Date Your Wife Orange County Housewives edition.

Well, hello there, my friends, and welcome to Dagey Podcast. We have a special day here. My wife has brought her ridiculous five pound puppy that we should have never purchased. This dog is a waste of time, space and money.

What?

I'm just kidding. Dog's not here yet. Dog's not here yet. I know, right? It's coming though. It's coming. We actually have some amazing guests and a puppy that'll be here in the next couple weeks, which I'm not excited about, but we'll be talking about the puppy possibly if our guests have puppies. We have two people here with us. They have gotten engaged recently. This is their engagement podcast. We've already announced it. Now the world already knows, but we're going to be here with them anyways. We've got Jen. Jen. Are we camera on Jen right now? Yes, we are. There she is smiling. And the amazing stallion to her left. Huge delts, big shoulder cap. Absolutely goes to the gym. What's up, guys?

Thank you.

Welcome to the show.

Thanks for being here.

Thank you.

You didn't say anything about a puppy.

Oh, my God. He's so. We have a golden doodle and he's one one night late. I was scrolling on a website and I bought a yorkie, so it comes in a couple weeks. I just always wanted a little tiny dog. And he's like, what are you gonna do with it? I'm like, put it in my pocket.

Put it in a purse and. Yeah. Go shopping. Yeah.

Accessory.

Yeah.

Okay, so we're gonna get into it. Here's the deal. This is date your wife podcast, which means this implies wives. And we are now officially engaged, which we are moving down the process. So question Firing out of the gate to my man.

Yes, sir.

How and when did you make the decision that this one was a keeper and the one you wanted to put a ring on it? We weren't just girlfriend, boyfriend, you're hot, I love you. Let's get naked. It became I wanna. I wanna be naked with you for life.

We definitely had the beginning of Jen. And I was not your average met during COVID Met at a gym. Jen was married, okay? Unfortunately for her and her ex not happily married. And we took the slow route. And wouldn't you agree? We took the slow route. We spent a lot of time talking, walking. And before we even kissed each other, we knew it was forever. We talked about. Yeah, we talked about forever. We would go on walks, we would hold hands and feel weird about it, like, should we do this? Should we not? But we knew before we kiss, that this is you.

What did you. What did you feel? And Jim comes in questions. I go like, what was the feeling that had you say, wow. Because listen, here's the fact most marriages are in, in divorce and most marriages that are not are full of shit. And so you have this very small percentage of people who have what you're saying and talking about what was the thing that you were you as a man, what were you feeling? And then I'm asking you what you were feeling, but what were you feeling.

That had you go, I'm gonna give you two answers.

Okay.

To that question. I have done some. I was married. I wasn't amazing my first marriage. I dated after that and wasn't amazing at that either. Had never been faithful in any relationship and didn't care. Truly. I have to own my excuse, my language. And we all grow up with the cliche when you know, you know. And the minute I met Jen, I knew and she didn't quote, unquote, fit the mold, you know. And what do I mean by that? I was 43 when I met Jen. My kids are grown and older and if somebody would have said, you're going to meet a woman who has five kids and that will be your life partner moving forward, I'd say, not a chance. My kids are grown and out the door and I'm going a different direction. And then you meet the one, everything changes.

So how old are.

I was going to say, tell us how old your kids are again.

My children are 19 and 20.

Okay, so they're. Yeah, they're older, they're older, they're grown. And how old are yours, Jen?

So I have 20, 17, 15, 13 and 10.

Okay, still in the game. So you're still in the game? I'm still in the game.

I'm still in the. And it's funny when, when Ryan and I met at the gym, my ex husband and I were a big foster family and I had two, I had two additional kids, brand new baby and a two year old. And I remember Ryan saying like, so, like how many do you have? Because I think you had heard I had seven. He was like treading very lightly at that.

In my soul, I'm like, I know she's the one. Now let me get my arms around five kids. And then a friend at the gym said she was 7. I'm like, oh man, how am I.

Doing curls getting ready for this. And he get these guns wrapped around these babies.

All these kids.

Garrett, he. I was 18 and I was dating him for Like a month. And then somebody's like, oh, you're married or you're dating Garrett? Ask him about his son. I'm like, oh, no different. Garrett. He, we were dating. He didn't tell me he had a son. And I was 18. I would have like freaked out.

I didn't know.

And then people would tell me all the time. They're like, like, my mom thought I was crazy cuz we're seven years apart and he has a kid. And I was like, don't worry, we're not going to get married.

It's not going anywhere.

It's just for fun.

Yeah.

Now I'm like, having fun.

22 years later, we're still here after.

This hot piece of ass. That's what you're thinking.

I was having fun. And then at.

This guy's wild, let's go.

It's his kid, his problem.

Okay, so you. Now hold up, hold up. So you have, you're married. Do you have the feeling when you were still married?

Oh, I knew it was a slow death, honestly.

Did you guys. How many years before you ended your marriage did you know it was over Two. Two years. And was this like an event or a slow roll into death?

Slow roll. And I was fighting it tooth and nail the whole time. Like I kept chasing it, thinking maybe it's not what I think it is. But words were being said and feelings were being felt and I couldn't figure out why. They didn't match. Didn't match.

I think it's hard too, as a mom. Like, you hold onto the family for your kids. Like, you can be in so much pain, but you're like, do the best for my children. And so you hold onto the story for so long until you're in so much pain that you're like, I can't do this anymore.

And it was confusing because the marriage was not great, but we were a good family. And so I felt like, well, we have this like amazing family. And people would compliment the family, but I didn't know why my ex husband and I were such a mess. I couldn't figure that out. And when I would ask, it would get flipped at me. Like, you have to stop being insecure. You have to stop asking. And then I would be like, okay, Jen, pull it together. You're being insecure. But you know, thoughts and feelings and actions were not aligning.

So this piece starts slowly dying. You come to terms with the fact that it's not it. When did that happen for you? The. Okay, I'm.

This is this is the part that was crappy of me, because I think, knowing my personality, I knew it, but I. I'm a stayer. Like, I. It's just. I would just stay. And then it was his fault I met this guy, but it wasn't even. Like, when I met Ryan, I thought, he's nothing. He's just invoking some feeling that I'm like, why am I not having this? I don't even know him. But why does he remember conversation with me? Why does he check back in and ask about how this went? But I can't even get my husband to have a conversation with me? And it started making me feel like, oh, my gosh, I want something bigger and better. And so I didn't think it would be Ryan. I kind of had heard this playboy thing about him, and I knew I was not, like, that mold for him. And so I just knew he invoked something in me that, like, woke me up.

Like the feelings that you weren't having in your marriage. You're like, wait, I want this? And I'm unwilling to stay married to this guy if I'm not getting it.

Yeah.

Which is basically, like, connection, conversation. Somebody who cares to, like, check in on you, like you said.

Right. Or just remembers, like, simple conversation. And. And so now I'm having this, like, struggle of. And then I start testing. Like, it wasn't fair, but I started testing my ex. I'd come home and I'd be like, remember when I told you about that we were building our yoga studio at the time, and I said, remember I told you about the plumbers? And da, da, da. And my ex would be like, you didn't tell me about that. But, like, this guy who I don't even know be like, jen, did your plumbers make it to the studio? You know, I'd be like, wow, okay, this is kind of weird. Like, my ex should know. Why does this guy know? Yeah. And so I just started thinking, like, yeah, maybe something's not right here.

How much. How much do you think? The kids having as many children as you did, plus the foster children. How much of that cloak and daggered what was going on, like, kept you distracted enough? And then maybe add in some alcohol, a couple vacations, and, like, it was able to suppress these things that maybe you were considering before.

Crazy thing is, we did not. There was no alcohol, no vacation, so it was, like, at home with kids. We didn't even go to dinner.

Truly.

And that's not an exaggeration. But what I know now is my house was A revolving door of foster babies and animals constantly. And I think I was numbing. I think that kept me needed and loved. And so now I'm like, I can look back and think, oh, okay. I was constantly searching for something. And my ex husband traveled all the time. And so when he'd come home, he was this amazing, intentional father. But because he'd been gone, he didn't want to go anywhere or do anything because he'd been traveling. So it was like home with the kids. And so I think you're right. I think all of the kids and fosters was a distraction for me.

Did he make good money?

Did he?

Yeah.

Yeah, he did.

Okay, so he had a house, he had the money.

Yep.

Okay, so all that part was covered.

Yep.

And he was doing his thing, which is travel. Travel, go make money.

Yep.

Was he cheating?

No, I don't think so.

Okay.

I really don't think so.

Here's why. Here's what? Here's the day. In my world, you can only appreciate the peak that people stand on if you understand the pit they came from. So the questions of, like, how did this man spark this love in you? Is only appreciated with the contrast of the starving woman in the desert. So now all of a sudden, here, you're starving. You don't know you're starving. You're thinking that it's okay to just have like a little broth every day, Right. And n walks in fucking shoulder cap buffet over here.

Tell me about it.

I remember Will Circus Olay meets like, you know, Las Vegas. We go. Trust me, I heard sexy from. Are you from Jersey, bro?

No, but you. I get that all the time.

Swear to God, you're like every guy I've ever met from Jersey. You talk about Jersey. Where you from?

Born and raised in Orange County.

Where's your. Where's your ancestry from?

Armenian.

Oh, that's why. Dude, you got that goddamn. Go outside for two minutes.

I got back from the Bahamas, so. Yeah.

My children envy your skin. My envy your skin. I tried the spray tanning thing. Here's a problem. I'd look for two days, I'd look like a weirdo. For three days I look amazing. And six days, I look like I have leprosy.

Same.

Just like, you have to come. I'm a white pasty dude. I can't be this great Armenian.

I agree.

Okay, so you are. You're in this place, and then you meet him, and you both are not looking for this.

No.

You're like. And you're like, net meaning logically Nah. But now this spark happens. Now the spark happens. What. What does the start do to you as you're feeling this coming from the Starvation Desert?

Well, I knew. So. I mean, we're women, right? Like, we have, like, this intuitive feeling. And I knew. I'm like, I should not be this excited about my workout tomorrow morning. Like, instead of, like, hair up in a sweaty bun, I'm like, should I put on a different sports bra? I wonder if you guys gonna be there at the gym tomorrow. Just an excitement I had. Like, there was a zest in life again. There was like a hope of a conversation. It was so, like, juvenile.

Well, I think that women need. We need time and attention. And if you're lacking that and not being, like, seen and heard, it's like you can kind of sedate with whatever it is for so long, and then you get that attention and you're like, wait, I like this. This feels good. So it's. It's always like a balance with Garrett and I, too. Like, I'm like, we've been married forever, but I still am. Like, hey, I know we're married, but we can't go into autopilot. And it's like, one of the things we always talk about is, like, even though you're married, you still have to date. Like, you have to make a conscious effort to literally get a babysitter and go on date nights.

They were so.

Otherwise, like, a month goes by if we don't go on a date. Like, we're so. Like, there's this friction where we're just, like, so irritated at each other. And then irritation just goes to numbness and resentment. And so it's like, you can only live in that for so long. You know what I mean? But I mean, marriage is like, it's a constant effort. Like, it really is.

It's funny because defeated. I had girlfriends. My ex husband. I. Sorry. Sex was a must. So my marriage always had sex. My marriage never had time or conversation. So I got to a point I was pissed about the sex because why are we having sex all the time? We can't even have a conversation with each other. And so it's funny. Like, I think men, you guys can speak to it. Sex is important for you. More so I feel like, than it is sometimes for us. But, like, I feel like as a woman, when you are prioritizing me, then I'm down. Yes. And so it was just this weird, horrible mess of a combination we had going on.

Well, Danielle came at me last March. I call it the Crowbar effect.

I had to wake him up. I had to wake him up a little bit. Sounds aggressive. I'm, like, the least aggressive human ever.

It wasn't kind of aggressive. It was aggressive as. I mean, I hadn't been taking off my. I hadn't been taking off balance like that in a decade.

No. Well, here's the. The backstory. I. Having my babies back to back. I was, like. Got really into fitness and was just that person that was, like, working and working on my business and just kind of telling myself, like, everything's okay, like, trying to be the best wife and all these things. And all of a sudden, I was like, I'm not feeling seen. I was like, and I don't care if you pay the bills and give me a house and the cars and the trips. I was like, I don't care. I will literally leave all of that. I'm like, that's how important it is for me to, like, feel seen and heard. Now, I didn't say it like this. It was. It was in a fight and messy, and I. Because I was in so much pain. I think as women, we. We tell ourselves, I'm okay. I'm okay. I'm the strong one. I got to be the strong one. Shove your feelings down, or you're like, I don't want to start an argument, so I'll just suppress my feelings. And I realize all of a sudden, I was like, I. I look perfect on the outside. I'm like, but I'm dying on the inside. And I want to stay married to him, but things will have to adjust. Otherwise, we'll just go different directions because I'm unwilling to feel like. I'm unwilling to hurt this much. You know what I mean? So I. It was scary for me to have this conversation with him, but I was at kind of this place where I'm like, I can't. I'm un. I'm unwilling to feel this way anymore. Like, I want the time, the attention. So even though we've been married for so long and have everything, I was like, I need more.

How did you get him to hear you?

Well, I mean, here's the deal. She would. So you back it up. Like, this happens. I'm actually in, like, 65, 000 men. Like, I get to see into the lives of men, all kinds of men. Men, like, mad, etc. I get to see patterns, entrepreneurs, how they up marriages. Like, half the guys I worked with, one on one last year, five are divorced. Divorce is running like cancer through everything. And Relationship second round chance is even worse. It's like, it's horrible, right? So I'm trying to figure out how to, how do I understand all this? So I'm watching and studying all this. And meanwhile, part of the problem is sex. If sex doesn't happen in a relationship, good night. This dude's gonna go somebody else or it's over. And women don't get this, like at some primal level, this man's penis needs to be in your vagina. And it sounds crazy and it's all crass. That's so disgust. It's crazy fact, biblical fact, God built men to now up above that. It's making love, being connected, soul level connection, etc. So if a guy's being starved, which I was being starved, she was not the best with it. She was uncomfortable with this most of our marriage. So sex was always a hard topic for us. And I would go long periods of time feeling just like vaginal masturbation. Now I tell that to you because that was a backstory to her finding herself. Now she gets into fitness competitions. After our third daughter, all of a sudden she's like, goes from prude, I need all the blinds now, etc to like platform shoes upstairs with lingerie on, asking if we could put a stripper pole in a bedroom. I'm like, I don't know who the this woman is, but I have been waiting for this. So she satisfies this thing I've been wanting. We get this house, I'm making more money, I'm building the businesses, I'm getting late, I'm getting a strip show like three nights a week. She's sending me naughty photos all day long. I'm like, dude, I'm like rekindled. I want to devour this woman. And I worked more and I worked more and I worked more and we had two more babies and she's doing the strip shows and we're having the sex and we're doing the thing, etc. And then she sets me down after I come back from get some tattoos in Texas. She's like, hey, I need you to understand, I can't feel you. And the last six months my mind has been thinking about other men and being with a different man than you. And if I can't feel you, I don't care about any of this. And I was like, okay, hold on. Pump the fucking brakes. I have built the empire, I have provided the wealth. I take you on date nights twice a week. I take you on four vacations a year to exotic place around the world. I drape you with fucking jewelry. I show up for our fucking kids. I do fucking. You show me one motherfucker that does what I do. It didn't matter, because once you've gotten all the shit, you hit all the checklists. We found the one thing that both of us were actually after. We were after the same thing. The thing you two are talking about, that connection. The thing you two are talking about right now.

So, Garrett, I have a question for you.

Yeah.

Prior to Danielle coming and telling you this, you're working, you're doing your thing, sex shows. Everything's great for you. Did you not know.

No.

That this truly was blindsiding for you?

There was a blindside. There was a sense of. Like. I actually had this wonder of, like, why do I actually not feel. I felt like I should feel more.

Huh.

Because we had it all.

I think, too. I. Like, there was a piece of me that felt so bad that I kind of sexually rejected him for a long time. So I was like, this is stupid. Like, I want to be free and have fun. And so I really. There was, like, an effort for myself, too. I was like, I need to unleash. And so it's like a piece I, like, found myself. And I felt like he was, like, cool. I got everything I wanted, but I'm like. But I didn't get everything I wanted in return, right? So it was like. And I didn't realize it because I'm like. I'm like, I should be happy. I'm telling myself I should be happy, but I knew there was something missing, and I was like, oh, my God. I can't. I can't connect with him. I can't feel him. Like, sex is great, but, like, I can't. Like, I need more, you know?

So how do you. What was it that's so hard? It's not, like, get a bigger job. I need a new car. I'd like another baby. Like, what. How do you put that?

She was asking for what you two are talking about. She was asking for the thing that can't be described. It's like, what is like. Eckhart Tolle in the Power now says, I can't tell you what the now is admitted. I tried to tell you what the now is. It's now no longer the now. I can only give you signposts to what the now is. You're getting close. Here's what is. So this feeling we're looking for, we didn't know what it was. She couldn't find you.

Find it, like, how do you do?

Yeah.

That's what her and I reference it.

As the drug it is.

Once you've tasted it. And I don't do drugs, I'll never go back.

Yeah.

And if it's you. You mentioned, I don't care about the houses, the cars, or this, that I'm out. So the drug isn't there. I know what it's like.

Yeah.

And I'm chasing that. And I'm so grateful now that, like you said, obviously why we're here. Date your wife. That's the centerpiece of her and I is the drug.

Yeah.

And there's only one way to get the drug. That's to feed it.

Yeah.

For us.

Yeah.

Intentionally feed it.

Yeah.

But they were so. I'm confused.

We were feeding it, but, like, you guys had something. You gotta look at how you guys.

Were feeding 22 years together. Come on, now. I mean, that's.

I think it was, like, almost like we were. It was like we were doing all the things, but we weren't, like, crossing the line for the other person. It wasn't like he didn't feel like I was, like, cheerleading him in his business or I didn't feel like he was, like, saying, like, hey, how, like, caring, like, sending me message. Like, how did work go? Like, what's going on?

Like a remembering thing.

Got it.

I remember she's like, I told you.

I was like, oh, when you're saying that, I'm like, you gotta.

You gotta remember something. Give her a bone here or there. Remember something.

But, yeah, I think for us, how we turned it around is we. I was like, I. We need. Like, we're so busy, and it's easy to just get wrapped up in life, and you're, like, kind of almost like doing the checklist. Even if it's like, doing the checklist date night, you're like, go out, have a couple cocktails, come home, go have sex, go to bed. And it was just kind of felt very, like it gotten to this point of, like, checklist. So the one of the things that helped us was we needed to kind of, like, unpack this. Like, why are we both feeling this way? So we hired a therapist, and we worked with them on Zoom once a week, like, every week for, like, an.

Hour, two hours every day, every week. And then we came straight into a podcast, and our podcast and date your wife would pretty much be fights from the session. So I have two hours therapy, then an hour podcast, like three hours every Monday, just battling through. And I'd lose My screaming. In therapy, she'd be yelling, in therapy she'd be crying. But you tell them the truth. You were a liar. Was a liar.

I don't know if I was. I don't know if I was lying. I was suppressing my feelings. I just didn't want to like, bug anybody, you know what I mean? I was like, nope, don't.

What were you lying about? Oh, sharing your feelings. Like, I know. She's like, how did you not know? This woman held her pain, her emotions, her frustrations, her sorrows, her desires for 20 years, including my emotional affair in 2009, including the abandonment of me. Working so much and never been around, never once told me, and then unloaded this shit like a goddamn like armada of garbage trucks on me at the same time. And I'm sitting here trying to hold this and going, my whole fucking kingdom is going to fall apart. You've been hiding all of this shit like a guy who's been cheating for 20 years and just barely tells you. And like, you've been lying to me. You've not been happy, you've not been. You've been hurting and sad and depressed and alone and frustrated and angry. And you're still resentful about this and this and this, this. And you've not told me. So she tells me. Then the truth begins unfold. And that's why I was like, so I'm taken back. So, yes, I was surprised because there was. I hadn't thought about for 10 years. She still got this registered. I think it's emotions.

I think it's hard too, because I'm like, I want to be supportive that he's like working so hard, but I'm like, I. I really feel connected when we spend more time together, whether it's like a lunch date or a workout or whatever, you know, with kids, it's so hard. And so for me, I'm like, I can't go a week high fiving you and then have one date night where we both fall asleep at like 10 o'.

Clock.

Like, I have to have like, time, whether we walk on the beach or whatever it is. Like, I have to have connected time. Like, I don't have a ton of girlfriends because I'm so busy with work and kids. So I'm like, he's my best friend. Like, I need to spend time with my best friend. So I just felt like I was, I was kind of like, you know, giving him all the things and trying to be the best wife. And it wasn't being, I wasn't getting it in return. And I just kind of was like, huh.

Asking for it.

But, yeah, I wasn't asking for it. I was just like, oh, I need to support that. He's out hunting. He's out working. I just need to not. I need to not bug him. You know, like, our role as a.

Woman sometimes, like, I'm just protecting it.

Yeah.

I don't need to put this on him. He's busy. He's doing all his things, and then you suppress. Suppress. And then it's.

In marriage.

Yeah.

So this is why it was such a shock when you have this guy who's not only got fantastic shoulder cap and amazing skin, but he's also. He's. You're listening to her in a way you've never been listened to.

Yeah, I. I truly. I thought, like, I'm so grateful he walked into my life. I thought he'd walk in and walk out as quickly as I met him, but it gave me. I told you. It just was like, now I know what. I know what I want to feel. And I don't want to be dead anymore. I don't want to be numb. I don't want to be dead. I want to be heard. I want to be prioritized. And so I couldn't believe it, that it was this guy. Like, I just.

I have a great story for you guys.

Go for it.

We have. At this point, we have kissed. Maybe. Maybe not. And she said, I want to come over. Great. Come on over. We sat at our sectional, or my sectional at the time. I sat on one side, she was on the other. And after, you know, she's got five kids, and she's not supposed to be.

The kids were in school, and I'm.

Supposed to be at Target or something.

I'm like, at Target?

An hour goes by. She's like, I gotta go. I said, all right. Walk to the door. And she's like, that's it. Like, what do you mean? She's like, I thought I was coming over here to.

I did.

And she's like, instead, I feel like.

You put me through an interview.

I did. No joke. I was like, never in my life have I ever been this girl, but I'm going for it. And I'm like, I'm coming over. I'm coming over. And I thought we would have this, like, crazy, wild sex situation, and then. And then it would be done. And then I could just squash it. I'd never probably hear from this guy again. And I just live the rest of my life knowing like, at least one time in my life, I felt that feeling. I felt that. And then he just sat there interviewing me, and I'm like, do you really want to know what town I'm from? I'm ready to get naked here.

She says that on the way out. And I said, I have more to lose here. He has been told, I'm this playboy. So she's expecting one thing. I'm showing up different.

And that's funny.

The likelihood of your marriage with five children, probably zero. That's being intimate. Don't take this the wrong way. I can do that anytime I want with anyone else, and I don't love them. And I'm not worried about these feelings of loss. I said, so essentially, we could have sex, but you're going home to your marriage and probably staying, and I lose. And I said, I'm not interested. So she thought it was an interview for me. It was like, I'm, like, protecting my heart at this point. I love this woman. I don't even. Haven't even held her hand or kissed her at this point. And she's talking about sex and any other, let's call it, relationship or situation in my life. It's only sexual.

So when was the first kiss?

On a walk on the path. Yeah.

It was so weird with us, to be honest. And I'd love to know, like, truly. Then it got even weirder, because once I started, once I went home, I told my husband, like, I don't want to do this anymore. I moved out of my house and never went back. And so here goes this relationship now, starting this relationship with this man. And you know what's so weird? I go over there that one time thinking, like, I'm just going to do it. I'm going to get naked. It's going to be crazy sex. I'm out. I'm done. Once I had a relationship with him, I was like, what Garrett was saying about you. I was like, don't look at me. Shut the blinds. Can I please cover up? I had all these weird insecurities that I never knew I had, because here I am at 40. Whatever. I was 43, 44 at the time. And now I'm dating, and I've had five kids, and. Oh, my gosh. You know? And so then I go through all this weird insecurity crap.

Yeah.

And I didn't know it. I mean, I was like. She was like, turn the lights off. And so finally I sat her down and said, what is going on? And she's like, for 20 years, I've been sleeping with the same person. Very vanilla. And the word on the street is you're doing this swinging from the rafters. And she's like. And I'm. I don't want to.

You know, that's a lot of pressure.

A lot of pressure I got to keep up with. And you know what? He was so, like, he looked at me, and I realized I'm like, wow, I haven't been looked at in so long. Like, almost like he was, like, taking me in, and it made me want.

To be like, yeah.

Smaller and smaller and smaller and really very vulnerable.

It was more vulnerable likely to have him penetrate you with his eyes.

Yeah. Yes.

Than it was.

You are so right. You are so right.

That's why I like it. I mean, Danielle and I would have sex with that. She wouldn't look at me either. She's like, look away. I tried to get her eyes shade. Look away because, like, there's something. I think there's something more. There's way more intimate, like, eye than there is, like, body.

You are right.

It is.

So you're sitting in that part, and you're. You're feeling comfortable. But you said her. You have to talk with her.

I did.

What was the talk like?

I just said, I don't. I mean, you're the most beautiful woman to me, I'm so confused as to what's happening here. It's like we're playing a charade game. Is it light enough? Is it dark enough? Can you turn this? Can we be under the covers? I'm like, this is not. This is like we're writing a script. Can we just be, like, intimate and close? And finally we had that conversation, and she shared her insecurities, and obviously I can understand why. And I think it changed, continued to help evolve us, because I could have empathy and understanding for where she was coming from.

Was it hard for you, like, I mean, knowing his background, to, like, feel like you could trust him?

Yes.

And even now, I mean, like, is it something that is scary for you or how did you. Is it just how he shows up that you're like, I know I can trust him.

You know, it's weird. We had a situation. I don't. I don't know your story, but I heard you say, like, the emotional affair. We had a situation early on in our relationship, and it was a definite, like, hiccup between us, and I was like, gosh, am I ever gonna come back from this? And with Ryan, like, every time we go out and about, we. Not every Time. But a lot of times when we go out and about, we will run into an ex or a hookup or this or that. And he's very friendly with all of them. And so I'm not like, a mean girl, so I feel like I need to be friendly back. But then it's this weird. It's just weird and uncomfortable. I don't have anybody. I'm from a tiny town in Oklahoma. I was married forever. So it's been an adjustment. Like, I've had to grow in confidence in my man, because if I don't, it'll eat me alive.

Yeah, you stand in your own certainty. It's like, hey, he's with me.

He's with. Right?

Yeah. And I think that's, like, sexy to a man is like, when you can stand in that power and just be 100%. So I want to. I really want to dive into. You're on Orange County Housewives. Can we go there? Like, go there? Can we go there?

You can go there.

So how did this happen? Like, who do you know on the show? Or how did it happen?

I have been friends with Tamara and Eddie for a long time. Long time. And Tamara. At the end of the season, I guess the girls are asked, like, if you know anybody that we should look at, give us their name. One year, Tamara gave me. Gave them my name. I was married to my ex. They called. I went through the casting, didn't get it. And that was it for me. Like, I thought, okay, I tried it, whatever. And then season 17, two seasons ago, I got a call, and they're like, jen, it's Dawn. And I laughed right away when she said, we're calling. We just watched your scissor reel from a few years ago. And I said, dawn, I'm not married. I don't own a home. I'm dating a guy. My ex is dating someone else. And we hung up. And literally the phone rang 20 minutes later. And I should have known because they're like, now you're a shit show.

Oh, geez. This is. This just happened.

Oh, now you're perfect. And that's how. That's how it went.

Okay, that's. That's funny. About five years ago, I didn't know anybody on the show, but I went through the whole interview process as well, but I didn't know anybody on the show. And I. I feel like it's like, when I look at it, I'm like, it looks kind of very Exposing. Exposing? Yeah. Like, is it. Has it been hard for you? I mean. Cause you guys are being super vulnerable and sharing your truth here, which is great and awesome, and I feel like we're connecting, but, like, TV can, like, twist things. Like, how has it been, like, a breeze? Has it been, like, what is it like?

You are very opened up to everyone's opinion and people, you know, some of it is put out there, and it's not exactly how it went. And that can be hard because 50% of people are like, oh, they're pigs. And 50% of people are like, oh, I like them. And I'm still working on it. Getting the thick skin, because I take. You could show me a string of Comments that are 15 the kindest things in the world, but the one that digs at me or him, I just. I'm like, ah. You know, I get hung up on it. And so I'm just trying to learn to be a little bit more bolder, thicker, stronger.

Yeah.

How are you doing with it? Right?

You know, nothing can prepare you for it like having a child. You know, when they walk you out and you get in the car, you know, car seat and, like, see, you're like, what? You know, child number one. It's. It's. That's how this is. There's no preparation for it.

Yeah.

Last year we filmed. We don't know what we're doing. Everything's great because nobody knows who we are. And then the first episode airs, and then all of a sudden, all these people behind keyboards have an opinion about you and don't know you. And, like, you got better guys.

Him.

Yeah.

Huh?

Are you a bad guy on the show?

I am.

Yeah.

I'm.

He is like, you're a good bad boy, bro. Bad boy.

I'm Orange County's douchebag. I'm Orange County. Yeah. Yeah.

There you go.

At some level, you're like. You say what you want. Like, you don't know me.

You know, I'm grateful that I'm rooted in my faith because I would tell you what we went through last year. Being new to this was extremely hard. And there were, you know, many of, like, potential pitfalls and breaking points along the way. We weren't, A, rooted in our faith and B, in each other. And if it wasn't that, it would be.

What do you mean by faith?

A faith in the Lord. It is my foundation. But I also counter that with a strong spiritual background for me that both feed me manifestation meditation, just a lot of inner work. And that, for me, is what keeps her and I. I would say that's our glue. It really is. Yeah. It keeps us grounded, especially in these moments like today. Season 18 is airing tonight.

Yeah.

And she has been sideways all morning, and I am.

I didn't realize it's airing tonight. Well, thanks for being here on the day it's airing.

I know. Well, now I said, oh, God, she's. I hope I. I hope I show up. Okay. You're getting me, like, frazzled and headsy and all kinds of things. Thank you for having me.

And I, you know, this morning, about a couple hours ago. So what's going on? She said, I'm just all over the place. Airing tonight. And all the emotions and all the, you know, it's really mental warfare what you girls go through and being a partner and trying to support through that. Yeah. Sometimes not easy.

Yeah. I think it'd be hard to. I mean, women are hard on themselves, so it's like. Is it hard to, like, see yourself on camera?

It's so horrible seeing yourself, hearing yourself, all the things. I mean, we just pick ourselves apart anyway and then go do that. You're like, oh, gosh.

How do your kids feel about it?

Luckily, I'm so close with my kids, they don't watch it. Think. Thankfully, they don't even ask to watch it. Why would they?

Does that like you or.

No, I don't really want them to. And not because I show up and I'm naked or drunk or wasted and I'm embarrassed, but there's no need for my kids to watch that show. And. But when. When I do film with the kids, when we film with the kids, they'll say, can I. What can I watch when I'm on it? And of course. And you know what I have seen in my kids? Our world. My kids and I's world really kind of got rocked in the last two years. I mean, we went from this beautiful life to really, like, a big struggle. And my kids will say to me all the time, like, mom, you work so hard. Like, I'm so proud of who. You know, I'm so proud of who you are. And, you know, that's just like. As a mom, it's, like, priceless, honestly. And so the fact that they're proud of me and they see me hustle and they know my. Why is everything Keeps you in it.

For the kids and the right reasons.

Yeah.

And it's, I think, to children, it's like you can almost ignore the side noise. You're like, they're almost our little rock.

Yes, they are. It's just so the kids are super supportive and proud and. And, like, we've had funny things. They're like, Mom, Ms. So and so. Last year at school did not like me at all, but then she asked if you were my mom, and she loves the show. She's so nice to me now. Perfect. The lunch lady gave me extra chips. Tell the lunch lady, thank you.

Cash in.

Yeah, so that's kind of been fun.

And we're very honest with our children, so they know the premise of the show. They know some of the highs and lows of the show. So why do we share that with them? Because some people would say, well, why would you share some of the, you know, inner chaos with them that goes on at adult level? Because they go to school and they hear. And they're on social media. So for us to be able to communicate that and they hear it from us six, eight months ago when it was filmed, they're like, oh, yeah, of course we know that there's not a blind side, that they're going to watch episode two or 15 and say, what did my mom do? Or what did Ryan do? Stuff like that.

Do you feel like the show maybe, in a way, has brought you two closer?

No question. No question.

Because you have to be each other's like glue, like you said.

There are.

There are times that we go through, like, airing is happening now. I'll go through a phase where I'm like, I just can't. I'm not gonna watch right now because it's, you know, a hard time for me. And he'll watch and then he'll say, you know what, babe? It was great. It was this, it was that, you know, or. Or he'll go through it. It has really, like, made us go. This is the foundation. And it's not you on your own or me on my own. The is us. And I don't know, I feel like it's given us, like, a really strong footing in it.

Yeah. Last season, I'll give you guys, like, a peek behind. Jen and I didn't live together. Her and her ex were nesting the kids and them stayed at one house. When it was her time with the kids, she'd be there. When she wasn't with the kids, she'd come to my house during filming her first season, she would film. It would be tumultuous, as oftentimes it is. And then she'd call me after and I'd be like, hey, babe, how was filming? And she's either in tears or screaming at me, where the fuck were you last night? I'm like, you and I went to dinner and I came home, and my daughter and I watched so and so on tv. Why? It's like somebody told me you were out at a bar last night with a brunette. I'm like, I.

So they plant seeds.

I don't know what you're talking about. And so we would do this and then that. Just, you know, at that point, you're either going this way or you're going this way.

Yeah. You gotta trust it.

Made the glue. It's strengthen our relationship tenfold because we again sat each other down and we're like, stop.

I see this show do two things to people. It either, like, breaks them or brings them together. It seems like I had a client who was on the show and it was hard for me to watch.

Was it?

And I just. Because I did her hair personally, and she had like, six, seven kids. I can't remember. And anyways, it was hard for me to watch. Like, everything kind of. It seemed like it just, like, fell apart. And I was like, oh. But partly is like, it almost exposed what was. Maybe she was kind of hiding or going through anyways. So I don't really know. But, like, you guys were in such a place where you're new in your relationship, so it's like you could have let it take you one way or the other, but you chose to, like, trust each other and kind of strengthen together, which is so important for your kids to see as well. With everything that you've gone through, you're like, okay. Like, that would for me, I'm, like, looking at your situation, you know, you're just like, you said you have a boyfriend. You're like, like. And they come to you and, like, you want to be on the show where you just like, it. Sure. Like, was it scary?

Like, let's do this. Because at that point, I was thinking. At that point, I was like, I'm 45. I'm working my ass off at the studio. But I don't know how that's gonna go. I'm hopeful I'm gonna do this. Maybe this. Maybe this levels up the studio. Maybe this turns into something else. Maybe I don't have any other opportunities. And I was just like. I took an attitude of, like, total gratitude. Like, no matter what, I'm so grateful that this girl is. Got this opportunity because I got to make it. I got to make it work.

Yeah, I love that. Yeah.

So your faith plays a big role in your world now.

Million percent.

Were you always that way?

Yes. I was a college athlete. Not to go. Nostalgia.

What'd you play?

I played college soccer.

Soccer.

But as an athlete or in any walk of life, we have extreme lows.

Yeah.

And how to deal with them. Fortunately, my only outlet was the Lord, because I tried everything else.

Were you raised in. In Christianity?

I was. Yep.

Yep. What denomination were you raised in?

Non denominational.

Awesome. I'd love. Because non denominational is its own denomination now. I laugh because we at Ocean's Church here locally with Pastor Mark Francie, and they'll tell me, like, yeah, it's non denomination. I was like, hey, listen, I was raised in Mormonism. This is. This is a denomination now. You guys, routines, the songs, the way you do it is beautiful, but inside of it too. It was new for us because we walked away. We left the Mormon Church in 2009, and then we didn't do anything. I took a doodle toy from a route with Hinduism and Buddhism and eventually plant medicine and a whole bunch of other journeys, and then found myself on this 15 year journey back to where we are now, where last week, before the podcast, she's asked me to pray over. And we're having these deep spiritual moments now together that we've never had before. And a relationship with Christ we've never had before, which, had we had it over the years, like you are saying you have it now, it would have made things so much smoother.

I think being raised Mormon, it was like, I always felt like I had a relationship with God and Christ, but was, like, nervous about how to talk about it. Right. It was just. We were raised in, like, Mormonism is just very structured and very different. And so it was like, I always felt like I had that connection. But just recently, we feel like we. We've been talking a lot about it, you know, and I feel like it's fun to meet, like, other couples and even realize, like, everybody. You need that in your life. You really do. It's like the thing that is the glue. It just. It makes you. It makes everything in this life, like, worth living for. And I genuinely believe that, like, when you are given opportunities, God can speak through you to help other people. So consider even the. The opportunity that you have to be on the show.

It's.

They can twist it however they want, but they can't twist you too.

Exactly.

They can't change you guys.

Yep.

So I tell Ryan all the time, it's kind of funny, like, you get so sick of me saying this. Ryan's like, social media dms are like chicks and boobs, like, want to meet up later. And I always say it's hilarious. And then mine are like, adoption stories, foster animals. But I will tell you that you are so right, because I have had. We've had so many connections with amazing people we would have never met and people who feel like they want to share a story or an experience that has just been. Oh, like, priceless.

Yeah. Yeah, I love it.

Well, I'm happy for both.

For me. And we're two seasons in now. That has been. The value of AD for me is the connection with other people that I don't know that will unfortunately have seen and assume what they see on TV is real.

Right.

And say, man, I went through that. I went through that. I loved how you showed up, and you were so honest. And I've built these friendships with people I'll probably never meet all through the show, and I have so much gratitude for that. If it ended today, that would be my takeaway. Did anything good come from it? I'd say that that was it.

Yeah. So you're in. It's already been two seasons. Oh, wow. Okay.

Well filmed. Two seasons, but the first one starting.

Okay, gotcha.

Airing tonight.

Nice.

Big party night tonight. So with all of what you're doing, have you two ever thought about doing a podcast together? Just a week.

The podcast, it's come up lately.

You should do it. You guys are great.

Come up lately.

It's great therapy, and it's great time to talk and connect. It's very different. But also, you're. You're so open. I push hard in the paint with questions because I like to see where people are at. I'm like, how deep is this reservoir?

Yeah.

And. And, yeah. And you guys went. You were like, oh, we're base jumping. No problem. Let's go, both of you. But it's cool because we base jump, too.

Give you guys an opportunity to, like, to share your truth, you know, because even people. I told them, like, yeah, they're coming over my house, and there's like. I'm like. I mean, honestly, I'm like, I. I met him. They seem pretty chill. Like, I'm just gonna see where this goes. So it's like, it's. It's almost like doing a podcast would give you an opportunity for people to see the real version of you too, you know?

Oh, thank you.

Thank you. It could be amazing. I'd listen to that podcast. The same thing I was trying to tell Louie and Teresa to do too, because there was, like, the narrative that was portrayed.

Yeah.

But then I never knew the Narrative. We just knew Louie and Teresa.

I didn't.

We knew Louie and Teresa outside the show. We didn't know them in. I mean, we didn't watch the show, so I wouldn't even know what was going on. They'd be like, oh, this and this. And I'm like, dude, you guys are. We don't. We don't. I don't care about that. We just, like. We just know we love you guys. And they'd be the house and was like, I don't know what that's all about. I just know you guys for who you are. So part of what we found with running our podcast is it's. It's been more beneficial. Although we have tons of people who listen and get huge value from it. A lot of couples who get permission to talk about shit they wouldn't normally talk about by listening to us talk about it. Yeah, we'll fight in podcasts. Like, we're battling it all disagree.

We. You know how it is. But, like, I feel like it's been. We try to add value, but more than anything, we just try to be real. Because, like, a lot of couples are going through the same thing, but they don't want to talk about it, and they shove it all down.

Like, if you two are doing. Imagine doing podcasts tonight after episode one releases, and then you're doing a show together, the crazy part is just from a marketing perspective, hey, this will roll straight to your podcast. They know. Everyone finds out you two are doing a weekly podcast after every episode, and you're getting to just talk and be truthful about yourselves. Now you're contrasting, so you actually hope they paint you as this dark demon, because then when they see the contrasting divine that you're actually showing up in, that contrast creates such polarity that it actually draws everybody to you.

So I have a question for the both of you. You guys obviously aren't on the show, but you have your own exposure, business, personal. So there is the. We call them haters, call it chatter, call it normal stuff. How do you guys deal with it?

We've gone through a lot of shit, too.

Yeah, it's hard. I mean, still, like you said, you'll get, like, 50 nice comments, and then you get one, and depending on your mood, you're that. But for me, it's like, I just try to, like, if it's. If I'm gonna comment back on something that I want, it's almost like I want my fans. I want them to see me stand up for myself. I'm Like, I'm not. I don't care about you, but I'm gonna stand up for myself.

A voice?

Yeah, like, that. You don't get to say this on my feed. And I'm not doing it because I care about this person. It's like, I'm doing it because I'm like, no, that's not okay to say that. So I think it's okay to, like, stand up for yourself, especially if it's like, something you're like, that's 100% not true. But if it's, like, a stupid comment or whatever, I'm just like, cool, troll face, delete, block. Don't care. Don't have time. But you do. You get thick skin over the years. Like, you. You just do. And so you choose to fight your battles strategically. So that's, like, the biggest advice I tell people. I'm like, you can, like, just don't let it, like, rile you up. Like, one of my biggest posts this year was like, I posted me, like, in. I was getting ready for a comp, and I was like, literally, you know how you get, like, so tiny? And I posted it, like, next to my postpartum, and people gave me so much. Like, there was, like, over, like, thousands of comments. And I was like, they don't even know the journey. So it's like they say they comment ignorantly. So you have to remind yourself that, like, people comment ignorantly and you're.

You're.

You're allowing yourself to be exposed. So you have to just be like, whatever.

I loved how you're trying to pretend like you just. I just calmly handled it. Like, I was.

Oh, no. I was really.

Firing right now. Are you firing right now? I'm like, take a breath over there. I'm like, this is not going well.

This post she was talking about. We were out of town and I met. I saw what was going on. I don't give a. People talking about me. We're out of town on that same post. We're in Dubai, and I. I see what's going on, and I'm like, these.

He'll fight my battle. Sometimes I'm like, babe, it's okay. Let it go.

Here we go. Jesus flipped tables. I'm about to flip your tables. Let's go. And then I get messages from my kids. They're, like, sending us videos. Just so you know, it's a family war. All my kids are together. It's two in the morning, battling people in the comments, calling them out, cross checking people. Now. That doesn't Happen all the time. But I can imagine, too, with where you guys are at. You guys. The kind. The amount of traffic and attention you're gonna get and the number of.

It's just getting started. Yeah.

The number of desperate. I hate my life people.

Yeah.

Who are seeing you be happy. The number of women stuck in marriages that have been dead for decades, who envy the courage that you demonstrate. The number of men who long for the feeling that you're speaking about who don't have it instead of saying, wow, that's amazing. How could I do that? They attack. And when I started to realize that most people attack because they're fucking weak. They attack because they wish they had the courage that you're demonstrating. And the only way they can justify their pitiful lives is to talk shit.

Yeah.

So they're like, cool, I get it. So the thing that flipped for me was saying, oh, you want to be me? That's why you talk. But you could be me, but you won't do what's required. So when the woman comes to the house, instead of looking her eyes and saying, I want your soul, you keep them. You're the. Not me. I saw this woman's soul, and I hunted her soul. Don't be pissed at who I was. That man is dead. Who he was made me who I am today. And this man that I am today saw my divine partner and didn't give a. About anybody else's opinion. I'm going straight into the heart of this woman. She's mine. You did the same thing. Said, this is my man. Holy. None of this makes sense. I'm terrified. How could I possibly. How could this be it? You're like, this woman has five children. I'm done with kids. How could this be it? And both of you, in the conflicting paradigm of your minds, allowed your souls to speak truth. And then you demonstrated the most beautiful and powerful thing of all time. The courage to follow your souls. And I'll let everything else sit on the sideline.

Thank you.

You two are amazing.

You ready to teach me up here?

Yeah, bro.

You said it earlier. I like the base jump.

Yeah.

Okay. You said you went through something in 2009.

Yeah.

Fast forward.

Yeah.

You're a man with an ego. Because we all have them.

Yeah.

When you get what you're doing now, which is spectacular anywhere.

Yeah.

With warrior. When you get people who come at you, do you.

About my past?

Just in regards that. Everyone wants to have an opinion.

Of course.

So do you want to take the high road? Do you fire back? Do You Are you selective? That's why I'm asking you to teach selective.

Okay, so literally just be honest with yourself. Where you at today? You pissed? Punch him. You're feeling holy and let it go. You feel like you want to somebody up them up. Go live about it. Them up and then go live about and be like these. Let me tell you what's going on. Get it out. Because otherwise, if you don't get it out when you want to get it out, and you pretend like you're not feeling it, it'll spill over into her and others without trying. So for me, when I saw it, I was like, hey, sometimes I'm just gonna blast people. And people like you need. I expect more out of you.

You say Jesus Christ when that happens. Now are you like, oh, man, I went too far?

No, I news I'm not Jesus. Good news. I'm not the savior. I'm a man who was saved by grace and didn't have to earn it. Me saying you doesn't disqualify me from it. So I'm sorry you don't like it. But we live in a society where people get to talk and punch me and my wife and my kids publicly. And you don't say, there you go. Then I retaliate and I cross check and I somebody up and I'm the bad guy. Because you on my front porch.

I feel like I know.

And I will. I oftentimes will be like, you shouldn't do that.

You should fire based on an edit.

It.

Yeah.

And I'm not able to stand up. I can't even stand up for myself. I'll just take it. And then you see me at the grocery store. I'm like, that's that douchebag guy who did this, this, and this. It's like, no, I didn't do any of those things. Yeah, that's why I ask you. You gotta like train me up here.

That's what I'm saying. How do you. How do you count? How do you counterbalance interpretation of media? Be the most honest people in the game. But if somebody else is controlling the edits, like, listen, if I was ever on a show like this, they would twist my sideways. I would look like goddamn Lex Luthor. I would look like worst in the game. They put like, Jesus, Jesus. And I see he wants to Jesus. I'm like, what in the world? Where did that come from? So what I do you overwhelm with your own media?

There it is.

You own the media. So everybody eventually will always come back to truth. So people can talk all day long about me, but I'm already the one telling my story. And it's way bigger than anybody else trying to. When New York Post tried to run on me, when New York tried to run on me, tried to run smear campaigns on me and my brands, it couldn't. It didn't matter. Everything I thought they had, I'd already told them, own it all. Own it all publicly. Yeah, I was a playboy. I off, I did this. I cheated on my wife. I cheated on my girlfriends. Guess what? That was me. That's who the I was. I had no idea where I was. I was dead asleep spiritually trying to find my way in this world. And then it happened. I woke the up and my soul was engaged. And God sent me my universal connection. And guess what? Last time I checked, the Bible is filled with stories of men who were fuck ups until they woke up.

He uses the fuck ups.

He uses all the fuck ups. All of the Sauls De Pauls are the men who brought awakening. That's why, bro, everybody tells you you and me are behind. We had to go low so we could go high. And we're the only ones can be trusted. Because when we walk into any situation, it's just not a lot of anybody's done that we're like judging anybody for. We're like, yeah, I get why you did that. Yeah, yeah, I did that. Yeah.

That's why I just have like massive love. Like, you know, because I'm like, I've been there.

I'm sure to the defense that you probably defended more her. You don't give a. If they say anything about you, it's her.

Yeah, I feel like too, because now that you're on the show, you need to build like your own, your own personal brand to show people this the new version of you. Right? So that's what I would encourage you to do is like, fine, they're gonna spin it however they want, but I'm gonna keep showing up, doing the lives, doing my own brand so people can see me. Because they're gonna come find you and they're only gonna want to look for the dirt. Show them who you really are. You know what I mean?

You know what's funny though? And I know we're talking about the exposure of the show, but let me say this. You are right. There's nothing that they are putting out there that's not a little bit of who we are. And so you're highlighting the things that, that you're highlighting publicly the things we all keep in our. In our closet. And so now you're forced to be like, just like you said, it is me. I did do that. Now what are you going to do? And you know what? You've probably done it or you know someone who did it. And. And for us, I think we've got to get to the spot where it's like, I did do that. It's not my proudest moment. And then I start realizing, I'll get a message. Message, John, I've been in this situation. And so you're kind of like, okay, it doesn't help feel good to be like, here's my dirty laundry. Go through it. But you know what? There's some good that has come of the exposure.

Realize that everyone has dirty laundry. Yeah, everyone is up. Everyone has fallen short of. The grace and power of God is why Christ exists. Not to save us in our perfection. What to save us in our imperfection. Without it, we're done. So when you realize that no one. Everyone's hiding. They're all hiding. Everyone's hiding. That's why I'm scary as I couldn't even get on the board of directors of my hoa. They're like, you're the fucking Trump of the stranger. I says too much because I'm like, I have nothing to hide.

Right.

I am scandalous. You can do nothing to me. You can't touch me. Because you, on the other hand, not YouTube, but you. You won't look me in the eyes.

Exactly.

Because you know I have nothing to hide. And you closet full of skeletons. And the minute I show up, my presence in understanding and truth in me causes you to squirm with discomfort because of the guilt that you have with all the lies that you're hiding. So when you're honest.

I think it's very freeing too, though, when you said, like, you're kind of, like, exposed, but you're like, I'm owning it.

Yes. It's freeing.

And I love the flip side that you just shared that you're like. And then I get a DM or a message that somebody's like, thank you, you. So I think there's so much power in sharing your story and who it can actually impact and help, especially if you're like, yeah, that was me. This is what I'm doing now, right? Garrett. And I, He. I'm actually. I'm a lot more quieter than him, if you didn't notice. But he. That he was the one in the beginning that taught me this. He's like you. It's okay. We need to share. We need to share. We need to share. So for the past, like, decade, we've just kind of been like, this is who we are, you know?

So you committed to launch a podcast from last week that you'd retired and told the teams not to publish.

There was one podcast. It's because I was mad at him. There's one.

So there was simple yes or no?

No.

Well, we launching the show or we just doing a real. I'm just putting it out.

We launched one podcast that we were, like, in the biggest fight. Like, I was in tears. Like, I was just like, you, Like. But I published it anyways. I was like, whatever. And then I got feedback that, like, from women, they're like, thank you for publishing in that and staying in the fight. And I was like, wow, you're welcome. And I. I was like, I'm not gonna publish it. So recently we had one, and we got in a similar situation. Not as bad, but. But I just felt like we were in this big fight, and I was like, whatever. Like. So I didn't post it. He's like, why don't you post it? But secretly, I was, like, still kind of mad at him for the argument that we had inside this.

So I was like, so did you post it or not? Are we posting or not posting?

Oh, geez.

It's. I mean, it's like. It's scary. It's still scary, though, because you're like.

Answer the question we've been asking.

Okay, so here's why I haven't posted. I think there's a piece of me that I'm still a little bit bugged.

I'm like, I don't know know.

I mean, now I feel like I have to.

But are you going to go see us or no?

It's like, I feel like when I do a podcast, I'm like, is there somebody going to want to.

Joe Biden, will you answer a question? You're like, the biggest politician. Yeah, sure, post it.

It comes out Tuesday, guys. Yes, There it is.

So listen, you two running a podcast and just talking with each other this way, because I guarantee you, like, just. Just being with you two right now, the way you two dialogue is like how we dialogue when no one's around. But the crazier part is you doing that not only will set you free, it gives everyone following you an opportunity to see the truth behind the tails. They get to hear you, be with you, experience you. You can do on social media and post pictures and do Your lives and stuff, that's fine. But a podcast gives them every single week. Episode comes out.

Yeah, people.

Episode comes out, podcast comes out. Now it's double trouble. Let the show do what the show.

Is going to do.

That's great. That's their job, to mix and make it great. That's the way they had it. That's why they're great.

Great.

And you're gonna be the bad boy. Congrats.

I guess. Own that role.

Yeah. Donut. And then the next piece is why you come to the podcast. You're like, oh, wait a second. Kind of like these two. Kind of like him. He's not. This is weird. I thought he's an. He's a bad boy in the county. He's not. He's actually.

Really? Yeah.

Wow. This is a brilliant man. I really feel his heart. Geez. Janet thought she was just, you know, like a cheater with a hot boy and. No, she's not. She's. Wow. Oh, I'm just like her next. You know, people are doing in their lives what you two are demonstrating, which is the courage to live.

That is well said. I think we. We do exactly that without saying the courage to live. And it takes a lot of courage.

Yeah.

Just show up and look in the mirror and, like, I'm gonna live.

Yeah.

Live for us and our kids and round up the noise and try.

Yeah. But even then, like, you might even have a bigger calling within this opportunity of being in the show. And now you kind of gotta have this new version of you come out.

That's my. That's something I keep putting out there.

Like, I.

This. I'm so grateful for this. And what. Where am I going with this? What am I supposed to do? Where am I supposed to go? And I just keep, like, we always say, like, just guide us, lead us.

Yeah.

You know, we want him to, like, you know, show us the map.

Yeah.

Here's the lens you get to look through right now.

I think you just look at something as, like, it's creating opportunities, and you get to accept these opportunities that you want to be a part of and the impact that you guys will make. So I'm excited for you guys. I'm excited that we, like, like, we're friends now. Like, remember? I'm like, we need to do a podcast. Cuz I really feel like you connect with people through a podcast. It's not like it just, you know, let's go out and have a drink or whatever. It's like you get a. Get to know their story and Stuff. So, like I said, I'm grateful that you guys chose to come on this, even though you have, like, so much going on today, especially with the launch of the show and everything out, but.

You guys were just. What we needed.

Everything a little bit.

That, like, part therapy session.

Yeah.

Grounding. Yeah.

Like, recharge.

Perspective.

Yeah.

I want to say thank you for having us. Absolutely. I kept saying to him, how in the hell.

Oh, my God. I'm not.

I don't have time to get ready. And I'm so grateful that this was today.

Yeah.

So thank you.

This afternoon.

Yeah.

Things fall in place for a reason.

We know you were supposed to be here. Yeah. I don't coordinate podcasts in the middle of live workshops that are running at my office. She said you were coming, and God's like, go help him. So. You're amazing, and I'm pouring into you, not from my strength. Like, he knows you're called to this. He's called you to this. He's sending you into a place. Just shine the light. You don't have to save anybody. You don't have to apologize. You don't have to be anything different than what you already are and just shine the light.

Isn't it interesting? They're painting you as the villains. I know it's hard sometimes, but you guys are gonna. You're gonna show them, though.

And the fun part is every beacon, carrier of light has been casted as actually somebody coming from the darkness. Genesis, chapter one, verse two and three. My most inspirational verse in the whole Bible. People are like, why? Beginning with the heavens and the earth, verse one, verse two. And the earth was without form, verse two, the earth form. And there was darkness across the deep. And the spirit of God moved across the Waters, verse 3. And God said, let there be light. And there was light. The darkness that is going to surround you guys speak light, and they'll be late. And sometimes that's going to show up with, like, blasting people, because that's what light looks like. Sometimes it's going to be just letting it go. But know that in the show being there and YouTube being here, I'm gonna say this. We're here to support you.

Thank you.

With whatever that be. Even if we just had to be the people that you come hang out with. Not on the podcast. Yeah. Come to the house and be like, hey, it's stressful as. Can we come out? Yeah, come on over. Let's go.

Watch what you say.

Come recharge.

Watch what you say.

We're here. We appreciate you Guys, beautiful people.

Thank you for having me.

Amazing. And you are. I get to be around a lot of guys. A lot of guys around a lot of broken dudes who are trying to figure out who the they are and a lot of amazing men who figured out who they are. You have done a lot of work on yourself. You've allowed true healing to happen in your life. They say that to you as a man who's aggressive. I'm Alpha's, I'm an at times. I'm also very connected to this piece of transformation you've brought into yourself. That couldn't happen except for God. God and Jen. The work that you've done on yourself, to be ready for what you two have stepped into, it only comes because you were in the desert. Christ was in the desert for 40 days before his entire ministry began. He had to battle. He battled. Now you two are walking through into the gates, the next stage of your calling, like walking into Jerusalem now with the message. So I'm excited to see your message involved and please do this podcast because I think it'd be amazing. We'll listen to it.

Thank you, guys.

All right, thanks so much for being here on the show. This is the day to my podcast. Two amazing, amazing guests, new friends. Listen, I'm gonna put all their social media channels and handles. Go. We'll check out the show. We're gonna watch it tonight. We didn't even know which tonight we're gonna watch tonight. It'll be fun. Sit and drink some wine. And why we don't drink wine. We drink tequila. Tequila. And we'll watch the show tonight. We'll look forward to having you guys here next week. And remember, for all those are here wanting to learn what is the backbone of all that we do here? Well, it's the Warriors Way system. It's an operating system, works for men and women. We can get access to it for free. 30 days, get a trial head to wakeupwarrior.com or to worrylaunch.com, both these are going to give you a gateway or pathway in. We'll give you the app. We have all the training, all the coursework, all the curriculum. Come join us live, see if it doesn't work. If it does work or doesn't work, either way, it's going to be a test for you. On top of that too, we have a new men's Bible study group. If you're not part of that virtually. Warriorwarriormansbiblestudy.com we'd love to have you on that too. Thanks so much for being here. This is the date you wife podcast.