Why Men Stop Leading in Marriage | The Truth About Emotional Connection

Like, I'm always the one that's the instigator, and I got to this place where I was like, why doesn't he instigate?

We are 25 years together, 23 years married, 5 kids and a grandchild. Well, my friends, welcome to another episode of the Date Your Wife podcast. My name is Garrett J White. We're here with my beautiful wife, Danielle K White. And author of the book God Is My Ghostwriter. Audiobook just came out.

Audiobook just dropped. I actually was listening to it this morning, and it's like kind of hard for me to listen to because I feel like I'm like reliving the past in a way. And I'm like, oh, I remember that, that was sad. Oh, I remember that, that was hard. Oh, I remember that, that was fun. But then it also like has appreciation for like, gosh, I guess I— this is a good story, you know. I mean, hopefully people find it a good story, but I just it's like, it's kind of hard to listen to. And it was very hard to actually record an audiobook. If you've never recorded an audiobook, it sucks. But I feel like 90% of people nowadays listen to audio. So I know I do. I don't, I don't remember the last time I sat down and actually read a book.

So, well, it's like, like this podcast. I mean, number of you guys here listening to this, how many times you watch this on YouTube versus actually just listening to it in a podcast? Right. Audio's like, like the game. Well, in the spirit of audio, let's talk about the book for a second because, um, I wouldn't say you were a liar, but I might go as far as to say you were a hider.

A liar or a hider?

No, not a liar, a hider.

You know what's so funny? When you read the book for the first time, you were kind of like, I had no idea that's how you felt. And I was like, really? We were living in the same story, which goes to show that you can be living in the same story and have two totally different realities.

Listen, I mean, let's talk about the hider. By the way, I'm not saying I don't hide.

I don't— that's the thing is like when you say that, I'm like, Really? I don't feel like I was hiding. You were in the same story.

But I was in the story, but I was not in the feelings of you, like your feelings in the story. That's why when I read the book with you, when you got your first publisher copies and we were laying in bed reading it chapter by chapter, I was—

You were shocked?

Emotional, and I was shocked. I don't think I understood—

What part were you shocked in?

The first 10 chapters.

There's only 12 in there.

Well, it was all 10 of the 12 chapters. Is there really only 12 chapters?

Pretty sure there's 12.

OK, well, it wasn't the 10 then. It was probably the first 5 or 6.

Yeah. What were you shocked about?

You never— either I couldn't hear it, which is possible.

Which is still a possibility.

OK, true. And if that's the case and I still didn't hear it because I couldn't hear it, I had no idea. Like, we didn't communicate. When we were first married, we talked a lot. But there was a lot of mystery behind your actual feelings. I think most people don't actually know how you feel most of the time.

Do they need to know how I feel most of the time?

Obviously not. But I'm just saying, like, I can't, like, it's hard for me. If you kind of know where I'm at all the time, you can be around you for a while and not really know where you're at.

Well, I'm like, as I'm listening to the book this morning, there's like a few chapters I'm like, that's sad. And I talk about how in, you know, the culture that we were raised in, raised in Utah, raised Mormon, it was like, you're not allowed, and probably in a lot of Christian faiths and communities, it's like you're not allowed to air your dirty laundry. You're not, if you're sad, like, suck it up. And I would imagine that women feel this too. It's like, don't show your, emotions. You got to be strong for the kids. Men probably feel this way too. And so you just kind of go through life being like, I can't share my feelings because I got to be the strong one. And I express it in more detail inside, inside the book that it's like there was even periods where I felt like I was carrying you, like when you broke your Achilles tendon for the second time. I— there's this part where I'm like, now I found myself being not only the caregiver to my children and my husband, but also a provider in our family. And I'm like, man, that was a lot for a 20-something-year-old, you know, like—

How old were you at the time?

I think I was like 28, maybe.

So 2011 would have been what? What? Let's see, 2011 would put us at like 20. No. How long ago was that?

I don't remember. I just remember it was like right when we moved to Arizona. And I think I was like 28.

28 years old. That's a lot.

This was a lot.

That's a lot. Like, what do you think it is that kept Is it because you were naive and you were just young and you just didn't know any different? Do you think that's what kept you in the game with me?

What kept me in the game with you? Yeah.

Like, I mean, between 2009 and 2015, I mean, there was— that was a gauntlet. That was a gauntlet of time.

Well, I've shared this before. Like, I'm like, you should never stay in a relationship just for your kids. But on the flip side, you should absolutely try to stay in your relationship for the kids. So for me, I looked at it— it's like I didn't feel like I was in, like, some scary, abusive relationship. And so I was like, okay, well, whether, and I've shared this before too, whether you think you're the villain in the relationship or your husband's the asshole, you still played a role inside of him being a reactive asshole or whatever it is. And so for me, I'm like, okay, I would rather figure out why. And again, I shared in the book, I'm like, I couldn't figure out why I was resentful. I couldn't figure out why I wasn't physically attracted to you for a period. I couldn't figure it out because I wasn't allowed to talk and communicate to anybody else. Yeah, you know, or at least that was my narrative or my story. And so it just got to this place of kind of like not numbness, but it was just like, this is what you do. I didn't question it, you know, it was just like, this is what we do. Until I was like, you know, I feel like I should want to work on myself in our relationship. And so that's what really what kept me in it is just like trying to figure out myself, I guess.

I think about it, you were a year older than Parker. Our son, I mean, you were 28 at the time. Parker was 27.

Yeah.

Not married, no kids. Yeah. You were married and had 2 kids.

I was married, 2 kids. We had financially lost, like, grown it and lost everything. Then we moved out. We moved to a completely different state. We were starting over. It was just— it's a lot for a 20-year-old, 28-year-old.

Sometimes I sit back and I think, wow, like, I mean, imagine how different— I mean, just imagine for a second, like, if you and I had gotten divorced during that period of time, Charlie and I, that wouldn't be here.

Mm-hmm.

You'd have gone on to be with somebody else. You've been married to someone else for like 10+ years.

Yeah. Well, yeah, like I would have still been— I still would have been like, yeah, like in my late 20s.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I'd been married to somebody totally different. Who knows? Maybe I'd divorce again. I don't even know. Like, I just— it's weird when I sit back and think about the number of crucial moments and conversations where anything that we were doing could have gone left. Maybe we kept going right, but we could have gone left. I got a lot of people are taking the left right now.

Yeah, it's weird. It's— I do think in 2025 was like a year of everybody was finally exposed, and now everybody in 2026 is like, well, here I am. It's like nobody wanted to admit the changes that were happening in the marketplace, whether you're a millionaire or a billionaire or whatever it is. Like, nobody— everybody was like scrambling last year, like, what's gonna work, what's gonna not? It was literally the year of throw shit at the wall and see what lands. And obviously there's a lot of people that have been in the game long enough that they can kind of, you know, conservatively navigate. But I think this year was— this year is the year of like a lot of people being like, okay, I'm a little bit— I'm a little bit exposed here. There's a lot of like really big businessmen that I had followed and met throughout our podcast and things like that that I'm like, they had like, you know, millions and millions of followers and they're like, I'm starting a new account. I'm like, because your first account was a fake account. Like, it's just like so much change happened last year that it's kind of an interesting year. And I'm sure that leaves— anytime there's a change like that, it challenges couples.

Yeah.

You know, like we went— when we lost everything, that's when we had our first, like, do we want to stay married? You know, and even this last year has been tough for us. Like, even as long as we've been married, it kind of shakes the foundation a little bit. You know, I'd like to say that we're a lot more evolved than we were 15 years ago. So even though it's shaky, we're like, okay, what do we gotta do?

We went, I mean, if you look at the last 18 months, I mean, you had an inclination to the pressure that I was carrying and made the decision or gave us the inclination to make a decision to leave Southern California and move to Miami. And then I got here to Miami and and rocked and locked with Grant and 10X and the group. And what was supposed to become a place for us to go find space and a new game, and we thought we'd live north somewhere up in Boca or Palm Beach or somewhere.

Started going hyperspeed.

We came into Miami. And I completely doubled down again and went 10X to the 10X I was already going. And that pushed us to a place. And it was interesting to get to a place where the house, the cars, the money, the game that we had built, and yet last spring, you know, spring of 2025, like you were, you were questioning. I think you were questioning things before I was even questioning things.

Mhm.

Like, what were you questioning at that time? Because we got here and it was like we'd left the house in California and we got out here to a totally different side of the country, totally different community.

I think it was like almost like it wasn't like I was questioning things. I just was like, okay, we came out here, we're kind of, we're like a little bit off gear a little bit. And so it was just kind of recap. I just like didn't feel like myself, you know. And there was a lot of change. I moved all my kids out here. We became grandparents this year, like, and we had toddlers