EP 101: Can Punishment Actually INCREASE Good Behaviour?

I've got something to mention. It's kind of like the— it's a bit of a theme from last week. You know where they're doing those crazy videos where someone's done something, so someone's overlaid a video peppering that person, and then someone's overlaid a video peppering that person that's peppering that person. It's absolutely fucking wild, and I've got no respect for it.

No.

Even though I've got some respect for the people doing it, but not the actual activity. But I was thinking, like, can you imagine if we took time out of our day to piss and moan about all the trainers that people come here and tell us about? I know. I'm like, I honestly don't care. It might have been a bad fit personality-wise. It might not have been fucking whatever. Like, who gives a fuck? Fuck off. Fuck.

There isn't a dog trainer on the planet that is immune to have that happen to them.

Of course not.

Like, we have trained people's dogs who have worked with, like, really great trainers that we massively respect, like the biggest of big names. Yeah, like, when we— and, and I mean the biggest of big names, and we don't go, we must be better than them.

No, no, that's a full pecker thing to do. Absolute peckers.

And they're— like I said, there isn't a trainer, us included, right? And we know this because of— we meet all these people. Every person sat in that hall right there has tried, like, well, 90% of them, we've got the data, have tried at least 2 trainers before.

Yep.

Right? There's no one immune to it. No, it's gonna happen to you, it's gonna happen to the next trainer, it's gonna happen to the, the, the best trainers on the absolute planet, 100%, because if you've got— well, there's so many considerations there is, uh, personalities, as you've said. Yeah, obviously the human being itself is a major factor. So when the trainer takes the dog and goes, oh, look at me, I can train the dog. Yeah, great, but it doesn't matter if you can train them.

No.

Yeah, yeah, it doesn't matter if the dog is good for you. No, um, it doesn't. There are other things like we might say, oh, you, you—

I feel awful just to interject, just because she's walking past. The other day I had to— she had two dogs So I had to grab one of them. I hate taking the fucking lead because the dog was sound. I didn't do anything, but he was just like, oh, okay, I'm with someone else. I'm not going to do the thing contextually. So it's like, that shows me that it's a shit idea for me to take the lead, like right in that moment. Yeah, stupid.

Thick. And then other considerations, like we might say, yeah, I think you should use an e-collar with that dog. And that person's like, no, I'm not going to use any collar with the dog. Okay then, see you later. Yep.

Right.

Whatever, whatever. It doesn't work out between us. They go to the next dog trainer. Yep. That dog trainer says, I think you should use an e-collar with the dog. And that person then goes, oh, it's the second person that's told me this now.

Of course.

Yeah. No, goes to another trainer. Third trainer, I think you should use an e-collar to try and solve your lurcher's prey reactivity. Hmm, you're on to something here.

Yeah.

Okay, fuck it, I'm going to use an e-collar. Solve the problem.

You're not going to go back to the—

dog trainer is the dog. The dog trainer that solved that person's problem. And the other two are consequently shit dog trainers, which also isn't the case.

Yeah, but again, it's like an ego thing as well, isn't it? It's like the dick swinging thing that you get there a lot. But it's like, if a dog— I remember back in the day, not so much at the moment, I can't remember a recent example, but we had a couple of dogs that went to a different company and I was bitter about it because of the specific company it was, but that's a different story. But the dogs did all right and I'm like, fucking, you know what, brilliant. Yeah, fine. If they've got their problem fixed and they're cracking on with the dog and the dog's not put down, fucking don't care. Yeah, well done. I'll give you a fucking— I might think you're a knob, but the dog's life's better.

Yeah, 100%. It'd be really easy. I think people just like love a bit of drama, so it makes like good content for people. Yeah, but yeah, imagine like for every person in, we just slagged every single dog trainer that they've all been through.

Was that back in the day when I played sport? I'd be like, oh, me putting on social media, ah, you missed a tackle today and there's a try scored.

I didn't.

Would be weird. It'd be really so weird.

To go and just call out like someone on another team and it would be like, oh, what a knob, what a knob.

You'd get rinsed.

You'd get serious third-hand embarrassment.

Yeah.

Like just witnessing that.

Yeah.

And I do with dog trainers online, to be fair. I watch them and how they behave and—

Yeah. It's a little bit, um—

Yeah.

Yeah, anyway.

There's a couple of bad ones for it. They do a lot of those stitches, they're called, I believe. Stitches.

Oh yeah, stitching. Stitches. Stitch-ups. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Just again, it just provides a bit of controversy, which is just a, which is a bit fueled by social standing.

And I've seen one trainer, I don't even know if she's— I've said she now, that cuts out a few others, but I don't know if— I don't think I've seen her do anything else other than stitch videos and be like—

Yeah, I know the one you're on about. Yeah, doesn't actually train dogs, just stitches videos.

I'm not that aware, but yeah, but like some and it's kind of exciting content because it might be a resource guide or something, and it's like, oh, should this dog ever be allowed in society?

Yeah.

And yeah, all right, I get this, gonna get a few waaahs and fucking likes and shares and shit, but like, well, what are you actually doing about it?

No, nothing. Just take already viral content, put their face over the top of it so they piggyback off that virality, therefore then gives them an inflated social status of followers.

Yeah.

And then the The assumption is then made that social status correlates with being a good dog trainer.

Yeah, and then they just put it down anyway.

True.

So put it down or put on a load of drugs, put a load on drugs and then put it down. Yeah, sadies.

They can't all be as good as the same, mate. That's what it sounds like we're saying.

No, not at all.

Obviously, well, so we won't say that. But what we'll do is we'll throw a link in the description with all our case studies, testimonials, proven record of training dogs. Yeah, that's all we can really do, right?

Yeah.

And it's all it really should be based on.

Yeah, but how many, um, how many guns did you have in your pocket when you asked them to record it?

Yeah, that's true.

Yeah, they look— they'll look like they're sweating.

I offer $1 million for every positive review.

Yeah, I heard that. You got big pockets in that. Deep ones. Yeah, deep as fuck. Here you go.

How are you for 6 grand in cash for leaving us a testimonial? Yeah, we got a few. We'd be fairly out of pocket, right?

I think we might be. Yeah, it would be a decent business model. Yeah, so fucked up there, isn't it?

Sexual favors, however, we'll do them until the cows come home.

Yeah, suck a dick. Yeah, we've been there before, haven't we, on the podcast?

We've been there plenty of times.

Don't know if it made into the podcast because a lot was trimmed out.

No, but is this—

was it last week?

Happily will suck a dick for a 5-star review should someone want it. Yeah, if they won't do it out of kindness, but just don't tell Google because that could be incentive. The spunk in the back of our throat could be an aversive.

You don't know, do you? It's in the eye of the receiver.

You don't know until you try it.

Anyway, it started off dog training-ish, didn't it?

We were doing so well. Yeah, I think, I think that can stay in. I think that, I think that can stay in. Yeah. Yes. Any more about dog training or trainers or the trainersphere?

Um, no, not really. I just feel like it's going more pear-shaped in that sense.

Dragon. Yeah, I think they've always kind of done it.

Yeah, I do. Maybe I'm just noticing it more, or maybe it's just they're becoming more aggressive. It was the one where there was the 3-video thing that absolutely blew my mind.

The one on top of each other, like a human centipede of reels.

It was like someone peppering someone who saw someone else peppered to someone peppering there as someone. My mind is now blown. And the dude was just trying to have a dig as well. He was just like, he wasn't an evil bloke, he was just— maybe he got something slightly wrong, or in someone's opinion he was slightly wrong, and he was just attacking him.

I'm just like, fuck off. Hey, probably not guilty of that in the past, to be fair, but I like to think I've grown up somewhat.

I think you have. Yeah, you used to be a right little bitch.

Fair enough. I just can't be arsed.

No, that's the thing, you cannot be arsed.

Yeah, and it's like, it's gonna— this is gonna sound nobbady, but like, you don't ever receive shit from above, it only ever comes from below.

Yeah.

And when you reciprocate such shit, all you do is shine a light on below.

Yeah.

And therefore do someone else a favor.

You're shining a short— a short— you're shining a torch on shit.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So if like someone went and like bagged us out and we went and responded publicly, all it's going to do is take a lot of our audience, which we work very hard for. Yeah, you have to take your clothes off for.

We had to suck a lot of dick for.

Yeah, to the point we have permanent tonsillitis like Owen.

Give it to someone else.

Yeah, which they frankly don't deserve.

Yeah, they've not— how many cocks have they sucked?

Yeah, yeah, sorry, sorry. I bet Uh, almost no cocks.

No.

Um, so yeah, there you go.

Yeah, all right.

I was going to lead on something else, but it's just vacated Da's brain. Oh, we got a big, um, graduate group.

Yeah, a big one.

55 dogs are coming.

Yeah, that should be good.

And it was put in the calendar fairly late too. There was only a couple of weeks notice.

I know.

The next one, there'll be plenty of notice.

Yeah, we're gonna go bigger. Oh, we still get some golds.

Probably.

We don't want to cause too much.

I think it's going to be fine. I'm actually raw-dogging it in Topfield solo, naked.

Yeah, there was a mention of mankinis in, in the meet, in a WhatsApp group somewhere.

So there was, yeah. I think that's a youth thing, right? Is it?

Yeah. I mean, I ain't got one of them, but I can wear my budgies.

You could wear the tent that's falling down up there. You're that big. You'd look like a giant, um, Achilles, but instead of your Achilles, it's your spine or your knee or something.

Probably both.

Fair enough. So yeah, we get to catch up with some graduates and some former students.

That'll actually be nice, won't it? I hope some people who turn up—

by the time this podcast is out, we'll already have some footage.

Yeah, yeah. But even regardless of footage, it'll actually just be nice to see the people and dogs who've, you know, from 6 to 12 months ago.

Yeah.

And they're killing it.

And right now, as we talk, what we'll do is we'll throw up some of those messages in the graduate WhatsApp group that we've been receiving recently. There they are. There's a lady and a horse and a dog. That was cool. There's a sausage dog, and there's a bunch of people that have messaged us how good their lives is— is ours. Yeah, lives ours. And that's what we call a circle jerk. That's what we call a Marilyn Manson, I believe. Yeah, took out two ribs to suck himself off, in case you didn't know. So was the rumor.

Must require some serious spinal mobility as well, to be fair.

I actually, um, gave it a go in the office the other day, clothes.

I saw. And if I didn't have an average penis, like, or if you had a giant penis—

no, if I had a giant penis, yeah, I wouldn't have to be giant, just have to just decent size, below average. You just have to be fucking, you know, more than a half an inch, and then I'd probably get somewhere.

A one-half inch.

I'll do it now if you want me to.

Sausage salad. No tail.

Yeah, a nub tail. Yeah, is that intentional or not?

I don't know. For what?

Sorry, Jesus Christ. Holy Jesus Christ. Can we— where'd you find him from?

I thought it's— what is it these days? Gen fucking—

what is he, a gen fucking What are you?

Gen pop, probably. Z.

What? Susie? A boomer.

Yeah, I don't know.

Are you a boomer?

I was just created. I was never really born. I was just manufactured in a very average factory.

No, you weren't. Bob fucked Sue and then Sue pushed you out.

Yeah, I've got a Rita as a dog and I got a Bob and a Sue as my mum and dad, so Rita, Sue, and Bob too. Seen the movie?

No, we'll pop it up here.

Oh, really? It's kind of a timeless classic, but it's meant to be awful.

Is there any intention behind the naming of— No? Probably not Bob and Sue, but maybe the dog?

Yeah, maybe. I didn't name her though. She came as rear.

So not maybe then, no.

Well, not from me, but it could have been from the other person. I can't speak for them.

Yeah, but how the fuck did the other person know they're gonna give that dog out for adoption to someone with parents called Bob and Sue?

Granted, but they might have had parents called Bob and Sue. Could be a really elaborate plan. Like not much return, and maybe none because they'd never find out.

English movie film knowledge, we'll never know. But hopefully this dog one day goes to someone with a Bob and a Sue.

Yeah, fucking hell, that's a fairly tenuous link, isn't it?

Really bottom of the barrel stuff, aren't they?

Oh, Sam said there's tiramisu in the fridge for us.

From who?

Uh, Kelly, I think. It's been left here a while, but it's still in date apparently.

Purchase tiramisu or man-made?

Purchased, I believe.

Do you want, do you want to eat it?

I'll take a bit.

Where is it from? We gotta have a look where it's from, Lucas. Let's have a little—

if we tried it before, where is my tiramisu from?

Oh yeah, ask what happened to its tail.

Size of the guy. What size of the guy, eh?

Yeah, a big, big bloke. Yeah, how about I'm just fucking raw dogging and stealing some crates from him? Just taking him out the car park, put him into his van, start screwing him in. Screwed him on it. He just laughed in my face. Did he even come out with words?

No, he would— he'd have been so terrified he wouldn't be able to speak.

Yeah, it was funny.

It was funny.

God bless him. God bless him.

It's a great bloke.

Yeah, I like him.

Waitrose, you see?

I don't think we have done a Waitrose. Do you mind just going to get us a couple of spoons?

We never done a Waitrose. I thought we'd done Waitrose. No, we have done a version of Waitrose. It was the one with the weird base, wasn't it? Was Waitrose not the really cheesy one? No.

No, that was a specially built.

Yeah, it was a special order.

Just two spoons there, young man.

Dick spoons.

Oh yeah. Ideally with big wooden shafts attached. I know something we need to discuss.

Okay.

We sent out some feedback forms from our graduates yesterday.

Oh, we did, yeah, because we are not afraid of feedback. No, in fact, if anything, we embrace it. Maybe I shouldn't say that on here because people might really rip into us.

Yeah, fuck them.

Yeah, I'm fairly—

I don't think they would have got this far.

No, no.

Chloe's calling me podgy earlier, mate, and now I'm a bit self-conscious. Now I don't know about the tiramisu, but Don't listen to that fucker. I know, but she was poking at my bits.

Poke her fucking legs and that then.

All right. Fat knees.

No, it's okay, look, use your foot. You got 4 spoons here? Yeah, I picked up 2 spoons. Old Timothy 4 spoons.

Who's eating this tiramisu? General Grievous? You know the guy, Ping. Yeah, hold tight, hold tight.

Oh, very nice. Yeah, don't tell me I can't handle two packs at the same time. Yeah, I know, one hand as well. That's probably a unique skill.

Yeah, 100%. There's not many blokes or chicks, maybe your sister, to be fair, she looks like she's got big hands.

Yeah.

There's no way this ASMR does to Kelly what her feet do to me, mate. They make— like, I'm off the tiramisu instantly just by fucking saying it. They make me— by the thought of it, there's no chance she washes. No chance she washes. Think about it.

Well, when she stayed up here the whole time, there was no Evidence of her cleaning herself. Yeah.

I'll get the feet up again. And then what we're gonna do is we're gonna walk through a field when it rains with our bare foot.

Yep.

And we're gonna compare feet pics.

Oh, they'll be exponentially more clean.

Yeah.

But we probably should prove it. Okay.

It's giving Orbit feet. It's pretty good, this, to be fair, mate.

It's alright, isn't it? It's quite— the base is strong, isn't it? Yeah, like whatever the, um, the stuff there is, the gear. Carol's cheesecake was great.

Did I get finished off? No. All right.

I think I, um, I think I kind of verbally said it to you at the time, but maybe not with a number.

It can't go on the tiramisu scale though.

No. I mean, it was a knockoff of obviously what I invented.

Yeah.

So it's just the only points I would detract is for it being a knockoff.

Copyright issues.

Yeah, copyright infringement. Yeah. Other than that, fucking great. I give it like a 8.5 on the cheesecake scale.

You like sticky toffee pudding?

Yeah.

No, yeah, who doesn't?

Yeah, she's making you sticky toffee pudding now.

Oh nice, that's amazing, isn't it?

She watched the podcast or she just—

she just loves cooking.

She's retired.

Um, ice cream custard or what? Cream?

Sorry?

With the sticky toffee.

Ice cream custard. Is it all? Is that all?

Am I speaking a different fucking Fuck, it might as well be.

Giant Gangantrunk.

Sticky toffee pudding.

You know those giant people have like mad deep voices. Anyway, anyone else in the world do that to you? Yeah, you would fucking— you would Incredible Hulk them and take them by the foot and just—

beauty guard. Anyway, go on, ask your question. Sticky toffee pudding, are you having to complement it ice cream, cream, or custard? Or a combination of any of those.

Uh, is it heated or not, the pudding?

It's up to you. You could determine if you want.

If it's heated, I'll go ice cream, please.

Oh, nice.

I like the contrast.

If it's cold?

Uh, not ice cream.

No?

Maybe warm custard.

Interesting.

How about warm pudding and warm custard?

Yeah. No, too warm then. Sweaty. Now, yeah, maybe. Yeah, ask me that.

Climate-based desserts. Yeah, desserts based on—

winter's a bit crap in it comparatively to summer.

Yeah. Do you know what I miss? And I've only ever had it once. That Kraft— what the fuck is it called? The Eton Mess that wasn't Eton Mess was like Kraft Mess or something. Do you remember? Yeah, Kraft and Mess. Remember when I had a wobbler because I couldn't find the car park?

Oh, you had a serious wobbler too, and you were really— it was an elongated wobbler and all.

Fucking bastard. There was a lot going on at that time though.

Does he always get a light over there?

Okay, just checking. Is it blinding you?

No, you're just in the pale seat, I think.

I'm in a pale seat.

Fucking hope that one over there fucking blasts you with pale light. You look like Count Dracula on drugs.

Sorry, what else then?

What else then?

What?

What were we just talking about?

Value to the—

we slagged off other dog trainers. No, we didn't talk about dessert. No, we didn't.

We didn't slag anyone off.

We called them all nasty.

Yes, that's different.

Why are they so nasty to each other? I don't know, they all upset each other.

They do, they do.

They all, they all get the saddies from it. Yeah, they need to stop it. Yeah, just concentrate your own shit.

I got Coco on my quad. Yeah, just go and help a few dogs out on that.

Yeah, put your leash where your Instagram reel is.

Yeah, nice.

Get on a t-shirt.

Why is he laughing? That was pretty good.

No, I'm gonna put that on the store.

Do this.

Yeah, nice. All right, fair enough.

All right, what else then?

What else then?

What are we doing next week?

Got a decent-sized booty next week.

Big boot camp.

All right, a few changes we've got off the back of the feedback. We've made some changes. Yeah, we've implemented those changes. So I've been implemented today. Yep. Um, some will be implemented more next week, but always looking for those little tiny improvements. Some of actually fairly wholesale changes, so it might be big differences, hopefully for the better. Yeah, and not that we go, ah, this is why we didn't do that.

Bollocks.

Yeah, yeah, that would be—

what changes? Because we can say it now because it will have happened.

Um, a couple of changes to the back end of the week, so we're going to make time for some short individual-based stuff where we take people off and do that, which we kind of do now, but more in terms of like finding out what exactly what they need, making sure that they are well au fait with ways to reach us in the future should they need to. Obviously, we want them to go away fixed, but there's blips in life, isn't it?

Yes.

So we want to make sure they're very well informed of how they can get in touch with us and make sure that they're smooth going forwards. And I believe afternoon tea is on the cards at some point Thursday afternoon. Scones or scones?

Uh, fuck, I don't know whether I've ever said it. This could be the first time. Scone.

Yeah, definitely, mate. Nice. Yeah, you like a scone though, don't you? I've seen you with them ones when Tony's mum makes them, really go. Yeah, put them away, don't you?

Oh, with the cream and strawberries? Yeah, yeah, fuck, I have loads of them. And they're like Bruce Bogtrotter, just covered in the stuff.

Yeah, I have to try incredibly hard like not to eat anything sweet too early, otherwise the seal's broken and I just go hard all day then.

Maybe you're like 7 foot 2 and 150-odd kilos, you just eat way more.

Well, doesn't mean I should.

Imagine if Sam ate what you ate. He looked like Danny DeVito. He looked like Fortuna Plump or whatever the fuck they're called when she turns into a giant blueberry. We should swap what you two eat for a day.

Yeah, we should. He said to me the other day he's never seen me eat.

No, the only thing I've seen you do. Yeah, mostly, mostly chalky.

Yeah, a lot of chocolate, you know. It's nice, isn't it? I did a thing the other day, you know, when we were filming reels. Yeah.

Is Kirky offsite or is he around? And my way of telling was to go see if the air fryer was on.

Yeah, yeah, nice.

Air fryer's on, goujons are warm.

Excuse me, what happened to his tail? Her tail?

She was born that way.

Are you joking? Yeah, she was born without a tail.

Oh, crazy. She was the only one, bless her. Our friends breed them but nobody wanted her.

No tail.

Ah, shit.

Well, there you go. You got her now.

There she is, look. Brilliant. Thank you.

You're welcome.

She's very talkative on Monday, that dog. Oh yeah, very talkative on Tuesday, that dog. A little less talkative on Wednesday, that dog. And now quiet.

Look, no, shut the fuck up.

Must be shut down.

Must be.

It's got the saddies and the depressies.

Yep. Its tail's doing that though.

Nah, that just means arousal.

Fair enough, fair enough.

It's a bit like when your tail twitches, it means you're aroused, right?

Yeah. See, it's all it means.

It's the only thing it means.

The only thing. The only thing.

It's just an indicator, mate.

Okay. What else? Uh, what were we just talking about? When?

Just now.

Just now. Eating.

Doesn't sound right.

He's nibbling.

You gonna get another dog soon?

No.

That was, there's almost like you preemptively thought about it.

I thought about it a lot, yeah.

I mean, you thought about getting one and then just persuaded yourself not to.

Yeah. Not until I'm in a very big house.

Okay.

We're going away a lot and it's hard enough to find someone to look after your fucking 3 dogs, never mind more. Yeah, it's shit.

Really is.

So, what we'll do, once you've sorted out this fucking whole malarkey of going around the world opening dog schools—

And when you do. Yeah, what will it be? Rescue or a specific breed?

Oh no, definitely get a rescue.

Or a Ponchon? Or rescue? Bobby, would you get a specific rescue breed?

Yeah, um, I think with the like amount of dogs we get offered in this place, it'll probably just be one of those that you fall upon. Yeah, fall upon, like a, you know, a flea bite situation or something. Probably just happens, doesn't it? Yeah, you can kind of get a vibe whether it'll fit with your group or not.

Yeah, that's true.

So not really, fair enough. Yeah, not thought about it too much. I'd really like a cattle dog, but it's purely off aesthetics. I've said that before.

Yeah, they're aesthetically cool as fuck, aren't they? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I don't even know him too well. I've only met a few, but Rip's cool.

I had a, um, I was gonna say a call with earlier on, but it wasn't with him, it was with his, um Human. You're not allowed to say owner, you know.

He works here.

You're not allowed to say owner, are you?

No. Guardian.

What day is it? Friday?

Yeah.

Parental, um, advocator or something.

Wouldn't mind a girlfriend for Stark, like a Sheila, just to walk around in the garden.

Yeah, hover Walt. Yeah, hover Walt.

I don't know, they look like cattle dog.

Yeah, nah, they're more like, um without sounding offensive to Hovawarts, because I imagine they've got like a society of Hovawartians, but it's kind of like a big retriever, like a heavy-boned retriever, but they're a guardian breed. Oh, okay.

Um, what about them? You want one of them?

No, I just— it was really interesting. I think I've only spoke to one or seen one before. I said to the lady, I was like— because she didn't have the camera on and the call— I was like, do you mind popping it on so I can have a look at the big fella there? She was happy to oblige, which was good.

Have you seen the Kangal?

Yeah, that's big.

Yeah, they're crazy.

What wouldn't you get one of them?

Yeah, they came in on boot camp where we saw your video. You said don't get one, here he is.

Fair enough. Okay, people act like we're really severely gonna judge them.

I know.

Yeah, and we couldn't give less of a fuck. I know we shouldn't have, but we got two dogs. All right, we've got two dogs.

Yeah, from littermates.

Yeah, should we try and train them now?

It's like Benno's got two Malis now.

Yeah, yeah, picture of Benno with his two Malis up here.

I've not heard of him.

I've heard of him like mummies. You've not heard of him since? No, I like to think he went out that day and just went down to Bradford and got a two-hour car boot.

Yeah.

Yes, bro, you got two of these melon floats or what?

Yeah, throw them back at UPS vans. Yeah, you could put a couple of crates in there, couldn't he? Yeah, easy. Or maybe not.

It might actually help this whole getting robbed situation.

Yeah, probably would too.

John Wick. Yeah, let's get a picture of Benno up here and his two John Wick melon flutes defending his UPS man, please.

Yeah, that'd be amazing. It probably happened by now, so it's not even really AI, it's just like a— yeah, remember them police robots that weren't AI but it was just like a, like, you know, it's like it's actual thing. Yeah, happened.

It's just a mock-up, just a reincarnation, a reenactment.

Yeah, yeah, nice.

Yeah, yeah, nice. So yeah, the picture we're showing here is a legit real-life picture. It's not—

Frederick, man, look.

Yep. Um, yeah, any other dogs you wouldn't get?

I don't really know.

All right, aren't they?

Yeah, I used to, I used to be, um, I wouldn't say against, but you know, like we were just talking about a minute ago, weren't we? Like your Romany rescue types or your Macedonian rescue types. And yet I've like, I've got along with all the ones we've had recently.

They're quite funny. Actually, Three-Legged Murph, they just kind of had this look like, picture of Three-Legged Murph. I don't want to be, uh, yeah, look, you don't want to be training me. Can we just meet in the middle?

And yeah, let's just agree to disagree.

Shall we sit in the garden all day? I don't, I'm not bothered, but it's fine. Stop trying to make me do shit I don't want to do.

Yeah, because I'll resource guard it.

I will guard the dishwasher. Are you even looking at that dishwasher? I'll fuck you up.

Yeah, all right.

Well, you do— you need to take it that far? No, but bored because I was running around the streets and I put me in a flat.

Yeah, I gotta find something to do and I've at least got to pretend to be edgy. I was actually fine. Yeah, yeah, but yeah, you know, the presumption is I'm gonna be an edgy fucker.

So if you're reading Facebook groups, and here we are. Okay, yeah, Facebook groups are a funny place, aren't they, for dog advice? Yeah, like really crazy.

Yeah.

I see some wacky, wacky crazy shit on there.

Yeah, but I mean, yeah. Oh, we— are we allowed to say we're thinking about the, um, Galápagos Island creature? Oh, the Arctic, you know, the fucking biscuits.

Anyone? Do you know?

I wanna pick up a pick up a Penguin.

What about penguin?

Jesus, Tiddy, fucking—

you know what I mean.

What do you mean no?

I don't know.

The thing, Nicole, we had the other day with the—

oh, about the—

oh, is that still—

no, probably, probably still under wraps.

Fair enough. We can leave that bit in though, because you just said it. Yeah, fair enough.

So how many people listen to this? About 12, right? Per episode across the different platforms. Each one maybe gets like 1,000 on the tube, right? Yeah, yeah. And then maybe like 2,000, like 2,000. All right, any other—

what about Apple?

Does it go on there?

I don't know, that's weird.

I heard it's like hundreds of thousands.

Yeah, Apple I think is 1,000 to 200,000.

Yeah, incomparably.

Hey, what, 3,000 people are listening to this? Thank you, by the way. Yeah, that you are listening to it, like kudos.

I don't really tell why.

Just leave us a comment. You're all so inconspicuous. Just comment just right now. I guess they're probably busy when you're doing it and listening to a podcast. Crazy.

So Kelly listens in the car, does she?

Why? She knows us. She gets to listen to this shit all the time.

Yeah, but you'd never know if you just— there's a possibility. That's the magic of it, isn't it? It's the gamble. The magic of the possibility of missing out on just a little bit of something.

A little snippet of golden bollocks.

And then they get to the end and they're like, oh, that one was shit again. Oh, and then in about 6 episodes' time, they'll be like, oh, fuck, that was good. And then it just keeps them going for the rest of the year. That's kind of right, I think. It's like, you know, jackpot theory. Although that's not even necessarily a proven thing in dogs, but—

Oh really? No, I feel like it could be. Not proven, but I feel like it could be.

I heard an interesting term the other day. In fact, Christ, here we are. Look, this dog—

Can we not talk about sucking dicks instead?

We can suck a dick afterwards if you want.

Brilliant. All right, so I'm in.

You'll like this. Yeah, you'll understand it straight away. Theoretically, reinforcement cannot reduce a behavior. Yeah, but practically it can.

Uh, yeah.

And the same with punishment. So theoretically, punishment can increase the likelihood of a behavior, but practically it can, although that one's a little bit more difficult because it's going to increase the likelihood of a different behavior.

Oh, gotcha.

All right, I mean, yeah, so you— we can't just necessarily say black and white that reinforcement can reduce chances of behavior.

So give us an example, like a really easy one.

All right, so if I'm teach— if the behavior is recall, right, and my dog won't recall because of squirrels Yeah, I take squirrels off the table with punishment, therefore my recall is more likely to happen as a result.

Okay, and conversely, if I recall my dog in the presence of a squirrel and sting him pretty high for non-response, I could reduce the behavior of chasing squirrels. Yes. Yeah, fair enough. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I guess it— yeah, it's all a bit of a waffle, isn't it, really? Yeah, the whole operant conditioning thing.

Exactly. That's why you can't just—

yeah. Yeah, because I always say like, um, um, if a dog is lunging, barking, and growling at me—

yep—

because I've got a walking stick—

yeah—

and I hit it with a walking stick and validate its response to bark, lunge, and growl, like, I could stop it barking, lunging, and growling then, but it could bark, lunge, and growl more in the future because it's now upped its emotional response. What's that count as? Because I'm adding to something to increase something, but it is a negative, an aversive stimuli. And although, yeah, what— or B.F. Skinner didn't necessarily say it has to be a piece of— is that right?

Yeah.

Or aversive. It just says it has to be—

yeah, like, yeah, but yeah, yeah. But also, he was—

you would never consider that positive reinforcement, would you?

No, in a Skinner box. So like they probably weren't.

I'm more into like the voodoo and witches stuff nowadays anyway, mate.

Yeah, well, that didn't work out too well for me.

Um, no, I didn't at all.

But yeah, like obviously in Skinner Box there is no other options to happen, so you could never have that practical sense of punishment increasing something else or reinforcement decreasing, could you? Because there's nothing else to do.

Nope.

Which is probably why it looked like a black and white thing for him at some point.

Yeah, okay. No, I mean, he's dead now anyway, isn't he?

Don't know. I imagine so.

I think probably long dead. Yeah.

Damn.

Does anyone ever really die?

Not— no, not if you're as spiritual as I am nowadays.

Exactly. Here's Luke. He's from Macedonia, that guy.

Yeah, he's cute, isn't he? Yeah, Rufus.

He was really keen, so we did some like practice earlier on of passing stuff over the top of him. He was really keen on a Cadbury's Roses. I kind of wanted to give him one just because he's been such a good boy.

I know, isn't it? You know what, chocolate's a sad thing because it's one of the best things in the world, and when I'm there, I'm eating it, I'm like, and my dogs just sat there there. Yeah, thinking, why, why can't I? And I can't say it could potentially kill you.

I think the chances are really low as well if it's just like Cadbury's. I know it's not really cocoa in it, is it? No, white chocolate would be fine with it, wouldn't it?

Yeah, apparently. I mean, take that with a pinch of salt if you're listening, but yeah, yeah, take any fucking— any of this shit with a pinch of salt, I guess.

Yeah, literally sometimes, because you can get salted chocolate these days. Yeah.

Sheila loves Harry Balls and chicken skin, but she does shit herself afterwards. Yeah, remember that time we secretly fed her a load of shit chicken skin and then she shat all over a young man's car?

It's funny, innit?

It was great because she enjoyed it. Yeah, I don't know whether she probably enjoyed shitting through the eye of a needle.

Probably should have been two bollards.

I think if you're— do you know what, but to be fair, like, it's only bad when you're a human, you gotta rush to a toilet. When you're a dog, you just go anywhere. It's not bad. Yeah, you just fucking spray it all over your dad's car. It's like I need shit. Oh yeah, done. Shit. And like, do they ever need a poo? Because if they can just poo. Yeah. Stark's shat in here twice in the last week and the bungalow. Once in the bungalow, once in there, once in here.

What?

No, mate, he gets up in the morning. Yeah, gets up in the morning, the first thing he does when he goes in the garden, just trying to find his ball ball.

So loves his ball. Yeah.

And then finds a ball, and then, then he realizes, oh, Dad's here, and he gets excited, so he comes back in. I try and like shoo him back out and I do poo poo, do poo poo, I go do poo poo. And he goes, no, I'm too excited. And I'm like, oh, he does like a quick wee and then he'll come back in. I'm like, right, promise you don't eat poo poo. And he's like, no, I don't eat poo poo. And then I'll jump in the shower and I'll come back out, there's a big steaming shit in the house. Here he's really bad for it. Yeah, he was just—

it's a tough one in here though.

But then to be fair, to be fair to him He took himself outside today for a shit and chat behind Alex's car. He was like kind of on his car, it was weird.

I picked one up from outside Alex's car door last week. Was that Mark?

That would have been stuck.

Yeah, yeah, he's not keen on the Mercedes. No, fair enough.

So, you know, yeah, anyone got any toilet training tips, just give us a shout. Yeah, that's funny, isn't it? It's funny, I'm like, Stucky, that's poo poo in the house, and he's like, cleaners will get it.

With an adult dog then, would you, would you ever fucking tell him he's a bad boy for that?

No, no, I can't.

I like him too much.

Yeah, no, it's only a quick poo poo, it's not my fault. I should just let him out.

I can't tell Bumble off for anything.

If some people watch me with my dogs, they'd be like, you're not a dog trainer. Yeah, you can't be.

The only thing I've ever like stopped Bumble doing was fucking up the robot lawnmower because I thought if he flips it, he'll muller his face up. Yeah, so I'm like, you can't do that, that's, that's a terrible idea. See, only— and he looked at me like, oh, what do you mean? You know that martingale collar he's got? Yeah, I literally went, that's bad, you knob.

The last time I stopped my dogs doing anything was probably Ranger at the swans.

Yeah, fair enough, that was fairly key as well.

Um, and then Diles with sheep as well, to be fair.

Yeah, fair enough.

Mark's now an escape artist.

Yeah, he's pretty good at getting out of here and the bungalow. He can open doors and that, so— and that door, he can go— it's like Houdini gets through that lock.

He pushed it off its hinge last night. Not its hinge, the nail that stops the door.

That's good. So once they've done it once, yeah, fine.

Yeah, yeah. So he's really good at making friends with other doggies though. Yeah, he's really good at diffusing situations. He's just like— he's like you and that guy that sent like funny emails, but then when you actually met him, you really liked him.

Yeah.

And then he's like that, but dog form. He's just really good at diffusing. I've seen him like— when I used to have other like spicy dogs in the house, I've seen him like spicy dogs. And they're like, fuck, is this guy doing it? They're like, are we? He's like, fuck, I don't think we are.

He's like, what do you say?

Remember really spicy? Yeah. Um, Malinois, like, backtied to a table, and Stark was like lying on the sofa, and he would just start like looking at her and going And she was like fuming and then like tilted her head a little bit and I was like, I'm just gonna fucking let this play out. And he like ended up like slinking off the thing and like crawling over to it, but like crawling like really appeasive on his side. And then next minute they were just frolicking around the fucking house. She never, never interact with the dog ever. It's just really good at like just teasing it out of them. He's just such a Fucking flirt. So anyway, when he does get loose, he's pretty good at defusing situations. The fucking man-eating dog. He just— he gets a good read of the room, to be fair.

Yeah, fair enough.

So yeah, fair enough.

Okay. Yeah, well, it's the value of a decent Stoogeman as well, I suppose. A rehabilitated dog.

He's all right.

Good boy, isn't he?

Level of sociability directly inversely correlates with level of control you need over your animal. I don't mean sociability as in hypersociability. I mean like social as in I am able to navigate social situations. Yeah, do you know what I mean? Yeah, like you can have a dog that I think can— I believe this to be true— take a look at another dog and go, that dog does not want to be interacted with, and skirt.

Yeah.

And you can give that dog quite a high level of liberation because of like, obviously make good choices. But conversely, you take a dog that isn't good socially, yeah, that might need to be compromised with higher levels of control initially. Do you know what I mean?

Yeah, I do. Yeah.

And so Maybe I never needed to train that dog. It was all unnecessary. Or maybe the training contributed to his level of sociability.

You'll never know.

We'll fucking never know. Yeah, do you know what I mean?

Yeah.

Oh no, I'll just go fuck myself.

Yeah, no, I was just thinking, I was mulling it over in my brain. As opposed to—

you've met probably people in the past that are just like, yeah, I don't ever take this dog out on a lead. Like, he he's— they think he's like super well behaved, which I guess he is, or like super well trained. Yeah, they're not really, they're just like— there's an element of luck that they're just like sociable and can read the room a little bit.

Yeah, yeah.

So can be off leash a lot. Yeah, sometimes actually with the right dog that can be taught by just like being really loose with the puppy. Again, this isn't advice. The puppy gets like chinned by the right dog, plays with the right— the couple dogs. Yeah, learn something.

That could happen by chance. Yeah.

You know what, when they kind of stare at me like that and they make them sort of noises and their body looks like that, I'm probably gonna swerve it.

Yeah, yeah.

But when they do it, then—

shaka-khan.

Yeah, shaka-khan.

Yeah, the bag's not bad at that, to be fair.

Yeah, yeah. Melon Mars, mate, they're clever. Yeah, man, flirts.

He's really good at throwing them on the back foot as well, you know. If a dog goes at him, yeah, he's really good at like jumping back and throwing fuck off, but not actually.

Yeah, really good at it.

He's good back foot fighter, like. Although also, Roman found out he's a fairly good front fighter, so yeah, fair enough. But that was fair. Yeah, yeah. Roman found out Bumble's pretty good front foot fighter as well.

He's probably just getting fucking starting fights and getting his ass whooped.

Yeah, yeah, by Flea. Me and Bumble.

Yeah, fair enough. All right, let's wrap her up. Yeah, yeah, I think so. Yeah, anything else?

No?

Any inputs?

Yeah, okay, good.

Just let you sit on that one. Uh, all right, we'll see you in the next episode. This episode 101.

Is it? Yeah, like the dog. We should have got a Dalmatian.

Oh, fuck's sake, that would have been good.

What was she called? Fraggle? Yeah, she wasn't called Fraggle. What was she called? Freckle, the mad loud one.

That was a crazy, uh, Sugar Plum.

Sugar Plum, yeah.

And Puddle Duck.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

What was the third one gonna be called? Sugar Plum, Puddle Duck, and—

oh, fucking hell, Sugar Plum was one of the loudest dogs I've ever heard.

That, that Daxi this week wasn't far off.

No, just didn't have quite the lung capacity of Shugs. So yeah, I'm a bit gutted we didn't get one. Can we just like AI some into the background, just floating around?

100%, 100%, mate.

I think, um, yeah, that would make sense.

All right then, 55 dogs would be a lot.

Yeah, you got it though.

Yeah, we got it.

You got it.

We've definitely got it.

Yeah, you got this. I've seen you train dogs, mate.

We as a collective have got it.

You got it.

All right, put the shot there of me getting it, please, Suze.

Getting it.

Copy?

Ping that up there. And—

Oh, you'd get it.

I'm understanding the assignment.

You'll get it.

I'm not gonna touch a single leash. Do you know why, mate?

'Cause you're not a knob. Do you know what?

You don't need to.

This, I'll finish on this. Can I finish on this?

Mm-hmm.

Something I'd never thought of. So for us, taking the lead deprives them of the experience and all that kind of stuff and going through the stressful period with the dog. And obviously like it teaches them that we can train the dog and they can't. A lady on a feedback call the other day said, in the past trainers have taken the lead off her and it just fucking feels like belittling and, They feel like shit. I never really thought about that.

Here, let me show you how to do it.

Yeah. Oh look, the dog's fine, it can do it.

Yeah, you're like you trying to read from a teleprompter and then me pushing you off the seat and then going, look, this is how you do it, and then just getting off again.

Yeah, yeah.

So I couldn't think of anything else that I'm good at other than reading off a teleprompter.

Fair enough, we've all got a niches. Yeah, yeah, fair enough. Yeah. So yeah, don't belittle your fucking clients by taking the leads off you jerk-off.

Unless you've got a really big penis and you're big and hard and massive cock and you're just so much of a bloke and you drive a big black van full of fucking power tools and Malinois. Yeah, you've got 4 Malinois and they're called Apache Helicopter and Glock 42. Yeah.

Assault rifle, and James.

And James is a rescue, and he was— he killed his last 3 owners. You big penis.

It's not a huge stretch from the truth, is it? Anyway, yeah, fair enough. Anyway, yeah, don't take the lead off him.

Right, buy in.