Beyond Transactional Love: Building Real Connection, Presence & Growth in Marriage with Jarek and Jessica

My friends, welcome to another episode of the day Dr. Wide podcast. And Olive and I, back from 22nd anniversary. Sign us. What was your top element before we introduce our amazing guest today?

You know what? We didn't do gifts this year, but we did something a little bit more, like, sentimental for each other. Oh, you bought me some gifts. But I thought that was very, like, meaningful because we. We haven't done that, so.

Has there ever been a time we went on a trip but we did not buy on a tire suitcase?

That's okay. Yeah, I. I thought it was good.

I like the.

You wrote me a book and I wrote you vows, so it was good.

Special. All right, well, we'll talk about on a different shelf. We have, as we told you, we've been bringing guests on for the last year, and every guest we have on the show comes for a different reason. I've connected with them some way. They've connected with my wife some way, and they have a unique angle on life. Every single one of these shows focus on the same thing, which is revealing one more aspect of what it is to stay together in a dynamic relationship while having children, sometimes blended families, sometimes not. Creating building businesses, living wealth and abundance, and at the same time, dealing with the dark side that comes with all of that. So our guest today and his beautiful life. We actually did a podcast together here about a month ago, a month and a half ago. It was the first time I did a podcast before the podcast. And Jerky Jericho and I sat for. That was not normal for us to do.

No, no.

Normally it's like a vibrator.

No, no, that was, like, three hours left. Like, seriously, like, okay, we. So we're not doing the podcast anymore. We, like, like, literally, like, we could not stop. We were going. We were going.

We're like, we should get started.

I mean, the energy we're exchanging, like. I mean, this was, like, amazing. Like, if we. If this was recorded, it would be next level.

Yeah, I know. We didn't. We. We'll put that on the team.

Finishing your.

I know.

We'll come. We're coming. Yeah, Everybody's fine. Did you put it on the end? Then you criticize this, too? It's like she keeps saying, it's like, where did. Somebody comes in. Give him the mics. Like, give him the mics. Like, there's so people that, like, immediately. And it's. It's, like, perfect. Like, that was made. Yeah.

Now we also have the next one in the lineup of two straight months of powerful women with sitting in the Magic chair. Jessica, welcome to the show.

Thanks for having me.

Very excited to have it, too. Okay, so here's the deal. We're going to dive right in. You ready? Jessica, I'm gonna come to you with this question. Who saw. Who first? Did Job see you? Did you see jerk? How did this go down? Was this a random occurrence? Give us the detail.

This went down in a dating app during COVID We were on Bumble, I think. So it had to be. I think if I remember correctly, I think I had to swipe on him in order for the match to occur, and I had to reach out first. So by the time I swept on him, he had already swiped on me. So it was an immediate match. And if I spoke to him for extended, he would be able to respond to me. So that being said, I. I would have initiated the conversation.

So this is another marriage process by Bumble. Bumble is bring your gut. This is. Okay, so what did you see? What was the hook that had you go, I'm going to swipe on this guy? And the thousands of guys who were on that act wanting to swipe on Duke. Guys, go, give us the superpower. What was the marketing hook? What was he. What was he looking like?

Or would you say I'm listen.

Sorry.

Well, to meet up the time I'd been single and dating in Miami and Yach. The Yach is Fort Lauderdale father. And just such a different vibe. I think that's what struck me first. Woods get puzzled with his children and more of, like, familial settings rather than clubs and tigers and sports cars. Just your stuff. Empty hands. So I have a child, and I just think it was refreshing. It's just kind of like a different speed than what I was used to in Miami.

Rehearsal with the overspeed.

Most certainly.

Yeah.

Get on tigers.

No more tigers.

I had it up. Yeah.

Yeah. Jerry never had a tiger. No, never. I never had a tiger either. That's okay. That's good. It's a. That's a good thing. If he had tigers, we're probably out. Okay, so you swipe the. You said you had to send the first message.

I had to send the first message.

Okay, so what's the first message? You said?

So the first message was small, just to kind of see how he responded. But what I do remember is I have an introductory three questions that I asked anyone just to see how to answer in mind are, if we went on a first date, where would you take me? Do you clap when the plane lands? And do you go barefoot in the Air, airports, airplanes. Those are my flying.

Like, did you remember. Do you remember getting these questions?

Yeah, that was the weirdest shit. What the hell? It's like they around yesterday. I mean, like a fun show. Is that like, I really. Like, I thought she's joking, but. Did you answer them? Yeah.

Okay, I'm over answering.

Yes.

No, no, no. None. None.

Well, free, bro. But then what was the first.

It was the first little date.

I'm trying to remember.

Where was it? Where would you take her on the first day?

Well, the first date is because it was Covid. So I was like, well, we had nowhere to go. We got to come over. The restaurant was closed like a bit. Like, So I was like. And we remember. Like, we talk about it.

Yeah, yeah, it was. It was a little bit different because of COVID right?

I'm telling you. Let me tell you from my point, okay? I immediately, like, she asked me. So what happened is she was setting on the app, like, listen, I'm not doing this. Like, you know, here's my phone number. Call me. And we start talking. And I'm driving to Miami on a date. While I told her I'm driving for.

To.

For the business meeting. I'm talking. That's a. That's. And I'm talking for like 45 minutes. I cannot get off the phone. I can. And I'm like, I'm like, at the. At the other person house. And I'm like, I cannot get out the phone. I really went to the date in 15 minutes. I'm like, dude, I gotta go. And I called her and I said, listen, you gotta come over my house. Like, we cannot go anywhere.

Really.

My meeting. But it wasn't a meeting. Was a day. I was keep, you know, thinking about her. And I was like. And. And then we continue. Like, you put. Like, she said, like, I'm not coming over. I'm like, where are you gonna go? Like, I'm like, listen, it's not only me. There's gonna be other people in this house. We're gonna feel comfortable. It's not like a date. Like, and. And that's how it started. And then my friends was like, dude, what? What if she's not real? What is? This big woman's gonna come out. Like, there's a different big shit. Like, you'll be like, what? But everybody was in the window looking. It's like, why? That's not her. I'm like, what do you mean it's not her? It's her. You know, I was new to that whole thing.

So, okay, so. So the answer is work. Obviously you did. And when he said the cell phone right out of the gate and said call me, were you like, okay, does this fit in line with the game? Because I don't know if that's how the game. I don't know how the bubble game works.

He sent his phone numbers like, comment. I was like, no, I still, I still need to find out more. Like, because people are just crazy. And so there was, there was more questions and more information I needed.

But also she told the out of you.

I definitely. I googled, you know, I didn't Google utel. I read that I will come visit you. And then I did. And I dropped a pen for my friends. Like, when you live in Miami, Fort Lauder might as well be like the next state over against, you know, travel Miami for Audigo. And then like, it's just if it weren't for Covid, I'm not sure how all this would have gone because it never would have happened. I never would have gone to your house. I never come to Fort Lauderdale. It was because of COVID So it's like everything. I kind of vacated all of my norms.

When it was a nice to thank her. We really started dating from Lulu Lemons. And we always, we saw each other from.

Where she can't really.

So like, what you don't go, you know, with the nice clothes, you know, it's like, you know what I mean? So we immediately met, like completely like organic. And for six months I thought, she's a setup for my ex wife because she was in the same line of business. She knew everything about. About real estate. She like, she was in my head. She like, you know, she like everything we talk was like, this is too good to be true. I mean, it's like I. I mean like, there's no way that's a setup. And like every time after sex is like, you are not being set it up, right? This is not a setup, right? You're not being sent by my ex, right? And she goes, no, just stop saying that. It's six months, right? Like, I was like, finally like, okay, this is not a setup. This is real thing.

And as he. As he thinks you're a setup and you're traveling for Padre Cadetho. What are you thinking?

I have never his. So he had a tumultuous previous situation, right? And whenever you find somebody new you're dating, you hear about an especially. I mean, they were married and there's children. So it's like, okay, I'm trying To navigate the difference between a person who's left a relationship and has certain feelings about it and what might be, you know, more realistic. And so at first I was like, okay. I mean, I can't imagine a situation where an ex would do some. Yeah, Like I just, I was just. I always consecuted the joke because it was like, that's crazy.

Not crazy.

It was. I mean, you know, as time progress, I. The context actually made loves sweet.

Basically, before we started the show, you're like, it's crazy that we're together.

What is.

What's crazy about it? It's backgrounds, how you met all.

I mean, the reason why we talked about it yesterday is because we were in Miami having dinner with friends in my old stomping grounds. So my work history is that I um, been an owner's rep in construction and my first project was building a nightclub in South Beach. So south beach was stomping ground. My daughter was raised getting picked up from the.

From school.

If I was busy by the club's bodyguards or security. And she would be there on, you know, at the nightclub with the performers and people. And during the. So it was like my life was very. Miami was just very different. His was very like suburban. We go to school, we pick up the kids and then come home. I mean, it was just. His was a lot more traditional. Mine was, you know, I live in a high rise. We Ubered. We had instacart come. I. You know, I dock.

What is the car is on down there? Yeah, she go to the store.

I mean it was just my daughter. We're taking Uber to tutor because I work 16 hour days. So it was just like a complete opposite. And then like I went to dinner at 8pm and my friends were from every country and just. I mean he's just very different.

He's like, I go to VE 5pm It's a dinner. What time we go to dinner?

Now Miami is different when we book here because we're like let's see at Taylor and go to dinner and we're like, what time to like nine. I'm like, I'm in bed at nine.

I'm open.

Until we didn't know we were all these places downtown m now and with a club people come up. The managers, we're the only ones that were like, we get to earlier, right? The 8:30 Jewish cell sits there early and doesn't luck to us every time. They're like, Mr. Mwai, we love f ing here. We would love to have him back as our Guest on a, a Friday night or like a Saturday night at like 10. We're like, oh yeah, we need you can't do that. You look a perfect fit for the, for the club. And like. Yeah, that, that's why we're here at 6.

Yeah.

He just sounded good for social. Okay. So there was a complete different attraction happening from two totally different worlds. Yeah. In a cross connect. And for six months you're not sure if this is real. For six months you're going, this is totally different. I'm in suburban gang here, hanging out in Fort Lauderdale. Okay. So at what point do you two decide, oh shit, this is. This Miami, Fort Lauderdale connection is happening. Bumble is about to create another connection for real. Well past six months, Mark.

This other way around.

It was like the frenzy then.

Yeah.

Right around.

So we met May in May and for me, Thanksgiving. This was like we were in our skin or did it break? Right. That's.

When. Is that when you told her? Your letter just said before.

Oh, no, before. Tell me you just started going to respond to that, right? You say thank you to her. This it is. I think you said thank you to me. You're reviling.

I'll say something.

I love you, Mike. Same.

Take care. I appreciate that. That's great.

I think that's what she said. I was like, what did she say?

Thank you.

Thanks, bro. I think it was. I'm trying to remember, but I think there was. I think it was around that time. I think there was some, some tumultuous stuff going on. And I just think that it was like the way he look for me, saying, oh, he's a big deal. He's the type of person that like it in passing. And I'm like, what? Like right now you say all your friends. Yeah, I love you. Wait, what? You know, he like. And so for him, he'd be like, yeah, just. He's not the same. Like for me, I'd like find a way to say it for a week and then like, it'd be like a promposal. Like that's how I say it for him. It's like, whatever. Yeah. So I, I can imagine. It's. It's hard to recall the exact time, but every benchmark press has been like a big deal for me. And for Yach, it's like a Tuesday. Like he gifted me a car and it was a very big deal for me. Yachik was watching soccer and didn't make it to the dealership. When they gave me the car, he just was like, let Me just rid the car. And so when I got home and I'm like, oh my God. He's like, babe, it's soccer game Zaki. It's just. Just move a little bit and. But it's a whole car. He's just like anyways, you like it? Do you like the car? We trip. You like it. Okay. So he's just very latitudistical about things where I'm like, I get it.

Who's more emotional? Who's first line would be more sentimental? Like more emotional right here, bro.

Where we just get them talking about like does the emotional sentimental.

No, definitely you.

I think that hard ticket.

Like oh, Saint Germano def. He said emotional.

Yeah.

Like who's going to put. Who's going to put their emotions on like out of us too.

It's him.

Like we go to. We go to Venice.

Yeah.

I create these books. I call them the Eden Scrolls. It's like my storyline marriage of our relationship. I named it the prostitute and the performer. And it was like expl.

But it's so we're talking to.

At first I was like, what are you giving me? And then if you read it, I was like, that's really good.

There was anger reading it. There were tears and reading it. There were pages ripped out of the book that was. But it was. It was a gift. I was like a power bijou. I'm going to give you something from our. So I'm the first one to be like, here's what I'm feeling. She's a sucker. Like very rarely in myself. Like rage. She'll come in like rage if she's not too seen or heard. But I'm typically the one that like puts my narration down first and then she'll put her emotion down second. Who leads the emotion conversation here? Is it botany.

And don't bury it.

Oh, are you serious? Are you serious right now? Duffy, dare me. Like quadruple. I'll be really. The rage here is on you. The emotion is on me. Right there. Giga's issues. It's. Dude, we can go back and forth now. We shit that.

Yes.

This. Okay so. So I guess we also have the sentiment that we know is me is. I'm like I'm.

Oh no question man.

Gifts albums with scrapbooks that I keep a lot of the kids.

First time in my life I start receiving gifts because like what do you buy me? Like I can get everybody I want.

Right?

And every time she gave me gifts, all my kids gave me gifts when we started together. Like every Time I cry, they giving me something that it's. It's. You know, I mean, that I. That I put, like, I would never. I did not even think. And they gave me like, you know, and it's stuff that keep reminding me, you know, like, I keep having that keep. It's. It's. It's the sentimental stuff, but I would not even think of it.

Was that when for you with Jess, that was like, that's supernatural. Like, that's part of her evil. Was that weird for you to receive?

I thought I'd tell you what really grabbed me, and it grabbed me immediately. It was the three questions like that me over. Like, I can't believe she asked me those questions about it. But it's the first time in my life I had somebody that was putting the all needs before. I mean, my needs before their own needs. And that's the first person in my life that ever, ever gave me permission to be me.

Wow.

And I'm like, is this. This is fucking fake. This is. There's no way she let me be who I want to be. And it's like, even when I was screwing it up, she's like, just, do you boo. I'm like, you're supposed to be angry right now. You like, I am. I'm gonna do my shit. But I let you go first. You. I'm like, like what? Like, I can be me. I don't have to pretend I don't. I. I just can truly, like, you know, just go cry, be vulnerable, be like. Be whatever. Like. And. Or even with the ideas when I'm, you know, be creative. Like, I give you an example. We going through all the stuff. And then I said, I'm going on social media, and I'm scared shitless to tell barrier that I'm the one. Social media. It's like, you know, like all this stuff, you know, that we have so hiccups in our relationship. Like, all the relationships are. And I'm going on social media. And she goes. She looked. And I was like, I was skilled, shiftless. And she look at me. Whatever makes you happy. I. I'm definitely gonna, you know, support. I support you. I'm like, what? They're gonna be women. They're gonna be like, you know, it's like, I support you if you want to do it. I'm like, what? And there was like, just one. Is that. There's like. I can give you millions of examples. Like, bu. What? I don't have to pretend. Like, I don't have to. You know, And That. That gives me permission to be creative with my own self. And I was like. I was like, evolving as a man because I was always even like, my. My parents love me. My parents are still together. They did this. You know, I'm a father of five now, so we screw up so much in life. Right? But my parents did this out of. They knew what they knew at the conscious level. They were working, but they were always putting me down. In my entire life, I was getting down by the coaches, by the priests, by the teachers, by the partners, by friends, by everybody else. And suddenly, at age of 48, I have, like, an angel sending to me. It's like, do whatever you want to be. What's wrong with you? You're supposed to criticize me. You're supposed to tell me whatever. You're gonna forget out the reason. You know what? I stopped drinking. She never called me. Don't drink. You want to drink, drink. Like, why are you supposed to be mad? No drink. Or didn't let it work. And then suddenly I was like, I want to drink because I could.

Yeah.

It doesn't give me, like, hiding, the counting, the. You know. And suddenly I woke up one day, like, I mean, I went through the process.

Yeah.

Suddenly. Yeah. But you gave me permission to. You know, I mean, she gave me the permission. Just do you. You're gonna get sick of it. And. And guess what? My eye came up on my own. That shit doesn't serve. But, like, I can. Yeah. Yeah. Like l. Examples. Yeah.

Like. Yeah.

No judgment.

Yeah.

You know, I mean, like, my part of me, my partner is not judging me. I mean, when she gets emotional, I.

Mean.

This is my bodies, and I stick to my bodies. But we don't live in ultimatums and definitely don't live in any space where there's anything productive in tearing down. So I think that's always, like, my values are first, so those are things I believe.

They're strong.

I also think that it was very clear that even for Yadav to tell you that the first six months he thought that I might have been. Had a nefarious purpose for being around, there were several indicators as I got to know him that he wasn't operating in a space of feeling safe. Feeling. It'll be the best way to put it, but it would.

I just.

I could tell that he had been hindered from. From feeling.

Like.

I guess sick is the best word. And. And so for me, it was always important to. To not be a part of that system and to make sure that. That he had safe Space and that.

It just operated and a different system.

Different upbringing, different, you know, my entire life. I have to earn love with my parents. I have to earn love. I have to be better. You know, I have to do better in school. I have to be better out of the. I have to perform. Then through my. I'm getting goosebumps. Then through the relationship, I always have to. If I'm not performing, if I'm not doing better, I'm not. I'm not providing value that I'm not being loved. So my love was always conditional. And she showed me in a stripper of time, like, love is unconditional. I look it for who you are. You know, when you the shit up, like, I still love you. I'm not. I'm not liking it. But let. Let be you. Be you. So then what happened is I could just resolve all the issues and I'm still. I'm. I'm a working process with beyond the shit. I'm a working process. And you know, we talk about it like this is going to be forever. Like we evolve, man. That's why we even do the podcast. It's a progress. But my progress stopped because I figured that it doesn't matter what I know enough.

Yeah, we've been. We had been stuck in that as a couple. That's why I call it the performer. And the prostitute was like there was this transactional love.

Yeah.

When we got together, Daniel was 18. I remember she was 18 years old. She really unbettered me. Got married when she was 20. I was divorced, I had a son. She was 25, 27. We got married, she's 20. I've been together for 24 years. So we got. We crowded on through the gamut watching her get to experience that. But for most of our relationship, Danielle wasn't safe to share.

But even to put some context behind that. So I grew up. My parents were entrepreneurs. I grew up in that. A 12,000 square home. He was. Grew up in a totally different environment, literally, like trailers, like small towns, like every. And so I loved him and saw him for who he was. Like, who's this guy you're dating? My mom was like, you're crazy. Who's this guy you're dating? She told me there's lots of fish in the sea, like move on. And you know, and I'm like. Because here I am 18 and meet this guy. He's been married, divorced, has a kid, doesn't come for money. And I'm like. I felt like I saw him for who he Is right. But as we got married, because of how I was raised, he kind of felt like he had to perform, like, to show it for me. And I was like, no, no, no. I need to remind you, when I met you, you had a piece of shit $500 car. Like, I knew who you were.

So. But it.

I. But I can understand that. I think that men get to this place to show your value. You're constantly performing until you get to this point where you're like. He even like, just this last year, he's like, I'm tired of performing. And yet, like, how he's calmed down. And I'm like, yeah, you're safe. Like, we're not here to see him perform. Although I love seeing you on stages and seeing this piece of you come out when you're home with me. Like, I prefer you don't perform. I prefer you kind of be home. Be.

Be you.

Most guys. Most guys have been. Jerry. Remember talking about that? Yeah. If we was most of the time that raised under that phrase, hasn't it? Which is. To earn your love as our woman, we must constantly double the ante. The challenge we got into was we had. I had created such an abundant world around her that she lost all sense of herself. From nannies to cleaners to shoppers to assistants to. Everything had become so padded. I thought I was providing a life that she wanted only to have created a prison in a palace like a litter. You got fright. Great. You want the earth. Great. You want a shirt? Great. You want this necklace done. You want this ring? That's a problem. I'll hire someone. I don't want to do that, but I'll get people to do it. I'll get people and get people to do that for you. Not realizing the whole time all of my behavior was actually attempting to prove my worthiness to have her from the beginning, only to recognize she'd already chosen me before I'd given her all the shit. But how did you. How did you come into the relationship with that frame? Because we're around hundreds and hundreds of couples with, like, a border who are trapless. I'm calling a performer prostitute. And then me is like, hey, I'm gonna perform for you this way. You, me, I'll provide, and we'll have some good conversations. I want you to me on demand. I'm gonna buy you whatever you want. This prostitution game opens up in marriage, which the only time I saw the send a table with a bunch of my guys in San Francisco at this conference, and one of Our guys was like, he got divorced and he'd hire a bunch of escorts and guys, some of the guys were like, dude, what the are you doing? And then one of the dudes was aerobics. You've been in programs for like 10 years ago.

You know.

At least he's honest about that's what you're talking about. He said, let's, let's talk about this with a. How many of you buy shit for your wife so she bucks you. How many of you just think if you keep buying more stuff, you're going to earn more physical and emotional affection from your wife and that you expect it. He's out. Look at us. We all married prostitutes. And they all agreed to it, but I didn't even know they were. And it's not like I'm not talking about like prostitution. Prostitution, but like the energy of training.

That says you brought a good point. I hope you're comfortable. But about it, she is like, listen, I cannot fuck you on your phone. There is something, you know, like, you have to understand that, that I have. There's something going on. I have to feel the energy. This is like, I know that's what you used to your previous relationships. It does. It doesn't work with me. I'm not like that. You know, I need you. I need you to be present. I don't. About all the other stuff. And then of course, that and I'm coming in. And you know what I've got wrong? Well, look at the lie you get over there. It's like, I don't care. How about you? I don't. People like, I cannot even have sex with you right now. Like, do not even hear.

But it's a dynamic too. The dynamic is in the relationship. All I have to do is pay the bills and give you things and my side of the relationship is done. You need to take care of all these other things and be the things that I want in order for your side of the relationship to be done. And I think that's for me to be hyper independent before I met you and then come into this space where you're basically saying, you don't have to work. I'll buy the things that you want. That's how I'm going to show up in the relationship. And what else could you want? And for me, it's. I can do these things for myself. I never asked for the excess. I'm, I'm, I, you know, for me, I'm a partner. And I think that's where we kind of missed Is I'm saying I'm not a prostitute. I have been able to be the provider for so many years. I have hyper independence, which dude could be a gift or a purse.

Sure.

And I don't want to be made to feel like a prostitute because that's the way you're making me feel right now. I bought you this. I can do what I want. And I'm like, wait, hold on a minute. I lived in a condo. I had a cute car. I was doing great by myself. So that necklace isn't going to buy you whatever you want from me. I would actually prefer it.

And this is.

This is literally happening a lot. I prefer romance. I like effort in not material things, but in sentimental things. The first time Jarik tried to make a gesture of sentiment.

Don't put on camera.

He googled how to be romantic and sent me a edible arrangement.

There you go. Hey. I've asked katgbt did he deliver?

Did you deliver?

He said no day.

Yannick has never bought me a gift himself. My daughter buys it. His daughter buys it. He did pick out my ring. I sent him a picture of what I wanted. And. But he did that. But he. It's to him. It's a blank gift to you. So who cares where it came from or your daughter picked it out? I paid for it. So you still got a gift. And for me, it's. I want it to be something you picked out for me. And we have this myth frame it. We don't know.

Don't do the sore floor. Hair is the process. And because you have everything, everybody does all the shooter.

Yeah.

And it's like paying any deal for you.

Exactly. And that's what she's like.

We're like, dude, we are the source of all this cursing.

Yeah.

Our stuck in a bite.

Yeah.

I'm a flower store.

Yeah. Yeah. So he.

He started, like, bringing flowers at work, at home. I'm like, that's so cute. And then see, all of a sudden, I'm getting flower reagents delivered to the house once a week instead of him physically. Jiminy.

Or twice a year. I don't remember.

He's like. So him physically going and kicking him up. And then he's like, why do you care? They're getting delivered. And I was like, I thought it was true that you went out of your way during your workday. You put on buffet.

I died in the Oprah.

I was there at the flower shop with the oh, here. And I was. I was like a third weekend at doing it. I was like, I bet you it was way to automakers. Yeah. Thought to the owner, I was like, hey, listen, so what would it take for me to have you deliver you just great bouquet. I don't care what it looks like. Just make it all.

Just use that guy's mouth.

But lights want to be dollars a bouquet. That's probably good, right? How big is that? Oh, ye.

That's good.

So that size. Okay. So everybody two times a week. I said, here's a challenge. He can't deliver them on the same day at the same time. She's going to know the gigs up so well. Because why they wouldn't savvy. You act. They're like, they only deliver on these days. And these days, like, well, what would it take for you to deliver on that day and the next week? That day. And then at that time and at this time, he said, yeah, we can't do it. I was like, all right, we'll make a run out of it. Within Juicy doing it. That's exactly. She was. Honestly, I was like, so want you.

To want to get showers. Yeah.

All right.

So this is a miss right there.

Yeah. But that miss is not just you guys and us. I'm telling. This is how we were trying to begin. We were trained in transactional. We provide. You could have. This is what we've been taught from the time we were born. And when you start to become more successful to most of the guys who are around, this is the world they operate. Transaction one is why marriage end. And then Miami has just a great pull of transactional winners where you can just go get, go get, go get. Which we think will bring us out. Yes. Only to find out it's this challenging woman and this challenging, independent woman who has her own money, who look at us. And they called the bluff. Which for guys that are used to transactional shit were like, I don't understand what. But it's not working.

Do you want rich in Miami? Whatever. Yeah.

It's.

You're like, I don't need you. Like, what does it say? Well, what. Why would you date?

Like, what's. They don't really feel value. And so, like, many times it was like, I didn't like it. I could tell. I didn't like it.

Yeah, I. It's interesting because Garrett, he had to remind me because I'd be like, I want you to come help in their business or I want you to come do this. He's like, well, you don't understand. I hired Anna and Jeff and all these people to support you. And I was like.

These seven people I hired personally, please help you.

We don't.

Well, I was trying to tell him. I was like, I do. I'm have to work on being like, I do appreciate this lifestyle. I do appreciate that. But also it means a lot to me if I can just get a little bit of your time, attention and validation. You know, I'm like, it to me, because you're so busy. I know you can put that in another area.

It.

It means a lot that you put it into me and you care. It shows you you care about. Right.

And then you feel guilty for feeling that way.

Yeah. Because my mom is what you last say us. Yeah.

It's. It's such a.

It's a balance.

And. And then you feel guilty so like you kind of back down. And then it's like, what.

But then you don't voice what you want. And then you get resentful because you're like, I fucking want you to want to give me fours.

Yeah. And it goes like that just to.

Validate what you said. My first wife said the same thing to me. I'm like, yeah, whatever. We have all the money, right? The second watch that exactly the same one. And I didn't still did not get the message, you know, because we act so freaking dumb. Like you, I mean we stubborn. We just like, you know, we are. You know me. We just like when she said. And I was like, oh, shit. Like, I want you. I want your present moment.

Did you. I know what that meant when she asked you that first time.

Well, she did not ask me that way. But she's like, I don't care about the other stuff. Like, I don't care about the money. I don't care about. I want you. She did not. I don't think you said it with Presence. Remember we were fighting ed and outside. But then I. Then, you know, then I kind of like that's. She wants me to be present. And then also when they. At the same time they was watching some people reading something and it was our kids. The kids want. They love languages. They want Presence City. They don't care about the car, they don't care about the trips. My kids don't care about anything. She took me on the trip other, other, other. Other breakfast with my son at that time we met. And she was like, what do you. What do you like to do with your dad? And I'm like, ah, watch this. Like they're now when I'm like, dad takes me to all the games, to the finals, the Front seat, the boxes, bike, rice, steel, helicopters. Like all this, you know, yard on the Mediterranean. Go, Charles, choose there. And he goes, I like to watch Rie with my dad.

Oh.

And I'm like, okay, go. And they, you know, I got what he said. I like to. I film with my dad, but he doesn't have. So I can stop the movie. That we could talk about. Unlucky.

Wow.

So that's what she's talking about. That's what my kids are talking about. We there, but we never there. Right?

And I think the argument you're talking about, the crux of the argument, your stance was Akava hollow this. How dare you? Yeah, yeah. And I mean, I don't. For me, it was like I asked for none of this, which makes me feel horrible for saying it because again, I'm very glass and it's a viewer thing. But to throw it in my face, as though I should concede from whatever we're arguing about, because you provide it no longer makes it a blessing, it now makes it a burden. A burden, but also that prison you're talking about because it's a beautiful cage and it doesn't feel good anymore. It feels like an obligation and like your right to do things that might cause me pain or make me feel bad or make me feel less than in a. A partnership that should feel good. And so I think that was when it became something where it was like, put on a minute. This is not, you know, I'm not going to say what we signed up for, but this is, this isn't what you envision when you think of things like that. So I think that's where it became, you know, a point in our conversation.

I think all relationships go there though, because in the beginning you're going to have chemistry and you kind of don't really. That's why you're together. And then you get to this place where it's like, I think that guys, high producing guys are like, you should be grateful. It's our job to like, calm back.

Down to earth, you know, we are equal. But what happen, we separate ourselves. I do this, you do this. And we, we, we build the transactional relationship. And on the end of the day, we are equal. Me and women, color, social status, we are equal. We want so. But yet, just from the beginning, we're programmed by parents, unconsciously by grandparents, that that's what we have to do. Like we said, that's men. We only have value. To put our social media men only have value there. Okay. You know, they have to provide value they had like that. It's not true.

Well, it's also a shock show, which I'm sure is a shot for you should be placed with this beautiful woman who's saying, yeah, all your stuff doesn't impress me. I just wanted you. And for me, when Daniel would say this, like, she got very open with me in the last four or five. And I would say the first, I.

Like, guilty because we've gotten to this place where we, like, bought our dream home in California. We had a big car that we wanted, and I was like, why am I like. I kept telling myself, like, I just need to be grateful. And in this space, like, I was getting more and more depressed, and I felt like I couldn't burden him with my feelings. I should be grateful so I can't share, like, hey, I want more of your time. I want more of your presence. Because I am grateful that he's out there hunting and building. And I do like this lifestyle. But I got in such a painful spot where I was like, okay, I'll sell the house. I'll get rid of cars. Like, I don't have you. I'm dying. And I'm like, I, like, I'm like, I could go. I could go. I can create on my own. I'm not worrying about paying bills. I want you. And this happened, like, recently.

Two and a half. For years.

Yeah.

It was just. I was like. I felt like we built this picture of perfect life. Have been married for almost 20 years at that point. And I was like, what is off? I couldn't figure it out. And it was because I was like, oh, it turns out I actually would give it all bats if I could get to get you back, you know, which was my.

I. I was feeling it too, for a few years. I just didn't have a couple language on it. So I just started building bigger, bigger house, bigger. I thought managers had bigger, bigger what I didn't realize. Sabinehouse. I had built, literally, a prison in abundance and had surrounded my life with. And I didn't know why sex had become an obligation and why, like, every. Which I couldn't figure out. I'm like, I'm taking this woman out two nights a week on day three. I've got homeschool teachers. I've got three nannies within a 15,000 square foot house on the beach in Orange County. She's got the. She's got the urine. She's got things. She's got the trainer, she's got the fucking jewelry. I'm like, what the fuck am I missing here? How am I missing this? So when she collides with me and says, I don't give a fuck about.

It, and he's like, how you take.

On the house, take the cars, take the trips, take it all. I don't care. I can't feel you anymore. And if I can't feel you, there's no possible way that I'm staying here. I'm not going to cheat on you. Too high value for that. I'm too. I can make my own money, have my own hair brand. I have my own stuff. I don't need any of this shit here. You figure your shit out. And then I got the text every day. He's my own statements. If the king does arise, the kingdom dies. And don't worry, the queen leaves with the children before him. You think I text her old one time is enough. Because they had parry deep. Every guy was spiraling for months. Like, I didn't know. I was like, here I am. Found our way up, boy. Or training tens of thousands of men. Gotten to the point where for the first time in my life, I like.

Jerryu. Like for months is I kept Jerryu and I was like, I'm.

I his ego.

Yeah.

Oh, is that what the devil is? It's hard to hear the truth, but they hear the truth. It was the wake up call and she does the shit to me and I was like, what the fuck? You know what I mean? And sometimes I got pray, you know, I have the routine in ocean, like, where is it going to stop? And it's never going to stop. I think the challenge is the gropes because what happens, we cannot stop learning. And how do you learn to be present? It's constant game. You cannot stop being present. You got to be at this moment and that's what you want. And that's not good. But the problem is that's what we want, right? We want the same shit. We have a different way of communicating. And then what happened? We got validation from outside. Yeah, you the man. You thought this. You about to shut the up. I don't have shit. I don't have myself. I cannot be there for you because I could not be there for myself. And she gave me the permission to just, hey, go on your own freaking journey. Figure this out. I'm here.

Jesse.

How.

How do you. How do you source that strength in yourself to be? Is it because you've been down the path where you were produced and you were the provider and you were in that spot and I'M asking this question for a lot of the women that are asking because Danielle's brought this up on their show too. It is terrible. Like, I can't imagine I put myself in the last year of her shoes in a way I've never been able to spiritually, mentally, could just do my best, see what it's been like to be with me. Like, I've only looked at it from here. Like, you're so lucky. Then I flipped and I thought, what's it like being married to a psychopath who leverages money to manipulate everything, Every word, nothing is a no. It's a no. Well, you look here, it's a no. But let's pretend it was a yes. Like what were yes has to look like? Well, it's not a no. It's a no. Is it a no? I don't think it's enough. How about let's talk a little bit. I think it's a really yes. You want to see us? How about would you figure out what it's going to cost? Maybe? Yes. And that was the world I lived in. And she wasn't buying my bullshit at all with this. And that was a harvest. She couldn't speak to it. So coming into the last year. But man who's established, powerful, has money, has wealth, has tons of women who would be having to sign up for transactional love, has. You have been my tons of tons of people who are ready to line up for it. Like, you show up as a cliche. Not a girl, not a woman, not a transactional lover. As a queen. And this is the hardest for guys who've actually been searching for a queen their whole life because they show up different. Like, what is it you do as a woman to source ranking yourself when you're with a man that could legitimately steamroll any room he walks into between networks, relationship and resource, could get whatever he want.

I would say in the beginning.

You.

Know, you get to know the representative in the beginning. So in the beginning it was easy. It was fun and exciting and charming because it, you know, in the beginning, it's never directed at you. It's never, you know, so it was always, you know, watching him kind of in these environments where I'm kind of from the outside. So as I became on the inside and start seeing things for what they really were and what that meant for me and. And how that affected my day. I went through a place and time where it affected me so deeply that I. I think the way I internalized it was I need to Be better because this shouldn't bother me. I need to change. I need to work harder at this. I need to find ways to cope with this because I'm a problem. I. It's few and far between where things challenge me in a way that I can't figure it out and keep moving. So in this situation, it was like, okay, he. Because it's not only him. He had four children that were coming from a marriage. And that was an upcloud bio for me. How exponentially. And so it was like this added weight and responsibility of not misstepping in front of all these young people that I don't want to add any type of injury to. So it was a learning curve. I think when I started to learn, rather than blaming him for things that were a challenge, I started to learn how to understand my role in expectations. And. And I was always trying to fix and solve and put my expectations on everything. And when I learned how to kind of back up and fly above kind of those types of minute things that were really like, I would hold on to something and like, rabbit hole in it for a week. Like, I'm not sleeping. I'm going to figure this out. I'm going to fix it. And it must have something I did and replay the conversation six times and then try to fix it and then replay it again. I mean, it was just like rabbit hole after rabbit hole. So when I started to really be able to take myself out and look at things at a macro level, it suited me a lot better. I'm now in a space where my daughter. I just turned. She's 19 now, and I raised her by myself. So it was always like, when she turns 18, I'll be able to turn my focus back on myself. I told myself that for the last 18 years. That's when it'll be me first and then, you know, everything else, because it's always her first, what's best for her. And so in the last year, I kind of lost sight of that because now it's Yadav and he's got four children and his needs and his world had kind of become my world. And so all the things are important to him. And so again, like, just looking at things from macro standpoint, it's put me in a place of, like, relearning how to be myself and what it looks like. And it doesn't mean it has to look like the way it used to be, that the way it used to before him. But that's been like a huge struggle. And then making sure That I don't resent him for all of this because it's a lot to figure out and a lot to sort through, and it's very easy to be like, well, it's as well he did this.

This is.

And I would be having problems more for him, or I would have these feelings. So even try and keep myself out of that space and really just work your. It's. It's been constant work for me because it's just very easy to fall into all of those ruts.

What would take you down the rabbit hole? Like, when you'd say, like, something would stress you out and it would just relate. How do I fix this? Because I think women put a lot of, like, guilt and pressure on themselves, and they're like, I don't want to make sure I bring this out. Should I not? Baby, it's me. Maybe I need to fix it. And you do, and you're right. Like, you move slicko at checkers. Yeah. And then you, like, one day blow up on him.

Right. Okay.

This is actually really bothering me, and I'm trying to fix it, but what I really need to do is communicate it. Is there something specific, like, that you feel like for women that they kind of spiral or rabbit hole when it's like, hey, maybe I need to direct this, like, have a conversation with my husband.

I think for us, it's been in our household because it's. Especially when we first got together, it was his home that I came into and his children. And so there was, like, this feeling of, even though I'm the woman of a household, I don't feel like this is my home. I don't feel like I'm in control of anything. I don't feel like I can run this household. So I was running it from a secondary position. And for him, it was like, why just take control? And it's like, well, these aren't my children. I don't feel good. You know, if it was my child, I get right in there, and it's how I want to handle it. But I. Out of respect for him, I don't want to. And out of respect for their mother and out of respect of this home. And I just didn't really feel like I fit anywhere. And so it was like this space of, like, how do I bring it up? I don't want to be too. I want to attack him. I want to give them. I don't want to make him feel like he's not doing good enough. I don't want to make him feel so it was like, again, I put. He's not even thinking he's sleeping well at that. You know, I'm like, I wonder if he'll be mad and, you know, wonder if he'll be okay if I do this. And what if I leave?

Just do a little bit.

And they. But then it was the overthinking and the over processing. He's like, I have to make it perfect. And for him, like, a good example would be the first Christmas I got ready for, the first Christmas with his family for three months. And it was a very big deal for me. Nobody was scared. And so when nobody else who walked in the door was like, oh, my God, I was like, I failed. And they. A few spaghetti to myself. Whole thing. I made up this entire reality around these things that I needed to value myself, and I want these people to like me. And so as I. As I learned at a later time, I was like, I did this to myself. I put this on myself. I completely put myself in this position of this is it literally Christmas became D Day in my mind.

Yeah.

That's the makeup, right? These people, you know, and his family is so Eastern European, but they were like, no feeling. There's no, what's next? What are we doing? And I was like, did you see? I mean, it was just like. It was a perfect storm that I created. And the reality of me being the one that created this whole thing for myself and being able to kind of laugh at myself about it and being able to understand it now, when I feel myself starting into it, when it's, you know, these outside triggers that I can't control, it's laughing at myself for wanting to control something that I was controlling. Right. Wanting to control other people's reactions to the things. I mean, it was just like, I'm not gonna.

And then you're upset, and I have no idea why.

You're like, well. And so it perpetuates, and it becomes like, this snowball thing, and by the time I explode. Yeah. It's like, what the.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, then we. To lecture ourselves. Like, we.

We do.

It's like, we have to just, like, let it go.

Learn to pick and choose the battle. Yes.

Or if it bugs you, like, communicate.

Communicate without putting it onto somebody. Like, that's. That has been a huge challenge. But getting to that place has completely changed my ability to let kind of go through things in a nice. In a nice way.

I feel like, to hear it, it's interesting, because all there's stuff that'll, like, trigger Me and I want to communicate, but it's like he doesn't cure it. And unfortunately I got to be a bitch sometimes. Like, I'm like, I'm sorry, but that like. Because I got a little spicy. What are going to say the next day? He's like, oh. I'm like, yeah, I'm trying to tell you this like as gently as possible. And you wanted a really soft delivery. You didn't receive the soft delivery. So like the Danielle came out and it was sort of. Yeah, yeah, but.

But you hear of the soft delivery, but you're not communicating with the sub delivery.

Well, no, because when it's not, God, she doesn't care that much.

So. Yeah, Ari, just tell us. Like we enter a little more.

It's is.

You know how many times you. You know how many times she is just like, let listen you out of this, my dear. Yeah, I'm like, no, I'm not here. It's like, no, he's doing this like, so he. He. She knows like how everybody. How could get my attention. But with me, when this is to comes to her needs, it's like she just mentioned by passing. I'm like, it's not important. I just like. And then the second. And then. And then the first time. Yeah, first night. But I was like, what?

Like, guys.

It is like, why did you tell me that?

And then I'll be like, It's Day at 1:48, the Monday before at 6pm and Sunday after. Have we worked to the point where.

Like, I guess that's what you said.

This is a. This is the translation spot, right? Which is where I'm so proud of myself.

In the last two months you've gotten better.

Two months. Two months listening two months. Manager will be 200 years. And.

Second we think we got it.

Oh, bro, I know. It's like it's been two or three weeks. I'm like, it's at least four or five weeks. I've been this great. What are you talking about? But there's a. This was like us like what you're talking about is what she would do and then she wouldn't. I would think she's not talking about it. She would say things. I'm like, I. I wonder just like you.

I'm like, I think he didn't sense the importance of it until I was like irritated.

If I see a vote comes to me, it's like money. I'm like, yeah, okay, cool. I got some to you. It's like, I didn't know that was a Sign that we were supposed to sit and talk about a big problem that's going on in the P and L right now. Right. So my world is if there's not urgency brought behind it, unfortunately, I'm like, okay, sounds good. Talk to Jeanette. Put it on the camera. Like, I don't. Okay. Yeah, okay.

Or something. So in a con unsolving mode. Because all men do. And I'm like, okay. I go like him. He's telling me everything I'm doing wrong. So then I'm like, never mind. I don't know. How about it, like. And it's like, you're telling me everything I'm doing wrong. But I know you're a problem solver and you're talking any employee like, this girl on your way. And he's like, do you under my eye for him? I'm working it. I'm confused in my wall. I'm like, you need to do both.

Rodin. So here's my new scratch. Ready? I'm a good effort his work. Okay. I up once last night. So that was rough last night. Yeah, I lost some shit about her teenager. Wow. Yeah. I was like, you're like, no, no, not at either. So I started looking at his from a totally different space. And I thought, okay, obviously what I'm doing is not working. Clear. She's very clear that it's not working. I'm like, all right. So how do I deal with this reactivity thing? So biblically speaking, very cash on the Bible last couple years. But I wouldn't buy the way that most Christians look for Bible and the way they read it like a history book. I'm looking for something. Origin, Genesis. Like, what is the purpose of beauty, truly. So I came back to it. Truthfully, it's very true right now. Very passionate now, which is okay. The original man, Adam, was given a woman. And his role was to contain, not to control. Contain all of what the feminine is. And I've heard this rubber handle member. How do I do this and contain it gets interpreted like control. I'm not supposed to control or dominate you, but I must be able to contain full range the fiery bitch down here who's ready to stab me in the neck and throw shit and be loving, sensitive, divine, goddess is all. So I was like, okay. Adam had the original containment. Eve printed a fruit, he followed and then he flipped up, hid from God and then did the worst, blamed his wife. So I was like, what? If you could just contain all of it like that as a man, you can all in business Walk into a place of business. What could we deal? People losing their shit. You likely get calmer, quieter and you contain all it and watch me too. Walking border people losing their shell. Like quietest guy that contains all the chaos typically has the toe. But in this relationship, for some reason I forget all that shit out there. And then I'll listen and then she'll come to blob mode. And my response for many years was reactive white apple, listen, listen. And then erupt to meet the fire. So her fire's out. My fire's on earth. You you this bad. Broken glass. And they were not joby for two days. Never mind there's a thousand other women.

That wouldn't get in this out there right now.

This is. She's like, then you better go find them because I'm not going to tolerate this in war. Like, that's what I'm talking about.

For all the.

I'm giving you what the woman. I never asked for any of this. What's wrong? I said off I'm going. Take your cars back. I'm taking all this back. I'm burning that. Burning all down. I never asked for in the first place. Didn't really care when you bought. I'm like, you. You. And then we're right. Just happened what. What was happening. And the next morning it's just weird.

Like.

Like nearest sprinkle bed.

What just what you. What just happened? Huh? What just happened? So then the frame comes like, can I continue at all? So like now I'm like in the last two months, it's just. Just place it like, hey, she's obviously got something she's trying to tell me that I didn't hear. That's a new friend. Like, if she's freaking out this much, there is likely porky messages that I did not get through ethos or feminine checks. Messages that were sent into God knows where of pigeons I don't know about.

How do we miss a method?

I do. Or dudes, we don't have a jam on the. You and I were creating a performance households where it's very simple transaction. I gig you salary. You deliver these results. The end very clear. Roll my role. Give job your job. Do this. You don't do this. Really clear you up. These two don't play in night. And I couldn't figure bar line away for 22 years. Kind of figures out the issue.

You would always want me to share more. And then I was like, okay. So I'd try and be better about sharing, but ultimately I was like, I've shared too much. Is it going to cause a fight or is it a cause? And then I'm like, I don't really want to fight, but I want to tell you how I'm feeling about something without you being offended, you know. So it's, it's like, it's this. It's like a slippery slope. But at the same time too, I think like having guys reactivity sometimes, like I would make it worse. And one of my Amanda action on my friends recently, she's like, okay, I have a trick for you. When he gets like that, he's out of his mind. He's in his ego. You can't reason with him. She's like, you, anything you say from there on out, it's just going to make it worse. She's like, so what you need to do? She's like, I kissed this. She's like, just walk away then come back, put your hand on this heart and just be like, babe, I love you. Calm down. I appreciate you. Thank you for all you do for our family. And she goes, just spend like three or four minutes like pouring into him. And she goes, watch. It will melt him. He will forget what he was even like had an opinion about. So I get it on a date night. And he was literally like. I watched his whole body like.

And I was like, I'm assuring you, I was really uncomfortable.

You were a couple.

Yeah. No, I loved it though.

Well, you were like, hey, because here.

I am, I'm liking like is it this?

He was so angry. And I'm like, you can't be angry if I'm coming.

And she was like coming to me with this.

Like did you trust it where you're.

Like, well, it literally took me two minutes to buy zap come. And so I was just like. And the same fight you have for six months. This is SAP. Why are you doing this for any how this is new. I don't understand how Brazilian is right now. All I know is meat, fire or fire. So I'm not sure what to do with this right now because you're melting with a different fire. On the flip side, she'll lose her in the last couple months and I'm just.

School speaks say, but you know, let's talk about holding space is. Let's define. Because a lot of people don't know what holding space is. And sometimes holding space doesn't mean. Because I was holding space for ever for 20 years and I was just putting everything on the carpet. It's not holding space. So holding Space is not okay. I'm. Babe, I'm going to give you, like, when I s. When I hear whole space, like, how much space you want me to. Can hold, and I do with the container. But at some point we have to address the issue for sure. Hold it seriously doesn't mean that, like you said, like, without a container, like, the control. And I love what you said, that we truly try to control each other. Like, this is the biggest fight that we have. It's control. We don't fight about anything else. Like, the super shit is truly controlled, but we want to contain it.

Right.

But how do we hold space? And I love what you just. Like this. This is like, really. But how do. But what would you expect for him to do for you? Because I love this.

For.

For me, like, I would love that. But why would you like Juan Gary to do for you if you lose your shape?

Like, if I'm in one of my moats.

Yes.

Go to retrability.

I. I do appreciate. Because in the past, when I'm like, upset, whether I'm upset or emotional, like, I need to feel safe that I can be in that space. And what he has been doing recently is just literally kind of being quiet and like, not getting triggered. Because what he would do in the past is he's so good at reframing. So he'd reframe it. And then sometimes I feel like maybe I was wrong. Like, it would just kind of like the argument would twist. And so now I feel like he's actually hearing me. So. And then. And then the next day, I feel like we're in like a space. Or in the next couple hours, we've kind of like, we're in a space where now we can both actually have a conversation, which we have. Then, like, I'm like, we just need a minute. And now, like, we're all kind of cool down. Now we can actually talk about it. Because for. I think when you get so heated, then that's when you get in the stupid argument or you repeat, you know, patterns and you keep circling these same fights because you can't get past trigger. So for us, I'd notice. Okay, if you can get past the trigger, then you can have a real conversation of what just happened. Otherwise you're gonna like, we've done it in periods of our relationship for. Yeah, we're having the same argument.

Why?

Because we never got to resolution. We never actually calmed down to actually talk about it. We just had an awkward morning and then decided to forget or forget about it here's.

The hardest part, dude. The hardest part for me is to come to one truth that is done the most difficult for me to own as a man. I am the container of the calf. And Christian shouldn't be my home, my life and my children. In the end, if containment breaks and things go to chaos and I can't pull, it's on me. I had not wanted to accept this. I wonder ever remember therapy sessions we've been in on life K. When the are we gonna talk about her? There's an action to the reaction. I entire talk about my reaction. I'm tired and angled on the tsunami. And she's a giant little lily over here. And my tsunami is drowning. If you give me one more analogy of this I swear about my legal space. And I was always looking for when is she gonna get it. And then I got this place where I was like what if she's never going to get. What if the point is not for.

Her to get it?

One of the reason you and I are with these women is because they are the only type of woman who can forge true King Shihab. Which is ultimate containment immovability.

I'm not fighting with you. Two days ago, like really I was meditating in the ocean outcome of the ritual. And that's really truly what it came up. Because what happened is the higher her awareness gets and my awareness and the consciousness level, the more we fight. But it's just another thing to bring us to the next level.

Yeah.

And I'm sure two, three years ago I really had the breakthrough is like this shit's never go out. That's what we. But when I look at where we were like you know, five, six years ago and where we here. Like I could not even dream about this. Yeah. And. And. And. And I think the fights are getting maybe stronger, but resolved quickly. And it's like. Because we had more. There's like. You know. But it's. And. And I just realized is at the end, look. Yukat will never stop. We will never stop. We humans are always gonna up shit. But this is Erb. But just taking the ownership and understanding. You know what our fight is always like take it fucking bullshit. Take accountability. You know, like this. And then I'm like finger and her. It's good me.

I just sent him a ring. Cammie.

I do this. What Free him crew Paul, I'm not telling you.

We have a surveillance in our family room.

This was like. And I did a rule.

I'm like, you're probably even going to do this I'm just sending the ring cam, dude.

You know what she did? I like we were, we were like we got in five game right before dude. And I, I make it like serious idea about how much impact that you see. That's all we even do in this. So people know I got mad at her. I don't remember. Whatever. Like that's exactly what you were saying. The fights, right? That she lost her shit. All that's my shit. It doesn't work, right? And then. And the whole life I'm ruminating I'm doing this. Like Rush is going to take accountability, bitch. Fuck that shit. Fuck that shit. So the whole night, like right, my dreams done, right? I wake up in the morning, I'm like ing coffee. She's city, you know? And listen, that's what I, I. So I'm leaving. I'm leaving with the coffee, right? And she's sitting there, like right there, like where Sams is, right? And I'm like, you know, I'm sick. It's time for you to get accountability and ownership. All this all the time, blah, blah, blah. And then I went outside to where we were sitting with the apothecary. And I'm sitting and I'm sitting. I got her. Like I did it.

I.

That was the narrator's and I was like, you know, I got all the validation. So I only text message from her elder. Ah, I got this. You got this.

You did good.

You got sick, dude. This is not. And, and, and you get like, you know, I don't know. I'm embarrassed to show the video. I did this right in front of the freaking ring camera. So she cuts the, the, the, the thing. It's like a 30 seconds video. And I'm watching this. What the. This cup. It's not me.

It's also not the way you recounted that.

Then I'm sitting again. I'm watching this. My teardrops. That's not me. I know it's me. But in my head it was completely different. Dude. I was ready to hit her. Like I was like, what? Like, I know. Like we had coffee, like standing, like, like, like liberty, like holy. That my whole body. The egg. I was shaking. I was screaming. I was like, what the fuck? Completely different. And like my dude, I just went like outside like by the water. Start meditating, praying, start crying. What the fuck? Like I'm preaching, I'm teaching and I'm the monster. But first time I saw it. And that's not even what she felt. She felt probably billion times more than the Camera. But me seeing it, my reaction, it was like.

I was like, that, Jessica, for you when you sent it. And then he watched the response, like, where are you at in that?

I think that what I have learned with Yadik is that he is that range of emotion that he just told you about, where he really felt like, honestly felt like the way that he communicated was the best way and that he didn't, but he was supposed to, and he got be like, you know, he won, right? I knew that he felt that way. I knew that he didn't feel as though he had done anything wrong. You can't argue that in Sub Fool's Mission. So I actually. For me to send in the ring cam, rather than engaging in more conversation, you know, I'm going back and forth. When I did that, I actually kind of shuffled some myself because I was like a. This could go one of two ways. You know, I don't. I wasn't quite sure how he's gonna respond to it, but for me, it was. I'm not getting in the dirt. When we kind of go into these spaces, because I spent so much time past doing that, where I get in the mud, and it turns into a day of the back and forth and shittier and shittier. And like you said, just for us later on to be like, so, do you want to catch dinner? I said, we don't have to waste a whole day doing this. Let me just nib it in the bud. Let me just. I'm not engaging anymore. So I think that's part of me kind of growing up in, like, do I need to win or do I need to. In this case, it was, I need to hold a mirror. His behavior was crazy. I don't want to get in the mud with him and stooping that level, because sometimes you have to. In order for them to pay attention, you have to raise your voice. You have me just as crazy. It wasn't my daughters enjoyed my car that I just so.

Like, I was just the real one. I turn up.

I did. But I. I think that there was actually a conversation I had with Rubble that I never forgot where he said, when Yaruk is not acting like a king, Don expects for him to treat you like a queen. And, you know, don't let him.

He's.

I think he. I remember him saying, the queens don't do pedants. And so when he's not acting like a king, he's out here doing peasant shit. Let him be a peasant by himself. Go to peasant shit. So you Go outside and do that. I sent you a little ring cam and I just waited. But I just stopped dealing with the minouche of like when he gets into that space. Because there's nothing can be gained. You know that it's just going to revoke your days. Right? So I've literally gotten into the space of have the day you deserve. Why are you so.

I think that you're saying like you two as women and the. The few women I know who can pull this off is because you both see yourself from a higher place of certainty than soul alone. And the thing MCN are actually after is this. But the hardest thing for a man to pursue and to maintain is this. Because we live as false kings in wealth. Action like that.

But don't you think that men might think it's easier to be married to transactional woman? So they're like, I don't need this.

And so it.

No, I've been. No, no. 20 years. Believe me, it doesn't work. You get miserable because what happened is same over and over and over. It doesn't get you right.

Seriously.

So it seems easier when you're miserable.

It's not. But you also not being held accountable or to a standards the eight beer is acceptable.

You know what? I was very successful before I met her. But I can tell you I accomplished more in two years than in 30 years before I met her. What happened is all the challenges are even like. Well, you. You have all the we want to have and there's that. Oh, and like you said, it's. It's container, not a control. And it's like, would you do you do. I do. I do right now still there's sort of like. You get me to the point like I will be. We got. We are done three months later. Are you kidding? Not that we pass this ship and it's like, you know, we like, we. We go. We get it and then we gotta go move back and then again. But if I'm looking in right now, sitting here, I'm like looking like all this shit we've been through in the last five, six years. Like what the hell? Like, seriously, like we've been together since everybody. We think this was Tony. Like all the stuff. All the environment we've been. We've been through and you know, all the stuff we are surrounded and the people. It was like. Because remember like when she come aboard, everybody, my family, my community is like, well, who is she? Like everybody thought that like, well, now the one is gone. So now she is gonna be they're gonna be the first ones. And suddenly it took me, you know, I. I would not like, I don't know how she handled like all the stuff that was going on in my life. And. And she's still here. Like, I'm like writing. There's no way, bro.

The only way that's possible. Look at, look at this. Stunning, beautiful. Values, morals, standards. And here it is. Within it, it's more else. And I know. And this thing for me, this is what's been so I grew together for 20 Bermuda. For us to stay together and to have created what we are is not a function of my commitment. It's been a function of first and like two weeks from seeing him. When we have her kings, we're doing work up stacking, which I do this mental work in the morning. Tools. And God completely reframes my narrative on her to the point I'm sitting in that kitchen sobbing for an hour by myself because my story has been. I've carried her for 24 years. That was my story. Yeah. Just have a look. Because she knows where this are and bond all over, son.

Right.

God reframes through everything. And I am now taken on this path of going from breaking up with her nine times and we're dating, essentially leading her for seven, eight years to work and pursue wealth and be gone six days a week, 15, 16 hours a day, never around this young woman who's by herself here today. Transactional. My desires for sex, the pregnancies, the four pregnancies and births, the two miscarriages. Me traveling to. To speak to the world and wanting to come home and talk about the glorious conquest, yet never ask her how she doing. Like recognizing that for 20 plus years, the only reason we this is because of her containment of me. And to have that put so fiercely on me to the point that we go on our anniversary trip. Like, I'm just. I'm like, from a place of like, what the is wrong with you? To a place of what the is wrong me.

You know what they said that it takes a king to. To be a queen. It takes a queen to raise a king.

Yeah. You can't zero it away, bro, if you were with any one of a thousand women in Miami. Me too. Temporary transactional happiness. No refinement. No, she said pleasure, no growth.

It's a.

It's a pleasure dumpster.

Yeah.

It's literally a pleasure dumpster. And thousands of guys of mine are stuck in the pleasure dumpster cycle. So everything you two represent as women, I honor you for it. And for the courage it takes and for the scars that you take.

But I also think it's good to have you guys here in our home and being so transparent because I think couples Whether been married 5 years, 10 years, 6 years, 20 years, they think that the fight is not normal. Like, you're just happily ever after. And for us, like, I like that you said it's how quickly you can move past the fight, that you don't take that fight and use it for ammunition. Layer on a stupid argument. You're like, that happened.

What did we figure out?

Because I. But honestly, like, when we have couples on the show that are right, speaking truth, it gives people permission to, like, hey, we're going to have to have an uncomfortable conversation or we're not broken, or this is normal, or this part of growth. And I become a bigger person talking about kings and queens. And so I think it's just great that you guys are here being very, like, vulnerable and real because I think that's. That's why we started the show. We're like, we're not marriage therapists. We're not trying to pretend like we are. We're just trying to talk to people about what we're going through right now as we're going through it real time and hopefully getting down about it.

That's a fallacy of social media. We were talking about earlier where it's so easy to present this beautiful home, this beautiful light and beautiful children and beauty without showing the underbelly, which is no. Last night we had a nap down drag out, and then I sent up a ray cam and sipped my coffee like it's ugly too. I mean, we're still able to have the beauty. The container is the buey and the dumpster fire. And it all, you know, it's. It's actually very refreshing to hear you guys have the same scenarios as us because then it normal. Not. Not meant to normalize it in a. In a negative way, but it lets us know that we can still be on the same path with all these flaws. We're. It's so hot.

I don't think you can grow as a couple if you don't have these tough conversations. And I just don't think it's possible. I may know so many couples, and I don't mean this rude, but they settle. They settle into, okay, you're okay, you know, doing like the typical.

It's literally, it's. I'm gonna keep buying new shit.

You're gonna keep me and they'll find.

Me and we're not gonna buy about it. I'm not gonna keep pushing my desires and I'm just gonna keep doing my thing. And this is where all subfairs, this horrible affairs on the addition and all those.

Or you help some that stay through and. But there's relationship seems kind of hollow. Like they're just. They settle you with like a B relationship or a C relationship. And then you have people who are like, no, I want an A relationship. Because I know if you're in that kind of relationship, that ultimately that's gonna push you to go, I would not. I would not be who I am today if he pushed me. And vice versa. I think that's what any healthy relationship should be about, is that you can do it and grow simultaneously, but you should also be able to like grow together. When you see couples that are like growing like this, that to me is like a powerful couple. Because I know how hard it is. I'm sure you guys do too. And what it takes to do that together, to grow together and to continuously push each other.

There's several guys I know right now very d make a cameraman and they're like, that's it. I'm out hooker. And I'm like, bro, you understand that's her job. That. That is horrible. She is the resident expert on your. And no one in your world could call you on that more than she will. So either you could take it on as refinement and expand your capacity and container, or you could quit. She beautiful, she powerful, and she doesn't take your shit. And you already know what's on the other side. Reliable women who will tape all your shit, literally all your money, all your time, and blow you three times a day. These women do not give a fuck about themselves or about you. But you had one willing to fight with you for your greatness. And that's been the hardest thing, like to even communicate to Dendela. Like, we have not been trained on this shit. We won the game according to the world and what they taught us from the time of redemption. So it's confusing to us as men when women who have come from Eden itself who call us out to our acts capacity in a world where outside of us for yah or light, very few people support.

You know, she called me. She called me immediately. It's like you surrounded by Ismail and suddenly if somebody could challenge you and you're like, you don't like that? You. We breaking up. That's it. Every time we get five. Get up, get up. We know you know me.

Yeah, I do.

And it's like he changed his friend.

Group a lot in five days.

Yeah.

You have to. Because most of these men don't get it.

Yeah.

And they just, their. Their feedback on their opinions are. They don't mean anything because these men are after something different. They're after transactional love and submission from a woman under control. But to have a woman who is not being controlled and dominated contained to be everything she is and to speak out to what she sees and if you're free to do it, which I was not that kind of hustle. I was not into that kind of mar.

So what?

What?

What it changed you that you were okay or not okay that you were. That you heard her challenge to open up and be serious and who you want to be. What I said in the beginning of the podcast, like she gave me first time in my life I thought I got a permission to be me. What makes you change? I mean, you've been together so many years that she keep screaming and yelling, you have my permission. But show up like what was for you?

I hand built everything I thought would qualify me to be accepted in luck for that exact thing. And in it being told that I want you and if I can't have you, I don't care about all this. It just shredded my story. And I realized that if I had all this or didn't have this, this woman chose me. She had the most uncomfortable yes of her life. She was 20 years old, her family, the religion and no one supported us. BT I had nothing. I came flying off when you. Then they have like she abortion of her time. But I'm saying like she chose me against Everly and I lost sight of that for 20 years. How the fuck you lose sight is for 20 years.

Thing is like I was dating somebody who everyone was like, oh, you're dating so and so like you're going to be set for life. And I was like oh.

Like that was a trust fund that live.

I was like, there's no, there was no connection there. And I was like, oh, that's not.

What I'm looking for.

And so I just, I mean I.

When she choked, when the way she spoke to me was so harsh, like so fierce, but not in a way of threats or yelling, just for truth. Everything you have built. I don't care if I don't hate you. Which messed my mind up because I'm like, how could you want me without all this shit?

Well, I wanted, I wanted, I realized I wanted presence and I wanted Less reactivity. Because he was like, I want you to share with me. I'm like, I don't feel safe to share before.

You have no idea how many times I heard this.

Yeah.

So I was like, if you can't. I came to him at one point light. I was like, literally, I feel like I'm dying inside of your reactivity is hurting me. And I, like, had to come but that honest with him. I'm like, I don't think you know that you're hurting me. You're just being reactant. But, like, I can't do it anymore. Like, this doesn't. If you don't make an attempt to be aware of this, I will. I can't be with you. I love it. And take you and be able to.

Say that to him.

Oh, geez. She barely could say that then.

During the time you, like, formulated, this is my thought to, like, when I.

Think I was, like, said. Trying to say it for, like, probably like a year or two. And then I got to this place where I was just like. I literally was like, I'm bad. Like, I can't. I can't breathe. Like. And there he said things like this to me too, in our relationship where he was like, if you don't change this, I said, oh, why don't I change that for me on my left? And why wouldn't I work on that? So it was me coming in saying, like, this is hurting me, and I need you to make a conscious effort to work on it. I'm not saying it has to be fixed overnight. I just need to see that. You, like, take a pause for a second, and I'm like, oh, you didn't react the way I thought you did. Let him just make a conscious effort. Because, like, for me, there's things that I do that are not natural. Like, I was raised in a home that wasn't very affectionate, wasn't very heavy, wasn't very fizzy, didn't say, I love you, and. And I was like. It felt awkward for me, but it was important for him. So now. And I wanted my kids to see that. So I made an effort every single day, hugging, touch and love and hey, tell my kids, love you, love you, that I didn't grow up in that household. Now, like, if he walks by me in the kitchen in the morning, he doesn't hug me. I'm like, what the hell? So it's a pattern that I made. It was uncomfortable for me that I made a conscious effort because it was important for him. And now it's one of my values too. It's important for me, so. And it took me years to. To get that way. But now he's like, I love when you meet people. Like, you're a hugger. I used to be like, so awkward with introductions. I'm like, hey, like splitter you like. And now I'm like, it's just normal for me to be that way.

That's me.

So this is like we have. We wrap up for today. I want to say two things. One, Jessica, thank you for being so bold and honest because there are way more women with hearing the honesty that you two bring that will have the courage to have the conversations that the men actually need. That. And to Jared, to be at a place in your word, where are you on where you're just like, in a place where you're like, I don't care, man. I'm not deliberating my soul. Like, this is what I'm after. So I'm gonna put my out there and I'm gonna be free, and I'm gonna be free with this woman. I don't give a what anybody thinks about it. I'm going send the remedials, we'll put them online. I don't be here. Expose me. Rip me to the piece of the bond semi free. Because it's the same place, Sam. That's why you and I connect now in a way that we didn't three years ago, because one of us were ready for what we're publicly putting out right now and as a couple, to show that you can take and recreate a life from two different places. To blend a family, to love each other in all its forms. This is the new currency. This is what people are after. Everyone is tired of transactional love. It's exhausting. People, the world burning out on it. Yeah. And there's a shift coming. So thank you for being here and on the show together, sharing with everyone.

And the transactional law. When they change, when it's not transactional, then everybody around you, people, businesses, everybody else, it's the transcendence everybody give everybody. It's like suddenly the whole world around wood is. But it really tried. It starts at home, right? And that's what you, you, both of you bring. And really, it's just giving. Giving us permission to even fuck it up, but then hold us accountable. I mean, that's what it's like. You know what I mean? And I think that's the biggest thing and we appreciate it.

For everybody else, yes, they correct. He did wonderful and you didn't hold anything back and continue to manage the magic C2 plus months of the magic seed with our guest to emails just dominating it. One rock show.

I'm like looking across, I'm like, I gotta beat up our babies.

All right, so listen, here's the deal. I'm gonna leave all the links to social media to Yara Congested down below. All the rest of it too. Our favor we ask of you is this. Share the show with other couples that you know. Right? Millions of downloads on this podcast, which of course I was oblivious to until I was informed by our kings about this. This is helping. Everywhere we go around the world, we meet couples that listen to this podcast. They'd listen to a particular episode, a particular guest that was the key to unlocking their marriage. God is a plan for marriage is being destroyed everywhere you look. And men and women are quitting on this game faster than ever. You don't have to. There's another path. We're hearing it here today with the attic and Jessica and their story as well. Daniel and I's so surely show up on top of this too. If we can help you out being the resources of Wake Up Warrior, check out the wake up Warrior Book battleware book.com. great entry, boy. For men. To try to figure out some of the games that Yadav and I have figured out, we'd love you to figure it out sooner than we did because the chaos and carnage and scarring that comes from not is heavy. And no matter how deep you went down the rabbit hole and how bad it's gotten, it can get better. So thanks so much, Rainier, both of you. You're amazing, beautiful humans. And I'm glad I got your glasses back. Oh, I use them several mornings like a life of a power of the Arctic. I was like, let me put these and thank you so much very guys. Have a fantastic week. This is another episode of the date you wife podcast.