EP 94: Did We Sell Our Souls to Social Media? (Handling Internet Trolls)

How are you?

How's your backwards cap, mate?

Do you think I need to swap around?

Can we get a third mic and a third chair for Val at some point? Valerie, why won't you come on over, Valerie? We're too good at singing, we might get copyright infringed on this.

Yeah, we might. I'm pretty good.

I'm gonna—

you're gonna go with it too? Yeah, it's a different day.

Where's our wine today, mate?

It's just day off, mate. Went for a little hike with the little doggies.

Did he? Where'd he go?

Well, I say hike, you're in Stainburn Forest. It's pretty nice though, you should go there. Do you remember that time I joined the staff meeting and I was doing a lot of management actually at the time? Yep, that's where I was then.

Yeah, did you ever find out what sport Michelle did?

No, I can't remember, but she's fucking— she's a fucking unit, like in a good unit way.

Yeah, very physically— physically capable. Ask her. She must do, uh, javelin.

I don't know, lacrosse. Yeah, I don't know, hurling. What are you doing here, mate?

Just getting a tertiary mic for Van V. No. Oh, it's in the B&B. Oh, come on. Are you gonna help me set up the web— webinar? Is that a Maggie job?

You want me to do it?

What? Set the webinar up? Yeah, I heard you can, to be fair.

Pretty good these days. Although I heard— this is a true story— I went into Aspen—

I don't believe anything that starts with "although I heard." Well, no, I overheard.

It wasn't like I heard it from someone. I literally heard it with my own ears. I walked in the room to ask Chloe a question while she was on a call. Yeah, give me a fucking thumbs up for whatever it was. As I walked off, she was like, oh yeah, we're sending those two to Perth, but they're the most technological. I actually went back and went, hold on, hang on a minute, I wrote a web app the other day.

No, we're not technical logical, we're logistical.

Yeah. You ask us to— it's organizational, because actually logistically, you tell me to go somewhere, I'll get there. Probably, unless it involves an airplane and I leave my passport on the scanner again.

Yeah, you did do that, Jacob Morgan.

In which case, might not get there. But that's an organizational thing. I was at the plane ready.

Yep.

Could have gone on it, could have flown. Turns out they require you to have things like passports.

We're a week out from flying down under. Are we?

A week and a day.

All right, 8 days out.

8 days out.

A, uh, you gotta get a Mongolian week.

You gotta get the big one, um, you're gonna get the big W tomorrow.

Yeah, I know, let's talk about rugby league instead. So, um, yeah, that'll be popular.

Rugby league and canards. Might be some caffeine. You usually have caffeine before you play, right? So it's topical.

Yeah, but I can tell a funny story.

Go on then.

Pulled up to training on Wednesday.

Yeah.

Unfortunately, the games had to be brought forward, mate. Something to do with the other team or pitch or some shit. I don't fucking know.

Okay.

Right. Um, pull up to training.

Is it a double header again? Because there was—

No, I think no.

Fair enough.

So I don't know.

You can let me fucking Yeah, she's thinking about it.

She's called active listening apparently.

I need your laptop for audio. You can try.

Is that mine? No, that's his. Alright, I'll carry on the story while you do that then, mate. Yeah. Hide your passport— password. Blue123.

It's not far, it's actually not far off that.

Yeah, if anyone wants to steal any of my shit, Ranger1. There you go. Could have guessed it, right? Pull up to training, he knocks the window, he's like, does it down. All right, all right, Coach. He's like, yeah, game's been moved forward, I'll be, I'll be stuck in work. Do you think, do you think possibly, do you think possibly there's any chance at all that maybe— and then as soon as that word left his mouth, I said yes. He would be honored. So it's your official coaching debut.

Yeah, I only got to do one half though, right? I probably don't have to—

in the shed, in the dugout, yeah, managing players you have no idea who they are.

Should I write like a proper Spartilian speech for the—

please do, like, uh, or an Al Pacino, any given— was it Any Given Sunday? The game's about angels. In fact, do it.

Angels are all around us, and you know, if you're not willing to fight 'For that extra inch, then fuck you!' Or something like that.

I would be willing to fight for an extra inch.

I'd kill for an extra inch. I'd pay a lot of money for it.

How did you double me?

It's 100% increase. It's priceless.

Oh fuck, they're trying to train dogs over there. Well, we're trying to podcast.

Yeah, but the triangle, it's not like—

Yeah, that's true. Pass me these, we'll do our sponsors real quick. Want yourself a Lamborghini? You want to go hit, uh, Maddo up at 2211 VIP. He'll get you a Lamborghini for the price of a Vauxhall Corsa. Don't quote me on that, but it'll be close.

Yeah, I tried to do it, couldn't fit in the Lambo, so I just stuck with the Transit.

Or alternatively, if you would like a giant wooden shaft, a veiny triumphant bastard Did I see his leg? Yes, I think you might have done.

Broken his leg even?

Yes.

So I don't know if that's gonna— he probably could make himself a new leg. That's a great point from Lukas.

Yeah, nice. At least a splint. Yeah, a peg leg like a pirate.

A walking stick afterwards, probably made out of blackthorn.

Interesting fact.

Interesting story behind that.

We'll come on to in just a second. So yeah, the canine carpenter currently just on the one leg at the moment, but I'm sure as hell bet that guy can do on one leg what most can do on two. And if not, I'm sure he'll sort himself out of a wooden pegging one, pegging leg.

And I hope he gets better soon.

Yeah, get well soon, CeCe.

It's really inconvenient breaking a leg.

I've not done it. I'm gonna touch some wood, touch some laminate, hope I hope not to.

I broke mine in France.

Well, that is an inconvenient place to break your leg.

It really was. The med care was—

Le break.

I can only describe it as like what I would imagine a World War II field hospital would have been like. I didn't fit in the ambulance.

Not bad.

So I had to drive there.

With your feet out, with your feet out. Big fucking— like they've caught a giant.

Yeah, I basically got taken to hospital in a Ford Escort.

Le giant, le giant. Little fucking snapping pickies and that.

Yeah, with those big flashes they just go—

ah fuck!

Like magnesium pop-ups?

Yeah, nice. That's funny.

And then had to fly home with the fucker. That was a bit of a—

how'd you manage that?

Well interestingly they wouldn't let me go in the exit seat where there's more room and my leg wouldn't have been in considerable pain for 3 and a half hours on account of you've got to be able-bodied to sit in an exit seat so you could exit. I'm like, if we go down in a plane, yeah, do they want the one-legged guy fucking—

think about it though.

Yeah, I'm getting to that, aren't I?

On one leg.

Plus, if you've gone down in a plane, there's a chance there's a few more floating broken legs.

Who do you think you are, the canine carpenter?

Yeah, well, think about it. Where there's a will or motivation, there's a way.

Yeah, that's very true. That's very, very true. Yeah, you went, uh, viral last week for your first time.

First viral video.

Yeah, like 100,000 likes on Facebook or something.

Create— I basically created COVID last week.

And I was— a lot of my mentees struggle with—

it was more the dog. All right, but, but fine.

Owen had a puppy in his as well. Yeah, there you go. He's got a giant nose, to be fair.

Yeah. All right.

A lot of my mentees struggle with like putting themselves out there and like would be scared to go viral.

Yeah.

So I thought we'd talk about your experience, your first experience of going viral and how that affected your mental health.

I didn't even really know. Uh, but yeah, it's fine. Yeah, yeah, I assume like obviously there's some stuff you can cop a bit of shit for in there. Like if we start, I don't know, there's a few tool posts and stuff like that, you could cop a bit for that. You're not going to cop much for— even if the information that young Lucas gave us was incorrect, you might cop a bit and they might say actually Staffies were never nanny dogs. Um, that's about as good again. Even if it was something else where I said pronghorns are amazing, fuck you with your fucking halties.

That's Lex Rangers.

Is it? Brilliant.

There you go. I presume you copped a fair bit of abuse playing rugby at some point.

Yeah.

Should we talk about that?

Yeah. Like on Twitter and that, you just get fucking hammered.

Twitter's ruthless.

Yeah, Twitter's— Don't go on Twitter. Yeah, it's racist as fuck and they'll just get stuck into you. But then on the flip side of it, like obviously with the funny incidents that happened to me where I got completely sparked out and stretched it off, there was like two versions of people. So like even, even like opposing fans, like there was some that were like, look, he got fucking knocked out, like, but then other people from their own fans would spray them and be like, come on, mate.

Yeah, come on, that's not nice.

No.

So there's a little bit of that. The best ones was, um, Salford's own old ground. Do you play the Willows?

In the cage?

Yeah, yeah. So like on the cage, on the way out, they'd fuck it all in the way and then sling pennies through the crate. So that was pretty good. But then like when you, you know, when you're taking, waiting for a kickoff You used to get fucking rinsed on the back. Yeah, on the backpack. Rent boy, fucking your mum's fucking whatever. I don't really ever take it any to heart. It was like funny because normally we're up by a lot, by 40, so yeah, so no biggie. Yeah, fuck you, I'm a— but look at this goal line, bitch. Um, so yeah, cop to bear that. I suppose that's a bit more personal because it's actually in person.

But yeah, does it ever get to you?

Uh, no, I don't think so. Like, people like that would never have bothered me. But if my— if, um, if your teammates or whatever said you played shit or you let them down, oh, fuck me, that would cut deep. It'd be like you telling me now, mate, you fucked like, um, boot camp up this week or something. Like, what the fuck are you thinking? Yeah, putting those two pit bulls in there with no muzzles on and no training and just letting see what happened.

Daycare.

Yeah. So yeah, that obviously, like, there's certain people, and I think that's how it should be, isn't it? There's certain people who can say stuff to me. Like, there's a few people in our presence who actually count to me.

Yeah.

And then there's a lot, but the majority of people, strangers on the internet.

Okay. I was speaking to one of my mentees and they were like, oh, I don't want to be too markety because of like, I don't want other dog trainers to judge me.

And I was like, Yeah, you do. Yeah, you do. Hey, judge me. Yeah, you'd be, um, obviously like a few years ago you were like, I don't know, like one of the first to do it, but definitely one of the better people to jump into it. And you copped a fair bit early because you were one of the first people to— oh, you're selling your soul and you're doing that and training less dogs or whatever. Well, Look at me now, bitch. Yeah, are you training by proxy like way more dogs than anyone else? Yeah, directly not that many, but yeah, indirectly you're allowing exponentially more dogs to be trained than one-to-one. Yeah, fuck yeah.

Yeah, interesting, isn't it? Yeah, we get shit online all the time for like not being real dog trainers.

Do you know that?

Yeah, like, oh yeah, you're just a marketing company. I'm like, yeah. Bro, I genuinely don't think—

Those people over there, AI.

Yeah, they're holograms.

Yeah, look at them. That dog there, fake.

Yeah, we'll just throw a shot up here. We'll ping a shot up of, uh, one, the people here, they're real, and two, they are real, all the reactive dogs, or formerly reactive dogs, we just took to Roundhay Park.

Cosmo over there, look.

Truth be told, no, I don't train that many dogs anymore, but my God, does this place train some dogs.

Yeah, exactly. But it won't be able to train the number that it trains without you doing what you did.

Yeah, yeah, gotcha.

Do you know what I mean?

Selling my soul. Yeah, interesting.

Selling my soul.

Because there is a lot of like, oh well, I just only care about the dogs. And I'm like, yeah, yeah, but this is a means to an end. You understand that?

I said it to someone the other day and it was like, I count myself as the world's most fucking lucky dog trainer. Because you did what you did, I still get to be fairly hands-on, and the dogs are just almost brought to me. It's amazing.

The sun does a bit.

The sun does most of it.

When the weather's good, we don't need to do much marketing.

I just sit around twiddling my thumbs, looking around, scratching my head, trying to find some dogs to train. Yeah, but yeah, do I mean though, I said that literally to someone about like working joking our own dicks.

Do you think there are a school out there that trains as many dogs as we do on a weekly basis? Hard to say, innit?

Yeah, hard to say. Nah, probably not. Probably not.

It is a fair bunch. Like, I think you're like all the dogs that come to you on a Saturday as well, like a busy Saturday. Yeah, the group classes and yeah, puppy classes and, uh if you have a workshop on or a Kickstarter day on.

And yeah, fair volume starts to go full send, doesn't it?

Not to mention the mentees we then educate to them. Yeah, got 4 in this week. Yeah, they're doing their own thing.

Yeah, that's a good point, isn't it? You know what I mean?

So yeah, I don't know, it's a tricky one.

You've touched many a dog. Thou'st touch has touched many of them.

So yeah, don't care about what people on the internet think because of, um, you're stepping in your own way by giving too much of a fuck about like, yeah, putting yourself out there and stuff. And you can have a much bigger impact when you do.

I understand that it hits some people hard though, like being judged and fucking peppered all the time. Yeah, it's not for everyone.

Yeah, what I try and remind people is though, like, once someone puts their phone down, it vacates their brain. They don't care about it. Like, if you think about the last time you picked up your phone and had a little bit of a scroll, can you name like 3 of the reels you even saw on that scroll session? Nah, I bet no one listening can either. Do you know what I mean? That's how quickly it enters and vacates your brain. Yeah, probably one of ours.

Yeah, fair enough.

Yeah, spending a fair amount on ads at the moment. You can cop some shit doing that, you know, don't be fucking—

Oh, this shit again. I'm sick of me. Yeah, I'm genuinely sick of seeing—

I'm like, can I block this fucking guy?

Yeah, this guy, this guy.

Yeah, yeah, well, there you go. Got Valen from America, wherever she is. And she's over there, she's leaning against that post. She doesn't know she's coming on the podcast yet. She might not want to.

She will. Yeah.

Yeah, we'll get her on. What?

I don't think you can, although we probably pretty much forced my—

No, no, my fucking order didn't go fucking through.

Oh mate, oh you fuck, you let us down, mate.

I did, mate. I'm fucking doing it.

You're gonna have to do a pun.

It's doing it now. Oh, that's so annoying. It reckons it's gonna be here at 10 past to 20 past 3.

Alright, that's alright.

Yeah, that would be fine, wouldn't it?

You've only got your call at 4, have you?

Yep, a webinar at 4.

Webinar at 4, yeah, sorry.

A live webinar. I'll put, we've got a, we'll record the webinar, we'll put it in the description if you want to. It's for dog trainers if you're interested in. How we run the business and took over.

So long as you don't mind getting exponentially more busy and then getting peppered by little people on internets, it'll be fine.

Yeah, it's not a tiny people for you, little tiny borrower internet people.

If you don't want to be successful and then potentially cop in a bit, it's probably not for you.

Yeah, if you want to get in your own way and continually be a little pussy-ass bitch.

But if you want to— so I don't ever retort on any of our own stuff, you know, when people pepper us, I'm just like, whatever.

Well, I've got a case, a point to make about that, but go on.

But some of your mentees I saw that I follow, I saw one cop a bit, so I just started replying to him. I just fucking rinsed the guy. I was like, I'm ready for this, I'm gonna do it, I'm gonna get him. Yeah, I got him too. Amazing. He soon retracted his little turtleneck. Yeah, did he?

Yeah, they usually don't on the internet, they usually just—

yeah, he pacified it. Did he? Yeah, it was fair enough. I don't know what it was, but it was basically on about, um, something about prong, and I said like, regardless of whether whatever whatever, and some other shit, whatever whatever, and then—

Did you? I'm quite surprised at that, to be fair.

I was like, fucking there, just commenting away. No, I did, like, I saw it and I was like, nah, I won't do it, and he just left it there for like 20 minutes, and I was like, nah, fuck that guy, like, he 20 minutes. Yeah, it was a real— it wasn't 3 hours that you normally tell me to have before smashing the fuck out of someone.

Yeah, fair enough.

It was 20 minutes, but you weren't there to tell me to give it 3 hours, so look what happens.

Yeah, fair enough. Look what happens when you let a tiger out of the cage. Yeah, the advice I give in regards to trolls is like, a troll feeds off going back and forth, right?

Yeah.

As soon as you feed the troll, the troll grows. Yeah, it doesn't matter what you say back to it.

No, 100%. And so like, cut a fucking troll's head off, man.

Yeah, he's gonna die. Yeah, fair enough.

But yeah, you're right, it's most of the time it's unwise to give it.

Yeah, you just want— they just want more conflict, don't they? And if you just— oh, some fucking— I'm not even gonna mention, but some, some dog trainer that does this a lot with his face commented on one of our reels and tried to like correct us basically, and I just went like, great input, thanks for your comment, kiss kiss. Like, yeah, we'll bleep it out because there's no point. You just, you end up then sending all your, like, someone smaller than us, right? Yeah. And you end up giving them a voice by like replying to them. You end up telling your audience that they're worthwhile listening to as well.

Yeah, you know what I mean? Yeah.

And so they do it all the time. They're just trying to piggyback off shit.

Yeah, fair enough.

Yeah, just like, well, if I get into this with you and give you, you know, just one, I'm gonna give you what you want.

Listen, you tiny little man.

And, and then give you more of a voice.

Yeah, fair enough. Yeah, yeah. So they are a bit of a bit of like business advice for dog trainers, is there? Yeah, dog trainers might even listen to this.

Yeah. Should you delete it or not? That's a, that's another debate. If you delete it, you'll force them to another platform and like chase after you. So most of the time, just, just like it and move on.

Rigney likes a block, doesn't he? He likes himself. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Thing is though, like, a lot of dog trainers out there don't have like actual— this is not a swipe at all, but they don't have like actual businesses and shit. Yeah, it's like internet people.

Yeah.

Whereas like, we got an actual business with like a Google profile. There's nothing stopping like someone just fucking rinsing us on Google reviews, you know what I mean?

Yeah, we would hunt them down though for that. That's too far.

Yeah, shit, innit? But people have done it in the past.

Yeah, so I've seen a couple of fakies knocking around.

Yeah, someone just like, like, like watched a YouTube video once and was like, I use prong collars, I hate you. I'm gonna go, ah, I don't like your social media content.

That's probably a vegan, maybe.

Yeah, vegans love e-collars though, believe it or not.

Do they?

Yeah. Slow down.

Go on, explain.

I've just met loads of vegans that are into e-collars. Have you?

They're into them? Yeah, I'm into them. What are you into? Oh, e-collars.

E-collars and swinging.

Yeah, fair enough.

Brilliant. Whatever.

Alright, maybe I'm into vegans then.

Maybe. Maybe you would try some tofu.

Yeah.

What else we got to talk about, mate? I feel like that was quite helpful to dog owners, mate.

I just thought, what the fuck? Why is my fucking leg so uncomfortable?

You've got a prong in it.

There you go.

Speak of the devil.

Speak of the devil.

Speak of the devil itself.

Yeah. Yeah, what else then?

Fuck knows.

Yeah.

What else have we done this week? Dominating the rugby field tomorrow. Dominating another boot camp.

Did I already mention I wrote a web app thing?

No, you didn't, but you should tell them again.

Yeah, I wrote a web app to help my trainers with the weekly boot camp activities. It's pretty good. They can't believe I did it. In fact, some of them asked me how I did it.

Amazing how the turntables, huh, big fella?

Yeah, yeah. We're about to watch Pabs get eaten by a Rottweiler.

Oh nice, that's brilliant.

It really doesn't like him either.

His mouth's closed, it's gonna absolutely fucking lather him.

Look, don't do that while your head's next to the dog. Yeah, because of that.

Yeah.

Nice.

But wires are fucking tricky, aren't they? Yeah, they can be right knobs. They can be right don't tell me what to do knobs.

Yeah, that's the thing, isn't it?

No, if I want to fuck this guy up, I'll fuck this guy up.

No, you won't.

That's Pablo. Simão's leaving us. Did we discuss that? Yeah, he's going to Portugal, back, back home to the motherland.

Yeah, we might have to go for a, for a meal. I don't know, can you think of anywhere where we might go?

I don't know, somewhere nearby.

Somewhere close because obviously we'll probably go straight after work, maybe.

Yeah, somewhere close, somewhere where that allows dogs would be good.

Yeah, because we have a lot of those.

Somewhere that there's a— maybe some barbecue, like a barbecue.

Yeah, because like if you, if you, if there's any— if you can't finish your meal and you want to give your dog something, like they like barbecue food.

So I'm thinking maybe Hickory's. Hickory's, just down the road, just down the road, down there. You know, you ask me right now where Hickory's, I'd be like, what's that? Obviously it's down there, left, left.

That's a new inn though. The new inn's quite good too.

The new inn's pretty good, but they don't take cash, mate. No, Hickory's do take cash, which does make me judge them. And I mean, we, I mean, there's no reason why take, we don't need to pay cash.

No, no, it's like I've got a lot of it.

It's not like we're dealing drugs on the side.

Like the option. Yeah, true. It's more of like a principality thing. Although my dad said never die on your principles, but I like to die on my principles.

Yeah, I can see that. My principle is don't listen to other people's principles.

Fuck you, Bob.

Yeah, yeah, it's a bit of an oxymoron in a way, isn't it?

Yeah.

So yeah, that one sentence there is probably fucking Done a lot for you. Yeah, up there, good and bad maybe. Yeah, nice one, Bob.

Come on, Bob, man.

Nice one, Bob. So yeah, we'll go Hickory's, give Samo a bit of a send-off.

Yeah, and then we'll go again because he's, he's blossomed a bit recently. Yeah, he has.

He stepped up to the fucking plate, to be fair.

But Portugal may gain a decent dog trainer out of it.

Yep. And, uh, I'll our work here is done.

Yeah, and then you'll be touching more dogs.

We'll be touching even more.

We'll be fettling with more canines. What about the lady at the park today? That was interesting.

Yeah, it'd be great to get hold of that picture, wouldn't it?

I was an incredibly proud doggy dad, although my heart rate for the first 3 to 4 minutes was like—

You found and domesticated a dog. To be fair, this is 100% your hat. You know, in school when you could I can smell you, mate. Yeah, that's you, that. Yeah, but yeah, yeah, yeah.

So the first 3 to 4 minutes was a little erratic, a little chaotic, and my heart rate was high because he was just like, squirrel, squirrel, squirrel. Yeah, I just thought he was gonna piss the other dogs off.

No, he settled down pretty quick.

Yeah, he did.

He was a good boy.

Yeah, he did way better than I thought he would. He was a little too interested in the swans, but we fixed that.

Yep, I stuck an e-collar on Ranger for the first time. I used it.

Also the swan issue.

Also the swan issue. Don't do that. Yeah. Okay, fair enough.

Yeah, that was that. I don't think they caused any bother, did they?

No, not compared to last week. No.

Yeah, so I was pretty proud of the bag getting around there. Yeah, it was good.

And then we stayed for a wee fucking, what's it called, in halfway through the, not the cinema, the the theater.

Like an interlude, or—

Yeah, yeah, we had an interlude. We had an interlude and we're asked for a photo. Yeah, by a lady.

Yeah, and she was very respectful of the distance of the dogs.

Yeah, she also called them canines, which they are.

We found hilarious.

I think she meant K and a 9 though, didn't she? Yeah, as in like they were military spec dogs.

Oh, okay, got you.

I think.

Got you. Yeah, they could have been.

Yeah, there was Mark and Fleabag there.

Yeah, it might have been different if Bumble was there. Yeah, I mean, you got called a pit bull again.

That was funny, wasn't it?

That was funny. But yeah, she was very respectful, didn't want to come too close until we assured her it was okay. Yeah, a little closer, so just so that she can get you in the shot, because she wasn't convinced at first.

She got you in, which she did. Yeah, because I could see.

Yeah.

Even at a distance, she got us all in several times and then was like redoing it.

She was just really keen to do it.

For the record, people, this woman had fucking no idea who we were. It's not like it was a podcast fan or anything. It was just a completely coincidental Chinese tourist that wanted a photo with us and our dogs.

Yeah. There's some dogs there, look at it.

Yeah. Yeah. She's probably never seen a human your size before, to be fair.

Maybe.

It's probably about more you than anything else, but just is like trying to just dilute it a little bit by adding— Gachapon! Godzilla! Godzilla! No, fuck that, we're leaving that in. I think Godzilla's a Japanese thing, to be fair.

I've been listening to a lot of Japanese hip-hop recently.

You did, it was like, come straight on in the van as we were going back and I fucking—

you were bugging me.

Yeah, no, it was. Yeah, what else do you like? You like Japanese music, it's fucking— I've heard, seen you listen to a bit of classical. Oh yeah, Japanese hip-hop. Yep, the COD theme soundtrack. Yeah, sometimes COD soundtrack. What else?

I listen to quite a few soundtracks, to be fair.

Sometimes you listen to just that humming or buzz or whatever it is.

Yeah, like the white noise stuff. Yeah, I like the binaural beats. Yeah, that's got to be through between headphones because it sends one frequency in one ear and one in the other. Okay, go on. So it only really works through headphones.

Brilliant.

It's good for the— good for the—

does any song ever beat Talk of the Town though?

No, that's a good one, and it came on randomly in the gym the other day, and then on the way to the rugby you sent me the fact that you were listening to it. So then I put it on in my van, so I arrived at the ground listening to it also.

Yeah, it's, um, what's it called? Who sings it? Fred Again, Talk of the Town. Stop doing what you're doing, play that song, come back. Okay, right, now you've done that. It's fucking good, isn't it? There you are.

Yeah, you're welcome.

You're welcome.

Chemical Brothers from Munich.

Oh yeah, have you seen— have you watched Apex yet? You have done.

I've heard of Charlie's Flair on that.

Yeah, yeah. You've seen the song where he's dancing in the woods? Yeah, that's another good one.

It's quite a good movie. I wasn't expecting to like it. I actually put it on to be like one of those, you know, those like, I don't give a fuck if I actually pay any attention. It's good, but it was really good.

I liked it. I really like him as an actor. I think he's really good.

Yeah, he's good, isn't he?

I think he's one of our better actors in the— from this side of the world. Yeah, so he's obviously British. Yeah, Taron Egerton plays Eggsy. Have you watched The King's Circle?

Yeah, I think you'd enjoy—

oh yeah, did you enjoy him? Yeah, yeah, I can imagine you did. Yeah, yeah, you watched all three? It's three, I think.

Oh, four! Oh, I might have missed one then.

Yeah, I've definitely missed one if there's four. Brilliant. Well, well, there you go.

Is he in those though?

Is Eggsy in the old ones? Eggsy. All right, uh, I like it when he does the princess in the back.

Do you remember that bit? Yeah, it's a good bit.

It's funny. Can we do the bum? And he's like, yeah, obviously. Yeah, everyone stopped talking then.

I don't— yeah, it's almost like they wanted to know.

Yeah, how the fuck do we get there? Oh yeah, but because he's obviously British, he's doing an Aussie accent, he sounds— ends up sounding like Adam. Yeah, you can hear a little twang every now and then.

Yeah.

And then weirdly, I don't know if you noticed in the film, she was like and it had no fucking contribution to the story, I don't think. She was like, oh, you're not from here though, are you? And he's like, no, I'm from a shithole basically called England.

Oh yeah.

And I think they were justifying his ropey accent. Got you, I think. Yeah, but it was a really good film.

That's cool.

He's a really good actor.

He's good. Yeah. Um, Stormzy.

Yeah. It's a funky looking dog, innit? Go on then, what else we got? On that note, I like Stormzy. Do you like Stormzy?

Yeah, I don't mind a bit Stormzy.

You get way too big for your boots.

Never too big for the boots.

You got big toe for the feet. Never too big to do. I don't know the words.

Young man will. I don't really listen to the lyrics often of many songs. I often listen to songs without lyrics, like you say, like COD soundtrack.

That's a sausage dog, that.

Yeah, it sounds that way, innit?

Squawk. Richmond. That's a good name, isn't it, for a sausage? Richmond.

Very good name. A little bit of thought gone into it.

Yeah, pretty good. It's formal too.

So you've got walls.

You can call it Rich, you can call it Dick, you can call it Mundo.

Rich Mundo.

You can full Richmond it.

Yeah, it's good though. It's a really good name.

Yeah, not bad.

Right, what, what, um, imagine if that dog just bit him out.

Yeah, a little send-off for it, like kind of like cock height. It just goes adiós amigo and just fucking pings him straight in the left nut.

Adios to your cock and balls, man.

Yeah, adios to your chorizo, amigos. Right, go on then. Now what?

He's doing the thing again.

What thing? Why are you even— stop, we're on a podcast.

Sorry.

You've seen a dog be trained before, mate.

Yeah, I know, but he's just called it dude again. It's a chick.

All right, yeah, he's awful about that. It's the worst thing about him is that fucking— like, can't tell the difference between a dick and a puppy.

Yeah.

Fair enough, it's a dog, so you're not actively looking, but you can just fucking have a peep.

You can only assume that's kind of made life complicated for him.

Yeah, yeah, difficult to navigate.

Hey, um, I'm not gay because—

no, no, that's a dick, brother. Tell them about the, uh, broccoli. Tell them about the broccoli.

Oh yeah, so you sent me an interest in, um—

I didn't send it.

Someone sent me an interesting— was it a reel or a post? I'm not sure. But anyway, the post said, um, one person's tried broccoli and they say they don't like it.

Yes.

The other person's tried broccoli and hasn't tried broccoli and they say they don't like it.

Yes.

Whose opinion is more valid?

I would say the one who has tried broccoli.

Exactly.

Has more of a valid opinion.

Yeah.

Because how would the other one know otherwise?

Because they've given it a go and they now understand that they didn't like it.

Yeah. So then I get a little bit hazy around the next bit exactly how it is. Should we check? Yeah, we can check. Hello.

Right there. This is getting weird.

Yeah, it is a little.

Is it? It's funny though.

No, I mean this was a bit weird. What you're doing is entirely normal.

Alright. Oh mate. Oh yeah, here it is. In this essay, I'll explain why it is more straight to fuck a doug in the— I'm gonna read the whole thing.

Yeah, you guys think you kind of have a very valid point. Yep. It's definitely a—

if an individual has never tried broccoli and another has tried it once and they both say I do not like broccoli, who has the more valid claim?

Why are you whispering?

In this essay, I'll explain why it is more straight to fuck a dude in the ass once than not at all.

Yeah, you don't really need to read the essay, do you?

Nope. Nope. Who's going first, mate? Would you like to flip a coin? 'Cause we have to know.

Fair enough. Otherwise, we can't claim to be straight.

No.

'Cause we don't know that we don't like the other version.

Mm-hmm. I think it's probably an acquired taste anyway. Like olives. You do enough of it, you probably start enjoying it. Coffee. I don't know, I'm not sure. Nothing against it. Do whatever you want. Yeah, you want, fair dinkum.

Fair dinkum.

Never thought we'd get on to gay bum sex on this podcast, but yeah, here we are. Straight bum sex. Yeah.

That's probably been brought up a lot.

Yeah, it's been brought up this podcast. Yeah, Eggsy did it.

Yeah.

All right, what else?

Um, Jessie was here this week.

She can fucking waffle, can't she? Yeah, unfortunately we can't bring on the podcast because you don't have enough terabyte data.

No, it just looked like The Matrix green, like overlaid, overlaid, and like Where did she get it from?

All of it. Not like who she caught it off. Like, where did she get that level of speech?

Yeah, I don't know.

I don't have enough thoughts in my head to possibly talk that much. For the record, Jessie's a great person. Yeah, I really like her. Yeah, probably wouldn't tell her to her face. No, she might listen to this.

They'd say the opposite to her face.

Yeah, and just behind her back. We compliment her. Yeah, everybody does.

They all fronty-backy.

Better than being the other way around, mate.

Yeah, it is, to be fair. Yeah, there's plenty of those.

That's why I'm pretty brutal to people, because when I say something nice, you know I mean it. Don't trust those. Never say anything.

Still waiting for my moment, mate.

I've complimented you like every day in the last— I complimented you today for your backwards cap. They look great, which is not—

pretty sure that was sarcastic.

No, it wasn't. I give— I asked if you're wearing shoulder pads.

Funny.

I complimented your tan the other day.

Yeah, all right.

Yeah, you had great hair the other day. I complimented that. How about we go in there and try some broccoli, son?

Yeah, I'll sit with the Walter. Yeah, yeah, fair enough. I take it back. Yeah, yeah.

I'd probably complimented you on your web app.

I think you were more in shock.

I was a bit. I don't think I spoke for a little while. No. Especially when you showed it to me too. I was like—

I didn't actually function.

I didn't really process.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, fair enough.

You definitely slipped Simão fucking 20 quid to do it.

No, I watched him do it.

You watched him do it?

He looked, you could see the cocks turning. Nice.

The cocks. You could see the cocks turning.

My blood pressure went so high.

Yeah. Yeah. Another crazy high blood pressure shock.

Nose started bleeding and shit. Yep. Yeah, so that's good.

Yeah, you'll be all right.

Yeah, I think so.

Have some aspirin.

Yeah.

Or some ashwagandha or something, I don't know.

Yeah, I used to have a bit of—

Val, we're gonna need you in 5 minutes. You have to hop on this podcast.

Me?

Yeah.

Oh, really?

Oh yes. I believe she said I'm pretty social, but I don't know.

Tough shit. Richmond there, look.

There he is. Richard.

That's cute. Oh God, that is cute. I love the little dumpy fucking inward-outy legs. It's crazy.

Inward-outy.

There's a non-XL Bully.

Yep.

It's just a large Bully.

Yeah.

There's Sasha. A very athletic dog. Yeah. Her and her mum have been having their fucking broccoli. Not that broccoli.

Specimen of a dog.

Actual broccoli.

See that big fella, big bushy fellow there?

Yep.

He's called Bug.

Bug?

Yeah.

That's a great name, isn't it? Yeah, that's a cute dog.

What's that? Um, he is a European rescue. I can't remember where from.

There's a big white German Shepherd, Malinois cross Staffy. All right, what sport did you used to play or still play?

Triathlon.

Triathlon.

Yeah, it makes sense.

Fair enough. Yeah, there you have it. Still do it?

No, not competitive.

Don't push me. I still train.

You dive though, don't you? Is it diving you do? Like deep sea diving?

Diving.

Gotcha. When was your last triathlon?

Last triathlon? Oh, I don't know, about 15 years ago.

Oh really?

Fair enough. There you are, triathlon. There you have it, kids. Yeah. Be great if we could ping up a shot of Michelle's muscles, but I feel like that would be weird. Do you mind just giving us a double front bicep? You're just in Phenomenal. We just respect it. Yeah, you're clearly someone that is an athlete. And there you go. Um, all right, what else? What were we talking about?

I don't know, we've got to kind of see out our order again. Yeah, 3 minutes, there'll be 20 past 3. What time did it say it was coming?

Uh, 27 minutes past. I think it's 10 minutes. Oh, arrives at 3:25. So you've just got 8 minutes, buddy. 8 minutes, little guy. Right, 2 seconds. Right.

What's gonna be the hardest thing about going to Australia for you?

Um, I don't know. I trust— I'm leaving my dogs, but I trust Pablo quite a lot with my dogs, to be fair. So, but probably leaving the dogs.

But I saw— I once saw him take my dogs out And he put their e-collars on him and they were all set up and then he started using words I've never used in my life before.

Fair enough.

Yeah, I think they were doing most of it, which is also a little bit weird.

Yeah, was he clicking? Because that was—

he probably was. I couldn't quite see from a distance, but click is a universal command. Yeah. Um, yeah, same. He's like, um, Owen's gonna look after the bag for me, I think.

Yeah, fine. Yeah, you'll be fine. Is that the— yeah. So anything else that's upsetting you?

Nah, just dogs in it. Everything else will be fine.

We're going on the fancy plane. Yeah, because if we sold our souls to social media so we can afford shit like that, and mainly because you're too big.

Yeah, I tried the longest thing in the normal class, was like literal— like, you could have At the end, if like with an hour to go, if you just said, look, you can end it now if you sign like my house over. Yeah, all your possessions. I'd have done it.

Really?

Yeah, I was in discomfort.

Bad, didn't it? Tortures you a bit too. Yeah, whereas you would be really crammed in. It's not comfortable for me, and I'm a 6-foot-1-inch and a tiny bit man.

Yeah. About 20 pounds.

6 foot and 1 inch are the same together. I'm not 6 foot and then 1 inch, if that makes sense.

Some sense, yeah.

Yeah, you're 6 foot 6 and 3 inch. Generous.

Yeah, probably. I'm not 6 foot 6. Pablo is.

Is he actually? Is he taller than you?

Yeah, I think so.

That is mental. I thought you're the tallest human I've ever met.

I'm pretty sure Pabs is a smidge taller.

Did I tell the story of how I first met you on the podcast last week, or was I just telling it to someone else?

I don't know. No, I don't think you told it on the podcast, but should I tell it on the podcast? You could do.

All right, then I will.

Is it— did you work at the same place then though?

Don't think so yet. No, no, I didn't. I definitely didn't. All right, so the first time we bumped into each other, this was even before I played at Leeds.

Oh, was it?

Yeah.

Oh yeah, fine then. Yeah, so I was at David Lloyd's, which is interesting because you've recently gone back to David Lloyd's.

A long— yeah, it's a good club. Very busy though. Yeah, really busy, mate.

Was it?

I went Monday morning, it was, it was rammed. All right, David Lloyd's Health Club.

Yeah.

Expensive membership, but we sold us all social media, so we get to go on the fancy planes and the fancy health clubs.

I train in my garage.

He trains in his garage. Ever saw him in your garage as well?

Yeah, I really love to get one at home. Be great.

Do you have a giant bath that you can get into other men with? I got a small bath into other men with— get in with other men. Nothing's really— there's no one that's better than the other, to be honest.

Anyway, anyway, how did you first bump into us?

Oh yeah, me. So I, um, there was like a double door lock system, like as in, you know, you'd have in the zoo to keep in the meerkats, like an airlock.

Yeah, yeah.

So I went through the first one.

I can't remember those doors, like heavy timber fire doors.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, take a bit of moving. Yeah, so I'm there like two-handing her, opening her up, and this guy comes the other way And like, as I walk in, he walks into the same, and I just headbutt this dude's fucking chest, like straight up headbutt him square in the fucking chest. And then I back up and I'm like, holy shit, I thought I just bumped into a wall. Turns out this is actually a fucking human being. I looked up like this. I remember genuinely looking up and you were just there like fucking basically growling.

Doesn't sound like me. I was like, oh.

Sorry, sorry, sorry. And I like, I had to like get past you. You didn't move at all. You didn't even twist the shoulder, bruv.

I mean, jammed. Yeah, I mean, stuck. I don't know.

I'm surprised we didn't get stuck in there, like when Shallow Hal gets stuck in a lift with Tony Robbins. Ping it up, Pops.

Devils, come out! The hell are you doing, banana hands? That's me and you in the fucking— was I solo?

You were on your own, but I saw you there a few other times. I think you were training with Church.

Yeah, it would have been brothers or one other or something. I don't know. Yeah, he was—

I just remember thinking, oh my God, that's the biggest human I've actually ever seen in my life. So congratulations. Yeah, but then turns out Pablo's bigger. Yeah, taller anyway.

Taller. Don't think he carries as much lean mass if we were to do it again.

Built like Tyson Fury.

Did you think about it? Yeah, kind of.

Yeah, fucking—

yeah, you shouldn't work, does, did, did.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He does live in a van, so maybe he does have some more fucking similarities to Tyson Fury, but that's one portion of people I would not like to piss off today.

So not live in a van anymore.

I doubt it.

There's a Netflix series, I've seen the advert, I haven't watched it, but Yeah, but his house isn't actually mental considering like how much he's worth.

You reckon?

Yeah, it looks pretty wild on the— on the— I'm gonna actually watch an episode, just have a look.

All right.

I don't want to though. He's quite funny, but he's quite funny, but like reality TV, he's shy. Yeah, I got— you got an ultimate—

that's what all those little people are watching.

End of the day. Crazy athlete, won a whole shitload in boxing.

Oh, did he? Isn't he fighting Anthony Joshua? Is he?

I think so.

We're 1 minute away, Lucas.

Lucas is out.

7053, mate. 7053.

Is that your number?

That's a pin. This is, uh, Uber Eats.

Oh, okay.

They're outside.

723.

7053. Is it all right to give my code out, my Uber Eats code out to the—

it depends if it's a repeat code or whether it's a one-off individual code.

I think it was different the other day, so by the time they've listened to this, we'll probably have the smoothies.

The number stays the same, doesn't it?

Yeah, it does. 15 is mine. 64. Oh yeah, fair play. Yeah, I wonder if anyone is still listening.

I know it's gone a little, a little vague, hasn't it?

They all do though.

Should we— is there anything you want to talk about, Doctor Anywise? Just to bring it back up and run.

All right, yeah, cool.

Do you, uh, I feel like we practiced what we preached today. We didn't micromanage our dogs.

Not too much, no.

I was shitting myself because I wasn't, because, because I think I was thinking about this because you reminded me at one point and said, mate, you're going to practice what you preach and not micromanage. I was like, you're right.

And we'll stay free, just run into the middle of the lake. Yeah, I'm gonna micromanage.

There he goes, he's just fucked up 8 swans.

He gonna learn today. Let the boy watch.

Um, and I was thinking like, that should be your aspiration, but initially when you're teaching them a bit, there's got to be a bit of management, hasn't it? It's like I told him off for trying to eat the ball.

Yeah, but management and obedience.

Yeah, yeah, okay, yeah, no, there's none of that. It was just like, don't kill the fucking swan, bro.

Right, so here's what I've ordered us.

There seems to be a lot.

Tiramisu latte.

Has it got actual coffee in it? Yeah. It's gonna be off my rocker.

Yeah, well, I've got one as well. I've also got us a Crush 'Em each though, so we just have them.

Yeah, yeah, that's good.

Alright, sound. A Crush 'Em milkshake, to be fair.

I'll take a couple of sips out of this.

Yeah, well, let's try it and rate it, and then we'll move on to the Crush 'Ems.

Crush 'Ems. You alright there, Lucas? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Really thick straw.

So yeah, a KFC's tiramisu latte.

KFC, who would've thunk it?

I know. Just come across it last night by chance.

Is there no hole in this? A sippy hole?

Yes, on the other side, mate.

Where's my sippy hole?

Sippy, sippy, sip, sippy.

Give it a little swirl. When you can't use a sippy cup.

No, I mean, that tastes a bit like Jameson. I actually quite like it.

It does, to be fair. I don't mind that at all. If it wasn't the time it is, I would finish that beverage. Yeah.

Oh, stunning.

But given my aversion to sleep, yeah, I've got weaponized.

I might see it out.

Do you drink this as well then?

How's that going?

Oh, that's nice too.

Is it?

Yeah.

Is it?

Yeah.

All right.

I would have never thought KFC even did this. I just thought they did chicken and corn and beans and gravy.

They do gravy, do they?

Oh, now I'm thinking about KFC.

Yeah, we could have got—

I might have it for tea.

Yes, that's good, isn't it? We can have it post-rugby tomorrow if you want.

That's a good idea. It'll be an earlier finish too. Gotta be careful why I eat late. Sensitive soul, aren't I?

You're like a fucking magpie, aren't you? Yeah, pretty much.

You feed me after 6, we got problems.

And you get grumpy when, um, you've not slept. Oh yeah, turn into a gremlin, don't you? A bit of a diva.

I don't know. So how are we staying around for badminton? Well, when? Mixed feelings about that.

Tonight.

All these little cunts arranged a badminton tournament.

Chloe not playing?

Yeah, she arranged it without us.

Why are we not invited to ever— we never get invited to stuff. They play paddle without us.

We go paddle, they go dog walking.

Is it singles or doubles? Your knee be alright?

No, like, yeah, probably not. I can only assume not. What are we gonna do about the actual court lines?

Yeah, how are the courts being measured?

String or whatever. I don't know, should I ask? Yeah, yeah, make it as competitive as you can. That's a terrible idea.

What's the cash prize?

If it's competitive, I will kill myself to dominate. Yeah, I'll need 2 new knees by the end of it.

I'm not gonna gas myself out though because big game tomorrow. Yeah, second win of the season, mate.

I'm feeling it. Do you miss a game next week?

We're climbing up the ladder. Yeah, I do. Fucking really annoying. Almost canceled the whole franchise just to play one amateur game.

Yeah, that would make sense, to be fair. Still not too late.

Um, right, Adam, refund everyone.

I think—

oh, I'm playing against—

oh, like, got the bollocks to play whilst you're away.

Yeah, I hope he does.

Yeah, I will be so judgmental if he didn't.

Mate, I'm not gonna lie. Yeah, I know this isn't technically tiramisu at all, or even not technically tiramisu. It's nothing to do with tiramisu.

No, pretty good though.

Very fucking good. Lucas, you wanna go grab Val for us?

Is it an ice cream-based dessert? Chocolate shake, but it's largely ice cream.

Yeah, this is a crush 'em shake. Come on, Val. Do you want the rest of my coffee, Val? I didn't know you could— it's nice, it's tiramisu coffee, Val.

Oh, maybe, maybe.

Have you heard the song Valerie by, um, Amy Winehouse?

Yes.

Do you like it? I do.

A lot of people ask me that.

Why don't you come on over, Valerie? I didn't think our music made it to your side of the world.

Oh, no, it does. It does.

Have you ever heard of The Beatles?

Yes, I've heard of them. No.

I wouldn't bother her and rate 'em. Genuinely don't like The Beatles.

What? Why do you not like The Beatles? You don't diss—

I love The Beatles.

Do you?

Do I just hold this like this?

Yeah, a bit closer, ideally. Put down a boomerang.

Like Talladega Nights, like, I don't know.

Where are you from specifically then? Maine.

Maine? Or not originally, but I live there now.

Where were you originally from?

New Jersey. Jersey Shore. Yeah, yeah. People know where that is.

It's a show, isn't it? It's a TV show.

It's a terrible show.

Was it Ronnie and Mike and—

I've never seen that.

Well, you're actually from Jersey Shore?

Yeah, I am. Like 20 minutes from where they filmed it.

Shouldn't you talk like, uh, more like that, or no?

Well, so my mom is more like that. My dad's from Germany, so I think level this out a little bit.

Maggie's from Germany, did you know that? That's not Maggie.

I was like, I don't know who Mikey—

uh, Maggie's in there. Oh, Maggie, can you speak German or no?

Um, you like— I'd say intermediate speaker.

Yeah, the lady from with the Roy, she's from Germany. She's driven over here from Germany to do the boot camp.

Yeah, it's actually another German dude that lives in Wales as well.

There is?

Yeah, yeah, he's, uh, works for JBL, he said. The guy with the black lab.

Go on then, Val, tell us what you do and just, well, yeah, just give us an intro to you.

Yeah, so I have my business Venture Doggy. I'm out of Maine. I started as a dog camp, so I used to, I had like a Toyota RAV4 and I'd pick up like 10, 15 dogs, take them all hiking.

A Toyota RAV4? Yes. Fuck off.

It's like a clown car.

People are watching that, weren't they?

They're all me sausage dogs.

Yeah, they're— I mean, they just like kind of sandwich in there, you know, build it up over time. But, uh, okay, uh, so I didn't start with that many.

Do you ever have any like wild safety concerns when you're transporting that many dogs?

So I only took dogs that like met specific criteria, and I like kind of slowly add them in, and then they would come like every week, so they all got to know each other pretty well.

Fair enough. Yeah, sounds wild.

Uh, yeah, my car is like irreversibly scarred. From that experience.

So I can imagine.

Yeah, so that was, that's how I started, um, doing like more of like a daycare setup and then, uh, moved more into training. And then for the last like 3 years I've just been doing training.

All right, cool.

Um, and yeah, I'd say like I've been moving more into like the reactivity stuff and then, um, so much of it you can't really not. Yeah, exactly. And there's so many different levels to it. Like, some people say they're dogs reactive and it's really not a big deal, and some people say it and they're like, oh, they're actually really aggressive.

Like, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Um, so there's so many— yeah, so many different layers to it. Um, I also work with horses. I've had 2 horses.

Oh, nice.

Um, so I started with horses before dogs, and then it'd be kind of cool to like— they both taught me about each other.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Nice. Type of horses for what, like, roles?

Yeah, so I have an older Quarter Horse who's basically my younger horse's babysitter. That's kind of her job at this point. She did more like Western trail riding, stuff like that. And then my younger mare, she's an off-the-track thoroughbred, so I want to do dressage eventing with her, but she had surgery last January, so we're just doing like rehab now.

Is it true that Quarter Horse is called a Quarter Horse because it's so fast over a quarter mile?

The fastest over a quarter mile.

Good fucking knowledge, mate.

Yeah, that is good. That's why they have the big booties.

Yeah, big glutes. Put me in front of those. What other type of arse would you want?

That's highly inappropriate, don't you think, Mum?

Horse butt.

Yeah, fair enough.

Horse ass.

Dusty will be able to save me.

All right, what'd you come over for? Yeah, what brought you over?

Yeah, so I joined the mentorship program, um, which, yeah, I've been like just chipping away at that online, which has been incredibly helpful, um, for all the business aspects of things and even the dog training things. And, um, yeah, just being able to connect with other people, because I feel like as a dog trainer you kind of, you learn so many things and then you just start putting it together however you can best, but it's really hard to get like validated in any way or like see how someone else is doing it or like, yeah, just, it's nice to be able to bounce ideas with other people and then see how someone does something as a system. So that's been super helpful, like coming here, that's really what I wanted to see. And then I've found it's been really hard to, like I've done, especially for myself, it's taken me a long time to like, use any kind of punishment like in training in a real way because I don't want to use it until I really thoroughly understand it.

Yeah.

So I've kind of tried to see like—

interesting, given your background in horses, obviously. Well, that's part of why.

Yeah, well, it's a negative reinforcement and punishment. It's kind of like Keeler method. Yeah, a lot of horse training. And that's actually kind of why I was sort of like, horses, it's, it's like borderline abuse sometimes. So like it made me want to look at more of like, what can you actually accomplish with positive reinforcement? How far can you take that? And I feel like I've done so much with that and kind of seen where it hits the limit. And then it's sort of like, okay, how, yeah, how can I most effectively and humanely use like all these things together to be like, yeah, just get things done quickly but effectively for the, you know, better of the person and the dog. So that's been super helpful to see here.

Just like that.

Yeah. So this has been really amazing here to like, like, I feel like positive reinforcement is, it's so much like always training under threshold and you never seem to quite, it feels like past that certain point, you're just using management all the time and it's just kind of exhausting and people are stuck. And like, even with my own dogs, there's things that I'm like, is it, can I progress this more? Or is this something some people would say, that's it for you.

Like you're done.

Other people would say, no, you can fix that. So it's really nice to be able to see other trainers.

Yeah, go ahead.

Oh, look, you can fix that. Or no, maybe that's not for that dog.

Yep.

Yeah.

Nice.

What's next then?

Putting all these, all my notes together, getting my, getting everything organized, I guess. And I'd really Yeah, I'd really love to be able to set up some sort of boot camp programs as I can make that happen.

Yeah.

Yeah. So that's been like hugely like, that's been amazing to see here, like just how efficiently everything's set up and like how you generalize everything with the different environments for everybody. And even just like teaching people, which is like a huge part of dog training, like how you do that. And, uh, yeah, set people up for success and build their confidence.

Nice.

Yeah, they're all right, aren't they?

It's okay, isn't it?

They're good.

Not bad.

Oh, well, I'm glad you had a good time, Val.

Yeah, no, it's been amazing.

Oh, wicked. Um, yeah, where, where do you go from here? Are you, um, going anywhere else? You going straight back home?

So I'll actually be here next week for a few more days.

Oh, really?

Yeah, I'll be here next week for a few more days, and then, um, I'm gonna head back on like Wednesday or Thursday. I have to get back to London and then my flight leaves from there on Friday.

Oh, nice, nice. Oh, well, yeah, definitely worthwhile the trip then.

Yes.

What made you decide you wanted to come over in the first place though? Like, what, what were you like, right, I need to go and I'm gonna go visit the UK? Obviously you did the mentorship program, and I say to anyone they can come visit whenever they want, but like, there's a lot of Americans and Australians in the program and, um, Yeah, some of them are due to come and visit. A lot of them are coming back for like mentorship weekend and stuff like that. But what, what kind of incentivized you to go, right, I need to go and have a look what's going on?

Yeah, I think for me it's just, I think I need to be like immersed in something to really learn it. Um, and like, I think like the, the talking piece for me is, is so, it's like something that really helps me learn. Um, so, and then yeah, being able to see it firsthand hand and like be a part of the processing experience really, yeah, is just for me like really helpful for learning and just seeing how I could implement those things.

Nice.

I want to travel, so there you go.

Perfect.

You been to the UK before?

I haven't.

Oh, oh, this is your first time? Amazing. All right, make sure you grab a list of nearby things to do before you go. All right.

Yeah, yeah.

When you're here till next Wednesday, Wednesday, Thursday. Yeah, sound all right. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I'm gonna try to go up to like York on Saturday. I might try to go to Edinburgh on Sunday maybe.

What's that, 3, 3 and a half, 4 hours away?

Yeah, 4, 4 and a bit.

Yeah, well, someone told me it was 2 on the train.

Oh, it's not too— oh, if you go on the train. Yeah, yeah, that'd be quicker.

Oh yeah, I was like, I was like, that guy on the train, he's taking smack.

They haven't fact-checked them. Yeah.

Planned my weekend around it.

I just don't know if you can get a direct one from Leeds. Last time I went to Edinburgh on a train, I had to go to York first.

I think you can do two in one.

That's what someone told me.

Yeah, yeah, Edinburgh's real good.

Yeah, it is.

So is York, to be fair.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, both of them very historic.

Harrogate might be worth a little walk around as well. Yeah, it's a nice, beautiful, pretty city. You've been into Leeds? Leeds is a bit of a shithole. You went to Roundhay Park today though. I think that's like the One of the gems of Leeds.

Yeah, it is.

Yeah.

Me and Pabs have Googled it before. It's one of the biggest parks in Europe, the Charted Park.

Oh, is it?

Really?

It stretches a lot further than what we walk. What's the—

Oh yeah.

What's the biggest park in Europe?

Yeah. If you could find out for us, that'd be great. Leeds Indoor Market, I think, is the biggest indoor market in Europe.

Is it? Oh, really?

Like the mall kind of?

And I think Leeds Uni has The biggest corridor in Europe. Is that a Commodore?

So where I come from, Hull used to be the biggest council estate in Europe.

There you go, you're welcome. Yeah, go and have a look at Hull.

Hull's nice.

Hull's lovely.

The name is sort of like a little off-putting maybe, but—

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it is, yeah.

Like Slough.

Yeah, it's not appealing, is it?

No, Hull's a shithole.

Yeah, there's not much in Hull.

Go have a look at fucking Pontefract. Yeah, fuck them, there can't be that many. And even if we do, do we want to associate with you?

Nah, probably not.

Longest, biggest park in Europe, mate?

Urban park, public park is Phoenix Park.

Phoenix Park.

All right, what's number 2 then?

Yeah, just keep going through them, I guess, till we hit one we recognize. Oh, he's no Jamie off Joe Rogan, is he?

No.

Hang on, hang on. You're supposed to be a young man. You're supposed to be able to work a cell phone.

Do you want me to—

and sorts. You ever listened to this podcast before?

I have.

Oh yeah, have you? Yeah.

Amazing.

Oh, well, I'm driving around. Do a lot of driving around.

Yeah, there's lots of dead time in it, so Right, he's panicked, he's absolutely flapped, he's crumbled under pressure.

He'll ping him, sound.

Right, we've got to wrap it up because we've got a webinar to do.

You do, you're actually 2 and a half minutes over time.

Val, not to put you under too much pressure, but do you know what we say at the end of this podcast to sign out each one, by any chance? It's very subtle.

I can't remember, I can't remember.

All right, so obviously not much of a fan then. I'd never get to the end of one, to be fair.

I've definitely listened to them to the end.

I can't think of— oh yeah, all right, okay. Well, I say, say bye Ian, and then Ian says bye Ian, and then Val says bye Ian. Wonderful.