationship, the perfect amount of business success, and think that's the best-case scenario. But what I've realized is—

what's fresh in your life right now, like something you're pondering or contemplating that, you know, maybe you could speak into?

One thing that's been really fresh in my content and also kind of been what I teaching has to do with understanding that like our sub— many of our subconscious patterns that keep us blocked, whether it's in love, relationships, abundance, anything, a lot of those blocks come from the inner child dynamics that we experienced growing up of who we believed we needed to be in order to be loved. And a lot of the mechanisms that we create in order to, of who we believe we need to be, become something that's so subconscious and in the background that it like keeps us blocked. So for example, for me, where I realized this was in my own life is back in 2019, I went to a Tony Robbins event. You've been to a Tony Robbins event?

I haven't, no.

Yeah, so anyways, in 2019, I went right before COVID time. And there's this idea that he teaches that has to do with understanding the core question. The idea is that we all have a core question that we're constantly asking ourselves in the back of the mind. And what I realized was that my core question that was always like running in the back of my mind was, what do I need to do? Literally every night before I go to bed, I'd write down the top 3 things I needed to do the next day. It was constantly around like, what do I need to do? And what I realized is that a lot of my sense of self-worth has been connected to what do I need to do? And when I looked back at this and far as far as my childhood goes, what I could see was that as a kid, like my mom, for example, going through a lot growing up when I was 2 or 3 years old, my mom's dad died and she had like a lot of like trauma with him. So it still affected her though. And I remember— I don't remember this, but I can imagine that having a mom that was mentally going through a process she probably at a certain level was like in her own process. And there was probably an inner child part of me that was like, where's the love and connection? What do I need to do? You know? And what I realized and where I was kind of starting this off with what I was sharing earlier is part of that what do I need to do thing was me realizing that even to heal the pattern of believing I am what I do, how many YouTube subscribers, how many videos I put out, how I need to add value to them. It was like this doing this that was connected to my identity. But what I realized is the moment I became aware of this like thing that's been running my life of like my sense of value connected to what I do, it's like, what do I need to do to get rid of the pattern? Hmm. So isn't that interesting? Because it's like the pat— the way in which I'm trying to get out of the pattern of what do I need to do is by doing more. But that's not the answer. So it's become a new task for me to do.

Yeah.

And I think a lot of times when it comes to self-development, We're trying to become the best version of ourselves because we believe that deep down we're not good enough the way that we are. So if we listen to another podcast episode or we watch another video or we do, we do the inner child healing work like we need to do it in order to heal. But underneath that, what I've realized is a huge epiphany for me is around self-acceptance, accepting myself. Accepting the inner child part of myself that decided that I was only worthy based on what I did. And growing up with like, you know, tension in the household, who do I need to be? I need to ease tension. That's some patterns may have been alive to there, like grown there. So what's fresh for me right now is like becoming aware that a lot of the patterns that are on autopilot for me are things that my inner child decided of who I had to be to receive love. And that has now been something on autopilot that's been keeping me in certain patterns, trying to prove myself or trying to like earn love. And the thing I've realized is that love isn't necessarily even love that deep down is what I think I'm getting. It's more approval and validation. And I think that deep down as kids, if love wasn't the norm, unconditional love, and there were conditions to love, we'll settle for validation and approval. And it's like this dirty high that we get. And the rule is, if I get your approval and validation, then you'll accept or love, etc. But connecting to that inner child part of myself has been like the key. Yeah, that's been like the gold, is like connecting to that part of myself that decided that, loving that part of myself, and not needing to fix them. Like, okay, now do the inner child healing. Like, you're worthy, just so you know. Like, this idea of feeling worthy is such a concept that we try to— like, what does it mean to feel worthy? You know, like, I feel— where is worthiness in the body?

Yeah.

You know, it's like, it's not really a feeling.

Yeah.

Worthiness is like, is a concept. And who do we believe we need to be to be approved of or loved? And I believe when we start accepting that part of ourselves, that's where we start to like tap more into self-love, which is actually self-acceptance.

Yeah, man, it's huge. Yeah.

Yeah.

Like, even you sharing that, I was just realizing or seeing so many ways this shows up in my life too.

Yeah, how does it show up?

Because it is a trap. It's like a personal development trap where you're bypassing the truth of the matter, which is like, you're in it. You're always worthy. The story that you need to do something to be worthy to receive is like, we're receiving all the fucking time. And yeah, for me recently, bro, it was very similar because I, and I was thinking about my question was probably like, am I doing enough? And I noticed that in my business always, like, I feel like I'd be doing more. I feel like there's always more to do. Yeah. You know, and I've been working with a coach who's also a friend of mine, Kian, and he's been giving me some powerful reflections on our coaching call because I would go into this story of all these things I still wanted to do in my life. Yeah. And it would pull me out of the moment because I would then think that there's just so much more I gotta do. Yeah. And he was giving me the reflections like, bro, you're doing it. You're in it right now. Yeah. This right now, you are here. Yeah.

This is it. So what, can I ask you a question? So what are the emotions that you feel when you say, am I doing enough? Am I doing enough? What is the emotion underneath that thought?

Yeah, the emotion is like, it's almost like an urgency. And I don't know if that's an emotion, but it's more like a, like I need to hurry up. There's a sense of, it's almost like, it's not anxiety, but it's a mild form of like, yeah. And so it's an adrenaline thing, right? I've noticed for me, that's why like growing up, I had an addiction to caffeine for so long because there was this urgency to like, let's get going. I was always in a rush to get somewhere. Driving fast, moving fast. So, so much of my process has been like, let's just slow down and be here. Where are you in a rush to get to? What future moment has got more for you than what's here right now?

Right.

So that emotion that you're referring to is like urgency, frustration, anxiety, like adrenaline, cortisol-based emotions that speed me up.

And is that— was there a moment of your past where you decided that like that was the energy that either was familiar or that's what you had to that's what you had to like, I guess you familiarize it at a certain point in your past.

Yeah, definitely. Yeah, like my dad, um, worked really, really— he works as a pipe welder growing up, so he would work these long 10-hour days and then come home and have a few beers every night to kind of decompress. And he was always in a different mood every night, so he was either come home and quite reactive and angry around the house or whatever. So there was this part of me that was like a little bit on edge around his mood and reading people. Yeah, there's also this part of me that like knew I had to prove myself to get dad's love on the soccer field or whatever. So the story that I told myself was like, I have to train harder, I have to do more, I have to like—

Interesting.

You know, just always be putting in the work.

Yeah.

And it was just all these subconscious programmings from him, which is like, you only get out what you put in, you have to sacrifice, you don't get nothing for nothing. So all of these programs create this story that like, I need to be growing, I need to be working. Like otherwise, what's my worth? Like, who am I?

Right.

Am I worthy of any of this? Yeah. So Yeah, the subconscious stuff is where it's at. I love that you started the conversation with that. Yeah.

And interesting. So it sounds like there's a lot of like that urgency. So with the awareness that that's where the urgency has been and that there was a, I guess, a desire to like make Dad proud.

Yeah.

Is there anything that's been powerful in your journey of like healing that dynamic? Do you know what I mean?

Like, yeah. Yeah.

Almost like holding space for that inner child part of you that like decided that.

Yeah, correct.

You know?

For a long time meditation was so beneficial for me. Yeah. Because it helped me kind of get beyond the unconscious story that was just driving me forward and pulling me out of the moment. But there came a time recently where I realized like meditation had become this low-key way of numbing myself from being in the intensity that sometimes life would bring up. Yeah. Life would get really intense. Then I'd be like, oh no, I need to meditate. This is getting too much for me right now. Let me like, go back into like regulating myself. But through my help with my coach, it was like realizing that, no, no, dude, the intensity is it. Like be in there, get used to the intensity, enjoy it. You don't need to numb it or distract from it all these ways. So the kind of like unhealthy coping mechanisms of alcohol and drugs and social media and porn, all those unhealthy ways of numbing, obviously we wanna avoid them. But then there's the other spiritual way of numbing yourself from the intensity of life, which is like, let me just do breathwork and get high. Let me meditate. Let me do more of the yoga class. Like, because in a sense you're trying to avoid feeling all of the intensity of showing up on social media, coaching that client, making that bold request from someone.

Right.

So for me now, it's like really about leaning into that and go like, okay, can I be okay with this as well? Yeah, I'll be okay closing that big deal and just like this.

It's interesting. Yeah, it's interesting how the acceptance of a negative emotion can become a positive experience. So when we're trying to avoid feeling certain emotions, yeah, we're like avoiding feeling. And then that creates more resistance because there's not just like an acceptance of what is.

100%.

But then when we allow ourselves to feel it, it's like we're giving space for that to be felt inside of the body, to then be released, which then is very freeing.

Yes. Yes.

And what I think is interesting is like the more we allow ourselves to feel what comes up and to let it be there, that's like a lot of where the medicine is. And what I wonder too is What were you— so by having that energy of really trying, the urgency to like go, go, go, go, what emotion or what would you be avoiding? Like, what are you avoiding with that pattern? Because very often I think what happens for us is we have these patterns that are subconscious and there are emotional payoffs we get from the patterns.

Yeah.

So for example, like people pleasers, people that are trying to please everybody in their life. Subconsciously as a kid, they may have decided that in order for me to feel safe, which once again, safety is kind of like this emotion. Is it an emotion, or what is safe? Like, maybe to feel calm, really what it is. Yeah, because safety is a concept. But in order to feel calm, what I have to do is I have to allow myself to, um, like, manage everyone else's energies. I need to manage the energy of mom, of dad. If there's tension there, their tension is my tension. So it's— we can become the mitigator of other people's emotions and energies. And what happens is, as a people pleaser, they then carry that energy with them. And the payoff they get is they get to be a good person, or they get to be the one that's needed because they're easing tension, or the one that's getting approval, you know. So the payoff they get is approval and validation, when in fact that's also the thing that they're avoiding— the tension and being in their own frame and people seeing them as bad. And to be seen as bad as a kid may actually be like, you were bad if you chose yourself, or you were bad if you expressed your needs or how you felt. That's bad, but it's really authentic.

Yeah, you know, they're all those low-key ways that we avoid the intensity or the tension.

Yes.

Yeah. And then those ways that are socially okay because like, oh, he's such a nice guy, such a nice person, but right, like you're saying, it's— yeah, he's low-key avoiding or manipulating because he's not just confronting the tension of just maybe saying what needs to be said. So that's been a big theme for my life as well, bro, is people pleasing stuff and learning to maybe say no sometimes or just say that hard thing that I wanted to request from someone and being in the tension. Like the embracing of tension is so much of the, I guess the truth that I can see that you're on your path as well. And I'm very curious to know how you start to become more aware of subtle ways that you're avoiding just being with the tension. Here right now and choosing to create a new meaning around what that attention is, right? Something needs to be avoided or resisted. Is it for you something that you have like a moment-to-moment awareness now where you're catching yourself sooner and sooner and sooner when you go back into old patterns, however they show up? Yeah. What are you kind of reflecting on when you go about your day and some, maybe some added cues that you're aware of in your body to be like, oh, I'm in some tension right now. Can I, can I be with that?

Yeah, it's a good question. I think a lot of times what we do is we think that we need to figure out the emotion of like where it is and feeling it inside my body. A lot of times what it is is it's bringing the energy back inside of my body. And the cues that I ask myself is like, what's motivating this decision? What's motivating this rejection. So if it's, if it's like I'm rejecting expressing myself, what's motivating that? What am I really afraid of? And the thing, it's, it's like slowly but surely what I started to do is started to see patterns where I would abandon myself. So when I first learned this, it was actually like 3 or 4 years ago when I was living in Sedona at the time, and I was going through this huge transformation in my energy, and I was starting to feel safe, like safe in my own body, but also like present. And I would start to ask myself the question, like, if somebody texted me and they wanted, you know, like, come do this thing or like, come here. And I would normally like make it up an excuse why I couldn't do it if I didn't wanna do it. And I'm like, well, that's lying. Like, I choose to live by the values of being vulnerable. So vulnerability, authenticity, and integrity. And is that in integrity to abandon myself or to lie? About not wanting to come to this thing. And there was this— I remember there was this get-together and there was like this dinner and all of this stuff. And I was like, I felt guilty saying no because I felt like if they felt tension, I'd feel bad about that, or they'd see me as like a bad— not a good friend or something. And what I learned is in the moment of me making certain choices or decisions, I would ask myself, what's motivating this? What am I really afraid of? And what's authentic? What's actually real? And then I would catch myself and I would, I didn't have the courage to actually express what I really wanted to do. And I remember there was this person asking to come to this dinner and it was, it was interesting because I said that I, um, I said no. I said, I just kind of said no, like I, I didn't, I wasn't going to come. And then they asked me why, you know. So it was like, it was almost like not a test, but like it was like it allowed me to go deeper into it. And then in that moment I had the choice to say, well, like, oh, I could say I gotta pick someone up from the airport or something like that. I'm like, That's not true.

Yeah.

You know, so then I was like, oh, I like literally was just like, I don't, I don't feel I'm gonna take space for myself today. I don't feel like coming. And in that moment I realized, oh, it's not this whole thing that we make out in our head. It ended up being fine, you know? But in our heads, I think we kind of map out worst case scenarios or like, if I do this, then I'm a bad person. And one thing that I had to learn in my own journey of this is I had to embrace the parts of myself that I was afraid of becoming. And I think for myself, because growing up I had a narcissistic ex-stepmom in my life who was controlling and manipulative, from 7 to 17 I didn't have much freedom. Yeah, wasn't allowed to have friends, had to earn going to school activities, um, had to like earn getting enough food to eat even. So it was like this— I was always like on eggshells and like tuning to this person that was very like emotionally uncertain of where they were, but What happened was there was a lot of manipulation and like energy that I didn't enjoy, but there was a choice that I made as a kid that I wasn't gonna become like her. And part of what that meant though is part of the way she was being is like causing that tension became something I also avoided inside of myself, even if that tension was authentic.

It's like the shadow.

Exactly. So I, in a way, I had rejected the powerful part of me that would assert myself because even though my ex-stepmom was controlling and manipulative, there was still a certain level of power underneath what she did, how she was. She would fight for something she believed in. She would fight for my sisters. She wasn't my real mom. She was my stepmom. But her daughter, she would fight for like she, she had this energy that I think my dad growing up like didn't really model, and that's why they were with each other. So on one hand, it was like realizing that like she had this energy that I was like rejecting inside of myself because I was subconsciously afraid that if I embodied that assertiveness, I'd become evil, bad, or be manipulative. But the thing was is that wasn't actually true. By me embracing being assertive, I was also embracing, I was rejecting my power. Thinking that it was gonna be bad. But in fact, realizing I'm not gonna become that, I'm not gonna become her by stepping into my power. Doesn't mean I'm gonna become manipulative or controlling. What I realized is like I was rejecting a powerful part of myself. So what I had to become comfortable with was literally being the bad guy. But to be bad didn't mean being manipulative, talking down to people and gaslighting people. Being bad to me meant actually expressing my real self. It meant actually expressing a boundary to somebody else. It meant actually standing my ground when I didn't agree about something someone else was doing. And what I found was interesting is the more I embraced that bad part of me, the more instead of validation and approval from people, wanting that, I started to actually receive respect. So respect came out the other end. So instead of approval and validation, what I realized is I started to approve and validate myself. So as I was approving and validating myself, I didn't need it from other people, but in fact, respect would come. And whether that respect came or not wasn't my thing to manage. So this in a way for me was like an initiation into masculinity and an initiation into not needing the approval of mom and dad, which I believe is a very important part of what Carl Jung talks about when it comes to individuation. We have to actually individuate from mommy and daddy's wanting for what they want for us. And it's a thing that's like hard for us to do because as kids, we literally believe that mom and dad are God. They're the ultimate authority because they're our basis for survival. And the tricky thing is that as kids, What we do is rather than think of as mom or dad as bad or wrong in any way, as kids, we would rather think we are wrong. So instead of, as you know, instead of believing that like maybe, you know, and maybe their mom and dad's divorce growing up was just, was something that they didn't figure out. Maybe I could have been different. Maybe if I was more quiet or I was more acceptable or I pieced the family together, mom and dad would still be together and we would avoid this tension. See, as kids, we internalize shame. So as a kid, like internalizing, something must have been wrong with me, but realizing, not that we vilify our parents by any means, but realizing that a lot of people live like, I'm gonna go to college to be a lawyer or something because mom and dad want me to do it, but they abandon themselves in the process. Or then they're in a 30-year career and they realize their entire life they've been trying to do what mom and dad does. That's very draining. It's very draining to be someone that you're not in order to make other people happy.

Yeah, then they wake up and wonder why they're doing every weekend and go like, oh, I hate life. It's because you've abandoned yourself for 30 years. You need some sort of hit of high because your life is not giving it to you. It's all the ways you've denied life expressing through. So yeah, I hear everything you said there because in my own journey, it's been so much of that with, with my dad, the, you know, he was quite domineering in his energy. Yeah. Like outwardly express his anger, would just say what needed to be said. And sometimes it will come out quite like harsh. Yeah, harsh. And just, you know, so, and then I so disowned that part of me because I said I didn't want to be like that. So, so much of the men's work, uh, that I've been a part of, and now that I lead men through, is getting back in contact with that, uh, interesting, that primal essence that, yeah, nice guys gets shut off because they witnessed their dad in similar scenarios.

Do you feel like younger you created more nice— you had more nice guy patterns? If you had people pleasing?

100%.

And part of it maybe is connected to dad being domineering growing up and you just— you rejecting that part of yourself.

Yeah. And then I saw how that impacted so many other areas of like my dream was to play professional soccer and I made it to semi-professional, but I could see that unintegrated aspect of myself is what held me back.

Interesting.

'Cause on the field, I didn't wanna upset my teammates. So there'd be times where I'd pass the ball when I should've just fucked myself and went. Be like, give me the fucking ball, let's go. And then there was times in business where, you know, with launches, bro, I was like kind of too afraid to sell. I was too afraid to, you know, really be seen. Like, this is my product, you guys should fucking buy it, it's awesome. So it's been over the last few years that I've really seen that and how it's held me back in different areas because it's the purest form of masculinity when you just express yourself fully. That anger part that doesn't always need to come out as like this big rage release, but it can come out as like, hey man, like, or to your, in your relationship, hey, like, I just don't appreciate you speaking to me like that, right? Or you call someone forward, or you just say if someone's bothering you and the way someone's behaving is upsetting you, address it immediately. Otherwise it just builds and builds and builds. And so many men have this like kettle that's boiling, that's just building because they're not expressing, right, what they feel because they don't want to upset someone. Because they've disowned that part of them that from their dad. So like you said, there's, there's all these healthy aspects to having a connection with these darker elements, the darker masculine elements. When you've integrated it, you become actually a more safer man to be around, right? Because you're not avoiding these things in the shadow. Yeah. To get to the shame, you, you need to go through the anger.

Yep.

You need to confront that, like, right, that, like, let out the warrior.

Yeah.

So that underneath it you can be with this part of you that's maybe grieving or, or sad about the fact that all the love that you wanted from your dad growing up just wasn't there.

Yeah.

And then me giving that to yourself is just like, yeah, it's a liberating thing. Um, so I, I just, for men, I, I've been such a big proponent of doing this kind of work. Yeah. Going into that space. And sometimes when I'm coaching guys, I'll literally just, bro, you need to yell right now. Just, just go. Yeah. And, uh, I've been amazing to— it's been interesting to witness how some men just, they've never done that. They try to scream and it's just like, it's just nothing comes out. They don't have it in them. So self-expression for me has been a big part of my own journey to get in contact with all these lost parts of me, learning to express fully.

I find it interesting that like we were talking about this because you're, you know, we both have Instagram accounts and we create content in similar niches. Yeah, but my audience is primarily women, like women dominated, 70-30 split. And then yours is kind of more equal, but you focus and are passionate about the men's work.

Yeah.

Which I find interesting because I feel like a lot of times what we subconsciously do as creators is we project onto our audience the thing that we're currently learning. So if mom or dad, if your, if your core wound was more connected to mom or dad growing up, you might find yourself seeking more the approval of the masculine because maybe you didn't— that was whose love you craved more growing up. May have been your dad, whereas me, it may have been my mom.

Interesting.

Or that, like, the woman— so that's why I think I have predominantly a woman audience, and that's why I've kind of like really studied these patterns. Because as a kid growing up, who did I have to be to feel safe or to feel calm growing up is I had to understand female psychology. Even though I, I would say that like some of that isn't just female or masculine psychology, but it was like I had to understand I was tuning myself to a woman growing up. And then as an adult, I feel like I understand my relationship to the feminine. But I've learned through experience and a lot of like hard, you know, not expert at any means at like, you know, all these layers, but I have become very good at looking at subconscious patterns because I had a whole bunch of subconscious patterns that were under the surface that were running my life. And then for you, what you're kind of sharing now too is like, even though women follow you from, you know, from Instagram, they tend to be more relational in like their desire. So they tend to be more into relationship content. But it's interesting that like you like the men's work, but also it's kind of like you're healing the past version of you in a way. And probably are— would you say that a lot of your clients are more so connected to the people pleaser, nice guy type thing is like where you can really help them?

Yeah, definitely.

Yeah.

It's just so fascinating how like the content that I make is for the part of me growing up that really needed to hear it.

Yeah.

Yeah. Same thing with the clients that I end up working with. I'm like, just like I'm like the older brother that they really needed. Yeah. So that's why it's so fascinating with coaching. And you do that as well with probably who the people you see come in and it's like, it's just, you have the medicine that they need because of your own experience. So, and I wonder for you, bro, because I know you're recently in a committed relationship with Anna and how has some of those patterns showed up for you? Like now, you know, re-engaging in intimacy again. Yeah. What have you noticed in that? And I know your relationship is still fresh. So I wonder like, are you now getting new reflections or starting to see, oh, okay, this is interesting. You know, things are coming up for me right now. Oh, for sure. Yeah. Yeah. Do you feel like speaking to any of that?

Yeah, I'll share. I'll share whatever. I think like what was very interesting about Anna and mine's like relationship in general and, you know, we were friends for 5 years, like close friends for 5 years before we ever dated and or anything like I think that we felt a deep connection when we first met each other. But we both were in relationships, kind of like cycle to where like we weren't really available. But in our minds, I think we kind of put each other in like a friendship category. And therefore the way in which we related to each other was just like as friends. We've always— I remember when I first met her, I felt like there was some type of like deep connection there. But she had a boyfriend at the time and we just kept it as friends for years and we would kind of help each other with each other's businesses and stuff like that. And even for us to first even like open up the opportunity of dating, it required a certain level of vulnerability. And the vulnerability was scary to like express. I think part of my pattern was like expressing how I felt or expressing like the desire like to like explore a different side of the relationship was something I was afraid to do. Because I was afraid that if I did that, it would make our friendship weird. And we had 5 years of like a solid friendship. So I was afraid of that. I was afraid, what if it's not felt on both sides? You know what I mean? So it was like, I was like, oh, you know, we could just stay as friends. And honestly, we know everything about each other. Like every dating story, every person we've talked to, every relationship, we kind of know, we know, we've held space for each other after relationships and stuff like that. So it was very interesting going into the dynamic. But one thing that definitely Anna has helped me become aware of inside of myself is I definitely have patterns around believing that like I need to do things myself. Like my 6, like she's very supportive of my mission. She's very supportive of like, you know, she's very supportive in a way that I'm not used to in partnership before, but for sure I'd say, the very beginning of our relationship happened because of a vulnerable conversation. And that vulnerable conversation opened up the possibility for us to actually, like, explore dating. Did you— did you ever hear about, like, the way in which that all came? Do we talk a little bit about it in Costa Rica? Yeah, I was in Costa Rica and it was all these weird things kind of happened on this trip. We went with, like, Chad, Ashlyn, like our other— we had a whole bunch of— we had some friends there and it was basically like 3 couples. Or no, it was 2 couples and then my friend Anna, our friend Bella, and me. So we were like the single people. And through us going on this trip to Costa Rica where we were going to drink plant medicine for a night, ayahuasca, which we hadn't done in a long time, but it was this cool way to connect as friends. And even from the moment we got onto the flight, like things like weird synchronicity started to come up where like one of our friends got upgraded our friend Bella got upgraded to first class, and she got upgraded to first class, which through Anna brought up all of this stuff because she was in premium economy right behind. So I haven't told you this yet. You know any of this? Okay. Do you want me to share it with you? It's interesting.

Yeah.

So Anna has this, like, this pattern around kind of like she, like, works— she feels like she has to work really hard for, like, certain things, and then some people get it really easy, you know? And there's this pattern where she was kind of like in premium economy right behind me in first class. And she was like wanting to be in first class. And I was telling her she should upgrade to first class, but she kind of didn't. So I look back and she's like in the middle seat in between these two people that are talking to each other. And Anna's like, do you want to switch? And they were like, no. So she's just like, they're like this. And there's these two people talking and she's seen me. And then Bella randomly gets upgraded to first class. Not only did she get upgraded to first class, she paid $600 for her plane ticket. I paid like $2,500. Yeah, she gets upgraded and she gets upgraded in the seat right next to me. So this entire time we're on this plane ride, Anna's watching me and Bella talk for like 5 hours. And that's when I think she started to realize that there were like emotions coming up, which I thought was just her inner child stuff coming up because she got upgraded and she didn't.

Yeah.

But then I realized later on that there was like this, this subconscious, like, emotion that she felt you know, this connection to me that like she could start to see with Bella, you know. And, um, through the— I won't go into like detail, it'll be a longer story all the way around. But basically throughout the week, more and more of this like kind of information came to the surface where I could realize that she was kind of— that there was more to the surface than we were seeing. And I felt similar. And then that led to eventually a conversation that we had that then kind of unveiled all of this. And then very quickly that like all got— that all started to like kind of unravel. But for that to even happen, vulnerability was a part of it. Even, even I'll share a deeper aspect as well. So that happened. Then we started connecting in that way and like things very quickly kind of, you know, went into the— within weeks, like went into the full-on relationship. And we already knew everything about each other, which was interesting because you're dating someone that you already feel a really deep connection to, but now it's just in a new way. So that was interesting. Um, but another aspect of this too was in masculine-feminine energy, one thing that I realized is living— like, being around Anna a lot, because, you know, it's been like 4 months now.

Yeah.

You know, being around her a lot is something that has been newer for me. And one thing that I could see happened at a certain level is polarity would start to drop after living with each other for a while.

Yeah.

And part of it was because I felt like I couldn't completely give myself permission to be myself around her when she was around. Not because she had high expectations and standards and she would like judge me based on what I did, but like there was almost two versions of me subconsciously. I felt there was a version of me where I could be like the perfect partner that was like, you know, like meeting her needs in certain ways and being in my own masculine frame around my business. But also then there was the part of me that like, liked to watch like random stuff on YouTube and what would happen is I started to feel like I was getting trapped in. Like I started to feel like I couldn't be my real self for some reason. And what would happen is I would feel like, kind of like, I don't know, I wasn't giving myself permission to be my real self where I like would wanna watch random stuff that like she might think is weird, but I'd be afraid of like her seeing it as weird. So what I realized though, the big epiphany for me after realizing this was she wasn't caging me in. Now that I'm getting used to being around someone more often, it was me caging myself in. And also in childhood, I felt caged in childhood because I was around someone that I had to like kind of tune to. So then what I realized is I was tuning to her and putting this invisible barrier around myself of like, who do I need to be around her? And realizing that that was my dropping my own masculine frame, and that was creating this dynamic also where I was kind of oversharing in certain part of our relationship a little bit more than I needed to because we know we care so much about each other as friends, it's like I would share business things with her and stuff. And what I actually found benefit in is peeling that back and not sharing everything with her, peeling it back and like not sharing every little challenge that I have and being more bold in my energy where I'm like, no, this is what we're doing. This is what I'm gonna watch right now. And she's like with her headphones on, like giving myself more permission was the key to more masculine polarity And then she is always mirroring my ability to be in my masculine is directly connected to her, like, safety to be in her feminine.

Yeah.

So like, I have to check myself because the mask, the, the polarity was very strong in the beginning, but then there was like, I would find myself dropping that energy living together because we started to become so familiar with each other. And what I had to do, and something that's a constant thing, is like being in my own masculine frame, choosing to express myself when things come up, which is probably the biggest shift in our, in my, in a relationship I've felt with Anna, is when things come up, we quickly share it with each other. And back in the day, I would kind of like not, I'd feel embarrassed to share it, like if something was coming up. Now I share it as it comes up, and then she's able to like meet it. And sometimes knowing that things might come up for her as I share what's coming up for me, but like the purpose of it isn't to like fix. The purpose of it is to like share and then to like hold space for each other, but like in a way where it's just like the freedom is in our ability to share. So it's been very interesting because the other thing I've had to also like not do as much and like learn from is there's time she called me the other day because she spoke at a mastermind in San Diego and she called me and I was here in Austin and she was just venting about a drive that should have taken an hour and a half was taking her like 4 hours because of traffic.

Yeah.

And she was just kind of venting about it. And I had to hold back the desire to try to give her solutions. I had to literally just listen to her and then say, wow, that must suck. Literally, like, that sucks. And then she would like start to feel seen and heard versus me being like, well, what if you put on a good playlist? Yeah. What if you did this? That's not what she wanted. Like in the moment, she just wanted to feel seen and heard in her pain. And the old childhood pattern of me is like, let's fix. And even living around, being around her a lot, I have to hold back the desire to fix and instead be in my own frame. And she then feels more seen and heard, which is more healing to her than her wanting to be fixed, which also implies that she's broken.

Yeah. Yeah.

So anyway, so I'm curious in your own relationship. Well, I'll just pass it back to you for a minute, but then see if there's anything that you know, um, you want to share about that and maybe your, your relationship? Because you've been with your girlfriend, with, with Amanda, for— yeah, like almost 10 years now.

Yeah, it's almost funny, like, because I'm so at the point now where I'm just— I'm fooling myself around it. Like, I'll watch whatever. There's no—

when did that switch for you?

Yeah, man, probably.

So when you, when you were 20, you guys met when you were 21?

Yeah.

And when you were 21, you guys met, and then what was that What was that journey like over the last like 10 years? I wonder like, was a lot of your childhood stuff like offload in the beginning or did you not get into personal development stuff till later?

Yeah, that's why it's just so interesting 'cause in your 20s, at least for me, I was just on this journey. Like I started when I was 21, 22 having these realizations and going on this journey and she's been with me the entire time. So there's been so many different moments of doubt in the relationship because it felt like I was going in one direction, she was going in another. Critical conversations, crucial conversations, are the ones that helped us navigate through really difficult, challenging times when we thought it wasn't going to work out. And it's proven to myself and her so many times now that the breakdowns are necessary. Expect breakdowns in relation— expect moments where you go, yeah, you know, I don't know if this is going to work out, I don't think she's the one for me. And those stories are actually opportunities or signals that I find that I've realized to lean in and have the vulnerable share something. This is what I'm afraid of. This is what I need. This is what's coming up. And it's in those deeper conversations where you don't know if it's going to work out, but you're bearing your heart to each other. Ultimately, it creates this energetic space where you both kind of come together and you navigate through that, that challenging period, and you come out the other side of it even deeper. Even really—

okay, that's—

so we've had many of those moments, bro. And probably a couple of years ago was, was the one of the most intense moments where we had 3 months apart. She was living in Lisbon and I was kind of still just traveling around all over the place and I'd fallen into some patterns where I was just so in my business. I wasn't meeting her in all these different ways. I got complacent, I got lazy in the relationship. It was just, yeah, it wasn't that fun. I wasn't that fun to be around. I was taking life a little too serious. And she went and traveled to Lisbon and met all these amazing people and was having so much fun with all these new friends that she'd met that she's like, wow, I haven't felt like this in a long time. Yeah. Being around Jordan and 'cause we were living together a lot. And it brought up a lot of insecurity in me. I was like, holy shit, like what have I been doing? Like, and I started to like feel like she's gonna meet someone else that like, the guy that does all these things. And it was a really difficult period where I remember being in Perth in the middle of winter, she's in Lisbon in the summer going to these festivals. And we barely had much time talking to each other on the phone because of the time difference. And it was that hard conversation where I went, hey, I've been falling short. Like I haven't been showing up for you in the way that you need. It was like re-enrolling her into this relationship.

Interesting. So it was, it was necessary for you to re-enroll her. Yeah.

And I say this all the time to the guys that like feel like they need, their partner wants space or their relationship's on the rocks. It's like, you need to step back and honor where you've not been showing up and then acknowledge it. It's almost like restoring integrity for the relationship and almost declare that, hey, I'm not giving up. I'm gonna step into the man that you need. I'm not giving up on this. I'm committed to you. We're gonna figure this out. And I was like, hey, I'm booking you a ticket to Cape Town. We're meeting in Cape Town.

You're coming.

Like, yeah, like this. Yep. I'm not letting this go on like this anymore. And it was that— I remember saying that to her on the phone and she just like started crying one night. She's like, yeah, where is— where has this been? I've needed this. Yeah. And it was like a huge breakthrough moment. And since then our relationship's just been so solid. But ultimately the realization for me was sometimes you need to have space. Like, there needs to be space in the relationship. There needs to be— hey, as a man, I hear this a lot from the guys that I coach, it's like sometimes it feels like what I do is not enough. Everything I'm doing for my partner is not enough. They're still not happy. They're still wanting more of this and that. And ultimately that comes back to the guy in the people pleasing pattern or in that, let me just do everything for you, sweetheart, neglect or abandon me. And the polarity will fade when you do that. If you're living with someone, it's just what happens. The masculine needs different things than the feminine to recharge that pole, to rejuvenate itself. So for the men, I'm like, dude, you need to either start saying what you feel and start Setting some boundaries and an example you gave where like your partner's venting, cool, it's great to hold space for your partner venting, but if it crosses a certain point where you're like, all right, now it's been 45 minutes and then you're just venting, hey, you know what, love, like maybe I gotta cap it here. That's healthy masculinity, just saying like, this is my capacity right now, like maybe call up your girlfriend and keep venting there. And that's gonna be really triggering for your partner, but it's empowering for you and she's gonna respect you more.

And also what I find in moments like that it actually creates like safe containment because women don't really respect the masculine when it's, it's just catering any time she wants. Exactly. It's so readily available, but it's like, no, like there's, there's a value to someone's time and energy. And when you set that frame, even though they don't like it in the moment, deep down they might be like, yes, like they, they know where that, they know where that frame is.

Oh my gosh.

You know?

Yeah. Yeah.

So it's interesting.

It is. And that's where I use polarity or attraction because There's been many throughout our 10-year relationship, there's obviously periods and phases where like I'm not that like we're not having that much sex or I feel like I'm not as attracted to her anymore. I'm in my head going, hey, maybe, maybe she's not the one for me. Like I'm not attracted and it's like, no, no, no, no, you're just not giving yourself what you need to be able to recharge your masculine pole to be back initiating in that way.

Yeah.

So now I just use that when we're not having sex very often or the attraction is not there, we're not affectionate with each other, where am I not pouring back into me? Yeah, take full responsibility for it rather than going like, oh, like, you know what, you're not doing well.

What's an example of that that might be? I'm curious. So like, so maybe if something's— what would be an example of a way that you'd pour into yourself that then would like cause that polarity to come back?

Yeah, purest example for me is time with the boys. Time with the boys. Time with the boys. Like go play sport, go do something competitive, go fucking jiu-jitsu. I found in Lisbon the other month, I just, I went and had a roll at jiu-jitsu. I hadn't done it in months with one of my friends and I came back and I was just, bro, I just was so horny. I was like, let's go, I wanna have sex. This is, I'm feeling amazing. Like, let's go. It was like instantaneous. Yeah. What it done to my energy. Yep. Because it was just time with other men where I'm not in my head. I'm like doing something a little bit competitive. It was just the immediate switch that brought back this initiatory spark to the relationship. And I was like, dude, it can be as simple as that. And it becomes even more important if you do business with your partner where I've done business and has been helping my business for so long. If you're always in business with her, you're always in, she's always in her masculine or you're always asking her these questions about business. Well, mate, don't expect to be sexually alive for her if she's been in masculine mode all day. I was like, okay, I need to, like you said, maybe don't rely on her for all these business things. Go and ask someone else that so that she can be in that more feminine posture.

100%. I've had to tailor that back because for years as friends, I'd bounce a lot of things off of her and I would help her with business too. but I'm like, oh, actually this isn't the, this puts us in a different energy, almost like an equal, I don't know, like a different dynamic for sure.

But the challenge for both of us is 'cause like both of our partners, like our girls are powerhouses. Like they're just so good at being like getting shit done. So then it's like, how can we take more responsibility or lead for helping them switch that off? And so they can just oscillate between, okay, it's okay to be in the masculine sometimes, when it's, when it's not necessary, boom, switch it off. And then we're just so much more attracted and pulled into that. So yeah, I know that's a challenge for a lot of guys, but everything you've shared up until now has been relevant to leading in a relationship. It's like, how do you lead yourself? How do you honor what you need and confront the tension, right? Like, you know, I need to— I'm gonna go, go have a weekend away. I need to be on my— I just want to have some space. Yeah, craving some solo time. Yeah, you know, claim that. Yeah, if that's what, if that's what's needed. A lot of guys don't.

Yeah, because they feel like they can't, or they feel like they'll get in trouble, or their partner will think— and it's almost like the more you fill up your cup, the more you can be at a full cup with your partner.

Totally, you know, totally.

Yeah. What I find interesting too about something that you said was, is I, I found myself in this pattern in the past when dating someone, well, where when something starts to like not go right or there's tension in my mind, there can sometimes be this thought of like, what if this isn't the right person? And it's funny because I was talking to a friend about this where my, like when it comes to abundance and money, it flows a lot easier than where relationship, like my relationship challenges I would say are something that I've had more focus on, which has made me, I think, better at what I do because it's been something that I wanna figure out. But money kind of comes easily for me, even in business. And what's funny is a friend of mine who's— it's flipped. He's like, he's had like a long 15-year marriage, but business for him is this thing that he gets all heady about and scarcity sometimes. And we're able to like mirror that back to each other where there are times when like if a launch isn't going well, for example, he might be like, oh, maybe this launch is crap, it's going to crap. And I'm like, no, bro, you just have to figure out how to get through the launch. Like everything is feedback. You're just learning about yourself. And it's not a matter of if this launch converts, it's a matter of when it converts or what you have to do to switch it to work.

I've been a bit like that in business, to be honest. Yeah, that's, that's, that's been a big—

so interesting, interesting, because in the same way, what I— my friend reflected back to me is that at times in relationship, if there's tension or challenges, there's a part of me that's like, what if that's not the right person? What if it's like the moment there's tension or something coming up, there's a belief that like, what if there's— it's just someone else? Or— but what I've realized is that in the past, not even just with Anna, with other Like quickly, that's where my mind goes. And that is like the same version where my friend is like, oh, the business isn't going to— the launch isn't going to work. It's going to go to hell. It's going to go to shit. But it's like, no, that's— it's the same thing. So I've had to re-pattern myself to realize you can get through this even more powerful with someone. It's not that it's just the person, you know, it's because that stuff will come up with another person. Yeah, it's the same. It's subconscious stuff that's in your shadow and you find, you can find someone else, the same challenges are gonna come up because it's not just them, it's your relationship to them. It's your energy, it's also you, you know?

This is huge. And it's like going back to the things like this, it doesn't mean it doesn't come up for me, but I've just been in a 10-year relationship now where it's like, I've been through this so many times and I'm like, oh cool, like I've been through this. And likewise with you with launches, you've done that many launches that now it's just like, boom, you've worked through, that pattern barely shows up anymore because you have so much awareness around it and wisdom around how to navigate through it.

So I guess the more breakdowns you can have in a relationship where you come out stronger on the other side, you've been through like 9 or 10 years of that. So every time you have a big breakthrough or breakdown that comes and then you get through and you're like, actually— so you genuinely say that after the breakdown you feel deeper to your partner?

Without a doubt.

Interesting. That's good to know, you know, like— So just rest assured when it does happen, which it will, And even the couple things that have come up for us, like we do, we feel deeper and like more connected afterwards.

Conflict will 100% bring you closer together. It's just how it is. And it's usually one person in the relationship that does better at going first. That's what I found. And for me, Amanda does way better than me at going like, let's not argue. Like, let's just, let's address this. Let's move on. I think it's this Taurus nature in me, stubborn as hell.

I can be stubborn too. Like, ah, why am I? Like literally the other day I was like mad about something And I just, I would not let go.

She needs to know that I'm mad. She needs to be in my madness a little bit longer.

And almost like I was like, so like almost like subconsciously punishing her by withdrawing my energy because I was so, I just like wanted to pout and be mad.

Yeah. Yeah.

And it was so stupid because I was so aware of it and I'm like, oh man, I'm getting the payoffs right now of like pouting. And I was like aware of it, but I'm like, well, what do I, what do I do? What do I do? That pattern comes back. Like, what do I need to do to get out of this? You know, but there was almost like a self-acceptance that came in, you know, that like, that came in that, that helped a lot, I would say.

Totally, bro. This is just fascinating how relationships are those beautiful opportunities to go deeper within ourselves. Like, I always remind myself and remind people that, yep, the relationship is not there to make you happy, right? Not there to fulfill you. It's not there to even give you love. Like, it's there to reflect all the ways that you're not loving yourself or you're not going deeper within yourself. It's there to actually make you more aware of where you're blocking love in yourself. Yeah. And if you use the relationship as that, it's never ending, right? There's like always more love that can come through. Yeah. So what a beautiful thing. Rather than the attachment of like, this person should fulfill me, this person should play this role in my life, or they should love me in this way— says who? Like, they're gonna be— there's gonna be constant conflict if that's the case, because they can never fulfill that. Yeah. They can never be that for you. Yep. So all of this work around, you know, the inner process and the subconscious stuff that we talk about and we guide people through, it's so valuable because it's all awareness, man. It's all like seeing more, but continuously seeing more and more and more and it doesn't end. It doesn't end. That's why I just think having a coach, for me having a coach is so invaluable because he helps me see things that, oh fuck, I didn't even notice that.

Like, come on. 'Cause there's no real end date where you're like, I got it all figured out and I could just be. Maybe that's enlightenment or something, but But it's like there's always layers, you know? And even you, you've been doing, you know, like 10 years you've been in a relationship, but you've also been like teaching dating, relationship, and like, like inner child, you know, healing stuff. And me as well. And it's like it's a never-ending journey where it's just constant layers and layers and layers, you know?

So when it comes to like your content and, and the energetics, because yeah, whether, whether we realize it or not, we're all magnets. We're all like pulling. If there's something that the person listening to this or watching this is not happy about in their life, it's like, well, you created it, right? Everything in your life is a reflection of what you've been putting out and how you've been showing up in the world. And I wonder for you, like when you go through that process of going like, hey, I wanna make this amount of money or I want to scale my businesses in this way, I wanna attract this amazing relationship. Where does that process begin for you? Is it about identifying the outcome that you want and then tapping into that energy and, becoming aware of the subconscious? Yeah, you're blocking that right now. Or is it— do you go, hey, you know what, let me just step into the energy right now and trust what's meant for me will come? How do you normally go about that? Yeah, reality creation process.

Yeah, well, back in the day, I'd say it's a little different than it is now. Back in the day, it was like very much a focus on the end result, visualizing, feeling what it would feel like to be in it, but like it was this thing that was gonna happen in the future. And it was something that like I recognized that I craved in my life, even though deeper down I knew energetically it's I want it because of the emotions I will feel. There was this like definitely this externalization of it where it was always in the future and it was like something I would visualize. Like that was the mode in which I'd go about it. Now it's a little bit different. Now I've had a very strong connection to like the divine and God. Where it's like, who's to say that my ego knows what's best?

Yeah.

So my ego all day long can visualize the perfect relationship, the perfect amount of depth, the perfect amount of business success. Like, I can visualize it from my ego's perspective and think that's the best case scenario. But what I've realized is in the whole manifestation niche, which is like I've been on YouTube for years and back in the day I'd make videos on manifestation what I've realized is that one, there's a lot of superficiality that can be inside of it because it's like a lot of what people say they want, it's not just 'cause of the emotions they feel, it's because of like they want those things to feel better. They think that that's gonna make them happy. And what I've realized is it's also a very subconsciously manipulative way to control reality. The belief is that if I can attract love into my life or I can attract a certain amount of money in my life, then I can feel safe, then I could feel enough. But also my ego gets a lot of gratification in being able to say, I thought this, I imagined this, and then I experienced this. There's no divinity or uncertainty in the process. And really that's what it is. There's no uncertainty in the process, which means there's no divinity or God in the process. There's this belief that my ego thinks it, my ego feels it, my ego experiences it. And what I've learned is that that's a limitation and that's a lot of burden. Like when anytime someone says, I wanna create my reality, we create our reality, you don't create your reality. God allows like the things to flow in and out of your life based on the energy you're embodying. But when you put yourself as a vessel of something greater than you, even more beautiful things come into your life than you can imagine. So for me, what I've realized more recently is having this connection to God or the universe, which has actually come more into my life because of a book called Autobiography of a Yogi.

Wow.

Have you heard that book?

I have.

I haven't read it. It is the most important, powerful book I've ever read in my life, and I've read it a few times.

And why that's surprising, but I guess it's because it's so Vedic philosophy, right?

And even more than that, what Paramahansa Yogananda did is he was from the— he was from the East. And he was born in the East. And what his book is, is literally an autobiography of his life, him being around enlightened gurus and people that like were so in alignment with God that like magic, like literally reality was like way more magical than we can imagine. But what he did is he brought yoga and this philosophy from the East to the West back in the early 1900s. And when he did that, one of the ways he connected to the people in the West was actually by talking about Jesus, which is something a lot, a lot of people think of Vedic, like them wearing the weird hats and like there was a lot of like racism and judgment of him coming here. But he came here and he created the SRF, the Self-Realization Fellowship, in this, in the, in the California, throughout California. And there's, it's all over the world now. But he lived in such divinity with God. It wasn't about a specific religion. He, he was very connected to Jesus and he would talk about Jesus and because he talked about Jesus, he was able to relate to the whole Western philosophy because everyone thinks like people worship gurus. No, people in the East like admire and they worship the guru that like their embodiment of God that they're in allows them as a symbol to connect to that divinity inside of themselves. So Paramahansa Yogananda was— he was like celibate his entire life. He was connected to God in such a beautiful way to where he didn't have relationships the way that we do. And not to say that that's what we need to strive for, but his relationship with God. But reading that book and seeing his relationship with God for me made me realize that, like, there are levels and like there is a certain surrender that we can give to God in a way to where it just happens. Because for him, when he came here back in the 1900s, he didn't even speak English. He had to learn English and he traveled around for like 20, 30 years, giving thousands and thousands of seminars where thousands of people would show up. And he had nothing planned ever. God would just flow through him. And he was just, and like, Matt, you read the book, like magical things literally happen in the book. Like people brought back from the dead, like things that you have to tap into the book to see, like it's almost things like, it feels like magical thinking, but there's a sincerity to the book that just changed, that changed my life. And the life, you know, it was like the one book that was in the iPad given out or in, Steve Jobs' funeral. It's the thing the Beatles and all these famous people have talked about this book because it came out in the 1940s. But it's a life-transforming book. And I literally at one moment was reading it every single night before bed for like a year because it's so powerful.

Yeah, man, in sharing that, you helped me realize again how sneaky the ego can be by creating personalization about this. Look what I created. Or look what I manifested. Look what I'm manifesting. And all these little ways that you're like, oh, I'm doing this. You're separating yourself from, no, no, like something far greater than you is creating this, is allowing this. And I actually think, or what I'm realizing in my life, the moment I think that it's me doing it, I cut off that significance of that grand power. And I almost get, life will remind me or God will remind me by taking away the thing that I thought that I had. You were doing. Yeah, and it literally happened the other week, bro. I was like looking for a new assistant and I, me and Liam sat down and we mapped it out on the whiteboard exactly what we want in this assistant. We put a post out on socials and literally she came, the exact person we were looking for came in the next day. She ticked all the boxes. I was like, Liam, like look what we did, bro. Look, we literally called this in, had the interview with her. Like this is amazing. Look how powerful we manifested this. Got on a call and then 2 days later she's like, oh, I've taken a job somewhere else. So boom, gone. I was like, what the hell? What was that? And I just realized that dude, that was me thinking I did that. Yeah, that was me thinking like, I look what I created, when in reality, if I had developed more of that reverence or sincerity, I was like, wow, God, like God brought this into our lives. Isn't this beautiful?

And you know, and also from another perspective as well, you don't know if what's best for her life, 100%, like maybe where she ended up getting the other job or whatever is the path that actually would play out her patterns of what she needs to learn next in a better way. So it's like, it's almost like it's challenging to do sometimes, but taking ourselves out of it and realizing it's a whole piece, it's better for everybody. So like, what if that's also making space for somebody else that could come in? Maybe on a timeline she would have worked with you for 6 months, but then you would have trained her and everything and had to find somebody else. But that is now redirected to where someone else comes in, where it can be more of a long-term thing. Maybe, maybe not. Maybe it doesn't work like that, but like Who knows? Because I've had multiple times where things have happened in my life where in the moment it feels like it sucks, but then something better comes in or not, not just better, but like something that was more in alignment or there was a lesson I needed there to come in that, that also like, you know, was beneficial.

And that's why it's a great point because I think developing that neutral perspective to all that happens, which, which is God's perspective, right? God's perspective is everything is neutral.

Yeah.

We're the ones that project the right or wrong, good or bad, or yes, no, onto everything. So remembering, okay, can I treat this thing as neutral, even though, oh, like $200,000 just came in.

Right.

Cool. All right. That's what it is. The moment you start celebrating all these things, so it's okay to celebrate, but the moment you start saying, this is amazing, this is so great. Well, now you've created this contrast, which means when you get the thing you want, everything's good. But when you lose $100,000, now what? That's bad?

Right.

Well, like you just said, maybe you were meant to lose $100,000 to learn that critical lesson that sets you up for the next thing. That neutral perspective is a really good reminder like that I'm trying to bring into my life, which is like, Things flow in, things flow out. I'm deciding the meaning of it.

Yes.

What if there was no meaning? It was just like everything is just—

That's where the power is.

Yeah, that's where the power is.

Yeah.

So in business, it's tricky to do that sometimes.

Have you ever heard of that? There's this concept from a book that's called Reality Transurfing. Have you ever heard of this?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Great book.

So there's this part in it, it's called Decreasing Importance. So there's something in our reality that has to do— this book was written by a Russian quantum physicist. And it's got some esoteric concepts in it. But one of the core themes of the book that people really get value out of is this idea that anything we make really, really important, we put on a pedestal and we create resistance around. And what happens is the belief is that there's everything in our reality is based on balance. So because we're putting a lot of importance on something, there's this balancing effect in reality that comes that wants to neutralize it, right? So what happens is it then comes in to neutralize it. So for example, you really, really don't want someone to like brush up against your car and like to ding up your car. It's really, I just got this new car, it's so special, blah, blah, blah, blah. But then something happens and it like, ah, you know.

You're creating this negative charge to offset the balance. There has to be a positive charge. So it's like you're attracting the thing to offset the thing you really don't want to happen. Yeah.

Because think about that too. The thing that you're aversion, because it's on a pedestal, there's also this aversion against the thing happening that you don't want to happen. What are you visualizing when you think of somebody not dinging up your car? What are you putting out?

Yes.

Someone dinging up your car. Even though you say, I don't want them to ding up my car, you're still putting that energy out.

Yeah.

It's important it doesn't happen. Increased importance. But what happens is because that trigger and that energy is active inside the energy field, you're more likely to attract something to actually happen.

Yeah.

And what happens is the universe in a way isn't punishing you. It's you're learning about your energy. When you put a person on a pedestal, what happens? If it's really, really important they like you, what do you end up doing?

Yeah.

Not being yourself. You end up trying to get their validation and approval, which ironically pushes away validation and approval because you're not being your real you. And you've made— you've deemed them and what they think of as so important that it's this important, it's you're not giving it to yourself. And therefore, and what do you do? What do you not want? You don't want their disapproval. So it's all this energy charge. So what happens is when you decrease the level of importance and you see it as natural, that's where the power is. You see it as natural. It's like there's a certain acceptance you have in reality. When you go on a date with someone, think about it. Really, really important they like you. A lot of resistance. You're now focused on the outcome and the end result. When instead you go on a date and you're curious whether you have things that are in common with them, you're curious if you have similar values, you're curious and you want to have a good time. Those are all present moment things. So one of the biggest shifts for people that are going out and dating for them to learn is that what they can begin doing is set the focus on actually enjoying the process instead of focusing on getting the end result, instead of getting validation, approval, for them to text you back, etc. Realize that's something you can't control. What you can control is your ability to be present, your ability to have fun, your ability to connect with the other person and see if there's synergy. And what happens with that energy, you're, you're, you're, you're you. And when you're you, you're more likely to be, to be, find someone that matches that energy with the real you.

Totally. You can say neutral and secure, almost synonymous in a way, right?

Yeah. Well, I'd say, wait, you're saying neutral and insecure synonymous?

Secure. When you're secure within yourself.

Yes, yes, I agree with that.

And it's like same with money, right? When you're secure with money, you're neutral around money. Therefore money can easily flow into your life and money easily flows out. But if you're a little bit anxious around money or people, you're like, I need to hold onto this. I need to hold onto this person. Well then you're not neutral. You're like saying it's positive to have lots of money. So I'm gonna hold lots of money, but you're then in turn blocking the flow of money. So it's like, that polarity piece is everywhere. Polarity's everywhere.

It is, it's a paradox too. You know, when I teach about like emotional, like, like becoming, feeling worthy, for example, which of course worthy is a concept that we've kind of been talking about. But what I tell people that is different than what they expect is that around worthiness, we are all both worthy and not worthy at the same time. Worthy is a concept. We just exist like a baby just exists, right? Is a baby worthy? We say yes, a baby is worthy. No, it's not. The baby is both worthy and not worthy at the same time. The baby just is. You could put headphones on a baby that say, I am worthy, I am worthy, I am worthy. The baby could grow up its entire life with the thoughts in the background. I am worthy, I am worthy, I am worthy. It makes no difference. That's just affirmations and words. But worthy is a concept that we're trying to prove ourselves against something. You exist. People both are worthy and not worthy at the same time. No one is better or worse than you, which is a freedom switch for people. When you realize I don't have to try to prove myself one way or the other, there's freedom in that because whether people like you or not doesn't mean you're worthy or not worthy.

Yeah.

So it's almost like that's where it becomes a more powerful realization because we're not trying to prove ourselves anymore. Then we can just be free to be ourselves. But we don't even question that sometimes. We're like, how do I feel worthy? I want to feel enough.

100%.

But neutral. But once again, that neutrality is where the power is, because if you can accept that you are both not worthy and worthy at the same time, there's freedom in that.

You're okay with both.

You're okay with both.

Yeah.

You know, and it's the same. It's— and then you allow the flow to happen naturally. You are both not better than anyone else or worse than anyone else. There's freedom in that.

Yeah.

There are people that are going to like you, and there are people that aren't going to like you. There's freedom in that. Like, thank God. Like, do you take the pressure off, you know?

Yeah, and back to the thing with businesses and launches, right? I realized in me, one of the fears I had around launches was failing, was not getting the result, was not hitting my goal. So I was like, I was afraid of not hitting it. So it's a fear of failure was indirectly blocking me.

Because what would it mean for you to hit the goal?

Yeah, that's it, that's it. So it was like, my fear of failure was blocking the success because I was not accepting, the deeper I was willing to accept the fact that I could fail and all the emotions around that, would open up more of a channel for more success to come in and whatever that attained to. So that was a huge realization for me is like failure and success are actually the same thing. The only difference is like their rate of vibration and we're both of it. You're also the failure and also the success.

And you can't, you honestly can't have one without the other.

Yeah, if you're resisting one, you're resisting the other. So most people realize that they're blocking success because they're resisting failure.

Right, and you have to almost, and that's such a powerful point because people think that you can get success without failure, but actually failure is like the mechanism that allows success to come because failure is feedback, you know? So it's like if you were afraid to put out like a YouTube video or a piece of content, it's like in the beginning when you first started putting out Instagram reels, you probably put out a couple that flopped.

Yeah.

Did you?

Oh, always.

Yeah. And then— but then if you were like, it's— you deem it as a failure.

Yeah.

It's like people that are afraid of failure believe that there's an outcome, but it's a process.

Yeah.

Like, you failed until you succeeded.

Yeah.

Right. And then probably the videos that did the best for you were the ones you didn't expect to do the best. Is that right?

100%.

So we don't— we think we know what's best. We think we know what success and failure is. But the videos that did the best for you, just like me, the videos that have done the best for me are sometimes the ones I would never think they would go viral. I mean, it really reveals my flaws. Flaws. Some of these videos are embarrassing. Some of my first YouTube videos to go viral, they were so embarrassing. But who's to say that I know what success or failure is in a video? The audience knows. Yeah, right. So it's, it's not our thing to manage. Only thing we can manage is our ability to show up to the process, right? But it's the same thing with, with launches and like, you know, failures, successes, you know.

It's powerful, man. Yeah, the, the ability to just show up in the process and contextualize that into anything that that, you know, we're maybe struggling with in life right now is like, where are you just not showing up? And just allowing God or the audience or someone else to just take care of the result and let go of the meaning you're placing on what failure actually is or what self-worth actually is. Like you said, they're concepts. So that means we're projecting our own meanings onto them, which is then in turn like creating all the emotions that we're avoiding. So, but the truth is, if you're willing to confront any aspect of yourself, any emotional energy, then in a sense you should be able to achieve anything you want.

Right.

'Cause everything you want's on the other side of an emotion that you're afraid to feel. Yeah. In reality. Yeah. So I was like, the moment I remind myself of that, I was like, okay, where am I avoiding discomfort right now? Yeah. Emotionally. That's usually the direction to go.

Yeah, it's a powerful prompt to think of. And when you were asking earlier about like how to tap into like the energy, like how to go about, tapping into the energy manifestation. You remember the exercise we did the other day where we were like looking at different areas of our business and where are things on a scale of 1 to 5, 5 being excited, 1 feeling not excited at all, and you can't pick 3.

Yeah.

Where is this area in your business? And what I've found in my own life is when I do more 5s, which a 5 for me is like running a live event.

Yeah.

A 5 for me is like having this conversation right now with you is a 5. Yeah, it's like exciting. And what was feeling like a 2 or a 1 for me was like the old way I'd make content where I'd force myself to make content and I didn't have other people there. Like right now we've got other people here and it's, it's like I'm more in a 5 energy, which I think pulls out better content. And, and also it's just more fun. And when I'm in that 5 energy, that's where more magic happens, more synchronicities happen. I'm in the right place at the right time. It's like an energy. So I focus more on just getting into the 5s. And when I'm in the 5s, great stuff happens. When I'm trying to rationalize being in a 2, that's when it's like, that's when it becomes challenges. And sometimes we rationalize 2s because you, because of past, it's familiar to childhood, et cetera. You know? So for me, I'd say that like, that's, that's been a big epiphany for me. I mean, I remember we were talking to you about your business and like where you could You know, what is this or that? And certain things were like 2s. It's like, okay, that's not the thing that you want. You don't want to build a business where you're doing these things you don't want to do.

Totally.

So where do you get into a 5 and being in a 5 and when it's the most fun is when it like everything else aligns anyways.

Yeah. It's funny as you're saying that, because when I sit and have these conversations, they're always a 5 for me. Yet for some reason I don't prioritize them. Yeah. Because there's all these other like I need to make content, right? What if the content was available and just setting up conversations that were 5s like this right now? But I'm curious to know for you, what do you think people are responding with more, the information or the energy? Because in content there's information, which is ubiquitous now. Fucking AI is like anyone can put out great piece of content with information. But what's the differentiator now is energy. For sure, 100%. So how are you feeling into that with your content around, did you notice a trend where your top videos were just like you were just in it?

Yeah, this is funny. Me and my girlfriend, me and Anna, a few days ago, we were going through my YouTube channel 'Cause I've had videos for 8 years and we're going through, I'm going on the TV on my YouTube channel, flipping through. And I went like 4 or 5 years back and we were looking at my energy there. Then we look on like 2 or 3 years ago, we look at the energy there. Then we look at like 6 months ago, we look at the energy there. And I could tell that like there were moments when I had, at one point just making videos with the video camera, I was in a 5. But then what happened is I could tell that as I was like, I've created a certain amount of audience on YouTube, I need to just keep doing what I'm doing. I was like doing like a 2 and it was reflective also, I think, in what my audience could feel from that energy. And then what happened is I could tell when I was like in, you know, live events bring out a different energy of me, you know, but sometimes that video's like the most viewed video from last year was a 30-minute video from my Miami live event where I was coaching a woman on stage and it got over 1.2 million. It got 1 million views in like a couple of weeks. It went crazy.

Yeah.

And it was this like really beautiful moment with this woman I was coaching in a live event. But then after that, I'd post other live event content and sometimes it did well, sometimes it didn't. But like that energy was like so ripe and it just did so well. So I'm looking at with my girlfriend at these different YouTube videos and then we had one from the last couple months and I could just tell it was kind of forced. And I was like trying to find ways in which to create the content that just was alive. And then something interesting happened, right? I was like, we were talking about it, getting all heady thinking about it. At the very end, I went to a video that I was on my friend's podcast, Know Thyself. Train Andre, and we just click on that for a second. And a second clicking on it, there's this aliveness and energy, and I'm like, that's the 5 energy. Yeah, that's the 5 energy right there. So what's funny is it's like, I'm glad that the last thing we looked at was like not even from my YouTube channel, it was a conversation with someone else.

Yeah.

And when I go on podcasts, it brings out a different, a different energy. Even being here with you right now and kind of rapid back and forth in these different concepts brings out a very different level of energy than when I'm just focused on forcing content out. So a big barometer for me is like just paying attention to the energy and even asking people like, where does my energy light up the most? Like when you speak about certain things, I can see a passion. Like when we were talking the other night, we were looking at our businesses and like, where's the fives? And you started talking about your men's retreats and you were like, I guess so. You were just like, yeah, I just, I can't give these up though. I just love these so much. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I would do it for free. Yeah. You know, I'm like, That's the level 5 energy, you know? And I think that for some people that are maybe watching this, have like friends, like other— sometimes we're in the bottle, we don't see it, but like other friends can see when you start talking about something, you're kind of monotone and then all of a sudden you light up and you're just in it. It's like, what's that? Yeah, that's your, that's your light. Like, that's the thing you love doing, you know? Like with Anna, like there's things that Anna loves, like putting together experiences. She loves curating things for people. She loves aesthetic, like like she just gets into this energy where like you could see it. It's like, oh, it's so obvious, you know? And then for you, you have that same version for you, you know? But it's like, become aware of it for you. Use other friends and reflections to help you become aware of what it is, because they sometimes can see it when we can't.

Yeah.

But also like, where— look at— like, I'm spoiled because I have 8 years of YouTube videos out there. I can see this. And funny enough, the videos that do the best are the videos where I'm in most flow and I'm having the most fun. On my friend's pod— I've been on my friend's podcast twice. Both his episodes got over 500,000 views, which for his channel and at the time especially was like way more than, you know, his account's grown a lot. But like they did well because it pulls out an energy that I just love.

Yeah.

You know?

Yeah.

So it's like, how can I recreate that? And even being here with you today, it's like making me aware that this kind of style is just so effortless. Like we don't have, you know, we were going to pull questions from like the audience and shit. Like we don't— we don't have to do that. You know, do you—

have you dug into the Gene Keys? Do you know much about the Gene Keys?

I do know some.

I'd be really curious to know what your Gene Key profile is because mine is very much around the creative side of things. And in one of the particular Gene Keys that I have, it talks about freshness is one of the keys to my creative genius. Things need to feel fresh and like numbness is the inverse of that. So when things feel numb and I'm not really inspired by anything, like creativity just kind of dies. So it's like what you're saying is true. It's like, Finding what feels fresh right now. That's why I love, I started by asking you like, what's fresh for you in your life? Because that's usually where the inspiration is. It's like, oh, like this recent insight that I had or this breakthrough that I had. Like if you try and talk about an insight from last year, it doesn't have that same fresh energy because you've already processed it and integrated and all of that. So that's a good reminder for me because with content, especially in my niche, like I've boxed myself into this relationship space. And there's sometimes this pressure like that I need to be making content always about relationships.

But what if that's not where the inspiration is today?

What if the freshness isn't there. Yeah. And just like having the courage to just share what's alive right now, that, that is a huge thread for me. And yeah, I appreciate you sharing that because like that—

I remember there was a— when I was sharing with you yesterday, the day before, we were kind of talking about the energy. Like, I go live on Instagram a lot, and when I go live on Instagram, I said like one of the first things I talk about is the thing that's fresh on my mind that's like a new concept. And then I'm kind of bobbing and weaving to express a certain concept.

Yeah.

And for 2 or 3 videos, I might talk about a similar concept. And I'm kind of like almost like people at a comedy show that like do comedy. They might try out different jokes, different ways to see how they get it to land. I kind of do that with concepts.

Yeah.

You know, but I could tell there was like a light bulb for you and I was like, this is how you— definitely, this is how you like, you just talk about what's fresh and you're like, oh, you could just do that. I'm like, yeah. Like, you know, I was telling you, I think like I was realizing that I'm more myself, you know, when I'm, when I'm at home alone, I give myself permission to be myself. And the people you're around the most are the people like that you enjoy being around the most, are the people that are the— that you allow yourself to be yourself the most around. And then you might go out in public and say that you're drained around people.

Yeah, that's big.

But part of the reason you might be drained is because you're literally not giving yourself permission to actually express the real you. So a lot of it might be not just that there's certain people that you're around that like you resonate with at a deep level, which is part of it, but part of it is can you give yourself more permission to be the real you when you're in public? then you might find that you're not so drained in public. But there's a lot of pressure when you have— so that idea I shared on Instagram the other day, and it like, you know, it was—

it totally resonates. Yeah, it's in essence like, where are you just blocking the flow of energy, right? Like, where are you contracting or closing down? Yeah, you know, and so I really like that. I think, yeah, I resonate with that a lot because it's like, you know, you sometimes say that like, oh, like, I'm not— you know, I need to be on my own a lot. What is that? Is that just you closing down your energy when you're in a space with people that you don't want to be around? Can you still be open in all that that.

Um, I feel like you're a very community-focused person. Yeah, like you're around people a lot, which I think is cool. Yeah, I think one of the interesting things about being with Anna is that Anna is so community-focused. She's so— she has so many friends, she's so community-focused. And I've always been kind of like a lone wolf. I have friends, but it's like I've always been like doing my own thing and then just very like, very like mindful of my energy and not really doing many social things. And then I have a couple of really close friends I'm around a lot. But with Anna, what's been interesting is like tapping into that more social side where I like actually push myself to like, just through being around her, like being around more friends. And it's been very like meaningful, you know? Well, one thing I noticed about you too is that like you are a very community person around a lot of people. And I feel like that's like something to be, you know, it's something to be aware of, like where that edge is for some people, like breaking out of the box or their story about themselves.

But Definitely.

Also where you find like enrichment, you know what I mean?

Yeah, I mean, it's been interesting, bro. 'Cause like a couple of years ago I went the other way where I was like fully lone wolf, not really hanging out with any friends. And I just, even though on paper everything was great in my life, something felt off. I wasn't having the most fun. And it wasn't until I started to prioritize brotherhood again and going back to playing sport, hanging out with the boys, like that spark, that joy just came back into my life. I'm like, ah, okay, this is number one important to me, being around the right people. So no matter where I go, decide to live, like community, being around friends is the highest priority. It actually trumps the environment. I could be in the, I could be in the middle of the desert. If I'm around the boys, around good people, let's go. This is epic. So for me, that becomes now the highest value for where I'm deciding to move and my decision-making. So it's like being around, living with some of my best friends this year has been a huge, I've lived with my best friends in Toronto, lived here with some of my best friends. We're all still doing business and stuff together, but I've got this beautiful outlet where there's a lot of play, a lot of play happening. So yeah, man, I think a lot of people who run businesses neglect that, especially men. They just think I need to just—

Yeah, because the focus becomes on the outcome, the success, what it means, the success means, the safety that comes with that. But then they eventually realize they don't have as many people to share that with.

Yeah, or fun. Like, this is the thing, are you enjoying the process? 'Cause if you're not, I would say—

What's the point?

Yeah.

What's the point? So yeah, that's been a big epiphany for me. And then realizing that I changed my story around like, can I give myself more permission to be myself around these like new acquaintances, new friends, like stuff like that. That's been a very interesting like thought experiment for me that's allowed me to actually feel more free because I'm starting to question my old beliefs because people that are empaths that can feel other people's energies, a common thing they do is they develop a story that like they're drained around other people. The thing is though, one of the reasons they're drained around other people is because of who they think they need to be for the other people that causes the draining. So if they think they need to ease tension, that is draining. If they think that they need to please the other person, that is draining. If they think they can't be their true selves, that is draining. So a big epiphany for them is to actually embrace being their true selves, being authentic. And as they start to lean into that tension, they might realize, I can be around more people. It completely changes the energy.

This is why this year has been huge for me, because that was me for a time. I had this story that like I was limited in how much time I could spend around other people because it would drain my energy.

Yeah.

So I was living with like 4 guys in Toronto. 2 of them were DJs, fully extroverted, just like always. Yeah. Out like very expressive and I was called myself an introvert and I was like, dude, I need breaks from these guys, what the hell? But what I found was all the little ways that I was not sharing what I felt or thinking that I need to be this certain way around them. And the greatest growth was like just dropping myself in an environment where I got to see all these ways that I was maybe resisting tension, blocking tension, thinking that to avoid the situation. So I think if an empath's listening to that, calls himself a trainee, go live with some other people, drop yourself in an environment where you're confronted.

Yeah, like with that, like the thing you're most avoiding is actually the thing that will actually allow you to help. The key is letting people be in tension, letting them maybe not agree with you on something.

Yeah, that's it.

Now, yes, you know, and then being aware of where the stories come up, because the challenge, the challenge with empaths too is very often there's the codependency triangle. There's the perpetrator, the victim, and the rescuer.

Yeah.

And a lot of times empaths will identify with being either the victim or the rescuer. So what happens is there's a lot of burden there. You know what I mean? There's like a lot of like powerlessness almost. But what happens is the perpetrator's always the other people. But the problem is if that energy is subconscious, you continue to create perpetrators everywhere you go. You know, when in fact it might not be, it might just be you like expressing yourself and that tension that you, if someone else feels is their thing to manage, not yours. That becomes, you know, the fear is that you're gonna become a perpetrator if you cause other people to feel tension because you express the real you, when in fact it's more so you're just being real. Like, you can get out of that triangle by actually embracing the thing you're afraid to become.

Yeah.

You know?

Yeah.

Because otherwise you keep enabling that over and over again, you know?

Yeah. I feel like the theme of kind of this conversation, a whole overarching conversation, is like, how much more real can you be? Yeah. How expressed and comfortable with being in tension to allow this sense of neutrality with everything, right? That tension's not bad. It's just—

tension's not bad, tension is good.

Yeah, there's that— the shaman who was at Anna's retreat, the transformational tension, and he was— yep, I really like that. Yeah, you know, there has to be some transformation. You have to be in some level of tension for growth.

Yep. And most of us are just trying to avoid it.

Yeah, why would we label it as bad? Why would we judge the tension? Yeah, it's Beautiful.

Even in relationship, even as things come up, it's like, oh, oh, this is wrong, gotta go to do this. Like, no, this tension is like what allows you to go deeper into your own shadow and to all the places you're not loving yourself, etc.

Big time. Big time. Yeah, mate. Anything you think you want to kind of leave the audience with before we, before we close out? Anything that you think's top of mind that you want to share before we, before we tie a bow on this?

I think that there's just a general, um, a general understanding that like when you make yourself of service something greater than yourself and you're really committed to like learning all the ways in which reality reflects back to you more of yourself. Like, like I was watching, you know, it's funny, I had my birthday a couple of days ago and I've been going through this process of like kind of contemplating death, which sounds like, like really exaggerated and intense. But I was watching these videos of like these old people that were like basically going to die soon that were just sharing their wisdom.

Them.

And I just thought it was so fascinating. There was this one woman that was just such magnetic energy, and she was like talking about how she's like in her inner child energy now as like a 96-year-old. And it was like really inspiring to watch. But she was talking about how like we're all like, we're in a body and like everyone's a reflection and like you are you and I am me.

Yeah.

But we're also similar but different. And, you know, I think like often we get stuck in our stories of believing that reality is happening to us. And all of that without realizing that, like, at our core, I believe we're eternal spiritual beings having temporary human experiences. And we came here to have these kind of experiences with each other.

Yeah.

And all of this transformational tension that we're talking about is things that at a deeper level we came here to learn. And part of the learning lesson is actually absorbing it, is accepting it, is becoming aware of the stories that are on autopilot, trying to be worthy, trying not to be worthy, trying to fix, like, all questioning these things. And then accepting ourselves is I think one of the biggest epiphanies of this last year for me. Choosing to be vulnerable, choosing to accept ourselves is like one of the biggest, most empowering insights I found.

Yeah, man, I love that.

So I'd be curious for you as well, like what are—

Yeah, I mean, I think for me, when I reflect on this journey of unfolding deeper into the awareness of who I really am with the knowing of I'll never really get there in this physical reality, but it's like the idea of like we're getting closer, we're expanding towards it. Was that there is constant change. Yep. Cycles and seasons to living that are far beyond our control.

Right.

Even though we think we're in control of what's happening, we're really not. Yep. And I reflected on all the years that I've been aware of that process is like, yeah, there's seasons to everything. There's a time in the year where the tension is usually the most intense.

Right.

It's a time in that year where usually I will fall back into old ways.

Yep.

Trying to fix, solve, or avoid certain things. And the more, What I see as wisdom is catching those things sooner and sooner and sooner by acknowledging, hey, cool, like there's a time in my business where money's flowing in and everything's like sweet. Same as my relationship. There's time in the year where the relationships flow and everything's sweet, but there will be a time where it's hard, where like the tension's there and I'm like, shit, what's like, what's happening? Like things aren't aligned anymore or this, I'm going in a different direction. Like anticipate it. It's gonna happen. It's called fucking evolution in life. The tree, the leaves fall off the trees in winter, but they come back in summer. So like when the leaves have fallen off my trees, off my tree, How do I respond during that time? Right. You freak out? Yeah, yeah. Or do I just allow it, like honor the process? I love that. That's a huge thing for me and I'm taking that into next year.