The Divine Feminine & the Divine Masculine with Camilla Davis | S02 E07

Welcome back to another episode of When Kings Unite, the podcast where we consider masculinity as medicine. I'm super excited to be hosting this episode today. My name is Chris, and we're back in studio with a couple of our favorite kings, our usuals. And for the first time on our podcast, we have a queen joining us. We're so happy to have Camilla Davis joining our podcast today. So in our conversations, we usually focus on masculinity, what it means for us as men in the world, how we can heal our masculinity and grow more towards holding divinity in our masculinity. But there's a whole other side of the equation, and that's the femininity, the divine feminine. And so that's going to be our conversation today, is the divine feminine, the divine masculine, how those two merge and interplay in every single one of us. Regardless of whether we are a man or a woman. So that's going to be the focus of our conversation today, and I'm excited to dive in. You ready? Let's go. Hey, welcome back, everyone. Good to see your beautiful faces again. How have you been? Good. Hey, hey, hey.

Amazing. Even better now that Camila's here. Hey.

I know. So excited. Camila, thank you so much for joining us.

Thank you so much for having me. It's an honor.

Yeah, it's been a while since we've all been together in person. And when we were getting together and saying, you know, we really should have our first female guest on the podcast, who should that be? There was a short list and your name was right there at the top. So it was pretty unanimous. And I also want Yeah. I also want to mention one face that we don't see on the screen if you're watching on YouTube, or a voice that you won't hear if you're listening on any of our podcast platforms today, is our dear brother Wes. Boy, he's been going through some trials recently. He's had some health issues in his family, and that has disrupted his life and his work. And he was going to join us today and just was Just had a bad last couple of days. So, Brother Wes, you are with us in our hearts. We send you all the love, and we're so grateful that he's taken the time to take care of himself and his family and his loved ones, and focus on what's important. So, so our fourth chair may be empty, but it's quickly filled by Queen Camilla. So, Camilla, why don't we just dive in? Tell us a little bit about you. Who is Camilla Davis?

Who am I? Ooh, that's such a loaded question. Um, um, well, I am a sex educator. I'm a sexual freedom and intimacy coach. I help others uncover, rediscover, and tap into their power. And I really help people unlock the parts of themselves that are blocking them from their birthright, which is pleasure.

Oh, I love the way you said that, by the way. Yeah.

Thank you.

Love that.

Yeah. Yeah. Uh, my first question for you is, how did you get to be so amazing?

Well, I get it from my mama.

Okay.

I mean, truthfully, yes. Um, well, thank you for that compliment. Uh, that, I, I don't even know what to say to that. Like, what is, what do I say to that, Chris?

I, it's an open-ended question. You are amazing. And I'm genuinely curious, how did you get to be this way?

Well, let's see. I will, I, I always joke and say I came out of the womb this way, which I really did, you know? And, um, I came out of the womb in service. And so I have been literally serving all of my life. And in that service, I've been able to meet people where they are, experience different types of levels of relationships and people and the way that they're dealing with different things or what have you. And so it just kind of create, I would say it just created a well-rounded person because of all the experiences that I've had, you know, since I was brought into this world. So, yeah.

You know, one of my like favorite parts about you is just like how expressive

and like open you are as a person. Um, I'm really excited for like the world to know even more of you, uh, because like my first experience of you was just like this very tenderhearted, embracive, like collective energy. Like there was— as soon as I saw you, I was like, oh, I feel like home, you know, right now. Which is, it's huge. Like, I think that's such a big human quality, uh, to be able to hold. And one of the things that's always made me curious, I'm like, oh my gosh, this lady probably has a lot of life experience. Because I think to be able to hold all that beautiful light, you also have to be able to like tap in, you know, to, in different parts of ourselves that some people may not always wanna come in.

Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Um, I'll share a little history. Um, Now that I'm in a place where I'm comfortable with sharing, right? So you may not know, but my father died when my mom was pregnant with me.

Mm.

And so in that experience, needless to say, I felt everything in utero, every emotion possible. She loses the love of her life. And so you're feeling the grief, the pain, the depression, the sadness, the anger as she is— raising my sister. And then she didn't even know she was pregnant. He didn't know he was preg— I mean, she was pregnant. So then she finds out she's pregnant and I'm feeling the joy and the love and the— so when I say I came into this world like so, so loved and also feeling every fucking thing.

Hmm.

But I didn't have language to that. I didn't know what that was. And so growing up, you know, I was this loving person and also very, very in tune and intuitive and did not— again, like I said, didn't have the language for it at that time. So I would hear things like, oh, she's so sensitive, or why is she crying, or why is this happening, right? You get these, oh, she's a lot, or why is— you know, all of these different labels and things that you hear. And so what I understand, of course, now is that that gift that my father gave me in his death was the ability to feel. everything. And so it has lended me and helped me in a way within the work that I've done. I've worked in the field with children and families for years. So I've worked with at-risk youth in shelter and residential and group home, also working at Child Protective Services. So needless to say, I have experienced and seen babies up to adults going through and living life and the choices that they made and how it affects Them, you know? So yeah, it's, it's been a, it's been an interesting journey and I'm so grateful for it. Not grateful, of course, that I didn't have my father. Right. But understanding now the reason, my purpose for being here.

Yeah. I think I have like 3 main things off of that. Like one, I love how you're like really pointing to the fact of like energy is everywhere and sometimes we absorb things that aren't even ours. We've talked about that on this podcast like a few times, but I think you like perfectly like described that experience, which I, I think it's so important for people to realize. Like sometimes it, people literally will just transmute their energy in a way that they're not even conscious of.

Yeah. You're not even conscious and you can, and you're crying all of a sudden. You're like, what the heck is going on? 'Cause I'm not sad and I don't know what's going on, but it looks like it's you. Right. And you're just like boohooing. But it's not even your tears.

Yeah. Yeah, of course. Yeah. And then, I mean, like, thank you again for like sharing that piece. Cause I didn't know that about you, but I think it just like reconfirms like why everybody who's probably ever met you loves you. Uh, because I think you've done such a great job, like I said before, of like transmuting that. And something that I just have to say, it's like, oh my gosh, I literally think that you and Freddie are siblings. Cause the languaging that you both use is like, what? The heck is happening? I'm like, what? I'm like, I didn't fucking get

it. Yes, yes, yes.

That's awesome.

Yeah, I thank you for sharing that, Camila. And one of the things that stuck out to me that really resonated with me, and again, like Smith just said, there's definitely a kindred spirit, a familial energy frequency happening between you and I. And one of the things that you said that just sort of illuminated that in this moment is when you talked about people, like, immediately saying that you're sensitive, right? And one of the things that I've learned about myself in my journey is that I am a highly sensitive person, an HSP. Do you, have you heard that term? Do you identify with that? Um, do you consider yourself a highly sensitive and, and, and that being a superpower than a detriment?

Oh, absolutely. I, I think because I didn't understand it growing up and I didn't have people around me explaining things to me and helping me to see what the gifts that were bestowed within me. So, yeah, I thought it was a detriment, you know, 'cause I was like so sensitive. But it definitely is a superpower. It has allowed me to experience and see things and prevent things and all the— especially, like I said, in the career that I had before and also now, right? But yeah, it's definitely been a superpower. It has been a superpower. And I know how to guard my energy. I know how to, like, protect my energy and all of that stuff, like, now. But again, before, I just didn't have the language or understand what, what it was. Yeah. So I'm very empathic, very much so.

Yeah. And I, I love how you languaged that just now. You said, I am empathic. You didn't do what a lot of people say that makes me cringe. And you say, I'm an empath.

Oh,

there's a distinction between saying I am empathic

Mm-hmm.

And labeling, putting, you know, slapping the label in the jacket of, I am an empath.

Mm-hmm.

Which a lot of times means people absorb, you know, people's stuff and, you know, take on a lot of other people's energy unnecessarily and take themselves through, you know, unnecessary harm in a lot of ways by taking on energy that doesn't belong to them.

Mm-hmm. And I have, I mean, to keep it 100, like, especially in the career when I worked with children, again, I didn't have the language. I didn't know. I just knew how to serve. I just knew I would hear things and see things and act in that way and lead in that way. So I took on a lot of the stuff, you know, imagine what you're seeing, especially working for CPS, like Child Protective Services. Come on now. Like, imagine the stuff that you experience and that you You go home, and that doesn't just go away. For some people, they were able to turn— I just was not able to, you know, because again, these are children that did not ask for this.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Right?

So, yeah, I'm just curious then, how do you— you mentioned that you have ways of kind of protecting and managing your energy. Can you share a little bit about that? I'm just— as someone who is also, um, Perhaps not to the same degree, but I also consider myself to be an empathic person. I do notice the effect that the energies of other people have on me, and I've built some ways. I'm just curious, for someone who is next level in that empathy spectrum, how do you do that? How do you—

I'm still evolving, babe.

How do you make— Yeah, sure.

Thanks for taking that right there.

Yeah. But as you've gone through Your journey of experience of understanding what— that it is, in fact, a superpower, and how to kind of be with it responsibly in a way that also serves and protects you. I'm just curious, like, how has that evolution been for you as well to make sure that Camila's safe through all this?

Yeah. Yeah. Well, that— even you saying that statement, like, making sure Camila is safe, like, it wasn't even a thought that I had to protect myself. It was just, I jumped in, did what I had to do, and that was it. It was crisis triage. It was just all of the stuff, right? And so, it wasn't until after I left the field that my body— Yeah. My entire nervous system was shot. And still today, I am still dealing with some things. because of that experience. Yeah. Because I didn't have the boundaries, because I didn't have the protection of my energy. I just absorbed everything. So now I've learned to definitely— you know, I have practices and things like that that I do to protect myself. And, you know, whether it's energy bubbles and things around me, I do— I mean, like I said, I just do various different practices to keep me grounded. I will— If I'm in a space and there's a lot of people and the energy just does not resonate with my soul, I have no problem with leaving.

Mm-hmm.

So my boundaries are very, very clear.

Yeah.

And also communicating to the people that are around me that it has nothing to do with them per se. Yeah. Right? Um, or it has nothing to do with them at all. It could just be maybe I'm feeling and sensing that someone is dealing with something and I know how I can get into that. Realm of let me, and no, I'm not, I have to help myself first.

Yeah.

And that was a big lesson that I had to learn, putting myself first because my entire life has been about other people and serving others.

Yeah.

So I'm still learning through prac— different practices that I'm doing, um, to, to manage my, to manage my, my, um, protect my energy. Yeah. To protect my energy.

Wow. Yeah. I'm really, uh, I'm falling in love with you more, right? As you're speaking.

Aw, smit.

Aw, come on, girl. Uh, you know, um, something that Chris and Freddie know, uh, about my life is, uh, I left an environment where I was constantly absorbing. I, I did a lot of work with self-defense and, um, quite honestly, the aggressive nature, what I dealt with, like, I, I've had conversations with so many men, women, uh, kids coming into the space where they had some really terrible stuff, you know, that happened. And I was constantly hearing about it, naturally absorbing it. And, uh, very recently, um, I left that space even though I loved what martial arts does for people and how it supports their, um, Mm-hmm. Their safety and their wellbeing. There is a side of it for me, cuz I was so enveloped in seeing all the darker stuff all the time and not having enough space to be able to process all of it. I was taking on so much. So like to hear you say that, I think is so beautiful cuz especially in this last month, I'm like, ooh, what is this? Like, this is a really beautiful sense and feeling. But then also I know this is gonna be an infinite game for me. And I think it, I love particularly what you said around, I'm gonna keep it 100, right? Like I'm still practicing. 'Cause I think that's like the beauty of it is like someone that is so, someone that cares about their body knows that it's gonna be a lifelong game. Mm-hmm. It's not gonna, there's not a destination to that. But one of the things that I'm very curious about Because in my field, at least, I absorbed that, but I was also a person of service. I was constantly giving back. And that really caught my eye when you first said that, uh, at the start today. I was like, man, I'm curious how that must have went or how you balanced it, because I think that's a tricky combination, you know, for a lot of people. It's like absorb and be of service is— Yeah. It's tough. Yeah.

Yeah. Well, I didn't balance it. So, it's, you know, I absorbed it and just kept serving. I just showed up every day, you know? And so, like I said, that's why it wasn't until I left, I didn't really realize the magnitude of what I absorbed. And so, even now with the work and the things that you do to protect your energy, it— you don't know if you ever heard the saying, new level, new devil. Every time you're elevating, every time you elevate to the next level, there's going to be something, right? So it's going to, it's going to, it's going to require you to adjust your boundaries here. It's going to require you to speak your truth. It's going to require you to protect your energy. It's going to require you to say no, right? So it's an ongoing thing. It's an ongoing thing.

Yeah. Thanks for speaking to that. I really appreciate that too. And I think it's so powerful also for like, men to also recognize that in women, like how much they're holding, but also women to like be inspired, right? By this process as well too. Like, man, I'm just like, so my body's just, yeah, it's just so happy.

Well, and you mentioned, you mentioned receiving, you mentioned receiving. Yeah. And so even that, when I say outta balance, it was, I wasn't receiving. I was re— I wasn't receiving in the way that I re— needed to actually receive. Right. 'Cause again, it was me giving. And so now, um, that is the work that I've done with— I have people around me that pour into me and, you know, and hold me accountable and are there, you know, to support me in ways that I'd, I'd never experienced before. Mm-hmm. Especially the masculine. So I know we're talking, we're talking about like all of this, but it's, it's like, I would say with the— when it comes to the feminine, And there is this idea that she has it all together. She doesn't need any help. She's strong. She can handle it. And the reality is that is true to an extent, but a lot of times we've been placed in that role because of maybe our situation, circumstances, relationships, partnerships, whatever, right?

Yeah.

So we've been placed in that role and we've had to. It's not what we wanna do. It's what we've had to do for survival, right?

Yeah. Yeah. Um, well, speaking of the feminine, you know, uh, Smith talked earlier about his experience with you the first time, you know, you with your, like, your tenderness. Uh, and I experienced that too, for sure. And I will never forget The first time I met you and you walked into that room, and what I experienced of you was just this big energy. It was just this big, beautiful, shiny, bright, radiant energy that just enveloped me. And I'm sure it enveloped all of us, but definitely enveloped me. And, um, I remember you had this water bottle that was encrusted with all these bedazzled studs, sparkly stuff. I had never seen anything like it. And that was like a physical representation of your big energy.

Mm.

I recognized, um, you know, later during that, during that time, I got to really experience the bigness of your divine feminine energy. And we can talk a little bit more about, you know, how that experience was for us and for all of us, you know, during that time, because we were all together.

Yeah.

In that space. But, um, man, I like— Sumit talked about you know, falling more and more in love with you. Like, I've, I've been in love with you since day one. And so, yeah, yeah, absolutely. Just this big, beautiful, divine feminine energy. Tell me, like, what, what was that journey like getting to that, you know, like this, this, um, I don't really like to call it confidence because it's deeper than that. But it's more like infrastructure. How did you develop that infrastructure to be able to move and navigate a space with that big energy and it not be overwhelming for people?

Wow. Thank you for all of that. Um, again, it is, it is continuous practice because What you guys don't know is naturally— and it's funny that I'm about to say this because the people— you guys that know me would never think this, but I'm shy. And so— yes, right, Smith. Right. Exactly right. So, of course, you guys experience me, and it's like, that's not a shy person, or what have you, right? But naturally, I'm not necessarily— unless I know people, whatever, I tend to just kind of be to myself. Yeah. So I'm pretty shy. So it takes— It has taken work for me to show up, especially in the spaces that we have been in, to show up and to the progression from the time that I've been in this space to where you guys see me now. That has been the work that I've been doing because I literally have had to deal with my own conditioning, the judgment that I get. Being in spaces where you're the only Black person, African American person, or maybe one of two. Mm-hmm. Right? Being a full-figured woman now in this, in this stage right now in my life, right? So, you, uh, dealing with all the different judgment when you're going into spaces, it's not always well received. And I can feel that, and I understand. I don't take it personally because I understand I activate, I activate a part in people when they experience me. So some people are activated and they see the love and they're like, oh, what is she? Oh, that is something. Oh, what is she? I need to get. And then there's some people be like, what the fuck is that? And stay the fuck away from me because they're not ready to access that part of themselves.

Mm-hmm.

So I'm a walking permission slip for people.

Hmm.

I love that.

And I understand that. And it's not easy to step into rooms understanding who I'm called here to be. So that is the work that I have to do behind the scenes so that I can be fully in the, the place where God has me and where he wants me, which is to be visible and to be serving in the way that I'm doing now. I would prefer to hide. My career that I had before, I hid. And not only that I hid, it was, it was part of the job. We weren't supposed to be visible. You're not on social media. You're not doing those things because of the work that we did, because of the people that we worked with, right? Mm-hmm. I, most of my life was hidden.

Yeah.

So what you guys are experiencing is the work that I've done to get here. And it hasn't been easy, but I keep going because I understand who I am and what I'm called here to be. Woo!

I'll, I'll just say how grateful I am to experience Camila 3.0 or 4.0 or whichever version you are on. And I'm just sitting here listening to the conversation and the word that keeps coming to me and flowing through me is energy. is the, the, like, your aperture, right? The diameter of the aperture that you have for energetic flow is massive, in and out. And the pros and cons that come with that is what I'm hearing you speak to. Um, and I'll share, you know, my first experience. I had a chance to experience you, uh, before, uh, my brothers Freddie and Smith did, uh, once before. Yeah. And, um, Very similar experience of, ooh, that energy. I like that energy. I envision it was almost like a flood or a tidal wave, but not in a dangerous way, but just in a— like, you just want to open your arms up and say, yes, come here, come and get me. Kind of this flood of energy and just want to swim in a whole ocean of Camila. That's like— that's what I'm here for.

Yeah.

And I'm so— thank you for being that permission slip for me to step into a part of myself where I might not otherwise want to go swimming in an ocean of anyone, even myself. Right. So that was, you know, all the experience and the time that we spent together has been deeply, deeply impactful for me. And I would love to talk a little bit more about, as we're talking about energies, And especially here in this context, in this podcast, and what we talk about is primarily masculine, divine masculine, how we as men can inhabit and embody the divine masculine, allow it to— that which is within us to have more freedom of expression. And there's a part that we don't spend enough time talking about. Well, I won't say enough time. We haven't spent a whole lot of time talking about on this podcast, which is the divine feminine. Which is the flip side of the coin. I'm so glad you're here, and specifically for your perspective as a woman. What is kind of your relationship with the Divine Feminine? How has that shown up and manifested in your life? And then also, from your perspective, how do you view and hold the Divine Masculine? How has that shown up in your life, in your experiences with the people in your life? I won't even say the men, because we all have masculine and feminine in us. Yeah. It's the spectrum, and we all dance along this line in the spectrum throughout our life. Um, so I'm curious if you can speak to that, kind of the, your perspective of divine femininity and then the interplay that you've seen in your life of the feminine and the masculine.

Yeah. And before you do, I would love to see that chalice, that cup that you just had.

Oh my God.

That was beautiful.

Oh, you literally just saw that? I was just drinking tea.

Oh, it was, it's bedazzled. Of course. Of course. I knew it. Oh, it was bedazzled! So when Freddie was saying that, I was like, before he even said it was bedazzled, I was like, it's bedazzled, isn't it? And he said bedazzled. I was like, fuck yeah.

There it is.

Go back to the feminine, you know?

Great eyes, Mia.

Great eyes. Thanks, man. I didn't even know you saw that. I didn't even know you—

You can't sneak away like that. You can't do that.

I mean, I was just drinking, so I didn't even know you saw that. That's so funny.

I'm already calling it. This is probably my favorite part of the episode. This is it.

You gotta go back and look at that part.

Like, freeze frame. All right. Anyways.

Oh my God. Okay. You're funny. Um, so, um, let me get back. Okay. Um, hmm. All right. I'm trying to see how I want to answer this, if I want to answer it separately or just kind of like in, because when I think of energies, like we all, we all hold both. We all hold both, right? And trying to see. So I go back to, I guess I kind of go back to, because I'm thinking about if we were never, if we were never taught, I'm going to go back to the beginning. If we were never taught about Masculine, feminine energy. We were taught about masculine and feminine roles, right? And so in those roles, the man is supposed to do this, this, and this. The masculine, rather. Let's not— we're not talking about general, but like the masculine is supposed to do this, this, and this. And the feminine is supposed to do this, this, and this. And what I have found is that we've been taught wrong. Mm-hmm. Yes. When we're thinking of masculinity, you know, peop— we talk about, um, um, I, I'm just trying to come through this right now, so gimme a second. Um, so when I, when we think about masculine energy, And the things that we're told, we're taught about, like, oh, it's supposed to be about, you know, providing and doing all the things and taking care of this. And, you know, what is provision? So provision is I'm providing for my partner financially. You know, that means a roof over their head, clothes over there, like all the things, right? I'm providing emotionally, I'm providing spiritually, I'm providing sexually, I'm providing like all these different things. And for me, when I hear that in the way that we all, most of us grew up in that way, is it really does a disservice to men, to the masculine, right? Because there's so much more than just that.

Mm-hmm.

And the feminine, there we're taught that we're supposed to just, we're supposed to be taken care of and we're supposed to be like all these things, right? And again, there's so much more than just that. So when I think of divine masculine, I think of a person who is able— who is able to steward his own power.

Mm.

Right? Same thing feminine. He has to be able to steward his own first before he can ever lead anyone. So that means he has to be able to steward his own emotions. His own resources, right? His family dynamics, his relationships, the responsibilities that he may have. Maybe— well, definitely sexually, right? He has to be able to have his own steward— like, his power, his control over those things. His word, keeping his word. And when the masculine is able to steward himself first, Then he's able to lead effectively. When he's able to lead effectively, the feminine is able to see the difference because we are able to see, we're able to recognize performance. We're able to recognize when someone's words don't actually meet or match their character or their actions, right? So the way that, and what the way I want to look at it is, how do we receive it in the body? Not necessarily with the feminine, this and this and that. How do we experience it in our body? So when we have the masculine that is showing up and he's stewarding his own power and he has that level of, lack of a better word, control over himself, the feminine is able to surrender to that. She's able to be softer in that. She's able to allow him to lead because he's already shown he's able to do that. And so sometimes you'll hear statements that are, that people will say like, oh, like, you know, women, they're so, women are so strong and, you know, they're not submissive and all of that stuff. That's not true. We can't submit to faulty leadership. We can't submit to faulty leadership.

Yeah.

Right. So they're both necessary. We all, we have them both inside of us and they're both necessary in order to have and maintain relationships with one another.

Yeah.

But it also starts with you first. So see, even with us, we have to be able to do that same for us, right? Because if you have someone who is stewarding his own power and the feminine is not used to that, she's gonna Right? She's gonna keep, she's gonna try to control. She's gonna try because of her own experiences until she can see, oh shoot, I can trust this. Oh shoot, he's been consistent. His word is actually, I can trust his word.

Yeah. Yeah. Wow.

So I, I look at it, always look at it from a place of just what we feel and experience in our body.

Thank you.

Yeah, thank you so much. What a powerful, powerful point of view, a powerful way of being with. One of the things I took away from your share is that we've made it up. Like, we've called these different energies masculine or feminine. We've put them in these specific boxes. When I say we, if you look back far enough, more than likely has patriarchal roots, right? This is we, the men, who have made up these distinctions in our society and created these boxes in which we place people based on gender, appearance, whatever it may be, and expected the characteristics of, as you pointed out, the performance to show up.

Yeah.

Right. And the amount of what I hear you pointing to is the amount of wounding that happens there when we don't acknowledge both the whole range that we all have, that we get to play in, that you don't have to stay in this box, that we can play in the entire range on the entire spectrum, and that we don't always have to fit in that box.

Mm-hmm.

Right? And when we're thrust into a place that maybe we're not— another way that wounding happens is we don't get the training or the education, as you said, kind of that self-realized, self-actualized masculine of someone who could be the steward of their own energy. Who's teaching these boys to steward their masculine energy? Nobody these days.

Nobody. Right?

They're looking to the internet. They're looking to Instagram. They're looking to the boys on the school bus on the way to school. They're looking at porn on their phones. They're looking at whatever to try to figure out how to steward this masculine energy that is starting to build within them as they mature in their life. So much wounding happens there in the absence of that training and that education on how to be with and how to self-steward this energy. That's why I'm so proud and happy and really honored to be part of these conversations that we get to have, is to bring some awareness, to shine some light on it. Yeah. And it's all part of my growth and education. I tell you, as you were speaking about what it means to be fully embodied in the masculine, to be that leader, to be that self-actualized man. I was reflecting on my previous marriage where for so many years I wasn't, right? I wasn't the leader that was being asked of me for myself, much less for the family that I was performing a leadership role for. Right? Well, no wonder that fractured. No wonder I wasn't the man I wanted to be then.

Yeah.

Right?

Yeah.

So, and this, these conversations are part of my continued evolution and journey. No one ever taught me when I was a, when I was a young buck coming up on how to be with this masculine energy. And here I am at the ripe old age of almost 50, seeking out containers like this, friendships and support systems like this, and doing a lot of the deep inner work so that I can get there.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah. And I, I, I too, like, you know, even in my marriage, um, I chose someone based on, again, what I thought we're supposed to, right? All the boxes of like, yeah, oh, family man. And we're, you know, they say be, you know, be equally yoked. So we were both Christians and, you know, and we, we really, we worked with children and it was like all these things, check, check, check, check. And I was like, wow, right? But there's so much more than just that. And, you know, when you— when you— yeah, there's so much more than just that. And so when you're looking at the different family dynamics and the things that you may see and experience, and if you're both coming to the table not really understanding fully, right? Because no one really teaches you what you're supposed to do about marriage, and no one really talks to you about, like, certain things. So, we are both behaving in a way what we think is supposed to be. I'm supposed to be the wife, and he's supposed to be the husband, and these are the roles, and like all of that stuff. And it just didn't work. It just didn't work. And I know very clearly now that I would never have chosen him today.

Mm.

Because I'm very clear about what I need in a partner, not just a husband or a boyfriend or a relationship, a partner. Right? Who is willing to, like with the work that we do, who is willing to even tap into his emotions and be vulnerable? Like so many men feel like that makes them small or they look bad if they're expressing their emotions or, you know, crying or whatever. And like, do you understand like what that means for the feminine? How we, like, it brings us in closer. Mm-hmm. Those that have done the work to understand the gift that is being given to us when a man is willing to share his heart in that way, not the feminine who is using that and then trying to destroy him with it. That's different.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yes.

So some men are not comfortable being vulnerable because it's been thrown back in their face. It hasn't been received well by the feminine. Yeah. Yeah.

I, um, just feel super called to say thank you again for being here.

Oh.

Yeah.

Yeah. I'm like so present to the gift this is and what this can do for people. It's actually really making me, uh, yeah, really emotional. Right now. Thank you for being here.

Absolutely. Thank you.

And, um, just to speak, you know, vulnerably myself, I think, uh, the way that you explain masculine and feminine was, uh, something that I wish someone taught me like earlier, way earlier.

Yeah.

And, um, you know, one of the things that I, uh, Very present to, uh, it's how like a lot of men do wanna be different,

you know?

Mm-hmm. And they're just fucking afraid.

Yeah.

They're really afraid of the comfortability. They're afraid of the judgments. They're afraid of like all the pieces. And, um,

mm-hmm,

you know, I'm, uh, I'm 29 years old. And, um, I think my age, the one gift my age provides in this type, type of work is to show people that like, it doesn't matter what age you are.

Mm-hmm.

Like you can start right now. Um, and very admittedly, you know, uh, I've talked about this a lot here. It's just like, I'm, I'm not proud how I showed up before. There was a lot of like needing things from women, very unhealthy tendencies. Um, I would, but I was just like craving love and I didn't know how to get it. And the thing that you said around like, it comes here first, like was the game changer for me. And that it also includes like my feelings, like my own feminine.

Yeah.

'Cause I wasn't able to be with it for anybody else until I was able to be it for me. And so I'm just really touched that you put that on, on loudspeaker today and highlighted it because as soon as I got in touch with more of my feelings, that's when everything changed for me. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you for being here. And, um, yeah, really showing people that it's not like a, a right-wrong thing. It's more of like, we get to choose the experience that we want. I think you've done a really beautiful job of doing that.

Thank you. Well, you know, every— I mean, because I did it wrong. I was like, I didn't choose the right partner, but I chose based on where I was at that time in my life, right? And it's not even about wrong. Let me rephrase that. Everything is a lesson, right? Everything is a lesson. And every relationship that you enter, whether it is a romantic one or platonic one, it is to teach you something. It is to teach you something. And I learned so much about myself from that marriage and relationships that I've had, you know, so much about myself. You know, whether it was using my voice. I've always been a person who spoke up. I was— I've been an advocate all my life. But in marriage, it was— Because you're supposed to be this— And you're not supposed to, right? Not understand— I was just dying daily, dying daily, because I wasn't honoring these parts of myself. You know, the parts that you guys see and that you love, everything about me was wrong in my relationships. Everything about me was wrong, right? So, it's not a knock on that person. It is, again, I chose that relationship. Mm-hmm. responsibility for that. And I had to do my work after that to get to a place where I clearly can see like, oh yeah, I see where I need to do some work here and I need to do some work here. And so I can be where I am like today and I've done the work and I'm continuing to do, continuing to do the work.

Yeah, that's awesome. And, um, you know, one of my, uh, my partner's name is Anna. She's, uh, one of the most lovely souls. You actually got to like meet her in— Oh,

is that the one?

Oh, yeah. Yeah, she's, she's lovely. She also loves to dance. I mean, you also love to dance, so it worked out. Yes.

Um, we did, right?

Yeah, you guys did. It was awesome. Um, and one of the things that we've really taken on over like the last year together is like somatic work and like masculine and feminine embodiment of it. Um, and it's done so much like for us. And when you mentioned like your line of work, now all of this like is having me go like, oh, I wonder how that looks. You know, what's that experience look like for the people that you work with? Because, man, they're fucking lucky.

Thank you.

Yeah.

Thank you.

Can I build on that question just a little bit? I'd like to build on that question because, yes, they're lucky. And I also see, man, what a powerful avenue. What a powerful channel, a portal into accessing divine masculinity through intimacy, through sexuality, through pleasure. These are areas where This is forbidden land for many, many men. Right. We're told this is completely out of bounds. There's a lot of shame around it. There's a lot of rigid structure around how to give and receive. And really, it's much more about giving than receiving for many men, many of the indoctrination that we get.

Yes.

Right. As it relates to sexuality and intimacy and pleasure. So I'm curious, through your work, Like, how do you, how do you see men shift in their relationship to their own divine masculinity through this particular lens and channel that you work in?

Okay. Yeah. It's interesting that, you know, I really truly love what I do. Because I get to play all day. Like, I get to play. And I get to play and be creative and help people, right, uncover things that may be holding them back. And so you're talking about the masculine and being able to be in touch. We're talking about intimacy. And even though, yes, I'm a sexual freedom and intimacy coach, and people may come to me for issues or areas that they are having challenges in that area, right? But that's a small part of what I do. It is a small part of what I do. And so creating intimacy with one first, that's what we were talking about, the steward over yourself, intimacy with one first into messy, right? Dr. Fredi, into messy, right? That's right. So a lot of times we are not used to, right? You know, when he said that, I was like, oh my God, I love that. Um, we're not used to Dropping down the facade, the mask. You may have— like, if you're with your boys, you may have that, and you may have that relationship. But when you get with the feminine, it's like, I have to be a certain way. I have to behave a certain way. I have to move a certain way. And what I get to do is show people how to tap into those parts of themselves that their partners actually want to know, and want to see, and want to experience. And the world needs to know and experience. Mm-hmm. Like, imagine someone who is so closed off and so shut down in their body, what that feels like to someone like the feminine. Like, we can feel that and we're like, oh, stay away from that.

Mm-hmm.

Because he doesn't have access. And I need to be able to have someone who has access to those parts of himself to be able to have a conversation with him. Period. Right? So, if— The roles and men are taught certain things. Yeah, it can hinder, it can hinder their pleasure. It can hinder like various ways of how they're living their life. Um, but it starts, like I said, it all starts with us. It starts with us as the feminine. It starts with us as the masculine. We have to do our own internal work to get to a place. And it can maybe small, it may be small steps that you do that, like, right? It's So like I was thinking about when you were, when you were asking the question, I was thinking about, um, someone in particular. I had a client, I had, um, a, I was working with a couple and the wife is the one who reached out to me. And she's, she basically was saying that my husband of however many years, it's been like 30+ years, has always taken care of the family. It's his time.

Hmm.

It's his time. And here is this man in his 50s and he was like, I have no idea. What I like, what I want, what I— had no idea because his entire world has been service to his family. Everybody else first. So, it's not just the feminine. It's not just us. We do that. It happens both ways, right?

Mm-hmm.

And it was— it was so fun, um, to explore this because he came with a blank slate. Like, oh, great, right? And to see where he is today and him using his voice and asking for what he wants and, like, you know, exploring different things in the consent of their marriage is beautiful. But they didn't even know that that was even an option. It— you don't even— like, some of the men don't even know that they can actually truly speak what their desires are. And not even sexual desires. It might just be how we want to live our life, our family dynamic. Like, it could be whatever it is, right? But they don't even know— some men don't even understand. the value of sharing their heart with us.

Mm-hmm.

With the safe feminine, not just with anyone. With the safe feminine that could actually hold all that you guys bring. Because men, the, the, the load that you have on you in this world, especially Black men, Is a lot. Just like it is for us. Just like it is for us as well, right? But we get to— I get to hold all of that for you. And it is an honor to be able to hold all of that for you. Because trust and believe, I know you're holding it for me too. Because when I can't be out there doing what I'm doing, Mm-hmm. When I am, I am, I have certain things coming up from maybe childhood that's like bringing up certain things and I'm like, oh, this is bringing— who, who can I go to? I have a safe place to fall that can help pour into me and build me back up so that I can go out there and do what I'm called to do.

Hmm.

So it's a reciprocal thing. When you create that in your world with partnerships, friendships, community, it's a reciprocal thing. This is how we heal the world.

Hmm.

And the feminine is, is— everybody's like talking about, oh, the feminine is rising. She's already risen. She has already risen.

Yeah.

Ain't nothing to— she's already risen. It's just people are taking notice now. People are like noticing like, oh, Oh, oh, she is powerful. Oh, she can do this. Like, yeah.

That was great. That was awesome.

And powerfully, even men see their own feminine rising and accept and acknowledge the power that comes with that.

Yeah. Yeah. Because sometimes even, even in partnership, when you have a man who is so solid and grounded in who he is, He's not intimidated by her power. He actually supports the feminine in doing what she does. And he's looking at her, like, she could be on TV doing all kind of stuff, and he's like, that's my baby right there. And when she comes home, ooh, I'mma get— right?

Yep.

Yeah.

So, it's like— but then, but when he's not grounded in himself, it's— he wants to control it. He wants to douse the fire.

Yeah.

He wants to bring her down because she's getting too much attention.

Yeah.

And that's what we're— that's what we're experiencing, I would say, now is this, um, this wanting to hold us back. And it's not even possible.

Mm-hmm.

It's not even possible.

Yeah.

You can try. It's not possible.

I, I would be remiss, uh, at this point in the conversation if I did not, uh, highlight what you just spoke into regarding the holding. Uh, because I had the distinct pleasure of being held by you and being poured into. Mm-hmm. Uh, from your seamless, seemingly bottomless cup, um, and, or well, huh?

Bedazzled cup.

A bedazzled cup, a bedazzled well. Um, man, that was, that was such an unexpected and beautiful experience to to be held in the divine feminine that could see. And, and it, and it felt like in some ways also submit to my divine masculine.

Mm-hmm.

It, it, like, I, it, it was, it was insane. Uh, and it, and it was, it's funny. Um, I think it was like, what, a few, a few months before that, uh, experience, we, uh, we had a, a men's retreat. This was in what, what was this, mid-2024?

Yeah, you got it.

Yeah. And there was like this part at the end where we all acknowledged each other and there was a moment where Smith was acknowledging me, and he said, he literally said, dude, people, when they see you, when they experience you, they're going to worship you. And then fast forward to that medicine experience that we had together, and you did exactly that. I wasn't looking for it. I wasn't expecting it. But just the way you just naturally and beautifully fell into that frequency and just poured into me physically, verbally, emotionally, spiritually. Thank you.

Aw.

Thank you for that. So that's, that's the first thing is just thank you and expressing my gratitude for that. Uh, I want to tie that into something that you spoke into earlier around intuition, because I'm, I'm noticing a— I hadn't thought about it through this lens before. I'm noticing like a connection between intuition and intimacy.

Mm.

Uh, can you tell me and, and, and maybe tie it to that specific moment that, and then there were a couple of moments, uh, that night where you poured into me. Like, what, what was your intuition speaking to you that had you say, I'm going to pour into this brother?

Um, hold him. Yeah. Yeah. It— I can't even take any credit because it's all spirit-led. Like, it truly is. I can't even take the credit for that. And it also— because my sight, I saw you.

Mm-hmm.

And a lot of times when I am looking at people or I am experiencing people, I see the different versions of them. And so when I am speaking or I'm loving on you in a way, I'm loving on those versions of you. And so it was just— it was witnessing you. Well, first of all, like, all of you, because when you came in and I was just like, who are they? It was like such a presence. And I was like, yeah, this is different. We ain't used to— like, this is different. Like, these guys are different. I need to know who these guys are, right? And it just like— it was like— You— I was just so drawn to each of you. And I know when I spent time with you, I was drawn to you. And it was like on a soul level, it was like, ah, I see him.

Mm.

And whatever poured through just came through. And I'm grateful that it was exactly what you needed to hear because I just trust it. I trust. I trust it. And so— Yeah, we, we have that intuition. We have that part of us when we listen, you know? And a lot of times we're going back to the body. We all have access to it. A lot of times it's blocked, it's closed down because we're so numb. Our body is so numb. We don't feel anything. And I'm all about feeling everything. Mm-hmm. So again, if I hear people say, I don't have my intuition, I don't have intuition, I don't trust myself, I don't trust, you know, and it's, it, it goes back to the body. It goes back to safety. It goes back to their, their basic needs, right? Safety. If I feel safe with you emotionally, physically, spiritually, I am going to then open like a flower. The feminine opens.

Yeah.

Right? Just like a flower. When you take care of a flower and you water the flowers and you cut off the little, you know, and you just take, right? What does she just flush? She just She opens. She opens.

Yeah. Yeah.

And it's the same for us and, and, and, and, and vice versa. Um, 'cause we both hold all of those energies, both energies, the masculine and the feminine. Right? And so, yes, it was just, it was just, I saw you. And again, also speaking to the fact that, like I said earlier, you don't see a lot of us in spaces, in these healing spaces.

Yeah.

Right? And then when you do see some of us, it's like, still, like, I'm not— I'm not— I'm not trying to talk to you, right? Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Like—

which is unfortunate.

Very.

You know, it's really unfortunate. Um, but yeah, it was— it was— it was, like I said, you guys all came in and it was— oof, oof. If y'all don't know these 4, cuz Wes is not on here, but like these men here are the real deal. Like for real. Like, thank you. Yeah. Yeah.

Wow.

Thank you. Yeah. One, thank, thank you. You know, thank you. Um, I love that story, you know, because, um, I hold my friends really dearly. So thank you. for seeing him. Like, I think that's what really stood out for me to share. For me, it's like, you saw, saw my guy. He's on this side of the screen for me, but you saw my guy. You really saw him, you know? Yeah, he knew. Um, and one thing that I, I love, uh, about Freddie is that he has so many beautiful parts of him, and he's so willing to, to feel it. And in that moment you felt all of it, right? And, um, wow. It— we, um, we are part of a space called the Man Cave. I co-founded it. Freddie also leads in it. It's amazing. It's— and it's for Black and brown men. And what you also just said, Chris isn't part of it, obviously. Uh, obviously. Yeah. So little side tangent, Chris literally took a DNA test and found zero, zero percent Anything besides white?

None.

He was like, I'm trying, I'm trying.

I'm doing my best here.

None. But, uh, you know, I think that's why like spaces and representations of this type of healing is, is so important. But I've gotten to see, you know, through that container originally to start like Freddie and some different shades of him and You know, this idea of holding is such a beautiful one because I think like going back to everything that you said, we cannot heal what's inside of ourselves until we see it. We cannot support someone else until we see them and also be in love with it. Like Freddie has this saying called now love.

Now love.

Right? And like, it's just so beautiful. And so like, thank you for like seeing Chris Thank you for seeing Freddie. Like, that is such a beautiful gift. And I'm, again, I'm so ecstatic for this episode because I cannot wait for the ripple effects that are going to be created from your presence. So thank you again. And I will probably keep thanking you. Thank you.

Well, thank you all too, because you, you allowed me to see you. You didn't know me. You, you had to make the first step as well too, to be open to allowing me to see you. And I know I even spent time with Chris one time too, and he allowed me to see him. And then I also witnessed you all allowing each other to see each other and how you were supporting one another. And it was like, who are they? Who are they? It was beautiful. So, yeah. Yeah.

We're men in process. That's what it is. And supporting each other, holding each other in that process as well. Which, as we're coming up on our time here, but I do feel called to ask, we've all had a chance to share, and you've shared so beautifully and lovingly with us of our experiences with each other and how we've been there for each other. And for our listeners now, for those men who are perhaps just starting to think about or just starting on their journey of Exploring who they really are in their masculinity, or for those who may be well along the path, they've been doing a lot of work in themselves. What message do you have for them?

Hmm. I know you're saying starting out and it can be a challenge, but what came to me instantly is if you are in a place where you can find one person that you allow to witness you. Witnessing is so powerful. It still starts with you first because you have to be honest with yourself, radically honest with yourself first about the areas, the things that you know that you are challenged in or what have you. And then having a person be a witness for you in that, not to give advice, not to, you know, tell you all, like, you know, solutions and all of that stuff. It is literally just a presence. Sacred presence heals so much. Sometimes just sitting next to someone without saying a word does wonders. So, I would say find someone that you feel comfortable enough or, or at least willing to get to a place where you're willing to develop that relationship with that person to be that for you and you for them. Yeah.

Powerful. Thank you. Thank you. That's really, really powerful advice. Um, and I'm taking it to heart for myself as well. Even after the years of work I've put in, I was like, yeah, How and where can I continue to be open to being witnessed?

All of us. All of us. Yeah.

Beautiful. Kings, any final thoughts for Camilla before we have to say goodbye?

Thank you.

I love you. I

love you too. I love you all. Thank you.

I will also, I will second and I will co-sign on all of that. Camilla, thank you. And I love you. And it's been such a joy to have you be a part of my life. And I speak for the other men also in saying, you know, just the effect, the impact that you've had and that the short times that we're together in person, but also just, you know, the continuing conversations, the continuing friendships, the ongoing support, just the being with and for each other is really so special. So yeah, thank you for joining us here today. It's been an honor and a joy to have you here. Truly a special and, dare I say, groundbreaking episode. We have our first female guest.

Freddie, can we get an ayy? Ayy!

I guess we popped the cherry, huh?

There it is.

There it is. And with that, we will bring it to a close, this episode of When Kings Unite, where we hold masculinity— oh, oh, we're not closing yet. Freddie has something.

I think we would be remiss if we didn't ask Camila, where can people find you?

Thank you.

Oh, well, thank you. Okay. Um, well, I am— my website, um, my business name is Flavors of Pleasure. And so you can find me at flavorsofpleasure.com. As well as on social media, any platform on social media is the same as well. So that's my info. Thank you.

Awesome.

Thank you, Freddie. Thank you. I completely skipped past that, stepped over it. Thank you so much for bringing that in, and we'll make sure and have it in the show notes. We'll have all sorts of links where people know how to find you. Um, yeah. So with that, I guess now we're officially— wrap it up with this, with this episode of When Kings Unite, where as always, we hold the mantra of masculinity as medicine. Thank you so much for joining us today. And we look forward to the next episode. We'll see you then.